# Getting a Hearthstone up to 600°



## BrowningBAR (Nov 19, 2011)

Figured I'd go through the process of how I get the Heritage up to 600Â° since there have been some questions and remarks about getting a Hearthstone up to certain temps. This isn't a perfect illustration, as the photos were taken quickly on an iPad later in the day so the lighting is poor, with a lot of reflections, and I did not take photos of the splits that were used. 

First, I started with about six medium sized splits (on the smaller end of the medium scale). In this particular instance I am starting on a hot bed of coals with the stove top sitting at about 300Â°.


Fire has been going for about 10-15 minutes. The air controls are completely open and the pipe damper is open. Top center stone is at 377Â°







After that photo was taken the air controls were adjusted to 60% open. Pipe damper is still open.


5-10 minutes have passed. Air controls are still 60% open with the damper open. Top center stone is at 412Â°






After that photo was taken the pipe damper was closed and the air controls were adjusted to about 45% open.


10 minutes have passed. The pipe damper is closed with air controls still at 45% open. Top center stone is at 519Â°






After that photo was taken the air controls have now been adjusted to about 15% open with the pipe damper closed.


This photo shows the control settings at this point (note that the Rutland is lagging behind in temperature readings):






5-10 minutes have passed. Air controls and pipe damper remains the same. Top center stone is at 545Â°






5 minutes have passed. Air controls are now closed. Pipe damper remains closed. Final shot. Top center stone is at 595Â°





Stove topped out at 610Â° briefly before coming back down.

And there you have; A Hearthstone at 600Â°.


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## Milton Findley (Nov 19, 2011)

Well, I am within 5 degrees of believing you.  You know that if there is no picture, it didn't happen.   ;-)


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## certified106 (Nov 19, 2011)

I will bet that thing was cranking out the heat at that point! Did you have any clothes left on by the time it was at 600? LOL


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## MarkinNC (Nov 19, 2011)

One of my friends has a hearthstone stove, I think it is a Heritage.  Anyway, I think he is afraid to take his stove above 350 or so. We have talked about it and various brands saying it's OK to go at least to 500 degrees.  He says it heats his house well even though he never takes it up high.

I started out zeroed in on the Hearthstone brand and they sure are pretty.  I wound up with a workhorse type stove in the end and I have to ask if there is something to that softer heat "thing?"  I know I like my 700 or 750 degree stove when I want heat.

Nice post btw, this forum is hard to post pics on and posting three pics in one was a nice trick.


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## BrowningBAR (Nov 19, 2011)

certified106 said:
			
		

> I will bet that thing was cranking out the heat at that point! Did you have any clothes left on by the time it was at 600? LOL




Standing right in front of and over the stove had me sweating.

That load gave me a five hour burn. I'm going to start working on trying to figure out how to stretch out the burn times.


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## BrowningBAR (Nov 19, 2011)

Milt said:
			
		

> Well, I am within 5 degrees of believing you.  You know that if there is no picture, it didn't happen.   ;-)




Damnit, ruined by the fine print, yet again!


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## BrowningBAR (Nov 19, 2011)

MarkinNC said:
			
		

> One of my friends has a hearthstone stove, I think it is a Heritage.  Anyway, I think he is afraid to take his stove above 350 or so. We have talked about it and various brands saying it's OK to go at least to 500 degrees.  He says it heats his house well even though he never takes it up high.



If he's happy, I guess that's all that matters. Though, he might want to learn how to burn it hotter in case he ever needs more heat.




> I started out zeroed in on the Hearthstone brand and they sure are pretty.  I wound up with a workhorse type stove in the end and I have to ask if there is something to that softer heat "thing?"  I know I like my 700 or 750 degree stove when I want heat.



It heats well. For my application, I need a larger firebox for a variety of reasons. It is a solid, consistent, and simple to operate stove. If I would do it all again, I'd go with the Mansfield as the larger firebox provides better flexibility.



> Nice post btw, this forum is hard to post pics on and posting three pics in one was a nice trick.



The trick is to post your pics on a free hosting server like PhotoBucket and then make your post using the "[ img ][ /img ]" option in the top navigation when you create a post.


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## Scott2373 (Nov 19, 2011)

> The trick is to post your pics on a free hosting server like PhotoBucket and then make your post using the "[ img ][ /img ]" option in the top navigation when you create a post.



Or just use the "Preview Post" button below and keep adding pics each time it refreshes. You'll see a list of added pics to the right of the "Browse" button.


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## shawneyboy (Nov 19, 2011)

Excellent post Browning. A great illustration of one of the ways to get a big ole rock up to temp.


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## Battenkiller (Nov 19, 2011)

Scott2373 said:
			
		

> > The trick is to post your pics on a free hosting server like PhotoBucket and then make your post using the "[ img ][ /img ]" option in the top navigation when you create a post.
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> Or just use the "Preview Post" button below and keep adding pics each time it refreshes. You'll see a list of added pics to the right of the "Browse" button.



