12/1/96 - - Back to List
archives - Back to Club House
1. Dennis Dillion resigns as CEO of CFM-Majestic
2. Winston Pellet Parts
3. Vent Free Headaches reply
4. Vent-Free and EPA
5. ODC response (Preway parts) and Vent-Free
6. Reno Show - Computers and Networking
12/2/96
1. Narrowcasting
12/4/96
1. Ramblings on HearthNet and Communications
2. Vent Free Reply
3. Need Speaker for show
12/11/96
1. Hearth Pillow ?
2. HPA Affiliates
3. China, History and Hearth
12/14/96
1. China and Hearth
2. More China and Hearth
3. Getting Rich on the Net
4. Do's and Don't - lessons l;earned the HARD way
5. Hearth at Reno
12/15/96
1. Web Sales
2. More on China
12/17/96
Intor- Internet Trade Show
1. Greeting Card
2. Philospophy...final say..
3. Getting Rich on the web
12/20/96
1. He's Back
2. HPA Site Registration
3. Co-Branding
4. Direct Vent Caution - into existing chimney
12/22/96
1. Exclusivity
2. Mediocre prices
3. No warranty reimbursment
4. Poor dating and terms
12/30/96
AOL Sucks
1. Selling Yourself !
This Months Digest Sponsored by: Travis Industries, America's premier manufacturer of steel wood, gas & pellet hearth products exclusively for the Speciality Hearth Retailer. See the NEW LOPI Heritage Bay, Discovery Fireplace, Avalon Avanti DVS Fireplace and Fireplace Xtrordinair 36DV-R & 32DVS gas products in our NEWLY REMODELED Web site. http://hearth.com/travis. Call 1 800 654-1177 or e-mail us at [email protected] for dealer information. ___________________________________________________________________________
1. Dennis Dillion resigns as CEO of CFM-Majestic
2. Winston Pellet Parts
3. Vent Free Headaches reply
4. Vent-Free and EPA
5. ODC response (Preway parts) and Vent-Free
6. Reno Show - Computers and Networking
1. Dennis Dillion resigns as CEO of CFM-Majestic From: Craig Issod, [email protected]
The Valley News, a central Vermont and NH newspaper, reports that Dennis
Dillion has resigned as CEO of CFM Majestic for family reasons. The paper
also says CFM-Majestic recorded 168 Million in sales and income of .33 per
share, compared to .55 per share last year.
2. Winston Pellet Parts
From: Louis Tweed
To whom it may concern, I an interested in finding a source for Winston
pellet stove parts. In particular I need the circuit boards. I have 7 of
the units in my warehouse. I need boards for 3. Anyone who has access to
an extra set of the boards, or any possible contact where I might find something,
would be appreciated. Louis Tweed Mace Energy Supply Smithsburg, MD 21783
3. Vent Free Headaches reply
From: [email protected] Date: Thu, 28 Nov 1996 13:06:27 -0500 To: [email protected]
Subject: Vent Free Headaches reply
Karen Marengo asked to hear from others who have vent free displays. We
have 8 of them, 5 Temco and 3 VC. Generally we have one of them on almost
all day from the fall until spring to provide more efficient heat and we
use more than one in the fall in transitional times when the furnaces are
not yet needed to give us enough heat. Otherwise, the others are turned
on and off as people want to see them. We really haven't had any complaints,
from staff or customers. Our main showroom is 7500 Square feet and the connecting
area is another 7500, so this could help out too. We also have a bunch of
vented displays and direct vents. Sorry, no real advice, just our experience.
Craig Chapello Fireplace & Patio Center
4. Vent-Free and EPA
From: "J. A. Harman"
1) Vent Free
I have a question: If a retailer feels a need to vent his vent-free product
because employees are getting sick, how can "we" comfortably sell
these to the consumer?
2) EPA
Yesterday, while installing a gas log, I saw what I think was a press conference
with the EPA. I didn't hear if anything was said about our industry. This
morning in our newspaper there were 2 articles on this subject. Nothing
was really said about wood burning. There was only a small mention in a
picture showing the size of the particles that are currently regulated compared
to the proposed. So far it doesn't look to negative for us. What is being
said in other parts of the country????
Enjoy the biz while its here!!!
J. A. Harman AEC
5. ODC response (Preway parts) and Vent-Free
From: [email protected] Date: Fri, 29 Nov 1996 00:22:40 -0500 To: [email protected]
Subject: Responses
I thinhk ODC is gone. They operated in Evansville for many years. I'ts a
long story. The local bank sued for forclosure about a yeat ago. I think
you are out of luck.
Response #2: WE have 11 vent free burning displays. Some burn nine hours
a day. Ocassionally our people think they are receiving fumes. We have two
professional co meters. The highest reading we have been able to get is
2parts per million. However, when we fire up a new unit in the showroom
we really hear about it. With clean air mixers and proper log placement
we have never had a problem. Our showroom (main) is 6000 sq. ft.Your employees'
doctor advised her to find another job? I can' get a reading higher than
two parts per million of co. None-the-less when we have smokers blow into
the testor we get 11 to 45 ppm readings. I'll start worrying about vent
free vent frees produce more co's than a smokers breath
6. Reno Show - Computers and Networking
From: "Jim Butchart"
I read with humor both the post from my fellow Northern California/Nevada
affiliate member Duraflame(I'm sorry I don't have your name. It's on my
other machine....), and the response from, His Wizardness, Craig Issod.
If you will recall, Mr. "Logs that will have your love interest shedding
clothing before our fire" ; ) took exception to a retailer sharing
his disappointment with a particular northern manufacturer. Seems to me
this forum was actually created for just such moaning. Actually I think
Craig just created a soapbox where we could hop aboard and share what's
on our minds and hearts. I have used it to complain about unsafe gas insert
designs, and my own disappointment with the same manufacturer. I didn't
get flamed for naming names. I think we just feel like this is our link
to our far-flung peers and we can talk about anything that pleases us as
well as anything that pisses us off.
-----I'm getting pretty jazzed about the Reno Show coming up in a few short
months. Sign up early! Show up! The show is the most important date on my
calendar and I think it should be yours as well. One thing I want you to
do when you track me down is come up and shake my hand and introduce yourself.
Our Northern California / Nevada affiliate group is the host this year.
I was just elected to be the upcoming VP of our board of directors. So I
took that as a mandate to get a wild hair. (Sorry.. four years in the military
will do that to your language.) - So I am bugging my affiliate members to
get behind making your show in our backyard one you won't want to miss.
Last year Craig and I made a web site demonstration which Craig used in
his Intro to Things Internet. There was a lot of interest! So this year
the Education gurus at HPA HQ are presenting a full blown network of computers,
both PC and Mac, which will be available from Thursday on. It will be cool!
Since a lot of you have been doing this for awhile, and several have web
sites up and running, you should make it a point to spend some time in the
computer room and talk to the new guys and show them the drill. You are
excited about this medium and its tools. We need to get a lot of the
uninitiated excited about computers too. You can do that by sharing what
you know. And besides, it will make you feel like a big shot.I've been asked
to give a talk on networking. I need to get a feel from you on what you
think needs to be covered and where you fit on the scale of network savvy.
I have set up a little survey on my site, for you only, to answer a couple
of questions and give some info. I sure would appreciate it if you linked
here -> http://www.hearthshop.com/network.htmlNow I have to go create
that page and get it to work before you have a chance to visit me. What
have I gotten myself into?---- [email protected] http://www.hearthshop.com
___________________________________________________________________________
This Months Digest Sponsored by: Travis Industries, America's premier manufacturer
of steel wood, gas & pellet hearth products exclusively for the Speciality
Hearth Retailer. See the NEW LOPI Heritage Bay, Discovery Fireplace, Avalon
Avanti DVS Fireplace and Fireplace Xtrordinair 36DV-R & 32DVS gas products
in our NEWLY REMODELED Web site. http://hearth.com/travis. Call 1 800 654-1177
or e-mail us at [email protected] for dealer information. ___________________________________________________________________________
end of Digest - Post messages to [email protected]
This Months Digest Sponsored by: Travis Industries,
America's premier manufacturer of steel wood, gas & pellet hearth products
exclusively for the Speciality Hearth Retailer. See the NEW LOPI Heritage
Bay, Discovery Fireplace, Avalon Avanti DVS Fireplace and Fireplace Xtrordinair
36DV-R & 32DVS gas products in our Web site. http://hearth.com/travis. Call
1 800 654-1177 or e-mail us at [email protected] for dealer information.
