# cleaning smoke chamber in a masonary fireplace



## mike in ct (Mar 3, 2011)

was hoping someone could advise. i am a mason. i have built fireplaces for years, and 3 years ago i finally built one for myself. pic attached. i have a brush on a chain i use to clean the 18"x18" flue, but the smokechamber and smoke shelf is another story. i've been taping a wire brush to a pole to get up in there. it works somewhat, but alot of the creosote ends up on smokeshelf and i cant get at it. i'm worried it's building up there and i dont want a chimney fire. i burn it all the time in winter. i really love the fireplace, but i'm worried if i cant clean it good i'm just asking for a chimney fire. i dont want an insert, but it would solve my cleaning problem if i run a ss liner down to stove.......??? what to do? any suggestions appreciated - mike


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## BrotherBart (Mar 3, 2011)

You bet it is building up there. Biggest mistake most chimney sweeps make is not getting that stuff out of there. With mine I always had to stuff the end of a Shop Vac hose in and suck the stuff out. And it filled the dang vac bucket. 

A guy where I worked religiously had a sweep come every year. The fool didn't get the stuff out of the smoke shelf and the chimney fire a week after a sweep damn near burned down a very nice house.

Get up in there and get that stuff out.


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## Todd (Mar 3, 2011)

I use to get at mine from the inside. Took a brush through the damper best I could then shop vac the soot. Very messy, probably worth it to pay a good sweep.


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## webby3650 (Mar 3, 2011)

In order to get the smoke shelf clean, you will have to remove the damper plate. The area behind the smoke shelf should be filled in order to prevent too much build up. I use a brush that is spun with a drill, gets every nook and cranny!


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## BrotherBart (Mar 3, 2011)

webby3650 said:
			
		

> In order to get the smoke shelf clean, you will have to remove the damper plate. The area behind the smoke shelf should be filled in order to prevent too much build up. I use a brush that is spun with a drill, gets every nook and cranny!



You are the exception my friend. Most don't realize that level to the top of the smoke shelf ignores the fact that they are hollow and full of creosote.


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## cmonSTART (Mar 3, 2011)

Ditto on the spun brush.  It works great.  A long ash rake with a bent handle works great to rake the crud off the shelf and into the firebox.  A broom and shop vac will get the rest.  

Do you have any pictures of this fireplace?


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## mike in ct (Mar 3, 2011)

i've added a pic in first post  of when it was just finished. no mantle on it at that point. to brother bart......yes , being a chimney builder, i am fully aware of problem areas and what a chimney fire can do, thus my concern......i just dont have any good knowledge of cleaning techniques other than a brush for flue . really like to see a pic of any tools you guys use if possible . i parge all my smokeshelfs and smokechambers with refractory cement so everything is nice and smooth up to flues. just so diffucult to get up in there to get at it, and then to vaccuum it out to boot. was thinking someone may have a clever attachment for the shop vac, specially made for such a job. my wire brush duct taped to a broom handle worked " ok " but i found myself quickly saying " got to be a better way " .....so here i am ....askin.... appreciate all the feedback - mike


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## Todd (Mar 3, 2011)

Heck of a nice job on that fireplace!


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## ddddddden (Mar 3, 2011)

+1.  Very nice. . .I guess that's one of the perks of being a mason.    Now you just need a nice stone stove.


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## gpcollen1 (Mar 3, 2011)

I always pulled the damper out.  It was one bolt on the back/bottom and one connection on the top to the lever/handle.  From there it is easy.


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## mike in ct (Mar 4, 2011)

well thanks for the compliments. i built it with stone that was all taken off the property , with the exception of cobblestones around opening. it's pretty massive. it's 6' 3" wide , 15' tall and has a 4'wide opening. outside it's 6'3" wide and 30' tall with a massive poured concrete cap/top/cover....it has a great draft and does not smoke ( unless we get 50+ mph winds off the lake) 

    i really wanted a fireplace and was inspired by the huge one at the great lodge at yellowstone....so cool........ but did'nt want a stove. we have a big raised hearth with stone surround in the lower level that we use to burn a hearthsone heritage in. when my son was born we stopped for safety reasons and i sold the stove. we are going to replace that this year with a coal/wood combo stove in anticipation of projected ridiculous prices of fuel oil. but back to the fireplace, i had thought of a heatilator insert, but if i told you how many i've looked at that were all rusted out in 20 years time, i said nahhh......and rumfords which do throw a decent amount of heat in the room are not to code and my local building inspector gave a customer of mine a thumbs down to build one. they fought with him and finally gave in and built a traditional firebox, which sends all your heat up chimney, which is what i have. i am thinking of installing a grate /heater blower in it to get some kinda heat out of it. but we all just love to sit on the raised hearth and listen to it, and warm up while watching the tube.

    in reguards to the damper yes, i agree, i have not removed it yet, as this is the first year i'm getting any real build up of creosote. still looks like a nasty bs job none the less , but i want to do myself just for piece of mind. i know most folks burn in a stove, but i'm a bit of a dinosaur i guess, i like the campfire feel. was hoping someone here had some tricks to make this an easier job.......


