# Stihl 180 vs. 181



## jdinspector (Dec 29, 2011)

I stopped in a stihl dealer today to look at saws. They had a nice display, but I noticed the 180 missing. The guy behind the counter said they had been discontinued, but did not know why. Does anyone know why? The jump from 170 to 181 is about $90.  Seems like a big jump for the same sized saw. Anyone?


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## HittinSteel (Dec 29, 2011)

sthillj's have gone strato in response to epa regulations. I agree on the price jump seeming high, but consumers will pay it, so why not charge it?

BTW, if the Stihl dealer does not know why the 180 was replaced by the 181, I would have serious reservations about buying a saw there unless he has the best prices and you plan to do all maintenance yourself.


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## DanCorcoran (Dec 29, 2011)

I've always heard that Stihl is the saw to buy because they have great dealers.  Sounds like I'd better research a great local dealer (Stihl, Husky, Echo, whatever) and then buy whatever they're selling.


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## jdinspector (Dec 30, 2011)

DanCorcoran said:
			
		

> I've always heard that Stihl is the saw to buy because they have great dealers.  Sounds like I'd better research a great local dealer (Stihl, Husky, Echo, whatever) and then buy whatever they're selling.


Yes, it seems that a dealer would be important to be on good terms with. This particular guy was filling in and did apologize for not knowing more. I would like to purchase from my local dealer, but he is $20-30 more than some others. I am going to ask the counterman if he'll match prices of other area dealers. Is it poor form to purchase a saw from one and service it elsewhere?


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## NH_Wood (Dec 30, 2011)

jdinspector said:
			
		

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I'd say not necessarily poor form, but you lose part of the relationship. I bought me Dolmar specifically because it was the best saw line that the best local dealer/shop had in my area. The guys are excellent mechanics and have done small repairs for no charge on my saw. I personally would spend $20-30 more on a saw if the dealer was known to be excellent to work with. Cheers!


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## jdinspector (Dec 30, 2011)

NH_Wood said:
			
		

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## Kenster (Dec 30, 2011)

Within reason, I'll always be glad to pay a little more to buy local and have a good, established relationship with a business.   I have a high school classmate that is a Ford Dealer.  Every time I traded vehicles I gave him a call.  He could save me, maybe $200-$300 but I would have to drive 600 miles one way to make the trade.  But I bought six vehicles from the same dealer in four years (four in  just one year.)   You think that dealership didn't treat me right?   The Service manager called me "The Stockholder" every time I drove in.  

I like buying local because I like to support my neighbors.  And I like that good relationship.  I wouldn't pay double to do that but don't 'mind paying a little more at the local store.


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## NextEndeavor (Dec 31, 2011)

I had a 180 for a short time, purchased primarily for limbing.  This task spends majority of time at half throttle plus lots of idling.  It needed more full throttle running than i was doing so kept fowling the plug and smoking a lot.  Stihl dealer recommended the new 211 for my needs.  I wanted to keep a smallish, lighter saw for wood less than 6 inches such as limbing.  I traded up to the 211 and very happy with it.  The past couple days I've worked next to a 025 and this 211 does more cutting on about half the fuel without the blue cloud of smoke.  I believe any of their saws ending with a "1" are the new low emission type claiming 70% less smoke.


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## CTYank (Dec 31, 2011)

NextEndeavor said:
			
		

> I had a 180 for a short time, purchased primarily for limbing.  This task spends majority of time at half throttle plus lots of idling.  It needed more full throttle running than i was doing so kept fowling the plug and smoking a lot.  Stihl dealer recommended the new 211 for my needs.  I wanted to keep a smallish, lighter saw for wood less than 6 inches such as limbing.  I traded up to the 211 and very happy with it.  The past couple days I've worked next to a 025 and this 211 does more cutting on about half the fuel without the blue cloud of smoke.  I believe any of their saws ending with a "1" are the new low emission type claiming 70% less smoke.



Huh? Any modern saw running 50:1 synthetic with a properly adjusted carb should show NO smoke once partly warmed up. NONE.

The latest generation 1-suffix model saws have stratified scavenging, licensed from Husqvarna, that greatly minimizes short-circuiting of air/fuel/oil mix from transfers out the exhaust. Smoke should be gone already, essentially.
It's about unburnt nasties going out the exhaust without getting the chance to burn and do work.


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## HittinSteel (Dec 31, 2011)

CTYank said:
			
		

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A Stihl Dealer with bad advice strikes again...... although selling a new 211 was good for business (and definite upgrade for the purchaser and a NICE saw).


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## MasterMech (Dec 31, 2011)

+1 on 50:1 producing minimal, if any, smoke.  Especially if tuned correctly and a high-quality oil is used.  

Yeah the price jump is significant from the old MS180 to the MS181.  The engines are a bit more complex to manufacture too.  Gonna miss that $199 MS180C.  Look around, dealers around here still have them on the shelf.

Pricing on any Stihl is left up to the dealer.  A given saw, with a given bar & chain combo, should be priced the same (DSRP is the same anyways) so long as it is in the same region.  There are several Stihl regional distributors and pricing usually is similar if not exactly even.  That said, if you request a different bar and/or chain, the pricing may be affected depending on how the dealer handles the swap.  If he's ordering the max recommended bar size and swapping it down for you, then his cost is probably higher than if he had just ordered the saw with the smaller bar to begin with.  Most Dealers IMO aim to please the customer.  The ones that are still in business anyways. ;-)

There is something wrong with that 025 if it's smoking heavily and getting out cut by a 211.  I'm guessing it needs an operator tune-up! ;-P


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## MasterMech (Dec 31, 2011)

HittinSteel said:
			
		

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Licensed from Husky? Any documentation to that effect? With their R & D department I highly doubt that's the case.  Hell, we're talking about a company (the ONLY company...) that manufactures their own cutting hardware (bars & chains) because they won't trust anybody's quality controls other than their own.


