# Buying Advice for a Wood-Burning Furnace



## Jonathan Stroble (Nov 4, 2013)

Hello all,

I would appreciate any advice I can get about purchasing a new wood-burning furnace.

The background:  I purchased this year a home, built 1973, in upstate New York.  Two stories plus an unfinished attic and an unfinished basement with a concrete floor.  About 2,150 square feet of living space to heat, split between the main level and the upstairs bedrooms.

The heating system is an oil-burning furnace in the basement providing forced air to the floors above, controlled by a digital thermostat on the main level.  There is also a Brock wood-burning furnace tied into the HVAC ducting.  I'm not certain but I believe it was manufactured in 1982.  The oil-burning and wood-burning furnaces are each serviced by separate flues in a masonry chimney.

The Brock wood-burning furnace looks a bit decrepit.  The electric motor controlling the metal flapper that regulates air inflow, just below the furnace door, is disconnected as evidenced by a bare wire dangling onto the basement floor.  When I fired up the furnace, the side-mounted blower kicked on soon after the plenum became warm to the touch, but sounded sickly and produced exactly zero positive air pressure at every heating vent in the house.  With a roaring fire, the oil furnace blower would kick on every 5-10 minutes for about 20-30 seconds, producing a brief flow of warm air throughout the house.  But otherwise, the primary effect of the wood furnace seemed to be heating the basement from heat radiating off the plenum and chimney connector.  There is no barometric damper installed on the Brock and even with the metal flapper open only about 1/4", there is a strong draft and 4-5 pieces of 16-18" wood are completely consumed within 2 hours.

I am strongly considering buying a new wood furnace to replace the Brock.  I have a few choices among furnaces that are sold by local dealers.  These include:

U.S. Stove 1602R
Harman SF-2500-A
Energy King 480EK
PSG Max Caddy

My budget is $3,000 - $4,000 for the furnace alone, not including the added expense of paying a HVAC company to modify the ducting in the basement to accommodate a differently-shaped setup.

If any of these models are clearly superior/inferior for my purposes, I would be glad to know that.  I can find the various tech specs online but I don't have the knowledge or experience to know which one is best or worst.

Many thanks just for reading all of that!


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## Gasifier (Nov 5, 2013)

Just a few things for you to think about.

I would not exclude looking at a Kuuma. http://www.lamppakuuma.com/  (Just click on Kuuma furnaces.)

I have no experience with them and am not affiliated with them in any way. I found them when researching wood gassification boilers. If I had been looking at a forced air unit I would have considered them. From what I have read, I have heard good about them. They are a little expensive, but you will save that money back in the efficiency of the unit, I would think. Gasification is an impressive burning technology.

A few questions for you. I don't know if you have burned wood in the past so, forgive me if you are an experienced wood burner who is knowledgeable about a few of these things.

Are you planning on adding the wood furnace for burning in this season?

Do you have a supply of seasoned wood ready for this season?
(Seasoned wood is something that is a decent moisture content of let's say 20% m.c. or less., this usually takes being split and stacked outside for a year or more depending on wood type. Some, like Ash can season quicker, but some like Oak take 2 years or more.)

If not. Can you get ahold of seasoned wood for this year. (Many who sell it say it is seasoned, but most of it really is not.)

You could also consider a gasification boiler and use some type of heat exchanger to convert to forced air heat and distribute the heat with your existing plenum and ductwork. I am no expert in this but there are many here who could help you through the process. (Even if you used a contractor to install it.)

But the simplest thing would probably be the route you are going. A forced air unit. I would shoot for the most efficient unit you can find. Even if it means waiting until next year to start burning in it while you get and wait for your wood supply to dry.


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## lampmfg (Nov 5, 2013)

We stand behind our product and have undergone strict efficiency and emissions tests to prove our claims.  It's hard to burn wood any cleaner or more efficiently!!  Here is a review from a current Hearth.com member.  https://www.hearth.com/talk/threads/kuuma-vapor-fire-100-wood-furnace-results.112796/
Proudly manufactured in small town of Tower, MN...