I do both depending on how large I want my pic to appear when it opens, or how important fine detail is to the reason I'm posting the pic in the first place.  I'm sure that there are some who don't realize that clicking on an attached photo enlarges it beyond the thumbnail size.  If the photo is important enough to me that I want it displayed in its original resolution then I upload it onto my Photobucket account.  Takes like 30 seconds.

FWIW out of politeness to the group, I usually try to keep to the attachments when I can because they don't blare out there in the forefront... 'specially in somebody else's thread.  If I really feel the photo needs to grab attention for some reason, I still try to keep the size around 800 pixels in its largest dimension.  If more detail is needed you can always crop it in Photoshop.  Nothing more embarassing than accidentally posting a 1200 pixel pic of your moisture meter reading 12% MC.  :red:


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## Battenkiller (Nov 19, 2011)

BTW BBAR If I was going to try to explain the technology to a newbie, I couldn't think of a better photo sequence to show them.  Especially that last photo, with almost every secondary hole lit up, clean flame, and no smoke apparent inside the box.  This is the type of burn I'll be shooting for when I eventually get an EPA stove.  Obviously, it does the job of heat output as well as any of those scary looking "Bowels of Hell" photos and videos that are on the Interweb.


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## BrowningBAR (Nov 19, 2011)

Battenkiller said:
			
		

> BTW BBAR If I was going to try to explain the technology to a newbie, I couldn't think of a better photo sequence to show them.  Especially that last photo, with almost every secondary hole lit up, clean flame, and no smoke apparent inside the box.  This is the type of burn I'll be shooting for when I eventually get an EPA stove.  Obviously, it does the job of heat output as well as any of those scary looking "Bowels of Hell" photos and videos that are on the Interweb.




Thanks. If I would have done this about two hours earlier, the photo quality would have been much better. The photos showing at 519 and 545 degrees actually had a lot more going on in the firebox than the images show. The secondaries were less organized and more erratic than the final shot at 595.

And you are correct, at least for this stove, that if you have the "Bowels of Hell" look going on, you are either still locking in the burn, or you are wasting fuel. The "Bowels of Hell" do not give you the high burn temps on this stove and, for me at least, shows that a lot of heat is going up the chimney.


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## BrowningBAR (Nov 19, 2011)

Battenkiller said:
			
		

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Yeah, I felt the photos were a little large, but when I shrunk them down the quality looked even worse since you lost a lot of detail shoing what was going on in the firebox. Also, the readability of the blurry temp reading didn't help when I shrunk the images down further than what you see.


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## BrowningBAR (Nov 19, 2011)

shawneyboy said:
			
		

> Excellent post Browning. A great illustration of one of the ways to get a big ole rock up to temp.




The pipe damper won't work for everyone, but the air controls, what is going on in the firebox, and the temp reading should at least be a good indicator to most. I think the poster with the Equinox is trying to run his stove like an old smoke dragon by letting the fire rip, wait until the temps come up, and then shut the air back. That would never work on these stoves.


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## snowleopard (Nov 19, 2011)

MarkinNC said:
			
		

> I started out zeroed in on the Hearthstone brand and they sure are pretty.  I wound up with a workhorse type stove in the end and I have to ask if there is something to that softer heat "thing?"  I know I like my 700 or 750 degree stove when I want heat.



I use Picasa (free download) for posting pix.  There's a sticky around here somewhere on posting pix to the forums, and I just followed the instructions.  Makes it pretty simple, which is what I was looking for.

As far as the soft heat thing, yes, there's something to it.  If you've ever spent time in a log cabin heated with a woodstove, you'll have an idea of what that is like.  Log cabins are not particularly energy efficient, but they are very comfortable once the thermal mass of the logs has gotten warmed up, and heat radiates back into the room from them.   It doesn't have that roasting-on-one-side-freezing-on-the-other direct blast of heat. I don't know why it works this way, but it seems like it does a better job transferring heat to the thermal mass in my house, as opposed to other stoves that created hot air. 

I tend to run my stove between 350-500 degrees, and it keeps our house very comfortable.  I've lived with many other stoves: barrel stoves, wood cook-stoves, steel, cast iron, and even one sheet-metal stove, and I've spent time around other people's stoves as well. I've never had a stove like this, and as long as I'm heating with wood, I would choose stone as my primary heater.


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## woodmiser (Nov 19, 2011)

Thanks BB,. I can get my Equinox to 600 easily with a good load of dry wood and some so-so oak. Matter of fact I was almost at 700!


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## BrowningBAR (Nov 19, 2011)

woodmiser said:
			
		

> Thanks BB,. I can get my Equinox to 600 easily with a good load of dry wood and some so-so oak. Matter of fact I was almost at 700!




Highest I've gotten the Heritage was about 650.

700 on an Equinox must have been pumping out a ton of heat.


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## Battenkiller (Nov 20, 2011)

BrowningBAR said:
			
		

> Yeah, I felt the photos were a little large, but when I shrunk them down the quality looked even worse since you lost a lot of detail shoing what was going on in the firebox. Also, the readability of the blurry temp reading didn't help when I shrunk the images down further than what you see.



