# Heavy Smoking After Reloading



## 69_Eliminator (Dec 28, 2013)

Hello All!  I am a newbie as this is my first season heating with wood.  I bought an old Aurora fireplace insert about a month and a half ago.

I have been trying to do as others have said to not keep adding wood to the fire, but fill it up and let it burn down to coals and then load it up again.  The problem I'm having is that it is putting off a heavy smoke cloud for about 20 or 30 minutes after I load it up.   It is also smoking like this or worse when I load it tight for the overnight burn. 

My wood is oak that is reading 18%-20% on my MM.  After the load has been burning for a while I have gone out and looked at the chimney and I can barely see any smoke. 

I feel like a real A-hole smoking the neighborhood out.  Yesterday I was a half hour late leaving because I didn't want to leave with it smoking heavily.  I like burning and I know this year will be a learning curve, but I'm get frustrated with this old dragon!

Is this just the nature of the beast/smoke dragon or is there something I can do to lessen the heavy smoking after reloading?

Any and all tips are appreciated.

Thanks!


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## 69_Eliminator (Dec 28, 2013)

Forgot to mention this in my original post.  My neighbor has an old wood furnace that he uses to heat his house.  He burns the wetest biggest splits I have ever seen.  I was helping him split some wood today that was soaking wet and I asked him if he was going to put it at the end of the pile and burn it last so it can at least dry out a little bit and he said no and that he was going to take it inside to burn.

I rarely ever see any smoke coming from his pipe.  How is he getting away with this and no matter what I try I smoke the neighborhood out?!


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## KindredSpiritzz (Dec 28, 2013)

maybe it needs more air for awhile when you reload. If it doesnt smoke after you get it going you just need to get it going quicker. Im not familiar with your insert, but maybe open the air up more on reloads or crack the door for awhile.


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## 69_Eliminator (Dec 28, 2013)

KindredSpiritzz said:


> maybe it needs more air for awhile when you reload. If it doesnt smoke after you get it going you just need to get it going quicker. Im not familiar with your insert, but maybe open the air up more on reloads or crack the door for awhile.


Thanks for the response!  We were leaving the door cracked for about the first minute and a half until the flames started rolling really good and then shutting the door and then it would start rolling smoke after a couple minutes.

After it's going you wouldn't know I was burning by looking at the chimney.  On the next few loads I'm going to experiment by opening the inlet air up to about 50% and slowly close it down to where I normally run around 10% open.

Thanks again.   I'll post up how my experiment goes.


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## Hogwildz (Dec 28, 2013)

The neighbors may not smoke cause he is constantly feeding an already hot fire. Which would make sense cause that is the only way he is going to burn that wet wood.
Your not far off if it smokes at reload then clears up. It also depends on how hot the stove is when you reload and how good/hot a bed of coals you are reloading on.
I am not familiar with your model, is it a non EPA stove with no secondary or cat? If so, that is part of the nature of the beast.
If it clears up in time as you stated, then your not doing so bad, cut yourself some slack. Just keep an eye on the stack & cap. Worst area for build up will be up top.

Just saw your last response. Open the air all the way when cold starting or relaoding, let the fire get established(splits starting to char/ good blaze going), then start closing the air as normal.
That is prolly the main factor of your problem.
Check your cap soon, and every so often till you get your burning habits dialed in.


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## BrotherBart (Dec 28, 2013)

Yeah leave that door cracked until the stove top temp is around three hundred and close it with the primary air still full open. Around five hundred close it down in quarter increments. Only do this if you are burning E/W.

If E/W the key to holding down the smoke is to have the coals dragged to the front and have really small stuff in front. The flames from the little stuff eats the smoke while the stove is coming up to temp.


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## 69_Eliminator (Dec 28, 2013)

Hogwildz said:


> The neighbors may not smoke cause he is constantly feeding an already hot fire. Which would make sense cause that is the only way he is going to burn that wet wood.
> Your not far off if it smokes at reload then clears up. It also depends on how hot the stove is when you reload and how good/hot a bed of coals you are reloading on.
> I am not familiar with your model, is it a non EPA stove with no secondary or cat? If so, that is part of the nature of the beast.
> If it clears up in time as you stated, then your not doing so bad, cut yourself some slack. Just keep an eye on the stack & cap. Worst area for build up will be up top.


I was thinking the same thing as you on why his doesn't smoke.  He goes through a lot of wood, probably 3-4 cords and his house is always roasting hot.

