# Who wants to make and install a hoist?



## Machria (Feb 10, 2013)

Any "hoist geniuses out there?   I need a hoist installed on the top of my deck pictured below.  I will need to go down about 25', and carry about 250 lbs of wood.  The motor will need to be attached to the ceiling on the inside of the deck, while the cable goes straight out horizontally about 2' (to keep the wood sack away from side of house on way up) and then around a pulley and down.  The pulley will need to be on a bracket that sticks out off the side of house just above deck.

What do ya think?   I'll supply the parts required, the beer, some cash, and a hot stove!  .  You supply the know how!


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## gandrimp (Feb 10, 2013)

Wheres the snow pics?

Not to sure about your idea working very long lifting 250 lbs unless you mount your winch and your pulley on a piece of steel.
If you mount the two seperately,there will be an amazing amount of pressure in two different directions.

http://www.hardwareandtools.com/Min...ey-Hanger-Farm-And-Or-Industrial-5651161.html

Maybe this door trolley, good for 400 lb could be used and just lift straight up, without the pulley.

Im 1200 miles away sorry I cant help.


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## Bret Chase (Feb 10, 2013)

it is possible to do... wood structure, and the change of direction does make it more difficult.  to use an actual hoist is the best thing to use, but they are very expensive.  The last trolley crane I built.. the 1 ton electric hoist itself was over $3,000...


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## Bret Chase (Feb 10, 2013)

the simplest way is to mount a W8X10 wide flange beam to the bottom of the ceiling joist, and hang a manual trolley off of it and mount say a half ton hoist... tie a short rope to the trolley.... push it out to "lifting position", lift the load... then tug the trolley back with the rope..


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## bogydave (Feb 10, 2013)

Cranes can be safety nightmares.
How about a conveyor ?


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## Bret Chase (Feb 10, 2013)

bogydave said:


> Cranes can be safety nightmares.
> How about a conveyor ?


 
yeah, there's that too...
http://www.cordellmfg.com/tech_osha.htm


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## MasterMech (Feb 11, 2013)

bogydave said:


> Cranes can be safety nightmares.
> How about a conveyor ?


 Catapult?


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## smokinj (Feb 11, 2013)

Buy a part-timmer!


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## nate379 (Feb 11, 2013)

That fellow is pretty brave, those scaffolds aren't exactly solid.  I used some when I put up my solar panels and I think I threw out 2 or 3 pairs of undies over the course of a few days


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## lukem (Feb 11, 2013)

Hay hiker!


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## Como (Feb 11, 2013)

Why not use a hoist like the roofers do? You can covert an aluminium ladder with a Harbor Freight electric winch. Plus is that it would be free standing, could be used elsewhere and is not in the way when you do not need it.

A conveyor would be more expensive. And you would need 2 people really.


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## Couderay80 (Feb 11, 2013)

scissor lift??


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## mikefrommaine (Feb 11, 2013)

Couderay80 said:


> scissor lift??


Thats what I was going to say. You could drive to your wood pile load it up and park it right next to the deck. Decent used ones are available for 5k.

And it would come in handy around a house that tall. Could probably rent it out to the neighbors and make back some money.


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## Machria (Feb 11, 2013)

Ok, maybe I should explain the purpose of the hoist. This is to be a permanant install, to be used to hoist up a load of wood to the stove room every few days. This would be instead of having to carry it up 2 or 3 flights of stairs daily. And, the wife could do it. Just lower the "bin", go down and load some splits into it, then go to the deck and hoist it up and unload it to the wood rack next to the stove. So this needs to be as un-obtrusive as possible. I'd like to mount a simple electric winch to the cieling above the deck, have the cable go straight out thru a hole in the wall to a pully that directs it down. The pully would be suppoorted by a few steel supports which would hold all the weight. Something like what is pictured in the attachment... Should be pretty easy really.


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## Jags (Feb 11, 2013)

I wish I were closer.  We could probably have that up and running in short order.  What are you pulling up?  Something like a bag or more of a pallet?


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## billb3 (Feb 11, 2013)

fork lift lfrom a junk yard
or a dumbwaiter might be safest


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## Machria (Feb 11, 2013)

Jags said:


> I wish I were closer. We could probably have that up and running in short order. What are you pulling up? Something like a bag or more of a pallet?


