# Consumer Reports Rates Six Freestanding Pellet Stoves



## richkorn (Aug 29, 2009)

New 2009 Oct. issue that came in the mail. They tested these 6 units only.
Order by CR Ranking:
1. Harman P68
2. Napoleon NPS40
3. Enviro Empress
4. Quadra-Fire Castille
5. Summers Heat 55-SHP10L (Lowes)  (Englander at H.D)

*DON'T BUY: PERFORMANCE PROBLEM* (Although if you take out the worthless chute flapper the problem disappears as stated and discussed on this forum)
Lopi Leyden


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## Stentor (Aug 29, 2009)

What's the date of the Consumer Reports comparison? The ones I googled were 2007 through January 2008.

Pellets are still a low volume appliance compared to oil furnaces and the like, but increased attention form consumer organizations is a good thing. We'll all benefit from a larger market.


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## doghouse (Aug 29, 2009)

Can you post a link?


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## gbreda (Aug 29, 2009)

richkorn said:
			
		

> Order by CR Recommendation:
> 1. Harman P68
> 2. Napoleon NPS40
> 3. Enviro Empress
> ...



Funny that you mention Lopi Leyden as problematic.  Dealer in Dover NH told me that they were getting away from the Avalons (same as Lopi) because of too many problems last year.  Wonder if they are referring to your issue and know about the mod made to yours.


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## defield (Aug 29, 2009)

Rickhorn,

What  Your signature says Lopi - 2008!  Does that mean that you have not hauled your Lopi to the local dump because Consumer Distorts . . .er . . . .Reports . . . gave it a *"Don't Buy: performance problem". *  Surely you have gotten rid of your performance problem Lopi and have just not had time to update your signature.

Sure wish that I had read that comparison before purchasing my Lopi, to which I was attracted because of the quality of the castings, the very nice fit and finish, the warranty, the favorable user reports, and the attractive appearance that reminded me of my  former Vermont Castings Vigilant wood stove.  Even though the Lopi has performed flawlessly for us and been a very efficient heating unit, and everyone looking at it has been impressed, and we are very happy with it,  if Consumer Reports says "don't buy" , I may have to haul that disgusting performance problem out of my living room and throw it into Casco Bay.  Oops, the DEP probably would not like that.

Seriously, I have long disliked the sterile way that Consumer Reports tests many products and, therefore, when doing due dilligence before a purchase,I would much rather depend on reports from real world users,  who are operating in real world conditions, like the good folk who post in this forum.  People like Mike Holton who do lab testing as well as actually working on the stoves, as well as using the product himself,  and solving a wide variety of problems for end users, can offer far more valuable information than the best pure lab tests.

My rant for the day.

Old Ranger


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## newf lover (Aug 29, 2009)

The article is from the Consumer Report just issued, the October 2009 issue. I have the paper version; not online. I did not get the impression from the article that the tester was very impressed with the idea of a pellet stove period. Here are several quotes from the article. "But owning one can still be a hassle. All pumped out ample heat in our tests, but you'll have to hoist 40-pound bags of pellets and empty the ash pan regularly." They mentioned other upkeep like cleaning the glass and having the vents and chimney checked annually by a chimney sweep. Obviously, this person does not have experience in living with a pellet stove. Also-
"But we found you could easily pay $4000 to $8000 to buy and install a pellet stove or solar heater and wait years to recoup the costs. Those systems also need more maintenance, and one of the pellet stoves we tested has a glitch that could leave you shivering this winter."  The "glitch" was the pellets they were using, which in the picture says Cleanfire, jammed the auger. When they switched to shorter pellets, the problem stopped. "The manufacturer touts a jam-free auger and lists no pellet size requirements." I found that funny and a little ridiculous. "A stove that's picky about pellets could be especially limiting if supplies tighten. And because sizes aren't marked on the bag, you could end up with longer pellets- a $750 mistake for a bulk purchase of the 3 tons usually burned in a year."  
that is why Lopi ended up on the not recommended list. Although I own a Harman P68, I feel Lopi got a raw deal here in the review.


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## webbie (Aug 29, 2009)

A lot of those concerns seem real...and that is what customers expect out of a pub that does not accept advertising.

As nice as the folks here are, many of them have "special interests"......and would not always inform the potential customer about the cons of pellet stove ownership.

