# Wood Cook Stove (w/Oven)



## WhatIsChazaq (Aug 12, 2010)

Here's what we want to do...pull out a section of cabinets and the piece of crap gas stove and build in a solid hearth and shielding...then install a wood cook stove with oven to heat the house and cook on during the colder months.  We have a full outdoor kitchen where I'm getting ready to build an outdoor cook stove/oven for use in the summer.

I've looked at a bunch on-line, like the Baker's Pride, Pioneer Princess, etc...but the clearance requirements are HUGE (between 25" and 36" to the rear, mostly 25" to the sides).  Anyone know of any with closer clearance requirements?  Oh...and for less than $2,500??  A nice option would be a water reservoir and/or a water coil for heating water in a holding tank...


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## begreen (Aug 12, 2010)

Yes, woodstoves need safe margins. Can a wallshield be used to reduce clearances in your location? Maybe look at the Heartland and Esse stoves? These folks might be able to suggest some options too:

Use this link: http://tinyurl.com/25cvpjs, or copy and paste: "http://www.antiquestoves.com/general store/generalstore.index.htm"

and Tom sells some cookstoves:

http://www.chimneysweeponline.com


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## soupy1957 (Aug 12, 2010)

BeGreen: your first link there, gave me an "Error 404" message.  

My wife has been campaigning strongly for a kitchen "stove" (wood burning) ...........she's done a ton of research on them, from the point of view of an interested consumer.  I've been resisting her up to a point.  I was willing to (since I like the looks of them too, frankly), let her find and buy one, but not so willing to use it for cooking. Not because they wouldn't do the job, or anything like that.........just didn't find it advisable with my wife's "M.S." since she has limits in her physical ability and I'm not much of a cook.  I want to make the "cooking" chore as easy on her as I can, and using a wood stove requires a finesse or balancing act with the wood that adds more physical stuff to the chore (imho). 

Turns out that these stoves usually come in sections, first off.  These "sections" have to have some sort of special masonry cement to seal them, and apparently over time, they will need replacement of that cement.  Basically, it sounded to me like the cost of having a stove (renovated and 2nd hand is cheaper than a "new" one, if indeed there truly ARE any "new" ones around............after all, these were the working horses of 100 years ago, and are mostly prized for their ornate designs), like this, and the cost of maintaining a stove like this, was a bit unattractive.

When I put in my stand alone wood stove for heat (not cooking), I made sure there was at LEAST 5/8" Dry Wall behind it, and a masonry layer of brick on top of THAT, both for heat reflection as well as appearance and safety.  If I were truly going to install a kitchen COOK stove (wood heat fuel), I'd want a kitchen that had plenty of space available for a buffer.

Here's a short blurb from one of the websites we tapped into when WE were considering this item seriously: 

*"An antique wood-burning kitchen cook stove must be located a mimimum of 36 inches from unprotected woodwork and other combustible materials or furniture. The addition of a heat shield or other protective devices, to the wall or the stove, allows a reduction of those distances by 50% to a distance of 18 inches from a combustible wall and 9 inches from a noncombustible wall. The wood-burning stove needs to be vented. This is done through a class-A, double-walled chimney."*

http://www.goodtimestove.com/kitchen_ranges/victorian_cooking_ranges.html

P.S.: With regard to the link location........the wife and I are celebrating 32 years of marriage next week, so I'm going to surprise her with a visit to this particular stove store location (link)
and I'd be happy to give you a report on it, after the 21st, if you want.

-Soupy1957


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## Dakotas Dad (Aug 12, 2010)

soupy1957 said:
			
		

> BeGreen: your first link there, gave me an "Error 404" message.
> 
> -Soupy1957



Just as a note, copy and paste into your browser window the whole link, worked fine, good site.


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## begreen (Aug 12, 2010)

Updated post. Added a no spaces url link and instructions.


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## SteveKG (Aug 12, 2010)

Wood cookstoves are monsters...they take a while to heat up, but then they stay hot for a very long time. That is not necessarily a bad thing, except in the summer when I want to bake bread. 

