# Exhaust fan on Napoleon NPI-40 making a noise.



## kh395269 (Dec 6, 2008)

Hi, I bought a Napoleon insert last April and installed it this past September. We have only been using it since it got cold this year. I'm using Pennington pellets which unfortunately we really detest already, since the are loaded with dust like you wouldn't believe. the only good part is I only paid $224 for them back in the summer.  We clean the stove out everday. However, our exhaust fan has developed a noise. I hope it is not on it's way out yet. Has anyone else experienced anything similar? I have e-mailed Napoleon yesterday, but so far no response. I'm not sure who to go for service since I purchased this on the internet from Zoobler. I would think it should be covered by warranty. Any suggestions? Hopefully, it is just a simple tweak or fix. Thanks, Kim


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## Revig (Dec 6, 2008)

Sounds like a possible faulty combustion blower motor- not difficult to replace but is covered under the two year electrical warranty to the original purchaser. I've had a couple with the same bearing/bushing noise.


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## save$ (Dec 7, 2008)

I have the same stove. Also, I think the same noise. Fortunately for me, the noise is intermittent. 
I contacted two dealer about this issue. One contacted a Napoleon rep who reportedly said that they had a very few stoves with that problem. He suggested I take of the left side panel and check for a pinhole leak somewhere between the blower and the exhaust pipe. The other dealer felt it might be related to some form of air obstruction. He suggested I check my clean out tee for ash. Now, I have no idea why the noise comes and goes, but I do know that if I turn off the stove and let it sit, that when I turn it back on, the noise is gone. So far it has been gone for a week and I must admit, I haven't done anything to correct it. I am thinking that when I get a little more motivated. (no longer able to hear the Tv) that I will first try the leaf blower thing. Sounds to me like the best way to clean everything out.
If you find a solution, please post a follow up.
thanks


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## Saltair (Dec 7, 2008)

I also have an NPI40 and the convection fan alternates between quiet, annoying, and cant hear the tv. A local dealer has ordered a new one under warranty. I have not been impressed with the quality of this stove, but it looks nice. I have spoken directly with Napoleon service and they would not help me. I was told that because of the type of appliance it is it required a certified service tech and was refered to local dealers.


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## Cavedweller (Dec 28, 2008)

I also have a Napoleon npi40 installed in October 2008, bought in summer. Have had extensive problems with noisy blowers sometimes intermittent, other times annoyingly constant. I am scheduled to have my 4th blower installed next week. noise is often times unbearable. Napoleon will give you no answers only to contact people you bought stove from who don't seem to have any better answers. Spent to much money to be this dissatisfied with the stove. not recommended..


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## kh395269 (Dec 28, 2008)

I still haven't ordered my new part. I just filled out the paperwork today and realized I need the darn serial # which we will have to pull out the stove for. The noise seemed to get better for a while, but now it has been undearable the last two days or so. It's to the point of driving me crazy, it's so incredibly annoying. That's awful that is could be replaced 4 times and still have a problem. At the time I bought this stove, I had a choice between this one and a small Breckwell for the same price. I'm thinking now I surely should have went with the Breckwell. Since I bought this off the internet, I have to go back to the original seller to get my warranty parts. I also contacted Napoleon and they are not very helpful with anything. It should be that any local dealer should be able to handle the warranty repair. It's obvious this company doesn't have a clue when it comes to customer service. And, if they know they have a problem with these blowers, by now they should be shipping out an improved model. I'm also very disappointed.  Is there any one out there that has been problem free with their exhaust blower?  - Kim


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## kelvin (Dec 29, 2008)

kh395269 said:
			
		

> Is there any one out there that has been problem free with their exhaust blower?  - Kim



I've been running my NPS40 for almost two months now without that exhaust blower noise problem, at least not yet.


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## j00fek (Dec 29, 2008)

next time i have to have a blower changed the stove is going back...


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## Cavedweller (Dec 29, 2008)

Just wanted to touch on the heat output as well. We have about a 1500 sq ft home. the stove is rated for 2000 sq ft and the heat surely does not drive you out of the room on cold days. again very disappointed with this stove and it appears NAPOLEON is not quick to respond to any of the problems.  however when I spoke to NAPOLEON one time the girl did say they were receiving several complaints about the blowers and having many problems with them....


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## jsvo (Dec 29, 2008)

are all of these stoves new models this year? i just started mine for the first time yesterday,so no noises yet.i talked to 3people that install these stoves and theyve all said good things about tech guys at napoleon.i dont think this stove can heat a 2000 sq feet house only max 43000 btu,s. have you put thermometor in heat tubes and checked this for output. turned mine upto five last nite and it was 220 degrees,and 170 on three.good luck to all i will be watching for fan noise.


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## woodlecj (Dec 30, 2008)

I have the insert and have run it about 2 months now.  I also hear the exhaust blower make "slow oscillating bearing whine".  It might last two minutes, then goes away.  Having been around different fans all my life, it is definitely bearing noise.  Sometimes due to dirt or otherwise poor quality control in the bearing races.  Could also be that as the stove heats up and gets the bearings up to a temperature and tolerance, then they behave themselves.  I haven't pulled mine to see who makes the blower (hopefully not made in China).  If I have issues, I'm going through Zoobler first.

As for heat, mine will smoke you out, but remember it's all about feed rate.  If you need 42,000 BTUs out of your stove, be prepared to feed it 5lbs/hour or 3 bags a day.  8000BTU/lb x 5lbs = 40,000BTUs,  Any stove would need that.

On setting 2-3, it's warm with a small flame; on 4-5 it's hot with a tall flame.  When it's 25-30 degrees out, I heat a 1700 sq. ft. two story on a little more then a bag a day.  76 in the stove room and 67-69 in other rooms.  I have a center hall stairway so the heat rises nicely.  I also run it 24 hours a day; this way you never let your house cool down.  Remember your house acts like a thermal battery;don't let it get too cold.

Craig


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## kh395269 (Dec 30, 2008)

Hi Craig, 

I agree with the heat output. We also rarely go over a bag a day and heat a 1650sq ft ranch with out many problems. The farthest bedrooms stay at about 68, where as the adjacent kitchen is usually 72. We use a small suspended fan in the living room door way pointing down the hall and a fan near the unit blowing it to the doorway to move the heat down the hall. The unit has been heating are house ok, but this is the first stove I have ever had, so I don't really have anyting to compare it to. The only thing I don't care for is that it does get really dirty pretty quickly, but I think that is the poor Pennington pellets we ended up with as well. We have been sifting the sawdust from them to help the process, but we still find we need to clean the pot and the window everyday to keep it running clean and efficient. As for the blower, my husband is an auto mechanic and he also says it's a bearing noise. It started out very intermittent, but it is now more frequent and constant. Also, for us it gets worse the more time it is running.  Maybe it's a coincidence, but it also seems worse on colder evenings. I love running the stove but we have actually stopped running it the past few evenings. The noise has been keeping me awake at night, and I can sleep through most anything.


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## Cavedweller (Dec 30, 2008)

Does anyone know the return policy on these things and I mean the whole stove. has anyone tried to return theirs? i mean this is getting ridiculous... any suggestions or opinions would be greatly appreciated.. i dont know if NAPOLEON is required to back stoves that appear to be lemons.


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## Cavedweller (Dec 30, 2008)

PLEASE IF THERE ARE MORE PEOPLE OUT THERE HAVING THE SAME PROBLEMS AND YOU READ THESE COMPLAINTS PLEASE LET US KNOW BY LEAVING YOUR COMMENTS,MAYBE SOMEONE CAN OFFER US A SOLUTION...


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## Revig (Dec 30, 2008)

As a very satisfied Napoleon dealer, I can tell you that Napoleon does and will take care of their problems. Not sure of how things work with the internet sellers, "Beware of the high cost of the low price" comes to mind. I've experienced firsthand these same troubles with units I've sold and installed, and as far as I can tell, I believe the manufacturer got ahold of some bad fans, because I've replaced such with another reputable manufacturers Fasco motor, and have had no problems since. Just replaced another convection fan last week, under warranty of course. Please keep in mind that Napoleon tech services always responds to the dealers needs asap, as they should and do, because the responsibility lies with the dealer first and foremost. Any reputable stove manufacturer instills responsible service from their dealers, then the manufacturer will stand behind and work out any issues through that dealer. Dealers should be accountable to the customer first, and if they are promoting, servicing and installing quality products, the manufacturers need to stand behind their dealer. IMO, of course. With this being the crazy time of year for us dealers, it is hard to take care of all troubles in a timely manner, but I guess sometimes that is not good enough, which is certainly understandable.


