# Rotten wood in outdoor?



## tjcole50 (Jan 4, 2014)

Lot if guys I work with are saying they burn nasty wood in their outdoor boilers and have done so for years. Obviously clean good hardwood will burn better. But my dilemma is I have 17 acres of downed wood ,storm damage and rotten stuff just sitting back there to provide years of heat. I have debated the entry level central boiler unit. A lot of trees downed or leaning have been there for 1-5 years and the ton of junk wood has been there since who knows. But if I can burn this stuff in an outdoor boiler non epa then I may consider the large cost for one of these! Thanks again


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## Fred61 (Jan 4, 2014)

If it's on the ground and starting to rot, leave it there for the critters to make their homes in. It will also add nutrients to your soil. Some people think it's ugly but good foresters think it's beautiful. Take down the ones that are leaning and those that are crowding other trees, split them and stack the firewood outside with just a cover on the top of the stack in a place that has good air circulation and sun.

You should do your part in keeping pollution to a minimum which means you should not be burning wood in a non epa outdoor boiler whether it's punky or solid. Get yourself a good boiler that produces less pollution for the sake of our planet and your neighbors.


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## Coal Reaper (Jan 4, 2014)

Anything will burn if you get it hot enough. You are losing a great deal if heat to get it to that point, heat that could be going to your house.  How often do you want to feed boiler? How often do you want to replace boiler?  The current path requires both more often than is acceptable for most.  Can you sleep at night knowing that thing is pouring unburnt gasses into the air you breath?


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## tjcole50 (Jan 4, 2014)

Well it would be a new central boiler . I thought there classics were non epa and retail for 4700 where as the epa one is 9700$ ouch. I only have permission to cut dead or leaning storm damage or ground wood . Gotta listen to farmer or in screwed for free wood lol. I have about 20 hickories I'll be dropping soon on my land but was going to use that for my living room stove


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## tjcole50 (Jan 4, 2014)

Trust me I'm not trying to pollute or cause issues just trying to get edumacated. I went to the farmer asking if I could clean up his woods for him there is a lot back there that looks to be unhealthy for that  wood lot


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## DamienBricka (Jan 4, 2014)

My Father who has acres of land leave a lot of branches, leaves and rotten wood on the ground by the tree. He always told me it was good forest management.
Over the years I have seen his trees grow and they are a lot healthier and bigger then the properties around him.


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## tjcole50 (Jan 4, 2014)

We had a really bad storm tornado started out in a field in front of us. I live in a clearing of trees but the damage outback was bad lot of dangerous cutting but full grown trees need cut up I agree with small amounts on the bed of trees


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## maple1 (Jan 5, 2014)

I wouldn't bank on future use of that 17 acres if I didn't own it.

Downed trees can be burned OK, if they haven't gone too far and become punkey rotten. Usually, if when they are split, they actually split rather than crumble or break apart, there will be some heat in them. But they have to be cut, split & stacked for a while in an open area to make sure they are dry. When they go to far, they become sponges that just won't dry out and give next to no heat. I'm burning a lot of windfall spruce now that I processed early this past summer. Need to burn more of it than good hardwood or course, but it was a lot easier for me then to get a bunch of it ready to burn than it was going after 'good' stuff. Some of it I had to leave where it was, but most of it is burning really good for what it is. I'll be pulling more of it out of that area this coming summer. Not having to fell stuff can really cut down on time & risk, depending on the situation.


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## JP11 (Jan 5, 2014)

You're looking for blow downs more than rotten and fallen over.  Depending on the ground, you may get a fair amount of wood this way.  I have very wet ground.  A tropical storm coming thru a couple falls ago gave me a dozen hemlocks, right along the driveway.  I wouldn't have cut them for wood.. but they were a mess and had to go anyway.

Dry it all and burn it.


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## Fred61 (Jan 5, 2014)

With good forest management blowdowns and dead rotten trees aren't the only ones that get harvested. Trees that are crowding other more valuable trees need also to be removed. Forsters use the term "releasing" when referring to the thinning. I personally have proven that a forest can be improved over the 26 years I owned my woodlot. I had gone in and "released particular trees and 12 years later and observed the growth rings on the released tree. The wood production is unbelievable. Sort of like thinning carrots in your garden. If your neighbor is unaware of good forest management he will forever have a forest of weed trees which will produce half of what a well managed forest will produce.