 
I'll probably have a large re-inforced canvas bag/sack made up.  Just like the hand log carriers for sale fro $30, but I'll make it a bit larger to take more wood up.


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## Jags (Feb 11, 2013)

billb3 said:


> a dumbwaiter might be safest


 
Easiest and fastest design.  My question above was for one simple reason.  If lifting a bag, no problems.  Lifting a pallet like object it will want to turn on the way up and down.  You can't have that.  Eventually the cable will break.  Easily corrected by using a pipe on two corners with the pallet having slides mounted on it, sliding up and down the pipe.


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## Jags (Feb 11, 2013)

Machria said:


> I'll probably have a large re-inforced canvas bag/sack made up. Just like the hand log carriers for sale fro $30, but I'll make it a bit larger to take more wood up.


 
You will still want some sort of line attached so that the bag does not turn circles.  A simple clothes line attached to it would be just fine.

Ask me how I know why you don't want the load to be able to spin.  Actually, don't, just trust me.


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## mikefrommaine (Feb 11, 2013)

Bret Chase said:


> the simplest way is to mount a W8X10 wide flange beam to the bottom of the ceiling joist, and hang a manual trolley off of it and mount say a half ton hoist... tie a short rope to the trolley.... push it out to "lifting position", lift the load... then tug the trolley back with the rope..


 

This sounds the most feasible. But why not an elevator? Might help resale value.


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## NickDL (Feb 11, 2013)

mikefrommaine said:


> This sounds the most feasible. But why not an elevator? Might help resale value.


I was thinking about an elevator too but figured that it is much more than the OP wants to do.


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## Bret Chase (Feb 11, 2013)

Machria said:


> Ok, maybe I should explain the purpose of the hoist. This is to be a permanant install, to be used to hoist up a load of wood to the stove room every few days. This would be instead of having to carry it up 2 or 3 flights of stairs daily. And, the wife could do it. Just lower the "bin", go down and load some splits into it, then go to the deck and hoist it up and unload it to the wood rack next to the stove. So this needs to be as un-obtrusive as possible. I'd like to mount a simple electric winch to the cieling above the deck, have the cable go straight out thru a hole in the wall to a pully that directs it down. The pully would be suppoorted by a few steel supports which would hold all the weight. Something like what is pictured in the attachment... Should be pretty easy really.


 

There's one thing you NEED to get out of your head.... a winch =/= a hoist.  you will burn out the single holding brake in a winch in short order and the load will fall.  Winches are not designed for vertical lifts, hoists are.  there also is more than one load-holding brake in a hoist.  

... and from what able to see the structure of the roof... the load path will collapse the bottom chord of the gable end... it was never intended to resist a concentrated sideways load.


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## bioman (Feb 11, 2013)

Jags said:


> You will still want some sort of line attached so that the bag does not turn circles. A simple clothes line attached to it would be just fine.
> 
> Ask me how I know why you don't want the load to be able to spin. Actually, don't, just trust me.


I would like to hear that story !


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## BobUrban (Feb 11, 2013)

I know it could be done but I certainly would not use a cantaliever off that gable as it's only point of attachement or you will run into bigger issues.  I am no engineer but I have built  a lot of steel buildings as an iron worker and the preasure is much greater than 250lbs hanging there for sure.  I would think a column may be necessary to adaquately support the lift but I like the idea.  Very outside the box and will be really cool for sure. 

As a former property and liability insurance agent I would be sure to build in a lock as well.  Something like that is a magnet for foolish youth.


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## wardk (Feb 11, 2013)

Built this for lifting lumber and plywood to second storey wood shop, cost about $350


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## CaddyUser (Feb 11, 2013)

Bret Chase said:


> There's one thing you NEED to get out of your head.... a winch =/= a hoist. you will burn out the single holding brake in a winch in short order and the load will fall. Winches are not designed for vertical lifts, hoists are. there also is more than one load-holding brake in a hoist. ... and from what able to see the structure of the roof... the load path will collapse the bottom chord of the gable end... it was never intended to resist a concentrated sideways load.


 
Agreed!  Unless you can locate a hoisting winch that has an independent safety lock system, the brake is inevitably going to fail.  The worst case would be when the load is at the second level, and the brake lets go as you are reaching to unload.  If someone is anywhere at the ground level, it is not going to be pretty.....  The least case scenario is that you will be replacing that nice window on the side of your house as it crashes to the ground....