Cooking on/in them is an art, but it is not difficult to learn. Patience and planning are necessary. Items cooked in the oven often must be turned regularly to bake evenly. With loaves of bread, I turn them every ten or fifteen minutes, depending on the bread. Pies, casseroles, etc., I might turn once in an hour. This just means you cannot safely go away and do something else outside or whatever unless you are willing to go back into the house every quarter hour. 

I don't see a problem for someone with MS. On the other hand, I don't have it and neither does my wife, so I am no expert. The only difference I can think using a wood range vs a gas/elec range is that the entire wood stove is hot, everything on it. Naturally you must be careful not to touch anything on the stove except the handles for the oven door(s). If MS or other restriction means a person is more apt to stumble against the stove...might be a problem. I don't know. 

My range has two sheet-metal layers outside the stove body on all sides but the front. (I mean, the stove was manufactured this way. It is a RAIS brand, and our model is no longer made. I don't know whether RAIS makes anything like this now. Our stove is rectangular and the RAIS stoves I've happened across in stove stores the past couple years are all cylindrical.) This gives two heat shields plus the air space between them allows air to rise in the envelope and I can have the stove within a foot or less from combustibles. We have a kitchen stool on one side of the stove about four inches away and it remains cool. So there are some stoves out there built like that. The main limit to clearance is that the heat from the top of the stove can effect the wall behind it, and I have sheet steel bolted to the wall with an air space behind it beginning at the level of the top of the stove. 

However, the other posters are correct that most of the ranges I've seen do not have those heat shields. I had an old classic-style range in my previous cabin [rented and not my stove] but the wall behind it was of stone and it was no problem for the stove to be right up close to it. Also, it had a water heating reservoir on the side against the firebox, and that completely insulated that side, cool to the touch.


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## snowtime (Aug 13, 2010)

What you are looking for is an insulated cook stove. These are stoves usually insulated with rock wool and have very close clearances. The downside to this is they are just supplemental heaters. We have 2 cook stoves but they are not what you need .The PioneerMaid is a heat producer which needs lots of clearance but is a hell of a stove and its oven design means no turning of bake goods. The problem I see is cost. I know of no insulated stove for $2500 but then i have not made a search.  Good luck.


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## soupy1957 (Aug 13, 2010)

How M.S. can affect using a wood stove............M.S. affects different patients in different ways, but the commonly shared issues are typically, vision, manual dexterity, strength, and stamina.  When tending a fire, you need to be on your toes, watching for errant sparks, loading and shifting wood, etc. (some of the same issues when using a wood stove for heat).

Thus, "I" am the sole source of real tending of "the fire" regardless of what box it's in.  Ever try and cook a meal with someone underfoot?  Not only is it hard enough for her to cook a meal, start to finish, due to her M.S. (she's a wonderfully talented cook, who has had to give up a lot of that, due to her M.S.), but having "me" underfoot, trying to maintain the temp in a wood stove, would be logistically a nightmare for her in her wheelchair.

Nope.  For us.........if we had an Antique Cook Stove, it would purely be decorative.

I hope that helps you get a window into how "M.S." affects cooking with wood, or even "cooking" in general. 

On another note, I have to tell you that the wood stove used for heating, and the heat it generates, has brought her more winter comfort to her M.S., than the oil-fired furnace heat EVER did.  Emotionally AND physically.

-Soupy1957


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## cmonSTART (Aug 13, 2010)

My client yesterday afternoon had a beautifully restored Elmira cook stove.  They actually had it professionally restored and the chimney relined.  She actually used it too for both heat and cooking.  They're not the most efficient things in the world  but the do serve a purpose.


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## benjamin (Aug 13, 2010)

I saw a "Mora" on fleabay a while back, but I wasn't exactly looking for one and the reserve wasn't met...  

It was made by a company "Moravia"    http://www.kvs-ekodivize.cz/solid-fuel-appliances/cooking-stoves    It had a more modern style and may be something you'd be interested in, not that you'd ever find one again, but there may be something similar out there.


