# Chimney liner installed without insulation



## aaron1 (Oct 11, 2012)

Hi,

I screwed up and need help figuring out what to do.  i bought a flexking pro liner from chimneylinerdepot.com.  i bought a 6" round liner and thought it would fit my chimney, but when i went to install it with an insulation blanket around it i found that i couldn't get it down my chimney, as the flue tile at the very top of my chimney (where I measured) is a little bit bigger than all of the rest of the flue tiles down the chimney!! chit!  anyway, i tried cutting off part of the insulation and finally had to resort to just cutting off all of the insulation and putting the liner down the chimney bare.  it is a 32', exterior chimney.  i will be using a vermont castings vigilant from the late 70's for now, as it came with my house.  here are my options:

burn the stove and see how the creosote buildup is after a few months and after the winter is over.  if it's not too bad just keep it as is.

cut out a couple of bricks on the chimney on the outside, stuff in some insulation in the first flue tile and then pour down some pour-in insulation so it is insulated

take out the liner and buy a smaller round liner or an insulated oval liner and eat the expense as a dumb mistake.

what would you do?  i'd like to be up to code if possible i think, but if i would never have a problem, then i don't care i guess.  i just don't want to have no insurance coverage if my house burns down!!  i plan to burn hot fires with seasoned wood and try to be careful with creosote formation.


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## dougand3 (Oct 11, 2012)

Welcome, Aaron1. Where are you located? How cold does it get?
Stuffing Roxul batts in top and bottom of tile chimney MAY keep liner hot enough.
If not, probably easiest would be pour-in insulation. You could first buy 32' of flex rods (needed for cleaning with brush) to help settle it.
Rather than knocking bricks out - how about a block off plate?
DIY block off plate thread
https://www.hearth.com/talk/threads/my-diy-block-off-plate-installation.61183/#post-780309


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## weatherguy (Oct 11, 2012)

Id put a block off plate like Doug suggested and pour in insulation, problem solved, you'll end up spending a bit more than you had to but you'll be good to go and wont have to worry about anything.


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## granpajohn (Oct 11, 2012)

Flue tiles + SS Liner = meets code without insulation. (Assumes tiles are in reasonably good condition...Don't worry...If I'm wrong someone will flame me soon enough.)
That said; insulation is nice for exterior chimneys.
I think your strategy is good. Try it and see.
Plus...what Doug said.


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## fire_man (Oct 12, 2012)

You have that tall 32 foot flue going for you to create a good draft, but after a certain height it starts to work against you as the flue gases cool off. I'm unsure about whether code demands insulation of a wood stove liner - my chimney guy tells me absolutely yes, it is a requirement (but you have to consider the source).

I can tell you after recently insulating my 15 foot exterior lining, it has definitely helped with poor draft - too early to tell if it helps with the creosote. I did not like the idea of using pour in mix, just too permanent for my taste in case of some kind of problem down the road.

Considering the extra height you have, I think I would have gone with a 5 1/2" insulated liner IF you decide you really need one. Some people have purposely used a 5 1/2" liner to reduce draft on such a long flue. Removing the existing clay tiles sounds like a nightmare to me.

Those old Vigilants can make a TON of creosote if not burned right - believe me, I ran an old Resolute which is the little sister version of that stove and had to sweep 3 times a season. You may want to look around on the PRE-EPA stove forum for previous posts with your setup.


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## zzr7ky (Oct 12, 2012)

Hi - With good dry wood I doubt you will ever miss the insulation.  I insulated because my chimney is only 17'.  I needed to keep the flue warm to keep it drafting. 

I would keep the air open and get the stove/chimney up to temp an then enjoy. 

Clean it after a month or so and see what you get.  I use metal electrical conduit bolted together for cleaning rod.  It's light and a lot cheaper than store bought cleaning rig.

Enjoy!
Mike


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## mellow (Oct 12, 2012)

Did you have a camera run down your chimney and a pro sweep it before installing the liner? That would be one of the ways to see if you NEED an insulated liner, if you have cracks in your terracotta you HAVE to insulate.

For example you have a chimney fire in your uninsulated liner and it catches creosote on fire in one of the cracks that didn't get cleaned and that fire spreads to your house structure, then your insurance has a reason to deny coverage, it has happened in the past.

If it was me, I would have the chimney inspected and if cracks are found I would bust out the terracotta and put in an insulated liner that you have already purchased, but, just to throw a monkey wrench in here, you could have done a 5.5" insulated liner and that might have fit down your chimney, with your height you should have plenty of draft.


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## fire_man (Oct 12, 2012)

+++1 to mellow's advice. Get the old clay liner inspected, it may make the decision for you.


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## EJL923 (Oct 12, 2012)

I have an un-insulated liner in an interior chimney, about 23'.  My chimney was in good shape.  I have a block off at the bottom.  i actually have to much draft, really kills my burn times.  Creosote hasnt been a problem in the three winters i've been burning.


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## aaron1 (Oct 13, 2012)

I live in new york, so it gets sort of cold here, but not horrible.  i guess i will try burning it and see how much creosote i am creating frequently.  i'll probably end up going with the pour down mix if i insulate.  thanks for all of the advice.


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## Stubborn Dutchman (Oct 13, 2012)

I almost made the same mistake last year, but the folks at Rockland tipped me off to double check my dimensions. I ended up using standard flex liner then poured in Vermiculite. It only took a couple bags at about $12 per bag. Real easy to do. I checked the insulation yesterday when I swept the chimney. Hadn't even settled any. Almost all my creosote was in the top few feet plus the uninsulated 18" extension so I am sure the insulation helps my exterior chimney. This was my first sweep since starting to burn last fall.


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## Heatsource (Oct 13, 2012)

granpajohn said:


> Flue tiles + SS Liner = meets code without insulation. (Assumes tiles are in reasonably good condition...Don't worry...If I'm wrong someone will flame me soon enough.)
> .


 
flame: some flex liners require the insulation for their listing, and therefore code :end flame, lol


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