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## Saltair (Dec 30, 2008)

I had the combustion blower and the convection blower changed a week ago. The new convection blower was making noise within 24 hours of installation. I have also lost control of the fan speed. The troubleshooting guide leads you through a test of a temp sensor which I did, and the service tech repeated. The sensor is fine the control is bad. A new one is on order. I have been heating my 1600 squarefoot cape with this stove all winter. When it is really cold outside, single digits, or cool and windy I am lucky to see 65 degrees in the down stairs. I have never checked upstairs, i dont really want to know but its cold. I started with athens pellets, but have switched to other brands that burn better. I have tried numerous fan setups to move heat and cold air around and they mostly just add to the electric bill, which by the way doubled the first month the stove ran 24/7. Most of the heating ability and electric cost stuff wouldn't piss me off as much if the unit itself wasn't made with junk parts. There are only three moving parts in the whole setup and I have changed two of them and one is bad again. I would love to ship the whole works back to Napoleon for a warranty exchange, but dont even know if that is possible. The dealer that sold me the untit was useless and is now out of business which makes him no help at all. I am not likely to get him to return any phone calls since he still owes me parts to complete the installation. I ordered some of these parts elsewhere in october ad am still waiting. At least they are nothing that would keep me from using the stove. Thats my sob story. I could not in good faith recommend this stove or Napoleon to anybody.


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## j00fek (Dec 30, 2008)

i recently checked my fathers fan and his is a fasco, which made some noise but he did a full cleaning the other day and the fan is ok now. i think that i have a lennox, maybe not. ill check tonight.


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## kh395269 (Dec 30, 2008)

Saltair said:
			
		

> I have tried numerous fan setups to move heat and cold air around and they mostly just add to the electric bill, which by the way doubled the first month the stove ran 24/7.



Hi, I haven't noticed that much of a difference in the electic bill, but then again I have not been running the unit 24/7, most nights and some days. Has anyone else? Maybe it's your separate fans causing the extensive hike in your bill? This month will be tough to tell with the Christmas lights.


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## kh395269 (Dec 30, 2008)

Stove Doctor said:
			
		

> Not sure of how things work with the internet sellers, "Beware of the high cost of the low price" comes to mind.



I'm not sure why everyone is not treated the same when a stove breaks, regardless of where they purchased from. I've only used this a few months. The defect should be replaceable without any question. If your Audi car breaks, you can bring it back to any Audi dealer. You don't have to go back to OR state where you purchased it.

And to tell you the truth, I would have loved to buy locally if for one the price was at least reasonable  compared to the stove I purchased (which by the way, I purchased for $1450 new(door and surround included)) and the stove guys around here weren't royal jerks, not saying by any means that all stove guys are jerks. When I bought the stove, I was going to have it installed by someone local and no one around here was helfpful at all. in fact, everyone here in CT was down right mean  and nasty to me. They also gave me a hard time about selling me their pellets since I didn't purchase a stove from them. It turns out my husband installed the stove without a hitch and saved us hundred of dollars in the process. He will fix it as well. Thank God I have a handy husband or this stove would be pretty much a big pile of expensive, metal junk to me at the moment.


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## woodlecj (Dec 30, 2008)

Saltair,
Hard to imagine your electric bill doubled; must be all those fans!  I've put a Kill-o-watt meter on my stove and it only uses about 125W running which is 3KW/day and I pay $.10/kW, so $9/month to run for me.

It would be interesting to see what make, everyone's fans are.  Mine is all closed up, but maybe I'll take the shroud off and give it a look.  Seems like Fasco is the good one.


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## Cavedweller (Dec 30, 2008)

Dear Stove doctor,  I actually  did purchase my stove locally from a napoleon dealer, my question is this, is napoleon advising there dealers of these problems..  I feel like I am the only one with this problem because they say they have not had complaints from the other stoves they sold at least not about the fans which i find hard to believe since i am now on my fourth (4) fan since oct.   the dealer has been helpful as far as replacing them however its getting a little old specially when i see the amount of complaints on the internet. does napoleon take returns on these stoves? do they do recall notices on there defective products.. i did speak to one women at napoleon and she did acknowledge several complaints and problems with the fans. how long does it take for any action to finally get things done... again i say this is ridiculous.....


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## j00fek (Dec 30, 2008)

i just sent an inquiry to napoleon from their website, but i expect a very general answer when i get one.  either i get a concrete answer or the stove goes back


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## Larry88 (Dec 30, 2008)

I too have brought a Napoleon NPi40 stove over the summer.  I installed the stove 2nd week in Oct. 3 weeks later the noise started in the convection blower.Same thing,it would come and go. Called the factory got no response. Called the internet company that I bought it from.They are very helpful so far.The noise is so bad at times that I have had to shut the stove off.I am hopefully getting a new convection blower soon. Napoleon Company is closed until 1/5/09. Will keep you posted. As for the stove itself. I like it very much.I have a 2200 square ft house with an upstairs. Down stairs stays 70 with no problem. Heat comes on upstairs only when it is real cold outside. Upstairs stays about 65. I turn the ceiling fan on in the living room.I keep the pellet feed most of the time between 3and 4


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## kh395269 (Dec 31, 2008)

My husband just pulled the problem blower and it's a FASCO W062-0022. Zoobler told me the replacement part was W062-0027. I don't see the 0027 part # listed in the parts catalog. Perhaps it is a newer replacement part, knowing that the current blower is having a problem? Or, now I don't know if Zoobler made a mistake on giving me the replacement #. I will note both #'s on my request, noting the current FASCO 0022 as defective. 

Oh one more question, apparently we did not save the part of the box with the serial # to paste on our manual. We looked all over the stove for a number and the only place I see a number is the right handed poanel when you open it up, beginning with NPI. Is that the serial #? It isn't clear - nothing says serial.

PS I also called Wolf Steel and also got they are closed until January 5th.


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## Cavedweller (Dec 31, 2008)

My stove dealer wrote the serial number on the receipt so you may want to check there. also I would make double sure about the part number because my stove dealer has been replacing them with the same model maybe thats my problem 4 blowers later. i will also see if i can find my stove serial number...


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## kh395269 (Dec 31, 2008)

Thanks, I just checked the receipt again and trucking paperwork, but no serial #  How can you sell a stove without the serial # on it? It has to be there somewhere.The only thing that makes since is that is has to be that NPI # ( 5 digits I think - mostly 0's) on the right panel with the schematics. Does your serial begin with NPI? Obviousy the model does, but I'm hoping the serial does too. My husband will flip of he has to take this thing apart again before he gets the replacement part in.


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## Saltair (Dec 31, 2008)

WIth regard to my electric bill. May wife and I have no kids and work long hours. The truth of the matter is it didn't take much to double our bill, but it wass still a shock. It cost more to run this stove than the AC in the summer. wasn't expecting that i figured these for pretty low draw appliances, but will admit I didn't really check. I am most irraitated that I have to have the TV volume blasting to hear it over the grinding fan across the room that was replaced a week ago. Between the problems with Athens pellets the problems with this stove, and my dealer going out of business I am about worn out dealing with the whole mess. All that keeps me fighting it is the amount of money I have wrapped up in it.


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## Revig (Dec 31, 2008)

Cavedweller said:
			
		

> Dear Stove doctor,  I actually  did purchase my stove locally from a napoleon dealer, my question is this, is napoleon advising there dealers of these problems..  I feel like I am the only one with this problem because they say they have not had complaints from the other stoves they sold at least not about the fans which i find hard to believe since i am now on my fourth (4) fan since oct.   the dealer has been helpful as far as replacing them however its getting a little old specially when i see the amount of complaints on the internet. does napoleon take returns on these stoves? do they do recall notices on there defective products.. i did speak to one women at napoleon and she did acknowledge several complaints and problems with the fans. how long does it take for any action to finally get things done... again i say this is ridiculous.....



Hello Cavedweller, I do understand your line of thought and will respond by saying that I have not received any feedback from Napoleon regarding fan issues, but do believe there is a problem, what else could cause these troubles? As far as a return issue, my first course of action (as a dealer who sold such a product) would be to consult my area rep and advise of customers issues and then let that course of action follow through. Yes, it does take a little time and patience. Anytime a customer sees the dealer several times for the same problem certainly would warrant customer dissatisfaction. That is precisely why I took it upon myself to try the "other" Fasco motor to try and determine if the problem still exists or has it been remedied. To date, I have not heard another complaint on those units that I stepped in and repaired. That tells me that something is up with their lot of blowers.


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## Cavedweller (Dec 31, 2008)

thank you stove doctor for your quick response, can you explain what you mean when you speak of replacing the blower with another manufactures fasco blower motor. is fasco not the manufacturer, also do you have the make and model so i could perhaps pass it along to my stove dealer should he be inclined to listen to me or perhaps i could put you i contact with him... thanks again


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## kh395269 (Dec 31, 2008)

I agree. Stove Doctor-Is the 0027 the correct replacement part? I'd like to get this right the first time. Thanks.


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## j00fek (Dec 31, 2008)

i checked lastnight, i have a fasco. ill have to check the part# tonight. i never thought to check the model each time it was changed...


