# Mounting LCD TV above mantel with wood insert



## cykins (Aug 5, 2008)

I'm installing a new wood insert (VC Montpelier) in my masonry fireplace. I would like to also mount our new 52" LCD TV above the mantle. I've spoken to the TV manufactuer and they say the operating temp is 104 F (40 C). I Does anyone have any idea of how hot it gets around the wall/ceiling  with the insert running for a while? The insert comes with a blower, so I don't know if that makes a difference or not.

Tks


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## The Dali Lima (Aug 5, 2008)

Great question!  I am wondering the same, as I'd like to mount a TV above my wood stove (it will have a "fake" mantle above it) - I'm thinking that it gets too hot based on my research, but would love to hear what others think.  steve


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## Jay777 (Aug 5, 2008)

I have no experience, but..

This sounds like a really bad idea.


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## webbie (Aug 5, 2008)

I researched this also - and the main thing is that the viewing angle of a TV is suggested to be lower than that - it may cram your neck or be uncomfortable!

I was going to use one of those brackets which would have at least allowed be to put a 15 degree downward slope on it.

I think, as far as heat, you could be OK.....worse comes to worse, you can install a small heat shield somewhere. Earlier plasmas were not OK with any heat, but things are different with LCD.


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## begreen (Aug 5, 2008)

The first thing to check is the insert's combustible clearance requirements to the mantel if it is made of wood. If the mantel is made of stone and projects further out from that wall than the front of the TV screen it then no worry mate. The mantel will act as the heat shield. If nothing is blocking the heat, then it could be a problem. 

The set doesn't want to get too hot. If the surface feels warm you are already at about 105 degrees. In some installations, over time the stove heats up the chimney mass over 105 degrees. This heat gets transmitted to the wall. In this case a bracket that holds the set a little bit off the wall is a good idea.


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## Jay777 (Aug 5, 2008)

Even if it'll operate, I just doubt it's a good idea for long-term placement.  Electronics just don't like heat.  Neither does plastic.

I'm worried enough about screwing up and having a runaway fire at some point.. I wouldn't want to add "melting my $1300 TV" to the list of consequences...

If you do it, please post during the winter and let us know   Really it does just depend on the distance involved, and whether the mantle is going to be helpful.

As BeGreen noted, anything that feels warm is more than 98.6 degrees already...


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## bluefrier (Aug 5, 2008)

I am in the satellite tv industry and would not recommend a LCD tv above a fireplace or woodburning appliance if the operating temp is 104*.


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## cykins (Aug 5, 2008)

BeGreen said:
			
		

> The first thing to check is the insert's combustible clearance requirements to the mantel if it is made of wood. If the mantel is made of stone and projects further out from that wall than the front of the TV screen it then no worry mate. The mantel will act as the heat shield. If nothing is blocking the heat, then it could be a problem.
> 
> The set doesn't want to get too hot. If the surface feels warm you are already at about 105 degrees. In some installations the stove heats up the chimney mass over 105 degrees. This heat gets transmitted to the wall. In this case a bracket that holds the set a little bit off the wall is a good idea.





All the required clearances for the insert have been met for the oak mantel. The matel ia approx 10" in depth, while the TV, even with the tilting mouting bracket will only protrude approx 6" at thye top of the TV from the wall. So it looks like it will be away from any direct heat from the insert.


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## begreen (Aug 5, 2008)

You might inquire about having a damper seal (block-off plate) installed to further reduce heating up the chimney mass.


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## Jay777 (Aug 5, 2008)

Maybe this is too obvious, but light a fire and then stick a thermometer there.


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## cykins (Aug 5, 2008)

That definitely would be the best approach.........however, the insert has not yet been installed (two weeks away) and I just purchased the TV and want to install it now...I also want to hide all the cables, so I don't want to do this work and only find out that it's too hot with the insert going flat out.


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## Wet1 (Aug 5, 2008)

The TV will be fine there... for a while.  Without a doubt, the life expectancy of the TV will be reduced if it sees sustained exposure to 100*+ heat.


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## burntime (Aug 5, 2008)

I am adding insulation on my stainless liner and a block off plate, when it is done the samsung 52" lcd will be right above the firelace at a slight angle.  My brother has a high end pioneer elite plasma above his and no issues in 4 years.


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## Dix (Aug 5, 2008)

In my off time from the internet, I manage an electronic service center . Contracts, warranties, installs, etc.