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## EatenByLimestone (Jan 5, 2014)

Standing dead are good homes for animals too.  The pilieated woodpeckers often start the hole, then the squirrels enlarge it.  Then as the hole gets larger, other animals move in.  

Make sure to leave some of the standing dead for the animals.


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## stee6043 (Jan 5, 2014)

Coal Reaper said:


> Can you sleep at night knowing that thing is pouring unburnt gasses into the air you breath?



Hah.  I love the drama!  I hope you ride a bicycle and don't drive a car, Coal, for the sake of your good nights sleep.


To the OP, I've never had much luck rescuing much of anything from a fallen state.  Unless I get to it within a few weeks (months maybe?) of falling, I leave it.  Too many times I've started in on a fallen tree with my saw only to find that the middle was 100% water or worse yet, completely missing due to the above mentioned critters that build homes in there.  These days the only time I may go after one is if it fell on another couple of trees and managed to stay 100% off the ground.  Those seem to be worth saving more times than not.

My two cents only.


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## BoilerMan (Jan 5, 2014)

If you wouldn't burn it in your stove, don't burn it in anything else.  That's my rule.  Any tree that has been down for any length of time is generally punky, and rotted wood as has been said has no (or very little) heat left in it.  Any questionable wood I have is campfire wood or left in the woods. 

TS


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## burrman (Jan 5, 2014)

if it burn i burn it in my outdoor stove..it dont mind the punky wood ..its all btu's just some more then others..if thats all you have to burn and can burn it for free..i say go for it


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## burrman (Jan 5, 2014)

Coal Reaper said:


> Can you sleep at night knowing that thing is pouring unburnt gasses into the air you breath?


  i myself sleep pretty good..thanks


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## Coal Reaper (Jan 5, 2014)

stee6043 said:


> Hah.  I love the drama!  I hope you ride a bicycle and don't drive a car, Coal, for the sake of your good nights sleep.


Nope, i drive a powerstroke. 
There is restaurant down the road that we frequent with several OWB around it. Even inside the place you can smell them unless the wind is coming from the direction across the river and then a big cornfield.  I have heard people complain to waitstaff and insist that there must be something that can be done. On a damp still day below freezing the smoke will just linger in the valley.  There is a field with all rotting logs in it behind the parking lot. It just doesnt sit well with me thats all.


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## Coal Reaper (Jan 5, 2014)

And aside from pollutions and smell and smoke there always this that most of us have seen:


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## burrman (Jan 5, 2014)

I come from propane side of the fight... ya my owb is not a gasser yes its smokey n yes prob not the best for the air but I'm saving money using it..I burn wet/green/dry/seasoned wood. ..if it burns I burn it....I'm saving money....I hate how people on here think if someone has a owb they are thought of differently...just my thoughts I guess


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## iceguy4 (Jan 5, 2014)

burrman said:


> if it burn i burn it in my outdoor stove


 Do you have any idea how many BTU's are in a tire?


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## tjcole50 (Jan 5, 2014)

Wow he hates it so bad he should sell n do something else? Are they really that bad? Not knowledgable on these
Edit meant video


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## Thom Griffin (Jan 5, 2014)

A couple exceptions to reluctance to burn downed trees:  #1 would be ironwood.  I've never seen one rot, unless it's less than 1 1/2 inch diameter.  It's like putting a piece of anthracite into your boiler.  Oak tops can be really good even years later, as they have wide spreading branches which stay up off the ground.  One last good "rotten" tree would be beech trees which have broken off from beech bark disease; but you've got to get them the year they fall.  They decompose from the break up and down, in both directions, but they do have a lot of heat in them.  Unfortunately, they usually fall over at the break, about 20 ft in the air and are extremely dangerous to cut because of this.  I winch the broken top down, then cut the base.