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## laynes69 (Nov 5, 2013)

Based on age and size of home, I would opt for the Max Caddy. The Usstove, Harman and Energy King contain no type of true secondary burn. For the most part, those wouldn't vary much from what you currently have. Based on your description of your current wood furnace, I wouldn't use it. If the blower isn't moving heat through the house, it sounds like the heat is moving backwards into the oil furnace. That heat is tripping the limit/control of the central furnace, which is the reason it runs for a few seconds till it drops in temp then shuts off the blower. 

By far, the Max Caddy offers many options over a standard wood furnace. A self modulating blower based on plenum temps, a hot water option and the ability to add backup heating options. Also it's one of the largest furnace's with a clean burn capability. We have a Caddy, and it does well for us. The other furnaces listed would be wood eaters for sure. If I had the room, I would have the Max Caddy.


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## brenndatomu (Nov 5, 2013)

The only half decent furnace (and I hear they are actually pretty good!) is the Caddy, delete the others from the running! From what I know about the Kuuma furnaces, that'd be my top pick unless you want/need one with a built in backup heat option, which the Caddy has. But if I had your budget to work with when I did my install, I'd likely have a Kuuma, give 'em a real good look, nothing else out there like 'em (that I know of) in forced air wood furnaces. Too bad Arboristsite is down, there are a number of REALLY happy Kuuma owners over there.


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## georgia hillbilly (Nov 5, 2013)

I have experience with the usstove of the largest size available and also have experience with our 
Charmaster. Hands down, one awesome heating machine. https://www.hearth.com/talk/threads/extremely-satisfied.115648/#post-1562959


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## STIHLY DAN (Nov 5, 2013)

There is only 2 options. Max caddy and the Kuuma. Forget the rest, you want efficiency, safety, and ease of use. I chose the American made with American parts small family owned company of Kuuma for my furnace. Glad I did in more ways than one, they are great to deal with, real good people. There furnace is built awesome with no smoke and easer to use than the TV. From what I hear and read, PSG is also a good unit, I have no experience with them tho, There rep is an honest guy, very knowledgeable. But they are a LARGE Canadian Co. Good luck.


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## brenndatomu (Nov 6, 2013)

http://www.lamppakuuma.com/testimonials-kuuma-wood-gasification-furnace-sauna-stove.html


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## Jonathan Stroble (Nov 8, 2013)

Many thanks, all, for the thoughtful and helpful suggestions.  I've been leaning toward US Stove but I'm now going to take a harder look at the other options.  Thanks again!


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## sloeffle (Nov 8, 2013)

I currently have a Caddy. I also looked at the Energy King 385ek ( EPA certified ) as they were roughly the same price. The Energy King is a little bit heavier but I did not really like how you would have to clean the secondary burn tubes. The dealer was also new selling them so he did not have anybody I could talk to about it.

My house is a little newer than yours but a little bigger. The Caddy heats it fine. IMHO I think the Max Caddy is too big for your sq footage. I would rather have a furnace that needs to run flat out vs lots of idling. Idling = creosote buildup and wasted wood. As laynes pointed out, it does have some features the others do not. A modulating blower and hot water would be a nice addition to have. I wish my Caddy had those options.


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## Indiana_Guy84 (Nov 9, 2013)

I m also looking but this will be my first wood furnace, I have a Older home and a 2.5 car Garage to heat. I was Looking into buying two of the Drolet Tundra's From Rural King for 1799.00 each, plus cold air/air filter kits and shipping total was about 2200.00 each.  I found a local dealer for the Blaze king Apex but hasn't called me back yet for a Price. I Haven't been able to find any reviews or videos on youtube for the Drolet Furnace or the US Stove Company 8500 Pellet Furnace But I know Rural king has it for 2,299.99. I wanted a Pellet/Wood Furnace that was EPA rated but Don't have a Very large budget, I'm looking to spend around 2500.00 Max on each furnace but Only one furnace per year. Tax Time.
I'm currently heating with Natural Gas and want to add on to the Furnace in my House and have a stand alone in my garage. I was going to run a New natural gas lin to my garage since I don't pay very much for natural gas, but it would be expensive to run a new line with another meter. Currently I pay 0.57 Per Therm on natural gas. I have access to 20 acres of Black Walnut Trees Providing no termites, But there are people in my local area selling seasoned fire for 75.00 a truckload. 