___________________________________________________________________________
Hearth Digest 12/2/96
Narrowcasting hits home (Craig Issod, [email protected]) - A recent news
story stated that the Nielsen ratings of ALL major TV networks has decreased.
This is BIG news, and will cost the networks billions in lost advertising
revenue.
It is my feeling that this is part of a shift from BROADcasting to NARROWcasting.
Just as cable has made dozens of different "theme" channels available,
the Internet has the capability of expanding the choices to thousands ..or
even millions of "specialty" channels.
It is my hope that HearthNet will become one of the sucessfull channels.
Even now, over 20,000 people per month are tuning in - and they are staying
for quite awhile once they've landed.
_____________________________________________
As of you can imagine, my email box runneth over...but I do get a few tidbits
that are worth sharing with the group. You see, the name of this domain,
"hearth.com" is quite close to the domain "health.com"
, thus I have folks asking me how to get into shape .. here's a recent winner
(it's for real) To: [email protected] Subject: MY SADDLE BAGS
______
HI, I AM SURE YOU GET THIS QUESTION A THOUSAND TIMES, BUT HERE GOES. i WOULD
REALLY LIKE TO IMPROVE THE APPEARANCE OF MY DERIERRE!!!!!!!!!!! ASIDE FROM
THE GRUELING LUNGES THAT MY KNEES REFUSE TO PERFORM, AND SQUATS THAT I CAN
NOT SEEM TO COORDINATE, IS THERE ANYTHING THAT I CAN DO TO LIFT THIS BUTT
OFF THE GROUND AND GET RID OF THESE DIMPLES (CELLULITE) THAT IS DETERMINED
TO ASSURE I NEVER WEAR A THONG AGAIN?
TERRIBLY UNHAPPY WITH THE JUNK IN MY TRUNK, I WANT TO SEE THE FORM AND INDENT
OF A HEALTHY POSTERIOR
_______
Quite funny, eh ?
Reminds me of a cute story from the "old" days of stovedom. There
was a stove called the "Pyramid Stove" that was developed by a
relative of the Gatlings (Gatling Gun)...The salesman claimed that it came
to the designer in a dream (no kidding !)..and that it could heat to far
ends of the house...without getting hot on the ouside ! I took one look
at the single wall stove with firebrick lining and told the rep "If
you let me fire that thing up, then you pull down your pants and sit on
it..then I'll buy a truckload". He refused the offer.
Help !
HearthNet needs some help...more content and more Ideas. I need input and/or
articles on the following:
1. Heat Values and Character of different woods (non-technical)
2. Chimney lining techniques
3. ????? Need more ideas...
If you would kindly surf over to our main informational page - http://hearth.com/what/specific.html
and let me know of any suggestions you may have. As it is, we are going
to do an entire site rewrite over this spring/summer, including the addition
of video and audio files and other multi-media technologies. So, include
Video ideas in your suggestions...please email to [email protected]
Record Month - Now wearing my Stoveworks hat...I'm pleased to report the
best month in our 18 year history. If we can get the product, I'm sure that
December will also follow this trend...We're booked solid thru the first
of the year.
________________
Fresh Air Fixer - Condar has announced a new Fresh Air Ventilator that may
just be the answer to a lot of the "stale air" problems discussed
on this list. Check it out at http://hearth.com/condar
___________________________________________________________________________
This Months Digest Sponsored by: Travis Industries, America's premier manufacturer
of steel wood, gas & pellet hearth products exclusively for the Speciality
Hearth Retailer. See the NEW LOPI Heritage Bay, Discovery Fireplace, Avalon
Avanti DVS Fireplace and Fireplace Xtrordinair 36DV-R & 32DVS gas products
in our Web site. http://hearth.com/travis. Call 1 800 654-1177 or e-mail
us at [email protected] for dealer information. ___________________________________________________________________________
end of Digest - Post messages to [email protected]
This Months Digest Sponsored by: Travis Industries, America's premier manufacturer of steel wood, gas & pellet hearth products exclusively for the Speciality Hearth Retailer. See the NEW LOPI Heritage Bay, Discovery Fireplace, Avalon Avanti DVS Fireplace and Fireplace Xtrordinair 36DV-R & 32DVS gas products in our Web site. http://hearth.com/travis. Call 1 800 654-1177 or e-mail us at [email protected] for dealer information. ___________________________________________________________________________
1. Ramblings on HearthNet and Communications
2. Vent Free Reply
3. Need Speaker for show
1. Ramblings on HearthNet and Communications Date: 04 Dec 96 14:23:16 EST
From: [email protected] (Daniel J B Melcon) Subject: A posting!
Dear Craig;
I have followed with interest the recent postings about Vermont Castings
and CFM, in particular Chris Caron's (you know Jim, the guy from Duraflame;
he's our HPA treasurer and your Northern California neighbor!). I especially
like Chris' point:
"Hearth.net should be a forum for thoughtful, rational discussion of
issues and ideas, and not a medium for spiteful or tit for tat exchanges.
I'm not calling for censorship, I'm suggesting a high standard be set for
the quality of content.... Let's keep the exchanges on this list on the
high road and act professionally. "
Amen. However, I don't like Chris' conclusion that YOU shouldn't allow certain
items to appear. I think Hearth.Net is a great forum, and should be left
wide open. So I am not enthusiastic about having topics be limited, and
I especially don't want you (as web master) to edit, censor, or otherwise
control what is broadcast.
If I want to post something that is totally in left field, cruel, crude,
or libelous, I guess it's your job to contact me directly and say why you
feel its not appropriate. Otherwise, you should facilitate information flow,
not restrict it. And Hearth.net cannot succeed if it is structured to meet
your personal issues or agenda. From our conversations on the funky old
telephone, I realize you know this, but it never hurts to make sure everyone
is clear on the purpose and structure of Hearth.net.
I'd rather have few, if any restrictions. If Majestic wants to announce
a new catalytic vent free product, that's news, and I'd like to be aware
of it. I'll sift through the promotional aspect. And if a dealer takes them
to task for problems he has had, that's okay too; its his right.
However, with rights come responsibilities (that will be the name of my
new political party). This freedom does put a very heavy responsibility
on everyone who contributes to Hearth.net. Having written about the industry
for a dozen years, I've been blasted more than twice by those who didn't
like or agree with some of my opinions (or facts). That's okay, it goes
with the territory. But like they used to say on Hill Street Blues, "Let's
be careful out there".
I'm not passing judgment on anything that has been posted to date; it actually
seems relatively tame compared to some sites. My point is that in this completely
open, unedited, and very valuable forum, all of us need to consider the
possible implications of anything we say.
Dan Melcon
PS. How do you run a store, do this whole Internet thing, and still find
time to romance your bride with Duraflame logs?
webmasters answer- Dan, tell the truth, my love life ain't what it could
be ! - something had to give - I'm now over 43 anyway, and have already
helped repopulate the planet (3 offspring), so celibacy may be better for
me anyway..
_________________________________________
2. Vent Free Reply Mime-Version: 1.0 Date: Wed, 4 Dec 1996 13:39:29 -0500
To: [email protected] From: [email protected] (Noel Gilmore) Subject:
Re: vent free headaches
>From: Fran Marengo
We have 3 unvented units in a showroom a fraction of the size of yours and
have noticed no problems, even when I forget and leave one running (we're
in south Florida...boy, does my air conditioning ever get a workout!).
First question that pops up in my mind is, how susceptible to the power
of suggestion might the afflicted sales people (and yourself) be?
Next question: could this be the "what is the unvented fire burning
along with its oxygen" syndrome to which Craig has alluded in the past?
If tests have not been done on what happens when other gases get added to
this tricky mix, then no one really knows what could cause "CO poisoning-like"
symptoms.
Are you sure the "CO poisoning-like" symptoms ARE CO poisoning
symptoms? Can the affected salespeople have their blood levels checked for
high CO? Then you would know if it actually WAS CO coming from somewhere
(ostensibly the logs) or if it is another vapor.
Does this make sense...anyone?
Noel Gilmore
_________________________
3. Need Speaker for show
Date: Tue, 3 Dec 96 06:22:00 UT From: "John Wallace"
NWHPA is looking for someone to put on a 3 stop dog and pony show on Direct
Vent venting, this is the aera that our members say they need the most help.
