Debating about a stove purchase for a new home build

[kingofcreosote]

Building a new house in North Idaho. R45 ceiling, R23 walls. Daylight basement with R5 foam on the outside of the concrete walls. Around 1,800 square feet or so and two stories. Wood stove will be in the basement with the stove pipe going straight up (so pretty tall). Single wall pipe on the inside to class A once it hits the chimney.

Right now we have a 1980 doublewide with a Napolean 1450 (EPA, but older) as our stove. Wood is our primary heat source. We're able to keep the place warm, though regulating temperature can be tricky, especially at night.

I've been researching EPA vs pre-EPA stoves, cat vs non-cat, etc. People really seem to love Blazeking and I think the Princess would be sized about correctly for us.

I did find an older Princess stove with a cat for under $1,000. I don't know a lot about it, but it's a 8" flue. How would that compare to the modern Princess? Are long burn times attainable? Can I reduce the 8" flue to 6" without serious issue?

Overnight burns are great, as is being able to leave the stove for a day trip and get back to it going. We like to keep the main part of the house around 70, maybe a little under, and the bedrooms in the lower 60s.

I'd like to be able to have low output throughout the day, vs starting fires here and there. I currently am able to stock the stove in the double wide with small pieces throughout the day, which works okay. The stove in the new house won't be quite as convenient/central to monitor.

Are the minimum heat outputs lower with smaller models and higher with larger? Does this apply to other stove brands as well?

I'm also interested in Kuma stoves. Our neighbor seems to do pretty well with theirs. Though the 30-40 hour burn times (I doubt we'd use those that often) are unheard of with Kumas, vs fairly common with Blazekings.

Thank you!

 

[stoveliker]

For a BK don't use single wall stove pipe; especially with a tall flue..you might end up too cool at the top leading to creosote plugging.

The minimums of the smaller stoves are similar, the maximum output is not. That may be different for another stove brands.

Overnight burns are easy with a BK. In fact I've gotten 36-37 hours (with red oak and of course very low heat output).
But any 2.5+ cubic foot will allow reloads in the morning without lighting it up from start.

40 hrs is only with the King model.
It's not common though as most folks need a bit more heat than 3.5 plug in heaters of 1.5 kW (which is the minimum output of a BK 30 model or princess).

I'd not put in an 8" flue.. costs a lot and limits future stove choices.

 

[kingofcreosote]

Good to know about the single walled pipe for Blazeking. I can see single walled pipe being more useful with a less efficient stove.

Unfortunately, no red oak up here. Tamarack is the best we have.

Really would prefer to not have the extra expensive of the 8" chimney, mostly over the class A pipe. But I imagine it would creosote a lot slower.

Do you know where the minimum burn figures are posted?

Edit: Blazeking's website has "Constant Heat Output on Low" figures. They are definitely lower on the smaller models, although not tremendously so.

Princess states: 12,576 BTU's per hour for up to 30 hours

Could I get less than that per hour with a smaller load that wouldn't last as long? Or is that the lowest practical output, regardless of how full the firebox is?

How would the pre-EPA Princess compare to the current Princess? Is it notably different on any of the specifications, or pretty close?

 

[stoveliker]

The blaze king website has manuals and brochures with a BTU per hour output for the slow burn. I.e. the lowest output. It's around 12,000 BTU per hour for the models 30 and the princess.

Ah, I see your edit. Yes smaller but not much.
Less is hard; this is the output coming mostly from the catalyst at this point and you need to keep that active if you burn with no flame.

Creosote is created by having too dirty exhaust (smoke) by either choking the fire too much or, more often with an unmodified EPA stove, having wood that's too wet.
A chimney can have that condense by cooling the gases to below the condensation temperature (of water). Cooling happens just by gases being in the chimney, by having single wall stove pipe, by having a tall chimney (gases are in there longer), or by having a flue that's too large, as it'll slow down the speed of flow.

Blaze King is made in tamarack country in WA, so that is all good. Those burn times advertised are with fir, not oak. I got more than the advertised time by having a very full box of red oak.

 

[stoveliker]

I don't know the pre EPA princess. If you can, get a modern one. BK has evolved in good ways over time.

 

[Wisco Shepherd]

I have the smaller kuma (Aspen) and like it a lot. My little 1.8 cu ft firebox can get me through the night with a few coals to start with in the morning. They don't go as low as a BK but go pretty low.

They breathe pretty easy so if you do it I'd reccomend having a flue damper.

 

[EbS-P]

Make sure to get a blower door test. Will an outside air be a a simple install? ERV? Do you have a heating load calculation?

 

[kingofcreosote]

I have the smaller kuma (Aspen) and like it a lot. My little 1.8 cu ft firebox can get me through the night with a few coals to start with in the morning. They don't go aslow as a BK but go pretty low.

They breathe pretty easy so if you do it I'd reccomend having a flue dampe

My neighbors have that stove and they really like it. Seems to hold coals for a long time, even with the small fire box. What kind of square footage do you have?

I'm curious why the BK burn times are so much longer than the Kumas. Is your Aspen a LE model? I think 2020 and later. I assume yours has a catalyst?

Make sure to get a blower door test. Will an outside air be a a simple install? ERV? Do you have a heating load calculation?

Not sure what a blower door test is, nor ERV, or a heating load calculation. In the mobile home we have outside air. Outside air is probably doable, although would look a little wonky and be a little bit of a pain.

I just know that we will have way more insulation than we have now, so heating up the space should be much easier.

 

[Wisco Shepherd]

My neighbors have that stove and they really like it. Seems to hold coals for a long time, even with the small fire box. What kind of square footage do you have?

I'm curious why the BK burn times are so much longer than the Kumas. Is your Aspen a LE model? I think 2020 and later. I assume yours has a catalyst?

We are very small sub 1200 square foot. This time of year I get by on one fire a day. And yeah for a little firebox it punches strong burns quite clean one of the most efficient stoves made when looking at EPA testing.

BK stoves are purely catalytic not a hybrid like mine. They seem to be the best around at being turned down low. This is less of a big deal if you are heating a larger space and don't need the uber low end input. And I believe the Kuma is cheaper which may give you some cash to upgrade that pipe to double wall.