# Need help from wood stove folks



## Bikerguyforlife (Jul 13, 2018)

Hi my name is Den i live in erin tn i just bought a salvaged home and discovered the heat unit is shot..can someone guide me as to who sells the best and cheapest wall thimbles? And guide me into hooking up these hand me down wood stoves? Im new to all this and could sure use help...im trying to get these 2 wood stoves in before winter hits tennessee...thanks guys!>


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## Bikerguyforlife (Jul 13, 2018)

Here is the hearth i just built from 2x6 and repurposed lumber...


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## Jags (Jul 14, 2018)

You might want to slow down a bit.  Different stoves have different r ratings for the hearth as well as clearance to combustibles. Consider getting the stove(s) first.


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## Blazingembers7749 (Jul 14, 2018)

Jags said:


> You might want to slow down a bit.  Different stoves have different r ratings for the hearth as well as clearance to combustibles. Consider getting the stove(s) first.


Agreed


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## Bikerguyforlife (Jul 14, 2018)

Blazingembers7749 said:


> Agreed


I have the stoves..one is an old atlantic 224 and also a vermont resolute..the resolure however has very small log length 13" i think


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## Jags (Jul 14, 2018)

If u haven't already done so, check out the install manuals for each.  Make sure you meet or exceed the requirements.


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## Bikerguyforlife (Jul 14, 2018)

Jags said:


> If u haven't already done so, check out the install manuals for each.  Make sure you meet or exceed the requirements.


Does anyone know the cheapest place to buy stove pipe online? I also need to wall thimbles...no codes here in tn but would like to do it safe...is it required to have double wall going outside? Its quite expensive any insight would be good


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## Blazingembers7749 (Jul 14, 2018)

Where possible i like using the insulated wall thimbles


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## Blazingembers7749 (Jul 14, 2018)

Assuming your going into a masonry thimble otherwise class a.


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## Bikerguyforlife (Jul 14, 2018)

Blazingembers7749 said:


> Where possible i like using the insulated wall thimbles


i just ordered 2 of the Selkirk Corp 206463 6,...could sure use help when i get them...lol cutting into my vinyl siding is scarey


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## Blazingembers7749 (Jul 14, 2018)

Generally anything passing thru a wall or on the exterior needs to be class a pipe


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## Blazingembers7749 (Jul 14, 2018)

I use a 4.5" grinder with a lennox dimond blade very easy to control the cut.


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## Bikerguyforlife (Jul 14, 2018)

Blazingembers7749 said:


> Generally anything passing thru a wall or on the exterior needs to be class a pipe


Thanks blaze...appreciate your help brother ☺


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## Blazingembers7749 (Jul 14, 2018)

Ok before we get ahead of ourselves let me make sure i have this right... you have no masonry thimble/ chimney you are going into correct? If at all possible i recommend going straight up if not possible or to much of a hassle you can go out the wall then up just make sure you follow both the pipe and stove manufactures instructions. If the stove does not rear vent the manufacture will generally list how many ft of rise the pipe needs before going horizontal. Usually you want class a pipe to extend into the room the appliance is in at least 6 inches but still make sure to check the manufactures instructions. Clearances are of the utmost importance and remember they list minimum clearances its always better to give yourself a little play in this area. A picture of the exterior would help if you need a parts breakdown


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## begreen (Jul 14, 2018)

How was the hearth constructed? Is there adequate R value (heat resistance) built in for the proposed stoves? What clearance to combustible is being honored assuming the nearest combustible is the wall behind the metal. The old Atlanta may be an unlisted stove. That means 36" clearance to combustibles all around. Either stove will need to have 16" of hearth in front of the door.

I suspect the wall heat shield may need modification to qualify for a clearance reduction. It may need to be the full width of the sides of the hearth depending on the stove. It will need to be on 1" standoffs, and open 1" top and bottom to allow air to freely convect behind it.

From the looks of things the Resolute may be the better fit. It takes up to a 16" split. The manual is here:
https://www.hearth.com/talk/wiki/vermont-castings-older-stove-models/


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## begreen (Jul 14, 2018)

A good starting point for understanding the stove pipe and chimney installation is the manual provided by the flue manufacturer. This can be downloaded from their website. www.woodstovepro.com has some decent pricing on chimney pipe. If you need help call them up and ask for Sean so that you get the right parts.