Where shell we go to find our expert? Where else but the hearthnet. Please
e - mail [email protected] or use the hearthnet...Thanks JW ----------
___________________________________________________________________________
This Months Digest Sponsored by: Travis Industries, America's premier manufacturer
of steel wood, gas & pellet hearth products exclusively for the Speciality
Hearth Retailer. See the NEW LOPI Heritage Bay, Discovery Fireplace, Avalon
Avanti DVS Fireplace and Fireplace Xtrordinair 36DV-R & 32DVS gas products
in our Web site. http://hearth.com/travis. Call 1 800 654-1177 or e-mail
us at [email protected] for dealer information. ___________________________________________________________________________
end of Digest - Post messages to [email protected]
This Months Digest Sponsored by: Travis Industries,
America's premier manufacturer of steel wood, gas & pellet hearth products
exclusively for the Speciality Hearth Retailer. See the NEW LOPI Heritage
Bay, Discovery Fireplace, Avalon Avanti DVS Fireplace and Fireplace Xtrordinair
36DV-R & 32DVS gas products in our Web site. http://hearth.com/travis. Call
1 800 654-1177 or e-mail us at [email protected] for dealer information.
___________________________________________________________________________
1. Hearth Pillow ?
2. HPA Affiliates
3. China, History and Hearth
From: [email protected] Date: Mon, 9 Dec 1996 13:19:47 -0500 To: [email protected]
Subject: Fireplace flue pillow
With such a accumulated wealth of knowledge out there, I'm hoping someone
can answer my quick question. Have you heard of a "fireplace flue pillow,"
and, if so, do you know who would carry it? Thanks.
2. HPA Affiliates
From: [email protected] Date: Tue, 10 Dec 1996 09:21:29 -0500 To: [email protected]
Subject: HPA Affiliates...Are they worth it....is there interest?
I am curios about something: It seems like the there is an HPA Affiliate
that covers the majority of the country. However, in this part of the Midwest
there is no such organization. I had a conversation with the HPA office
a week ago concerning what was involved with starting an affiliate and was
told that the board of directors have put a hold on any more affiliates.
If I want to pursue it, I would have to get the subject on the adjenda for
the March board meeting. I realize there is a lot of work that goes in to
an organization like this so I would love some feedback before it goes too
far.
I have a question for two different groups: If you belong to an Affiliate...is
it worth it?? Do you get any value from it? Are you involved with making
it work? Do you appreciate the benefits? Do you attend the meeting and/or
educational functions? Or..do you just ignore it and do your own thing??
If you are here in the Midwest (IL, IN, OH, MI, KY)...do you have any interest
in getting an affiliate discussion going?? Are you willing to help?? Does
it seem like I have too much time on my hands?
I realize the HPA's position is dictated by dues money. The more money the
affiliate has, the less money the national organization has. However, I
see some real needs and some real benefits IF affiliates really work.
So, what do you think? Are they worth it? Do we proceed?
Thanks for the opinions, Rick Vlahos Creative Classics Crystal Lake, Il
[email protected] (815) 477-3500 (815) 477-3522 Fax 3. China, History and
Hearth From Craig Issod, [email protected]
As part of our "Help from the Hearth" program, we recently donated
some money to a group that is helping Tibetan monks and nuns. I have heard
some tidbits about the goings-on over there, but didn't know very much about
it.
Last Sundays Philadelphia Inquirer changed all that. There was a front page
article, quite extensive, detailing the torture, genocide and other crimes
China is committing against the Tibetan people. Here's the basic thrust:
China has militarily taken over Tibet, a mountainous county populated by
peaceful people. Chine wants nothing less than to eridicate the memory of
the original culture, and has taken many steps to do so including:
1. Murder 2. Torture of men AND women - of the most brutal nature 3. Closing
and ruining ancient monastaries 4. Arresting people for praying 5. Repopulating
the area with over a million Chinese in an attempt to dilute the culture...then
claim it does not exist 6. Exiling major religious figures
Why is China doing this ? For natural resources and power !
China has little to say on the subject, and the US , having granted "Favored
nation status" to China, does not want to rock the boat. After all,
what would we do without those cheap TV's, Computers, Castings and other
articles of trade.
Meanwhile, the destruction of an entire nation, people, history and religion
goes on.
What does this have to do with the hearth ? Probably not much... I'm fairly
certain that some manufacturers do import castings and other items from
China. These folks should be aware of what is going on over there. If they
don't agree with Chinas actions, they should tell the companies that they
deal with and the Chinese Embassy. Silence means that they agree with the
"status quo". This type of economic and "grass roots"
pressure is the only possibility for stopping the madness.
Dealers--if you handle stoves or accessories made in China, a short note
to your supplier will help show your concern.
Imagine if the US took over Canada, repopulated it with us rude Americans,
tortured the populace-including nuns and priests, destroyed the churches
and history... It's the other side of the world, but this is exactly what
is happening.
Thaks for listening.
Craig
___________________________________________________________________________
This Months Digest Sponsored by: Travis Industries, America's premier manufacturer
of steel wood, gas & pellet hearth products exclusively for the Speciality
Hearth Retailer. See the NEW LOPI Heritage Bay, Discovery Fireplace, Avalon
Avanti DVS Fireplace and Fireplace Xtrordinair 36DV-R & 32DVS gas products
in our Web site. http://hearth.com/travis. Call 1 800 654-1177 or e-mail
us at [email protected] for dealer information. ___________________________________________________________________________
end of Digest - Post messages to [email protected]
This Months Digest Sponsored by: Travis Industries,
America's premier manufacturer of steel wood, gas & pellet hearth products
exclusively for the Speciality Hearth Retailer. See the NEW LOPI Heritage
Bay, Discovery Fireplace, Avalon Avanti DVS Fireplace and Fireplace Xtrordinair
36DV-R & 32DVS gas products in our Web site. http://hearth.com/travis. Call
1 800 654-1177 or e-mail us at [email protected] for dealer information.
___________________________________________________________________________
1. China and Hearth
2. More China and Hearth
3. Getting Rich on the Net
4. Do's and Don't - lessons l;earned the HARD way
5. Hearth at Reno
Craig Issod had said: >Imagine if the US took over Canada, repopulated
it with us rude Americans, >tortured the populace-including nuns and
priests, destroyed the churches >and history... It's the other side of
the world, but this is exactly what >is happening. > >Thanks for
listening.
From: stephen morris
Right on, Craig! I'm not the most political person, but I'm glad to see
someone take a stand and I think it's time we got our collective heads out
of the sand about the exploitation of third world nations for American convenience.
Get on the soapbox anytime!
2. More China and Hearth To: Craig Issod
China is a BIG subject in this mans eye, always has, and always will be
The bottom line is 'assimilation' , not profits.
Did you know that all industry in china is military, stuffed dolls today
.... presto magic .. artic field gear tomarrow... Why design a manufactureing
plant to only produce one thing? Isn't Business War???? and in war , overwhelming
your advisary with cheap prices, more ammo, instant support and resupply
isn't that how we win the Hearth products War?
For crimney sakes just look at Chinas History!! These people built the largest
Masonry mass in history JUST to control outside forces!!!
>Why is China doing this ? For natural resources and power !
This sounds like a Republican platform! Doesn't control of resources and
energy equal power, Just look at who we're all in bed with today in comparision
with 20 years ago....GAS!!!!
>Meanwhile, the destruction of an entire nation, people, history and
>religion goes on.
If i was Chinese I'd buy Walmart/ Bimart/costco/.... Mart/Mart... and offer
every Hearth product out there, and then import sales people and installers
happy to make 100 times their old wage and put all their retirement funds
in fossil fuels....How long would Tiebetans last against that onslaught.
>What does this have to do with the hearth ? Probably not much... I'm
fairly >certain that some manufacturers do import castings and other
items from >China. T.
This has everything to do with the hearth,.... Love, Food, Shelter... every
man, woman and child warm themselves at the hearth... and the Economics
that drive it..
Every dollar spent is a VOTE in favor of the economics that drive it...
reminds me of an old Confucis saying .....'elementry my dear Watson"
willieweep the chimney sweep
3. Getting Rich on the web
From: [email protected] Date: Fri, 13 Dec 1996 11:47:59 -0500 To: [email protected]
Cc: [email protected] Subject: Getting Rich on the web
Wonder if anybody on this list can relate to our experience thus far with
our website.
We published last August, after 3 mos. spent designing, editing and linking
some 168 pages of pictures, pricing & info pertinent to the products we
sell. Our goal was to create a stand-alone vehicle for the web shopper,
with all possible questions anticipated and answered, and all features and
benefits listed for each product, to allow comparison shopping and ordering
online.
A shopper can, for example, click on WOODSTOVES or GAS STOVES or BARBECUES
or KITCHEN PRODUCTS or GAS LOGS, etc. and get a page of thumbnail photos
of all the models we sell, arranged in groups by size. Scrolling down to,
say, the MEDIUM size (1,000 - 1,500 sq.ft.) heater section on the WOODSTOVES
page, he or she can then click on each model to go to a page with a larger
photo and specific features, benefits and pricing for that individual stove.