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## Burn-1 (Aug 15, 2010)

BeGreen said:
			
		

> Tom sells some cookstoves: http://www.chimneysweeponline.com



Tom has a pretty screaming deal on one of the Rolls Royce brands of solid fuel stoves, the Aga, $4,795 $1,500 off. With double wall pipe I think most of the Heartland stoves have close clearances and he has those on sale as well. They do have jackets and small reservoir options. Now it's not $2,500 but I would say worth the investment.  If I didn't owe the Uncle a bit extra on last year's taxes, I would be seriously looking at the Aga. The Esse Ironheart does have an option for a domestic water preheat but I'm not sure if this is available in the US.

We looked at a few others as well but there isn't as good a market for them here as there is in Europe and Australia. 

I enjoyed the Youtube videos done by Pivot Heat in Australia but it makes you jealous seeing what else is out there.

Waterford Stoves

Thermalux stoves, (Australian)

For your price range and desires you might try to find an older Tirolia. These were Austrian stoves imported in the 1970's and have a back boiler and insulated cooktop, back and sides.


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## WhatIsChazaq (Aug 15, 2010)

Burn-1 said:
			
		

> BeGreen said:
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I don't see the Aga on the site...is it maybe a floor model or in-store only model?


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## Burn-1 (Aug 15, 2010)

WhatIsChazaq said:
			
		

> I don't see the Aga on the site...is it maybe a floor model or in-store only model?



Link below. It's a Heartland badge but the stove is an AGA

AGA rebadged as Heartland

Heartland is one of the brands of the AGA Rangemaster group.


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## SteveKG (Aug 15, 2010)

Burn-1 said:
			
		

> WhatIsChazaq said:
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According to the web site, with double-walled pipe the clearances get down in the range of 3" sides and back. Not counting heat from the cooktop. That is pretty good. 

Also, again reading from the link above, trucking is free to a terminal, and that has to be worth as much as $400. 

Someone we know in England bought one and paid about $6000. This was maybe ten years ago, and was not this model but an Aga. So that is a really decent price.

Anyone know someone who's baked/cooked with an Aga?? I would like to hear how they do. I know they are popular in upscale homes, but I don't know whether that's because they bake well or look so cool.


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## SteveKG (Aug 16, 2010)

I became inspired to do some searching on the web last night, and what I read was that Aga bought the Heartland Co. in Canada. The story is, they took Heartland's woodstove knowledge and used it to come up with an Aga wood-fired cookstove. So, it has the classic Aga look. For what it's worth. 

I also saw these stoves [The Heartland-Aga Artisan model] advertised a few other places for prices in the low- to mid-$6000s, plus trucking. So for less than $5000 shipped, decent savings. Of course, it is still a boatload of money.

What I can say is that using a poorly-designed wood cookstove is a misery, a good one is a true pleasure unless one wants very quickly heated ovens and cooktops [often you'll need one to two hours to get the oven up to desired temp unless you are just warming up leftovers, 450 degrees you need to think more toward that 2-hr time.] I doubt one would find a brand-new cookstove of the good-design variety for less than maybe $2500. Probably more. Our RAIS was $3500 almost 20 yr ago, list price. We found one for a lot less as the co. quit making them and wanted them gone from inventory, but it was still a lot of bucks. But I haven't bought a loaf of bread in years.....

As far as heating the kitchen, I've never used a wood cookstove that didn't pour out the heat, regardless whether it was any good for baking.


Edit: I just rec'd an email from ChimneySweeponline and stand corrected. Apparently the Artisan is not a new stove but is, indeed, a rebadged stove from one of the Aga sister lines in England. Goes to show, again, not everything one gets off the Internet is entirely accurate.


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## WhatIsChazaq (Aug 17, 2010)

Oh gee thanks folks...now y'all got my wife and I in love with a $5k stove (Heartland Artisan)!!

What can I rework in my budget....

dog food for the next month?  :-/  :shut:


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## fraxinus (Aug 17, 2010)

Here's another possibility: Bryant Stove Works in Thorndike ME (www.bryantstove.com) has an amazing collection of fully restored antique cook stoves (and other types) for sale. I haven't been there for some time, but they have been in the stove restoration business for many years and their website has some beautiful stoves for sale. Thorndike is a trek from CT, but far from impossible. Bryant also ships and their prices seem to me very reasonable.


