# gassifers are too much work



## fishman (Mar 2, 2009)

I have a EKO 40 1000 pressurized tank (can,t get temp above 120 maybe piping to small) but that is just the start of all the problems with these things. wood must be small in diameter and 20 inches long (more handling) and it will still bridge and shut down boiler.causing the need to open the door and stir the wood while letting out huge amounts of smoke.They call these indoor units thank God i didn't listen to my guys and put this thing in my basement i would not be able to use it.I put on garage constantly open doors to let smoke out and flue pipe drips water.People that sell this junk say no smoke when gassifing mine smokes all the time, i adjusted air inlet , fan speed everything you can do still smokes. I bought this thing thinking i wont use as much wood compared to a OWB wrong again and i own 100 + acres of Ohio hardwood stupid move should have bought OWB chuck wood in an forget about this thing is a full time job to keep running right. anyone interested in buying this thing i will sell every piece part pumps piping tanks and what ever else i can find assosiated with this thing  for $6K over 11k invested call me 330-583-3604 got go stir the wood


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## Eric Johnson (Mar 2, 2009)

How long have you been using the boiler, fishman?

Sounds to me like your wood is not dry.

Have you tried turning dry wood (like old pallet wood or something that you know is very dry)? It makes a big difference.

Do you get gasification in the lower chamber?


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## fishman (Mar 2, 2009)

first year and my wood is dry and ihave burned pallet wood still smokes


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## fishman (Mar 2, 2009)

it does gasify but wood always bridges


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## fishman (Mar 2, 2009)

I have $500.00 dollars worth of class a flue i will throw in


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## WoodNotOil (Mar 2, 2009)

It sounds to me like you also may not have enough stove pipe for draft if you are getting a lot of smoke when you open the door.  It sounds like your setup needs some troubleshooting and perhaps you need drier wood.  Is this a new install?  If your storage is starting out really cold, it takes many fires over several days before the system gets up to temp.  Add to that the heat load required when it is cold for the house and that would be a frustrating situation.  We have troubleshooted a lot of systems here in the boiler room, but will need lots of info on your install to do it.  Sounds like you are most of the way to a good system, just need to work out the bugs a little.  Tell us about your house, heat delivery, and piping arrangements and give us a chance to help you out.  I have a Tarm and love it.  I burn only wood year round and have overcome a lot of hurdles to get my system running correctly over the last few years.


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## sdrobertson (Mar 2, 2009)

WoodNotOil said:
			
		

> It sounds to me like you also may not have enough stove pipe for draft if you are getting a lot of smoke when you open the door.  It sounds like your setup needs some troubleshooting and perhaps you need drier wood.  Is this a new install?  If your storage is starting out really cold, it takes many fires over several days before the system gets up to temp.  Add to that the heat load required when it is cold for the house and that would be a frustrating situation.  We have troubleshooted a lot of systems here in the boiler room, but will need lots of info on your install to do it.  Sounds like you are most of the way to a good system, just need to work out the bugs a little.  Tell us about your house, heat delivery, and piping arrangements and give us a chance to help you out.  I have a Tarm and love it.  I burn only wood year round and have overcome a lot of hurdles to get my system running correctly over the last few years.



I'll echo all the posts above and add that your actually really close to having it work.  Give the folks here a chance and they should get you up and running.  Winter is almost over and if you still want to sell it, you should have no problem in the fall for the same amount of money or more depending on the economy.


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## Eric Johnson (Mar 2, 2009)

I don't think we've ever "lost" anyone. People have had similar problems in the past, and I think we've eventually got them sorted out.

Bridging can be minimized by changing your fuel loading procedure and the way you stack your wood in the firebox. Water coming out of the exhaust pipe can only mean one thing: wet wood.


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## fishman (Mar 2, 2009)

thanks for your reply but from what i se only a hand full of guys have success with these and even they have to admit these boilers require constant attention
 i would like to hear non bais opinions from people like me (not gettin paid)


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## sdrobertson (Mar 2, 2009)

fishman said:
			
		

> I have a EKO 40 1000 pressurized tank (can,t get temp above 120 maybe piping to small)



I'd start with not getting it above 120.  These like to run above 160 to really get going well.  How's it plumbed so we can figure out why its not burning hot.