Another click brings up the installation info page for that model, with
diagrams showing stove dimensions, clearances and hearth sizing. Navigation
buttons appear on every page to allow the shopper to go instantly to each
brand and model in the medium stove area to compare features, benefits & pricing
with the other stoves in that catagory and size.
Since we published, we've paid heed to constructive comments, and spent
many hours streamlining our original concept to make it even easier to navigate
our site. At this point, we're proud to say the thing works like a charm.
A ten-year-old child who might have an interest in any of the products we
sell can navigate our site with ease, and select the one or two models that
will best suit his or her needs and budget. Having thus narrowed the field,
our ten-year-old need only click on the CONTACT THE SWEEP button on any
page to bring up a handy form to fill out to order the product or get further
information.
It's easy. Surf the site, pick the product, complete the form; we do the
rest. So, why does the typical E-mail response thread go like this?..............
Shopper (Monday's mail): Please send pricing on glass fireplace doors.
Me (Tuesday): Thank you for your inquiry. We have several models available,
each of which comes in many sizes and finishes. A complete price list would
overfill your mailbox. Please return to our website at http://www.nas.com/~chimneysweep,
click on the GLASS DOORS button, and pick the model or models that most
interest you. E-mail back your selections, the finish you desire and the
exact dimensions of your fireplace opening, and we'll get right back to
you with pricing and availability.
Shopper (Wednesday): Fireplace is about 24" tall. I like the Glassfyre
II doors.
Me (Thursday): Need exact fireplace opening size (height and width), to
price doors.
Shopper (Friday): Fireplace opening is 25 1/8" tall and 38 3/8"
wide. Include freight with pricing.
Me (Saturday): Pricing for all three Glassfyre II models, each in the eight
finishes available, appears below. Need to know where you live in order
to compute freight.
Shopper (Sunday): Oops. Here's my address. Send me a brochure on the Glassfyre
II doors by regular mail while you're at it.
Me (Monday): Here's freight pricing, showing UPS ground, express, and next
day rates. Your brochure goes out today's mail. Please let me know if you
have any questions.
Shopper ( Several days later): Found the manufacturer's phone number on
the brochure you sent, and gave them a call. Turns out there's a dealer
right in my neighborhood! Ordered my new door from them today. Thanks for
the help.
Multiply this dance by the thirty or so hits we get each day, and throw
in those special requests like, "Send me everything you've got about
wood, gas, coal and pellet stoves and fireplaces", then spice the mixture
with the fact that, so far, we've made exactly one $115.00 sale from a website
lead. The result, so far, is a time-consuming pain in the neck.
Would love to hear from the other members of this list with websites, particularly
those who are making scads of sales.
Tom Oyen THE CHIMNEY SWEEP [email protected]
Reply (edited) from Craig Issod - [email protected]
Fact is, I know SEVERAL members of Hearthnet that have done 50,000 or more
(including myself) just from the web. Some have done over 100K.
I can even tell you about folks who are on our list of dealers who made
MULTIPLE sales, and still do not have any web pages up ! JUST FROM THE LISTING
!
Of course, this will sound like I am blowing my own horn...and I am...but
you failed to use all the resources at your disposal - for one... HearthNet
( I don't think you are listed) and my consulting company. We could have
told you what is worth doing, what is not (from direct experience) and worked
out an acceptable risk/reward budget for you.
MANY folks are doing what you did, throwing a lot of time, money and aggravation
against the wall hoping some will stick. Many are finding that it will not.
The original Idea of HearthNet was that there was power in numbers...Hundreds
of small sites out there in stoveland could not draw the same amount of
traffic and PR as one could. This is the same idea behind a magazine - surely
each retailer and manufacturer cannot afford to produce, print and distribute
their own magazine to the entire world - same with a web site.
Your Glass door shopper bought local, and our stores have made scads of
LOCAL sales on the net. I think this is the best possible setup...to expand
our local and regional markets.
Tom, before I started HearthNet, we were the first fireplace retailer on
the Net. I was getting hundreds of visitors per day, and selling all over
the US...then I came to a crossroads - two choices - wither expand my services
to be a "mail-order" outfit, or start HearthNet and share the
wealth. As you know, I chose the later...and so far it has worked out quite
well.
Make no mistake about it - direct sales are possible on the net - But to
make a success of it would require MUCH more time, energy and money than
any of us have put into our sites.
Craig
PS...Some members of HearthNet (including myself) are swapping leads with
other members resulting in more localized sales for all of us ! More "power
in numbers".
4.Lessons learned the HARD way ! J. A. Harman [email protected]
Here are a few things that I have learned in the last couple of years that
I would like to share with everyone. These things I either did, didn't do,
or was starting to do.
1) Never, never, never sign a contract without your OWN lawyer reading it
first.
2) NEVER, NEVER, NEVER, NEVER trust someone you "think" is a friend
when it comes to business, money or both. Friends don't let friends get
screwed over.
These are the all time biggest mistakes that I have ever made!!!!! Boy was
I stupid!!! I don't think I will ever stop kicking myself. This leads to
the third thing besides a sore butt.
3) If it is to good to be true, well, you know the rest. Don't ever let
opportunity blind you. 4) Be honest with your customers and suppliers. Thank
God this wasn't a problem for me. 5) However, procrastination is a problem
I am still learning to cope with. Don't procrastinate. 6) Do not bad mouth
other brands or dealers to customers. I won more sales because one of my
competitors regularly did this and I didn't. 7) Be reasonable about controversial
issues such as "reline your chimney or not". I also won a lot
of insert sales because of a more reasonable approach to this issue than
my competitors. 8) Stay consistent. Stay consistent. Stay consistent. Can't
say this enough. 9) Change your window and floor displays regularly (consistently
). 10) Don't fall into the temptation to run a sale one after another. Even
an annual sale could hurt you. Be careful with the sales. 11) Be careful
with independent chimney sweeps. The ones out here preach NFPA 211 as the
absolute authority regardless of manufactures instructions and the authority
having jurisdiction ( this authority goes by manufacturer instructions,
at least in my area ). 12) Don't let anyone push you around, customer, supplier,
government or anyone else. 13) Your families spiritual, emotional, and physical
needs ALWAYS, ALWAYS come before anything else. 14) If you are stupid enough
to let numbers 1 and 2 happen to you, don't let this ruin your faith in
people. There are still good people out there. Personally my motto now is
"People Suck!!!". Its a good thing I am in the field more than
on the sales floor.
Well, I can't think of anything else. You "old timers" out there
are probably thinking "I know that". In this busy time I hope
this jogs your memory. And to anyone out there still trying to graduate
from the University of Hard Knocks, maybe this will help.
May everyone have a wonderful season!!!!
Thanks Craig!!!!
J. A. Harman [email protected]
5.Hearth at Reno
Date: Fri, 13 Dec 1996 12:44:09 -0500 From: Ben Weathersby
Contact: Ben Weathersby
HEARTH Education Foundation Training and Certification Exams at Reno
HEARTH will offer three important pre-show training opportunities as well
as all of its four certification exams throughout the show at Expo 97 in
Reno. Training sessions will be held Thursday, March 6 at the Reno Hilton
(not the convention center). The lineup includes:
Gas Exam Prep Training, Thursday 8-5, Reno Hilton, Carson 3. This review
of the HEARTH Gas Training Manual is an opportunity to increase your professional
knowledge and to become a Certified Gas Hearth Appliances Specialist. Dont
miss Mac McGraws presentation that brings great reviews and high test scores.
The $150 registration fee includes the manual and exam, which are themselves
valued over $200.
Pellet Exam Prep Training, Thursday 9-5, Reno Hilton, Teton 1 & 2. This
review of the Pellet Training Manual, the premier industry reference by
pellet veteran Chuck Brewster will help you gain knowledge and get the certification
that makes you the recognized expert. $150 registration fee includes the
$100 manual and $150 exam fee.
Chimney Performance in Modern Homes, Thursday 9-5, Reno Hilton, Ruby 1 & 2.
Learn the cutting edge approach to house as a system chimney design. John
Gulland gives you an understandable, reliable technique. $150 registration
fee includes the manual which the prestigious Energy Design Update newsletter
called the best-organized and most useful publication on chimneys.
You can also conveniently take Certification Exams at Reno. Gas, Pellet,
Woodstove, and Fireplace Exam Sessions will be offered 10 times during the
show dates at the Reno Hilton Hotel. You can register for as many exams
as you want, and if you are taking the Gas or Pellet Training, you can take
exams at the show or at your local library within 6 months after the show.
