# Thinking of moving up from a Stihl 029 Farm Boss...



## burntime (Jul 13, 2008)

Mine still runs great, I have had it like 7 years, what is the next logical step?  I want to go to a pro series for weight and chain speed.  I am a stihl guy for sure!  I have not even had to put a plug in mine!  Can the pro's direct me?  Last move was a store saw to the stihl and now I want to raise the bar so to say.  I currently run a 20 inch bar and full chisel chain.  When using the full bar length in oak it needs a little more power.  Thanks in advance...


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## burntime (Jul 14, 2008)

C'mon, someone has to be a saw guy here?  I want to move up but don't want to overbuy if that makes sense.  Is there a saw that is the same weight or preferably lighter with more power?


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## yukiginger (Jul 14, 2008)

Go to Stihl's website and compare but the 361 is probably ideal, and the 441 is another step up from there.  Not knowing details of your intended use this is a good place to start.  Of course you will want to visit some dealers, get their advice, and do some demo cutting if possible.  If you are not planning to keep the 290 a trade might be something else to put on the table.

Vist arboristsite.com (and go to the chainsaw forum) if you want lots of reading.

MarkG


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## Jack33 (Jul 14, 2008)

Well, you can drop $600 plus extras and tax on a MS361.  That will get you superior chain speed or RPM's, filtration, vibration, and reduced weight compared to your 029/290.  But, you won't get a big step up in power.  So, you may not get the "wow" factor when considering what you just spent.  If you really want to step up in power and can swing $800, get the MS441.  Do you need 70cc to cut firewood...no...but you will be done in half the time and have a lot more fun.

If you are often cutting 20 inch oaks, get the 441.  Then put a .325 16" bar and chain on the 290 for small stuff and for when you pinch your new one.


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## burntime (Jul 14, 2008)

I was thinking 500 or so and sell mine for 250.  Wow that is an eye opener.  Stihl I think I will have to go shopping ;~)


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## bbb123 (Jul 14, 2008)

I have an old 029 farm boss with .050 3/8 chain and same thing never had a problem with it.  I moved up to the 440 several years ago.  It weighs 2-3 pounds more but the power makes up for that when cutting the big stuff.  I would guess with 12"+ wood it is nearly twice as fast.


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## burntime (Jul 14, 2008)

I think I may stop in the next week or two and look at the 361 cb or the 441 to see what the price is local...does anyone know or see these recently?  I know more than I want to spend but hey, I think I paid 400 for my 029 and made that in a few side jobs and used it for 7 years plus.  Yep new bar and a few chains but that thing has been a good saw, just would like more ooomphhh on the oaks.


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## Jack33 (Jul 14, 2008)

Try to find a dealer that will let you test drive them before you buy, bring yours along for a side-by-side comparison.  If you go with the 361, I would not get the "cb" version.  It is simply more stuff to break and there is a reason why it is not used on any of the larger saws.  Think about how much effort it really takes to tension or swap a chain with bar nuts?


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## burntime (Jul 14, 2008)

I love the 361 with a 18 inch bar.  I actually have the 18 on my 029 I remembered there are 74 links and sure enought, 18 inches.  They sell for full list 579.99 and 10 bucks for the next size up bar (18") so 589.99 then 50 bucks for a hard case and extra chain and some oil.  That just is not gonna happen.  :~(  I did some research on arborist site and if I open up the muffler a bit it should increase the saw and run cooler?  I am gonna give it a try.  I know for sure I am buying a stihl blower.  229.99 list for the top one, 199.99 for one down.  CFM is close but for the 30 bucks it has a housing so it can be converted to a shredder...  No one sells for full list, in the car business that is refered to as silly sticker!  Anyplace on line to buy from?


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## cmonSTART (Jul 15, 2008)

Looooove the MS 440.  That's a very fun saw, but pricey.


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## burntime (Jul 15, 2008)

I think the new 441 is 800 bucks, I want an all around saw so 361 is more for me, just wonder if they ever go on sale...


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## WOODBUTCHER (Jul 15, 2008)

Have you looked at Dolmar

In my area here are the prices/specs with 20" bars

STIHL MS361 69cc/4.4 hp/12.3 lbs $609.00
Dolmar PS7900 79cc 6.3 HP/13.6 lbs $639.00
Stihl MS441 70cc/5.5 hp/14.6 lbs $789.00


WoodButcher


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## Backroads (Jul 15, 2008)

burntime said:
			
		

> I think the new 441 is 800 bucks, I want an all around saw so 361 is more for me, just wonder if they ever go on sale...