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## kh395269 (Dec 31, 2008)

Well, I submitted my warranty request today. Now I guess I just wait and see. In the meantime, my husband cleaned the stove thoroughly last night when he had it apart. It seems to be running a bit better, though you still can hear that it has a bearing problem. We're uising it in the meantime. It's supposed to be cold here in the Northeast tonight and it is currently snowing.

Happy New Year everyone!


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## edcherylx (Jan 2, 2009)

Hi,  Add us to the growing list of unhappy Napoleon stove owners.  We are scheduled to have our 2nd replacement fan installed.  Adding to the frustration of the loud fan noise... is our dealer making us wait 4 weeks each time for service.  As other people mentioned, at Napoleon's head quarters (wolf steel) they do not respond to any questions about the issue, other than to make you go to your dealer.  Has anyone isolated the proper replacement fasco part number?  Has Napoleon actually provided CORRECTED replacement fans?  Or are dealers simply installing the same broken fan over and over again?  Do us consumers need to unite and ALL write the attorney generals office at the same time?  If we got some answers from Napoleon perhaps we might have some confidence that this problem will be corrected.  We are going to continue to email and call wolf steel for answers.    E&C;


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## Larry88 (Jan 2, 2009)

Been cold here in the northeast .Been running my stove on#5 setting for the auger speed.Seems to be better.Still a little loud but not too bad. when the stove is hotter it seems to run better.I did turn the stove down for a short time yesterday to #3 and the convection blower started getting real noisy again.


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## Saltair (Jan 2, 2009)

There has been a new development in the Napoleon Warranty issue for me. Maybe Stove Doctor can help me out on this one...

My dealer went out of busniess. I have mentioned this several times posting on this board. He still owes me a few parts that are not critical for the stoves operation and he has become a ghost. I am going down the AG track to try and find him. In the meantime I have used another dealer to provide my warranty service. To this point that includes changing both fans and they were supposed to have ordered a new fan speed control as well. The new fan starting making noise within hours of being installed. I called this morning to start the process of replacement and was abruptly informed that they could no longer provide warranty service on my stove becuase Napoleon would not reimburse them for service on a stove they didn't sell. huh? They are a dealer the stove has serial numbers that have been submitted I dont see why there should be a problem. I will contact Napoleon myself regarding this monday morning when they reopen, but I am very concerned that because I had the misfortune of buying from a dealer that folded I am stuck with a lemon stove that i cant get service for. The napoleon website touts their great warranty saying you dont even need to register the product they will take care of stuff, and yet the local dealer is telling me they cant get paid. Something doesn't add up here.


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## Larry88 (Jan 2, 2009)

Just sent an email off the Wolf Steel.Don't know if they will return email or not .Also sent link. Maybe they will take the time to read???


There have been a lot of problems with the blowers on your Napoleon pellet stoves and I am one of them. I have contacted you by phone and never received a return call. Their  are other people that seem to get the same service. I thought that you are a manufacture that will stand behind there products?
 People have replaced the blowers 3and 4 time with the SAME PROBLEMS.I have contacted the company that I bought my stove from and I hope that they will continue to help me .I do have concern with your lack of follow up with theses problems. I do like the stove over all but don't know if you will live up to your warranty promises. Here is the web site that you can read the complaints that we have been having. I hope to hear from you .I would like to tell people that you are a company that takes care of their customers.https://www.hearth.com/econtent/index.php/forums/viewthread/30356/


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## kh395269 (Jan 2, 2009)

Awesome posts guys. I am so happy to hear that someone else is also pursuing and following up on this issue. Here I thought I was the only one with issues.


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## kh395269 (Jan 2, 2009)

Oh PS I still don't even know if I will be reimbursed for my warranty parts. Zoobler's policy is that you buy the replacement parts and then you have to ship back the defiective within 15 days for testing and credit, if the manufacturer determines that there is actually a problem. It seems to me that they would be hard pressed to deny that there was a problem.


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## turbot2112 (Jan 3, 2009)

sorry to hear all you guys are having problems with the exhaust blowers being noisy. ive been running the nps40 for almost 2 seasons now and can tell you that hell yea it is a noisy stove at times. i feel that the stove is a piece of crap and that is including customer service from nepoleon and from the people who sell the stoves. last year i did a post on this stove and people were quick to jump on me about the installation being the problem for the noise and the crappy heat output. well we cant all be wrong can we? there were other issues with customert service that im not going to get into. i just hope all you guys get your stoves straightened out. this will be the last season with this stove and then its going to the curb cause i wouldnt feel right selling it to someone.   good luck everyone     jeff


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## Cavedweller (Jan 3, 2009)

I CAN NOT BELIEVE IT I HAD MY FOURTH (4) BLOWER PUT IN LAST WEEK. I HAVE ONLY HAD THE STOVE IN SINCE OCTOBER,2008 AND THE THING STARTED SCREECHING AGAIN TODAY. I'M ALMOST AT A LOST FOR WORDS...  I GUESS I'LL HAVE TO ORDER MY FIFTH(5) ONE. ANY SUGGESTIONS ....ANYONE?????


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## Larry88 (Jan 4, 2009)

Hang in there Hopefully they will find the problem and we will get a good quality blower


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## kh395269 (Jan 7, 2009)

Thought you gentlemen might be interested in the response I finally received from Napoleon today which seems to be blaming it's customers for not taking care of their units properly as the cause of all the problems. I've already given my stove a thorough cleaning  and we've only been through 1 - 1/4 ton of pellets. Give me a break. 


We are sorry to hear of the difficulties you're encountering with this
product. What you've described is certainly not what is considered normal
for the unit. With regards to a handling of the issue, we respond to any and
all issues that our dealers & distributors file with us under warranty. If
we hear of one instance of a specific issue, several departments are
immediately contacted to investigate if there's anything being done, or
missed, that could be contributing to it. If we hear of more than one
instance of a specific issue, product in the range described is quarantined
and examined. If possible, any identified problems are fixed in house. When
not possible, a replacement part, or retrofit kit is created, or a recall is
generated.
Thus far, when we have been receiving the 'defective' product back, we've
not seen anything to indicate defects at all. The majority of what we're
encountering has been terrible lack of maintenance, installation related
issues, or a simple lack of education on the product -- with some fans that
customers claimed as 'noisy' not producing any sound, when returned &
tested. 
This year especially, we had an entire quarter of the North American
continent jumping on the pellet-stove bandwagon, driving the wood-pellet
industry into extreme shortage. Dealers were selling the product without
having the stock to fill orders, and not even needing to spend time
educating the customers on the proper installation, use and maintenance of
the product, because they were in such high demand. Customers weren't even
reading their owners manuals for operating instructions, resulting in floods
of needless calls to dealers, distributers and even the manufacturer, on
basic operating information. While we do not suggest this is the case with
yourself, we are stating that these other customers you described could
easily fall into one of these other categories -- as they may not have known
what to expect with their purchase.
Until we identify otherwise, we will continue to handle all such issues on a
case-by-case basis, examining each product returned to us for any
correlation and always informing our dealers of the results of the
investigation. If any part we receive back is legitimately defective, we
always provide replacement parts as per the terms of our warranty.

Take care & thank you for your purchase,
-Wolf Steel Technical Dept.


Sent: Monday, December 29, 2008 1:26 PM
To: ask@napoleon.on.ca
Subject: Consumer Question from Website

Question: Hi, Been having alot of problems with our exhaust blower on our
new NPI-40. We only have been using the unit a few months. We are going to
submit for a new replacement unit, but I have heard that this is a
widespread problem. I'm not exactly happy that I have to buy the unit from
Zoobler and then wait for refund once tested. Just thought you might be
interested in seeing how other customers as well are upset that Napoleon
does not appear to be properly handling the issue. It sounds like some
people have had to have the unit replaced several times. Has this problem
been fixed on new replacements? It is really beginning to hurt your customer
sat. Thanks.


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## kelvin (Jan 7, 2009)

Oh man. That's a really bad way to talk about your customers.  Napoleon may never again need to worry about extreme shortages due to too many orders to fill once prospective buyers of their $2,000 products start reading that message.  

And I am (so far) a very satisfied NPS 40 owner -- unlike (so far) all of you uneducated bandwagon jumpers who keep sending your perfectly silent fans back to the factory.  Now I dread ever having to contact the company if my unit starts acting up.