Call us for special show prices on individual exams and manuals. Exam sessions
(Woodstove is a 2 hour exam; others 1 1/2 hours) will be offered: Thursday,
March 6: 5:30-7:30 pm Friday, March 7: 7-9 am; 10-noon; 1-3 pm; 4-6 pm Saturday,
March 8: 8-10 am; 11-1 pm; 2-4 pm Sunday, March 9: 12-2 pm; 3-5 pm
Registration is by phone (802) 728-3569 or fax (802) 728-9657 and payment
by Visa or by check/money order. Seating for training sessions is limited.
Early registration also gets your manuals to you sooner for more preparation
time and maximum training benefits.
HEARTH will also maintain a booth on the trade show floor. Be sure to visit
to get the latest on exciting new programs for 1997 and to highlight your
name on the HEARTH Certified Specialist Honor Roll. Be sure to stop by Booth
751.
___________________________________________________________________________
This Months Digest Sponsored by: Travis Industries, America's premier manufacturer
of steel wood, gas & pellet hearth products exclusively for the Speciality
Hearth Retailer. See the NEW LOPI Heritage Bay, Discovery Fireplace, Avalon
Avanti DVS Fireplace and Fireplace Xtrordinair 36DV-R & 32DVS gas products
in our Web site. http://hearth.com/travis. Call 1 800 654-1177 or e-mail
us at [email protected] for dealer information. ___________________________________________________________________________
end of Digest - Post messages to [email protected]
This Months Digest Sponsored by: Travis Industries,
America's premier manufacturer of steel wood, gas & pellet hearth products
exclusively for the Speciality Hearth Retailer. See the NEW LOPI Heritage
Bay, Discovery Fireplace, Avalon Avanti DVS Fireplace and Fireplace Xtrordinair
36DV-R & 32DVS gas products in our Web site. http://hearth.com/travis. Call
1 800 654-1177 or e-mail us at [email protected] for dealer information.
___________________________________________________________________________
1. Web Sales
2. More on China
Date: Sun, 15 Dec 1996 16:35:10 -0600 To: [email protected] From: [email protected]
(The Energy Store) Subject: can't get em all
Tom Oyen's whining about loosing some web sales and Craig Issods chest pounding
response revealing more free secrets about web marketing was very interesting........
Craig please ... you do deserve credits but softly...softly..... and don't
give away all the secrets on how to make money on the web too freely. They
are all competition in some ways.
Tom, have you ever operated a retail store? I am sure you have........ You
know we sell lots of stuff for the mass merchants and large discount stores
and our legitimate competition every day by helping a potential customer
become more knowlegeable during our sales presentation. It is just a fact
that you don't make every sale. The web is no different.... some of your
customers....... even after hours of personal informative help..........
will purchase elsewhere.... even locally. We regularly lay out DuraVent
chimney systems on our DuraVent website and we have no idea if or what the
web customers eventually purchase..... it is part of the overhead. We assume
most people do buy locally.
As for some free web marketing advise...... if you need to send out the
manufacturers literature on a product that you have on you site...... then
you need to add something to your site. It is a very costly mistake to try
to follow up web inquiries with the mail... We spent umpppa dollars before
we woke up and realized that in most cases our site was providing all of
the information that was on the manufacturers brochure and more... yet we
still recieved requests for hard copy. Our gas log site had better pictures
and a lot more detail than the standard brochure but we still got requests
for literature....... I think it is an old trait that the consumer on the
web will have to overcome... Now we refer the customers asking for hard
copy or additional information to the manufacturers site, when available.....let
them send out the literature or let the web shopper explore the manufacturers
site (sure they will get some dealer names but so what).... or better still
we offer them a copy of our HearthWarming Magazine which we will mail to
them for $5.00 (There is a plug for you Richard even if we don't see much
web support coming from you..... something about the web should be in every
issue)
http://www.weyrkeep.com/direct/hw.html
I must say that your site looks great Tom and has lots of information.....
glad to find it as we always need some fresh new ideas to plagerize. };-)
Isn't the wild wild web fun? kg-one
Visit the Emporium - We Lite Up Your Hearth's Desires http://www.weyrkeep.com
1-800-722-FIRE Dragons Breathe Best Together Forge a Stronger Fire
2. More on China Date: Sat, 14 Dec 1996 14:47:48 +0000 From: Roger Sanders
Craig Issod wrote: > 3. China, History and Hearth
Craig,
Thanks for the China/Tibet posting. It's a good break from unsolvable stove
problems to solve the world's problems. I think we all need a little change!
I do take strong exception to your inference that if we just quit buying
from China, they will be nice to Tibet.
You and I are, but everybody can't be a Vermont Castings dealer yet. If
some dealers sell Earth Stoves or other brands with parts from China, that's
great! A few Chinese components might just help keep stoves prices down
for all our customers. Dealers should care a lot more about manufacturers
supporting customers and about product reliability, than about where stove
components come from!!
You're absolutely right however, about China devastating Tibet. But Craig,
where have you been for the last 70 years or so? You ask why is China doing
this to Tibet? China is COMMUNIST! Communists have to make everyone totally
dependent on their government (a little like Hillary and her Health Care).
You need to understand the communist value system and you can answer your
own question. It's very simple: All that is good comes from government.
Everything else is by definition, bad. Non-communist traditions are bad.
God and Religion is bad because it doesn't come from government. Capitalism
is bad because it is like Mafia and takes money from people. Personal freedom
is bad because people are not dependent on government. So, destroying Tibet
is just normal for them. Remember, China is doing less political cleansing
these days than they used to.
Why do you need to make up an image of the US taking over Canada to see
how bad big government can be? Just look back at historical reality. Remember
someone named Chairman Mao? He cleansed and killed a few million fellow
Chinese that didn't fit into his communist big government before the Tibet
situation began. Do you remember good old Uncle Joe Steel (Joseph Stalin)?
He killed about 20 million Russians and their neighbors in order to politically
cleanse and make the rest totally dependent on his communist big government.
Belarus is finally admitting that Uncle Joe even killed over 100,000 of
his own Russian army officers in a forest near Minsk. It was just one small
event in Uncle Joe's starving, torturing and shooting millions every year
who didn't like his brand of communism. Even Hitler, as evil as he and his
NAZI (National SOCIALIST Party) government were, wasn't as bad as Uncle
Joe's communist government.
By the way, you don't have to look elsewhere for big government caused personal
destruction. Look at the misery our own socialist welfare state philosophy
has brought to our citizens in our inner cities. We're not cleansing them
like the Chinese do, but the incredible hopelessness, drugs and crime there
comes very close. Almost all those folks are now completely dependent on
our government for food stamps, utilities, rent subsidies,rent price controls
or government housing. They have no hope. The Chinese could certainly ask
you Craig, why our government destroys the lives of as many citizens in
our inner cities as they do in Tibet?
Back to Tibet. Why do you think that withholding trade (in it's best form
an embargo) will magically make Chinese communists nice? Trade embargoes
only hurt the poor working people. They will only work on dictatorships
like the communists create, if they're total embargoes that cause an internal
revolution. A military occupation is then needed to insure the old government
doesn't come back. How many million Americans will it then take to occupy
China? We can't even make Sadam and Castro be nice by using trade embargoes
on them. They're nobodies relative to China.
Here are two other solutions that will work, if you want to stop communist
brutality: The first is the MacArthur solution. Harry Truman fired MacArthur
because our General got carried away and wanted to solve the Chinese communist
problem with a few H-bombs. The other solution is to trade with the Chinese
until they become as much a capitalist as you are Craig. In the process
they'll become dependent on our dollars and their communist government will
go the way of the Soviet, the Polish, the East German, the Hungarian, the
Rumanian, the Czech, the Latvian, the Lithuanian, the Estonian etc.communist
governments.
By the way Craig, pop the cases off your Macs. You'll probably find some
components from China in them that were sold to other far east manufacturers,
who make many of the sub-assemblies in your Macs. Our Macs are very happy
with their Chinese parts.
Lets let our hearth manufacturers buy Chinese if it's good business for
them. If our current Democratic Party Executive Branch is good for anything
it should be international politics. It's sure reasonable to expect that
our current leader, Honest Bill Clinton (and not our hearth manufacturers),
will keep pressure on the Chinese internationally, for their brutality.
Honest Bill may not be much of a military threat to the Chinese, but he
at least can keep them embarrassed for their actions.
