# Drying time for dead trees



## Black Jaque Janaviac (May 4, 2010)

Do you save any drying time by cutting already dead trees?

There's a lot of oak wilt in this area and thus the oaks are dying and decaying faster than we can burn 'em.  

I got through the winter by selecting standing trees that had the bark off.  I'd fell 'em and found that the top 2/3s was usually burnable right away (that's the part that's been sitting in the sun and wind).  Now I'm collecting the lower 1/3 on all the trees cut.  The inner parts are still wet. 

Will this still take 2 years to dry?  Or is that 2 year dry time figuring on cutting live trees?

I'm still cutting for next winter and would like to know how "picky" I should be when I'm gathering wood.  Selecting out only the wood that will burn now is a pain.  Although wet wood is heavier it's so much easier to scrounge.


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## FLINT (May 4, 2010)

if the oak has been dead long enough that the bark is already falling off - I'd cut it up and split it as soon as possible and get it drying and I think you could definitely burn it this coming winter.  This is what I've done for years.  I primarily cut standing dead and down wood - and most of the time i'm cutting in the spring to burn in the winter.


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## Uper (May 4, 2010)

Depending on how long they have been dead, I find the top portion of the tree to be drier than the main trunk, especially near the base.  I just cut some dead standing maple and will split the lower portion and set it out in the sun for the summer.  The top portions were dry enough to stack under my lean-to.  Since I just got started last year, I burned a lot of dead standing and am still trying to get ahead by choosing mostly dead standing.


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## zzr7ky (May 4, 2010)

I agree with the above.  However, Oak in particular may still be wet.  

I judge how dry the wood is by knocking the splits together.  Sounds like wooden baseball bat?  It's good to go right away.  Sounds like @#$%, it could use a year to season.  I don't get more complicated than that.


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## benjamin (May 4, 2010)

When I was knee high to a grasshopper standing dead elm was all my dad cut, usually it didn't even have any "brush" on it, all of the finer branches had fallen off, leaving mostly usable wood.  We'd go out in the fall, fill up a couple of trailer loads and burn it that winter.  No splitting involved, if it was too big to fit in the door of the furnace it was left on the log.  Looking back those big rounds should have dried at least a full year, but we never knew the difference, the small stuff started fine and burned fine and the big pieces were still going in the morning. 

If you're able, cut it all and set the big rounds away for another year.  Burn the top stuff this year. Unless you want to split everything, then you may be fine with the time you have left.


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## firefighterjake (May 4, 2010)

I got by the first year by burning dead elm killed by Dutch Elm Disease. My experience was that if the tree was dead-dead with the bark fallilng off it as it stood on the stump then the wood was pretty much good to go in 3-6 months (OK, didn't burn as good as the wood I was burning this year, but it did burn decently) . . . but if the tree was just dead with the bark intact (indicating it had not been dead for long) then the wood would sizzle, hiss and spit . . . so yeah . . . my experience with elm at least showed that there is a difference in how fast the wood seasons depending on how long it has been dead . . . not to mention as others have said the size of the wood and location on the tree (top part often good to go, lower part near trunk takes longer to season.)


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## quads (May 4, 2010)

Oak is different than the rest.  All I ever process is fallen/standing dead oak with no bark.  Generally the tops will be pretty dry.  But the trunks are quite often full of water.  I have found wood from the trunk takes about as long to dry as green does.  If you need wood to burn as soon as possible, look around for something besides oak even if it was standing dead.  Let the oak season the full 2+
 years for best results!


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## Black Jaque Janaviac (May 4, 2010)

> Let the oak season the full 2+
> years for best results!



I'm not sure whether to be discouraged or encouraged.   I really need to be stashing away wood for this coming winter, so I guess I'll be "sorting" which I hate.  On the other hand if I get even better results by seasoning oak two years - I should have a lot to look forward to.


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## oldspark (May 4, 2010)

What does the wood look like when you split it, can you tell if it is starting to dry and how heave is it, I have cut downed oak that had a lot of the moisture gone and it was ready in less than one summer and then I have cut downed oak that was the same as a green tree.