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## edcherylx (Jan 7, 2009)

Hi we got a response today also, again Napoloen is trying to tell everyone that they have not heard of any other problems... what kind of fools do they think we all are?  I sent back a link to this site for them to read.  Here is the email we got back:

Good morning, Cheryl;

Firstly, while we can appreciate your frustration in this matter (as the
difficulties you've encountered seem numerous and agitating), we kindly ask
to please not threaten us. It doesn't loan to any sort of positive
communication and won't hasten our ability to resolve any conflict, or help
you. 
We must also apologize for any lack of reply you may have received to this
correspondence -- we unfortunately can not account for it, as this is the
first this department has personally received from you. May we ask whom, or
what number you were calling, so we can identify where the lack of reply is
coming from and hopefully address it right away? 
If it is also not too much trouble, could you possibly provide the
dealership name you purchased this product from, and a contact name at that
location? The pellet insert is a new product and it is possible that perhaps
the dealer requires more assistance with resolving this issue. A lot of
dealers just started selling this product in the tail end of 2008, which
could be contributing to some of the delay you're encountering.
Lastly; there is no problem currently being experienced by the fans in any
of our products that we are aware of. If the dealer would like to file for
warranty on the fans you've replaced, they can return these products to us
so we can examine them & test them, to determine what may have contributed
to their premature failure. On that note we must add that this is not normal
performance of this product, and it should not continue indefinitely.

Thank you in advance,
-Wolf Steel Technical Dept.



Question: We have a Napoleon Pellet Stove Insert. NPI-40.  We have the
problem fan (severe grinding noise).  It was replaced once already (waited 4
weeks for service to be available to come out) and after one week, the same
thing is happening.  Now service is making us wait another 4 weeks to repair
the repair.  This puts us at 8 weeks of inability to use the brand new
stove!  My brother bought a Lennox at the same time, he's been up and
running 24x7 with no problems and it's completely quiet. Why can't Napoloen
authorized repair service technician's repair this properly?  Has the
problem with the fans been fixed?  I would appreciate a response from
someone at Napoloen, an explanation as to what is going on with these fans.
I plan to start filling out all the web reviews I can on this stove and I'd
like to report that Napoleon took care of the problem and we had good
communication with them.  However, sadly I must report until now that is not
the case as we have called and written a few times with no repsonse.

Please foward this to management.

submit: Submit Question


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## edcherylx (Jan 8, 2009)

Hi,  We received an actual phone call today from a Napoleon sales representative.  He was quite interested in our problem regarding the fan noise but again did not outright admit there are problems with the fans.  He actually indicated that perhaps the fans are taking in ashes from the chimney's which are uncleaned and that is making the fan fail.  He stated that some fans which came back to the company have had debris in them.  I mean, is this for real?  We installed a brand new stove insert, into a fireplace that was never used and the problem could be the fact that the fan is sucking in soot and ash from a dirty chimney?  First of all, it would then subsequently blow all that debris into my living room, wouldn't it?  Second of all, as I understand it, these fans are supposed to be sealed aren't they?  I've been reading complaints online about fan noise from other manufacturers now too like Harman and even the same complaints about the fan being replaced with the noise only to return.  I sure hope something is worked out soon.  E&C;


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## Saltair (Jan 9, 2009)

I spoke with a rep at Napoleon Monday afternoon regarding my fan noise and the local dealers unwillingness to work with me on the issue because according to the dealer Napoleon would not reimburse them for work on a stove they didn't sell. The rep informed me that because the stove was not installed by a authorized napoleon dealer my warranty was no good. I told him the stove was installed by the guy recomended by the dealer because the dealer did not do installs. The rep revised his statement saying they would not cover labor, but I could still get parts. Of course the deal with parts is a dealer must provide them and then reimbursement will be made to the dealer from Napoleon. I then told the rep that given the way my local dealer treated me I didn't see them working with me in this manner. he gave me a Napoleon Sales reps number and said I should go through him. This guy is in eastern Canada, an hour ahead of me, and I haven't been able to get home in time to call the guy all week. I should be able to try him tomorrow so we'll see how it goes.

On a side note my stove ordered in May delivered in October is about a year and a half old according to the serial number. I wonder where it had been? The rep told me that early stoves had problems with loud fans, but these problems had been resolved. I figure that accounts for the first bad fan but not the second.


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## edcherylx (Jan 10, 2009)

Hi, this is the latest email from Napoleon tech.  They seem unwilling to admit the part might be defective and are blaming the problem on dirty chimneys.  Can this be for real?  Why won't they admit something is wrong with the fans.  Wouldn't the fans be blowing ash into the room if this was the case?

Hello again;

What has been the condition of the fans when they're being replaced? Do they appear damaged? Dirty? We've received some convection fans back from dealers with similar issues, and they've been congested with ash. We suspect that the existing fireplace cavities are not being cleaned as we specify in the manual and that there is residual ash that is congesting the convection blower and shortening their longevity. Has your dealer sent any of the blowers back to us for examination? Was your existing fireplace cavity thoroughly cleaned by a qualified chimney sweep prior to installing the insert?  Has the dealer checked to make sure that the chimney liner is completely sealed, and hasn't been torn, or damaged during install? For the fans to be repeatedly failing after so short a time period insinuates that there's conditions in place in your installation that are contributing to this failure. We certainly do not have a bad batch of fans and the product has been thoroughly tested &  certified for this type of application.

Thank you in advance,
-Wolf Steel Technical Dept.


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## Cavedweller (Jan 10, 2009)

Dear Stove Doctor, You as an authorized dealer of the NAPOLEON product line have seen the complaints in this forum as well as experienced this problem first hand, yet you can now clearly see NAPOLEON responses to the issues at hand. I was wondering if you yourself have spoken with any reps and have been satisfied with their answers. What suggestions do you have for us the consumer to do at least to get some open minded responses from NAPOLEON or our respective dealers?


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## edcherylx (Jan 11, 2009)

We are getting our fan replaced Mon for the 2nd time.  Meanwhile I made a video of the noise and posted it on you tube for anyone's viewing pleasure.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O785BgqqdCg


E&C;


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## edcherylx (Jan 11, 2009)




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## Cavedweller (Jan 11, 2009)

THAT IS EXACTLY IT THE SAME NOISE MY STOVE HAS. I am going to do the same thing and video my stove to show how it can sometimes be quiet and sometimes make HORRIFIC noises!  EXCELLENT IDEA!


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## Saltair (Jan 11, 2009)

Yep thats it...

I spoke with the Napoleon Sales Rep and got the same question about the cleanliness of my chimney. I had a stainless liner installed for the stove exhaust, the chimney itself is sealed of with fireproof insulation, and the hearth and firplace firebox were rebuilt this summer and the firebox is clean concrete. My fan is not getting ash in it. I am getting my seconded replacement fan as well as the other parts that have failed. I should have them in about a week. As I posted above I cannot get labor covered in my warranty so I will have to install them myself. This is not really a problem, but given the trouble I am having you woud think Napoleon would want an authorized tech to install the parts. who knows...


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## kh395269 (Jan 11, 2009)

Like de ja vous. Same here too. The noise just rings your ears. It's awful. Thanks for posting! Great idea! No one can deny a problem after seeing that.


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## kh395269 (Jan 11, 2009)

I also got my replacement part on Friday. We will be installing it hopefully tomorrow. It is different then the one currently installed.


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## j00fek (Jan 11, 2009)

same exact problem here, but with the exhaust fan


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## kh395269 (Jan 11, 2009)

My husband just fixed the exhaust fan - a day early The new and different fan is much, much quieter. Now, it makes the blower seem like is loud. Hopefully, that is not defective as well. My husband said the old version was definitely and clearly incorrectly designed and should be recalled. It should have never made it through quality control. The impellar (sp?) is clearly backwards and cannot be reversed, and that is root of the problem. The stove is even operating better overall (airflow is much more noticeable). We are hoping it will now operate cleaner as well.


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## Cavedweller (Jan 12, 2009)

the blower fan has been my problem all along. hope my exhaust doesn't go next. if my blower fan ever quiets down enough i might be able to tell about my exhaust. good luck


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## edcherylx (Jan 12, 2009)

OK.. tech guy came out today... he did not replace the fan, but instead simply took off the black outer ring that is mounted on the blower fan.  He is wondering if that is the problem as it seems to have a tight tolerance against the moving fan blade part.  He stated that he has replaced about 15 fan motors himself and decided that if he simply replaced this one again, we would still be in the same boat because its the same fan.  

Oh And guess what?  There was NO ash in the fan at all, what a surprise.  So running the stove again to see what happens.  Right now hearing only the normal air flow noise which is nice and quiet... ahhhh.  Will post later with an update.


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## edcherylx (Jan 12, 2009)

Well that didn't take too long to act up again... here is my new video of the stove after the attempted repair of removing the outer black ring from the blower motor.

I'm really at a loss as to what we should do.... we are thinking about asking if we can return this stove for a credit towards a different model.


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## Saltair (Jan 13, 2009)

Good Luck with the exchange. after what I was told about my warranty I dont hold out any hope that I will ever be able to exchange this stove. It is so frustrating the stove has run quite all evening, but last night it was driving be crazy. I am still waiting for my second replacement convection fan. If yo move forward with your plan to exchange to stove let us know how it plays out...


