Homeowners Insurance Issues

[whlago]

Hello All,
Recently I changed homeowners insurance policies and now go through a broker that found a cheaper policy that I have my car and homeowners with. Recently I got a check back from the Insurance Company and, while I love having money that I didn't expect, a red flag went up in my head.

Well, they had previously asked for information related to the pellet stove such as certification that an annual cleaning of the vent pipe was done by a professional, along with a photo and such. I sent a letter to the company explaining how I personally clean the vent a minimum of three times per year, explaining that the chimney is five feet of vertical pipe terminating outside the house at the required clearances.

Evidently the letter didn't satisfy them and they have issued a cancellation on my policy and returned my premium, pending reciept of a letter confirming that a professional is cleaning the stove. I refuse to pay a "professional" to come in once a year to do what I can and have done just as well just to satisfy some insurance requirement!

Any advice from anyone on how to handle this would be much appreciated.
Joe

 

[SmokeyTheBear]

Find a different insurance company.

 

[whlago]

I certainly could go that route, Smokey...however my first inclination is to try and educate this one so I can keep my insurance (and not have to find a new one for both home and auto), and maybe set some precedence such that future "pellet owner" clients will not have to go through this crap.

Was hoping someone had some good arguments that have been used to convince the company that you don't need an annual "professional" chimney sweep when you do all they do and more by brushing the vent pipe and applying the leafblower vaccuum every ton or so. Hoping that is enough and waiting to hear if they will give me an exception.

 

[GrahamInVa]

I had similar issues with my insurance. I installed the stove myself and they didn't approve of it. I ended up having to switch or pay a dealer to inspect my work. My current insurance co. knows i have the stove but never asked about installation or cleanings. I actually saved a few bucks by switching anyhow.. it worked out good..

I wouldn't bother trying to educate them... just switch.

 

[Dill]

Trust me I've been an insurance agent for quite a while now. Your not going to be able to "educate" the company, heck lots of companies are no longer listening to agents on stuff like this. Used to be if I went out and felt scared of your dog or stove I wouldn't insure you. Now they have banned breeds and 20 question checklists.

 

[joescho]

I had similar issues with my insurance. I installed the stove myself and they didn't approve of it. I ended up having to switch or pay a dealer to inspect my work. My current insurance co. knows i have the stove but never asked about installation or cleanings. I actually saved a few bucks by switching anyhow.. it worked out good..

I wouldn't bother trying to educate them... just switch.

X2

All they care about is $$$$$$$$$. They have a bean counter somewhere that tells them that you have a device that creates fire and it needs to be cleaned professionally.

I have both a wood burner and a pellet burner and the condition of my liners are completely different every year. The wood burner is much more dirty and harder to clean, the soot practically falls out of the pellet liner. I clean my pellet chimney myself too, but they have no idea that the soot in a wood burner and the soot in a pellet burner is much different, and they do not make the distinction.

Get a new insurance company... you can't win this one....

 

[Ddubs77]

That blows...I'd find a new company

 

[whlago]

I gues I'm able to have a one time inspection by a chimney sweep to state that the vent is free of creosote and I'm good to go. Works for me...

 

[daveswoodhauler]

Trust me I've been an insurance agent for quite a while now. Your not going to be able to "educate" the company, heck lots of companies are no longer listening to agents on stuff like this. Used to be if I went out and felt scared of your dog or stove I wouldn't insure you. Now they have banned breeds and 20 question checklists.

I Second Dill. I work for a P & C carrier....once they come up with a guidelines and or requirement, they are not going to bend. Your broker is most likely getting 10-15% commission on the premium you pay, so I think your best route would be to call your broker, and have them call their "underwriter" and see if they will make an exception in your situation. (I am guessing they wont, but thats why your broker is there to act on your behalf) Good Luck

 

[imacman]

Just changed ins co. for both my house & car. Told them I had the pellet stove and that it was installed as per the owners manual.....they never asked anything more about it, and no additional charge for having it. 21st Century Ins. (online company). Saved me $300+/yr on the house ins.

 

[Waterbug]

Get your chimney inspected and then burn your house down. That will fix 'em.

 

[whlago]

Get your chimney inspected and then burn your house down. That will fix 'em.

Don't give me ideas WB...I'm all for fixin 'em

 

[whlago]

Just changed ins co. for both my house & car. Told them I had the pellet stove and that it was installed as per the owners manual.....they never asked anything more about it, and no additional charge for having it. 21st Century Ins. (online company). Saved me $300+/yr on the house ins.

I saved about $300/yr (homeowners only) going to this company through a broker coupled with my car and my kids car (new driver ) The real savings was in the car insurance....so I am hesitant to switch again. The one-time inspection (although totally ridiculous because I've only been burning since November last year and have cleaned it 3 or 4 times since including brush and leafblower) is going to be the way to go for me.

 

[bbfarm]

Our insurance never asked about cleaning the vents or having anything professionally inspected. Our agent is my brother in law and he just emailed a form for me to fill out stating the dementions related to walls, vent and hearth. he knows we installed it ourselves.

I would switch insurance also.

