# Insert I have never heard of



## Jonny006 (Aug 2, 2013)

Hello, first post but long time lurker.
I am supposed to pick up an insert that I found on CL tomorrow am. It's a "Nu-tech catalyst" insert. Guy said he used it for the last five yrs and had no issues heating a 2400sq ft home. It has a blower and it appears to be in good shape. a web search turns up very little on this maker. anyone out there have any info? Likes, dislikes etc. For $100 and gas I don't think its too bad a deal but, I don't want to install a nightmare that I will regret.
Thanks!


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## begreen (Aug 3, 2013)

I suspect this stove is much older than 5 years. You might want to ping webbie for the history on this stove.


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## dafattkidd (Aug 3, 2013)

http://www.nutec-castings.com/Replacement parts and service.htm

Hey Jonny, welcome to the forum.  A quick google search revealed this info.  Check the link above.  It may be helpful.  Sounds kinda like the guy selling that stove doesn't know what he's talking about.  Based on the nutec website, there is no such thing as a nutec stove.  Check it out.  Take lots of pics and post them here.  Then we can have a better idea of what exactly you're dealing with.  Good luck!


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## BrotherBart (Aug 3, 2013)

I think Nu-Tec is who webbie sold the Upland stuff to.

http://www.nutec-castings.com


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## Jonny006 (Aug 3, 2013)

Well, I picked it up. It's friggin heavy! Still not sure of the make but there was, at one time, a catalyst. It is currently not there but there is a round cutout for one at the top. It's gonna need some work. New gaskets and a thorough cleaning and some paint but, for $100 I can't fault it. The blower is there and works. It does not have any type of fire bricks on the inside. The walls are straight steel but the base has a cement looking floor that extends about 3" up. It too is a little beat up. The only issue I see right now is that there is a small crack in the face about 1.5" long near the door hinge. It is very thin but I can see daylight when looking from inside. Pretty sure the guy I got it from over fired it a few times but, it's not bowed and the doors shut flat. The crack he said was there and he still used it with no ill effects. Maybe some chimney mortar can fix it.


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## Jonny006 (Aug 4, 2013)

So it looks to be a Buck Stove model 2800? Anyone have any experience with this model?


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## begreen (Aug 4, 2013)

gzecc has one.
https://www.hearth.com/talk/threads/big-buck-28000.42526/


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## webbie (Aug 4, 2013)

The Nu-tec was just an aftermarket cat add-on - generic. They worked OK......

Personally I would not give much or ask much for such an old Buck Stove. Not to say someone would not pay it, but most would be scrapped. You are talking 1979 technology there.


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## Jonny006 (Aug 4, 2013)

Webbie, I agree it's an old stove. I had a VC Encore prior in my old house but it was sold with the house. Our new house is larger, and I have run into some major financial setbacks because of shoddy work done by the previous owners. A stove was always in the budget especially with the amount of trees we just took down but, that has taken a back seat due to financial considerations. For the price I paid for this stove I can't fault it. If it does the job for a year or two and I throw a little money at it to make it safe and workable I'll be happy. It's probably going to cost me $1000+ to line my chimney but, that will be fine as if I go to a newer stove later the chimney will be done.
That said, does it make sense to replace the cat? The online manual I saw that was linked above gives no mention of a catalyzer. Also the connection to the chimney is a bit hard to figure out. I see they sell a connector that attaches to the top of the stove and reduces to an 8" round but, that is not for use in an insert type install.
I'm thinking that if this stove can be used that I will have a company come in for the install. I did my own install on the last house and it was a groan. Lining a chimney and making that connection is a pain.


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## webbie (Aug 4, 2013)

I'd say it only makes sense to replace the cat if you find that the rest of the entire mechanism works perfectly - that is, does it seal well to the stove top, does the bypass close well, etc.

It originally had a 1/2 thick round cat in it. That is, I don't think a really thick one will fit - check it.

If you can pick one up on the cheap ($100 or so), it may be worthwhile. Maybe one of the steel ones.....


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## BrotherBart (Aug 4, 2013)

I have never heard of any of the old Bucks being cat stoves. That rectangular flue exit tells me it ain't a cat stove. What worries me is burning a cracked stove in your house. That and the cost of a boot to tie it to a liner is gonna be more than you paid for the stove.