I've never seen them on sale but talk to the sales rep.  If they move alot of saws, like where I bought mine, they will not ask for list.  They knocked $35 bucks off my saw without me even pressing the matter.  I told him I wanted prices on a bunch of saws.  I showed interest in the higher mid-range and lower PRO series.  He printed me a price sheet and the bigger the saw, the bigger the savings.  Don't expect to save hundreds of dollars but you could save 25-50 maybe if you ask.  Worked for me.  And who couldn't use to save a little ching now and then?


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## Gator eye (Jul 15, 2008)

I got a 361 with 20" bar....it's a good mix between weight and power for all around cutting. It'll eat through a pile of logs on the ground small and big. Drop any tree within reason and still not to heavy to limb with.


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## computeruser (Jul 15, 2008)

The next logical step in power is a 70cc-class saw.  Stihl 441 or 460, Husqvarna 372, Dolmar 7300 or 7900.  The 60cc saws won't be enough of a jump in power  to make you feel like you spent your money well, though you will like the 361's reduction in weight over the 029.  The 361 (or Husqvarna 357xp) is a nice saw, but they really aren't all that exciting in stock form.  Ported, well, that's another matter (and another couple hundred bucks if you have someone do the work for you).

Personally, I'd make the jump to a good 70cc saw and sell the 029.  I had a 290 when I sold it off for my 7900 some years back, and it was a no-brainer the first time I put a whole day in cutting.  The increase in production was obvious and appreciated.  As an added bonus, the 7900 weighs about the same as the 029, and is feels like running 2 029s at the same time!


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## burntime (Jul 15, 2008)

The problem is where do you stop?  The 361 is 600 bucks, the next step is 7 then 800.  I thought about opening up the muffler on mine, I checked another site and it looks pretty easy...the issue is tunning it.  I don't get what they are talking about with stops etc.  I like the 029 but want something lighter and more hp.  Normally I would jump for the biggest but I have carried the 029 all day and know that a pound less is a big deal.  You sound like you know quite a bit about the saws, would opening up the muffler and figuring out how to adjust the carb make a big difference in your opinion?  My buddy has the 039 and that has enough horsepower for me at 4.3...the 361 is 4.4, my stock 029 is like 3.8or 3.9, what will the muffler mod really do for me?


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## carbon neutral (Jul 15, 2008)

Woodbutcher, Where in CT are you getting that price on the Dolmar?  I have decided to try a dolmar for my next saw.  I haven't seen anything from Sthil or Husky that comes close in price or power to weight ratio.


In my area here are the prices/specs with 20" bars

STIHL MS361 69cc/4.4 hp/12.3 lbs $609.00
Dolmar PS7900 79cc 6.3 HP/13.6 lbs $639.00
Stihl MS441 70cc/5.5 hp/14.6 lbs $789.00


WoodButcher[/quote]


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## burntime (Jul 16, 2008)

I did more reading.  Apparently I have a 029 SUPER farmboss...  It is a 46mm bore vs 47mm and is rated at 4.1h.p.  The 361 is 4.4, will opening up the muffler on mine make up the difference?  I think these are just too close...  Curious what the 361 would produce doing the muffler mod?  Maybe the lighter of the 4xx series saws makes more sense like someone said before.


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## computeruser (Jul 16, 2008)

Opening up the muffler would make a difference, and retuning shouldn't be a challenge if you've got access to a tach, a screwdriver, and a drywall screw for the limiter cap (if present).  Without the tach, well, if your ear is good...

If your goal is lighter AND a bit more powerful, than your best choice in a stock machine would be the 361 or Husqvarna 357xp.


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## burntime (Jul 16, 2008)

Do you turn the drywall screw in to catch the limiter cap?  I have a listing link on how to tune it, says set idle, then low, then high and richen it up a little.  Is it like any other carb, go for most rpms then richen to protect it?


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## N/A N/A (Jul 16, 2008)

Burntime, I have a Husky 162 that I learned on and used for years. Its an old saw but is a pro model. I am not sure of the horsepower but thanks to our friends on this forum I found out the saw has 61.5 cc.s. A good friend of mine who I cut with often has the MS 290. The two saws cut almost the same. Well close enough to being the same for this conversation. About three weeks ago I was having issues with the old Husky and because my time is valuable to me, I decided to buy a new saw. I ended up getting the MS 361. And let me tell you WOW what a difference. The three saws cannot even be compared. And to me, its really not all about the horsepower. The chain speed does it all. The chain speed alone made me a happy camper with this saw. You could strap a 350 cubic inch V 8 to a bar and chain and if the chain only goes around that bar "X" MPH...thats all the faster the saw is going to cut. Well I could be totally wrong...I am no pro...but thats the way I see it. Go from a 290 to a 361??? I think you will be in heaven. Well at least I am...