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## WhatIsChazaq (Aug 17, 2010)

It's not quite around the corner from Southern Missouri!


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## firefighterjake (Aug 17, 2010)

fraxinus said:
			
		

> Here's another possibility: Bryant Stove Works in Thorndike ME (www.bryantstove.com) has an amazing collection of fully restored antique cook stoves (and other types) for sale. I haven't been there for some time, but they have been in the stove restoration business for many years and their website has some beautiful stoves for sale. Thorndike is a trek from CT, but far from impossible. Bryant also ships and their prices seem to me very reasonable.



Plus you could stop by and say hi to me . . . I live next door (well one town over) from Joe and Bea . . . they're good people.


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## Burn-1 (Aug 17, 2010)

Good Time Stove Company in Goshen, MA is another specialty store however, with stores like this and the one that Frax mentioned you're paying a certain amount for the antique value as much as you are for the functionality of the cookstove. 

I say go for the AGA. If you peek around some of the UK back to the land/sustainability sites you will find a number of AGA and Rayburn users.  Do a Google search like "our Rayburn" or "our AGA" domain:.uk

That should give you some more feedback. Good luck.


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## fraxinus (Aug 17, 2010)

Sorry, WhatIsChazaq. I seem to have confused your home state with Soupy1957's. At any rate, Bryant Stove Works has some very good looking kitchen stoves on their website in the $1500 to $2000 dollar range. There's a $170 crating fee and then what ever the freight charges would be for a very heavy item. Still, with new Agas in the $4000 and up range, one of these old stoves would certainly seem to be price competitive even with shipping.


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## WhatIsChazaq (Aug 23, 2010)

Just found what looks like a really good deal on a used Heartland Oval 1903.  Driving down to take a look at it Tuesday morning.  Has the heat shield so rear clearances are 8", right side is 10.  This might work, but it's huge.  I'd have to take an army with me to load it and I'd be removing part of a half wall to install it.


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## soupy1957 (Aug 23, 2010)

"Antique Wood-Burning Kitchen Cook Stove:
An antique wood-burning kitchen cook stove must be located a mimimum of 36 inches from unprotected woodwork and other combustible materials or furniture. The addition of a heat shield or other protective devices, to the wall or the stove, allows a reduction of those distances by 50% to a distance of 18 inches from a combustible wall and 9 inches from a noncombustible wall. The wood-burning stove needs to be vented. This is done through a class-A, double-walled chimney."


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## WhatIsChazaq (Aug 23, 2010)

Install clearances for the Heartland Oval:

http://www.chimneysweeponline.com/chtoval.htm

...and here is the actual user and install manual from Heartland:
http://www.heartlandapp.com/GetFile.ashx?idFile=15


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## begreen (Aug 23, 2010)

I got a close look at a Heartland Oval at a local artist's house. It looks like a very fine stove. I would love to have one of them, but it is a big fellow. Congratulations on your find!


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## WhatIsChazaq (Aug 23, 2010)

How do you like that Alderlea?  I just saw them for the first time on-line today...I think we're going to put one in my mother's house (to be built by Christmas I hope)?

The Heartland Oval I found...is only two years old and the lady is asking $1,250 - that's a smoking deal I think.


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## begreen (Aug 23, 2010)

Awesome deal. I am really curious how the stove works out for you. Keep us posted.

The Alderlea has turned out to be a winner. It's exceeded our expectations. The stove is easy to run, low maintenance and works over a wide temperature range. We particularly like the residual heat that gets stored up in all the cast iron. The stove emits a very even warmth. It only radiates from the front. That keeps our house comfortable without overheating the living room. Even if the fire has died down because of a smaller fire, the heat pump often doesn't come on in the morning and the stove is still warm to the touch. That said, the ash pan is a waste. We don't use it at all. But the firebox is deep and has a generous front lip, so it is not a bother. But it would be nice for PE to offer the stove at a lower price without it.


