# Fancy pants  2 stroke chain saw oil?



## greythorn3 (Mar 5, 2012)

now that i got me one of them fancy stihl saws, i was wondering what was there anything special for 2 stroke oil to use? 

in my old junkers i just throw any 2 stroke oil i got in  usually walmart, or some outboard 2 stroke oil. both are blue for some reason. fancy lookin anyhow.

i also use used motor oil for the bar oil, but am guilty of being to lazy allot and running bar without oil.   hehehe


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## jeff_t (Mar 5, 2012)

A friend has been running synthetic pull-on oil from walmart for many years. I switched to it a couple of years ago, after I burned down my Dolmar. I was using Klotz, left over from the fun days. I think it contributed to the failure. Definitely want to use oil for air cooled engines. I've been happy with the Poulan oil so far, though I haven't torn anything apart to see what it looks like.


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## Hogwildz (Mar 5, 2012)

I use whatever the hardware store has. I did read somewhere to avoid the stuff that is also good for marine use.


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## Jags (Mar 5, 2012)

With the minimal cost difference and relatively low consumption, I have been going with the synthetic stuff.  I have no way of proving if it is working any better or not.


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## Butcher (Mar 5, 2012)

Is it a new saw? The dealer told me tis fall when I bought a new Sthil that if I ran only the synthetic oil they would double the amount of time on the warrantee.


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## Clarkbug (Mar 5, 2012)

I say run with any name-brand synthetic oil.  Im new to saws in general, so mine are all used.  Had an issue with one that was carboned up pretty badly, and running some Stihl Ultra in it seemed to help remove the build up.  Plus if I run a little heavy on the ratio or tune it too fat, I dont need to worry about any buildup again.  

Maybe its just a mental thing, but saws are expensive, and oil is relatively cheap.  If I make another order from Baileys, I would get their synthetic mix, seems pretty darn cheap.


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## rkshed (Mar 5, 2012)

30 years of riding and racing 2 stroke motorcycles in the woods. I use Golden Spectro in my saws now, ssame as my bikes.


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## HittinSteel (Mar 6, 2012)

Clarkbug said:
			
		

> I say run with any name-brand synthetic oil.  Im new to saws in general, so mine are all used.  Had an issue with one that was carboned up pretty badly, and running some Stihl Ultra in it seemed to help remove the build up.  Plus if I run a little heavy on the ratio or tune it too fat, I dont need to worry about any buildup again.
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> Maybe its just a mental thing, but saws are expensive, and oil is relatively cheap.  If I make another order from Baileys, I would get their synthetic mix, seems pretty darn cheap.



I'm almost through a case of Woodland Pro Synthetic with no issues....... not suprising as it is the same stuff as echo powerblend and dolmar full synthetic.


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## taxidermist (Mar 6, 2012)

stihl oil


Rob


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## Bigg_Redd (Mar 6, 2012)

greythorn3 said:
			
		

> now that i got me one of them fancy stihl saws, i was wondering what was there anything special for 2 stroke oil to use?
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> in my old junkers i just throw any 2 stroke oil i got in  usually walmart, or some outboard 2 stroke oil. both are blue for some reason. fancy lookin anyhow.
> 
> i also use used motor oil for the bar oil, but am guilty of being to lazy allot and running bar without oil.   hehehe



Literally ANY 2 stroke oil will work and work just fine in a 044


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## moody (Mar 6, 2012)

i have been using shindaiwa oil for 18 years now it also has fuel stableizer in it .


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## barn burner (Mar 6, 2012)

rkshed said:
			
		

> 30 years of riding and racing 2 stroke motorcycles in the woods. I use Golden Spectro in my saws now, ssame as my bikes.



Really? I always used Klotz in my bikes and occasionally Maxima castor (only because of the sweet smell...lol)

Back to topic. I have the baddest saw around, a Poulan Pro something or other with an 18" bar. This thing gets hammered with any 2 stroke oil I can find. If I had the privilege of owning a Stihl, I would probably use the best oil money could buy.....just sayin


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## greythorn3 (Mar 6, 2012)

to be honest with you guys i been thinking of trying whale oil in the stihl, you guys ever try that?