No, I didn't mean in your case here, just in general.  Perfect size IMHO.  You're trying to show what's going on inside your firebox.  The bigger the better.  Plus, you're the author of the thread.  Makes you the king.  :cheese: 

I like the way you took the time to do insets for the temp readings as well.  Next time I post shots like that I'll follow your lead.  ;-)


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## MarkinNC (Nov 20, 2011)

snowleopard said:
			
		

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I use picaso as well.  When I tried to upload a picture from my android phone the other day, it was to big,  Now if the forum automatically resized it for me (like the other forums I belong to), that would be great.  I've though about posting this in a suggestion area on the forum.

Thanks for the follow up on the soft heat


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## trettig (Nov 20, 2011)

Awesome illustrating photos.  I think I will install a stove pipe.


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## BrowningBAR (Nov 20, 2011)

trettig said:
			
		

> Awesome illustrating photos.  I think I will install a stove pipe.



A pipe damper is cheap to do, and may work for you since your chimney is taller than mine. But, it may not solve all your problems. I suspect your wood and operating methods may be attributing to the problems. I hope this helps and I hope to see an update on your Equinox.


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## Highbeam (Nov 20, 2011)

BrowningBAR said:
			
		

> And you are correct, at least for this stove, that if you have the "Bowels of Hell" look going on, you are either still locking in the burn, or you are wasting fuel. The "Bowels of Hell" do not give you the high burn temps on this stove and, for me at least, shows that a lot of heat is going up the chimney.



I have found this to be true as well. The hottest fires are not the brightest but they are the ones where the secondary tubes glow red and where primary air is almost shut off. 

The other trick is small wood. You wouldn't be able to fit six splits of anything in this stove unless they are pretty small. You are using the 4 inch splits which is not what old smoke dragon users remember. All of the small pieces seem to start up better and give off their gasses.


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## oldspark (Nov 20, 2011)

Highbeam said:
			
		

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 Well I am still learning how to run the summit but the highest temps I get are with flames on both the wood and secondaries, the flue temps drop after I start to close the draft down, with my new chimney I like using some of the bigger splitts, this especially holds true for the less dense wood. Not sure you can come up with the "best" way to run any paticular wood burner, its a learn and burn as you go for your own needs.


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## Woody Stover (Nov 20, 2011)

snowleopard said:
			
		

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Right now there's just a small pile of coals left in the bottom of the box and the stove top is at 170. When I step out from behind the bookcase I can still feel the radiant heat off the stove, 25' away.


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## BrowningBAR (Nov 20, 2011)

BrowningBAR said:
			
		

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New inadvertent high; 684Â°  :red: 

Threw a bunch of uglys in on a reload, damper closed and air open at 50%. I got the rare Bowels of Hell with high temps...


It's a little warm in here right now.


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## BrowningBAR (Nov 20, 2011)

BrowningBAR said:
			
		

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And 20 minutes later


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## DanCorcoran (Nov 20, 2011)

oldspark: "...the flue temps drop after I start to close the draft down,"

That's a good thing.  When you reduce the air supply, the heat stops going up the chimney and stays in the stove.


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## oldspark (Nov 21, 2011)

DanCorcoran said:
			
		

> oldspark: "...the flue temps drop after I start to close the draft down,"
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> That's a good thing.  When you reduce the air supply, the heat stops going up the chimney and stays in the stove.


 That was my point maybe it got lost in the mix.


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## rudysmallfry (Nov 21, 2011)

Damn, I can't even stay in the room with my Heritage when it's at 500. I can't imagine 600+. Do you guys get that cast iron smell? I've got new stove pipe this year, so I guess there's still stuff burning off.


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## BrowningBAR (Nov 22, 2011)

rudysmallfry said:
			
		

> Damn, I can't even stay in the room with my Heritage when it's at 500. I can't imagine 600+. Do you guys get that cast iron smell? I've got new stove pipe this year, so I guess there's still stuff burning off.




I only get an odd smell from my double walled pipe when I have too much heat going up the chimney. With the damper closed, the surface temp on the double wall pipe does not exceed 250 when I'm doing it right.


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## Stump_Branch (Nov 22, 2011)

Good write up browning


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## mtbon (Nov 23, 2011)

Thanks Browning for this post, I believe this is how these stoves should be run if need be.

However, this practice is in sharp contrast to how Hearthstone advises me to run my stove.  They told me not to ever run the stove (Homestead) above 500Â°.

I won't get into details here, and there are some good posts from other Hearthstone owners here on max. temps for these stoves, I just felt compelled to share this information I received straight from the company.

I realize this is my first post and I don't exude credibility, but I have been a hearth.com forum follower and have learned a lot great practices regarding EPA stove operation and wood processing.  I am not out to bash Hearthstone by any means and for the most part I love my new Homestead, just wish they provided more consistency/clarity on how to run these stoves.

Thanks.


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## BrowningBAR (Nov 23, 2011)

mtbon said:
			
		

> Thanks Browning for this post, I believe this is how these stoves should be run if need be.
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I'll look through the manual for the Homestead, but I know that Hearthstone recommends maximum temps of 600 on the Heritage, Mansfield, and Equinox. I'd wager that applies for the Homestead as well.


