Early Report with New VC Defiant

[EddieB]

Well, it's been a week since we had the Vermont Castings Defiant installed and I thought I'd post some observations and ask a few questions.

First, I'll start with a few observations, and throw in some pros and cons so far.

The stove produces MONSTER heat. The house is a large colonial, with the stove installed an the living room. That room is close to 500 Sq Feet and opens to a dining area and kitchen. With outside temps in the 20's I can report that the room with the stove stays around 80, hotter of course right in front of the stove in the middle of the room and just about 80 on each end. The dining area drops off to about 78 and the kitchen 76. There is a large room with cathedral ceiling on the other end of that floor and it stays about 72. There is a stair way across the room from the stove, so much of the heat travels directly up the stairs, where the there is a cathedral ceiling in an large open area leading to the bedrooms. The bedroom temps hang in the high 70's with the doors open, and drop to about 70 in the master bedroom directly above the stove with the door closed. The other bedrooms are the kids, and they leave their doors open and the temp stays in the mid 70's. There is a ceiling fan in the room with the stove, that helps keep things moving.

Keep in mind that all of this is with the stove loaded full, but the air all the way down.

I've been loading it about 3 times a day, a full load when I wake up, a smaller 3/4 full load around dinner time and another full load around 11 before I go to bed. When I wake up around 7:30 the stove is still humming along at about 450-500 degrees with a few small chunks and nice hot coal base. I've been using 3 Envi Blocks on the bottom, and semi-seasoned splits of mixed hardwoods for the rest of the box.

I can report that the Envi Blocks last a long time in this box, intact, when I wake up in the morning the only thing I can recognize in the box are the remains of the envy blocks, which still have their shape, although they seem like burnt out marshmallows. They seem to have lost the majority of their weight and break apart if you poke them lightly. I bought the blocks for two reasons, first, during a snow storm or heavy raid, I won't have to go outside to get any wood. I store the blocks in the closets, on the floor behind the sofas and in the finished basement.

I've not had much luck keeping the glass clean. It gets a light build up of brown and black that come off easy enough with a little water and a sponge. (I've been opening the doors and putting the screen in for a bit at night, this gives the glass a chance to cool so it can be cleaned and provides a nice looking fire to enjoy while we sit in the living room at night.

I've noticed that the front doors are a little out of alignment. The gap seems about 1/4 inch larger at the bottom then at the top. It's not leaking but I'd like it adjusted. Yesterday my wife noticed what appeared to be a few drops of some kind of liquid on the tray that sits just in front of where the doors meet. It couldn't have been water, since that would have evaporated immediately at the temps, but she said it was wet and could be smeared with the gloves. I have NO IDEA what that could be. Perhaps a little of the glue that holds the gaskets in place? Maybe someone has some ideas.

When cursing along with the Cat, the stove produces no noticeable smoke from the chimney.

The Pros (so far)
I haven't turned the heat on at all in the house. (Not a single drop of oil used heating the place since the stove was installed)
Enjoyable to watch the stove burn, much better then most of the junk on TV
The house is WARM. With oil we were keeping it at between 62-64 and still spending almost $1000 a month on oil.
The top loading makes loading the stove really easy
I scored about a cord of OAK from the neighbor from a tree he had trimmed this week.
I haven't burned myself YET
The wife is happy.

The Cons (so far)
The glass doesn't stay as clean as I'd like it to. (Any suggestions)
The ash pan seems like its got to be emptied about once a week
The wood quality I've been able to get from a local supplier is not so good and I had to pay for it. (165/cord)
I've started looking at chain saws and splitters and I think it might be starting to get addicted. I've been wondering if there is some sort of a 12 step program to treat my wood burning addiction.
I hope it won't require rehab. or extended treatment.
The wife thinks the kitchen is cold (compared to the living room). How is it that 76 can seem cold?

Questions

How do I get real seasoned wood to burn for this year? Is that even possible to buy?
How do I keep the glass clean?
How can I even out the temps in the house a little more(will the central air fan do that or will it just waste electric)?
Is there any way to heat the finished basement (can I blow some of the extra heat to the room directly below)? I was thinking of an in intake near the ceiling across the room that I could feed into an pipe with an inline fan blowing the heat down stairs. In addition, I was thinking of putting a second vent on the floor of the basement with a fan to blow the cold air from there up to the room with the stove. Would that be safe? Possible? Cost effective. The basement is well insulated and mostly bellow grade and doesn't require much heat to keep it warm. In the past the oil burner running would keep it warm there.
How empty should I keep the ash pan?
Why does my IR thermometer show almost 100 degree difference on the stove top from the right to the left? Is that something I should be concerned about?