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## burntime (Jul 17, 2008)

I am really thinging I will do the muffler mod and try it out, I was at the arborist site and talked to a couple guys and they tell me that the 029 SUPER is what I have, more hp then the 029, if I do the muffler mod it is supposed to be every bit of the 361 but added weight???  I have to try before I ebay my saw and spend the money.  I am almost contemplating going up more, just need to try and justify it in my mind


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## N/A N/A (Jul 17, 2008)

I understand....$600 is hard to swallow for anything let alone a new chain saw. Its really fun modding stuff. I am sure down the road after the warranty is up I will be doing some mods to my saw.


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## cmonSTART (Jul 17, 2008)

We just had a guy come in last night wanting to upgrade from his 290.  He walked out with an MS 460.  Yikes!  Certainly a step up!


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## burntime (Jul 17, 2008)

Thats what I am afraid of, 3 tens of a hp step up is not a lot, I need to determine what I want if the mod does not do it.  361 sounds good but 3 tenths for the extra money????  I know Firefighter29 loves his but I would almost be inclined to step up to the 441/460, but then I need a smaller saw for limbing...ahhh, the sickness starts, unfortunately reality slaps me before I can dream too far :lol:


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## carbon neutral (Jul 17, 2008)

After reading about all of this modification stuff maybe I will try it on my husky.  Is there a good source of info on what to do and how to do it?  Without a dyno I guess it would just be guestimation about how well any one mod worked.  I just don't want to ruin a perfectly good saw in search of making it better.


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## youngstr (Jul 17, 2008)

cmonSTART you wouldn't work in Milford now would you? 

Yesterday I purchased a 460 to replace my 290.  After running the saw for 2 hours last night before it got dark all I can say is WOW.  I bucked some large hemlock and I can honestly say I think the 460 is at LEAST 3X as fast as my 290.  Granted I've only run the saw for a couple of hours but I couldn't be happier.  I can really see how this saw could change the way I cut wood.

Now I need to decide whether to keep the 290 for limbing or go with something even smaller/lighter.......

Y


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## Outdoorsman (Jul 17, 2008)

burntime,  

From reading your posts I'm quite sure that a moded muffler is not going to be enough to satisfy your need for more power.  But I can also understand your reluctance to pay down a bunch of money until you're sure what you really want.  While I've had other saws, my first Stihl was a 029 and I ran it for 11 years until I ran it to death.  I was also wanting more & when I replaced the 029 I made sure I stepped up enough that I'd be satisfied.  As I'd had the chance to run my FIL MS 036 Stihl comparing it to my 029 I knew it was not the step up I wanted, though it's more than you may think due to the 036''s higher rpm rate.  

That's when I bought my MS 460 & like youngster above posted it's a huge step up, I'd say more than 3X but you get the idea.  But it's also no limbing saw, so I later bought a MS 260 which is a very good limber.
Then I recently got a chance to buy a Dolmar 5100s, for only 2/3 normal retail, so I bought iit.  

Based on comparing the 260 vs 5100, which are 46.5/51cc saws respectively and I like the Dolmar even better than the Stihl.  

All 3 of these saws are pro grade saws, and let me tell you, I'll never go back to a homeowner grade saw again.  The pro saws pull much better rpms, have much better weight to power ratios, but they do usually cost more.  

I'd suggest you should take a very, VERY close look at Dolmar saws, most of all the 7900 model, and here's why I think that.  The differance in cost/weight/power ratio of the Dolmar 7900 vs Stihl MS 460.

Stihl MS 460 power head weighs 14.6 lbs has 6 hp & costs $789.00 at Amick's web site.

Dolmar 7900 power head weighs 13.6 lbs (about what your 029 weighs) has 6.3 hp and costs $679.00 at Amick's site ($10.00 LESS than the MS 361 costs at Amick's).