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## BrowningBAR (Nov 23, 2011)

Yep, page 38 of the Homestead Manual:
"The surface temperature on top of the stove should not exceed 600Â°ï€ Fahrenheit"


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## mtbon (Nov 23, 2011)

Yes, it does say 600Â° in the manual.  I am in contact with them about having a part replaced and they are telling me that it is not a good idea to exceed 500Â°!  
I easily reach and need 500Â° out of this stove, but parts should not be compromised because of it.


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## oldspark (Nov 23, 2011)

mtbon said:
			
		

> Yes, it does say 600Â° in the manual.  I am in contact with them about having a part replaced and they are telling me that it is not a good idea to exceed 500Â°!
> I easily reach and need 500Â° out of this stove, but parts should not be compromised because of it.


 With most stove sticks and paper will get you to 500!


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## BrowningBAR (Nov 23, 2011)

mtbon said:
			
		

> Yes, it does say 600Â° in the manual.  I am in contact with them about having a part replaced and they are telling me that it is not a good idea to exceed 500Â°!
> I easily reach and need 500Â° out of this stove, but parts should not be compromised because of it.




Who is "they". Every dealer I have spoken with and all of their manuals state 600 degrees. The only parts that will be effected by high temps are the soapstone. Everything else is cast iron. Exceeding 600 brings a risk of the stones cracking. Parts will _not_ be compromised with temps exceeding 500 degrees.

What parts are you replacing?


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## leeave96 (Nov 23, 2011)

BrowningBAR said:
			
		

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+1 and FWIW, the soapstone on the Woodstocks can go to 700 degrees so I wouldn't hesitate, if I needed the heat, to take a Hearthstone to 600 - or maybe 599.... 

Bill


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## Todd (Nov 23, 2011)

There's a difference between the Woodstock's and Hearthstones. The top stones are thicker, 1 1/4" on the Hearthstones verses the 3/4" Woodstock top. If you put down another slab of stone on top of the Woodstocks the temp will drop 100 or so degrees. 

The high temp isn't what cracks the stone, soapstone can handle any amount of heat a wood stove could give it, it's the cast iron that doesn't like temps over 1400 and the expansion of the cast can put stress on the stones. I would say any stove top temp over 600 in either stove is getting close to those 1400 internal temps.


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## Highbeam (Nov 23, 2011)

And with the double wall construction of the woodstocks you would be less likely to crack a stone. They don't see the same temp differential that a single wall stove would see. 

There are stainless steel bits and cast iron bits inside out stoves. The normal failure, other than stones cracking, is catastrophic sagging of the stove top. The cast iron grid supporting the roof is a weak link. Luckily it is relatively easy to replace. 

The stone may not get too hot but if you have a super hot blast furnace type of fire going then you can overheat the castings before the stone heats up. This is why a probe meter in the flue is so beneficial. My standard condar probe meter displays temps well over 1000 regularly and I've seen 1250 degrees 15" up the flue, all when the stove top is under 400, so you know that the castings are seeing some high temps when a stone stove is being pushed hard.

You really can't compare operating a steel stove to how a stone stove runs.


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## mtbon (Nov 24, 2011)

BrowningBAR said:
			
		

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Both the dealer and their Hearthstone rep. say not to exceed 500Â°.  I was taken aback by that one, especially after reading the manual.  
The problem I have is a warped airwash plate.  On the Homestead it is a thin piece of metal.  I have looked at the Heritage and the airwash plate on that stove is either cast iron or a heavier gauge steel.
I am not too happy about it since I have only used the stove one season and have been very careful to not go near the overfire temp of 600Â°.  
So far Hearthstone is saying this is normal for this stove model, but I am saying it's a defective part.
Thanks.


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## leeave96 (Nov 24, 2011)

Todd said:
			
		

> There's a difference between the Woodstock's and Hearthstones. The top stones are thicker, 1 1/4" on the Hearthstones verses the 3/4" Woodstock top. If you put down another slab of stone on top of the Woodstocks the temp will drop 100 or so degrees.
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> The high temp isn't what cracks the stone, soapstone can handle any amount of heat a wood stove could give it, it's the cast iron that doesn't like temps over 1400 and the expansion of the cast can put stress on the stones. I would say any stove top temp over 600 in either stove is getting close to those 1400 internal temps.



I think what I'm thinking is that regardless of the thickness or if there are one or two plates of soapstone, the hottest part of the stone is on the inside of the firebox.  It may be that when the Woodstock stovetop is at 700 degrees and the Hearthstone's stovetop is 600 degrees, the interior surface of each is similar in temperature and maybe your cooking the cast iron in both at the same temp limits.

Thanks!
Bill


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## BrowningBAR (Nov 24, 2011)

mtbon said:
			
		

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I think you are being fed some bad information. A warped ash plate is not normal wear. Especially after one season. Do you leave the ash pan open to boost the air during the start up of a fire?