A lot better cracked insert than that one is sitting at the back of my yard for sitting around on cool evenings. When it cracked, it was out of here.

(was typing at the same time webbie was)


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## Jonny006 (Aug 4, 2013)

Well, I agree. The crack does concern me, but not all that much. It is really only the thickness of a hair and since the thing is still in the back of my truck maybe I can have it welded? Truth is I really like the size of this stove. Most of the inserts I've seen, my two sisters have identical ones, only seem to be able to fit a small amount of wood and the size of the logs has to be a consideration.
I mean in all seriousness, is this stove a waste of time? I don't mind polishing a turd and throwing some new gaskets and making it work for a year or two. I just cant shell out 2-4k on a new stove right now. At the same time I also don't want to spend hundreds of dollars on an unsafe relic that might burn my house down.


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## webbie (Aug 5, 2013)

It's no more a turd than the hundreds of other classics that folks here burn. It will be much dirtier than current stoves, but some can be mitigated by proper use.

As I said, the cat was a retrofit by nu-tec. It was a decent unit - we sold and used many of them. 
http://www.csmonitor.com/1987/0126/hretro-f.html

They made one for freestanding and one for inserts. I used many of them on Squire Stoves.

One concern with the Buck is the fan and thermostat(s). If you have to replace all that stuff it could run big bucks. Make sure it all works.


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## Ashful (Aug 5, 2013)

How did the previous owner have it connected to his chimney?  Does he have the boot, or was that boot replaced by the nu-tec cat housing?  Point is, if previous owner had it set up and burning, all of the hardware should be there.

I would definitely have that crack welded shut, prior to use.  It may not hold forever, but it's better than burning as-is.


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## Jonny006 (Aug 5, 2013)

Ok. The fan works. It has a switch on the side and when plugged in it turns on. I'm not sure a out the thermostat though. The stove appears to be steel not cast so I imagine a competent welder could throw a quick bead from the back to seal it up. 
I don't have the boot. I see they sell one for like $180 but maybe I could have one made up by a shop. The previous owner told me he had his chimney guy make him up a boot and it looks as if it was just mortared to the top. I'm not really sure how this damper works. To be honest I've have not had the time to really check it out. I do know that the chain or whatever mechanism that is used to close the plate is missing and has been remedied by a piece of wire. I think this stove was not used properly as evidenced by the crack and lack of useable gaskets on the door. 
If the cat was a retro fit do I really need it? The guy before clearly didn't use it. Other than environmental concerns are there any downsides to not having it in there?


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## Ashful (Aug 5, 2013)

Jonny006 said:


> I don't have the boot. I see they sell one for like $180 but maybe I could have one made up by a shop. The previous owner told me he had his chimney guy make him up a boot and it looks as if it was just mortared to the top.


I'd be wary of any chimney connector that's held in place by mortar or stove cement. One good back-puff or chimney fire (it happens), and your chimney may be disconnected. Look for a solution that bolts in place.



Jonny006 said:


> If the cat was a retro fit do I really need it? The guy before clearly didn't use it. Other than environmental concerns are there any downsides to not having it in there?


 
Mainly, keeping your flue clean. Burning low and slow without a cat in the active region is a recipe for creosote. You will read and hear many horror stories of chimney fires from older folks with pre-EPA stoves, who failed to keep their chimney clean. It's a manageable problem, if you're aware of it and stay on top of it.  Either burn hot, or plan on several cleanings each burn season for the 24/7 burner.


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## BrotherBart (Aug 5, 2013)

Joful said:


> from older folks with pre-EPA stoves


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## Jonny006 (Aug 6, 2013)

Well good info here. I took a look at the stove today and the damper control is not connected. It looks as if there is a hook which goes through a chain loop which should open and close the flap. I think a piece of metal came off the hook bc it won't catch the loop. The whole assembly is attached to the cat holder which is bolted to the stove top. The two 3/16" bolts are not coming loose. I think they may need to be cut but if I do that ill still need them and the threads are on a piece of metal that forms an "L" at the top and I don't know if replacements are available. And...I'm still not sure how this assembly should work and how I would get a cat in there. 
This may go back to Craigslist.


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## mellow (Aug 6, 2013)

Jonny006 said:


> This may go back to Craigslist.


