# power/gas company is getting smarter



## yooperdave (May 12, 2011)

well, this would have been the third time (if i remember correctly) that the co. changed the gas meter...but...i came home to a message on the phone asking that i call them (gas/elec co) to help explain a "no usage" indication of their meter reading.
usually, they just send someone out and change the gas meter, but now, they are at least calling first to receive an explanation. man, that sure felt good!


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## davmor (May 12, 2011)

Congrats. Nothing like sticking it to the man . Dave.


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## jeff_t (May 12, 2011)

That's funny. I haven't bought LP since Oct 2009, in my 250 gal tank. But my gas man is a good friend, so he knows.


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## Backwoods Savage (May 12, 2011)

Dave, don't count on that being the last you will hear from them. I recall that for 5 winters we went to Arizona. Before we left, we always notified the power company that there would be no electric usage. Every year sometime in February or March we would get a letter from them stating there was a problem and to please contact them. This went on for the 5 winters we went south. Some companies just don't know what is happening even when you tell them.


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## jeff_t (May 12, 2011)

Now that I think about it, the electric co decided my meter wasn't working right. They came and changed it out, then 'estimated' my bill back to when they thought it quit working. That happened to coincide with the installation of a gas water heater, and the end of a hot summer. WTF? When I called and told them they had to fix my bill, they told me I should've notified them of the change. What a debacle. I almost forgot about that. Too bad I can't shop around for power. If I had the capital to put up a windmill, I would have told them to piss off right then.


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## Backwoods Savage (May 12, 2011)

That is terrible Jeff. I'd still fight paying that. Why pay for something you did not get. I'd also bet the State might have something to say about them billing you. 

btw, the windmill can be a helper but I would not count on too much help in your area. Maybe if you lived over along Lake MI you'd do better. Besides, would you want to be buying batteries all the time? They can be recharged only so many times before they need replacing.


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## jeff_t (May 12, 2011)

Backwoods Savage said:
			
		

> That is terrible Jeff. I'd still fight paying that. Why pay for something you did not get. I'd also bet the State might have something to say about them billing you.
> 
> btw, the windmill can be a helper but I would not count on too much help in your area. Maybe if you lived over along Lake MI you'd do better. Besides, would you want to be buying batteries all the time? They can be recharged only so many times before they need replacing.



Oh, it all got straightened out. Just took a little time and more effort that I shouldn't have had to put in.

And btw, my former employer does quite well with his windmill, and my house is way more out in the open than his. I'd still think about it, but ROI is too far out for me.


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## fire_man (May 12, 2011)

Yoopedave:

We had exactly the opposite problem with Our Massachusetts Electric Company while living in an apartment building. One Month our neighbors below us moved out and the apartment remained vacant for months. Our Electric bill went to zero and I actually complained to the Electric Company that our meters must be swapped. They finally sent someone out (after arguing with me) and verified our meters were swapped! Shortly afterwards the family from hell moved in with multiple air conditioners and a party fridge for every room. Needless to say we lucked out to be paying our own bill.


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## Wood Heat Stoves (May 13, 2011)

I have the opposite problem, too. Last Winter my power was out for 8 days straight, yet the new PG & E "Smart" meter they just installed showed electrical usage during that time. I can guarantee nothing was working.


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## JoeyD (May 13, 2011)

Maybe you can leave a note on the meter saying something like "see stacks of wood in backyard".


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## yooperdave (May 13, 2011)

the meters used to be read physically on site, but when they were changed out last spring/summer, the meter reader lost her job.  they are now able to send a signal to a remote sensor, and everything is then billed from there.  but, even then, i don't think the reader made a note of the wood pile in the yard.


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## burntime (May 13, 2011)

I got the meter changed 3 plus times.  Kinda lost count.  The last time the guy was looking at the meter and more watching me.  I called him over and pointed to the front yard...  He just let out a Ohhhh, that makes sense...  Its been a few years now.  I think they finally got it...


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## BrotherBart (May 13, 2011)

They changed mine every two or three years for a long time. Even though they had to walk around the wood stacks to get to it. Their work order says "Change meter" so that is what they do.

Just hope you are home when they do it and shut everything down. They destroyed a very expensive UPS of mine when they just yanked the meter and plugged a new one in.


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## Intheswamp (May 13, 2011)

jeff_t said:
			
		

> Backwoods Savage said:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


If you have a small stream with a 3-4 foot drop/waterfall that is the answer...24/7 hydro  Of course if you're area is prone to droughts....

As Dennis stated, batteries are the Achilles tendon of most alternative energy systems.

Ed


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## Corey (May 13, 2011)

I got the gas meter change-out a few years ago...was only using ~$4-5 bucks of gas a month for hot water (+$16 customer charge).  The very month they changed it, I ran low on wood and had to kick on the furnace...bill shot up to $80-90.  Bet they thought they hit the jackpot!