I called about the
Energy King 385Ek $3750.00
Blaze King Apex$ Waiting for Return Call
St.Croix $4400.00
Fahrenheit 50f $4000.00 New 2000.00 used.

Online/in Store
Drolet Tundra: Rural king Online 1799.99 Air Filter Kit and Cold air Return kits plus shipping $2122.34
Fire Chief 700E $2095 at Big R Stores.


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## Jonathan Stroble (Nov 12, 2013)

I've got my eye now on a PSG Caddy that I can buy from local dealer for about $3,700 total, including the blower assembly and fan limit control (and tax).  The only thing that concerns me now is whether a Caddy would supply sufficient heat for my house.  I've read in a couple places that for my region (Upstate NY) I should need about 50-60 BTUs per square foot of heated space.  With a 2,150 square foot house, that equals about 118,000 BTUs.

The Caddy (according to the PSG website) has a maximum output capacity of 106,000 BTUs; average output capacity of 69,000 BTUs.  And it says "Maximum Output - EPA Test Wood:  52,000 BTUs."

Am I comparing apples to apples when I think about these numbers?  I understand it's preferable not to get too big a furnace for the job, but I'm worried that the Caddy might not get the job done.


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## STIHLY DAN (Nov 12, 2013)

That 118,000 is for fossil fuels. Heat on then off with many cycles. The wood furnace will be continuous heat output, You will be more than fine with it.


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## brenndatomu (Nov 12, 2013)

Yeah, fossil fuel furnace is way oversized so that it only has to run 10 minutes or so, cuz when mamas cold, she wants heat NOW!  Wood stove heat is constant, it's kinda like the ole tortoise and the hare, tortoise (wood heat) wins!
Caddy is rated for 2500 sq ft (or more) isn't it?


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## wood butcher (Nov 12, 2013)

I have a Napoleon HMF 200 wood furnace. It can be wood/oil/electric if you want or any combination. I have the wood/ electric as I got rid of the old oil furnace. This is my second winter with it and no complaints. I would recommend the Caddy too. The Napoleon is a copy of the Caddy. I am heating an old school house and it does well in the middle of winter.


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## Victorian Stove (Nov 12, 2013)

Have you checked out the Fire Chief wood furnace, American made and less expensive. It burns wood and coal and has several sizes. They are a baffled stove but make up for that with a thermostat and electric draft controller.


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## Jonathan Stroble (Nov 13, 2013)

STIHLY DAN said:


> That 118,000 is for fossil fuels. Heat on then off with many cycles. The wood furnace will be continuous heat output, You will be more than fine with it.



Thanks, that's very helpful.  I didn't understand the difference before your reply.

Does that mean also that the blower on a wood furnace will produce a more gentle airflow at the heating vents because it is designed to run for longer periods?


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## brenndatomu (Nov 13, 2013)

I'd stick with a furnace that is meant to burn wood only if that is what you want to heat with. Combo furnaces (my Yukon included) sacrifice efficiency to be able to burn multiple fuels. Better to "specialize" ...JMO


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## sloeffle (Nov 13, 2013)

Jonathan Stroble said:


> Thanks, that's very helpful.  I didn't understand the difference before your reply.
> 
> Does that mean also that the blower on a wood furnace will produce a more gentle airflow at the heating vents because it is designed to run for longer periods?



The Caddy has a four speed blower. You could set the blower to the lowest setting to allow for a more a heat pump type effect but you might end up loosing a lot of heat out of the flue. I have mine set at the medium-low speed and that seems to be a good mix of pushing air into the house, and keep my flue temps at a reasonable temperature. You can also change the off and on set point on the fan limit.

If you are interested in traveling to Ohio I might know of a dealer that might be able to beat the $3,700 price. Bringing cash to the table also helps. PM if you are interested in their info.


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## brenndatomu (Nov 13, 2013)

Jonathan Stroble said:


> Thanks, that's very helpful.  I didn't understand the difference before your reply.
> 
> Does that mean also that the blower on a wood furnace will produce a more gentle airflow at the heating vents because it is designed to run for longer periods?