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## quads (May 4, 2010)

Black Jaque Janaviac said:
			
		

> > Let the oak season the full 2+
> > years for best results!
> 
> 
> ...


You would definitely get better results by waiting 2 years, and eliminate the guessing, but I wouldn't be discouraged at all.  Just look around for other types of trees that might be ready to burn sooner, and sort out the smaller diameter oak that came from the tops and limbs, if you can.  Plan to burn all that first and then the wood from the trunks last.  In the end, burn whatever you need to.  Just keep an eye on the chimney.


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## purplereign (May 5, 2010)

A couple of points slightly off subject...be aware that while cutting these oaks, if you mechanically damage other live trees (breaking branches or scarring bark) you will be providing a means of infecting them with wilt as well.  Also, maintaining elm wood with bark intact provides a cozy home for the bark beetle that spreads the disease - this will apply with ash wood as well in Emerald Ash Borer areas.


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## oldspark (May 5, 2010)

Black Jaque Janaviac said:
			
		

> > Let the oak season the full 2+
> > years for best results!
> 
> 
> ...


 If the wood has no bark and you can tell it is somewhat dry when you split it do not worry about, it will be at 20% or less if you stack it in single rows in the sun by this fall, this is not rocket science and no guess work needed. If it is the part with more moisture in it you would have had a better chance if you would have stacked it a month or so ago, it will be good to go for sure (wet stuff) by fall 2011 and I would check it this fall but it needed to stacked already.


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## Black Jaque Janaviac (May 7, 2010)

> A couple of points slightly off subject



Good points to bring up.  We are only allowed to fell trees between October and April for the reasons you mentioned.


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## Lumber-Jack (May 7, 2010)

Black Jaque Janaviac said:
			
		

> Do you save any drying time by cutting already dead trees?


I don't know anything about Oak, but my whole wood gathering strategy is depended on the fact that the trees I cut are pre-seasoned and pretty much ready to burn right away. The concept of cutting and stockpiling green wood, so it can sit and dry out for years, is not one I share with other forum members.
So, in answer to your question, yes I save years of time by cutting already dead (and dried) trees.


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## Nixon (May 7, 2010)

Carbon_Liberator said:
			
		

> Black Jaque Janaviac said:
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Generally speaking , what type of wood are You cutting ? I gather that Your pre -seasoned wood is some what less dense than most hard  woods . Hence Your ability to gather it in a "pre-seasoned"  condition .[del][/del][del][/del][del][/del][del][/del]


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## oldspark (May 7, 2010)

I cut dead Oak all the time and it dries over a summer period but you run into some that is still green that could take longer.


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## Cowboy Billy (May 7, 2010)

I have been cutting for years. And I can usually tell by the weight of the split if it is dry enough. I have t posts about every ten feet in my pile. The stuff that will dry fast goes on one side the the wetter stuff on the other. I ran out of T poles and started crossing the splits on the end of the pile like Dennis does. And am surprised at how much sturdier it is than my t pole. 

Billy


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## Lumber-Jack (May 7, 2010)

Nixon said:
			
		

> Carbon_Liberator said:
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Yes you gathered correctly, the two types of wood I primarily seek are Douglas fir, and Lodgepole pine. Both of which are readily available and free for the taking on crown lands. Of the two the Lodgepole is more abundant because of the pine beetle kill, and tends to dry the best while standing dead. I believe there is two reasons for this, first because it has a tendency to develop vertical splits and cracks when dead and as part of the drying process and the cracks allow air in and moisture out. Also, the way the trees die from the pine beetle is the beetle carry a type of blue staining fungus that gets in to the tree and this fungus spreads and blocks the water conducting columns of the tree draining the trees of their nutrients eventually causing the tree to starve to death. The net result is that the trees dry very fast while still standing, in fact they tend to dry quicker standing than if they were to be cut and laying on the ground. I believe this is because they are more exposed to the air and sunlight, and any rain tends to shed off the tree better when it is standing vertical.