We won't do an install over any FP, unless it is capped off and not in use. 

LCD's & plasmas get very hot on their own, additional heat could cause part/pcb failure inside the set. Soot & heat will also distort the glass display, and cause problems between the layers of glass that are the screen assembly. Plus the PCB's that are attached to the display from the rear of the TV, as well as the fans and motors. These conditions could void a warranty/service contract.

Better to stick with the Norman Rockwell over the FP, and find another spot for the set.


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## burntime (Aug 5, 2008)

I have a 12 inch mantle and plenty of space, most of the warantees I have dealt with in the big box store items were not worth it with the ecception of circuit citys old warrantee.  Put a thermometer up there, if its not too bad then put it.  I think an lcd is better to put over a insert then a plasma though, less heat generated by the tv.  I guess if you turn the blues down a little that the lcds run much cooler too.


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## cykins (Aug 5, 2008)

burntime said:
			
		

> I am adding insulation on my stainless liner and a block off plate, when it is done the samsung 52" lcd will be right above the firelace at a slight angle.  My brother has a high end pioneer elite plasma above his and no issues in 4 years.




Do you (or your brother) have a standard fireplace or wood insert? I would think the amount of heat will be quite different for both.


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## burntime (Aug 5, 2008)

Mine is an insert, his is a built in stove (lenox bis)   Both have blowers to get the heat out.


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## fossil (Aug 5, 2008)

I wouldn't put my TV above my woodstove, because I can only really enjoy watching one thing at a time.  I'm finding that my threshold for sensory overload is decreasing in an inverse relationship to my age.  I like watching my stove burn.  I occasionally enjoy watching TV (although not nearly as much or as often as watching my stove burn).  I'll put my TV someplace else.  Rick


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## cykins (Aug 5, 2008)

Is your insert flush with the f/p, or does it protrude out somewhat. The unit I went with projects out 3 " from the face of the fireplace to meet clearance restrictions.


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## burntime (Aug 5, 2008)

fossil said:
			
		

> I wouldn't put my TV above my woodstove, because I can only really enjoy watching one thing at a time.  I'm finding that my threshold for sensory overload is decreasing in an inverse relationship to my age.  I like watching my stove burn.  I occasionally enjoy watching TV (although not nearly as much or as often as watching my stove burn).  I'll put my TV someplace else.  Rick



Good one Rick!  After being married for a few years I have learned a thing or two about phasing out one disruption for another! :bug: 

As far as the depth of my insert...its a hampton so it sticks out like 6-8 inches max.


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## savageactor7 (Aug 6, 2008)

I think what jay thinks...


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## JimmyMood (Aug 6, 2008)

It could be fine, but I think it depends on the specifics of your setup.  For this setup, the mantle protrudes further than the TV and the Jotul Winterport is flush with the fireplace, so the TV is blocked from the direct radiant heat.  I do also have a very low profile TV mount that is only 1.5" from the wall.  I put a thermometer on top of the mantle it in reached into the mid 80's with the air control wide open.  I believe my plasma is rated to run up to 95*F ambient.

Oh, and a tip I read on the internet (so it must be true.)  The TV should be less than 15* above your eye level or it can be uncomfortable to watch.  For reference, your looking at 12* above the camera.


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## burntime (Aug 6, 2008)

I am going to put a 52 inch lcd over mine, here is my setup.  Excuse the mess, cartoons on of course.  I think this just screams for a big tv over the mantle!  For the record I built the mantle from scratch and covered the brick with the ledgestone.


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## struggle (Aug 6, 2008)

We just bought a 52 LCD Sony and there is no way I would set it up above a fire place or stove insert. It is just way to hot. 

Also my neighbor did install a set above his fireplace and they absolutely hate it. They now watch TV in their basement as it is much easier on the neck. The height might not seem bad at first but it will get to you after a two hour movie.  

I installed mine on the wall just above where our old set was on a stand and it works great for viewing height. Maybe tomorrow I will post a picture of it.


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## cykins (Aug 6, 2008)

JimmyMood said:
			
		

> It could be fine, but I think it depends on the specifics of your setup.  For this setup, the mantle protrudes further than the TV and the Jotul Winterport is flush with the fireplace, so the TV is blocked from the direct radiant heat.  I do also have a very low profile TV mount that is only 1.5" from the wall.  I put a thermometer on top of the mantle it in reached into the mid 80's with the air control wide open.  I believe my plasma is rated to run up to 95*F ambient.
> 
> Oh, and a tip I read on the internet (so it must be true.)  The TV should be less than 15* above your eye level or it can be uncomfortable to watch.  For reference, your looking at 12* above the camera.




