# Fisher Grandpa Bear - Guidance on Wood Stove Purchase



## kcflds (Jul 29, 2016)

Hello All,
I'm a new member here and this is my 1st post. I was looking for some guidance on purchasing a new wood stove for my home. It will be going in my basement which is approx. 2000 square feet, unfinished. I found this Fisher Grandpa Bear for sale and they are asking $900 firm. I am new to this community but from what research i've done this seems like a fair price. They claim it hasn't been burnt in very much and that it hasn't seen much use.

I have a few pictures and any guidance would be appreciated


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## begreen (Jul 29, 2016)

Seems like a pretty high price, especially for off season. How does it look inside?


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## kcflds (Jul 29, 2016)

begreen said:


> Seems like a pretty high price, especially for off season. How does it look inside?



Here is a picture of the inside
.


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## begreen (Jul 29, 2016)

Looks pretty clean which would indicate low use if they are the original bricks. I would expect this to go for closer to $5-600 at this time of year, but @coaly should be able to provide a more accurate assessment of value.


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## kcflds (Jul 29, 2016)

begreen said:


> Looks pretty clean which would indicate low use if they are the original bricks. I would expect this to go for closer to $5-600 at this time of year, but @coaly should be able to provide a more accurate assessment of value.



Thanks @begreen for the help. Ill wait and see if @coaly has any information for me. Sounds like its a little steep though.

I did confirm that those are the original bricks.


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## coaly (Jul 29, 2016)

It appears to have Grandma doors........  and I think that's too much as well.


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## kcflds (Jul 29, 2016)

coaly said:


> It appears to have Grandma doors........  and I think that's too much as well.



Thanks @coaly, I appreciate the information. Looks like ill keep on searching.


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## coaly (Jul 29, 2016)

Notice the star which had a '76 the first year they were made and early '77 still had the star without the '76.
Grandpa had a larger style tree on the star doors;




Later Grandpa doors with the smaller trees are much farther apart for the wider doors; Comparison pictures below.



	

		
			
		

		
	
 Grandpa  
	

		
			
		

		
	



	

		
			
		

		
	
  Grandma

That is how you can tell easily with a good front picture.


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## kcflds (Jul 29, 2016)

Okay, I see now. Thanks, im learning so much. What do you think is fair on these as im going to keep looking until I find one to purchase. Is 500-600 what I should be expecting to pay?


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## kcflds (Jul 29, 2016)

@coaly 

One of your previous posts mentions that the Grandpa had six bricks in the back....this one im asking about seems to have six as well.


*Grandpa UL Unlisted pre 1980* with 2 square doors;

Width ; 29 1/2" across top plate.
Depth ; 30 1/2" overall with ash fender (shelf)
Approx. weight 454 pounds
Logs to 24" across stove
Heats approx. 2000 s.f.
Requires 6 bricks across back, 4 sides
Flue size 8 inch top or rear
Door opening ; 22" wide X 11" high


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## coaly (Jul 29, 2016)

Or less for a non UL listed. You are pricing the least desirable models; (double solid door without glass) First, the double door stoves are built for fire viewing with screen in place and have a much larger outlet which cuts down on efficiency. If your goal is to heat a large area efficiently and fire viewing is not necessary, you want a single door stove with a 6 inch outlet. Papa Bear for 2000 SF will heat even more, closer to 3000 s.f. in your area depending on insulation and many other factors. *Your existing chimney is what you're buying a stove to fit.* Then consider the size stove, and lastly top, rear or side vent for your installation.
I assume the stove pictured is either a Barometric Stove with the box removed to vent out the back or it has had a second outlet installed to use top or rear vent. If that's the case, as a collector piece it is worthless.


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## coaly (Jul 29, 2016)

*The inside picture looks like a Grandpa brick count, and is the Grandpa shown on right two pictures.
The left picture IS a Grandma and is a different stove.*
It is older than the stove on the right. Notice the straight door handles with tight wound stainless springs. Grandpa on right is newer with BENT handles and newer plated  springs. It will probably have 5 fin draft caps as opposed to the older Grandma pictured with 4.
Next notice the background and different colored floor. Hmmmm

Those measurements are from the original drawings and are what the fabricators were *supposed* to build. Some, including the Dunn Brothers in VA made a wide body stove that used longer hinge plates to reach over to the doors. They are definitely Grandma doors in the front picture on left. (notice the handle comes out of the door outboard of the tree tops. Grandpa has the handle on the side of the tree towards the center of the door.
This will use a 17 wide X 10 1/2 door seal channel iron. (Grandma)



	

		
			
		

		
	
 Grandma star door  
	

		
			
		

		
	



	

		
			
		

		
	
 Grandpa Star door. They didn't match. Never saw a Grandpa have a star door from '76 or '77 with small trees.

If you get a picture of the doors on the Grandpa on the right, they will have the smaller trees and no star OR be the newer arched top doors.  Arched top doors have a thicker hinge which is hard to tell in the side view pictures.


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## kabella (Jul 30, 2016)

We've had one of those stoves in our vacation home since the 70's. Unless we're doing something wrong that stove won't heat 2000 sq.ft. Our home is 1600 sq.ft. and it won't heat it all over.