Basically, yes. Since a fossil fuel furnace has a high BTU output for a short time, that means that the blower has to run at a _high speed_ to distribute that heat throughout the house. Conversely, a wood furnace normally has a lower BTU output over a long time, so the blower only has to run at a low speed to distribute the heat.
Ever notice that when a gas or oil furnace blower kicks on, that the first few seconds of the blast of air coming out of the vents is _really_ cold? Even if a blower does cycle on and off, with a wood furnace, the first of the air will normally not be cold, because the blower needs to run often (due to the constant fire) so the ductwork never gets a chance to cool off. So yeah, gentle, even heat!


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## Jonathan Stroble (Dec 19, 2013)

Purchased a PSG Caddy from Papa Bear Riverside Stove in Marathon, New York.  Worked with Jim by phone, who was very friendly and helpful with purchase and delivery.

Total cost for my PSG Caddy (PF01010) was $4,215 USD which included the furnace, blower assembly, and fan limit control; sales tax; and, a $100 delivery fee to cover Jim's gas costs for hauling everything a couple hours north to my house.

Installation is set for Jan. 6 by a local HVAC outfit, Country Suburban.  I will be replacing a Brock wood-burning furnace which I believe is about 30 years old.  It shares ductwork with a Williamson Centennial Low Boy oil-burning furnace which just burned through $586 worth of #2 heating oil in about 35 days, thermostat set on 68.  (Yikes.)

Will report back re: first burn.


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## M1sterM (Dec 19, 2013)

Thanks for the update, Jonathan.  Hope you keep posting good pics of the install and your impressions once it's up an running!


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## Jonathan Stroble (Dec 21, 2013)

Here's the Caddy uncrated.  Haven't yet uncrated the blower assembly.

Several of the firebricks 
	

		
			
		

		
	





	

		
			
		

		
	
 inside the furnace collapsed during delivery, despite a wraparound cardboard insert apparently designed to prevent that.  I stacked them back up to the best of my ability.  One of the upper rear firebricks is precariously balanced and wants to fall forward into the firebox.


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## laynes69 (Dec 21, 2013)

That's one thing I would change is add some brick retainers in the firebox. When I clean our heat exchanger, I pull everything forward instead of inside the fire for removal. I love our Caddy, they are a nice looking furnace.


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## Jonathan Stroble (Jan 15, 2014)

Finally got the PSG Caddy installed last night and it's up and running.  Still figuring out the most efficient way to operate it... it's going to be a learning process.  It's not too cold out this week, for January -- lows in the 20s, highs in the upper 30s -- so it's a good time to learn the furnace without feeling pressed to fight frigid temperatures.

I've installed a magnetic flue temperature gauge and I'm watching the relationship between various loads and the flue temperature.  Highest I've let it go so far is about 500 F; from what I've been able to learn online, the safest operating zone is somewhere around 350 to 450 F.  (One website suggested 400 to 900 F but that seems really high to me?)  Fortunately, with the ceramic glass door it's easy to see what's going on inside the firebox.


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## maple1 (Jan 15, 2014)

There is so much variability in measuring flue temps that it could be borderline dangerous - it seems to be the one thing that gets my BP on the rise. You need to make sure you are comparing apples to apples in how & where you're measuring them, and what you're comparing them to.

I have a magnetic guage right beside a probe guage, and the magnetic reads 100°c less than the probe when burning. IMO if you're seeing 500f on a magnetic, that's too hot.

Is there a recommended flue temp & measuring procedure in your manual?

I think it is also quite important to tune your chimney draft into what the manufacturer specs, and keep it there, with a barometric damper.


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## sloeffle (Jan 15, 2014)

I rarely see flue temps over 200F with my magnetic thermometer on my Caddy. 500F is way too high. I also have a barometric draft damper that probably makes them somewhat cooler. As maple suggested I think you need to check your draft speed with a menometer.  The manual should have the correct amount of WC to set your damper with.

Until you get you draft speed under control I would try to burn smaller fires. Smaller hotter fires create less creosote also. I generally only fill mine up about a third of the way unless we are in the middle of a polar vortex.