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## Todd (Nov 24, 2011)

BrowningBAR said:
			
		

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Air wash plate or ash plate? I remember my old Homestead had a pretty heavy duty cast iron plate in front that held up the baffle board and it never showed any signs of warpage. The ash pan grate was a bad design imo, I had a few overfires because it didn't seal properly, I ended up taking the grate out and replacing it with fire bricks. Also had a stone crack on the right side.


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## BrowningBAR (Nov 24, 2011)

Todd said:
			
		

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Did it warp after one firing season?


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## Todd (Nov 24, 2011)

BrowningBAR said:
			
		

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Nope, and I ran it pretty hard in the 500-600 range. I had this stove back in 2002-2003 so the design may have changed since then?


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## BrowningBAR (Nov 24, 2011)

Todd said:
			
		

> Nope, and I ran it pretty hard in the 500-600 range.




Which leads me to believe something aided in the warping of the part for the poster 'mtbon'.


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## kayakkeith (Nov 24, 2011)

maybe should start another thread but my Keystone I generally get it to 650 on the high end for a hour or so. I hope that doesnt do anything bad to it


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## BrowningBAR (Nov 24, 2011)

kayakkeith said:
			
		

> maybe should start another thread but my Keystone I generally get it to 650 on the high end for a hour or so. *I hope that doesnt do anything bad to it*



It won't. Woodstock recommends a top temp of 700 degrees. Hearthstones are different due to design and 600 is the recommended top temp for Hearthstones. You are fine.

Getting either stove above recommended top temps briefly will not cause either stove to explode, break in half, or to get sucked into a black hole.


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## kayakkeith (Nov 24, 2011)

was really worried about that black hole thing as we are at 3200 feet here and we get sucked up much more easily then low landers........ LOL


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## Todd (Nov 24, 2011)

I don't know, once I see temps up in that 650 range my internal cat probe is pushing that 1600 limit and it makes me worry a bit about cat life and the stress it's putting on the cast iron parts around it. 500-600 is where I like to cruise.


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## Highbeam (Nov 24, 2011)

Something else to keep in mind comparing WS to hearthstones is that the heat source for a WS is the cat element which lives right beneath the stove top. This can make the stove top get hot way before the rest of the stove is up to temp. This may be why WS owners claim to get shorter warm up times than us Hearthstone users that rely on teh actual fire to heat the stove.

None of us should be running our stoves at or near the max temp regularly. If you do, then you need a bigger stove. Running anything at redline will reduce the life and increase odds of an early stove death. So if you need more than 500 degrees on a stone stove then you need to consider your situation before you end up busting something.


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## BrowningBAR (Nov 24, 2011)

Highbeam said:
			
		

> None of us should be running our stoves at or near the max temp regularly. If you do, then you need a bigger stove. Running anything at redline will reduce the life and increase odds of an early stove death. So if you need more than 500 degrees on a stone stove then you need to consider your situation before you end up busting something.



I kind of disagree with that. I could understand if you were running the stove wide open with this roaring fire. But, with the pipe damper and air controls closed I consistently get the stove over 500 degrees with a pretty calm firebox.


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## BrowningBAR (Nov 24, 2011)

If I end up moving the Heritage to the Vigilant's location I think I'll put in a pipe probe to see what the temps are when the stove is running at a high temp. My double wall pipe usually does not get higher than 250Â° and will be as low as 150Â° when the stove is running at a high temp.


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## mtbon (Nov 29, 2011)

BrowningBAR said:
			
		

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The airwash plate I am speaking about is the metal plate at the top front of the firebox near the front burn tube.  I only noticed mine has a slight bow after seeing this thread: https://www.hearth.com/econtent/index.php/forums/viewthread/27969/.  Todd even commented that the guy overfired the stove.  Mine air wash plate is not as bad as what is in the thread.  My chimney guy said the plate is just too thin and was not surprised I have the bow.  I went to the dealer showroom and noticed the Heritage has a much thicker air wash plate.  I almost think Hearthstone knows about this problem but is unwilling to fix anything b/c it requires a complete stove rebuild.

I do not use the ash pan, ever.  

I inspected the bottom of the firebox and the ash grate sits flush and all gaskets seal tight. 

I would just like to know if I am doing something wrong here.  If I overfired, then was it a one time event or does this stove have troulbe handling the 500Â° cruising temps?
Hearthstone considers the slight bowing of the plate to be normal.  I don't think it's normal.  I may just start a new thread and call upon the Homestead owners.
Thanks.


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## shawneyboy (Nov 29, 2011)

Highbeam said:
			
		

> *So if you need more than 500 degrees on a stone stove then you need to consider your situation *



Hell I can hit 500 with kindling and some chunks.  I regularly cruise in the 575-600 range.  I ain't skeered of busting, blowing up, black holes, nuttin


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## Dakotas Dad (Nov 30, 2011)

While we cruise around 450 most of the time, we kick up around 600 all the time. I wouldn't want the stove to cruise at +550 though.. not because I think for a moment it would hurt it, but because I like to be able to sit in the living room with clothes on.