On the other hand, I would take their particular reviews with a grain of salt. There is no way they could have tested enough products....to mean much.

That is why, when it comes to cars - etc, they use "repair history" over 100's of thousands of the same model.

In other words, the article may be more useful for folks to determine whether they want a stove at all, as opposed to which stove they should buy.


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## stoveguy2esw (Aug 29, 2009)

the old ranger said:
			
		

> Rickhorn,
> 
> Seriously, I have long disliked the sterile way that Consumer Reports tests many products and, therefore, when doing due dilligence before a purchase,I would much rather depend on reports from real world users,  who are operating in real world conditions, like the good folk who post in this forum.  People like Mike Holton who do lab testing as well as actually working on the stoves, as well as using the product himself,  and solving a wide variety of problems for end users, can offer far more valuable information than the best pure lab tests.
> 
> ...




thanks for the plug ranger, i should note that im far from being the only industry rep here, *the many dealers and service techs who help in here deserve equal billing as i * , but  the testing i do is on my own products , i do not do "comparison testing" with other brands (though at the shows im dragged to them like a moth to a flame,pardon the pun, i love to see the innovations out there) consumer reports does that kind of work  *and im extremely pleased to see one of our units making their top 5.* thats quite a coup for us selling in the mass merchant market as for the comment on the lopi product not having seen the actual report (a link would have been nice, i didnt google it yet) if that statement is actually in the report as posted would be interesting as there are far more than 6 available units out there and if it has a "dont buy" tag why would it be listed as the 6th best option when others are available? as for the quality of lopi's products , i have no brief on that. i dont really follow lopi that closely (nor do i other brands) when i see a thread with a person having an issue i read it look for the technical data i can find on the web and try to help just as others who are more familiar do. and i do not coment adversely on any particular brand of stove (being a manufacturer "playing" in this arena my own conscience will not allow me to do so) i would love to see a lopi rep respond to this (not a challenge but an opportunity for them, ive gotten good reviews in here and the prospective factory reps who would attend this forum im sure would recieve the same accolades, trust me , they are appreciated) as have metalfab, BTU , supercedar, and others i know im forgetting someone (my apologies). these guys should be respected as well for taking time to "hang" with "john q public"

that said if you ever get down this way ranger , first beer is on me bro


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## tjnamtiw (Aug 29, 2009)

it's refreshing to see that many here recognize that Consumers Report is not very accurate in many cases.  Yes, they don't take advertising but, if you've ever owned things that they rated poorly for many years with no problems, you must surely wonder if they take bribes.  )))  You would be better off buying what they don't like, IMHO.  Eg:  Dodge Dakota pickup, Amana washer and dryer, GE refrigerator, Tappan Heat Pump - all still going strong.


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## richkorn (Aug 29, 2009)

the old ranger said:
			
		

> Rickhorn,
> 
> What  Your signature says Lopi - 2008!  Does that mean that you have not hauled your Lopi to the local dump because Consumer Distorts . . .er . . . .Reports . . . gave it a *"Don't Buy: performance problem". *  Surely you have gotten rid of your performance problem Lopi and have just not had time to update your signature.
> 
> ...



I like your rant!

Too bad the Leyden got boned on this one. unknowing buyers reading this issue now won't even look at the Leyden. If the tester just new that the chute flapper was the 'glitch' and not the size of pellets (flapper a new mod for 2008 and now Lopi is recommending we take them out) he would have tested one awesome pellet stove.  

I think I'll keep mine than you :exclaim:


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## richkorn (Aug 30, 2009)

The article is in the new Oct 2009 CR paper issue. They only tested those 6 units. The Lopi wasn't listed as the 6th best option - just a Don't buy. The others were ranked from 1 to 5.


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## richkorn (Aug 30, 2009)

> Funny that you mention Lopi Leyden as problematic.  Dealer in Dover NH told me that they were getting away from the Avalons (same as Lopi) because of too many problems last year.  Wonder if they are referring to your issue and know about the mod made to yours.



Actually CR said it has problems. I have no problems with mine (except for conv. blower noise), it works great.


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## Stentor (Aug 30, 2009)

Webmaster said:
			
		

> ..........
> In other words, the article may be more useful for folks to determine whether they want a stove at all, as opposed to which stove they should buy.



This is the important point.  The article probably says enough to save some people wasting their time.  Unfortunately, doing due diligence to get the best stove for you isn't easy. I got lucky and got some good advice to point me in the right direction for me.