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## woodchip (May 13, 2011)

Over here, when your power consumption drops without any reason, they usually check out the meter to make sure you are not bypassing it or have interfered with it in some way.

They like to advertise how they can help you reduce your bills, but they don't really like it if you make your own power and beat the system  ;-)


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## egclassic (May 14, 2011)

Talk about smarter, Duke Energy here in Cincinnati is currently installing what they call "smart meters" (electric only, so far.). These new "smart" meters are now going to be read every 15 minutes or so by satellite. This will now allow them to start charging us "peak usage" rates, just like cell phones. Maybe they already have these where some of you live now, but I just heard about them this year, another way for them to stick it to us!!


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## BrotherBart (May 14, 2011)

egclassic said:
			
		

> Talk about smarter, Duke Energy here in Cincinnati is currently installing what they call "smart meters" (electric only, so far.). These new "smart" meters are now going to be read every 15 minutes or so by satellite. This will now allow them to start charging us "peak usage" rates, just like cell phones. Maybe they already have these where some of you live now, but I just heard about them this year, another way for them to stick it to us!!



I wish ours did. We get "peak usage" rates 24 hours a day. Of course if they change it the base rate will be what it is now and "peak" will be above that. But my co-op knows me by sight and name and when they do it the receptionist will be saying "Oh no. It's him.". They really hate when somebody takes them up on that "this is a user owned utility" line.

They get asked the same question that absolutely kills politicians. "Why?" and then silence. They then put Dancing With The Stars to shame.


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## heatwise (May 14, 2011)

my dad had the authorities show up years ago at his place because they thought the meter was tampered with. he allowed them in and breifly explained the lack of consumption but refused to let them look around and asked them to leave. i guess they thought they had a criminal.


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## Backwoods Savage (May 14, 2011)

YooperDave, what happened yesterday? Looks like they turned the heat off outdoors up there while we were roasting.


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## yooperdave (May 14, 2011)

Backwoods Savage said:
			
		

> YooperDave, what happened yesterday? Looks like they turned the heat off outdoors up there while we were roasting.



well dennis, goes with the territory, right? had the low 30's last night (colder at 99 lbs house) and the next 2 nights also. should make for some good walleye fishing, though...what with the ne wind and cooler temps. today the high will be in the 40's; sun. will be in the 50's and forecasted to have that big yellow thing in the sky peek out a little...


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## Backwoods Savage (May 14, 2011)

Ya Dave. It reminds me of when we lived near Escanaba. I also recall that one year when the lilacs did not blossom until July 4! That made for a not so good festival on Mackinaw Island. My son was in the Gladstone band and they went to the festival. No lilacs. lol


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## woodsmaster (May 14, 2011)

[quote author="woodchip" date="1305314845"

"They like to advertise how they can help you reduce your bills, but they don't really like it if you make your own power and beat the system"  ;-)[/quote]

You are right on. It's funny how they preach conservation but sell you elec. devices to get your bill up. I had the co-op enginer out here when I run power to the shop and he addmited he was happy that I put up the shop becouse of the extra elec I would be using. I told him I also put in a wood boiler to heat every thing. He said as long as your putting up buildings you will use more power. So far I haven't used any more power than I used to. He even stated they want to sell as much elec. as possible.


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## Intheswamp (May 14, 2011)

At the beginning of 2001 we completed construction of a 5-ton geothermal system including all duct work here at the house.  The house is a vintage 1950 brick home with GIANT SINGLE PANED WINDOWS (right after the war glass was cheap, energy was cheap, etc.,).  

The local electrical cooperative had a program where they would "co-op" installation of energy-efficient equipment of which the geo system qualified.  I got in touch with them and they sent their "engineer" over.  He walked in, looked at the windows and stated they wouldn't help with anything until I replaced every window.  Right now I'm sitting beside one of the smaller windows...it has fifteen 11"x15" panes in it....some of the other windows are a foot or two taller than I am and 7-8 feet wide.  Replacing the windows would cost more than the geothermal system!  Ah well, the windows are old steel casement type windows that are needing repacing...but that rich uncle that I don't know about is gonna have to die first.

I understand that the windows would definitely help reduce our energy use but the fact is that the geo system cut our cooling bill virtually in half and for the first time in the ten years that we had lived here we could actually get the entire house to a comfortable temperature in the summer...at half the energy use.  I guess cutting our power bill in half wasn't good enough to qualify for the "co-op", though.  Same thing for heating though we previously used propane space heaters.  

I'm hoping this winter, with our little F3CB, that we can "stick it to the man" a little bit more. 

Ed


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## begreen (May 14, 2011)

What about having good, storm windows made? We have some classic old, single pane windows that I didn't want to lose so I had nice tight fitting storms made for them. They are fixed lights, so I cleaned them very well then installed the storms with a bed of caulk. The results have worked out well.


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