On getting up to temp.. start of the season I wanted to do the whole, slow/low fire to dry out the stone.. thought "gee, I will just throw a whole SC in there and burn it up.." lol, hit 275...


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## mtbon (Nov 30, 2011)

Dakotas Dad said:
			
		

> While we cruise around 450 most of the time, we kick up around 600 all the time. I wouldn't want the stove to cruise at +550 though.. not because I think for a moment it would hurt it, but because I like to be able to sit in the living room with clothes on.
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> On getting up to temp.. start of the season I wanted to do the whole, slow/low fire to dry out the stone.. thought "gee, I will just throw a whole SC in there and burn it up.." lol, hit 275...



Thanks Dakotas Dad, I have read many of your posts while researching this.  
What does your airwash plate look like?  When you put a straight edge on it, any bowing?  I need to know if this is typical like Hearthstone says.


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## BrowningBAR (Nov 30, 2011)

mtbon said:
			
		

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Mine is straight. No warping. My Heritage is 5-7 years old.


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## Dakotas Dad (Nov 30, 2011)

mtbon said:
			
		

> Thanks Dakotas Dad, I have read many of your posts while researching this.
> What does your airwash plate look like?  When you put a straight edge on it, any bowing?  I need to know if this is typical like Hearthstone says.



Mine appears perfectly straight. If you want to know the truth, my honest guess is that if you see or have one that is "deformed", my best guess is that at some time in the past it got banged or bumped while loading.. I also doubt any slight bend will effect it's performance.. but those are just guesses. 

Kind of like my baffle, I don't *remember* hitting it while reloading.. but all the dings in it beg to say otherwise..

My stove was made in late '08, and my airwash plate *looks* to be close to .125 thick. I will measure it with calipers if needed, the stove will probably be cool this afternoon. (my cheesy reloading calipers are some kind of plastic/glass material.. could melt..)

BTW, I have the mindeset of taking a very leary eye, or ear as it were, to claims of "he overfired it" or any other stove "knowledge" disspensed over the internet based on one photo, or one "my brother's stove got really hot" comment. Looking at the photo in your linked thread, that plate looks to be cast iron, mine is deffinatly not. I don't think you can get cast iron to sag like that, only "stay up" in the middle.. It may be a design change or something.. 

Can you post a picture of yours, maybe even start a new thread as we are dragging this one a far way off it's intended purpose..?


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## Dakotas Dad (Nov 30, 2011)

OK, just measured with a caliper, .135", so just a hair over 1/8th inch. 10 gauge if I remember right.


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## ryanm527 (Dec 1, 2011)

Last year I was happy if I could get my mansfield to break 400.  So far this season it's been a breeze to hit 600 on almost every load and it cruised for about a half hour around 725 a few days ago.  

I'm attributing it half to being more familiar with the operation of the stove and half to the fact that the wood I'm burning sat out all summer in the hottest and driest summer we've had here in decades.  I'm burning mostly honey locust with some occasional green ash, river birch, sycamore, red oak, and osage orange.


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## firecracker_77 (Sep 2, 2012)

Great post.  I'm going to mimick this damper arrangement and see if I can do the same.  One stove will do double duty for cooking.  I think if I let it cool some and rake the coals, the Heritage will make a great oven.


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## BrowningBAR (Sep 2, 2012)

Just be sure to check you liner for build up and check to make sure you do not have smoke coming from your chimney/pipe. If you have a weaker draft, or if you wood supply isn't good, or some other variable, you will end up with a smokey mess.


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## firecracker_77 (Sep 2, 2012)

BrowningBAR said:


> Just be sure to check you liner for build up and check to make sure you do not have smoke coming from your chimney/pipe. If you have a weaker draft, or if you wood supply isn't good, or some other variable, you will end up with a smokey mess.


 
Because of the damper cooling the pipe and leading to creosote?


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## BrowningBAR (Sep 2, 2012)

firecracker_77 said:


> Because of the damper cooling the pipe and leading to creosote?


 
There are a lot of reasons why the damper could create a problem. But, yes, this could be one of them. If I was maintaining 450+ degree stove top temps the chimney was smokeless and everything was right in the world. If I happened to hit a less dry patch in my wood supply and the stove wasn't taking off, I would leave the damper open more often.

My opinion is that the damper *isn't* used to limit your stove top temps. It is to limit the amount of heat going up the pipe since the Heritage tend to do this more often. Buy limiting the amount of heat escaping the firebox it is easier to achieve warmer stove top temps.


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## firecracker_77 (Sep 2, 2012)

BrowningBAR said:


> There are a lot of reasons why the damper could create a problem. But, yes, this could be one of them. If I was maintaining 450+ degree stove top temps the chimney was smokeless and everything was right in the world. If I happened to hit a less dry patch in my wood supply and the stove wasn't taking off, I would leave the damper open more often.
> 
> My opinion is that the damper *isn't* used to limit your stove top temps. It is to limit the amount of heat going up the pipe since the Heritage tend to do this more often. Buy limiting the amount of heat escaping the firebox it is easier to achieve warmer stove top temps.