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## tjnamtiw (Aug 30, 2009)

Yes, this forum is 1000 times more informative concerning stoves than Consumer Reports could ever hope to be.  It's probably true for auto forums and many other forums vs CR.  Actually talking to owners is much more informative than some guy in a lab testing something he's never seen before.


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## imacman (Aug 30, 2009)

Just curious as to what the lead time is for magazines to get articles written.....Travis Industries sent out the "fix" for the Avalon/Lopi stoves (removing the flapper) back in the winter (in fact, Nov. 8, 2008).  See the post by Rod Poplarchick: www.hearth.com/econtent/index.php/forums/viewthread/27973/

I wonder when CR actually did the Testing?  And I hope Travis sees the report, and contacts them with a "rebuttal" and a chance to re-test w/o the flapper.

I have my Avalon, and like other Lopi owners here have mentioned, it runs flawlessly, gives great heat, and is easy to maintain and work on.


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## save$ (Aug 31, 2009)

Your really have to wonder if they did the testing at all. In their comment about the Napoleon, they stated that "but it held fewer pellets and lacks an ash pan". The picture shown is of the NPS40, a free standing stove. I own that stove and it has a huge ash pan. One so large I don't have to empty it until a I have burned a ton of pellets. The fireplace insert model has no ash pan, but that has a different number and was not the one pictured. So much for accuracy. My stove's capacity is a whole bag, and with the add on to the hopper, I can load nearly two bags. Looks to me like the author did some reading, then some writing. But for testing? questionable.


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## Dr_Drum (Aug 31, 2009)

I guess I will chime in and just say my Leyden has also performed flawlessly, while my neighbors and a co-worker with a Consumer Reports "preferred stove" now regrets the purchase. Mine never came with a flapper, and I only have one season on the stove, so maybe time will tell? I'd be the first to crap on Travis Industries if I had any cause, but so far it's just a great stove.
Mike -


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## dac122 (Aug 31, 2009)

Webmaster said:
			
		

> ..........
> In other words, the article may be more useful for folks to determine whether they want a stove at all, as opposed to which stove they should buy.



Agreed.  I've heard and seen CR folks interviewed and they generally say to use their articles as a guide instead of gospel.  

I for one like the fact that pellet stove reviews are making further inroads into mainstream publications.


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## minch (Sep 1, 2009)

http://blogs.consumerreports.org/ho...eaters-cfls-mattresses-vacuums-october-2.html


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## TboneMan (Sep 1, 2009)

I subscribed to CR for a time back in the early 90's.  I worked as a market researcher for an HMO at the time.   As a subscriber, I received one of their surveys.   This particular survey had various topics they were collecting data on.  One of the topics was health insurance.   

I WAS TOTALLY AMAZED and the amount of BIAS written into the survey questions.   I would never have been able to write survey questions with the level of bias their items had.   I threw out the survey and proceeded to cancel my subscription.

I haven't believed a word they publish since.


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## tjnamtiw (Sep 2, 2009)

TboneMan said:
			
		

> I subscribed to CR for a time back in the early 90's.  I worked as a market researcher for an HMO at the time.   As a subscriber, I received one of their surveys.   This particular survey had various topics they were collecting data on.  One of the topics was health insurance.
> 
> I WAS TOTALLY AMAZED and the amount of BIAS written into the survey questions.   I would never have been able to write survey questions with the level of bias their items had.   I threw out the survey and proceeded to cancel my subscription.
> 
> I haven't believed a word they publish since.



You just won me as a fan!


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## summit (Sep 2, 2009)

i just can't believe the napoleon was # 2.... i have seen them before, and have had many many customers trade them in for a harman... IMHO napoleon is a #2... a big stinky #2


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## Utilitrack (Sep 4, 2009)

Dr_Drum said:
			
		

> I guess I will chime in and just say my Leyden has also performed flawlessly, while my neighbors and a co-worker with a Consumer Reports "preferred stove" now regrets the purchase. Mine never came with a flapper, and I only have one season on the stove, so maybe time will tell? I'd be the first to crap on Travis Industries if I had any cause, but so far it's just a great stove.
> Mike -



Ditto what Dr_Drum says


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## MainePellethead (Sep 4, 2009)

I guess I'm glad my Castile is in there....phew.  lol.   My own experience for me has backed that up.....has performed more than I expected for sure.


