# Garn sediment problems



## Kemer (Feb 22, 2013)

I posted before that I was using up my anode rods and now I think they are causing me other problems.I noticed my performance declining on my garn 1500.so I checked my y strainer and sure enough it was blocked with a white residue.I have a 50 plate exchanger.my water temp is 170* but on the other side of the exchanger it is only 120*So my question is
Do I take it to a radiatior shop or try to clean it myself?
Does anyone know of a cartrage type filter that would work and not restrict flow.I'm short on room as I would have to replace the y strainer with the filter.
Any other suggestions would be appreciated.


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## nt30410 (Feb 22, 2013)

Kemer said:


> I posted before that I was using up my anode rods and now I think they are causing me other problems.I noticed my performance declining on my garn 1500.so I checked my y strainer and sure enough it was blocked with a white residue.I have a 50 plate exchanger.my water temp is 170* but on the other side of the exchanger it is only 120*So my question is
> Do I take it to a radiatior shop or try to clean it myself?
> Does anyone know of a cartrage type filter that would work and not restrict flow.I'm short on room as I would have to replace the y strainer with the filter.
> Any other suggestions would be appreciated.


Kermer;

I don't have a heat exchanger but I do have a Garn 1500, I do have white specs caught in my strainer and I did replace my anodes after 41/2 years. So you are not alone on that one.


Regards


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## TCaldwell (Feb 22, 2013)

Last week during the cold spell, I noticed a reduction in supply temps from the pressureized side of the hx from the garn. I removed the hx, white filmy residue coating the garn side, I flushed both sides with a hx scale remover from the plumbing supply house. Cleaned screens and reinstalled, what a difference, consistent a and b hx temps at 4deg differential, not the 15+ before. I went through 2 sets of anode rods before mike from precision told me to run without them as the water tested good. I think it would be a good idea to clean hx at least once per year after seeing this.


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## Kemer (Feb 22, 2013)

My water always tests good. I sure would like to not keep buying anode rods.Do you think it's safe not to?


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## Bob Rohr (Feb 22, 2013)

Kemer said:


> My water always tests good. I sure would like to not keep buying anode rods.Do you think it's safe not to?


 

The anode rods serve the purpose of protecting the boiler.  If they are eroding away they are doing their job.  Running without could move the corrosion potential to the boiler.  Any dissimilar metals in the system that could be setting up  electrolysis.  Brass and galvanize (zinc) could be an issue.


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## Sawyer (Feb 26, 2013)

Hey Harry, what do your anode rods look like when they are gone? Is the core that they are coated on still visible and all the magnesium is gone? when i checked my Y strainer last spring there were only a few specks of white, seemed like mineral or particles from my start-up like undissolved soap crystals.


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## Kemer (Feb 26, 2013)

Sawyer said:


> Hey Harry, what do your anode rods look like when they are gone? Is the core that they are coated on still visible and all the magnesium is gone? when i checked my Y strainer last spring there were only a few specks of white, seemed like mineral or particles from my start-up like undissolved soap crystals.


 George the only thing left is the center core  The stuff in the strainer looks like a white paste.


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## TCaldwell (Feb 26, 2013)

Yeah, looks like wall paper paste, clean the hx and your temps will return


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## DaveBP (Feb 26, 2013)

How about a bypass filter system. A hot water rated filter shunted across the circulator pump so a small fraction of the water passes through it, not the whole flow. Eventually, after numerous burn cycles, the suspended crap is almost all caught in the filter. After that you should have clear water.

Anyone do this? I know they aren't cheap.


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## jebatty (Feb 26, 2013)

I have a hot water filter on the boiler side of the plate hx serving the radiant floor. Reason for the hx is for antifreeze in the floor loop and water in the boiler/1000 gal storage. Take a look at these:

http://www.waterfilter-usa.com/hot-water-filter.php?id=HT10&gclid=CIXToqP11LUCFYZcMgodulMAzA
http://www.freshwatersystems.com/p-6056-rusco-hot-water-spin-down-filter-systems-1-14.aspx

The 160F rating on the waterfiler-usa probably is OK due to the low pressure in a boiler/garn system. I have one that has a metal housing. It rarely collects anything of interest any longer.


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## Kemer (Feb 27, 2013)

jebatty said:


> I have a hot water filter on the boiler side of the plate hx serving the radiant floor. Reason for the hx is for antifreeze in the floor loop and water in the boiler/1000 gal storage. Take a look at these:
> 
> http://www.waterfilter-usa.com/hot-water-filter.php?id=HT10&gclid=CIXToqP11LUCFYZcMgodulMAzA
> http://www.freshwatersystems.com/p-6056-rusco-hot-water-spin-down-filter-systems-1-14.aspx
> ...


 I have been looking at the rosco.I'm going to clean it today then install filter


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## jebatty (Feb 27, 2013)

Is depletion of the anode rod and sediment clogging the strainer or hx caused by the same processes or are the sources of these different? Why is the Garn equipped with an anode rod and other boilers and/or steel tank storage systems not equipped with anode rods? Is galvanic corrosion which an anode rod is supposed to trap identifiable as present in a system not equipped with an anode rod?