Yeah pretty much only smokes on reload until the wood gets glowing pretty good.  I'll have to check the temp on the next reload, but I was going by when the coals were about the size of an egg or a little less.  My insert is an old school smoke dragon with no cat or secondary burn.  Thanks for telling me to cut myself some slack, I needed that!  I was up on the roof today and the cap is gooey looking so I'm going to work on getting some of the powder or spray that I guess you put on the wood when you are burning and it loosens up the creosote.  I am also trying to find a chimney cleaning brush, but none of the home improvement stores had my size in stock so I guess I'll have to find it online.


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## BrotherBart (Dec 28, 2013)

If you are burning one of the old stoves, you get that sucker to five hundred degrees stove top as fast as you can or you will continue to fog out the hood.


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## 69_Eliminator (Dec 28, 2013)

Hogwildz said:


> Just saw your last response. Open the air all the way when cold starting or relaoding, let the fire get established(splits starting to char/ good blaze going), then start closing the air as normal.
> That is prolly the main factor of your problem.
> Check your cap soon, and every so often till you get your burning habits dialed in.



I always open the outlet all the way and leave the door open about 3 inches when I do a cold start to get it going.  On reload should I open the outlet all the way also?  Should I close the air down in two stage or maybe more?

Glad to hear that is the main factor for my problem and hopefully will get a good process soon.

Definitely planning on giving the cap some attention soon.  I wonder if I should just take it off for the burn season?


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## BrotherBart (Dec 28, 2013)

Please put your stove model in your sig so we know what we are working with.


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## Hogwildz (Dec 28, 2013)

69_Eliminator said:


> I always open the outlet all the way and leave the door open about 3 inches when I do a cold start to get it going.  On reload should I open the outlet all the way also?  Should I close the air down in two stage or maybe more?
> 
> Glad to hear that is the main factor for my problem and hopefully will get a good process soon.
> 
> Definitely planning on giving the cap some attention soon.  I wonder if I should just take it off for the burn season?


Yes open the air all the way on reloads also. We all do that, and it helps establish the fresh load firing quicker and less smoke time period.
You want to do the same for either a cold start, or reload, but open the air all the way for either. You may find you don't need the door open at all to get it blazing once you start opening the air all the way first.
As far as closing the air down, it won't hurt to do it in stages, keeps things a bit more even.
But this is mostly for EPA stoves. I think Bart is right on with his advise on getting it up to temp ASAP, for less smoke in the hood.
Do as you wish with the cap. But I would leave it on. No sense inviting other issues unnecessarily.

Gooey is a sing of smoldering or wet wood. Burn that sucker hot as Bart said at least 500, and don't rely on the powder. You can use it, but don't really believe in them myself for what they are supposed to do. Don't get a false sense of security just cause the powder is supposed to help.
The only cure is  #1 dry wood, and #2 burn it hot enough and no smoldering as much as possible.


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## 69_Eliminator (Dec 28, 2013)

BrotherBart said:


> Yeah leave that door cracked until the stove top temp is around three hundred and close it with the primary air still full open. Around five hundred close it down in quarter increments. Only do this if you are burning E/W.
> 
> If E/W the key to holding down the smoke is to have the coals dragged to the front and have really small stuff in front. The flames from the little stuff eats the smoke while the stove is coming up to temp.


Yeah I was leaving the door open until about three hundred, but wasn't leaving the primary open and getting it to 500, so I'll have to try that on the next start.  My stove top thermometer registers lower than my infrared when I point it at the door.  Should I go by 500* on the stove top or the infrared on the door? 

I have been using the log cabin method of starting the fire and when adding wood.  How do you only use E/W when getting it up to temp?

Thanks for the advice and tips!


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## 69_Eliminator (Dec 28, 2013)

BrotherBart said:


> Please put your stove model in your sig so we know what we are working with.


I wish I could!  LOL  I put up a post in the classic stove section to help me identify what model insert I have.  All that I know is that it's an Aurora.

https://www.hearth.com/talk/threads/aurora-stove-model-identification.120599/


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## BrotherBart (Dec 28, 2013)

The door temp is a non-event. Go by the stove top temp.

What dang stove are we talking about here?


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## BrotherBart (Dec 28, 2013)

I learned 25 years ago to get my old pre-epa stove up to five hundred fast to get clean exhaust and to never close it all the way down.