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## wkpoor (Mar 6, 2012)

HittinSteel said:
			
		

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+1 However biggest enemy is probably lack of oil regardless of kind.


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## MasterMech (Mar 6, 2012)

Greythorn,

You should be running a 2-stroke oil rated for air-cooled 2-stroke engines.  Synthetic is better but conventional will do fine in that 044 as well.  Oil rated for outboard/marine use or liquid-cooled ATV's/dirtbikes is not designed to take the high running temperatures your 044 will see.  You don't have to have fancy pants oil, just oil rated for air-cooled 2-strokes.


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## TreePointer (Mar 6, 2012)

greythorn3 said:
			
		

> now that i got me one of them fancy stihl saws, i was wondering what was there anything special for 2 stroke oil to use?
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> in my old junkers i just throw any 2 stroke oil i got in  usually walmart, or some *outboard 2 stroke oil*. both are blue for some reason. fancy lookin anyhow.
> 
> i also use used motor oil for the bar oil, but am guilty of being to lazy allot and running bar without oil.   hehehe




NEVER use outboard (water cooled) 2-cycle in an air cooled engine such as found in chainsaws.  It will eventually shorten engine life and may eventually cause catastrophic failure.

For chainsaws and similar air-cooled 2-cycle engines, use a quality 2-cycle engine oil designed for air cooled engines.  If you aren't sure, use a modern oil (recently manufactured) by a quality chainsaw maker (Stihl, Husqvarna, Dolmar, etc.).  Unless you are using your chainsaw for a special purpose like milling, follow the directions on the bottle (mix at 50:1).


EDIT:  MasterMech, you beat me to it!  I need to type faster, lol.


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## Bigg_Redd (Mar 6, 2012)

TreePointer said:
			
		

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And pine causes chimney fires. . .


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## Bigg_Redd (Mar 6, 2012)

FACT: Liquid cooled engines run on much tighter tolerances (higher compression, more RPMs) than air cooled and require MORE from premix oil, not less.


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## Bigg_Redd (Mar 6, 2012)

FACT: there's nothing special about premix oil with a picture of a chainsaw on it.


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## TreePointer (Mar 6, 2012)

Bigg_Redd said:
			
		

> And pine causes chimney fires. . .



No, pine does not cause chimney fires.


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## TreePointer (Mar 6, 2012)

Bigg_Redd said:
			
		

> FACT: Liquid cooled engines run on much tighter tolerances (higher compression, more RPMs) than air cooled and require MORE from premix oil, not less.



You are correct, but you're missing the point.  It's not just about the quantity of oil, it's about the nature of the oil itself.


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## TreePointer (Mar 6, 2012)

Bigg_Redd said:
			
		

> FACT: there's nothing special about premix oil with a picture of a chainsaw on it.



True, but I stated for those who are not sure (n00bs and recent owners) about the quality or nature of a certain oil in a big box store, they can be assured that a mix from a chainsaw maker that's run to specifications can be run with confidence.  This is for those who aren't saw/engine junkies like the rest of us.


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## Bigg_Redd (Mar 6, 2012)

TreePointer said:
			
		

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Please tell me everything you know about the nature or premix oil.  Start with film strength. . .


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## Bigg_Redd (Mar 6, 2012)

Or maybe start with hydrophilic properties of synthetic vs dino oil. . .


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## TreePointer (Mar 6, 2012)

Big_Redd, I think you are the one here with the refinery background, right?  I appreciate any information and am willing to learn.  I say that without sarcasm.

My understanding is from my chemistry degree and materials science & engineering work.  Although this doesn't make me an expert in this particular field and I have not specialized in petrol-chemicals and formulations, I should be able to understand *any reference link you provide*.  Of course, this is an internet forum and you could say I'm fabricating my background.  In fact, any of us could have that skepticism about one another, so that's why I provided a link to a reference and not my own writing/papers.  *Please provide a link so I (we all) can learn.*

Reference link:  http://www.ultralighthomepage.com/OIL/oil.html
Excerpt:


> Water cooled two-cycle engine oils require higher levels of a heavy oil to prevent piston and cylinder wall scuffing. Because of their high average piston temperature, lighter oils evaporate too quickly from the piston cylinder contact area. The heavy base oil, which vaporizes at very high temperatures, resists evaporation and remains in place to provide lubrication to the piston and cylinder. *Air cooled oil formulations must have much lower levels of the heavy base oil than water cooled engine oils. These oils require only a small amount of heavy oil to provide protection against piston scuffing and seizure at peak temperatures. High levels of heavy base oils in an oil formulated for air cooled engines can cause engine deposits. These deposits form as a result of incomplete burning of the heavy oil. The deposits can cause piston ring sticking and can eventually plug or disrupt the flow of the exhaust system, resulting in power loss and possible engine damage.* Detergent additives should not be used in water cooled two-cycle oil formulations. When burned with the fuel, detergents produce an ash deposit in the cylinders. This ash deposit can possibly foul spark plugs., form exhaust port deposits which cause loss of power, and possibly create cylinder hot spots that can cause destructive pre-ignition. On the other hand, the only way to protect air cooled two-cycle engines against piston ring sticking at their high peak temperatures is to include some detergent additives in the oil formulation. Detergents provide high temperature deposit control not available from other additives used in the oil. However, in the air cooled engine, any ash deposits that could form from the detergents are dislodged by engine vibration and exhausted from the engine.



I'll try to find a better reference to discuss....


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## JustWood (Mar 6, 2012)

TreePointer said:
			
		

> Big_Redd, I think you are the one here with the refinery background, right?  I appreciate any information and am willing to learn.  I say that without sarcasm.
> 
> My understanding is from my chemistry degree and materials science & engineering work.  Although this doesn't make me an expert in this particular field and I have not specialized in petrol-chemicals and formulations, I should be able to understand *any reference link you provide*.  Of course, this is an internet forum and you could say I'm fabricating my background.  In fact, any of us could have that skepticism about one another, so that's why I provided a link to a reference and not my own writing/papers.  *Please provide a link so I (we all) can learn.*
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I'm also interested in more info as I have nearly 2 cases of outboard oil I got at a yard sale for next to nothing that I'm about to start using.


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## TreePointer (Mar 6, 2012)

Also, I do understand that there are special formulations (multi-purpose) that are supposed to work fine in either type of 2-cycle engine.


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## Bigg_Redd (Mar 6, 2012)

Has anyone on this board EVER seen an OIL RELATED failure?  Ever?  

I never have.  Not in outboards, chainsaws, or motorcycles (lots of hours with all three).  And, I don't know anyone who has.

Straight gassed?  Yes.  

Jetted lean?  Yes.

Failed because of type of oil in an otherwise properly tuned engine?  No. Never.


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## Bigg_Redd (Mar 6, 2012)

finalLEE said:
			
		

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I have burned gallons on TCW-3 in non-outboard 2 strokes.  Your saws will love it.


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## TreePointer (Mar 6, 2012)

Bigg_Redd said:
			
		

> Has anyone on this board EVER seen an OIL RELATED failure?  Ever?
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> I never have.  Not in outboards, chainsaws, or motorcycles (lots of hours with all three).  And, I don't know anyone who has.
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Link?


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## Bigg_Redd (Mar 6, 2012)

TreePointer said:
			
		

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So I guess the number for you is zero as well?  

I just googled "premix oil related engine failures"

Zero articles on "I used the wrong oil and burned up my engine"


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## TreePointer (Mar 6, 2012)

In an effort to get statements from qualified persons (more knowledgeable than I am) and not uncontrolled data or anecdotal evidence, I've just put in some requests and will make more requests for technical papers (and otherwise) to various OPE manufacturers and oil companies regarding this issue.  I'll post the information as soon as I get replies.  Maybe I'll make a new discussion topic for this.

Here are MORE LINKS that support NOT USING WATER-COOLED OIL in chainsaws:

Reference link:  http://husqvarna.custhelp.com/app/answers/detail/a_id/122/kw/2_cycle_oil
Excerpt:


> Can I use outboard two stroke motor oil in my air cooled outdoor power equipment?
> NO, outboard two stroke motor oil designed for water cooled engines does not provide the needed protection or lubrication for two stroke air cooled engines.