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## WhatIsChazaq (Aug 25, 2010)

There it is.

I now have to figure out how to move all 640 pounds of it to our place.

Here is a blog post showing where it will be installed:
http://www.slowbellyfarm.com/2010/08/wood-cook-stove.html

Or...here is a shot of where it's going:





Any ideas on how to move this beast?  I called a local rental place and the guy suggested a piano dolly with a hydraulic drop bed trailer ($75 for the day for both).  Problem with the piano dolly is the water reservoir side.  The legs are recessed because of the water reservoir on the right side, so getting a dolly under the legs is impossible.


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## begreen (Aug 25, 2010)

Nice! It looks brand new. I'd look at removing as many parts as possible. Does the reservoir detach from the main stove body? Doors, griddle covers, the warming back, (hotwater tank?), etc. That should get it down to where 4 strong guys, one on each corner, can move it. Then maybe put a sheet of 3/4 plywood bolted to an appliance dolly to move it?

How much cabinetry is being removed besides the stove in the kitchen? It looks like it's going to take some surgery to install it in that location. 

Here's a shot of the one I saw locally. It had lots of room to breathe.


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## WhatIsChazaq (Aug 25, 2010)

I don't know if the reservoir is removable, it's 3:15am here and I just woke up saying to my wife "I figured it out!  I designed a way to do it in my sleep!"  I hate when the sleeping me is smarter then the awake me.

So I'm sitting here on the couch sketching it out...and it should only take two to move.  This will require many pics!

...as for the where it's going, yes it will require LOTS of surgery!  Removing cabinets, part of the wall, building a non-combustible alcove and hearth pad, etc, etc.  I have to get up into the attic and make sure there are no obstructions above that part of the kitchen.


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## soupy1957 (Aug 25, 2010)

Very nice!  We await the arrival of OUR Antique Cooking Stove by the end of September, once the restoration work is complete.  I've explained to the wife that we'd have to undergo an ADDITIONAL renovation to our already recently renovated home, in order to actually COOK on it, but it will be fully ready to do that, should we want to.

Been doing lots of investigation thru a variety of sources, to learn more about the particular foundry that ours came from (Boston Stove Foundry Company, of Reading, Massachusetts) and have learned a little about the stove.  We've got more digging to do, but it isn't as easy as you might think, to come up with data in this case.  

-Soupy1957


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## SteveKG (Aug 25, 2010)

The heat shield/warming shelf should be easily removeable and prevent damage to them if you screw up and the stove tips to one side or something. A few bolts. 

I can't imagine the water reservoir would be terribly difficult to remove, again some bolts. 

The grate, etc., should pop right out for cleaning, so take them out. The doors, I don't know. I've removed the doors from two different cookstoves for some repairs and they were not difficult. At least on those two stoves.

I actually completely disassembled a stove similar to this one for rebuilding, couple parts were broken inside. It was a lot of work, but it was a matter of removing a BUNCH of stovebolts. They were covered with years of soot and some had rust. Lots of WD-40 and patience. 

But if it were me, I'd remove the back shield and shelf, any doors I could, the reservoir, and the grate. That is about 5% + of the total weight, so not a really big help, but some. Plus, any door handles are then out of danger of being broken off. Plus, you do not want to bent or dent the back shield, any damage will show forever. 

I have installed two cookstoves in my house, removing the first one, all by myself. By hand. It was work, but I did it ok, and I am no strongman. I used heavy plywood or boards beneath the feet of the stoves and rolled the thing across 3" steel pipe pieces. I put cardboard and plywood down on the wood floor for the pipe to roll across. I suppose an appliance mover sort of thing might do just as well and be easier than moving the pipes back to front. But I am a lightweight and had no trouble actually moving the stoves once they were up on the boards. I got them up by carefully lifting one end, then the other, with a five-foot pry bar, though anything like that will work. Put some cardboard, or whatever, between the prybar and stove so you don't chip off any enamel, if appropriate. 

