# Need immediate advice - Siding job started today - is this the proper way to attach tyvek?



## joefrompa (Jul 20, 2011)

Hi all,

Siding guys started today on my house. They are doing fanfold foam board insulation and then tyvek on top. They just started.

I've taken a picture of how they attached the initial roll of tyvek, which I believe is improper. I will be contacting dupont later on today to double check but wanted to ask for some immediate advice from a group of members on here who often do this stuff and may know the answer.

Here's the picture:







Thanks for any immediate advice on whether or not this is proper. I don't care about hte nail being bent, I care that they are using nails and not felt fasteners or plastic-washer-nails (wrap cap nails).

Joe


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## chrisasst (Jul 20, 2011)

Should be staples I believe.


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## semipro (Jul 20, 2011)

No help with the attachment method. 

I'm wondering if they even need to put a rain shield over that type of foam but then, I don't recognize that brand of foam. 

What type of siding are they hanging?


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## Reggie Dunlap (Jul 20, 2011)

How thick is the foam insulation? Staples won't hold in foam, so they're using the nail to hold the Tyvec while they install the siding. They should also tape all Tyvec joints.


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## billb3 (Jul 20, 2011)

When they did the houses next door they were pretty generous with the staples.
Do they have a grunt coming back later  to do the taping and stapling ?
Course , if it's getting shingled those staples will hold it on, but  with just nails it's gonna be tough to tape and make nice corners at the windows.
Looks temporary.


-and I was tempted to go over and see the length of the staples because the tyvek was going over 1 inch pink foam board. With vinyl siding  on top of that.  Didn't look very hurricane proof.

and the new owners are already pressure washing the vinyl.
spraying up  into  it, of course.


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## joefrompa (Jul 20, 2011)

Hey guys. It's 1/4" fanfold foam board that is rated to go under exterior vinyl as a sheathing that, in and of itself, is sufficient. I'm having them tyvek on top of that for extra protection and other benefits of tyvek.

The foamboard is being attached to studding and undersheathing (which is basically sheetrock under the foam) with nails. The foam is not being taped at it's seams.

On top of the foam tyvek is being laid down and I would say laid down appropriately - bottom to top, about 6" overlap between sheets.

Tyvek is being attached with those nails as seen in the pic, then the seams are being taped off with tyvek-brand tape.

On top of that is going to be ~12' stretches of Mastic vinyl siding, .44 dutch-lap style. 

I talked with the general manager when he was on site this morning and he said the nails hold it better than staples. However, I'm not concerned with that - I'm concerned with it correctly fastening it and maintaing it's strength, as well as maintaining it's water-tight status.

I'm not gonna give them a hard time or anything when I don't know - but i'm calling dupont this morning to double check, or maybe the vinyl siding institute.


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## joefrompa (Jul 20, 2011)

Foam brand is "Green Guard"


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## JustWood (Jul 20, 2011)

billb3 said:
			
		

> When they did the houses next door they were pretty generous with the staples.
> Do they have a grunt coming back later  to do the taping and stapling ?
> Course , if it's getting shingled those staples will hold it on, but  with just nails it's gonna be tough to tape and make nice corners at the windows.
> Looks temporary.
> ...


That does look temp. When they get all the way around the house they will prolly remove nails and seam together.


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## joefrompa (Jul 20, 2011)

The guy actually put down stapling (if I heard him right). 

FYI, I got an e-mailfrom the guy who sold the job to me who stopped by. He saw they were using 1/4 fanfold insulation when I had bought 3/8" - he told them to rip all the foam and tyvek down and start over with 3/8".

On the plus side, it shows some perfectionism and professionalism. On the downside, I don't get to see the new stuff going back up. Hopefully it's not all covered over tonight.


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## jimbom (Jul 20, 2011)

The Tyvek roll used to come with manufacturer directions on a sheet stuck in the first lap or two.  I refereed to that when a discussion came up about my Tyvek installation.  Check the unwrapped rolls or the trash cans.  

http://chicagohomeprimer.com/editable/uploads/File/Tyvek InstallGuideWRB_K16282.pdf


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## lukem (Jul 20, 2011)

Nails from siding will provide additional fastening for Tyvek as well.

The only time I've ever done it I used nails with plastic caps.


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## gpcollen1 (Jul 20, 2011)

joefrompa said:
			
		

> Hey guys. It's 1/4" fanfold foam board that is rated to go under exterior vinyl as a sheathing that, in and of itself, is sufficient. I'm having them tyvek on top of that for extra protection and other benefits of tyvek.
> 
> The foamboard is being attached to studding and undersheathing (which is basically sheetrock under the foam) with nails. The foam is not being taped at it's seams.
> 
> ...



Sheetrock under the nails??

As for the insulating board, I had the guys gorilla tape the seams of it.


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## joefrompa (Jul 20, 2011)

The material under the original asbestos shingle siding is a form of sheetrock. Feels/looks the same albeit without the same paper top surface. It's original to the house as far as I can tell.

I did forget that the siding is nailed through the tyvek anyway...


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## joefrompa (Jul 20, 2011)

So just talked with a dupont tyvek specialist (great customer service experience by the way).

He told me using nails is fine as long as the tyvek is covered in siding pretty quickly. Using disc nails or crown staples is a best practice, but is mainly for keeping the tyvek properly attached if it remains exposed to the elements up to the 120 days its rated for, and keeping it wind resistant while it's uncovered.

So +1 for the siders - so far they have corrected one issue they did (improper foam board thickness) and are using an appropriate technique for the tyvek. The only thing that hasn't gone perfect is that when they dropped off the dumpster the truck took out a large maple limb on one of my prime trees. Sucks but stuff happens.


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## thinkxingu (Jul 20, 2011)

Nails are fine, plastic-ringed are better.  Either way, they should absolutely be taping the seams.  One more layer of protection (imagine gaps all over your house!) and will keep the foam from shifting/opening up.

S


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## joefrompa (Jul 20, 2011)

They are taping the tyvek seams with tyvek tape.


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## thinkxingu (Jul 20, 2011)

Oops, missed that.  Good.

S


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## joefrompa (Jul 20, 2011)

I'm making sure they are doing the following:

taping all vertical seams
taping all or most horizontal seams
Taping all window/door headers/sides but not the sill plates of windows (according to dupont, that's proper)


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## fishingpol (Jul 20, 2011)

Some contractors are trained and certified to install Tyvek.  If they are, there should be a lifetime warranty on the install.


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## nate379 (Jul 21, 2011)

If you have 6-8" overlap, shouldn't need to tape seams.


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## joefrompa (Jul 21, 2011)

According to dupont, 6+ inches of overlap and taped seams is what provides not only a water-resistant barrier (the main purpose of tyvek) but also a good air barrier. 

Here's what they've told me, which seems right: besides their usual taping, they tape around windows and corners by taping the tyvek directly to the j-channel. 

One thing that absolutely sucks about this job is that all their hammering is making the original, 35 year old nails in my drywall pop up under the paint. So in my excellent living room, where I paid $700 to have a professional (and close friend) painter come in and smooth out imperfections and do an awesome job painting 1 year ago, I now have loads of nail pops on the exterior wall.

Just one of those unexpected things. If the drywall had been screwed in, wouldn't have happened.


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## nate379 (Jul 26, 2011)

Should have fired in a pail of screws before your bud came and did the drywall smoothing.


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## joefrompa (Jul 26, 2011)

Yeah. Shoulda woulda coulda....didn't.

Lesson learned. I'm waiting till their down, but I'm going to take a towel wrapped 1x3 and a rubber mallet and see if I can't sink them back flush a bit.


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