 
Wise decision.

On a side note I tried getting the nu-tec conversion kit a few years ago,  found a guy with a stock pile of them,  was going to put it on my Craft stove but found the Sierra cat insert instead.


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## Ashful (Aug 6, 2013)

mellow said:


> Wise decision.


 
Yes, and we need a new member here... that being the next owner of this stove.


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## Jonny006 (Aug 6, 2013)

Ah the Internet. I did a little digging and phone calling and it seems that while this cAt retrofit is an issue it may not have to be. I was informed today that the entire damper assembly is still available for these stoves minus the cat. So in essence I could have a hungry non-cat stove that will heat the house. I know many of you think it's silly to make this old beast work, but like I've said if I throw a cou


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## Jonny006 (Aug 6, 2013)

Sorry, iPhone typing...
Anyway if I spend $200 bucks getting this pig up to speed I will have a $300 stove that could feasibly save me $1000 in oil. I also just got a line on 35' of 8" liner for @250 with cap. So, lets call it $600 to have it all set up. Isn't that worth it? Of course, this is all hinging upon this stove being repairable. I think it's possible though. 
I am trying to wrap my head around the connection to the liner though. I wonder if there is enough clearance between the top of the stove and the fireplace opening to reach in and attach the pipe. Guess ill find out huh?


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## pen (Aug 6, 2013)

Jonny006 said:


> I am trying to wrap my head around the connection to the liner though.


 
That's the piece that BrotherBart mentioned earlier being likely to cost you more than the stove unfortunately.

Possibly something like this would work http://www.firesidechimneysupply.co...rt-boot.html?gclid=COad7eKR6rgCFUqk4AodEjIAUQ


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## mellow (Aug 7, 2013)

Jonny006 said:


> I also just got a line on 35' of 8" liner for @250 with cap


 
I would want to see the specs on that liner,  for that kind of price it sounds like regular single wall black pipe.


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## Jonny006 (Aug 7, 2013)

The liner was used by a buddy of mine. He removed it when he sold his stove. It's single wall stainless flex pipe.
Yes, the top boot will conceivably cost more than the stove. But if it's safe it's worth the money.
I'm getting excited to get this old beast up and running. I'm not excited about installing the liner and cutting out the fireplace damper. Nope. Not looking forward to that at all.


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## BrotherBart (Aug 7, 2013)

I just have to inject this. My old insert was the same age as yours. Heated this joint for 21 years. The last year of its life I lined the chimney and put a boot on it to connect the liner. Not knowing that a crack had developed in the back. Combined with the fact that the stove was never envisioned to have the kind of draft that liner provided, and the crack letting air in, the sucker ran away the first time it was fired after the liner install and got up to 1,400 degrees stove top and scared the hell out of me. Plugged the crack with furnace cement and the next night the same thing happened again.

Be careful giving those old inserts too much chimney draft that they never dreamed of when they designed them to have since they thought they would be dumping into flue tiles. My liner is 21' tall.

Just sayin...

.


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## gzecc (Aug 16, 2013)

I have a 28000 also. Its satisfactory with extreamly season high quality wood. Unfortunately I would guess that your motor is probably fried, if the insert was over fired. At least make a relationship with the guys at http://www.servicesales.com/buck-stove-parts-c-22.html
I would also oil the motor before re-installing and have the crack welded. The long term problem with this insert is the 8" flue requirement. As you probably know, 6" is the standard now.
I probably use 30-40% more wood than I would with a newer insert. Life is a compromise!


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## Jonny006 (Aug 23, 2013)

The motor hums and blows air quite nicely. The crack has been fixed by a competant welder and he is under the impression that while it did get hot, the crack is more of a design flaw than due to overfiring. The crack is just below the door hinge where there is a bolt which holds the door frame assembly. It was most likely under alot of tension and the added heat caused the split. That was his assessment, and he knows more about metal than I ever will.
The guys at Servicesales also told me that they can supply a new catalyst and damper handle for the retrofit that I have so this can still be a cat stove. I have the 8" liner and just have to get the top stack and some gaskets and I should be good to go.
I am not overly concerned about wood consumption as there is plenty around here. And as I have stated before, this stove is not going to be forever. It's kind of a band aid until I can afford a more modern, efficient, equivalent. Like a kick ass wood boiler!