**edit**-I'm not getting paid - I went from a Central Boiler to EKO and had my share of problems but they are workable and when its fix - you'll be truly amazed.


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## fishman (Mar 2, 2009)

I have over twenty feet of flue and it is above my roof line i heated the storage for weeks house has baseboard and is about 2300 sQ ft well insulated


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## Eric Johnson (Mar 2, 2009)

Nobody getting paid here, that I'm aware of. And I think there are more than a handful of satisfied gasifier users, including all the major brands.


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## WoodNotOil (Mar 2, 2009)

I have no connection with the heating industry at all!  I have a nearly uninsulated 1800 sq ft. house in northern VT and a Tarm 30 100k btu boiler.  I start a fire in the morning before work.  Go to work all day.  Come home and light another fire at around 6pm.  Then I refill at 10pm before bed.  I have 1000 gallon unpressurized storage.  With this procedure my household is never cold, I have enough DHW, even with my wife and three children home all day and the thermostats around 68*.  I burn about 10 cords a year and do not burn any oil at all.  This includes year round DHW.  My usage will drop significantly when I blow insulation in the walls.  There was lambs wool on tar paper that resembled fiberglass batting put in the walls in the late 40s when the house was built that has fallen to about knee level.  As you can imagine my house has a lot of heat loss.

Your system can work and you are not being sweet talked on this forum by heating guys with a vested interest.


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## fishman (Mar 2, 2009)

piping from boiler to storage is from the famous cozy heat drawing 1.4 inch on boiler 1 inch pex to storage about 20 feetaway


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## sdrobertson (Mar 2, 2009)

Are you using any cold water protection?  What temp is the water going into the boiler?  If the water coming out is only 120 then you somehow have to slow the water down as the boiler needs to stay warm as then you can turn down the air and then adjust the settings back to the recommended settings to start getting good gasification and prevent the bridging.


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## fishman (Mar 2, 2009)

the boiler gets hot but wont heat storage


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## fishman (Mar 2, 2009)

danfoss 3 way mixing value


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## WoodNotOil (Mar 2, 2009)

We need more details.

Do you have a danfoss or termovar return protection?
Please supply a link to the piping layout or a description of it.
Can heat go directly to zones from the Eko or do they only come off of storage?  Are you heating a fossil boiler in series?  What is your backup heat source?
Are your lines to storage insulated?
What size pump to storage?
What control for heating storage are you using?


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## fishman (Mar 2, 2009)

does allthe idling do to bridging cause condensation in flue


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## fishman (Mar 2, 2009)

forget storage i just want this thing to haet my house this year then i am going to throw it away if nobody want to buy it a buy OWB


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## fishman (Mar 2, 2009)

whats the fix for the bridging


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## WoodNotOil (Mar 2, 2009)

Try following the procedure Nofo outlines here https://www.hearth.com/econtent/index.php/forums/viewthread/27273/ . 

The only condensation I know of in the flue comes from the wood being too wet.  What type of wood are you burning?  How long has it seasoned?  Have you ever checked it with a moisture meter?


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## fishman (Mar 2, 2009)

all hardwoods 2 years no


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## jebatty (Mar 2, 2009)

> ... from what i see only a hand full of guys have success with these and even they have to admit these boilers require constant attention.



I sympathize with the issues you are facing, but I can't agree with your assertion, and I would submit that the far majority of gasification boiler users are extremely satisfied. I have used an indoor wood stove in our house for 19 heating seasons, have used a traditional OWB for my shop for 9 years, and now have used the Tarm for two years for the shop. I just talked to my wife about doing a Tarm install for the house for a couple of very big reasons: it is easier, safer, and produces more heat while burning less wood than the other wood burners, and it normally requires not more than one fueling per day (two on very cold days, that is , below 0F), which is in far contrast to the fueling every couple of hours for the wood stove and at least two massive fuelings per day for the OWB to get 24/7 heat.