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## 69_Eliminator (Dec 28, 2013)

Hogwildz said:


> Yes open the air all the way on reloads also. We all do that, and it helps establish the fresh load firing quicker and less smoke time period.
> You want to do the same for either a cold start, or reload, but open the air all the way for either. You may find you don't need the door open at all to get it blazing once you start opening the air all the way first.
> As far as closing the air down, it won't hurt to do it in stages, keeps things a bit more even.
> But this is mostly for EPA stoves. I think Bart is right on with his advise on getting it up to temp ASAP, for less smoke in the hood.
> ...


Awesome!  I will open both the inlet and outlet wide open on the next load and cut them both back in three stages.
Less smoke in the hood is a good thing so I'll get it as hot as I can as fast as I can, but believe it or not I don't think it smokes that much on getting it up to temp as much as when I was re-loading or adding wood.

I guess I will leave the cap on so I don't get rain down the chimney.

Hopefully I won't need the powder after I get the chimney cleaned and implement the methods you guys are talking about to keep the smoke down.  The cap is gooey and the top flue tile has glaze in it.  So hopefully I can use the powder to loosen up the glaze, sweep the chimney, burn better and hopefully the rest of the burn season goes well.  I think the gooey was coming from a combination of slightly wet wood and smoldering, which I think is what is causing the smoking problem.


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## 69_Eliminator (Dec 28, 2013)

BrotherBart said:


> The door temp is a non-event. Go by the stove top temp.
> 
> What dang stove are we talking about here?


What does "non-event" mean?  The problem with the stove top temp is that the air from the blower blows across the stove top which I think is causing the stove top thermometer to read low.

See post #13 on which stove I have.


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## BrotherBart (Dec 28, 2013)

Turn off the blower until the stove is up to 500. Cooling the stove while it is trying to heat up is part of your problem.


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## 69_Eliminator (Dec 29, 2013)

BrotherBart said:


> Turn off the blower until the stove is up to 500. Cooling the stove while it is trying to heat up is part of your problem.


 
I was leaving the blower off until I saw 300* or better, but will now leave it off until I see 500* I have been starting my fires with kindling and working my way up to medium splits, but it probably takes 15 minutes to get it to 300*. Should I get some old pallets, break them up and burn them to get the stove hotter faster rather than using kindling, large kindling, small splits and then medium splits?


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## Hogwildz (Dec 29, 2013)

He has an old Aurora. The manufacturer no longer makes them since EPA regs.
The have a site but sell other manufacturer stoves and spa & pool supplied now.


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## Hogwildz (Dec 29, 2013)

Here is I believe the original manufacturer's website. I may be wrong.
They sell other brands now, but no longer make their own.
They may be able to help you with some info on the stove.
http://www.aurorapoolsandspas.com/

Here are a couple parts suppliers for what parts are still available.
http://www.woodstoveparts.info/Aurora_Parts.html
http://www.woodstove-parts.com/Atlanta_Aurora_Wood_Stove_Parts.html


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## 69_Eliminator (Dec 29, 2013)

Hogwildz said:


> Here is I believe the original manufacturer's website. I may be wrong.
> They sell other brands now, but no longer make their own.
> They may be able to help you with some info on the stove.
> http://www.aurorapoolsandspas.com/
> ...


Thanks for the information and links!

My insert looks extremely close to the top picture in this link that you provided: http://www.woodstoveparts.info/Aurora_Parts.html

I will put the link up in my stove insert identification thread to see if that helps someone identify it.


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## Hogwildz (Dec 29, 2013)

Search the older posts here also. During a search I see at least a couple other folks posted having this brand stove.
They are a couple years old or older. Some with photos.
Here is a few more links I found:

https://www.hearth.com/talk/threads/aurora-wood-stove-info-wanted.26804/

https://www.google.com/search?q=Aur...3NenE2gX9vIGADA&ved=0CC4QsAQ&biw=1680&bih=878

http://www.doityourself.com/forum/f.../375094-wood-burning-insert-modification.html

http://knoxville.craigslist.org/app/4201066814.html


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## 69_Eliminator (Dec 29, 2013)

Hogwildz said:


> Search the older posts here also. During a search I see at least a couple other folks posted having this brand stove.
> They are a couple years old or older. Some with photos.