Reference link (any modern Stihl chainsaw manual - MS362 manual p.28, PDF page 30):  http://www.stihlusa.com/stihl_ownersmanuals/MS362_Manual.pdf
Excerpt:


> Do not use BIA or TCW rated (two-stroke water cooled) mix oils or other mix oils that state they are for use in both water cooled and air cooled engines (e.g., outboard motors, snowmobiles, chain saws, mopeds, etc.).


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## Bigg_Redd (Mar 6, 2012)

TreePointer said:
			
		

> In an effort to get statements from qualified persons (more knowledgeable than I am) and not uncontrolled data or anecdotal evidence, I've just put in some requests and will make more requests for technical papers (and otherwise) to various OPE manufacturers and oil companies regarding this issue.  I'll post the information as soon as I get replies.  Maybe I'll make a new discussion topic for this.
> 
> Here are MORE LINKS that support NOT USING AIR-COOLED OIL:
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FACT: All TCW-3 oils exceed both JASCO and API standards for premix oil.


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## TreePointer (Mar 6, 2012)

Bigg_Redd said:
			
		

> FACT: All TCW-3 oils exceed both JASCO and API standards for premix oil.



Yea, but that statement doesn't necessarily mean that Stihl (and other OPE manufacturers) approves TC-W3 oils for all their equipment, especially the new strato engines and 4-mix engines.


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## Bigg_Redd (Mar 6, 2012)

TreePointer said:
			
		

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But we're talking about a 044 here, no?  And do you think the Stihl branded oil is differently formulated for the fancy new low emissions saws?  Like they sent new oil to dealers especially for the new saws?   Really?  You think that?


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## Bigg_Redd (Mar 6, 2012)

TreePointer said:
			
		

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Also, API and JASCO ratings are not the be-all and end-all, but they are the only standards by which premix oil is actually tested and rated.


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## TreePointer (Mar 6, 2012)

Bigg_Redd said:
			
		

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I never stated that Stihl branded oil is differently formulated for new low emissions laws.  The new engines and overall designs are.  There is still a "no TCW oils" statement for those engines.  What I was attempting to state is that it's even more important now to use the right oil.  Stihl dealer techs. will tell you that even regular Stihl oil (orange bottle) will cause problems in the 4-Mix engines--they've seen it many times.  And, no, when it comes to the 4-Mix engines, it's not just a ploy by Stihl to get us to buy more expensive full-synthetic Stihl Ultra.

Here's the unanswered question:  *Why does Stihl say no TCW oils in the MS-362 manual?*


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## TreePointer (Mar 6, 2012)

Bigg_Redd said:
			
		

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They are the only *industry wide* standards that are recognized if you want to pay them money to have it printed on your oil bottle.  It doesn't preclude Stihl or any other OPE mfg. from using a higher standard or special requirement on their own equipment.  There's no reason that Stihl can't say API and JASCO rated oils are okay as long as they are not rated for water cooled engines.


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## TreePointer (Mar 6, 2012)

TreePointer said:
			
		

> Here's the unanswered question:  *Why does Stihl say no TCW oils in the MS-362 manual?*



That ^


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## MasterMech (Mar 6, 2012)

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Because TCW is short for Two-Cycle Water-cooled.  The standard ONLY applies to WATER-COOLED engines.  Is somebody running a water-cooled 044 here?  Just because a good oil is TCW-3 certified does NOT mean it is appropriate for use in an AIR-COOLED engine.  You may be indeed using a TCW-3 oil with "no-problems" but I've been eating at Mickey D's for decades with "no problems" too. ;-)  Any complications from using a TCW oil in air-cooled engines are likely to show up late in the product's life-cycle and be blamed on bad fuel, operator error, invading aliens, etc. or just be written off as normal wear & tear on an engine that's X years old.

FACT:  Air-cooled engines ARE designed with "looser" mechanical clearances than their water-cooled counterparts because of the greater operating temperatures they must withstand, not because they are "more demanding." 

FACT: TCW rated oils are NOT NECESSARILY designed to deal with the significantly greater temperatures found internally on air-cooled, high-RPM engines like the one found on the 044 or any _modern_ chainsaw/trimmer/blower.  Granddad's old Homelite Super XL (Blue Case of course!) was just fine running on 30wt non-detergent but adventures over 8K RPM were rare.