Sorry to pour cold water on the idea - I always like new engineering problems, but this is a big no no...


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## ScotO (Feb 11, 2013)

This hoist may be just what the doctor ordered....

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Engine-440L...802?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item5ae9b3690a

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Minisize-El...090?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item3f21e14d02

I like the whole idea you have, just make CERTAIN that you have the structure to support both the lateral and vertical forces you will have at the mounting/pulling site.....


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## Bret Chase (Feb 11, 2013)

BobUrban said:


> I know it could be done but I certainly would not use a cantaliever off that gable as it's only point of attachement or you will run into bigger issues. I am no engineer but I have built a lot of steel buildings as an iron worker and the preasure is much greater than 250lbs hanging there for sure. I would think a column may be necessary to adaquately support the lift but I like the idea. Very outside the box and will be really cool for sure.
> 
> As a former property and liability insurance agent I would be sure to build in a lock as well. Something like that is a magnet for foolish youth.


 
you'd have to strip off a LOT of v-match to even start...


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## wardk (Feb 11, 2013)

Scotty Overkill said:


> This hoist may be just what the doctor ordered....
> 
> http://www.ebay.com/itm/Engine-440L...802?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item5ae9b3690a
> 
> ...


This is the hoist I used.


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## Bret Chase (Feb 11, 2013)

either of those would work, I think... it would be a matter of how long they last...


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## Machria (Feb 11, 2013)

Bret Chase said:


> There's one thing you NEED to get out of your head.... a winch =/= a hoist.  you will burn out the single holding brake in a winch in short order and the load will fall.  Winches are not designed for vertical lifts, hoists are.  there also is more than one load-holding brake in a hoist.
> 
> ... and from what able to see the structure of the roof... the load path will collapse the bottom chord of the gable end... it was never intended to resist a concentrated sideways load.



Hoist/lift/winch... All the same thing.  One has a break, one doesn't, but both are the same motor...   I have not spec'd out either, and that is why I want somebody else to build this for me.   

It's really NOT going to be a very big load.  250 is what I want to be spec'd as the MAX LOAD.  but it will never have 250 lbs of wood in one sack.  More likely 100lbs which is enough splits for a couple days. The gable is not going to have a problem holding up a couple hundred pounds.  Common, I just finished hoisting 750lbs up there.  I installed 2000 lbs of slate up there,....  And the house regularly gets 100mph winds directly into it.  100 lbs isn't going to finish it off!  

Not only that, the load will be split to several points, some back to the hoist motors bracket, some to the bottom brace under the pulley, some to the top brace....   Each will end up with just a little load.  

So who wants to build it?


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## Machria (Feb 11, 2013)

Scotty Overkill said:


> This hoist may be just what the doctor ordered....
> 
> http://www.ebay.com/itm/Engine-440L...802?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item5ae9b3690a
> 
> ...



Those look perfect.  Just mount it sideways, bolted to a beefy steel L bracket so the cable comes out horizontally out to the pulley.


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## Fins59 (Feb 11, 2013)

Don't know if this was covered, didn't read every post.
Give this a thought.  Anchor a pulley  up above your deck.  Hook a cable to your load of wood.  Run cable up through pulley and back down to a vehicle on ground.  Drive vehicle forward to raise load.  Back up vehicle to lower empty platform or what ever you have.  No motors or winches to burn out.
Of course that pulley would have to anchored very strongly (in any scenario).


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## Mr A (Feb 11, 2013)

This looks interesting.


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## Machria (Feb 12, 2013)

Mr A said:


> This looks interesting.



LOL!   LOL!   LOL!   What the hell is that guy doing with all that wood up there?  He must have 10 chord up there?

But he's got the right idea, I just would rather use a motor than taking a ride down every time!


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## Mr A (Feb 12, 2013)

Machria said:


> LOL! LOL! LOL! What the hell is that guy doing with all that wood up there? He must have 10 chord up there?
> 
> But he's got the right idea, I just would rather use a motor than taking a ride down every time!