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## Blazingembers7749 (Jul 14, 2018)

There are others on here much more knowledgeable than myself on where to get pipe from as i am new to this field


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## Bikerguyforlife (Jul 14, 2018)

I will be using river rocks underneath a depth of 2-3 inches i bought at home depot, im mounting it in corner of room i will be using the resolute stove my question is...how far from wall does stove pipe need to be? I attached a pic..im trying to figure where to mount thimble...might need to go on left side of outter stud


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## Bikerguyforlife (Jul 14, 2018)

No masonry thimble im using going thru standard wall...vinyl on other side...FORGIVE THE HORRIBLE UGLY PAINT...ITS A RENOVATION IN PROGRESS


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## Bikerguyforlife (Jul 14, 2018)

I also forgot to mention the wifey wants one of those steel black heat shields with the wildlife scene cut out at the top..so there will be an additional heat shield behind the stove


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## begreen (Jul 14, 2018)

That's pretty close to the wall. Single wall stove pipe needs at least 18" clearance from the wall or ceiling. Double-wall stove pipe needs 6" clearance from the wall and ceiling clearance will vary with the brand pipe, but allow 9". This is from the edge of the pipe, not the center.


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## Blazingembers7749 (Jul 14, 2018)

begreen said:


> That's pretty close to the wall. Single wall stove pipe needs at least 18" clearance from the wall or ceiling. Double-wall stove pipe needs 6" clearance from the wall and ceiling clearance will vary with the brand pipe, but allow 9". This is from the edge of the pipe, not the center.


What he said


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## Blazingembers7749 (Jul 14, 2018)

begreen said:


> That's pretty close to the wall. Single wall stove pipe needs at least 18" clearance from the wall or ceiling. Double-wall stove pipe needs 6" clearance from the wall and ceiling clearance will vary with the brand pipe, but allow 9". This is from the edge of the pipe, not the center.


Not that you would want to but is there a rule code standard or manufactures instructions saying you cannot connect class a pipe with 2 inch clearances all the way to the stove with an adaptor instead of using connector pipe


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## coaly (Jul 14, 2018)

Bikerguyforlife said:


> Does anyone know the cheapest place to buy stove pipe online? I also need to wall thimbles...no codes here in tn but would like to do it safe...is it required to have double wall going outside? Its quite expensive any insight would be good



No codes??

The State of Tennessee has adopted the 2006 International Building Code (IBC), the 2009 International Residential Code (IRC), the 2006 International Fire Code (IFC), and the 2006 International Energy Conservation Code.

Codes for stove installation are adopted from NFPA Standard 211 which has been in effect for the entire US before codes were adopted. So anywhere in the US that NFPA Standard must be followed. That is where the criteria comes from for the entire installation including chimneys, clearance to single wall pipe, stove clearance to wall, *reduced clearance* for non-listed (untested to UL standards) stoves and appliances, as well as stove construction. Jurisdictions simply adopt the NFPA Standard into their Code, which would be the 2006 Mechanical Code which covers venting and stove installation in your case. (ICC or International Code is also called "The Int. Family of Codes)

The Atlantic 224 is not a UL approved appliance, so that's a no go right there.
Does your Resolute have a UL tag on the back? If not, it is not UL Listed. (All appliances must be UL listed (tested) to comply with the ICC code you are under).

Cheapest chimney parts I've found is Dura-Vent at Home Depot. If you're using a "through the wall" configuration you start with the "through the wall kit" and add chimney sections as required for proper height. That is much more expensive than a "through the roof" configuration that also works better where possible.

You must use black pipe for wood stove connection to chimney, not cheaper thin walled galvanized pipe for heating system duct work. Code requires the thicker pipe and the zinc galvanization burns off causing toxic fumes.

Your heat shield doesn't have air space for air intake under it, and it must have a 1 inch air space from shield to wall behind it for reduction down from 36 inches. I assume the black posts that support shield are metal or not combustible material??

Start here;
https://www.hearth.com/talk/threads/the-basics-on-how-to-install-a-wood-burning-stove.147798/

How to make a UL approved heat shield; (All heat shields in US must conform to the NFPA Standard of constructing them)
https://www.hearth.com/talk/threads/wood-stove-wall-clearances-primer.147785/


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## bholler (Jul 14, 2018)

Bikerguyforlife said:


> Does anyone know the cheapest place to buy stove pipe online? I also need to wall thimbles...no codes here in tn but would like to do it safe...is it required to have double wall going outside? Its quite expensive any insight would be good


Yes you have codes without question.  And yes you need chimney pipe through the wall or ceiling and outside.


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## Bikerguyforlife (Jul 17, 2018)

Its a class a thimble not sure if its masonry..im going thru vinyl house no concrete etc..decided to strip the black hearth looked to "guinea mansion"...lol im italian btw


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## Bikerguyforlife (Jul 17, 2018)

Bikerguyforlife said:


> Its a class a thimble not sure if its masonry..im going thru vinyl house no concrete etc..decided to strip the black hearth looked to "guinea mansion"...lol im italian btw





Bikerguyforlife said:


> Its a class a thimble not sure if its masonry..im going thru vinyl house no concrete etc..decided to strip the black hearth looked to "guinea mansion"...lol im italian btw


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## Bikerguyforlife (Jul 17, 2018)

Its a class a thimble not sure if its masonry..im going thru vinyl house no concrete etc..decided to strip the black hearth looked to "guinea mansion"...lol im italian btw


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## Bikerguyforlife (Jul 17, 2018)

Heres a picture after 6 hours of sanding


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## Alpine1 (Jul 17, 2018)

Bikerguyforlife said:


> Its a class a thimble not sure if its masonry..im going thru vinyl house no concrete etc..decided to strip the black hearth looked to "guinea mansion"...lol im italian btw


Italian? Benvenuto sul forum!