The Dolmar 5100s/6400/7300/7900 saws have only been available in the US market for a few years, Dolmar still needs more dealers & just now starting to get known.   A superior product matched with aggressive pricing is the classic way for a company to gain market share, most of all in a market with respected & well established competitors such as Husky & Stihl.  You're lucky to be in the market at this time with the chance to get a great pro grade saw like the 7900 at such a great price.


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## N/A N/A (Jul 18, 2008)

Burntime, reading the above few threads is exactly what I am trying to tell you. I am not trying to tell you to buy the 361 because I have one, I just dont want you to spend hard earned money on something that you really dont need, when you could spend less and have something just as capable if not more useful due to weight than some of the logging monsters. I could have bought a 390 at 4.3 HP. but I chose to buy the 361 at 4.4 HP. only .1 HP more. At a difference of about $150 is almost does not make sense. But after spending the money and being able to run and use the thing I learned two very important things. First, a pro saw "in the stihl line anyway"; turns the chain much faster than a mid range saw does no matter what the HP rating is. At least it sure feels like it for sure. So with a sharp chain it cuts wood faster. Second, after using my Husky 162 all those years and not knowing any different, the WEIGHT makes a difference. At 12.3 LBS. (361) VS 13 LBS (290) or the 14.8 LBS (441) I will take the 12 or 13 LBS thank you. My time is very valuable to me, and I am bucking fire wood not cutting down red wood trees. And I know how many hours are spent in cutting up a tri-axle load of wood and the extra weight does not help. I wish I could drive you over to my house so you could take my 361 for a test drive and you would see for yourself what I am trying to state. Unless its at least a little about "my saw is bigger than yours" (which I can understand LOL) dont waste your money.


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## carbon neutral (Jul 18, 2008)

I just bought a Dolmar 7900 to replace a husky 359 and that is a big jump in power and I am very happy with the saw.  People who own tree trimming businesses have said their 460 Stihls have trouble keeping up with this saw.  That being said I wouldn't have bought this saw if I was a one saw owner, the 359 was a better choice.  Why?  The 359 was easier to handle and lighter.  When I bought my stihl 180 I was specifically looking for something lighter than the 359.  I was surprised at how many times I would grab the little stihl 180 when I was going to cut just because I didn't want to lug around the 359.  The difference in speed cutting rounds up to 12" was barely noticable, the light weight of the saw was felt immediately.  When you own only one saw you are better off with a mid sized saw especially if you are cutting down trees and not just bucking logs.  When you have two saws you can go big for bucking and small for limbing.  Also gotta say this THE DOLMAR ROCKS!  I am a total convert, Stihl and Husky do not offer anything that compares to the 7900 especially for $639, the price I paid.


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## cmonSTART (Jul 18, 2008)

youngstr said:
			
		

> cmonSTART you wouldn't work in Milford now would you?
> 
> Yesterday I purchased a 460 to replace my 290.  After running the saw for 2 hours last night before it got dark all I can say is WOW.  I bucked some large hemlock and I can honestly say I think the 460 is at LEAST 3X as fast as my 290.  Granted I've only run the saw for a couple of hours but I couldn't be happier.  I can really see how this saw could change the way I cut wood.
> 
> ...



I've been exposed!  Ya, that's me.  Glad you are enjoying the saw!


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## countrybois (Jul 18, 2008)

Seems to me like you have all the information you need and have answered your questions, now it is up to you to make the decision.

The 361 is a step up from the 390 no matter what anyone tells you.  As you have stated it will suit you just fine. A very good all-around saw that will be able to run a 20" bar no problem. Will it give you the 'WOW' factor in oak?? Probably not, if that is what you are after definately go with the 440/441. BUT  you WILL feel the weight of the larger saw.

I have an 034 and a 440. I ran the 034 for a couple of years and it worked great for what I needed(5 cords/yr, mostly red oak) I picked up a 440 on ebay, because once you start reading these forums you can't have just one saw . It makes me say 'wow' every time I run it and I have a 28" bar on it. 

If it were me, I would keep the 029 and be looking for a 440/441.


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## burntime (Jul 18, 2008)

Yes, I think I will have to "settle" for the 361 :lol:   I still want the lighter weight, in a perfect world the 350 shortblock would fit in there and only weigh 5 pounds, this is not a perfect world.  I will more then likely own a 361.  I have cut with my buddies 039 and was impressed, the 361 is more power and faster chain speed so I think it will satisfy me, until I get some extra money.  Wow, did you know I burn wood to save money


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## countrybois (Jul 18, 2008)

If I were in the market for a new saw, I, also, would be 'settling' for an MS361.


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