BTW: This thread would be much more reader-friendly if y'all could combine multiple thoughts into one post.  :smirk:


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## rkshed (Mar 6, 2012)

barn burner said:
			
		

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I ran into guy cutting the same area I was and smelled a wicked familiar sweet smell. He was using Klotz too. Brings back memories...


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## Bigg_Redd (Mar 6, 2012)

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Because they HAVE to say it.  Here's some other questions: Is the 362 more powerful than the 361?  Is it lighter?  Is it more reliable?  More durable?  No, no, no, and, no.  Then why did Stihl introduce it?  Say it with me. . . REG-EWE-LAY-SHUNS!  Because it's the best 60cc saw they could make that met some bullsh_t EPA standard written by some clueless bureaucrat.  Everything in that manual is about limiting liability and keeping Uncle Sam's EPA off their back.  If the manual said, "use any old oil you want" that would sortov defeat the purpose of the heavier, more expensive, low emissions saws, wouldn't it?


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## MasterMech (Mar 6, 2012)

Bigg_Redd said:
			
		

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How much you wanna bet that same line is in the MS361, MS440, 044, 034, hell even an 056 manual? (I would have to do some diggin' to get that 056 Manual out...)


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## MofoG23 (Mar 6, 2012)

as someone posted earlier, the cost difference is next to nothing so I have been running the full synthetic stihl oil...still have a dozen bottles on the shelf.  Well worth the extra couple bucks, especially when compared to the purchase price of the saw.   :gulp:

...its a premium tool - treat it that way.


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## MofoG23 (Mar 6, 2012)

Bigg_Redd said:
			
		

> Has anyone on this board EVER seen an OIL RELATED failure?  Ever?
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> I never have.  Not in outboards, chainsaws, or motorcycles (lots of hours with all three).  And, I don't know anyone who has.
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not sure if we are trying to prevent a complete failure/lock up - I believe we are trying to extend the overall operating life before a rebuild is required.

Anyways, can someone prove that synthetic stihl oil as being inferior or not worth the few extra cents?


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## ScotO (Mar 6, 2012)

I have been running TCW oil in my saws for YEARS with no problem......ESPECIALLY since this ethanol chit gas came on the market.  I am fully convinced that the ethanol destabilizes the synthetic oil and shortens the life of a piston and cylinder.  However, I richen my oil/gas mix ratio so I am running more oil in the saw than is recommended.  And I tune the saw to run that heavier mix.   I have never ever had a mechanical failure do to the oil mix in my saws, EVER.  And I cut a TON of wood year-round.  Just my two cents, and I agree with Redd......that synthetic oil, combined with how LITTLE they recommend you run in the saw, is by design in the industry.   It may help emissions, but it isn't helping your saw, UNLESS you are running AvGas in it...that is the only way I would use synthetic oil in ANY of my machines.....just my 2 pennies on the issue.....


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## firefighterjake (Mar 6, 2012)

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Before he bought a four stroke Yamaha, my brother in law was running a Polaris two stroke sled that he said required a snythetic oil and he always bought the Polaris brand . . . I loved the smell of that two stroke . . . and I could often gauge how close or how far behind him I was in the woods by the smell since it had a distinctive bubblegum/cotton candy like odor. Breathing in bad pollution never smelled so good.


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## mecreature (Mar 6, 2012)

I used Mercury Premium 2-Cycle TC-W3 Oil in a poulan 2150 for years. I ran it in everything 2 stroke. Its still runs. 

Now I run everything with stihl oil in my 280. thats the plan anyway.

I might even put a little in my 1500 chevy for a pick me up.

If I was you I would only run the FancyPantsÂ® MotoMixÂ®.


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## greythorn3 (Mar 6, 2012)

sounds like im fine running the free outboard oil i got in my 044 as i have been running it in all my other 2 strokes then. wow this sure is a big debate.


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## mecreature (Mar 6, 2012)

click the image.
get the manual and read it..    044


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## Highbeam (Mar 6, 2012)

Poulan synthetic from walmart for the saw and gallons of supertech TCW 2 stroke oil for the diesel truck.


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## jeff_t (Mar 6, 2012)

Highbeam said:
			
		

> gallons of supertech TCW 2 stroke oil for the diesel truck.