You'd think we could depend on our 89% Democratic Party voting, alleged
"unbiased" press to keep telling the world about Tibet. Unfortunately
their obvious priorities are for: a.The easy money O.J.stories, with as
much blood as possible. b.Always making big government look good. c.Not
embarrassing Honest Bill. d. Finishing all news in 7 minutes so there is
time for sports and those items that promote their politically correct prejudices.
Unfortunately, Craig, we can't depend on Honest Bill or his "unbiased"
press for much that is good. We can give China a big dose of capitalism
though. We should all pitch in and "trade" the Chinese communist
government to death. Tibet can then have a chance to be free again.
Thanks for the opportunity to disagree with you.
Roger Sanders Fireside Spa & Patio [email protected]
Webmaster's Reply (from Craig Issod, [email protected])
Roger, perhaps you read things into my post that were not there. I did not
say for folks to stop buying from China...just to express their concern.
This is Democracy in action - if China gets NO resistance, they will just
go ahead as is...Amnesty International has saved many from prison and torture,
just by letting the offending parties know "we are watching you".
The nuns who were sat in water and prodded with electric cattle prods don't
want to wait until our brand of capitalism "saves" China. They
just want to live life, help people and try to attain their "enlightenment"
I'll choose to end this topic now, as it is getting off the Hearth Topic..
I think we can all agree that torture and genocide are not the types of
activity we like to support. Just as one might be concerned about child
or slave labor producing our products, we should be concerned about other
"problem" events.
___________________________________________________________________________
This Months Digest Sponsored by: Travis Industries, America's premier manufacturer
of steel wood, gas & pellet hearth products exclusively for the Speciality
Hearth Retailer. See the NEW LOPI Heritage Bay, Discovery Fireplace, Avalon
Avanti DVS Fireplace and Fireplace Xtrordinair 36DV-R & 32DVS gas products
in our Web site. http://hearth.com/travis. Call 1 800 654-1177 or e-mail
us at [email protected] for dealer information. ___________________________________________________________________________
end of Digest - Post messages to [email protected]
This Months Digest Sponsored by: Travis Industries,
America's premier manufacturer of steel wood, gas & pellet hearth products
exclusively for the Speciality Hearth Retailer. See the NEW LOPI Heritage
Bay, Discovery Fireplace, Avalon Avanti DVS Fireplace and Fireplace Xtrordinair
36DV-R & 32DVS gas products in our Web site. http://hearth.com/travis. Call
1 800 654-1177 or e-mail us at [email protected] for dealer information.
___________________________________________________________________________
Happy Holidays to all on the list...I sincerely hope that you have all had
a prosperous and/or educational year !
How big is this Internet thing, anyway ? Seems to be the question on the
minds of many of us list members and the public at large. I spend a lot
of my time researching this same query.
And so, I made the trek up to the Big Apple, Yes, NY-NY last week, to attend
Fall Internet World, the gathering of the "wired" masses. When
we talk BIG, we talk about places like the Jacob Javits convention center
in New York City. This Place is MASSIVE..and filled to the brim with the
likes of IBM, Digital, Apple, MicroSoft, Netscape, and hundreds of other
small and medium size companies.
After wandering for many hours, I came to the following conclusions:
It's WAY bigger than any of us think. When Multi-Billion dollar corporations
have to COMPLETELY REWRITE their business plans (Microsoft, Apple, IBM and
Digital among them) - this means something !
NO ONE KNOWS WHAT IS GOING ON..It's too big for anyone to possibly understand.
Each org or person may know a bit abount what is going on right around them...
but the overall picture is way too wide.
Suprises are everywhere - I sat at lunch with a guy from Digital Equipment
Corp. He said that Digital is doing a complete about-face to try to provide
heavy duty hardware for the Net. Turns out their great search engine, Altvista,is
the cornerstone of the whole company now ! They thought it was just another
search engine when they started it, and now it's defining their company.
I told him the HearthNet story, and he was completely floored ! He left
the table saying "Wait til I tell the guys back at the booth about
this".
You have not seen nothing yet - 3-D Worlds, with Avatars (digital representations
of YOU that can meet, talk and interact in these 3-D worlds) will be a part
of the future. Imagine a stove showroom that is completely 3-D, where you
can go into the seperate showrooms and view different products - Music is
playing in the background, and you are watching video of the burning display
units. This can be done NOW. In fact, if I had the time, I'd come up with
the first "Virtual Stove Showroom" on the Net...I'm hoping to
at least have a crude demo for the Reno Show.
enjoy...and peace....
1. Greeting Card
2. Philospophy...final say..
3. Getting Rich on the web
1. Greeting Card
Date: Sun, 15 Dec 1996 21:42:31 -0500 (EST) X-Url: http://www.michaels.com/
To: [email protected] From: [email protected] (kg fulgione)
Subject: Hearth Warming Wishes for a Healthy & Joyful New Year
Hearthlist Members, kg fulgione has send you a personalized InterNote greeting
card!
To retrieve your greeting card, open your world wide web (WWW) browser program
and go to the URL:
http://199.170.0.219/your-card/holiday/ [email protected]
If you wish, you may copy the above address and paste it into your browser's
URL location windows.
Please be aware that your card will only be available for the next 30 days
at this address.
Have a great day!
2. Philospophy...final say..
Date: Sun, 15 Dec 1996 21:23:22 -0600 To: [email protected] From: [email protected]
(Kg) Subject: whoa....cognito ergo sum
Whoa......... finally after 28 years I find an opportunity to use my Bachelors
degree in Philosophy (with a minor in social studies and an emphsasis on
Russian studies no less) with the my present business in Hearth ..... I
always new all my work with SDS in the 60's would come in handy for more
than just organizing food coops as a youth. But for some reason, even though
I could go into a long discourse explaining where Roger has most of it wrong
..... I do not feel this is the proper forum to carry on this discourse.....
nor do I wish to voice my displeasure with China, or Brazil, or Bolivia,
or ElSalvadore, or Saudi Arabia, or Pakastan, or Iran, or Lebanon or many
of the many other crazies of the world..... I would rather use another forum
for that and spend more time discussing Hearth on this forum.
Of course, this does NOT mean we can not elude to the distruction of the
Ozone that is being proliferated by our own greed..... when we aid in promoting
the extensive use of our limited resourse of dinosaur remains < know
in part as "gas"> .........but... Hey..... it Looooooooooks
gooooood! Now>>> "THAT" we can discuss. How did some
of us get to this point... when we started from a conservation concern.
How did the "Green" movement concerns change from the green of
the environment to the green of money? I don't know that answer but I would
be curious to gain some insight.
3. Getting Rich on the web
Date: Tue, 17 Dec 1996 07:10:09 -0500 To: [email protected] From: [email protected]
(Noel Gilmore) Subject: Getting Rich on the web
>From: [email protected] >Date: Fri, 13 Dec 1996 11:47:59 -0500 >Subject:
Getting Rich on the web > >Wonder if anybody on this list can relate
to our experience thus far with >our website.
YES, I can. So far most responses are similar to those you've received,
except I apologize to folks requesting info on large items explaining we
are a small store dealing locally and have no facilities to do mail order.
I have had a couple of nibbles from folks doing business in Central or South
America (we're in FL) but no sales yet. The respondents you describe are
the sorts of folks looking for a catalog-type business hoping to collect
all the catalogs and compare for who has the cheapest deal, and, of course,
you and I are not in that type of business. Myself, I just wanted a presence
on the Net, mostly so local folks could a) find that such a business exists
near them and b) get a look at the picture of my showroom so they know there
is something worth coming to see. I even have my web page address in my
Yellow Pages ad.
Noel Gilmore Autumn Moon Fireplaces
4. Green of Money [email protected] (Craig Issod)
the Kg-One said __
>>>How did the "Green" movement concerns change from
the green of the environment to the green of money? I don't know that answer
but I would be curious to gain some insight
Well, here's my two cents...No one should be embarrassed if they prosper.
A friend once told me " Money's a barometer of how you are doing".
If so, your financial success is something to be proud of (of course, pride
is one of the 7 deadly sins, but that's another topic)
As far as Gas, keep a few things in mind. First of all, I'm convinced that
the gas log customer who previously burned a cord of wet wood is spewing
FAR less pollutants into our air... So, this is conservation of a sort.
Also, our industry is striving to produce safer and more efficient appliances,
another step in the right direction.
Most important, we are selling knowledge, safety and peace of mind. Whether
wood, coal, pellet, solar or gas - we owe it to our customers to educate
and inform them.
Evolution occurs slowly..sometimes too slowly for my taste. However, we
as an industry have done much to improve the hearths and homes of our clients,
which is evident by the high customer satisfaction rate.