My thought, it looks like the drying room. did you notice the trap door and the rail on top enabling the load to be craned laterally? Get it up and moved a bit horizontally. i like this one


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## BobUrban (Feb 12, 2013)

I agree that 100lbs. probably will not pull the house down  - I would be more concerned with repeated use and anchored to wood.  And I would be more concerned with the weird and wonderful!  A tool like this can get abused like when someone thinks, "there has got to be a way to get that new refrigerator up here with this?"  And the ever present kids!!  I know if we had something like that growing up it would be a toy.  When the cats away....  Put a lock on it and save some headaches.


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## Ehouse (Feb 12, 2013)

For a small load like this, I'd favor an anchor point below the peak, and a 1/2 ton chain fall. Even if you fumble the pull, the load will not drop; both up and down are controlled. Could be on a short,(well anchored) cantilever arm, or trolly if you'd like. Pull chain can be run back onto the porch so no leaning out.

Ehouse


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## Machria (Feb 12, 2013)

BobUrban said:


> I agree that 100lbs. probably will not pull the house down - I would be more concerned with repeated use and anchored to wood. And I would be more concerned with the weird and wonderful! A tool like this can get abused like when someone thinks, "there has got to be a way to get that new refrigerator up here with this?" And the ever present kids!! I know if we had something like that growing up it would be a toy. When the cats away.... Put a lock on it and save some headaches.


 
NO KIDS!  SAY NOOOOO TO KIDS!   There are NO kids in my house!       Besides that, this would be the least toy to have to worry about.  The house has unprotected catwalks, dangerous spral staircases, the deck...   They will have plenty of "fun" before they even get to this thing!  

Still looking for somebody on LI to come and install it!  Who's in?


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## pen (Feb 12, 2013)

how about a power ladder instead?

http://www.powrladder.com/

That's one type.  The one used to use wasn't revolving, and would have to be lowered to get re-loaded with materials.  Not sure what the weight limit was on it, but it put up whatever we put on it when roofing. 

pen


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## gzecc (Feb 12, 2013)

Machria said:


> NO KIDS! SAY NOOOOO TO KIDS! There are NO kids in my house!  Besides that, this would be the least toy to have to worry about. The house has unprotected catwalks, dangerous spral staircases, the deck... They will have plenty of "fun" before they even get to this thing!
> 
> Still looking for somebody on LI to come and install it! Who's in?


 I don't know if there is anyone on the forum that crazy to do it for you.


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## Ashful (Feb 12, 2013)

Machria said:


> Any "hoist geniuses out there? I need a hoist installed on the top of my deck pictured below.


 
If you go back to your first posts, where you laid out your intentions to install a wood stove in your third floor, I think a few of us predicted this eventuality.  In other words... what took you so long?


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## wardk (Feb 12, 2013)

What about a hay elevator .


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## 711mhw (Feb 12, 2013)

I agree with Como & Pen posts 11 & 40. I know them as "ladervators" that the roofers use. It could be premanently mounted (vertically) and prolly run with and electric motor instead of gas. The roofers set them up (like a ladder) at an angle but that's so it will stay there on it's own. They'll bring up 2-3 bundles of shingles to the eave in seconds. They only have a small platform, but that would be easy to modify to hold at least a few arm loads of wood. It would take 2 people to operate this. Might just be a cheap way out!


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## Como (Feb 12, 2013)

Mr A said:


> My thought, it looks like the drying room. did you notice the trap door and the rail on top enabling the load to be craned laterally? Get it up and moved a bit horizontally. i like this one




I bought some of these bags, they hold about 1/3rd of a cord. I can think of some full sized Americans I have met who could do that trick. Their problem would be getting up the Stairs....

The electric winch pictured earlier is the HF model I have, it comes in different capacities.

As this is going to be a permanent fixture I would favour the trap door approach, winch it up, put the floor back in, drop and done.

I have friends who do it manually, he parks the truck underneath and hands up the logs for her to stack.


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## Como (Feb 12, 2013)

Just went back and looked and realise you can not do the hole in the deck.

So back to my first thought:



This uses a ladder and the HF hoist. For a permanent install I would look to use I beam, bolt it onto the side of the house and the structural issues go away.


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## Flatbedford (Feb 13, 2013)

The guy riding down while his wood goes up reminded me of this story.
http://www.snopes.com/humor/letters/bricks.asp


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## Machria (Feb 14, 2013)

Joful said:


> If you go back to your first posts, where you laid out your intentions to install a wood stove in your third floor, I think a few of us predicted this eventuality.  In other words... what took you so long?