Elaborate, please. That thing got a Detroit? I remember pouring oil in them, but only because it ran out the bottom.


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## Pallet Pete (Mar 7, 2012)

I have a couple of buddies who swer by this stuff http://www.amsoil.com/a/synthetic-2-cycle-oil personally I just use the oil from the manufacturer. In my case poulan synthetic and echo synthetic which works great. I have run amsoil in my car before and can tell the difference between cheap oil and that there fancy stuff  ;-)  

Edit ) here is the right link http://www.amsoil.com/storefront/atp.aspx 



Good luck 
Pete


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## simple.serf (Mar 7, 2012)

jeff_t said:
			
		

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Going to guess it's because the new low sulphur fuels suck at lubing the injector pumps. I do the same thing on my Massey unless I am burning #2 fuel oil in it. Damn injector pump is more than the whole machine is worth.


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## MasterMech (Mar 7, 2012)

Pallet Pete said:
			
		

> I have a couple of buddies who swer by this stuff http://www.amsoil.com/a/synthetic-2-cycle-oil personally I just use the oil from the manufacturer. In my case poulan synthetic and echo synthetic which works great. I have run amsoil in my car before and can tell the difference between cheap oil and that there fancy stuff  ;-)
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Biggest change I noticed switching from Stihl HP Ultra to Amsoil Saber Pro was the total lack of smoke and no carbon on the plastics near the exhaust outlet.  If my BR600 likes it then I trust it in any of my 2-strokes.  The 4-Mix is as picky as they come when it comes to pre-mix oil.


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## dorkweed (Mar 7, 2012)

jeff_t said:
			
		

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I run about 1/2oz 2 stroke oil per 1 gallon diesel fuel in my Dodge/Cummins. That comes out to about 16oz when I fill up.  It's to keep the lift pump and injection pump happy.


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## clemsonfor (Mar 7, 2012)

I use Husky oil as i can get it at Lowes. Way more than a bottle at walmart but it has a fuel stabilizer in it and has proven good for a year easy. Also i figure whats an extra few bucks a year on a $500 saw?

I do run walmart bar oil or poulan now i think. There is no reason for me to use dirty oil when that $7 or what ever it costs at walmart will last me almost a year.  A worn out oil pump from trash is gonna cost more than that.  Also, im no treehugger by any means but i really dont think thats an approved use of old motor oil.  Its considered hazordous waste, and has to be used proper. If the wrong person sees you in the wrong place, ie cutting on public land, it may or may not be good?  I know the poulan stuff is oil, but its not contaminated oil.


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## clemsonfor (Mar 7, 2012)

greythorn3 said:
			
		

> sounds like im fine running the free outboard oil i got in my 044 as i have been running it in all my other 2 strokes then. wow this sure is a big debate.



I really would not do that!  Its designed for liquid cooled engines that run way cooler than an air cooled engine. This means the oild will burn off to fast in your saw as its designed to be used in a cooler engine.  A boat head can be touched for a few seconds even after a run in it. A saw no way i would touch the head for a few seconds after 5 mins of cutting.

Same is true for a boat run on air cooled oil, wont complete burn and will form carbon deposits on the piston and chanbers.

Seriously it only takes one more oil bottle and one more gas can if you keep your boat gas in a can?  I buy saw gas maybe twice a year three times if i only mix 1 gallon sometimes.  Its not a huge pain to have another tiny bottle on your shelf.  

I have a 65cc ish saw (stihl) and if i mix just under 2.5 gals it will last me a long time!


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## Highbeam (Mar 7, 2012)

jeff_t said:
			
		

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No Detroit, oddly the older chevy 6.22/6.5 were made by detroit but were not the two stroke type. 

The Ford diesels from 94.5 until about 2008 used a hydraulic actuated injector that depends on 3000 psi engine oil to pressurize a chamber of fuel with a tiny plunger which squirts the fuel into the cylinder. A pretty hokey design compared to a typical rotary injection pump. This hydraulic design in particular depends on the lubricating properties of the diesel fuel to operate properly. 