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## laynes69 (Jan 15, 2014)

500 degree surface temps on the flue is way too high. Usually with a very hot fire, I see 250 degrees external, maybe 300 if the damper is wide open. I suspect your not running a barometric damper.... How tall is your chimney? You can't use recommended flue temps with the Caddy compared to other stoves. That's because the secondary heat exchanger picks up a lot of heat that otherwise would go up the chimney. If your seeing up to 500 degrees external, I would suspect that's close to if not overfiring. Did you get the draft speeds measured, and how are you loading and operating the furnace, and what is your blower speeds. Sorry for all the questions, just trying to get a feel for your setup.


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## Jonathan Stroble (Jan 15, 2014)

I may have overfired it for 5-10 minutes last night during first operation.  The magnetic flue temperature gauge, placed about 18"-24" from the exhaust port on the back of the furnace, touched about 500 F which was just on the upper border of the "safe operation" zone of the thermometer and just on the lower border of the "too hot" zone.  (The "too cold/creosote" zone runs from 0 F to about 250 F.)  The firebox was loaded about 1/2 full, a roaring fire, and the air inlet was all the way open.  When I saw the flue temperature at 500 F, I closed the air inlet completely and the temperature quickly dropped below 400 F.  Since then, I have not filled the firebox past about 1/3, and the highest flue temp I've seen is 420 F.

maple1:  I don't recall seeing a recommended flue temperature in the operating manual for the PSG Caddy.  The recommended draft is 0.04" to 0.06" with a barometric damper recommended if the draft is higher than 0.06".

laynes69:  The chimney runs from the basement through two stories and an attic, so I estimate it's about 30-35 feet.  I have not had the draft speed measured with a manometer, and I am not using a barometric damper.  I am burning relatively dry, seasoned hardwood about 18" long; since last night I have been cautious not to put more than 2-3 sticks of wood on at a time.  I don't know the blower speed, it's currently at factory setting.  I'm going to check it out tonight when I get home.  The fan limit control is also at factory setting, which looks to be about 100/off, 150/on.  There's another limit at about 250 which I haven't figured out yet; safety limit?


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## PassionForFire&Water (Jan 15, 2014)

400-500F with a magnetic temp gage seems way to high.
That means inside the flue pipe it's 700-800F.
This is all lost heat
I think you need to slow down your draft


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## maple1 (Jan 15, 2014)

I would have to say that you definitely have too much draft with a chimney that tall & no barometric damper.

Mine is about 30' tall & it pulls 0.1" easily when the fire is burning, with my baro closed, and with no effort made at sealing any of the pipe joints. That's with no wind blowing. Wind gusts can pull it way up to 0.3" - which is a very dangerous situation to leave unchecked. You definitely need a barometric damper, and I would also get a Dywer manometer to set it up with. They are cheap insurance.

And I think I've beaten around the bush long enough on the other issue & just come right out with it  - I think magnetic flue temp guages are garbage, bordering on dangerous. I think some have used probe BBQ temp guages (the dial kind that go on the BBQ cover) that you can insert into a hole drilled into your pipe - but I got my temp guage from my boiler vendor.


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## brenndatomu (Jan 15, 2014)

Jonathan Stroble said:


> I don't recall seeing a recommended flue temperature in the operating manual for the PSG Caddy. The recommended draft is 0.04" to 0.06" with a barometric damper recommended if the draft is higher than 0.06".


They have done extensive testing, with a -.04" to -.06" WC draft, they know that the flue temps will be right.



maple1 said:


> You definitely need a barometric damper, and I would also get a Dywer manometer to set it up with. They are cheap insurance.


I have now bought (2) Dwyer Mark II manometers from different sellers on fleabay (1 for me, 1 for sis/BIL) if you watch you can get 'em $20 (or less) delivered. I have mine mounted on the wall, hooked up permanently.


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## laynes69 (Jan 15, 2014)

In all reality, even just getting a barometric damper and setting it to high should put you within operating range. I've ran our furnace before at .08" with no problems, but .05-.06" is the magic number for efficiency.