Tks for the input. This setup looks very similar to mine. My mantle does protrude further than the TV (and I do have a low-profile tilt monitor to install the TV.), so it too will also be blocked from the direct radiant heat of the insert. Interesting tip on the 15* viewing level. How far from the fllor is the top of your mantle?


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## burntime (Aug 6, 2008)

If it gets that hot there is something wrong.  I just bought the liner insulation to put on mine and a block off plate will be installed instead of the rock wool.  Mine gets to 90 degrees tops the way it sits and will be less with the liner insulated.


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## Jay777 (Aug 6, 2008)

Regardless of the heat, that just looks waaaay too high.


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## burntime (Aug 6, 2008)

Then you need a better recliner! ;-P  It depends on how close you are as well.  My chair and sofa are 18 feet away from the tv.  I think it would be a hard sell at say 10-12 feet but 18 gives you some distance so the angle is not as harsh.


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## struggle (Aug 6, 2008)

If you have people that will watch the TV sitting on the floor you will find many are not going to like this set up. Like another said hope you have a recliner since it will be hard on the neck to watch. 

After we spent $2,800 on ours there is no way I wanted to compromise comfort for watching it. We also have a home theater setup as well, so if you are considering that later down the road you might want to consider space for a center channel speaker under the TV as well.


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## daleeper (Aug 6, 2008)

There is no way I would put an LCD or plasma tv over a functioning fireplace, stove, heating equipment.  One of the most common failures of these sets is the power supply and heat is it's enemy.  They generate enough heat on there own to kill themselves.  They don't need any help.


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## Dix (Aug 7, 2008)

> They generate enough heat on there own to kill themselves.  They don’t need any help.



Amen.

My post, page 1.



> In my off time from the internet, I manage an electronic service center . Contracts, warranties, installs, etc.
> 
> We won’t do an install over any FP, unless it is capped off and not in use.
> 
> ...


https://www.hearth.com/econtent/index.php/forums/viewthread/21002/


In 3 -5 years, when your picture quality is craptastic, due to PCB and/or a compromised screen assembly(multiple glass levels), due to soot, ash. etc, and you call for service, and are told that a new replacement panel is going to be $1500-$4000 +, *IF* it's still available (I have brand new LCD's & PDP's that I can't get parts/support/service info on, let alone the other stuff), what are you going to do?

I've been in this business for 25 years. I know my stuff.


My 2 cents.


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## PeteD (Aug 7, 2008)

You may want to put cable and power there now for a couple of reasons, even if you decide not to put a flat screen there for any of the possible negatives listed here.

1.  Resale value.  Someone may want to put a flat screen there if you sell the house and pre-wiring will be a plus to those people.  They may have no desire to use the stove, or be oblivious to the negatives.

2. Alternative flat screens that are impervious to the effects of heat will likely be available at some point in the not-so distant future.

The best bet would be to run a conduit to the location (from a closet, basement, or other accessible area) where whatever wires are needed for the device can be pulled at that time.  These things change all the time...coax, RCA, component, DVI, HDMI, etc.

I am in the same situation and am convincing myself as I write this post that I probably I need to do something while my wall is completely open in the back.  I recommend a conduit and power.  Worst-case you never use it, but you won't regret it later.

Pete


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## JimmyMood (Aug 7, 2008)

cykins, about your questions:

The top of the mantel is around 4"6'.  I'm about 6', and I am eye level with the bottom 1/3 of the screen standing up.  As far as comfort, my non-reclining couch is about 15' feet from the TV and I do not find watching it uncomfortable.  

The best advice I found looking around on the web was to make a cardboard cutout of the TV screen and tape that on the wall.  Look at it for awhile and see if the position and screen size is comfortable.   Maybe you can draw a nice picture on the cardboard to make looking at it more interesting.  I couldn't find the 15* reference again, but I did find this tidbit from Crutchfield:  (scroll to the Height paragraph)

http://www.crutchfield.com/learn/learningcenter/home/flatpanel_install.html?page=2


Despite the location, I am operating the TV well within the ambient temperature requirements in the manual.  This may not be the case with your installation, and you will have to take your own measurements. For your situation, I would sit the TV on its pedestal on the hearth until the insert is installed.  After the insert is installed, fire it up and test the temperature above the mantle.