Hardwoods are just not readily available out West here, although I did get a little walnut wood last year that is taking up room in my woodshed. Of course most of it is not ready to burn yet cause it was cut green, and the stuff is a PITA to split, and frankly it doesn't seem to produce any more heat than the Fir or Pine I have, so I doubt I'll get any more of that stuff.
However if someone ever offers to let me cut some Oak tree in their yard, I'll probably go for it.


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## billb3 (May 7, 2010)

Black Jaque Janaviac said:
			
		

> Do you save any drying time by cutting already dead trees?
> 
> .



Some, but how much can be tricky.
We have (more and more)  dead oak here, too and the stuff with the bark off seems to be the driest, especially if  it hasn't blown over and been horizontal. For whatever reason , even off the ground, all the oak I've cut up has been lighter quicker and burn better if it was vertical when cut up.
Dead doesn't always crack to  help gauge how it's drying, nor change color sometimes, so it can be hard to tell except by weight. And I've had similar sized splits from the same part of a tree difffer in weight  by enough to make me expect to find a big shackle in the  ashes afterwards (and haven't) .


Some of the dead oak here is like cutting into rock, though.
You might find yourself sharpening  more often.


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## Backwoods Savage (May 7, 2010)

Other than our recent calamity with the white ash, the only dead wood we usually cut is elm. We do wait until almost all or all of the bark has fell off the tree. The tops can usually be burned right away if needed but the butt takes a bit longer. We cut in winter and split in spring and those elm logs from the butt will be ready to burn the following fall. So in our case, yes, it does shorten the drying time.


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## oldspark (May 7, 2010)

Backwoods Savage said:
			
		

> Other than our recent calamity with the white ash, the only dead wood we usually cut is elm. We do wait until almost all or all of the bark has fell off the tree. The tops can usually be burned right away if needed but the butt takes a bit longer. We cut in winter and split in spring and those elm logs from the butt will be ready to burn the following fall. So in our case, yes, it does shorten the drying time.


 Calamity with White Ash?


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## Backwoods Savage (May 7, 2010)

Emerald Ash Borer.


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## oldspark (May 7, 2010)

Backwoods Savage said:
			
		

> Emerald Ash Borer.


 Bummer, no signs of it yet on my place but I guess it is in the area, I have a lot of ash trees so am keeping my fingers crossed.


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## Backwoods Savage (May 7, 2010)

It gets tough going back into the woods and see all those trees either dead or on their way to it. This is one more reason I have so much firewood on hand. I hate to cut all those trees but when they die that is about all they are good for. We did make some lumber from some but got all we need and most are not good for lumber as they are either too small or too many limbs to make much. Also it would be tough getting a skidder to them because of where they are and I don't want any more of our woods torn up. It is a bit wet where most of the ash are.

We can just drive down the roads in this area and between all the dead elm and ash it looks awful. But, in other areas they have oaks going bad and even pines in some areas. Looks like most of us will lose some type of tree.


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## CrawfordCentury (May 7, 2010)

In my experience - and I've cut allotta dead standing and 2-year log-length tops - red oaks are pretty stingey when it comes to giving up moisture. 

A decent rule of thumb is oakwhiff. If it's still got the gymsocks marinated in rancid Ragu odor about it, consider it green - 14-20 months to season. If the smell's there but more understated, 4-10 months should do ya. 

My strategy - dead standing, limbwood's usually good to go once bucked to stovelength. Trunk wood usually requires a couple/few months to dry. Now mind you, this is dead and not dying. The moisture is just wet moisture and not living green moisture.

Dead and downed stuff usually is good to go right away. Maybe a little surface moisture, or some that makes its way in through cracks and knotholes in the wood. But this dries real quick.

Tops and log length - if left laying for a couple years, it'll still be wet. Usually 4-12 months will suffice, depending on amount of time between felling and bucking.


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