My gut tells me that you likely have one or more fairly simple problems that a knowledgeable person could spot and provide advice to solve. My gut also tells me that, while pros can do improper installs or make mistakes also, a homeowner without experience doing an install is likely to commit a host of mistakes, adding up to $1000 and more to fix, and possibly resulting in the problems of a type you are experiencing. I made plenty of mistakes, some costly ones, but at least I did get heat right away, so I knew I was on the right track. I am still fixing mistakes. This is not the Tarm's fault but mine because I didn't know what I was doing. All fault lies with me.

I suggest hiring a boiler pro, as except for the return water protection, chimney and draft, and primary and secondary air settings, a gasification install is materially identical to a natural gas or LP boiler install. At least determine that this is done correctly. Search out other hands on advice from other gasifier users in your area, and I bet you can solve your problems rather quickly and hopefully inexpensively.


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## Nofossil (Mar 2, 2009)

Take a deep breath......

There are many of us here who don't benefit financially from these things, myself included. They work really well - that's why we spend the time and effort to share what we've learned.

There are at least a couple of things wrong. If you fix them, life will be MUCH better. I've never had a problem heating my house or my storage with my EKO 25, so I'm confident that you will get good results once your problems are figured out and solved.

There are a few common problems. I don't know which if any apply in your case, but it's good to rule them out:

1) Wood that's too wet. Oak needs 2 years of drying time after being cut and split. Most other woods require a full year. If you get dramatically better results with wood that's truly dry, then moisture is part of your problem. I recommend (as others mentioned above) burning a load of pallet 2x4 pieces.

2) Badly wrong primary or secondary air flow. Some units ship from the factory with the wrong settings. There is a sticky at the top that has some good discussion.

3) Running with the bypass damper open (or not tightly closed)

4) Incorrectly functioning inlet protection, resulting in reduced flow

5) Plumbing errors

To start with, are you getting a clean blue flame with a subdued roar in the secondary chamber? If not, you're running a very expensive traditional boiler instead of a gasifier. In that case, we need to figure out why you're not getting secondary combustion. 

Is the boiler getting up to temp and idling while the storage stays cold? In that case, we need to look at the inlet protection, circulators, and plumbing layout. As long ast the storage is below 160 or so, the boiler should never idle.

I suspect that there are one or two things which will make all the difference.

By the way, I look at the small wood requirement this way: I use about 1/3 as much wood as an OWB to produce the same heat. If that means I have to split the wood to 1/3 the size, then I'm handling the same number of pieces. They're just lighter and don't take up as much space.


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## Duetech (Mar 2, 2009)

fishman,
By experience I have found wood that has been cut for two years does not mean it is dry. Gasifiers really shine with dry wood. Another thing I have found is ash build up around the nozzle will cause a lot of bridging. The ash build up is usually accelerated by above moisture wood. It still burns but adds char and ash around the nozzle and prevents good burning and seldom gets good and hot until it gets dry enough. If it starts bridging before you get it dry enough you will have a hard time getting good heat. My EKO40 is in an unheated outbuilding and I don't have storage and my very old home is heated via an air heat exchanger in an old oil furnace. I get 8-12 hour burns but I went through some stuff to get there but in essence I use my EKO like it is an OWB. Just for heat purposes, and if you could, I would bypass the storage and see if the boiler will heat your home.


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## Eric Johnson (Mar 2, 2009)

I second the idea of bypassing the storage. It's just an added complexity that gets in the way of troubleshooting the basic system.


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## Tree farmer (Mar 2, 2009)

hold on fishman, once you figure out the issue you will be happy.  I will say I have had condensation as well and it is a combo of wet wood and low burn temps and outside chimney.   you should not get bridging even with higher mc wood, what are your split sizes?  Too big of splits right on the bottom I found makes for bridging but rarely have the issue. Listen to the well seasoned above they will get you through it.