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## Sawyer (Feb 27, 2013)

GEA spells out cleaning & filter requirements.


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## Kemer (Feb 27, 2013)

Sawyer said:


> GEA spells out cleaning & filter requirements.


 I'm cleaning it with white vinegar now and seeing an improvment.anybody know how long to let it soak?


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## Sawyer (Feb 27, 2013)

I do not know how long to soak as I have not cleaned mine yet as temperature differentials are similar to when I first installed it. This way I can learn from you Harry. 

Are you seeing particles as you circulate or is the water turning cloudy?


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## Kemer (Feb 27, 2013)

Sawyer said:


> I do not know how long to soak as I have not cleaned mine yet as temperature differentials are similar to when I first installed it. This way I can learn from you Harry.
> 
> Are you seeing particles as you circulate or is the water turning cloudy?


 I knew I had a problem when I cleaned my strainer and it was blocked with white paste


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## DaveBP (Feb 27, 2013)

So what is this white stuff everyone's seeing? Is it some zinc compound precipitate?


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## Kemer (Feb 27, 2013)

I think it's the magnesium from the rod


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## TCaldwell (Feb 27, 2013)

thats why mike advised me not to run more rods, as the water was in check, the magnesium ends up in a pile in the bottom of the boiler and the turbulance of the water circulation carries and coats the system. Did the vinegar do the trick, I used a over the counter hx cleaner, circulating it through with a sump pump and bucket, total time was about a hr. i am afraid that with the mag in suspension, cleaning will be needed more frequently.


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## Kemer (Feb 28, 2013)

TCaldwell said:


> thats why mike advised me not to run more rods, as the water was in check, the magnesium ends up in a pile in the bottom of the boiler and the turbulance of the water circulation carries and coats the system. Did the vinegar do the trick, I used a over the counter hx cleaner, circulating it through with a sump pump and bucket, total time was about a hr. i am afraid that with the mag in suspension, cleaning will be needed more frequently.


 Yes the vinegar worked..I still have a 14* differance so I might use sizzle.I have a easy set up for flushing like yours.


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## Sawyer (Feb 28, 2013)

How Close do you want to get the A in/B out differential. Wouldn't pump flow and demand make a difference between systems. I have always had a 10-12* differential, do you think this is cause for concern?


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## Kemer (Mar 1, 2013)

Sawyer said:


> How Close do you want to get the A in/B out differential. Wouldn't pump flow and demand make a difference between systems. I have always had a 10-12* differential, do you think this is cause for concern?


 I think your right.Pump speed and demand would make a differance I would be happy with a 10* spread


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## RowCropRenegade (Mar 1, 2013)

I haven't cleaned out my HX since it was installed.  I'm within range of what you guys are seeing.... 10-12 degrees difference.  This number narrows the faster the pump runs (variable speed pump).

I was told to clean the HX with acid...planning to do it this summer.


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## Kemer (Mar 2, 2013)

I did another cleaning with white vinegar and was very pleased with the results.I'm reading a 8* difference now


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## Sawyer (Mar 3, 2013)

Big difference Harry! What are your supply/return temps now for A & B?

How did you circulate the vinegar?


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## Kemer (Mar 3, 2013)

Sawyer said:


> Big difference Harry! What are your supply/return temps now for A & B?
> 
> How did you circulate the vinegar?


 I had boiler drains in the right place and used a sump pump in a bucket then flushed with clean water.My garn is 187* and my feed to house is 180*


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## Sawyer (Mar 3, 2013)

Glad this worked so well for you Harry. Now I know what to do with that sump pump I have been storing along with a lot of other junk out in the pole building. Like you, I made sure I placed drains in the lines along with isolation valves and unions when I first did my install just for this purpose. When I am done heating and just supplying hot domestic water I will clean my HX just to see the difference.


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## Kemer (Mar 3, 2013)

Sawyer said:


> Glad this worked so well for you Harry. Now I know what to do with that sump pump I have been storing along with a lot of other junk out in the pole building. Like you, I made sure I placed drains in the lines along with isolation valves and unions when I first did my install just for this purpose. When I am done heating and just supplying hot domestic water I will clean my HX just to see the difference.


 I bought those washing machine hoses with the two female ends and they worked great


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## NCFord (Mar 3, 2013)

Hey guys,
I'm new to this forum and Wood Gasification, but what you might look into is a  coolant filter setup for a diesel truck engine.  Some of these trucks(like my ford 6.0) have serious problems with crap pluging the heat exchanges.  These filters setups come with a filter head and use coolant filters from NAPA which are cheap.  I think the whole thing cost me around $150 form performance machine.  I think the cir. pumps would benefit from clean water especially if your water storage is an old propane tank.  I think all you would have to do is install it between the supply and return side so it acts as a bypass filter.  I think I am going to install one with my new boiler.  I may make my own and just use the napa fliters with another type of filter head...not sure about that yet.


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