 

[Alex]

Just told my Home owners about my new insert, they asked if it was installed my a pro, i said yea ( it was by my local stove shop), they said can you prove it if something happens, and i can, they asked about a town permit, i had one and the town inspected it, its all good. My insurance then said that im good to go, im fully covered, sounds good to me. Nothing about cleaning or any other of this hog wash, maybe just a different area. Good luck

 

[whlago]

Just told my Home owners about my new insert, they asked if it was installed my a pro, i said yea ( it was by my local stove shop), they said can you prove it if something happens, and i can, they asked about a town permit, i had one and the town inspected it, its all good. My insurance then said that im good to go, im fully covered, sounds good to me. Nothing about cleaning or any other of this hog wash, maybe just a different area. Good luck

It was pretty much the same thing when I installed it. This started when I changed insurance companies.

 

[BrianN]

whlago, I hope that they bend a bit on the issue. To bad you can't just invite them over and let them actually see what they are insuring, and how easy it is to take care of and clean.

When we bought our place. One of the insurance companies wanted a WETT inspection. Told them it was already done, but, they wanted it done again, plus, to have it done every four years. ??? What? Plus, they wanted it "professionally cleaned" every year.
Needless to say, I switched right there. My insurance company now has asked for nothing other than the original WETT inspection that was done four years ago when it was installed.
Although, I did have it professionally cleaned, and he showed me how to do every thing so that I wouldn't have to call him in every year and pay him $100 each time.

 

[RiddleMasterMorgon]

I would suggest to shop around a little bit more. I have a log house and finding the right insurance company saved me 1000 USD/yr on the home owners policy- no kidding. The car insurance was a bit more expensive than comparables, but as a bundle with the homeowner and umbrella actually the same than others.

They only wanted to see a picture of the pellet stove insert and the verbal assurance that is was installed by professional. They mentioned they might send their agent to have a look, but never showed up. No mention of cleaning had to be proven done by professional.

I am very happy with State Farm so far.

 

[infinitymike]

While I was in the middle of my gasification boiler install, I switched insurance companies , not by choice but Allstate dropped most of long island for fear of flood. We went with Nationwide and they had an inspector come by for an inspection. They saw the unit and it was an issue that needed to be addressed. All they asked for was pictures of it and a invoice from a licensed installer. Maybe give Nationwide a call, they never asked about the chimney. Did you have someone install it?

 

[smwilliamson]

Hello All,
Recently I changed homeowners insurance policies and now go through a broker that found a cheaper policy that I have my car and homeowners with. Recently I got a check back from the Insurance Company and, while I love having money that I didn't expect, a red flag went up in my head.

Well, they had previously asked for information related to the pellet stove such as certification that an annual cleaning of the vent pipe was done by a professional, along with a photo and such. I sent a letter to the company explaining how I personally clean the vent a minimum of three times per year, explaining that the chimney is five feet of vertical pipe terminating outside the house at the required clearances.

Evidently the letter didn't satisfy them and they have issued a cancellation on my policy and returned my premium, pending reciept of a letter confirming that a professional is cleaning the stove. I refuse to pay a "professional" to come in once a year to do what I can and have done just as well just to satisfy some insurance requirement!

Any advice from anyone on how to handle this would be much appreciated.
Joe

play along. who needs to inspect it, what qualifications should the inspector have?

 

[SmokeyTheBear]

A number of fire departments will inspect installations and venting, suppose the insurance company would believe them?

 

[Melissa220]

I had my pellet stove in stalled in August this year, four months after switching to a new insurance company. WHe I notified the broker, I got a SUPPLEMENTAL APPLICATION (!) sent to me asking if the stove was professionally installed, if it was UL approved, who inspected it and this was sole source or supplemental source of heat. They also wanted to know if it would be professionally cleaned before each season, if it was placed on a non-combustible floor material, how it was vented and if shielding was installed on walls within 18".

I just recently turned into the company the completed application along with a letter from my local fire department, a photo of the label on the back of the stove showing installation requirements and the UL certification, Also a copy of the manual pages showing the UL labeling and the installation requirements for corner install, which is only 9" clearance from the stove corners.

It will be interesting to see what type of a response I receive! And you have me wondering if, based on the professional cleaning question, I will be required to submit proof of such professional cleaning!

 

[heat seeker]

Just told my Home owners about my new insert, they asked if it was installed my a pro, i said yea ( it was by my local stove shop), they said can you prove it if something happens, and i can, they asked about a town permit, i had one and the town inspected it, its all good. My insurance then said that im good to go, im fully covered, sounds good to me. Nothing about cleaning or any other of this hog wash, maybe just a different area. Good luck

Same here. No increase in premium, either. (Amica Insurance)

 

[Stentor1]

I would be very cautious and would get everything in writing. The insurer doesn't care right now about your installation and may not be strict about requirements. That will change if you have a big ticket repair job from a fire. You'll probably get what the US Supreme Court calls "strict scrutiny".

Also, I think it is better to be precise about language. A "professional" installer is (maybe) not the teenager at Joe's Crab and Stove Shack. Some states (Mass, for example) have a certification program. Depends on the state you live in and what town or city permit is required. A "professional" annual cleaner is probably different --- depends on whether he works for a stove dealer, etc. When I got my stove, I received a permit from the city, got a copy of the work order from the installer, had a quick five minute inspection from the city, filed a copy of all paperwork with the local insurance agent.

I sincerely hope that was all unnecessary and that I will never need the insurance. But better safe than sorry. It was a one time investment of time but now I think I'm grandfathered.

 

[letsblaze]

My insurance comp sent me a packet to be completed with all the same info for UL listing, hearth specs as well as clearance's to the walls, any build up in the pipes blah blah blah..... Plus I still need to pay 175.00 for a mechanical inspection when it was installed by a liscensed builder....