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## kh395269 (Jan 13, 2009)

Well, I am frustrated as well..  My exhaust fan is operating much better and quieter with the new design. However, now my front blower is definitely making a bearing noise now. I think it was just drowned out before by how bad the back motor was. I've sent a note to Zoobler to see if they have a different replacement warranty part for that one as well. Back to the drawing board.


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## Cavedweller (Jan 13, 2009)

I cant say i am surprised ...... Sorry to hear about it...


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## edcherylx (Jan 14, 2009)

Latest news is... fan will be replaced again today.  I got a call from the New England Napoleon sales rep - so that was nice that they are getting in touch and keeping up with the problem.  However, it may do the same thing within 1-2 weeks and start making noise as the problem has not been identified and fasco has not provided new fans which fix the problem yet.  I did learn that the free standing pellet stoves have a fan that runs at 1600 rpm while the inserts fan runs at 3000 rpm's and perhaps this is why only the inserts are having a problem.   Will keep everyone posted on the sound of the 3rd fan.   E&C;


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## Cavedweller (Jan 14, 2009)

Is it possible to get your contact information for the New England rep as I am from New Hampshire as well.


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## edcherylx (Jan 15, 2009)

Hi, ahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh a nice and quiet fan (so far).  This is NICE, we really do like the stove.. it's nice looking and we are toasty warm running it at about 2.  But the fan problems are just making the experience tough to take.  Right now we can barely hear the stove running at all.  It's sooooooooooooo quiet!!   Good timing with this bitter cold coming.  

Cavedweller - all I have is an email for the Naploen rep... if you send me a note to edcherylx@msn.com - I will respond with that email addy.

Oh we did get another note from Wolf Steel which we feel is really out of line and took us by surprise.  We are really unsure why they are being so difficult.  I guess they don't understand the possibility of a bad "batch" of fans, we never intended to state every single fan is bad, we only stated there must be a bad "batch" of fans out there.  Oh and also so funny that they "doubt" this web site has any complaints.  AH!  Let them just read it.  Here is the email text:

Hello again;

Frankly; we will not state as you have suggested that the fans are bad, because they are the exact same fan as is used in 99.9% of the pellet-stove manufacturing industry. This is not a product that only Napoleon pellet stoves utilize. So if your statement were true, every customer of a pellet-stove manufacturer would have the identical problem.  We seriously doubt that this website you continually reference has such complaints.
Ultimately until either what you claim, or what we've suspected, is proven or disproven, there is little else we will be able to provide for you via email. We will continue to work with your dealer in assisting them with any assistance they require in service, or providing replacement parts they may require. They will work with us in determining the cause of the issue you've encountered and servicing your needs as necessary.

Take care,
-Wolf Steel Technical Dept.

Obviously their in denial about anything that could be faulty in their stove.  He still tends to believe the "dirty chimney" story although it has been "disproven" by the Napoloen authorized repair man who inspected our noisey fan and found no ash build up.  Time will tell what happens with this new fan.


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## Cavedweller (Jan 15, 2009)

My repair man also found no evidence of a dirty fan either. Although really how dirty could the fan get in three days which gas been about the average time and certainly well under a week before the new fan acts up.


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## kh395269 (Jan 15, 2009)

Napoleon must be feeding the same garbage to Zoobler about people not keeping their units clean and that is the source of the problem. Hence, my recent response from Zoobler:


"On the new issue of the convection blower, we are so sorry to hear of the problem and we are here to hep you through to a resolution. The issues you are having may be contributed to excessive dirt, dust or ash built up on your blower fan blades. Was the firebox thoroughly cleaned of all ash before the insert was installed? Are there pets in the home? Their hair, along with drywall dust, ash, etc. can cause issues to blowers that are not properly cleaned and maintained.A replacement convection blower is also available for a resolution the current issue via the same process."

Are they kidding? The problem is with the bearrings, not the fan itself (except we did determine that the impellar is backwards on the exhaust fan) and my unit couldn't possibly be kept cleaner then it has been. We just started using the unit at the end of Sept. We run it no more than 12 hrs a day. We've used maybe 1 1/2 tons, we clean the pot and stove itself everyday, and the whole thing has been taken apart and fully cleaned per specifications now twice in addition. This is crazy.


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## edcherylx (Jan 15, 2009)

Wow... yup, same stuff from zoobler... I mean where did they expect the stove to be installed?  In a dust free environment of a hospital?  What a dumb excuse for why a fan is failing, and even if there is a remote possibility that it is failing because of some dust or pet hair, then it's because of a poor design.  I see zoobler stated there is a replacement fan, hope you are able to get it and things work out.  The stove does work nice and is pleasant when quiet... it was 3.5 degrees out this morning, but 66 in my house with running the stove all night.

Day 2 - fan is still quiet!


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## edcherylx (Jan 18, 2009)

Hi,  Just an update...  Day 5 and the fan is still really quiet.... we are finally enjoying our stove!!  We are also praying the quietness lasts this time.  

Reflecting back on the experience we are very dissapointed in Wolf Steels handling of this situation.  The place we bought the stove from was at least trying to be helpful, although they do have a service problem in that it should not take 4 weeks to get someone out to us.  But Wolf Steel repeatedly refuses to admit there is a problem with the fans, they couldn't even say "we will look into it" or "perhaps there might be some problems, we are looking into it" or "we are investigating" - any of those responses would have been better than, it's your fault, you have a dirty chimney.  

Will keep everyone posted.


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## pinetop12 (Jan 19, 2009)

I have the day off so decided to come to Hearth.com and see the Napolean line of pellet stoves had beeen discussed here...
You guys had some great posts and the factory responses from Wolf?/Napolean/ were pure 'Bush-world ' in how they thought of their customers. The company responses in email form? were reprehensible. I am kinda disapionted cause I was /interested in a Napolean I have looked at here locally/ LA Maine. But reading these posts and how Wolf responded....
Its like they are unaware the internet exisit and consumer advocation is in play. The days of handling customers in a isolated fashion are mostly gone . -- 'do you have a cat or dog? this could be reason our fricking stove is not working,, WTF. 
I am still at a loss to understand how they could treat customers who bought there stove as such simpletons.
I an;t very smart but i can read ,and I have read enough here to move on to another brand of Pellet stove.

Thanks guys.


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## roushpwrd (Jan 20, 2009)

Does anyone here have an 800 number to Napoleon. We too are having a tremendous amount of issues with our stove. It is a Napoleon NPI40. For example, loud fan running at whatever speed it feels, auger not feeding pellets, control panel door broken and as for the highly recommended porcelain reflective panel....we don't like it. It is already flaking, warped and reflects nothing as we were told it would. (by this I mean we were told it would make the fire look larger and push the heat out into the room when in fact the heating tubes are where the heat comes from). I have called the stove shop where we made the purchase many many times only to get an answering machine. This stove is only two months old....customer service is poor. If I didn't care about the cost of the stove, I would leave it on their door step for others to see. The purchase was made in NH and I am considering calling the Attorney General, BBB and any other consumer protection advocates. This is ridiculous. We feel so alone and as if we are fighting a losing battle.......


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## Cavedweller (Jan 20, 2009)

I have never seen an 800 number for Napoleon, however their number can be found on the front of the manual you got with the stove or if you go to the website you can download the manual and the number is on that. I hope you have better luck with them then the rest of us...


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## Saltair (Jan 20, 2009)

No 800 number and they do not like talking to the retail customer. My retail outlet went under so I was directed to a different shop. When the treated me very poorly I was able to get someone at Napoleon to talk to me, but it was not what I was hoping for. Dont get your hopes up...


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## roushpwrd (Jan 21, 2009)

Cavedweller said:
			
		

> I have never seen an 800 number for Napoleon, however their number can be found on the front of the manual you got with the stove or if you go to the website you can download the manual and the number is on that. I hope you have better luck with them then the rest of us...


Thank you...I did see the number on my manual. I have called my dealer many times with no luck...I always get an answering machine. I see that it is going to be cold again at the end of the week here in Massachusetts....I may call the Attorney General on them to get what I need. I don't want to however I don't want to heat my home with electricity either. That brings me to one more thing....this stove seems to have a hard time heating when it is really cold outside. I do realize that it takes more to heat colder air but my home is very airtight and this stove still seems to be heating poorly. I did email the manufacturer one time asking what the MSRP for this stove was and they directed me to a dealer. Does anyone know what the MSRP is for the NPI40? I just wonder how many of us overpaid for a terrible stove.


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## roushpwrd (Jan 21, 2009)

Well....with a little determination, I have obtained an 800 number. I haven't called it yet however I plan to if I don't get a call within a half hour from them. My dealer, who finally answered his phone said he was having the tech support call me. Prior to hanging up, I got the number. I don't know where this location is however I will give you all the number anyway....I am in New England so this could possibly be a local number. Here it is anyway....800-873-1330. Good luck!