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## swerve (Sep 5, 2009)

Great news! I just bought an NPS40 for $1500 plus the stove is certified for the tax credit. The CR rating is fabulous. Can't beat that. It may not have thermostatic control but, personally, I think connection to a thermostat tires the stove and igniter. Better to run it on low steady heat. I purchased the stove at Spring Brook Ice and Fuel Company in Waterville Maine. Incidentally, they sell venting and pellets cheap.


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## imacman (Sep 5, 2009)

sandy888 said:
			
		

> Great news! I just bought an NPS40 for $1500 plus the stove is certified for the tax credit. The CR rating is fabulous. Can't beat that. It may not have thermostatic control but, personally, I think connection to a thermostat tires the stove and igniter. Better to run it on low steady heat. I purchased the stove at Spring Brook Ice and Fuel Company in Waterville Maine. Incidentally, they sell venting and pellets cheap.



Welcome to the forum Sandy.  Don't forget to post the cheap pellet prices on the "Fuel Price Reports" section at the top of the forum page...we all need to get pellets as cheap as possible, so help your fellow pellet-heads out!


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## rowerwet (Sep 6, 2009)

having seen CR give a lousy rating to a product one year (cutco knives) for having an "uncomfortable handle" and then praise them a year or two later for "comfort and balance" I don't trust their ratings for not so major items. A year ago they rated a rainbow vacuum as heavier than a kirby (the anvil of vacuums). They liked one portable play yard because the top rails didn't fold (try that in any car trunk smaller than an SUV, and said the rest were unsafe. 
I look at the ratings on cars and appliances, their recomendations or non I don't give to much use to. I find with cars they were in love with some companies and could never give a good recomendation for others, even when the ratings were good, it gave me the impression they are all BMW driving snobs who don't like small or domestic cars, never saw the point of driving a pickup truck, or large SUV, and think vans are only for tradesmen.


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## muss (Sep 6, 2009)

I think to have a true rating for a pellet stove, you would have to go thru at least 1 burning season. Yes, i had multiple auger jams but out of 4 brands , the Athen pellets were the only ones that gave me the problem, otherwise, i'm perfectly satisfied with my Lopi Leyden .  Muss


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## MainePellethead (Sep 7, 2009)

Hey Muss....good to see you mussling around for the heating season.....dont see u too much during the summer....  all ready for the pellet season?


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## zinfit (Sep 7, 2009)

If they had the Quadra Castille that I had it would be on their reject list. Based on the discussions on this forum they got the number 1 right.


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## John Ackerly (Oct 1, 2009)

I was glad to see CR rate pellet stoves but like many of you, think it was flawed.  I wish they had tested for blower noise.  That is the sort of more objective thing they are really good at.  And, they should have listed emissions.  Among those 6, the Napolean is the only one that hasn't been voluntarily tested, so as far as I know it can't be sold in Washington State, get the tax credit in Oregon, or the rebate in the upcoming Keene NY changeout.  They also had a snarky attitude towards renewable energy and some simple tasks, like loading the hopper of a pellet stove once a day.

We did a longer review of their review at http://www.forgreenheat.blogspot.com.


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## rowerwet (Oct 1, 2009)

so WA is allowing some pellet or wood stoves now?


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## stoveguy2esw (Oct 2, 2009)

rowerwet said:
			
		

> so WA is allowing some pellet or wood stoves now?



washington state has had tighter standards for some time now , however pellet stoves if they are epa certified virtually always meet the standard , we have sold pellet stoves in washington state for many years, as do other brands, now that more brands are submitting their units for epa phase 2 certification a larger selection should be availible.


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## CSCPeter (Oct 2, 2009)

CR did the testing last fall, and Lopi has already sent a letter stating that the flaw of the flap has been removed from all the stoves over 10 months ago. I do believe that CR is going to re-test and I am pretty sure that they will be retracting that "don't buy" label. As a retailer that is my number one seller and the only trouble was that flap which we have removed from all the units that were installed.


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## drizler (Oct 2, 2009)

"but you’ll have to hoist 40-pound bags of pellets and empty the ash pan regularly"

Really, wow who would have thought!    
While I do like many of their reviews, especially the auto reviews you do have to wonder what they are thinking sometimes.   The seem to treat their readers like totally helpless idiots who are completely clueless.


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