When the EPA required removal of sulfur, the process used also removes the lubricity of the fuel making modern diesel very dry and sticky which wears the hydraulic injectors quickly. These injectors cost a couple thousand bucks to replace and as soon as modern diesel is put in they start clacking and ticking like crazy. Adding one ounce of TCW per gallon of diesel immediately quiets the injectors to normal levels and hopefully extends the injector life. 

I use off-road diesel and Power Service additive for lubricity in my tractor but it uses a traditional rotary pump.


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## brian89gp (Mar 7, 2012)

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I have a 6.5.  Alternate between whatever 2 stroke oil I happen to buy and non-detergent motor oil.  Damn thing sounds like it is going to blow up if I forget.

I use Husky oil from Lowes.  Call me lazy but I like that they size the bottles for 50:1 of common gas tank sizes.  Have a 2.5 gallon tank, get the 2.5 gallon Husky 2 stroke container.


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## basod (Mar 7, 2012)

Back in the day didn't they just pour a quart/pint of 10w in a gallon of fuel?
rather than worrying about buying expensive oil I just mix it richer, as noted all the 50:1 mixes are EPA regs not to extend the 2-strokes life.


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## ScotO (Mar 7, 2012)

BASOD said:
			
		

> Back in the day didn't they just pour a quart/pint of 10w in a gallon of fuel?
> rather than worrying about buying expensive oil I just mix it richer, as noted all the 50:1 mixes are EPA regs not to extend the 2-strokes life.


more or less you hit the nail on the head.  BUT, I would at least use a TCW3 oil designed for two-strokes.  In my older saws I run my mis at 35:1, and tune the saw accordingly.  Never ever had a single problem doing it that way, and I have never fouled a plug either.....


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## jeff_t (Mar 7, 2012)

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That all makes sense. I wrote off owning a diesel pickup when I sold my Dodge in 05. It had some pump issues that would, strangely enough, disappear when I ran B20 in it. I guessed that the VP44 had a solenoid sticking in it or something, and the added lubricity of the biodiesel would clear it up. Could only see things going downhill from there, so I sold to some kid, bought a V10 Excursion, and never looked back.


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## Highbeam (Mar 8, 2012)

Biodiesel is an excellent lubricity additive. As low as B2 will completely repair the damage done by the process of stripping sulfur.Unfortunately biodiesel is not readily available in my area.


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## clemsonfor (Mar 8, 2012)

BASOD said:
			
		

> Back in the day didn't they just pour a quart/pint of 10w in a gallon of fuel?
> rather than worrying about buying expensive oil I just mix it richer, as noted all the 50:1 mixes are EPA regs not to extend the 2-strokes life.



I mix 40:1 in my saw. PEr stihl recomendations your only suppose to mix 50:1 with stihl oil any other oil it says to mix 25:1! Even old johnson outboards from the 70s are mixed 50:1 i think that is close to the epa start may they came after the 72 era enviro legislation?

Anyway they "old" 2 strokes were more sloppy not as high performance machines, they gummed up fouled out and didnt last as long on that oil that was inferior for its use. But yes any oil today is probly better than then, i would use the correct formulation though, it dosent cost that much.


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## basod (Mar 9, 2012)

Agreed on all the above, I've monkied around and tried the 30:1, and settled at 40:1.  I don't cut alot of wood when the mosquitos are out so no need to smoke them off  
atleast to this point it's kept the husky blower, cheapo weedeater brand trimmer, old school brushcutter and saw all running smoothtly.

I have a confession though my only 2-stroke failure came from my(possibly alcohol induced) lack of attention to the 2 gallon can I mixed with one bottle of poulan oil.
Yeah that killed the old poulan farmhand and a cheap weedeater blower that the GF really needed to run one afternoon when I'd had a few totties.


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## MasterMech (Mar 9, 2012)

clemsonfor said:
			
		

> BASOD said:
> 
> 
> 
> ...



I've got a mid-70's Remington SL-9 that I ran a couple tanks of 80:1 AMSOIL Saber Professional through it without issue.  No smoke, all power!  Haven't run it since so no report on long-term effects. (Saw is a "toy" and desperately needs a clutch sprocket.)


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## fyrwoodguy (Mar 10, 2012)

after reading this thread,now i know why the boat people don't run my oil. after all these years!  :sick:


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