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## Saltair (Jan 21, 2009)

Did the Napoleon Tech call you? or did you figure out where that number goes?


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## edcherylx (Jan 22, 2009)

roushpwrd said:
			
		

> Cavedweller said:
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Our NPI40 heats the living area nicely to about 68/69 even when -10 outside.  The bedrooms stay cooler at 60/62.  However, we did try different pellets and got much higher heat out of them.  What kind of pellets are you using?


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## Cavedweller (Jan 22, 2009)

EDCHERYLX , I am curious as to what pellets you've tried and what ones you like best


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## roushpwrd (Jan 22, 2009)

After taking the stove apart myself due to lack of customer service, I have noticed that a "screw" from the manufacturer is causing my auger to stick. A screw that holds the auger housing to the stove was dropped during manufacturing and finally got caught in the auger. It is jammed in there to the point that I cannot pull it out. I was thinking about trying to reverse the polarity on the auger motor however I don't know if it will work and if it will damage any other electrical component in the system. Any suggestions are welcome...thank you...


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## Larry88 (Jan 24, 2009)

Hi ALL,
I have been in contact with the  dealer I bought my stove from over the last couple of weeks. I received my new convection blower on Wed. Could not wait to put it in and stove is QUITE Wolf Steel wanted me to give  then my credit card, buy a blower ,send old blower back and if they said something was wrong with it they would credit my card.!! Fire Place Pro my dealer has been great.They had a new blower sent UPS and a return slip for the old blower. I hope this will be the one and only blower that I will have to change.But from what I have been hearing??? I will keep my fingers crossed.Good Luck to everyone .Will let you know if anything changes


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## roushpwrd (Jan 24, 2009)

I spoke to my dealer today about the multiple problems with my NPI40....he clearly stated to me, "he will not service the stove I bought from him because I am out of his area...a whole 35-40 minutes away from his shop". I seriously think I need to contact someone with some authority such as the DA's office and consumer protection agency. It has been over a week now and all I am getting is the run around....I don't want to have to go that route but I feel so helpless.


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## thebingo (Jan 28, 2009)

Same issue here.  Can't get a return phone call from my dealer, which is really frustrating to me.  I went there two weeks ago and they said they would get me a replacement fan...nothing yet.  My fan totally died and started making weird electrical sounds and a burning plastic smell.  Wonder what that is.


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## roushpwrd (Jan 28, 2009)

I'm gaining ground here...slowly but surely. I spoke to the dealer, he stated to the manufacturer that I was 2 1/2 hours away from his shop one way. He also stated that he gets paid NOTHING for doing warranty work. Neither of which are true. I am 30 minutes from his store. I did the repair work and Napoleon is aware of this. The place who handles the warranty, BAC Sales told me to fix it. The representative from Napoleon was not happy about this and is going to see that my dealer no longer sells their stoves. For some of my trouble, they are sending me the bricks that go into my stove...we have the reflective panel and it is no good. Warped and the porcelain is cracking off of it. This has stressed us out here at my home and cannot wait for it to all be behind us. Napoleon stated that if an "authorized" dealer repairs the stove, they get one rate and if a non authorized dealer repairs it, they get a lower rate for their efforts. I seriously want to put a claim in to be paid....that is my next step. I spent days troubleshooting thier issues and found nothing all the way up to the day when I emptied the hopper only to see a screw had fallen out and jammed in the auger. Napoleon had asked for pictures so I sent them to the rep. I wish I did this step first but who would have known??? Best of luck....


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## kh395269 (Jan 28, 2009)

Status on our stove - The new exhaust fan is working great. The stove itself is much more efficient (in addition to being a whole lot quieter) than it was before. We also notice the blower doesn't kick up higher like it used to. I really believe the old exhaust fan was not exhausting what it should and our unit was actually overheating. I am still waiting on my refund of $188 though and since we did the work ourselves, we really should get return shipping etc... The blower on the other hand is still louder than it should be (not deafening, but louder than  necessary). I really want to get my refund for the first fan before I request the second, so I am am not sitting here paying interest on a $400 credit card bill, which I think they should also pay. This is very frustrating. I shouldn't be out any money for their faulty fans. We've also invested alot of time into this that a repai person should be dealing with.

Also, we were considering buying the logs and the reflective backing to make the stove look "prettier" when this is all said and done. I'm afraid to buy the backing now - not sure what to do?


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## roushpwrd (Jan 28, 2009)

I tried to upload a photo of the logs and reflective panel however the photo is too large. I would gladly forward you those pictures so you can see first hand what they look like after awhile. Not so pretty....the only way to clean them is remove the 4 screws and wash them in the sink. The center panel does not shine anymore and is warped. The porcelain is flaking off as I stated before. I heard that the bricks stay cleaner....I'm going to try that route when they arrive. Now that I'm thinking of this, I am calling BAC Sales to see what they will do about my time.....here goes! Send me a PM with an email address if you would like those pictures....I'm sure they will clear up any concerns you have. When they are clean, they are awesome looking....but that doesn't last more than a couple hours.


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## AllPro (Jan 29, 2009)

Hello after reading this post I am more pissed than I was yesterday.I have the same piece of crap from Napolean and purchased it from Zoobler.My stove is squeling.Napolean was useless the last time I called.Zoobler will only accept emails another useless method.I wish the heck i knew that before I purchased through them they are a sham company with more complaints than compliments.I am also from New Hampshire.


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## Larry88 (Jan 30, 2009)

It did not take long for the new convection blower to start acting up !Same old same old!! just emailed my dealer .Lets see where this takes me ???


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## roushpwrd (Jan 31, 2009)

They sent my bricks to replace the porcelain reflector plate and a new door. That was fast....now I need to go after the dealer for the time I put into troubleshooting the stove. 5 days in the morning before going to work...and I work 2nd shift. It was the darn screw...who would have guessed. I will send him a bill for my labor as soon as I find out the rate for non certified napoleon repairmen. I guess I can get that rate by calling BAC Sales...they handle the warranty. So far so good....stay tuned Tomorrow I'll post some close ups of the reflective panel for you all to see....it's junk.


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## roushpwrd (Jan 31, 2009)

OK...here are the photos of the reflector plate that is only 3 months of age. It is warped discolored and the porcelain is stressed to the point it arrears it is burned right off.....rust is actually coming through the porcelain itself.....I installed the bricks today....they look much better. They are a little black but that goes away with the heat. My honest opinion...the reflective porcelain panel is junk....simply put! I hope this helps...there is a front and a rear view of the main plate...the side plates are perfect.


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## kh395269 (Feb 2, 2009)

Wow, unbelievable. You made up my mind. I will definitely  eventually go with the bricks. Please keep us posted on how they work out. Thanks, Kim


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## kh395269 (Feb 2, 2009)

I'm torn on my convection blower now. It makes a bearing noise but not a really bad noise, not like the exhaust blower. The new exhaust blower works great. The different design did the trick. I'm afraid I could end up with a front blower that is worst then the one that I have now, or that maybe Napoleon will try to claim that it is not defective. I am still waiting on my reimbursement for my exhaust blower. 

I honestly believe that the design of the original exhaust blower was a seriously dangerous defect and should really be recalled for everyone. It was causing my unit to even overheat.


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## roushpwrd (Feb 2, 2009)

I need to learn to proofread my posts...I meant "appears" and not "arrears" The photos of the plate are of a washed plate and no ash on it....so far...the bricks are awesome and add a lot of character to the stove.....I will keep you posted though....


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## roushpwrd (Feb 4, 2009)

OK...an update on the bricks over the porcelain panel....go with the bricks if you want a stove that has class. The panel as you saw warps and basically falls apart. The bricks do get dirty however they do clean up when heat gets to them just as any fireplace does.....in my opinion, they are worth it over the porcelain panel....


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## mrsethman (Feb 7, 2009)

I am now 3 weeks and counting without my NPI-40 working.  It committed suicide while my wife was watching American Idol.  The Ignitor shorted out tripped the breaker on my fuse box.  Rep still has not come to look at it even though I have asked multiple times.  I found all the parts online and going to to have to pay for them even though it is under warranty. 

Any suggestions?

Cold and frustrated.


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## AllPro (Feb 7, 2009)

Honestly Napolean/ Wolf Steel has the crapiest product I have ever seen and the poorest Warranty Service everything about them is shady.They seem to have it down pat to screw you and where the oil prices were so high they had an advantage to take people for a ride and crap on them after the fact.If you are looking for a Pellet Stove stay away from this product and mail order Like Zoobler very shady tie in money up front for warranty work.What the hell kind of warranty is that.Buy local even if it is more we ordered 3 things from Zoobler all were damaged and it takes 2 months before if you even can get your money refunded.While in the meantime you have to make another purchase to replace the damaged one.The other crock is when I called them the other day they stated they have no complaints or returns.I told them to check out this website.