What your doing now is dangerous, and I don't want to scare you but... The furnace operates via thermostat on the wall. If by chance you loaded up your furnace and went to bed and the damper opened for heat, your creating a forge inside your furnace. Who knows how long it will burn this way before the damper closes. By having the draft at recommended levels, there's less chance for issues like this. That and you'll be sending a lot less heat up the chimney and more heat will be going in the house. I made the mistake of not latching the door one night and went to bed tired. I didn't know about it until my wife found it in the morning. If I had draft like that, more than likely I might not still have my furnace.


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## Jonathan Stroble (Jan 15, 2014)

No worries, I've taken the wood-burning furnace offline and I'm heating with the oil-burning furnace until I can have the draft measured.  If the draft exceeds the recommended limit, I will install a baro before I use the Caddy again.


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## maple1 (Jan 16, 2014)

I would just buy a manometer & permanently mount it. It's cheap.

The problem with just having someone come measure it is that will only give you a snapshot. Draft can vary a lot depending on conditions - he might happen to catch the draft when it's lowest and think it's OK when it won't be when it's real cold out or there's a wind blowing. And he'll have to come back to tune in your baro with the manometer when you get it. Also, having the manometer mounted where you can easily see it when tending the furnace will allow you to tell at a glance if the baro by chance is sticking - they can do that on occasion.


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## Jonathan Stroble (Jan 16, 2014)

A manometer like this one?  http://www.dwyer-inst.com/Product/Pressure/Manometers/FluidFilled/SeriesMarkII

I found a YouTube video of a person demonstrating one of these:  

What confuses me is that the manometer in a flue draft application seems to be using the negative end of the scale... which maxes out at -0.05.  How do you measure beyond that with this manometer?


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## maple1 (Jan 16, 2014)

That's the one - Mark II Model 25.

You just hook the hose up so it pulls up the tube rather than down (don't hook it to the guage fitting he used but hook it to the other one - I think he used the left one, use the right one), which goes way up to 3". You can also use it to tune in your air ducts for static pressure balancing - but I've never done that so can't give any input on it.

Should be able to find one on Ebay - I got mine from DwyerDirect site last year, not sure if that's still available or not.

EDIT: you just hang it on screws on the wall, can leave it there all the time. I have a short piece of brake line I attached to my flue pipe, I just stick the other end of the hose on the other end of that.


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## brenndatomu (Jan 16, 2014)

What he said ^^^. I've seen that video, he has it backwards, well, it's actually correct, but for our intended use it needs to go the other way. Just hook the line up to the other port.


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## Jonathan Stroble (Jan 16, 2014)

Dwyer Mark II Model 25 ordered from www.dwyer-inst.com.  Not sure if it comes with red fluid; I didn't see an option to order it separately.

laynes69, responding to your earlier question, here is a pic of the blower wiring:





In case it's not clear from the picture, positions 1 (white), 2 (red), and 5 (black) are connected on the right side.  According to the manual, these are the positions for "Common," "Low," and "High," respectively.

The blower manual advises: "When connecting the blower, it is suggested to use the speed "LOW" (summer speed), «MED LOW» or «MED HIGH» in heating, depending on ventilation needs."  So I need to decipher the wiring and figure out what it all means.  I recall somebody (maybe earlier in this thread?) saying that he had best results with a lower blower setting.


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## maple1 (Jan 16, 2014)

It will come with fluid. You should also be able to buy it separately though.


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## laynes69 (Jan 16, 2014)

When it was -14 with chills of -40 I was running the blower on high speed. Now that it's warmed back up, medium low seems to do just fine. We don't have a blower speed switch, so I just have my common and my blower.


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## STIHLY DAN (Jan 17, 2014)

No need for the monometer. Just put in a baro, there like 25 bucks and install in minutes. Instructions MUST say you need one. Damn my furnace came with one.


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## brenndatomu (Jan 17, 2014)

Dang dude, where you buyin your BDs stihly?! I couldn't find one for much less than twice that! Also, how the heck you set the BD w/o a manometer? I have found that those "ballpark" marks that they put on 'em are somewhat less than accurate! I 'spose better n nuttin though...


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## STIHLY DAN (Jan 17, 2014)

I got mine at lowes, it wasn't till I came home that I found the one Kuuma sent. I have a monometer and have checked mine and many others. All the new installs are close enough, Its the older ones that get soot build up on the back of them. Whether it be fossil or wood fuels.