 
That makes sense.  I wouldn't start to close the damper until I started getting secondaries or until I had a really hot coal bed.  I know what you mean.  Leave it more open till you have some heat and a good clean burn.


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## Highbeam (Sep 4, 2012)

I have been disappointed with how much heat is sent up the stack of my heritage. Once I started mon itoring theis with an actual flue temp probe meter, I realized that the flue temp is much easier to push into unsafe areas than the stove top temp. We seldom even look at the stove top temp now.


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## BrowningBAR (Sep 4, 2012)

Highbeam said:


> I have been disappointed with how much heat is sent up the stack of my heritage. Once I started mon itoring theis with an actual flue temp probe meter, I realized that the flue temp is much easier to push into unsafe areas than the stove top temp. We seldom even look at the stove top temp now.


I forget, are you using a damper? If not, you might want to give it a try and see what the results are.


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## Highbeam (Sep 4, 2012)

BrowningBAR said:


> I forget, are you using a damper? If not, you might want to give it a try and see what the results are.



Funny. No damper but I tried to install one in my double wall simpson pipe and it turns out that the appliance adapter with a damper in it does not fit the collar. I would have to hack my double wall pipe and try to rig something that is not approved by Simpson.

With a damper, I believe that I could get better control.

I saved the damper section and will instlal it with my next stove if it is possible.


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## firecracker_77 (Sep 4, 2012)

I'm using double wall.  Is a damper an option with this set-up?  I sure hope so.


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## BrowningBAR (Sep 4, 2012)

Highbeam said:


> Funny. No damper but I tried to install one in my double wall simpson pipe and it turns out that the appliance adapter with a damper in it does not fit the collar. I would have to hack my double wall pipe and try to rig something that is not approved by Simpson.
> 
> With a damper, I believe that I could get better control.
> 
> I saved the damper section and will instlal it with my next stove if it is possible.


 
Odd. I am using double wall pipe from Simpson as well and it fit. I wonder what the difference was in the outcome for the both of us?


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## BrowningBAR (Sep 4, 2012)

firecracker_77 said:


> I'm using double wall. Is a damper an option with this set-up? I sure hope so.


It should, as that is what I use as well. I am interested in Highbeams response to see what the difference is.


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## Highbeam (Sep 4, 2012)

Oh no, that won't fit in the hearthstone cast iron collar. The crimped end is too small which allows for big time slop at the joint. The proper way to use double wall is to shove the bottom of the taper section right into the collar with no appliance adapter. I made a whole thread about this awhile back and the dealers verified that the appliance adapter in that photo is a no-go with a the hearthstone cast collar.  

I really wanted it to work.


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## Highbeam (Sep 4, 2012)

https://www.hearth.com/talk/threads...questions-updated-with-conclusion-pics.37346/

This thread.


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## BrowningBAR (Sep 4, 2012)

Highbeam said:


> Oh no, that won't fit in the hearthstone cast iron collar. The crimped end is too small which allows for big time slop at the joint. The proper way to use double wall is to shove the bottom of the taper section right into the collar with no appliance adapter. I made a whole thread about this awhile back and the dealers verified that the appliance adapter in that photo is a no-go with a the hearthstone cast collar.
> 
> I really wanted it to work.


Kind of weird. It fit right into the collar for my Heritage that firecracker now owns.


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## BrowningBAR (Sep 4, 2012)

Highbeam said:


> https://www.hearth.com/talk/threads...questions-updated-with-conclusion-pics.37346/
> 
> This thread.


 
That is so strange. You can even see the pipe in use here:


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## Highbeam (Sep 4, 2012)

Oh it went in, it just is a very sloppy fit. The collar on the stove is too big to make a nice tight seal. The cast iron stove collar is the perfect diameter and taper to mate with the regular snout end of the double wall pipe as MSG pointed out in the thread. 

Looks like you even screwed the adapter to the collar. This would have crushed the outer wall I'd think.

My advice to firecracker is to just set that appliance adapter into the collar of the stove all by itself so that you can visually confirm that it fits tight into the collar's taper without bottoming out on anything. You need this seal to be tight. It has to pass the walrus test, you know, every walrus likes a nice tight seal.


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## BrowningBAR (Sep 4, 2012)

Highbeam said:


> Oh it went in, it just is a very sloppy fit. The collar on the stove is too big to make a nice tight seal. The cast iron stove collar is the perfect diameter and taper to mate with the regular snout end of the double wall pipe as MSG pointed out in the thread.
> 
> Looks like you even screwed the adapter to the collar. This would have crushed the outer wall I'd think.
> 
> My advice to firecracker is to just set that appliance adapter into the collar of the stove all by itself so that you can visually confirm that it fits tight into the collar's taper without bottoming out on anything. You need this seal to be tight. It has to pass the walrus test, you know, every walrus likes a nice tight seal.


 
I did have a snug fit. It passed the cursing test; that's when I swear at it while trying to remove it. It was screwed in to the collar and nothing was dented or warped. A little weird that you and I had drastically different outcomes to the same product.