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## begreen (Aug 23, 2013)

Keep a thermometer on the old stove so that you can monitor it and keep the top below 700F.


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## gzecc (Aug 25, 2013)

Jonny006 said:


> The motor hums and blows air quite nicely. The crack has been fixed by a competant welder and he is under the impression that while it did get hot, the crack is more of a design flaw than due to overfiring. The crack is just below the door hinge where there is a bolt which holds the door frame assembly. It was most likely under alot of tension and the added heat caused the split. That was his assessment, and he knows more about metal than I ever will.
> The guys at Servicesales also told me that they can supply a new catalyst and damper handle for the retrofit that I have so this can still be a cat stove. I have the 8" liner and just have to get the top stack and some gaskets and I should be good to go.
> I am not overly concerned about wood consumption as there is plenty around here. And as I have stated before, this stove is not going to be forever. It's kind of a band aid until I can afford a more modern, efficient, equivalent. Like a kick ass wood boiler!


 The motor will sometimes work fine for a little while then squeel in the middle of the night. Problem with these old Bucks is the motor is only serviceable from the rear. Which means taking the entire 300+lb? insert out to oil and or change it.


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## webbie (Aug 27, 2013)

Here is a pic (ad) of the popular nu-tec catalyst add-on types:
https://www.hearth.com/talk/wiki/nu-tec-nutec-catalytic-add-ons/


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## central_scrutinizer (Sep 18, 2013)

Jonny006 said:


> Well good info here. I took a look at the stove today and the damper control is not connected. It looks as if there is a hook which goes through a chain loop which should open and close the flap. I think a piece of metal came off the hook bc it won't catch the loop. The whole assembly is attached to the cat holder which is bolted to the stove top. The two 3/16" bolts are not coming loose. I think they may need to be cut but if I do that ill still need them and the threads are on a piece of metal that forms an "L" at the top and I don't know if replacements are available. And...I'm still not sure how this assembly should work and how I would get a cat in there.
> This may go back to Craigslist.







If it helps you any, I have several of the Nutec damper rods with hooks.  I also have some cat screens (stainless wire mesh) and some cats.


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## Jonny006 (Sep 18, 2013)

Yup! That's the part. That hook is gone on mine. I had the guy who welded the stove heat up the bolts in order to get the cat holder out. So now the holder is free and I need the aforementioned part as well as an actual cat and I'm afraid that the original "L" bolts that hold the cat assembly are shot. The threads are pretty worn off. Are these still available? Also gonna need new gaskets, a Bakelite knob, chimney thimble and some fire dogs. Then... I should be good. 
How do I go about getting that damper rod?



central_scrutinizer said:


> View attachment 112006
> 
> 
> If it helps you any, I have several of the Nutec damper rods with hooks.  I also have some cat screens (stainless wire mesh) and some cats.


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## Jonny006 (Sep 18, 2013)

Jonny006 said:


> Yup! That's the part. That hook is gone on mine. I had the guy who welded the stove heat up the bolts in order to get the cat holder out. So now the holder is free and I need the aforementioned part as well as an actual cat and I'm afraid that the original "L" bolts that hold the cat assembly are shot. The threads are pretty worn off. Are these still available? Also gonna need new gaskets, a Bakelite knob, chimney thimble and some fire dogs. Then... I should be good.
> How do I go about getting that damper rod?


Ah, checked your profile Scrutinizer, I think we have spoken on the phone. You are my source! I will be calling soon.


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## valley ranch (Oct 29, 2013)

Sounds grim! Well, I've always liked these stoves. I found one for a relative who has decided not to install it. Great. I told her if she decides not to install it I'll take it. I will do what is needed and install it as a free standing. I'm surprised to hear people so down on them, wonder what they have in their house. I've worked on diesel engines, whenever they run away, just like a stove, fix the problem and their back in business. 

In any case I'll use it while I rebuild the one we're using now. Building a secondary air system.

Never lived where we didn't heat with wood. When I would see a buck in someone's house I'd look it over and let them know, If they ever wanted to sell it, let me know. When I've seen one that was a real wood eater, the glass in front was loose. Well, I'll let you know.

No wax Richard


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