I typed "Aurora" in the search engine and checked the "titles only" box and had about 10 results.  I looked through them and unfortunately no one has the same one I do


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## bluedogz (Dec 29, 2013)

I had the same problem identifying my smoke dragon a few years ago, and with smoking on reloads.  The most positive thing I can say is that it taught me to pay attention to my wood and burning habits, so that when I got a real stove it was heaven.


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## 69_Eliminator (Dec 29, 2013)

bluedogz said:


> I had the same problem identifying my smoke dragon a few years ago, and with smoking on reloads.  The most positive thing I can say is that it taught me to pay attention to my wood and burning habits, so that when I got a real stove it was heaven.


I can't find the model anywhere, but I have a plan  now.  From what the others have told me on opening it up upon reload and slowly closing it down seems to help a bunch.  I was very frustrated because I thought my semi-wet wood was causing all the smoke so I bought a cord and a half of dry oak and it was still smoking like crazy.

Yep, I'm looking forward to having a more modern stove next season!


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## Hogwildz (Dec 29, 2013)

Be careful with the Oak. It really does take about 3 years to dry.
It may not be as dry as you think. It may be, I don't know how long ago it was split. But about 3 years after split is optimal.


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## 69_Eliminator (Dec 29, 2013)

Hogwildz said:


> Be careful with the Oak. It really does take about 3 years to dry.
> It may not be as dry as you think. It may be, I don't know how long ago it was split. But about 3 years after split is optimal.


Wow! That is a long time to dry.  I'm not sure how long this has been drying, but doubt it's been that long.


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## begreen (Dec 29, 2013)

Take a few thick splits and resplit them. Then, retest the moisture content on the freshly exposed wood face of the split.


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## 69_Eliminator (Dec 29, 2013)

begreen said:


> Take a few thick splits and resplit them. Then, retest the moisture content on the freshly exposed wood face of the split.


I'll have to do that as soon as I get new batteries for my MM.  It just started giving some funky inconsistent readings.


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## begreen (Dec 29, 2013)

How was this insert installed? Is there a liner in the chimney and if so what size? If no liner, is there at least a stub over the damper area and a block off plate?


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## 69_Eliminator (Dec 29, 2013)

begreen said:


> How was this insert installed? Is there a liner in the chimney and if so what size? If no liner, is there at least a stub over the damper area and a block off plate?


Unfortunately I am poor this year and that's why I'm heating with wood vs oil furnace.  There is no liner, it just vents into a clay flue liner.  What is a stub?


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## bluedogz (Dec 29, 2013)

69_Eliminator said:


> There is no liner, it just vents into a clay flue liner.



That can't be helping anything.


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## begreen (Dec 29, 2013)

Agreed. The lack of any liner or even a stub past the damper area is most likely the issue. This is a potentially dangerous situation, especially if the fireplace liner is large or very cold.


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## 69_Eliminator (Dec 29, 2013)

begreen said:


> Agreed. The lack of any liner or even a stub past the damper area is most likely the issue. This is a potentially dangerous situation, especially if the fireplace liner is large or very cold.


What is a stub??  Ever since I last night when I followed the advice of others in this thread on reload techniques I have had very very little smoke.  My neighbor just dropped by and he said he didn't even know I was burning because he didn't see any smoke 

Thanks to all who contributed to thread with the burn techniques after a reload- it was extremely helpful!


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## begreen (Dec 29, 2013)

A stubbed installation has the pipe stubbed up past the damper plate by at least a foot or more and is sealed off with a block off plate.


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## 69_Eliminator (Dec 29, 2013)

begreen said:


> A stubbed installation has the pipe stubbed up past the damper plate by at least a foot or more and is sealed off with a block off plate.
> 
> View attachment 122080


Ok.  Thanks for the explanation and diagram!  Do chimney liner places sell the parts to do a "stubbed install?"  I don't think I can afford a full insulated liner this year and this maybe an option to increase safety.


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## begreen (Dec 29, 2013)

It is just a short piece of flex liner and a block off plate that you can make yourself out of sheet metal from Home Depot. The main question is what size is the flue outlet from the stove.  
Here are a couple articles with links on the topic that should be helpful. 
https://www.hearth.com/talk/wiki/why-damper-seal-is-needed/
https://www.hearth.com/econtent/index.php/articles/making_a_block_off_plate/


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## begreen (Dec 30, 2013)

https://www.hearth.com/talk/threads/well-it-happened-chimney-fire.120751/


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