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## kh395269 (Feb 7, 2009)

I know they have had at least one other complaint from me - Zoobler meaning.


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## AllPro (Feb 7, 2009)

They Napolean have had alot of complaints and they blame it on the customers lack of cleaning.If you manufacture an insert you need to engineer it correctly to handle dust.I dont know about all of you but i have never dusted the inside of my chimney.I had the chimney guy here this past week and he laughed stating it is not a quality stove.My plumbers where here they have a breckwell and another has a Yankee they have never had a problem and they said the same thing Crappy Company.I hope other people read these postings and if it prevents a few from making a mistake I will be happy.I hope something is done to get back at them I hate to see honest people in such a tough economy get taken advantage of evryone on this board seems so honest and genuine that it makes me angry to see all of you going through such unneccasery anguish.


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## roushpwrd (Feb 8, 2009)

I agree with you AllPro....Prior to my Napoleon NPI40 coming in, I tried to cancel the order and was going to order a Breckwell for a thousand dollars less....it seems I should have however the saleswoman begged me to keep the order or I would lose a percentage of my purchase as a restocking fee. I thought, how can you charge that fee for a product that supposedly isn't even built??!! Well, when I went to pick up my stove, she had me initial the spot that said if I cancel I would have to pay that fee. The bottom line here is I am going to do some research on the Breckwell stove and have it in my mind to have the dealer come to my home and pick up this P.O.S. Napoleon stove. The problems just keep growing and I totally agree with you....they should have produced a better stove. The damn thing is bugging the daylights out of me as I type this...it is loud as hell. I know they make whisper quiet fans such as the type that go in bathrooms....Come on Napoleon/Wolf Steel.....listen to us....can we get a class action against them???


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## AllPro (Feb 8, 2009)

You Know I thought of the same thing.I have several of my relatives that are attorneys.One is actually the asst Attorney general.I am going to ask them I really wish we could I am sure we could get alot more people on board.


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## roushpwrd (Feb 8, 2009)

AllPro said:
			
		

> You Know I thought of the same thing.I have several of my relatives that are attorneys.One is actually the asst Attorney general.I am going to ask them I really wish we could I am sure we could get alot more people on board.


I purchased my stove in Salem NH and I would be more than glad to take action against Napoleon/Wolf steel for an inferior product however at this point it is my dealer who is taking me for a ride.  All I want for my hard earned money is something that lives up to it's name....then again if a cheap product is produced by Napoleon, then it shoots down that thought. Maybe I should have said I want something worth what I paid for...and that cost is over #2500....that's a lot of savings for an average hard working American in times like these. Then to top it off...I saw that a bag of pellets equals on the average of 1 bag of pellets to 2 1/3 gallons of heating oil....at today's new oil costs per gallon...where is the savings??? Pellet costs are still way too high. It's like anything else...we see an easy out and then they stick it to us....as soon as the market picks up...I think I'll move to where I don't need to heat my home...


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## AllPro (Feb 8, 2009)

Where did you buy it in Salem ?


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## edcherylx (Feb 8, 2009)

As we've posted before, we have over the course of several weeks,dealt with our dealer (Fireplace Village, Salem), and Wolf Steel. Wolf was totally useless, insisting they had no problem with their product, any problem, like the noisy fan,was in some bizarre way,our fault(lack of cleaning,etc.) We have had 3 blower fans, the first 2 lasted an average of 2 weeks before becoming unbearably loud. This 3rd one has been in almost a month, and,knock on wood, has been pretty quiet..an occasional noise, NOTHING like the first 2, certainly bearable.
 I know Wolf has a link to this blog, and if they're reading it, gee, how come this fan is working even with our "dirty" chimney? I'm pretty sure we all know the answer to that.
 If somehow this fan stays quiet, we are pretty satisfied with the stove. It does what it's supposed to do. Actually, we have heard complaints about other brands of stoves also. It's not that a particular product has a problem, it's how that problem is handled. Napoleon says they're built on customer service, but those of us here know that both Napoleon,and Wolf Steel dont know the meaning of customer service. That is truly where the problem lies.


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## roushpwrd (Feb 8, 2009)

AllPro said:
			
		

> Where did you buy it in Salem ?


We made the purchase at Broadway Stove Shop on Rt 28.


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## Ricky K (Mar 11, 2009)

Stove Doctor said:
			
		

> As a very satisfied Napoleon dealer, I can tell you that Napoleon does and will take care of their problems. Not sure of how things work with the internet sellers, "Beware of the high cost of the low price" comes to mind. I've experienced firsthand these same troubles with units I've sold and installed, and as far as I can tell, I believe the manufacturer got ahold of some bad fans, because I've replaced such with another reputable manufacturers Fasco motor, and have had no problems since. Just replaced another convection fan last week, under warranty of course. Please keep in mind that Napoleon tech services always responds to the dealers needs asap, as they should and do, because the responsibility lies with the dealer first and foremost. Any reputable stove manufacturer instills responsible service from their dealers, then the manufacturer will stand behind and work out any issues through that dealer. Dealers should be accountable to the customer first, and if they are promoting, servicing and installing quality products, the manufacturers need to stand behind their dealer. IMO, of course. With this being the crazy time of year for us dealers, it is hard to take care of all troubles in a timely manner, but I guess sometimes that is not good enough, which is certainly understandable.



Maybe you are a dealer but I bought from an dealer and The Factory, Factory Rep or the Dealer has done an thing but the Run around I have had to lemons I replace and the other won;t Heat. So don't tell me how good the stove or company is.   They do not back what they sell!@!


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## kh395269 (Mar 11, 2009)

Hi All,

I am still having problems too ... sigh.. I'm not sure what to do anymore really.... I wish I could just return this whole thing and also buy the Breckwell I should have bought in the first place. Between the two.. I chose this one for it's looks.. bad choice. It was like picking a football team to win based on its colors.lol  Though, I did also figure that although Napoleon was only in the pellet business for a short time, they were in the wood stove business for quite a while, so they must have knew what they were doing.. obviously not. So far, we replaced the exahust blower, and the convection blower, and now the variable speed blower dial went. I am currently waiting for that part to come in. We just replaced the convection blower in the last week and a half.  I just got the RA number for the convection blower and was planning on sending that back when I noticed one of the fans was making a horrible noise the other night again. If it doesn't go away once we replace the knob, I really don't know where to go from here. I really just want to ship this thing back and demand all my money back. I don't have the time, energy, or patience to deal with this anymore.  Major frustration...  - Kim


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## Ricky K (Mar 12, 2009)

I just put a new convection fan in mine today and got it running.  Gather all you contact info and write to the attorney generals office. I did and am waiting to see what happens. I want my money back too.


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## Ricky K (Mar 12, 2009)

I told Osborn Pumbing the place I bought it that he was responsible to me the buyer and it was up to him to fight with the distributor and factory, Not Me.  The Rep Raymond won't even talk to me he refered me the Wolf and I tried to contact them and they won't even call me or e-mail me.  Time for a Class Action suit. and request to our represenative and senators to Ban all their product from coming in to this country.


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## Ricky K (Mar 12, 2009)

All of you folks need to gather all related e-mail and info dealing with these issues and contact you Attorney Generals Office, Senators and Rep. I want my money back. These are a piece of junk that they put together to get our money with no intentions of servicing or standing behind them. Also boycott all their other products.  Grill etc.


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## roushpwrd (Nov 9, 2009)

OK...I am on my second stove, a Napoleon NPI40 and it is JUNK also. It has been running for a month and I already have a new fan installed....the new fan is as loud as ever. I also noticed that the hot air is only being blown out of the left side of the heat tubes. I plan to make a call to BAC sales who handles the warranty and ask them to come get the stove. I am doing some research on a better stove for around $2500.....any ideas???? To sum it up, two stoves and 4 fans in less than 1 year......


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## bjr23 (Nov 9, 2009)

I bought a Nepolian gas fire place from Zooblers that's worked great for two years. When I bought the sales people spent a long telling me in detail about the fireplace. So I was thinking about a free standing Nepolian stove for my basement. But what a difference two years make. Zooblers service took a serious dive. I won't go near Zooblers now or Nepolean products now. Thank goodness for this site.  bjr23


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## walterburke (Nov 27, 2009)

Hi,
  I too have a NPI40 that I purchesed from zoobler. It stopped working a few weeks ago. The pellets won't drop into the pot. I removed all pellets and cleaned out where the pellets are place in. I couldn't find anything that was blocking the pellets. I have always kept the stove clean with my ash vacuum cleaner. The light goes on indicating that it "thinks" that pellets are dropping but they don't drop.  

    I tried to find someone to come fix it but no one will come to my house. I don't live near any pellet repair places. 

    Does anyone have any ideas how I can get the pellets to drop? 