I had this idea WAAAAY before even thinking about getting a stove.  .    Aka groceries, packages, wood for fireplace...    It was always part of plan.


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## Machria (Feb 14, 2013)

The ladder type hoists are much too intrusive looking for a perm install.  It's going to be a simple wire type hoist, it's just a matter of how I get a bracket made for it....


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## Mr A (Feb 14, 2013)

Some sort of dumbwaiter would be your best option. Depending on your budget, lots of ideas on YouTube searching ":Dumbwaiter" these seem a bit pricey to me, but do look very easy to install http://www.dumbwaiters.com/


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## Machria (Aug 20, 2013)

Ok, ordered a hoist and mounting bracket/hoist arm from Northern tools, arriving tomorrow.  Gotta run power to the spot, install the bracket and hoist, and I'll be in badness by burning season.


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## Ashful (Aug 20, 2013)

Mr A said:


> ... these seem a bit pricey to me, but do look very easy to install http://www.dumbwaiters.com/


 
Yeah... but what's one to do, when their BMW is hungry?


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## Machria (Aug 20, 2013)

Here's what I ordered so far, both rated for over 1000 lbs:
Hoist motor: http://www.northerntool.com/shop/tools/product_420551_420551

Hoist Frame: http://www.northerntool.com/shop/tools/product_200485108_200485108

Going to make a big 1/2 steel L bracket to mount the hoist on the ceiling, sidways. The line will go straight out to the end of the host frame around a pully and down to the ground wit ha hook on the end to hold a small sack. I'll load the sack on the ground, hoist it up, pull it over onto the deck and unload it into my split holder about 10' away next to the stove. Hoist lifts 33.5' per minute, I only need about 20 or 25' or something like that, so should take less than 1 minute to hoist and the duty cylce for the motor is 2 minutes on, 8 minutes rest/cool down which will work perfectly. 

I'll post some pics when installed...


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## paul bunion (Aug 20, 2013)

Why not put the hoist motor on the frame and swing it all over the railing for unloading?   Seems like that would be a much simpler solution.   The only problem might be clearance over the railing?


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## Machria (Aug 21, 2013)

paul bunion said:


> Why not put the hoist motor on the frame and swing it all over the railing for unloading?   Seems like that would be a much simpler solution.   The only problem might be clearance over the railing?



Clearance would be an issue.  Weather (I'm on salt water) and rust would be an issue with the motor hanging out in the weather 24x7x365.  Looks would be an issue, who wants a 65lb 14"x8" black industrial motor hanging off the back deck of their "beach house".     .....       I'm going to tuck the motor in under the deck roof, all you will see is the hoist bracket folded in against the side of the house above the deck.


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## Mr A (Aug 22, 2013)

build a gate


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## velvetfoot (Aug 22, 2013)

I knew this topic sounded familiar 

https://www.hearth.com/talk/threads...e-wacky-projects-for-wacky-wood-burners.9215/


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## Machria (Aug 26, 2013)

velvetfoot said:


> I knew this topic sounded familiar
> 
> https://www.hearth.com/talk/threads...e-wacky-projects-for-wacky-wood-burners.9215/


 
Wow!   That amazing as it's very similar to what I'll do, and he used the same exact Hoist I ordered!


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## Machria (Sep 11, 2013)

Found the hoist bag:

http://www.dinobags.com/sand-construction-bag.shtml

Will be installed in next few weeks....


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## Mr A (Sep 11, 2013)

Machria said:


> Found the hoist bag:
> 
> http://www.dinobags.com/sand-construction-bag.shtml
> 
> Will be installed in next few weeks....


Those types of bags are also sold at Home Depot. They're usually full of sand out front, I never asked for an empty one


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## Machria (Sep 11, 2013)

$7 from Dino, already on way.  I've never seen "sand" at a Home depot (or any other store) on LI.  LI is basically a giant SANDbar, doubt we need sand.


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## Mr A (Sep 11, 2013)

You haven't needed any, it's there. Clean sand needed for masonry, tile mortar, etc.
http://www.homedepot.com/p/MSU-Inc-9-cu-ft-Bulk-Washed-Masonry-Sand-478119/100318372#.UjDVYMasiSo


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