Maybe I'd rather everyone burn wood in an efficient stove, but that's not
the way of the world. So, I'll do my best to give our customers the bes
products and service, and try to keep our employees and suppliers happy
and prosperous.
Craig
___________________________________________________________________________
This Months Digest Sponsored by: Travis Industries, America's premier manufacturer
of steel wood, gas & pellet hearth products exclusively for the Speciality
Hearth Retailer. See the NEW LOPI Heritage Bay, Discovery Fireplace, Avalon
Avanti DVS Fireplace and Fireplace Xtrordinair 36DV-R & 32DVS gas products
in our Web site. http://hearth.com/travis. Call 1 800 654-1177 or e-mail
us at [email protected] for dealer information. ___________________________________________________________________________
end of Digest - Post messages to [email protected]
----------------------------------------------------------
This month's Hearth Digest is sponsored by HearthStone. HearthStone makes
unique quality products for the finest specialty hearth retailers. Check
out the stunning new Sterling available in September. Call 1-800-82-STOVE
or visit our Web site at http://hearth.com/hearthstone -- email [email protected]
_____________________________________________________________ OK, I'm not
a very good artist, but for those of you who want to check out my first
attempt at making a flying Axe chop thru a piece of wood, go to http://hearth.com/what/specific.html
Please email me and let me know if I should give up on my graphic arts attempts
!
1. He's Back
2. HPA Site Registration
3. Co-Branding
4. Direct Vent Caution - into existing chimney
1. He's Back
(From Craig Issod, [email protected]) Apple is buying Next for about
$400 Million and integrating it into Apple. Steve Jobs will become Advisor
to the Chairman and CEO of Apple (Gil Amelio). The goal is to ship Next
software on Apple hardware in 1997. __End of Press Release
Jobs was the founder of Apple, who was kicked out when Scully (from Pepsi)
gained power. Now, they need him to help propel the company into the future.
For the non-geeks out there..this NEXT software is FAR superior to Windows95
or the current MacOS (Mac Operating system). It has all the best parts of
MAC (friendly, Graphics, ) of Windows NT ( stable, do many things at once)
and unix (lots of powerful stuff). Should be interesting as the War between
MIcroSoft-Intel (Pentium/Windows) and Apple/Motorola/IBM (PowerPc, Mac,
etc) continues...Of course, we consumers will be the big winners as the
power filters down to us !
2. HPA Site - On-Line registration
Date: Thu, 19 Dec 1996 12:27:28 -0800 From: Kate Poindexter
Craig:
The Hearth Products Association (HPA) is currently providing a new service
which may be of interest to your readers. HPA members who are "wired"
may now register to attend HPA's Hearth & Home EXPO '97 on-line. As you
know, our web site (www.hearthassoc.org) provides information about the
association's activities and general information about the hearth products
industry. We have now added a show registration form (easily accessible
from the home page) to our site. HPA offers this form on-line for the convenience
of our members who use the Internet. Of course, registration forms have
already been mailed to members. Those who wish to fax or mail completed
forms will find instructions on them. Whatever your registration preference
is, HPA encourages you to REGISTER NOW.
Remember, the show is a bit early this year (March 5 -10). Education sessions
begin March 5 and run through March 9. The show floor opens March 7 and
exhibits remain up through March 10.
See you in Reno.
--- Kate Poindexter Director of Communications Hearth Products Association
[email protected]
3. Co-Branding
From [email protected] (Craig Issod) As most of you know, Martha (the
webmistress) and I own a couple of Hearth stores. One of my managers called
me today complaining that a local gas utility was selling the EXACT same
log set as us under a different name - for a much lower price. A little
digging showed that the brand was Wonderfire, and the log set seemed identical
to the ones we sell under the Vermont Castings name. OK, nothing much in
this so far...but here's the thing that bugs me - The literature for said
log set was identical to the Vermont Castings literature, except the word
Vermont Castings was replaced with Wonderfire. Even the VC address was on
the literature...leaving little doubt in the customers mind. What's the
point in co-branding if it's totally obvious to every customer and retailer
that the products are identical ? Sure, we in the Hearth Industry know that
Timberline makes these logs under a few names...but it sure would be nice
if customers were oblivious to these facts. We did well with these log sets,
but we don't enjoy looking like fools to our customers, and with the gas
company having a store a few miles away - and having the ability to mail
to millions (as bill stuffers) - it could get tougher to make a living.
What's the solution? - If Vendors are going to sell their products under
different names, they should make the packaging, literature and even the
product different. This allows them to keep their commitments to the specialty
retailer while branching out in other directions. Saving a few bucks in
literature just might not be worth the cost !
4. Direct Vent Caution - into existing chimney Webmasters note- the writer
of this pieces asked for me to withold their name...i saw no problem, as
the post is informative and the name would not add anything to the post..
Date: Fri, 20 Dec 1996 11:04:10 -0500 To: [email protected] Subject:
Direct Vent Installation
WARNING! WARNING! WARNING!
If you are selling or installing DV appliances you need to be aware that
some units on the market do not comply with the code. In particular, there
are several products which, according to the manufacturer, can be installed
using existing chimneys as part of the combustion air supply system. These
units carry UL's stamp of approval but they do not meet the requirements
of the ANSI safety standards.
The ANSI standards, it seems, require that the venting and combustion air
system be provided with the appliance. There is no mention that use of existing
chimneys is OK. Further, the standards have detailed test requirements for
leakage from the vent and combustion air components. Obviously no one is
testing the leakage from existing chimneys!
I don't pretend to understand what the safety issues are for units which
are installed in a way that clearly violates the safety standard, but I
can make a pretty good guess about the legal implications. If an accident
happens involving one of these installations the lawyers will quickly figure
out that the product does not comply with the standard. I don't think that
the jury will be particularly impressed with the fact that the manufacturer
and UL both decided that the requirements of the standard were not important!
I have discovered that changes to the standards were proposed which would
have legitimized the "existing chimney" installation. For whatever
reasons, the ANSI committee did not accept the change. I have also discovered
that the two major laboratories which test these products, IAS and Warnock-Hersey
do not allow manufacturers to violate these requirements.
With all the apparent problems with DV units (booms) I do not want to add
to my exposure by selling or installing sytems which are plainly not in
compliance with the standard specified by the building code!
The following are quotes from the new ANSI Z21.50 "Harmonized"
Gas Fireplace Standard. These are apparently common to all the ANSI DV standards.
"1.19.2 The vent/air intake pipes shall be supplied as part of the
direct vent system."
"2.29 JOINTS IN DIRECT VENT SYSTEMS
Joints in direct vent systems shall be tight. This provision shall be deemed
met if leakage from the system is not in excess of the limits specified
in the following Method of Test. After completion of section 2.10, the manufacturer
can provide another unit that has passed one delayed ignition test before
commencing the following test."
This section then goes on to describe a very detailed test to measure leakage
from both the flue pipe and air intake pipe systems. The air intake leakage
limit would be 48 cubic feet per hour - less than 1 CFM - for a 40,000 btu
unit. In addition the standard requires the measurement at 0.1 inches water
column - this is 3 or 4 times normal flue draft levels.
End of Digest - Send posts to [email protected] ----------------------------------------------------------
This month's Hearth Digest is sponsored by HearthStone. HearthStone makes
unique quality products for the finest specialty hearth retailers. Check
out the stunning new Sterling available in September. Call 1-800-82-STOVE
or visit our Web site at http://hearth.com/hearthstone -- email [email protected]
_____________________________________________________________
----------------------------------------------------------
This month's Hearth Digest is sponsored by HearthStone. HearthStone makes unique quality products for the finest specialty hearth retailers. Check out the stunning new Sterling available in September. Call 1-800-82-STOVE or visit our Web site at http://hearth.com/hearthstone -- email [email protected] _____________________________________________________________
We get letters Dept.
As webmaster of HearthNet, i get a lot of interesting mail. I truly enjoy
answering the "Stump the Webmaster" questions and comments from
the "hearth" public and trade. Most enjoyable, however, are the
comments from folks who have learned something from the site and/or will
help spread the word. This is networking in it's true sense.
Here's two of today's comments, including one that has a nice link to a
COOOLLLL "code" site.