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## fishman (Mar 2, 2009)

i have bypassed the storage i gave up on that in november the bioler heated the house fine until a very cold spell in january  thats when the bridging started i reduced the fan speed to 60 percent  and closed the  primaries to 12mm worked better now its doing worse bridging every hour it is gasifing but have a hard time getting up to temp i only cut standing dead from 100+ acres i know my wood is dry Jim cant find anyone (heating pro) that will work on these biolers the install is fine except piping needs to be larger diameter to storage because the flow has to be cut way back just to maintain flow from boiler


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## fishman (Mar 2, 2009)

my flame is mostly orange i have been burning for 40 minutes just to try and heat my supply line to the house i have circ in house off and have to repeat this process many times aday when i turn circ in house on the boiler loses 40-50 degrees turn circ off and repeat process ready to throw the whole thing away


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## fishman (Mar 2, 2009)

and will not catch up even if i burn allday


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## fishman (Mar 2, 2009)

tree farmer i split my wood into toothpicks so at least i save on that expense


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## fishman (Mar 3, 2009)

boiler run for 14 hours and never got temp up to 170 and gassed the whole time except for some bridging


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## WoodNotOil (Mar 3, 2009)

You may need more secondary air.  The flame should not be just yellowish orange.  It should be slightly bluish, but not too long.  Sounds like your circ may also be moving too much water to the house.  Also, your danfoss should keep the return water above the 140-160* range which it doesn't sound like it is happening.  That way the boiler should remain above the danfoss setting so long as there is still fuel to burn.  In cold weather you will see the exhaust from the boiler, but it will be mostly white like steam.  If it is dark gray, then full gasification isn't happening and you need to adjust the air.


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## Duetech (Mar 3, 2009)

fishman,
I have known frustration with my EKO40 as well. Have you cleaned inside of the primary (loading) chamber around the nozzle? We were at 0 this morning and I wasn't happy with my boiler output but I also had a deep compacted ash build up around the nozzle and the over all temp had been turned down. I have the older controller and it doesn't allow you to set it as high as the newer controller will go. That was a dum-me on my part as well as the congested build up around the nozzle. I cleaned the nozzle area and got about a bucket of char and ash and the boiler is once again gassin' and up to temp. I burn more wood when it is not dry than when it is dry. When you say your boiler gets up to temp what temp do you have?


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## sandman59 (Mar 3, 2009)

This is my first year burning my 40 and can testify about the dry wood making a big difference. I had only enough dry wood to last until the middle of January.   I then had to burn oak that was cut and split late last summer.  I had to make adjustments - start splitting the oak to smaller splits and had to open up the primary and secondary air setting.  I mix the oak with some dry slab wood but the majority is the oak.  I get lots of heat, but my burn time is reduced and my ash content is increased.  I also have to watch how I stack in the wood since it bridges more easily.  Another adjustment I recently made was to give the boiler more time to get up to temperature before shutting down on the "Fuel" setting.  I am so looking forward to burning all next season with dry wood.  I have a lot of maple already cut and will add some cherry this weekend.


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## EricV (Mar 3, 2009)

fishman said:
			
		

> thanks for your reply but from what i se only a hand full of guys have success with these and even they have to admit these boilers require constant attention
> i would like to hear non bais opinions from people like me (not gettin paid)



I don't think anyone here is getting paid for anything.  I certainly am not and I love my boiler.  I have a Tarm but basically the same technology as yours and I love it.  I start it when I get home from work (15 minutes tops)  then 2 more time before bed (less than 5 minutes including walking to the room where it is).

If ti is below 0 I might start a fire int he am but always.


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## Huskurdu (Mar 3, 2009)

EricV said:
			
		

> fishman said:
> 
> 
> 
> ...