It also loves firewood and we're going to replace it this Fall. The stove has been well taken care of and is in excellent condition. This area is heat with wood stove mostly with gas backup and the most we've been offered for the stove is $450.00.

We've spent Winter months here, the Blue Ridge Mts. in Georgia, and it would use a small pickup truck load of seasoned wood about every 7 days or less. We've got some friends that have the same stove and last winter they use 16 small pickup truck loads of firewood and the stove wouldn't heat all of their home.


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## coaly (Jul 30, 2016)

kabella,
There is certainly something wrong with your installation. My first guess is the chimney being too large.
I have 1880 sf. in NE PA and have connected all the common models to the same chimney and have been able to heat my home with the stoves rated for 1500 sf. The stoves rated for 2000 sf heat both levels from the basement in a few homes I've put them in. This is my only heat source and our temps stay below freezing, sometimes in the teens for a month straight. 10 below is about the coldest, 30 * days normal.
Sounds like you are pouring wood through it right up the chimney.
*Do you have a damper in the first section of stove pipe? Larger than an 8 inch diameter chimney flue? *(piped into fireplace chimney?)

Your air intakes should be open 1 turn or less once established, and many times just cracked open once up to temp. You should have lots of coals after 8 to 10 hour burn and be able to load on them for it to take right off. If that doesn't describe your operation, there is something drastically wrong.


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## kabella (Jul 30, 2016)

Hi Coaly and thank you for your comments. Yes the stove has a damper in the 8 inch pipe. It was installed by a professional wood stove company where we bought the stove. The chimney is stone with a liner and damper in it. That could be a problem if you think so. 

This stove was the stove of choice when we built our home here and there are quite a few of them here in our small valley. They're all installed just about anyway possible and everyone says the same things I mentioned in my comments. 

We know how to use the stove but not heating our home and excessive use of firewood is the same we hear from everyone that has one. I'm not degrading the stove, I've just given our experiences with the stove. We like the stove, it's just not working for us and it's good to hear it's working for you and I'll pass your comments on to the other stove owners her in our valley. I also do not know of anyone that has their stove in their basements, all are in dens.


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## coaly (Jul 30, 2016)

Are the others also double door stoves with 8 inch outlets? They do use more than the 6 inch single doors. They work great with a reduced 6 inch flue, however it is against code to reduce the flue or pipe smaller than the stove outlet. The stove was designed for open door burning with screen in place, and back then most were set on a hearth vented into an even larger chimney. So the reason for the larger outlet is to allow more heat up the stack to keep a much larger flue hot all the way to the top. (250*) The firebox size is fine for a 6 inch outlet. The newer double doors had baffles, also because chimneys were becoming more efficient. Now all new stoves will require a 6 inch chimney because they simply don't have the excess heat to loose up the stack to heat a larger chimney. So when you feel you're burning more efficiently with a newer stove, the smaller chimney liner is half the secret. adding a baffle not only directs the heat forward and away from stove outlet, but the smoke particles burned in the firebox allows lower stack temps since the particles are drastically reduced that form creosote. 
We have mostly tall oaks here with a mix of maple and hickory. I burned a double door Goldilocks for about 20 years and after trying a single door long narrow firebox that fits the wood, I would never go back ! Huge difference in burning characteristics. You give up a lot for the ability to view the fire.


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## coaly (Jul 30, 2016)

I should add, if they are top vented, they absolutely need a baffle plate installed.


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## coaly (Jul 30, 2016)

If the liner is larger than 8 inch round (50.24 square inches) it is a problem. If you mean the liner is masonry which gives up its heat to the stone, that's worse. A newer stove will require 6 inch stainless liner with insulation around it to keep the inside hot with the little heat loss they have. That's why a 6 inch single door stove with 6 inch outlet would be so much more efficient. Half the heat is required up the stack for the same draft. BUT you have the same square inch surface area of heated stove surface. A larger chimney is a "larger engine" to drive the stove, but that means it is only *capable of more flow *for a larger stove or open fireplace and requires more heat (fuel) to keep twice the area hot inside. It's not about the stoves, it's the chimneys. Put a new 6 inch insulated liner in for a new stove and try your old stove first. It will drive you out.


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## begreen (Jul 30, 2016)

Might it be possible that the wood being burned is not fully seasoned?


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## kabella (Jul 30, 2016)

Hi guys and I certainly thank and appreciate your comments and suggestions, and I'm certainly learning from you.  Yes, it has double doors, the largest Fisher at the time I think, 8 inch outlet from the back of the stove with the correct size damper in it and we do not keep the doors open to watch a fire burning. I have no idea where the screen is that came with it

The outlet pipe runs through a closed off fireplace with a 90 degree elbow up to the chimney. The chimney, I think, has a 12 inch by 16 inch cap on top and the chimney is lined with terracotta lining. It's a stone chimney.

Yes, we burn only 2 year old seasoned red and white oak and hickory that we cut, split and let season off our own property. White oak seems to be the best of the two oaks. We own a good amount of mountain property and probably 60% of our wood comes from standing dead and dead and down.


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