This first one should dispel the notions of those "What does the Web
have to do with hearth?" pundits. _________________________________________
From: [email protected] To: [email protected] Subject: how
to start a wood fire Date: Sat, 21 Dec 96 20:10:41 EST Sender: [email protected]
Thank you for the web page :) my girlfriend and I were having a hard time
getting one starting for the past few hours so that we decide to search
in the web. Following your instructions, it worked the first time :) thanks
Bwolen _________________________________________ (webmasters note - Just
imagine that the romance started earlier because of HearthNet...instead
of "Why can't you get it going - growlll", I hear "Prrrrr
.. Honey, that fire is beautiful and warm")
and from a former code official (visit this site !) _________________________________________
Date: Sat, 21 Dec 1996 16:21:45 +0000 From: Redwood Kardon
My compliments on your website. In this world of informational facades,
it's great to run across a site with some real content, some meat.
Please take a look at my site. My link to your site is at http://www.codecheck.com/intro.htm#mechanicallinks
To see my homepage go to http://www.codecheck.com
Hope this is the beginning of a great exhange. ____________________________________________
IN this digest:
1. Co - Branding 2. Comments on above
Date: Sun, 22 Dec 96 01:24:22 UT From: "PAT MARTIN"
Yesterday, Craig Issod said: 3. Co-Branding
>From [email protected] (Craig Issod) As most of you know, Martha
(the webmistress) and I own a couple of Hearth stores. One of my managers
called me today complaining that a local gas utility was selling the EXACT
same log set as us under a different name -for a much lower price. --end
of quote--
Does anybody other than me think that this is really the wrong way to look
at this. If one of my manufacturers does this to me I drop them RIGHT NOW.
What is the point of selling products that the consumer can get cheaper
somewhere else with a different name. Think about it. If you are the consumer
(which we are), would you spend more on the same product with a different
name if you know better? I say no and if our customer finds out that they
could have bought the same log cheaper and they are going to be pissed.
Will that customer come back and buy an insert for their other fireplace
from us knowing this? No way and they will tell their friends too. There
are plenty of products out there that do not sell under different names
so why not but from them. The products are really not that much better that
we should cheat our customers out of a better deal. Pat Martin
2. Comments on above Craig Issod ([email protected])
Pat, many folks agree with you, and I can't even say I disagree. There are
some points to make though.
A customer can ALMOST ALWAYS find the same or similar product they are purchasing
from you at a lower price elsewhere. This is true in MOST trades. So we
are fooling ourselves if we think we are the low price leader. Example..insulated
chimney. We give 20% off, while most of the Hearth shops in our area sell
at near list. Are we cheap ? Heck, no...the plumbing supply will sell at
30% off to the many off the street, and 40% off if you know them well.
Most popular gas logs, like Peterson, Temco, etc, are mass marketed by utilities,
dealers, and distributors with little regard for territory..yet retailers
such as us are selling scads of the product. Why? (here goes my big secrets
- hope my competition isn't listening)
1. We spent over 60K remodeling the showrooms to show the logs and products
burning for comparison. Included are two "walls of fire" where
multiple gas logs are under one hood.
2. We are nice to people (this is #1 important)
3. We give good advice and try to be accurate
4. We stand behind our product.
So, there are many decisions to be made. Maybe one manufacturer gives us:
1. No territory 2. Great Prices 3. Good warranty 4. Good terms
and another gives
1. Exclusivity 2. Mediocre prices 3. No warranty reimbursment 4. Poor dating
and terms
Which one would you choose...it's not always so easy !
Love to hear comments from others on the list.
Craig
End of Digest - Send posts to [email protected] ----------------------------------------------------------
This month's Hearth Digest is sponsored by HearthStone. HearthStone makes
unique quality products for the finest specialty hearth retailers. Check
out the stunning new Sterling available in September. Call 1-800-82-STOVE
or visit our Web site at http://hearth.com/hearthstone -- email [email protected]
_____________________________________________________________
This Months Digest Sponsored by: Travis Industries,
America's premier manufacturer of steel wood, gas & pellet hearth products
exclusively for the Speciality Hearth Retailer. See the NEW LOPI Heritage
Bay, Discovery Fireplace, Avalon Avanti DVS Fireplace and Fireplace Xtrordinair
36DV-R & 32DVS gas products in our Web site. http://hearth.com/travis. Call
1 800 654-1177 or e-mail us at [email protected] for dealer information.
___________________________________________________________________________
Hearth Digest 12/30/96
First of all, I'd like to wish everyone on the list a Happy New Year ! This
will be the last digest of 1996.
It was a very good year for most of us in the Hearth Biz.
Two Quick thoughts before I go to sleep tonite.
1st: AOL (America Online) sucks ! - Yes, I'm usually not so frank, but truth
must be told. I have recently "upgraded" to their newest software
and find that it is a giant step backwards..or sideways at best. I've been
a subscriber for over 6 years, and have put up with poor service during
most of that time. I kept thinking that they'd catch up someday...and get
it together - well, they have not.
Besides the obvious problems, like the SSLLLOOWWWW speed, hangups, time
waiting for flashy graphics to download, etc. - the BIGGEST PROBLEM is their
so-called Internet Access. Their browser software (the software that you
look at the web with) is about 3-4 times slower than Netscape. Worse yet,
American Online does wierd things with web pages. Beccause AOL is trying
to satisfy so many users at once, their computers "cache" web
pages, which means they take them off the servers computers (located somewhere
else) and store them on AOL"s computer. This means that you do not
always get the most recent version of a web page. Worse yet, there are many
sites that you cannot even get into with AOL's browser!
If you do make it to your favorite sites, you'll find that their software
is missing many of the "extras" that make web pages interesting.
For instance, Movies can't be seen and Java programs do not run. It amazes
me that they allow this stuff to hit the streets !
My advice to any of you that are serious about Internet access is to RUN
out to a low-cost local provider and open an account. Keep your AOL for
messing around if you like, but definitely get a REAL account.
2nd: Just got my newest Alternative Energy Retailer with the front cover
about the "Ventless Debate". The usual interesting reading, with
a few new twists. The newest problems are with Nitrogen Dioxide emmissions,
which have been measured at levels close to the maximum guidelines. Here's
the part that gets me irked...
Mary Carson, program Director of the Vent Free Gas Products Association,
is quoted as saying: "It's a slap in the face to the IAS (Approval
Service) It's like saying a consumer can't accept what's said by UL or the
ANSI. If ANSI's vent-free standards are questioned, then anything tested
to ANSI standards has to be suspect".
Anyone who has been around awhile knows this is a bunch of BS ! It truly
insults my intelligence to read such statements. Does Mary know that UL
approved Aluminum house wiring that later has to be yanked from the market
(burned down houses if I remember right). Does Ms. Carson want to subject
herself to the levels of X-Rays and other radiation that Standards Committees
previously said were safe ? Let's keep the debate to the facts and not put
that silly "they said it's OK" spin on things.
The fact is that when it comes to safety and public health - EVERYTHING
SHOULD BE QUESTIONED...Even if it does not suit one's pocketbook that week.
________________________________________________________________________
In this digest:
1. Selling Yourself !
From: [email protected] Date: Mon, 23 Dec 1996 13:02:12 -0500 To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: Hearth Digest 12/22
Craig, We do not have a storefront so we basically sell our stoves from
a catalog IN the customers home. This has certain advantages and certain
disadvantages...we are really selling ourselves. We never give individual
prices or even list prices for the stove or parts or labor...we give them
one flat amount and if we discount we give the discount off the flat amount.
We are not big volume. We have a friend who owned a stove shop in another
area. I was in her shop one day when she was giving a customer a quote on
pipe..she listed each and every part that he would need with her price for
that part. He took the quote and said "I will have to check with my
boss (referring to his wife) and will be back". He then went out the
door. I spoke with my friend for a few minutes and then left to go to a
large hardware store (a small chain store) in the same shopping center as
the stove shop to pick up some screws, etc....well, the potential stove
shop customer was there, with the list he received from my friend, picking
up the parts she had listed (some what cheaper I may add...cheaper as in
price and quality)...our eyes met and he turned quickly away. I guess there
are several morals to this story but I will let you or your readers determine
what they are. Hope to see yall in Reno.
Phil Mace The Lucky Sweeps Chimney Services South Lake Tahoe, CA www.tahoemall.com/sweep.html
___________________________________________________________________________
This Months Digest Sponsored by: Travis Industries, America's premier manufacturer
of steel wood, gas & pellet hearth products exclusively for the Speciality
Hearth Retailer. See the NEW LOPI Heritage Bay, Discovery Fireplace, Avalon
Avanti DVS Fireplace and Fireplace Xtrordinair 36DV-R & 32DVS gas products
in our Web site. http://hearth.com/travis. Call 1 800 654-1177 or e-mail
us at [email protected] for dealer information. ___________________________________________________________________________
end of Digest - Post messages to [email protected]