I have had some the same issues as you in the past.  My EBW-150 was hardly keeping up with the house demand, let alone trying to heat the 500 gallon storage!.   I went through 25 or so face cord this winter so far!  Way more than I should have had to.  I hope to cut that almost in half next year with a properly set up boiler and dry wood.  Piker and Pyber helped me out with secondary air adjustment and I have installed a barometric damper.  These two things have helped greatly, but the biggest thing I did was to find some dry wood.  I know they're beating you up over it, but please buy a $30 moisture gauge and check that wood that you are burning.  I have put in some dry elm and apple this weekend and it made a HUGE difference.  Before that, my boiler would run all day and not get up to the 180 degree setting.  The house would take all of the heat.  I not only got the boiler up to temp (180 degrees), but I was actually able to store some of the heat.  I've got a long way to go, but with they're help, I hope to heat my DHW well into the late spring/early summer.

np


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## Birdman (Mar 3, 2009)

I have to chime in. I have a Tarm 40. When I first started it up... I was scared. I had condensation in the flue pipe for the first week. It was constantly dripping moisture. For some reason... it stopped after that. All my wood was the same.. it was not extremely dry.. but it was not green either. Why this happened.. i don't know. There were other small issues that occured in the beginning.. but they all had anwers... and I am so pleased with my decision to buy the Tarm. I have it in my basement along with the remaining wood from the is year. I have used 5 cord so far. 64 to 70 in my house all year.... and have used tons of free hot water. SO glad i never bought that OWB. Well... on ht eother hand.. the new CB gasifier does look good... however... still happy with my choice.


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## Northwoodsman (Mar 3, 2009)

Fishman,

I sympathize with you on your hardship and just left you a voicemail.

I am traveling to Pennsylvania in a few days to attend a funeral and would be more than happy to stop by on my way home, help you disassemble your EKO 40 system and take it off the hands.

Please contact me thru my website at www.upnorthenergy.com 

NWM


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## stee6043 (Mar 3, 2009)

Northwoodsman said:
			
		

> Fishman,
> 
> I sympathize with you on your hardship and just left you a voicemail.
> 
> ...



Hey North, if you drive through Grand Rapids on your way home I'll buy the controllor and perhaps the refractories off you for spares!  We can part this beast out.

Fish, I hope you get your EKO running soon.  I brought my EKO 40 with 1000 gallons online at the end of December this past year.  My startup seemed to go much more smoothly than you're experiencing.  My biggest challenge for the first week was getting my storage up to temp.  Throttling down your bypass loop ball valve is absolutely critical to heat your storage for the first time.  My ball valve stays about 85% closed at all times....


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## sfriedri (Mar 3, 2009)

Fishman,

I can see how you could get frustrated with the problems you are having.

During the first month of using my EKO40 I was having severe bridging problems, and only by splitting my wood down to a very small diameter (<3") did the bridging go away.  However, I also did one simple modification to my EKO that nearly eliminated the bridging problem with larger splits.  Some of the older EKO's do not have this, but since your's is new it may have the same issue as my EKO.  My EKO came with two metal protectors that are located along the side walls of the primary chamber above the top outside edge of the nozzle refractory.  These metal pieces significantly narrow the passage for wood to drop into the nozzle area, and all my bridges were caused by hangups on these pieces.  If you have these pieces you should try removing them and see if that helps your bridging problem.

There is more info about this issue in this thread:  https://www.hearth.com/econtent/index.php/forums/viewthread/28868/

Good luck.


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## TimCroft (Mar 3, 2009)

Hey Burning Chunks,
Bridging was driving me nuts early on with my Tarm Excel.  I was loading up the firebox way too big and too early in the burn.  The coal bed was not deep enough to preheat the wood just above it and the embers depleted before before the next pieces were ready to burn in succession.  I discovered that building the fire small and then adding layers of increasing larger pieces over fifteen or twenty minutes helped to let a good hot gas burn result from a deep bed of coals.ls than gravity pushes it downward 

My tarm is not as happy with a full firebox as it is with one two thirds full.  the wood just tends to hang up when the weight of the wood above pushes the wood below as hard against the sides as it does downward.

I don't make money burning wood or selling equiptment but I sure have saved a bunch!


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## stee6043 (Mar 3, 2009)

fossilfree said:
			
		

> Hey Burning Chunks,
> Bridging was driving me nuts early on with my Tarm Excel.  I was loading up the firebox way too big and too early in the burn.  The coal bed was not deep enough to preheat the wood just above it and the embers depleted before before the next pieces were ready to burn in succession.  I discovered that building the fire small and then adding layers of increasing larger pieces over fifteen or twenty minutes helped to let a good hot gas burn result from a deep bed of coals.ls than gravity pushes it downward
> 
> My tarm is not as happy with a full firebox as it is with one two thirds full.  the wood just tends to hang up when the weight of the wood above pushes the wood below as hard against the sides as it does downward.
> ...