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## bholler (Jul 17, 2018)

Bikerguyforlife said:


> Heres a picture after 6 hours of sanding


Ok how are you going to meet the re we uired clearances To combustibles from the stove with that hearth?  Are either of your stoves listed?  If so we hat are the clearances noted on the ul tag?  If there is no ul tag the stove must be 36" from any combustible material.


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## coaly (Jul 18, 2018)

Blazingembers7749 said:


> Not that you would want to but is there a rule code standard or manufactures instructions saying you cannot connect class a pipe with 2 inch clearances all the way to the stove with an adaptor instead of using connector pipe


Here is an example of what you're asking. Triple wall class A Chimney used in an A frame home with exceptionally high ceiling over the stove stays much hotter inside than double wall connector pipe. It can be done, but is cost prohibitive.



	

		
			
		

		
	
 8 inch Triple wall Dura-Vent with 10 inch outside diameter.

This pic was taken to show what NOT to do for rear clearance. This metal shield is bolted directly to an outside wall and the connector pipe would have been too close for double wall pipe to the peak. The support box was already installed too close to the wall, so a prior owner installed class A Chimney all the way down to stove. (A Grandma Bear designed for use on a non-combustible hearth) The stove should have been moved out into the room with a non-combustible heat shield spaced 1 inch from the wall behind the stove with 12 inches clearance to the wall. Connector pipe should have been double wall to two 45* els under support box to achieve the 6 inch clearance necessary for double wall pipe.
In the 30 years this guy has lived next to me, I only remember red flashing lights ONCE at his home a couple years ago. It was probably time to clean his chimney last winter, so I expect the fire company to do their job again soon.
Of course I told him when the pipe was shot to move the support box so the stove could be moved farther into the room away from the wall, but that's too much work. So I suggested removing the combustible wall behind stove and blocking it up from foundation for a non-combustible wall behind stove. That's too much work too. I'm taking bets on when that wall behind stove will ignite. The structure was built in 1978 and that stove has been the primary heat source ever since.


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## Bikerguyforlife (Jul 19, 2018)

bholler said:


> Ok how are you going to meet the re we uired clearances To combustibles from the stove with that hearth?  Are either of your stoves listed?  If so we hat are the clearances noted on the ul tag?  If there is no ul tag the stove must be 36" from any combustible material.


Silly question...on interior wall do i cut out 6" hole? Or entire size of thimble with just enough to anchor it? I know i will need 2 cross members so all 4 sides are anchored to studs?


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## begreen (Jul 19, 2018)

Download and follow the thimble directions. Chimney pipe is what will be going through the wall. It needs 2" clearance all around. If you buy double-wall, class A chimney pipe that means it will be 8" OD, add the clearance + 4" (2" each side) for a 12" hole through the wall.


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## bholler (Jul 19, 2018)

Bikerguyforlife said:


> Silly question...on interior wall do i cut out 6" hole? Or entire size of thimble with just enough to anchor it? I know i will need 2 cross members so all 4 sides are anchored to studs?


Follow the directions.  I am still pretty concerned about clearances from the stove though.  Are your stoves have ul tags?


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## Bikerguyforlife (Jul 19, 2018)

bholler said:


> Follow the directions.  I am still pretty concerned about clearances from the stove though.  Are your stoves have ul tags?


Stove will be about 15 inches from wall...im using vermont castings stove instead of that much longer one in first pucture...plus a heat shield will be behind it...


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## bholler (Jul 19, 2018)

Bikerguyforlife said:


> Stove will be about 15 inches from wall...im using vermont castings stove instead of that much longer one in first pucture...plus a heat shield will be behind it...


Does that vc stove have a ul tag on the back?  If so what clearances does it call for?  What kind of heat sheild? And how far is it from the wood frame?


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## kennyp2339 (Jul 21, 2018)

The whole reason why so many people are bringing up "does the stove have a ul tag" is because if theres a fire the insurance adjuster will be looking for it as part of the investigation and if the stove doesn't have it and the stove isn't at the standard nfpa non listed clearance of 36" then the insurance company can deny the claim leaving you high and dry, also without a tag who's to say its an actual brand name stove and not a unregulated copy.


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