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## Shari (Mar 4, 2011)

We used something like this for about 3/4 of a heating season before purchasing our Oslo:  http://www.northlineexpress.com/item/5ST-WGH2422/24-x-22-Stoll-Woodburning-Grate-Heater

The item was given to us so there was no $$ involved to give it a try.

The good and the bad:

1.  Good - taught me that I really could heat our home with wood. 

2.  Bad - we had no way to close off the fireplace with this unit sitting on the hearth.

If you go with the above item I would strongly recommend installing glass doors to close down the fireplace when the fireplace is not in use.


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## Shari (Mar 4, 2011)

PS  Absolutely LOVELY fireplace.  Comment is coming from a stonemason's daughter!


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## cmonSTART (Mar 4, 2011)

Looks really great!


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## Wood Heat Stoves (Mar 5, 2011)

BrotherBart said:
			
		

> You bet it is building up there. Biggest mistake most chimney sweeps make is not getting that stuff out of there. With mine I always had to stuff the end of a Shop Vac hose in and suck the stuff out. And it filled the dang vac bucket.
> 
> A guy where I worked religiously had a sweep come every year. The fool didn't get the stuff out of the smoke shelf and the chimney fire a week after a sweep damn near burned down a very nice house.
> 
> Get up in there and get that stuff out.




hmm
pretty hard to get dangerous fires from the smoke shelf, sure it can smoulder for weeks, but if there is little to no air being introduced at the bottom of the soot pile, there can be very little explosive fire danger

i've ignited plenty of them while torching out heataliators, never had it be a serious issue, even when i added air holes for increased combustion...

just my experience


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## Wood Heat Stoves (Mar 5, 2011)

CTwoodburner said:
			
		

> I always pulled the damper out.  It was one bolt on the back/bottom and one connection on the top to the lever/handle.  From there it is easy.



that is next to impossible w many fireplaces/ at least the ones out west.
(most have the damper rods mortared into a metal sleeve)


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## cmonSTART (Mar 5, 2011)

Wood Heat Stoves said:
			
		

> CTwoodburner said:
> 
> 
> 
> ...



No kidding?  Most of ours just pull right out after removing a single cotter pin.


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## BrotherBart (Mar 5, 2011)

Wood Heat Stoves said:
			
		

> pretty hard to get dangerous fires from the smoke shelf, sure it can smoulder for weeks, but if there is little to no air being introduced at the bottom of the soot pile, there can be very little explosive fire danger
> 
> i've ignited plenty of them while torching out heataliators, never had it be a serious issue, even when i added air holes for increased combustion...
> 
> just my experience



Would be news to a guy named Neil in Reston, VA that had two fire trucks on his front lawn in 1993. Right after a chimney cleaning.

I hear what you are saying. Even with the chimney fires I had over the years the pile in the smoke shelf apparently didn't get involved. Or the fact that I cleaned it out every year had something to do with that. But his sure did. We were both burning the old inserts in slammer installs.


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## mike in ct (Mar 5, 2011)

yes, just a cotter pin and the handle comes off, then the damper will slide out. i've never seen anything different on dampers 25years or newer around here. i have had jobs on old fireplaces where damper was a pita to get out. ........it's not only risk of fire i'm concerned with , but a buildup on smokeshelf will hinder draft some and we dont want that. 

so cmonSTART , i see your a sweep, checked out your webpage.........so you say you bend a small rake to get in there and loosen it up, ...........do you use any clever attachments on the shopvac to suck it out easier. i see your the "black moose" i'm just trying to avoid being the "black mason " :O)

shari - thanks , and yes, i have considered glass doors. i checked into having a custom set made and it was freaking ridiculous. just about 3 grand..... nahhhh. not for a set of doors. i have a plasma cutter and a welder and i'm ok with fabbing stuff up and may just do it myself. so how did you like the grate heater? how big an area did it heat?


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## cmonSTART (Mar 5, 2011)

I just use my small vac hose on my sweeping vac.  It's nothing really special.  The rake I use is actually a smoke shelf rake, made for the purpose.  I pull most of it down into the firebox before I vacuum the shelf.  (dust control is key here!)


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## mike in ct (Mar 5, 2011)

dust control, hmmmmmmm .....so how do you work that? ........... is this rake something you get at the sweep supply places?


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## cmonSTART (Mar 5, 2011)

It is a rake I can buy from a chimney supplier, but you can probably make one pretty easily.  It's really just a rake with a 45 degree bend in the handle.  Dust control is a great big vacuum sucking up the dust the soot that falls down.


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## mike in ct (Mar 6, 2011)

actually i have a hard rake i broke handle on. i can narrow up the head and weld it to a piece of steel rod. how wide is it ?


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