    BTW- Zoobler has been awful. It took about 6 months for my stove to arrive. It came without the air control rod. That took a few more months to get. Then it wouldn't start. That took a few more months to fix. I'm an unhappy NPI40 owner but I want to get it working soon to save $$ on oil bills. Thanks, Wally


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## Colorado (Jan 9, 2010)

Been reading this thread off and on the past year or so. I bought my NPI40 in March 2009. Last week they replaced the convection fan for the second time. And today this third fan started hinting at noise. I can't complain much about my dealer - they have been helpful and understanding. I left them a message about this new noise.

My primary complaint is with Napoleon like much of yours is. I do believe the fan itself is good, but the mounting location that Napoleon put the fan in behind the stove allows it to draw dust into the motor and that's my theory. ymmv

My father has had a pellet stove for almost 20 years (different brand) and the bearings on his convection fan are greasable so he has the ability to keep it lubed. He's on the same convection fan still. We do not have this ability.

I have toyed around with the idea of taking it apart to see how possible it would be to drill a hole for adding my own grease in both the front and rear bearings. Of course this would "void my warranty" which I still have a year on. But the annoyance is crazy when it starts and the dealer does not stock these fans (big surprise). Has anyone done this?

The other option - although much more involved - is actually physically relocating the fan from it's location on the stove and having an HVAC person rig up some sort of vent pipe to move the air from the fan to the stove, thus hopefully prohibiting the fan from sucking in dust and making it last many, many years. And as a by-product... maybe the stove would be quieter. My concern tho in addition to the cost and engineering - is the heat output from the stove would be lower, even at high speed.

As you can tell, I've thought about a new solution for awhile. Anyone else try something "outside the box"?

My problem is that my firebox (originally an open fireplace) is so small, I barely have 1/2" of clearance above the stove so the NPI40 was about the only one I could find that fit. So if I wanted to replace it with something from another manufacturer, I fear I wouldn't find one that fits top to bottom.

Other than the fan issue, I love the stove. Looks good and puts out good heat for my 1700 sq ft tri-level.


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## Colorado (Jan 9, 2010)

Another quick point not related to the NPI40 fan issue - if you purchased the stove in 2009, you are eligible for a tax credit. The NPI40 is eligible. Up to $1,500. This will hopefully make dealing with the fan issue a bit less harsh to deal with.

See http://www.napoleonfireplaces.com/Company/taxcredits.html


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## save$ (Jan 9, 2010)

While I hate to admit it, I did have a period when my Napoleon fan made a horrid high pitch noise.  It would come on, I would shut the stove off or try other settings.  Seemed to work, then it came back. My stove is in the downstairs level of our split.  So, frustrated,  I just left the room and let it screech.  After a week, the screeching stopped an never came back.   Now runs very quiet.  I clean the fan only by use of  the leaf blower in the exhaust outside, and by using the vac (so far).  I do have concerns that the blower may "cake" up with ash/shoot.  That leaf blower method seems to take ever bit of loose ash out of my stove and the exhaust system.   I know what works today, may not remain true for tomorrow, but that is where I am at this time with no regrets.


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## walterburke (Jan 9, 2010)

I bought my NPI40 in 2008. Would I be eligible for a tax credit??? Thanks.


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## PRETZEL (Jan 10, 2010)

Been reading these posts and I have had the NOISE too. When we had service in it was QUIET. i have noticed if i turn it much over 3+ it whines like a ....., has to be a heat issue in the blower bearings.


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## j00fek (Jan 10, 2010)

had a nps40 since 08, harman since 01. had to have the first exhaust motor replaced the first yr. after that nothing has gone wrong. i had to take off the exhaust motor last spring to do a full cleaning. bought a new gasket for $9 man that alot. so i just went to the auto parts store and got some felpro gasket sheets and made a gasket out of that and put the fan back in and been rockin the heat this yr with no problems.

its sad to see all these people have problems, since i have 5 other family members with the insert model doing fine no problems in 2 yrs. but making substantial purchases from online dealers is a no go for me, i have to talk face to face with the person id buy it from.


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## kelvin (Jan 25, 2010)

I am now in the middle of my second season running the NPS40 and just started experiencing this problem regularly (high pitched squeal from the exhaust blower).  I have kept this stove and the vents very clean (including the leafblower trick). I have a call in to Napoleon.

Does anybody know whether there is a choice of part makers for a replacement fan?  It sounds like others who have replaced their exhaust fans under warranty end up having the same problem again.   It's bad enough I have to replace this fan... I'd like at least to find a replacement part that does not have the defect.  Thanks.


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## j00fek (Jan 26, 2010)

if your stove is still under warranty the dealer should replace it.


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## GARY24NASCAR (Dec 12, 2010)

I can't believe with all the complaints and proof (video is an exact match of the issue in this thread) that Napoleon ignores the issue. I've started another thread for this accidentally but I have reached out to Fasco the maker of the blower. Figure if Napoleon has done nothing by now with the complaints and threats to go to the BBB then that won't change any if I call.

The nice production manager at Fasco got back to me and stated this blower is in a lot of pellet stoves and there's no known issue with them. 

I've read elsewhere on the internet that someone swapped out the sealed ball bearings and tried sleeve bearings which worked. He spoke with Steve Arnold at Fasco which helped them. I'll be talking with him tomorrow, specifically, for details and help because there's some mixed messages from others at Fasco that ball bearings are better for high temp environments than the sleeve bearings. Apparently, the gentleman used the sleeve bearing instead and no further noises and ran at higher rpms (3500 compared to 3000). Unfortunately, that person did not follow up with many other details to help other people out.

At this point I am willing to try anything. I spent a lot of $$ on this stove yet can't use it because the noise is unbearable. I can't keep spending $200 a whack for new blowers!


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## hnkstang50 (Jan 22, 2011)

i dont have a napoleon stove but i have an englander stove for about a year now and am on my 4th room air blower motor. they all started making the same nose that is in your youtube viedo. im back and forth with englander now and the latest is they say its a squirl cage blower and is noisy... its frustrating and they say the same thing that there is no known issues and if there was alot of stoves use this blower. 

have you guys found any fix? other brands?

i took apart a motor today and found its the rear bearing making the niose the balls are actualy blued. i think heat is the issue and th rear bearing had no air over it and no metal heat sinc such as the metl squirl cage on the front bearing.


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## jtakeman (Jan 22, 2011)

This issue has been around for a while and not just one brand of stoves. Breckwell has had the issue too! They and Fasco came up with these beauties to help curve the heat issue.

They are c-frame shaded pole motors with fans at both ends to cool the bearings, Open frame also helps reduce noise issues overall. Enviro and Harman have used them on the combustion motors for years!


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## hnkstang50 (Jan 22, 2011)

j-takeman said:
			
		

> This issue has been around for a while and not just one brand of stoves. Breckwell has had the issue too! They and Fasco came up with these beauties to help curve the heat issue.
> 
> They are c-frame shaded pole motors with fans at both ends to cool the bearings, Open frame also helps reduce noise issues overall. Enviro and Harman have used them on the combustion motors for years!



Wow that's awesome. I don't know how I haven't come across that in all my searching. Seems like that would do the trick. Do you know how I would go about getting a direct replacmet for my room air blower.


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## jtakeman (Jan 22, 2011)

hnkstang50 said:
			
		

> Wow that's awesome. I don't know how I haven't come across that in all my searching. Seems like that would do the trick. *Do you know how I would go about getting a direct replacmet for my room air blower*.



Unfortunately, No. I don't have any numbers from these blowers to play around with. I see you have a thread posted on this. Maybe Mike H. has some info for you.

Did you save any of the old blowers that you swapped out?


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## hnkstang50 (Jan 22, 2011)

j-takeman said:
			
		

> hnkstang50 said:
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Yea. I sent one back. I took one apart and one is still together. I'm hoping Mike can help.  This noise is so frustrating.


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## SmokeyTheBear (Jan 22, 2011)

hnkstang50 said:
			
		

> j-takeman said:
> 
> 
> 
> ...



A hint perhaps if you gave those numbers to Jay maybe he could find something sorta like, maybe.


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## GARY24NASCAR (Feb 5, 2011)

When I called Fasco a while ago they stated there was NO replacement for the blower I have. Maybe the specific person I spoke with was incorrect. I've found no c-shape or open type replacement anywhere. I haven't used the stove until a couple of weeks ago when I paid for oil again and said screw it I'll suffer through the noise. If I twiddle with the blower control I can sometimes catch it at a point where it is much less noisy. However, this is a royal pain in the arse toying with a sweet spot...still loud. I'll call Fasco again this coming week. The other possible replacement (for me)  I figured to not bother with. It wasn't one of the c-shape / open style and I refuse to order 1 of these (or more)  normal blowers every year. I just want to find 1 replacement that will definitely resolve the issue and be done with all this crap. Thanks folks for all your efforts to date.
Gary


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