Amen, Fossilfree.  Another benefit to the small fire method you mentioned, at least for me, is less smoke.  If I have the time to load three or four times in a night instead of just twice I get an easier start and a much quicker bed of coals.  But if I have plans in the evening and I have to start my beast with a full firebox I typically toss in a firestarter (like you can buy at Menards) which helps insure I'll get gasification.  It just takes longer - say 40-50 minutes before I hit 160 and the smoke stops.  Compare this to 20 minutes or less with the smaller fires....


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## taxidermist (Mar 5, 2009)

hey fish where did ya go???? I know people that have tried to contact you by phone and no return calls. Is this still forsale????


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## Northwoodsman (Mar 5, 2009)

Fishman,

I'm heading to PA tonight so please let me know when I can stop by to purchase your system. I have emailed you and left you several messages but have not heard back from you.

Please contact me through my company website at www.upnorthenergy.com if your really/truley interested in selling you system.

Thanks ,

NWM


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## fishman (Mar 5, 2009)

i took my 44 mag and shot the thing full of holes


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## WoodNotOil (Mar 5, 2009)

fishman said:
			
		

> i took my 44 mag and shot the thing full of holes



Huh?  Maybe anger management is in order???


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## Eric Johnson (Mar 5, 2009)

We don't see many trolls on this board, but I'm starting to think that fishman might be one.


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## pybyr (Mar 5, 2009)

WoodNotOil said:
			
		

> fishman said:
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Does seem like a dubious way to achieve a return on an investment of this magnitude, even for a customer who is unhappy with a product!


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## rvtgr8 (Mar 5, 2009)

I think the way this thing is playing out smacks of deceit.  Could we be dealing with a frustrated OWB dealer who can't unload a yard full of "smokers" and was hoping to create the illusion of "gassifiers are too much work" for his prospective customers.  I think that scenario is just as plausible as someone shooting an expensive system "full of holes."  If he is legitimate, the behavior is reckless beyond comprehension.  What I learned from this thread is that the Boiler Room is filled with great people willing to stand up for a struggling stranger.  They offered hope in the face of accusations of self-interested motive.  The Boiler Room members have got to be some of the best people I have never met. ;-)


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## flyingcow (Mar 5, 2009)

rvtgr8 said:
			
		

> I think the way this thing is playing out smacks of deceit.  Could we be dealing with a frustrated OWB dealer who can't unload a yard full of "smokers" and was hoping to create the illusion of "gassifiers are too much work" for his prospective customers.  I think that scenario is just as plausible as someone shooting an expensive system "full of holes."  If he is legitimate, the behavior is reckless beyond comprehension.  What I learned from this thread is that the Boiler Room is filled with great people willing to stand up for a struggling stranger.  They offered hope in the face of accusations of self-interested motive.  The Boiler Room members have got to be some of the best people I have never met. ;-)



That's been my thought from the beginning. Something didn't smell right. Fishman had another post of the same type of question. Just somebody yanking our chain. Gonna happen once in a while.


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## willworkforwood (Mar 5, 2009)

A bit of bad fish isn't going to bother the Boiler Room - a quick trip to the crapper and it's gone :lol:


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## leaddog (Mar 6, 2009)

fishman said:
			
		

> i took my 44 mag and shot the thing full of holes



It would have been easier to have adj the primary air by moving the sliders. I don't think it helped the secondary air cause going thru two 1/4 in steel plates and 6in or so of fire brick might have stopped short that lead. 
You will have to get a larger pump for sure now and get a larger supply line. I'm sure there is someone here That can calculate the flow you will need.
Better yet there is a guy that makes furnaces That had all the answers A few days ago. His was cheaper, more efficiant, and had great thermal transfer as his was only 1/16 in thick. That would be easier to shoot holes in also. That wouldn't be you would it??????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????/
leaddog