Getting the stove off my pickup, with, unfortunately, and uphill slant out of the truck bed onto my patio...I used longer 2 x 10 boards [tailgate removed from the truck so it would not be bent]. I hooked up a come-along to the pallet the stove was on and slowly cranked it out, onto the boards, down the boards to the patio. I recommend doing this very, very slowly...took me a couple hours to do it, worried that if anything went wrong, I'd have 700 lb. of iron and steel coming down very hard. 

Worked great. A forklift would be nice, but not an option up here on my steep hillside and narrow driveway access. Just be sure to protect the floor and watch the door frame, etc. 

To move the stove a bit, to clean or check some stovepipe or whatever, I simply set a little piece of lumber beneath the stove and carefully use that long pry bar to scoot the stove out from the wall a few inches. Takes about three or four minutes. The lumber is to put the end of the pry bar on so it does not dent the floor.

By the way, for anyone looking for a wood cookstove, new or used or antique, the largest firebox you can get is your very good friend. Some gorgeous stoves have these tiny little fireboxes and you will be attending the fire several times an hour until the oven is heated up enough.


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## WhatIsChazaq (Aug 25, 2010)

That's awesome!

I did the exact same thing with our stove in Colorado...a Vermont Castings Encore.  Used the come-a-long to unload it by myself onto the front porch, then used it to pull it into the house and position it on the hearth.

I will remove everything that I can, just got an email back from Aga/Heartland support and the reservoir can't be removed.

Bummer.


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## SteveKG (Nov 10, 2010)

Well, I completely blame this forum string for the fact that my wife and I decided to drop more cash than we could imagine and order an Aga Heartland Artisan cookstove from chimneysweeponline.com.  I had zero interest in switching stoves til I began following this thread and became fascinated with the Artisan. 

I ordered it 8 weeks ago and the update is that it will be at least 3 more weeks. Meanwhile, I moved the Rais out into our greenhouse [attached room, so we can still get good use from it] and am now baking out in...the greenhouse. Of course, I was excited and immediately after ordering I began to relocate the old stove. Now, with this long delay, it is winter here and no heat in the kitchen. Oh, well, the greenhouse opens into the kitchen so I can crank up the Rais and keep it decent enough in the kitchen. 

Anyhow, I shall be happy to report further once the Aga arrives. I must figure a way to move the 850 lb. thing off my truck and up onto a porch and so on. I have an idea. A friend will loan me the "forklift"-type attachments for my tractor bucket and that will help. That and a heavy ramp of 2 x 10s will...maybe...do the trick. I will be working alone, so.....


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## WhatIsChazaq (Nov 10, 2010)

850lbs for an Aga!  That's a beast.

I have to gather and post some more pics.  The Oval is fully installed and working!  The part you'll find most interesting is how I managed to move it.

I built crate of sorts for it, then used piano dollies on either end after carefully lifting it onto the crate I built...then we (two other guys) and I were able to very easily load it onto a trailer with a hydraulic bed.  The trailer was $70 for a full day and worth EVERY penny.  The entire bed of the trailer dropped via hydraulics almost perfectly flat to the ground.

Check around with major equipment rental companies in your area...most use them to load and transport scissor lifts because they drop so low to the ground.  Check out this site, you'll get an idea of what I'm talking about...it was THE key for picking up the Oval, driving it 100 miles to the house and unloading it.  It was ridiculously easy!

Lift-A-Load Trailers

Your local rental place might not have the exact same trailer, but I'll bet you can find one similar in function.


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## WhatIsChazaq (Nov 10, 2010)

...actually this model was closer to the trailer I rented:

Low Rise Trailers


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## roddy (Nov 11, 2010)

any new news on the cookstove soupy.....
rod


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## WhatIsChazaq (Nov 21, 2010)

Second firing under way!  First firing showed a few leaks, ended up with a fair amount of smoke in the house.  Sealed it up today and she's burning really nice right now.

Oven is sitting at about 500 degrees in this pic from a few hours ago!


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## begreen (Nov 21, 2010)

Wow, she's beautiful. 500F in the oven?! Bring out the pizza!


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