Thanks again for all your help here. If I can answer any questions about the stove let me know.

Eddie

 

[Backwoods Savage]

Eddie, congratulations on the stove. Glad you are able to keep the temperatures up. Happy wife is always a plus. Good you scored on that oak too but don't count on burning that for a couple of years.

The glass being dirty is no doubt from the not so dry wood you are burning. However, that door out of adjustment might also be part of the cause. Just realize there is no good substitute for good dry wood and if you have to buy wood, it is best to buy it at least a year in advance. This means you should already have next year's wood stacked out in the wind to start drying. Weekly on the ash pan is not bad.

Now for your questions:

1. Finding real dry wood at this time of the year is almost impossible. Almost always impossible to buy dry wood at any time of the year no matter what the wood sellers say.
2. Keeping the glass clean is a matter of burning that good dry wood that you will have a problem finding.
3. Small desktop fans, sitting on the floor in doorway or hallways blowing cool air into the stove room. Run on low. This will push cool air into the stove room and will force warm air out. It works much better this way rather than trying to blow the warm air around. Sounds backwards but it works wonderfully. Ceiling fans should be run sucking air up rather than pushing air down.
4. Darned near impossible to heat the basement from above. Fire departments and insurance companies frown on vents or registers.
5. Ash pan? Just empty it as needed. Be careful where you store those ashes as they are a real fire hazard. Make sure whatever your store them in is placed on cement and never on anything combustible.
6. Usually not a concern with a 100 degree difference. Probably just a quirk of your particular stove or the fire is just hotter at that end.

Good luck Eddie.

 

[leeave96]

Sounds like your doing pretty good with your stove. Your dirty glass is probably a combo of several things - less than seasoned wood and a dampered down stove. Dennis hit on the wood, but when you damper down, you slow the air velocity through the stove and the air wash is not as effective. I get a bit of brown on my stove glass sometimes during an extreme dampered down overnight burn, but the glass burns clean during the day as we heat the stove hotter. I've also read a few posts that the 2in1 stoves may not clean the glass as well as older models - don't now if that's the case.

Getting a week out of your ash pan before emptying is great! I can go 3 or 4 days with my stove and I feel that's very good. Some folks empty their pan every day. Leave about 1 inch or a bit more ash in your firebox, but don't hesitate to completely empty your ash pan.

Keep us posted on this stove.

Happy burning!
Bill

 

[jharkin]

Hi Eddie,

Glad to hear that defiant is working so well for you. It is a beast of a stove, I have its little brother (the Encore ) and that can certainly crank the heat....

Listen to Dennis' advice on the wood. Ive been here for 2 years now and like every new guy Ive learned the wisdom of his advice... Every passing year gets easier as your wood gets better and better. Aim to get into a rythm of having 1-2 years supply on hand so you always know its dry.

Speaking of which.... at $1000 you must be burning a tank of oil a month. that's a BIG house... so to heat full time you are going to need an equally BIG wood supply. On a BTU for BTU basis a 275 gallon tank of #2 is equivalent to nearly 2 cords of hardwood so plan appropriately...

A few observations of my Encore which should be similar to the defiant and maybe help answer your questions:

- The dirty glass is just a fact of the design. Dry wood will help but it never goes away if you burn low. All the heat is generated in the back in the separate catalyst chamber so the main firebox doesn't get hot enough to stop buildup on low. When your wood is good this will clear on the first hot burn of the day ... getting it up to 650F or so griddle for 15min should do.

- I also get different temps left to right... right hand side of the stove near the thermostat burns hotter. you will tend to see the flames congregate to that side on medium low burns regardless of how the wood is loaded. I think it must be something to do with the airflow pattern of the stove as Ive seen others report this.

- Id suggest emptying the ash pan before its gets overfull. There are 2 small secondary air intakes in the ash pan housing that are there to keep the fire from going out at full low and to help burn down the coal bed evenly. Some people will keep the ashpan full to block this and be able to kill the fire but I prefer to operate the stove as designed. Your lucky its only weekly, on the Encore I have to dump every 3 days or so.

- One other thought... For even better control I highly recommend getting the Condar digital catalyst temperature probe. There is a button on the back panel where the probe goes and it will allow you to monitor the cat temp directly. This helps us because unlike other cat stoves like the woodstocks and blaze kings, the catalyst location in the back of hte stove means there is no direct correlation between catalyst temperature and stovetop temp. Its possible to have the cat close to overfire temp and the stove throwing a ton of heat off the back panel while the griddle is well under the danger zone.