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## burrman (Jan 5, 2014)

Haven't burnt tires..someone needs to build a stove that can..lol


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## BoilerMan (Jan 5, 2014)

burrman said:


> I come from propane side of the fight... ya my owb is not a gasser yes its smokey n yes prob not the best for the air but I'm saving money using it..I burn wet/green/dry/seasoned wood. ..if it burns I burn it....I'm saving money....I hate how people on here think if someone has a owb they are thought of differently...just my thoughts I guess


 I can see your point, trust me I'm not some kind of earth-saving type........
However OWB are a black eye for all wood-burners.  When I tell people I heat my house and water with wood they assume I have an OWB and say something to the effect you must not have close neighbors. 

This is simply not the case, there are many OWB around here, but many of them have either rotted out or have been removed in good faith because of copous amounts of smoke. 

I'm not argueing with the fact that you are saving $$$$ and not burning LP, it's just when people irritate others or are otherwise irresponsible we all get the blame. 

Personally I don't think wood-burning will be curtailed or outlawed here in Maine, but I don't want to see it happen in other places.  Fossil fuel is a very useful energy source and we should not waste is on space heating where it doesn't need to be burned.  Save it for transportation and emergency energy, burn solid fuels (including coal) for stationary heat requirements wherever practical. 

I enjoy processing wood, but my engineering mind does not like waste of any kind..........so the thought of doing a lot of it for nothing and wasting my time and money doesn't sit well.

Just my opinion, there are others who will disagree.

TS


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## phantomblack (Jan 5, 2014)

Guys, just because it is an OWB means it has to smoke. I run dry quality wood in my OWB and I only get smoke right after loading for about 10 minutes. Then it burns clean for the next cycles. No smoke hanging in the woods, no stink for us to smell, and I'm not running a gasser. 

The key is using good wood, running a higher set point (I'm running 185 damper close temp) and getting the damper draw rates set correctly. Once it is dialed in, it'll run clean with quality fuel. If you burn cruddy fuel, it'll smoke, with cruddy fuel they'll all smoke. 

OWB owners just need to get into the habit of using good fuel. It's the use of poor fuel that causes the problem, not the OWB.


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## iceguy4 (Jan 5, 2014)

Smokey boilers.....


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## iceguy4 (Jan 5, 2014)

phantomblack said:


> OWB owners just need to get into the habit of using good fuel. It's the use of poor fuel that causes the problem, not the OWB


 I agree ...up to a point. I think the problem is more "pilot error" then anything.  Properly seasoned and sized wood is a must. 
           How bout just maybe add another "stoking" to the schedule..  Don't let the burn get to ashes between stoking....then jam every void full around two green logs. I believe there ARE good owb's out there...but you must be a responsible operator .


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## phantomblack (Jan 5, 2014)

Agreed, I feel that I am a responsible operator. However, on my ride to and from work I am reminded that the many OWB users suck. When I bought my central boiler they dealer told me with a smile " if it fits through the door it burns".  He is right, but the side affects are pretty terrible. 

It's a bad deal, and eventually will affect all of us who prefer to burn wood. Only thing that I do is remind others that I know burn wood, to burn responsibly.


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## Coal Reaper (Jan 5, 2014)

burrman said:


> I come from propane side of the fight... ya my owb is not a gasser yes its smokey n yes prob not the best for the air but I'm saving money using it..I burn wet/green/dry/seasoned wood. ..if it burns I burn it....I'm saving money....I hate how people on here think if someone has a owb they are thought of differently...just my thoughts I guess


And thats why we are all here. If all i had was rotten wood i would burn cord upon cord of it before refilling a tank of oil or propane. There are better ways, thats all. I am not here to knock anybody with an owb (or any biomass burner for that matter) that is operated to the best of ones means. Run what yah brung.  If you would rather save some money up front and spend your time processig more wood and feeding boiler, well, god bless america!