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## Jonathan Stroble (Jan 26, 2014)

Manual says that the ideal draft is 0.04 - 0.06" WC.  Rookie question:  is that with a cold flue or a hot one?  I measured both and got an average of 0.03" cold, and 0.08" with a heating furnace before the tubing melted.  If the correct method is to measure hot, how do I connect the Dwyer manometer to a hot flue?


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## laynes69 (Jan 26, 2014)

You don't have to permanently mount it, just have it in enough to get a reading. Are those settings with the barometric damper?

You need to set the furnace when the flue is hot. That way it doesn't exceed your set point. I use a small 1/4" copper tube attached to the rubber tube so things won't melt.


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## maple1 (Jan 26, 2014)

Jonathan Stroble said:


> Manual says that the ideal draft is 0.04 - 0.06" WC.  Rookie question:  is that with a cold flue or a hot one?  I measured both and got an average of 0.03" cold, and 0.08" with a heating furnace before the tubing melted.  If the correct method is to measure hot, how do I connect the Dwyer manometer to a hot flue?



Measure with fire burning. I used a 2' long piece of brake line between my flue pipe & manometer tubing. It's permanently mounted like that.


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## jtheye (Nov 27, 2015)

I bought the hybrid 200 with 20k electric backup and the whole thing was mis-wired from factory.  Electrical from factory was wired wrong in connection pigtails and ended up costing me a whole new blower...  installation and blower replacement cost me another $2200.  That doesn't include the huge scare we got when our house filled with smoke from the factory wiring that melted.  Boy that was a scare, thought my house was on fire.  I am sure mine was not the only furnace wired wrong, but according to the manufacturer they have never had that happen.  This happen to anyone else?  So that you understand what your getting into, total bill for furnace, installation, fixing Napoleon's defective product with new blower....$15800.... yes that was 15 thousand eight hundred U.S.D.  Napoleon does not stand behind their product and I know for a fact that my unit could not have been the only unit sent out with connection pig tails wired wrong.


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## jtheye (Nov 27, 2015)

wood butcher said:


> I have a Napoleon HMF 200 wood furnace. It can be wood/oil/electric if you want or any combination. I have the wood/ electric as I got rid of the old oil furnace. This is my second winter with it and no complaints. I would recommend the Caddy too. The Napoleon is a copy of the Caddy. I am heating an old school house and it does well in the middle of winter.



I bought the hybrid 200 with 20k electric backup and the whole thing was mis-wired from factory.  Electrical from factory was wired wrong in connection pigtails and ended up costing me a whole new blower...  installation and blower replacement cost me another $2200.  That doesn't include the huge scare we got when our house filled with smoke from the factory wiring that melted.  Boy that was a scare, thought my house was on fire.  I am sure mine was not the only furnace wired wrong, but according to the manufacturer they have never had that happen.  This happen to anyone else?  So that you understand what your getting into, total bill for furnace, installation, fixing Napoleon's defective product with new blower....$15800.... yes that was 15 thousand eight hundred U.S.D.


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## brenndatomu (Nov 27, 2015)

jtheye said:


> total bill for furnace, installation, fixing Napoleon's defective product with new blower....$15800.... yes that was 15 thousand eight hundred U.S.D


   That's like 3 Kuumas dude! Only if you bought 3 Kuumas all at once they'd prolly send somebody out to put 'em in for ya! Definitely not tell ya tough luck pal! That's rough, I have heard similar poor customer service and high price stories about Napolean before


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## laynes69 (Nov 28, 2015)

I don't usually involve lawyers, but I would have in that case. Small claims court, or something. I really like the design of the units from napoleon, but you're not the first who has complained about dealing with the company. Wow is all I can say!


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## STIHLY DAN (Nov 28, 2015)

16 grand might exceed small claims court. You really got screwed! sorry to hear that.


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## lexybird (Nov 30, 2015)

I think I'd start another thread specifically on this dilemma , my heart goes out to you and I hate to see somebody else get the shaft from them . People need to know about this to make an informed choice and see their customer service in action . I hope you get that resolved ..16 grand wow that is totally lawsuit worthy especially if you can prove it was in correctly wired from the factory


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