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## jdinspector (Jan 10, 2012)

Thanks for the help on this. I picked up a new 180 today. I splurged for the one with ez start. Seemed like a neat feature. Who knows? I may regret that splurge down the road, but today I'm happy.

The dealer was adament that I burn high octane gas that doesn't contain ethanol. I also went for the 2 year warranty and will be using the Stihl synthetic oil.

I hope to give it a try this coming weekend.


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## MasterMech (Jan 10, 2012)

jdinspector said:
			
		

> Thanks for the help on this. I picked up a new 180 today. I splurged for the one with ez start. Seemed like a neat feature. Who knows? I may regret that splurge down the road, but today I'm happy.
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> The dealer was adament that I burn high octane gas that doesn't contain ethanol. I also went for the 2 year warranty and will be using the Stihl synthetic oil.
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> I hope to give it a try this coming weekend.



I hope you didn't get sold on an extended warranty.  I think you're referring to the "double warranty" promo if you buy a six pack of Stihl HP Ultra oil right?  Cheapest extended warranty I've ever seen.

EZ2Start is just one of those innovations, that actually works, that comes along on rare occasions.  System is simple and effective, do we need it on a 30cc saw? Prolly not but setting the spring and walking away to hear the saw start 10-15 seconds later is a great trick to show your friends!


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## chvymn99 (Jan 10, 2012)

I think you'll be happy with your 180.  I use mine almost exclusively, exept where the bigger saw is needed.  I've cut some rather large cuts with it, in. Honey Locust, Hedge, and Oak.  As long as your RPM are high and you let the saw cut, not push it will eat through.  Good Luck.


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## jdinspector (Jan 10, 2012)

MasterMech said:
			
		

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No, I didn't buy an extended warranty. I bought the double warranty that you described (use ultra oil). Cheap warranty is right. 

Neat trick with the delayed start. Gonna have to try that!


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## Rob From Wisconsin (Feb 1, 2012)

jdinspector said:
			
		

> Thanks for the help on this. I picked up a new 180 today. I splurged for the one with ez start. Seemed like a neat feature. Who knows? I may regret that splurge down the road, but today I'm happy.
> 
> The dealer was adament that I burn high octane gas that doesn't contain ethanol. I also went for the 2 year warranty and will be using the Stihl synthetic oil.
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> I hope to give it a try this coming weekend.



Ditto here.....I also bought the 180 last week to act as a "limber"/ small tree saw to compliment
my 290 Farm Boss. Really like it so far - much lighter, easier to handle. Also like the easy chain tensioner.
Purchased the case of Stihl Oil to extend my warranty to two (2) years (a promotional thing).


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## smokinj (Feb 1, 2012)

I like the 180 or my case the 192t.....Oh and they make a great neckless if they blow up!  ;-)


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## CTYank (Feb 1, 2012)

MasterMech said:
			
		

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What do bars and chains have to do with this? (Like, they didn't have to license tooth design, while Oregon's patents were still in effect!)
They live and do business on the same planet as others, meaning cross-licensing goes on all-over. It's well-known that in '99 Stihl *purchased *60,000 strato engines from RedMax. RedMax is now owned by ... ? Their R&D department didn't help there. They're not gods, and yes they do trust others. I understand that they also license strato technology from Shindaiwa. They just price everything higher.


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## jlightning (Feb 2, 2012)

I have a ms180 and have a question about the chain.  Where the chain is linked together there isn't a tooth there...its like they skipped putting one there?  My ms390 doesn't have a "tooth gap" so to speak where the chain is connected together?  Is there a reason for the design?


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## smokinj (Feb 2, 2012)

jlightning said:
			
		

> I have a ms180 and have a question about the chain.  Where the chain is linked together there isn't a tooth there...its like they skipped putting one there?  My ms390 doesn't have a "tooth gap" so to speak where the chain is connected together?  Is there a reason for the design?



Less cutters the easier it is for the little saw to pull.


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## jlightning (Feb 2, 2012)

Aaaahhhhh that makes sense!   I am also guessing that is the reason it gets a little jumpy when im cutting and my 390 doesn't.


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## smokinj (Feb 2, 2012)

jlightning said:
			
		

> Aaaahhhhh that makes sense!   I am also guessing that is the reason it gets a little jumpy when im cutting and my 390 doesn't.



Lighter the saw the more felt kick back your going to have. My little 192t (top handle 180) it will jump a lot but easy enough to control. 390 has the power to just cut through most of the time.


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## MasterMech (Feb 3, 2012)

jlightning said:
			
		

> I have a ms180 and have a question about the chain.  Where the chain is linked together there isn't a tooth there...its like they skipped putting one there?  My ms390 doesn't have a "tooth gap" so to speak where the chain is connected together?  Is there a reason for the design?



Happens all the time on many saws.  One cutter missing out of the pattern generally won't cause any ill effects.  Sometimes you just can't perfect the pattern for a given loop length.


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