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## fishman (Mar 6, 2009)

You guys are so gullable. An attempt to sell other products that gave me a laugh obviously those who thought this don't no much about business, one should never slander the competition it makes them look bad an is bad for that industry as a whole. I am in entertainment/ promotions and i would never slander anyone in my industry. My success comes from my ability( good bull shiter)  to prove why more people will come to my attraction versus my competition. If a business has used competition in the past first thing i do is praise them  for thinking of using an entertainment/promotion company to promote their business or event. Sorry enuff of business 101. My flue pipe was plugged with soot and ash probably from having fan at 100 percent and primaries opened half way, i did'nt reduce fan speed and close primaries until mid Jan. soot had collected about 4 feet up from bioler in a bend then fell down to the elbow right behind the bioler. 
 Thank you all for trying to help you are all a great group of (gullable) guys and your committment to these wood burning machines and the people using them 
is proof of your industrious nature. If you guys can figure these thing out you can do almost anything. Sorry if i pissed anyone off but i got your attention. 
P.S. I am starting to franchise my Patented fishing tanks guys like you that can fix anything are prime candidates for this venture. We are close to getting a large regional chain to hire us for shows in their parking lots and we are working on a national chain. any interest call me at 330-Fishing


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## leaddog (Mar 6, 2009)

Hey fishman, glad you got things working. Sorry if I started to think that you were playing with us. I agree that running down the competition is bad and I don't see much of that here. By and large most users here are very happy with what they have. All units have there pluses and minuses and each person has to evaluate his situation to get the right size and unit. There has only been a couple of brands that have been really badmouthed here and for good reason. We also like to bring out any outragious claims that are make and there has been alot of those. That said you will find that most here are REALLY wanting to help as we believe in these gasification boilers.
leaddog


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## taxidermist (Mar 7, 2009)

fishman said:
			
		

> You guys are so gullable. An attempt to sell other products that gave me a laugh obviously those who thought this don't no much about business, one should never slander the competition it makes them look bad an is bad for that industry as a whole. I am in entertainment/ promotions and i would never slander anyone in my industry. My success comes from my ability( good bull shiter)  to prove why more people will come to my attraction versus my competition. If a business has used competition in the past first thing i do is praise them  for thinking of using an entertainment/promotion company to promote their business or event. Sorry enuff of business 101. My flue pipe was plugged with soot and ash probably from having fan at 100 percent and primaries opened half way, i did'nt reduce fan speed and close primaries until mid Jan. soot had collected about 4 feet up from bioler in a bend then fell down to the elbow right behind the bioler.
> Thank you all for trying to help you are all a great group of (gullable) guys and your committment to these wood burning machines and the people using them
> is proof of your industrious nature. If you guys can figure these thing out you can do almost anything. Sorry if i pissed anyone off but i got your attention.
> P.S. I am starting to franchise my Patented fishing tanks guys like you that can fix anything are prime candidates for this venture. We are close to getting a large regional chain to hire us for shows in their parking lots and we are working on a national chain. any interest call me at 330-Fishing




I would call you but I bet you wont return calls


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## rvtgr8 (Mar 7, 2009)

Fish,

I too am happy that you have your system running.  The gullible part of this thread probably rests in my capable hands.  I think the operative phrase I used was, "smacks of," which is far short of an accusation.  Gullible members?  Maybe we are, but I prefer the term, "trusting!"  This group of people are saving me literally thousands of dollars on an install, helping me to learn a new aspect of self-sufficiency and more importantly, teaching me a little more about the word friendship.  I will wear the moniker you have bestowed upon us with some degree of pride.  When promoting your new product, and I wish you all the best, you would do well to peruse the threads on this site to learn just how far trust can get you.  My humble opinion, and mine alone.  Good luck and stay warm.

Robert


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## pybyr (Mar 7, 2009)

Well said, Robert- I am glad that the vast majority of folks here on Hearth in general and the boiler room in particular focus on positive things, and on helping each other.


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