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## burntime (Aug 7, 2008)

Doing The Dixie Eyed Hustle said:
			
		

> > They generate enough heat on there own to kill themselves.  They don’t need any help.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



I am not doubting you its just I don't care.  Thats where I want my tv.  I will spend 2gs and the reality is they will last 10 years and its time for a new one anyway.  They keep getting cheaper so the next one will probably be the same or less in 10 years, I can live with that.  The area does not get warm and it is well within specs so it should make it 8-10 years without a problem.


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## DiscoInferno (Aug 7, 2008)

I know my mantle (above the BIS Ultima) collects an impressive amount of ash.  I think it's from ash that falls out when the door is opened, which then gets sucked in and blown out by the blower and/or rides a convection plume up and over.  Be prepared to dust a lot.

I thought about mounting my new LCD up there, but besides the ash I could tell the angle would be too much as the seating is too close.  We put it on a pretty short stand off to the side of the fireplace instead.  So now when a commercial comes on, I can turn and watch the fire.


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## burntime (Aug 7, 2008)

I know what you are saying.  My wife is a dust nut so when I remove ash it is a slow and steady job.  Still have ash, just getting a lot better at it.


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## cykins (Aug 7, 2008)

There seems to be a fair amount of opposition to mounting a TV over a fireplace (especially one e/w an isert). The two concerns are viewing angle and operating temp when the insert is fired up. Given that I started this post, I think it's only right I let everyone know what I plan to do. Given that I have not yet had my insert installed, I plan to wait until I have that done. Not much sense to go through the trouble of mounting the TV, hiding those cables (which  may be a bit of a tear up) and spending big bucks for those longer cables only to find out it's way too hot when the insert is going. I don't have a problem with the viewing angle issue as we have a family portrait (which is virtually the same dimensions of the 52" LCD TV that we purchased) mounted in the exact place where the TV will " maybe " go. We are comfortable with that viewing position from anywhere in the family room.Once I have the insert up and running, I'll measure the temp and let everyone know...............I'll try and do that on a few " cool " days. Could be a little hot in the house when I do that. Although living here in Atlantic Canada, we never really see the " dog days " of August 

Tks for all the posts on this subject.


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## allhandsworking (Sep 20, 2009)

I have the set up you are talking about! Love the Montpelier and have a samsung 47" I sit about 12' away and have no problem what so ever with the angle. The mantel hangs out about 12" from the insert so little radiant heat hitting the tv. I have never had temp above 95 at the tv level due to the fan pushing the heat out! Insert heats 1800 SF Tudor with good insulation and 100 year old windows and storms,central chimney. living room is average 75 upstairs 68. The fan does a nice job of circulating the heat! I would install insert first like people are recommending though because every set up has variables.  Good luck


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## burntime (Sep 20, 2009)

The 52 inch flat screen 1.9 inch samsung has been hanging over the fireplace now for about 2 months.  Angle is great, very happy with it there!


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## FPX Dude (Sep 20, 2009)

I have FPX and it's blower is above the stove, then mantel extends 8" above it.  I'm planning on doing the same thing so was watching the temps above the mantel last season and it was essentially room temp.  I think the blower and mantel help direct the heat into the room and not as much UP as without...and yea, I'm gonna put it there because that's where I want it.   Also, tv's are kinda like toasters anymore, you don't fix'em, you just throw 'em out and go get another one.


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## myzamboni (Sep 20, 2009)

burntime said:
			
		

> I am going to put a 52 inch lcd over mine, here is my setup.  Excuse the mess, cartoons on of course.  I think this just screams for a big tv over the mantle!  For the record I built the mantle from scratch and covered the brick with the ledgestone.



I think you should wall mount the LCD where you currently have the TV.  I personally do not like the looks of electronics mounted on brick/stonework.  In addition, I would not like to look at a non-operating stove in the summer.


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## JimmyMood (Sep 23, 2009)

> I think you should wall mount the LCD where you currently have the TV.  I personally do not like the looks of electronics mounted on brick/stonework.  In addition, I would not like to look at a non-operating stove in the summer.



Trouble is that my 42" plasma won't fit in the location of my old 27" tube tv.


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## mellow (Sep 28, 2009)

I keep forgetting to post to this topic, I have had my 37" lcd over my fireplace for over 3 years with no issues, of course it feels cool-cold to the touch past the brick.

This is an older picture with my Sierra insert in, taken this past summer.


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