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## heatwise (Sep 4, 2012)

i dont recall getting our phoenix much past the 425 zone. i guess several splts and cut back air in stages seems to be the trick, thanks for posting ,i will have to give  it a try on one of those freezing winter days when the wind is howling.


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## firecracker_77 (Sep 4, 2012)

BrowningBAR said:


> I did have a snug fit. It passed the cursing test; that's when I swear at it while trying to remove it. It was screwed in to the collar and nothing was dented or warped. A little weird that you and I had drastically different outcomes to the same product.


 
You and Highbeam are the resident experts.  I will be checking in with you guys as I put the damper in.


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## BrowningBAR (Sep 4, 2012)

firecracker_77 said:


> You and Highbeam are the resident experts. I will be checking in with you guys as I put the damper in.


Hopefully it works out for you. But, you can not ignore Highbeam's experiences with the fitting. For me, it worked and fit well. For the life of me, I do not know what the difference was.


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## SteveKelso (Apr 6, 2014)

Hi guys I am new to the forum so forgive me if this problem was answered, I had searched on here but I cat seem to get a definitive answer to my problem  I really need some help with my new rebuilt *Heritage 8021 soapstone stove.*I will try to explain my setup and problem as clearly a possible.
I included a picture of the stove and setup.
The short description is this stove will not get, and stay hot at all...

Ok here is my setup I have about 16' of double walled pipe on the outside of the house.
Inside the house the stove pipe is about 4'  single wall standard black pipe with an elbow.
I have *No stove pipe damper* on the inside here is what happens.
Using even very dry seasoned wood can I get the box hotter then 200deg barley stays at 170?
The side medal door will be 300 - 400 but the top and stone barely 180
The strange thing is I can raise the Temp of the box only if I open the ash draw
( as I was told Never to leave open ) can I get the stove pipe and the stove to 450 -500 deg and it feels like its actually heating and I then see the Re burner pipes inside working  but as soon as I close the ash draw within a half hour, the box is 180 the stove pipe temp will be 325 deg ??
Now when I open that ash draw it is sucking a TON of air and the fire then gets huge so I know its drafting well.

  There is a Good flame burning inside but barley any heat coming off the stone ?
I am also BLOWING through 30 - 20 " pieces of Seasoned Oak in a day I am not exaggerating!
I have tried small wood, big wood, Same outcome, I have to keep feeding this every 45 Min or it will just burn out...

Now here is where I am confused I was told when I spent $2,100 for this completely rebuilt stove and it was beautiful looking and rebuilt very well with all new stone glass, and seals.
But he assured me that Soapstone Stoves were far better then metal ones because of the heat retention and radiation.
   I have a cheap Century _*FW300007*_ Wood _*stove*_ out in my studio with extremely high ceiling's and I can barely stay in that huge room when that stove is on low  even when its 20deg out?
  Maybe this can be a clue for an answer as to what's going on..
The Soapstone stove stone temp with a fairly large fire the Top and Stone will be 175 deg  but the pipe will be 325 deg.
The Metal stove will be completely opposite, the stove on a VERY low burn will be 375 deg  and the pipe ( Also with no Damper ) will only be 180- 200 deg..

I was going to sell this Brand new rebuilt stove on Craig's List for $500 dollars just to get rid of it to buy a cheap metal stove like the Century just to get a working stove that puts off heat  but I will see if its something I am doing wrong here first before I take the huge loss!

Is this  model stove just a piece of crap or am I doing something totally wrong ?
I can fill the Metal stove before bed and 8 hours later there will still be wood burning when I wake.
   With this Soapstone stove I have to Literally put wood in it every hour  or within 2 hours it will be out. Sure the stone stays warm for a few hours but a worthless amount of heat..
Please If anyone has any suggestions I would totally appreciate it, I Just cant believe this stove is THAT BAD !
What should the box standard operating temp be so I am not BLOWING through 30 pieces of wood a day ?
This has me completely miffed????
I'm using a Laser thermometer so I am confident the temps I am telling you are accurate.

Does this stove require a Damper  ?
  I really don't want to waste another $200 dollars on a damper and new Pipe if it is just a Bad Stove to begin with ..
If it is a Damper issue, does it go right above the collar of the stove or in the middle of the pipe?

Like I said any help or suggestions will be totally appreciated as I just am compleatly unsure as to what's going on here..
Thanks guys in advance 

Steve K.


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## webby3650 (Apr 6, 2014)

You have a lot of questions there. This is a very old thread, it would be best to start a new one so it gets due attention.
If you decide to offload it, I'll give you $500 for it.


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## begreen (Apr 6, 2014)

Agreed Steve, copy and paste your post into a new thread so that it gets a better response. And welcome to Hearth.com.


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## DanCorcoran (Apr 6, 2014)

begreen said:


> Agreed Steve, copy and paste your post into a new thread so that it gets a better response. And welcome to Hearth.com.



And put the name of your stove in the title, so that folks who know that stove can help...


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## BrowningBAR (Apr 7, 2014)

Steve, I responded to your PM in regards to this. You can respond here or through the PM.


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