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## salecker (Jan 6, 2014)

burrman said:


> I come from propane side of the fight... ya my owb is not a gasser yes its smokey n yes prob not the best for the air but I'm saving money using it..I burn wet/green/dry/seasoned wood. ..if it burns I burn it....I'm saving money....I hate how people on here think if someone has a owb they are thought of differently...just my thoughts I guess


You do realize you aren't burning green wood.Green wood is full of water.Water is what firemen use to put out fires.It takes around half of the btu's in a green log to heat the water to steam so it can be released out the chimney.Then the rest of the log can burn.
 Thomas


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## iceguy4 (Jan 6, 2014)

salecker said:


> It takes around half of the btu's in a green log to heat the water to steam so it can be released out the chimney


 In other words  twice the work because you didn't think ahead to let it season.


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## burrman (Jan 6, 2014)

salecker said:


> You do realize you aren't burning green wood.Green wood is full of water.Water is what firemen use to put out fires.It takes around half of the btu's in a green log to heat the water to steam so it can be released out the chimney.Then the rest of the log can burn.
> Thomas


In a pinch it works


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## iceguy4 (Jan 6, 2014)

burrman said:


> In a pinch it works



Aaaah I see ...heating season snuck up on you.    Tires, plastic, wire also work in a pinch.  Your neighbors must love you..   And you seem to brag about it...


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## Coal Reaper (Jan 6, 2014)

stee6043 said:


> Hah.  I love the drama!  I hope you ride a bicycle and don't drive a car, Coal, for the sake of your good nights sleep.


 ITS NOT JUST ME!!


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## burrman (Jan 6, 2014)

They do...


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## burrman (Jan 6, 2014)

iceguy4 said:


> Aaaah I see ...heating season snuck up on you.    Tires, plastic, wire also work in a pinch.  Your neighbors must love you..   And you seem to brag about it...


no actually i found my stove on CL for a great deal in  July and i rushed around and got everything installed  and ordered to be able to heat with it this year...i have seasoned wood to burn... but not alot so when my uncle asked if i wanted this wood which was cut down 4 years ago and stacked in 8 foot sections piled 8 feet tall by 60 feet long mix of all kind of wood i couldnt say no... yeah some is punky and rotten but it burns...fill my stove up at night and she burns all night long heating a house and a pole barn. i didnt have much time..not to mention i had a kid in june... no i dont burn tires..no i dont burn trash/plastic..just crappy wood..lol


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## phantomblack (Jan 6, 2014)

Burn the wood, keep your family warm. Then get properly prepared for next season.  

Just maybe watch the wind when you load the stove to keep smoke away from the neighbors or from the road.


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## BoilerMan (Jan 7, 2014)

burrman said:


> In a pinch it works


 So does burning oil/LPG

TS


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## burrman (Jan 8, 2014)

U must be rich then


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## iceguy4 (Jan 8, 2014)

burrman said:


> U must be rich then


  No one is "rich" here.    I suspect when we are all banned from burning wood due to a few who abuse it, the worst offenders will be the most outspoken about how un-just it is.   unfortunately  the "many" will have to pay for what the "few" do.


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## mwk1000 (Jan 8, 2014)

Been a while, but I was thinking of this forum looking at the picture this morning. Wood, it's always about the wood. A nice visual to help decide if the junk wood is worth it. I went scrounging for some extra wood during this -15 to - 5 cold snap we are having here. To funny to see that it did not have enough BTU's to heat the tank at all. Basically fill and fill and fill went thru 1/2 cord, then shifted back to the "good" stuff last night. No knobs or switches changed. If a picture is worth a 1000 words it's just not worth the work to collect it and burn it. Free or not.

BTW, Never really wanted to see the bottom of my house chart that says I need  91,300 BTU's / hr @ -15 but I guess you could say that is exactly what the somewhat cheesy standing ash was worth.

Nice to see some familiar names still chiming in. I'm still happily plugging away with the eko 60, saving us a ton of cash. My friend was just complaining about having to shovel a path through the 10' snow pile for his propane guy


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## JP11 (Jan 8, 2014)

90k an hour.. about what I need to keep the whole house 70 when it's -10 outside.  Dang glad it's coming from wood, from my own land.  MUCH better than coming from that stinky oil boiler growling away 24 hours a day.


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