# ASK BEFORE YOU CUT



## jdscj8 (Mar 1, 2009)

People please ASK before you go on someones land to cut.      Wensday we had a guy and his wife go into our timber with out asking anyone, and both got hurt. he cut a tree and it was falling at her so she jump into the creek and broke her leg, he went to help her and fell hit his head on a rock and knocked himself out, its a creek that you can't just climb out of.      
    No one knew they where there, i didn't find them untill about 10:00 pm when i checked on the horses. The lady heard my truck and started yelling when i shut it off.     There are alot of farmers and land owners that would be happy to let you help clear land off, but please be respectful and ask, and let them know when you go in to cut and get done for safty sakes. That way if there is a problem someone will at least know your there. And if they don't hear from you for a while they come check on you.    


   THANK YOU,   JD


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## Brian VT (Mar 1, 2009)

If they didn't ask, they were trespassing and stealing. Plain and simple.
On top of that, the possibility exists that they could get a slimy lawyer and a liberal judge and win a lawsuit against you.
What a country.

I have hundreds of acres behind my house that belong to a quarry operation that's based in Sweden. I could cut trees and 
no one would probably ever know or care. I didn't touch any before asking the quarry manager for permission.


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## Pagey (Mar 1, 2009)

It's good that you found them!  That sounds like it could have turned into a much worse situation.  Let's hope they are grateful and don't turn around and do something silly.


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## Backwoods Savage (Mar 1, 2009)

Seems the world is full of fools. Those fools almost paid the ultimate price. It is just so hard to believe that people think they can just go wherever they want and take whatever they want. I just do not understand it.


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## Adios Pantalones (Mar 1, 2009)

Wow.  What do you say to someone like that?  Trespass, steal wood, cutting unsafe with someone else around... 

I guess they're getting punishment enough, but there is always the chance that you get a lawsuit too (stupid as that is).


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## mainstation (Mar 1, 2009)

What a tale!! They were lucky indeed.   Lawsuit, wtf? Stupid is as stupid does.
Pretty expensive firewood.  
Even if you post your land off limits there will always be assholes who will walk right on by those signs.


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## jdscj8 (Mar 1, 2009)

If i wouldn't have found them who knows how long they would have been there.  They were ticketed at the hospital for trespassing,thieft,and distruction of personal property. And i guess more can be added by the judge in court next month.  Our property does have a locked gate that they did cut, and is posted no trespassing.  So from what i was told by the sheriff they can't come back on us.  As for the others that have our ok to hunt, ride horses, motorcycles,4wheelers, cut wood out here have all signed liability waivers our attorney drew up years ago, and we have never had a problem they always let us know when thy go in and out, if we are not home they leave a note on the door. They think there bugging us but it makes us feel better.


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## Adios Pantalones (Mar 1, 2009)

I can't get over the gall of someone to actually cut a lock and do that.

There's a lot of private land being closed off to hunting, or only open for a hunting lease- making it a rich man's game in a lot of places.  Land owner's got to pay the taxes, so I don't begrudge them their rights in this regard at all, but thanks to folks like you for your attitude.  I have been done a kindness by landowners that I approached directly.  One in particular out in Amherst, MA.


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## BrowningBAR (Mar 1, 2009)

jdscj8 said:
			
		

> They were ticketed at the hospital for trespassing,thieft,and distruction of personal property. And i guess more can be added by the judge in court next month.



Good! Too many times I hear people getting away with crap like that. I still wouldn't be surprised if they tried to sue, whether they have a case or not has never stopped anyone before.


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## jdscj8 (Mar 1, 2009)

Heres the funny thing. If they would have went 100 more yards around the corner they would have found my stacked split dried oak stash, theres about 12 cords there.  hahahaha

   Your right they might try and sue, but on the 23rd of March we'll find out more, it's going to be pretty interesting to say the least.


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## Backwoods Savage (Mar 2, 2009)

jdscj8, please keep us posted as to the results of this because this could happen to many of us and perhaps you can show the right way to tackle these nuts.

That is funny about them not finding your oak stash. lol


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## Backwoods Savage (Mar 2, 2009)

CZARCAR said:
			
		

> HOW & WHY DID MY POST DISAPPEAR?



Repeat after me:  Abra Cadabra and diggery doo, where oh where has my post blew?


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## rphurley (Mar 2, 2009)

Particularly in light of the fact that they were ticketed, I GUARANTEE you that they will sue. That's just how our country has become. If it goes to trial, in many states they only need to convince a jury of idiots that you were somehow at fault. It doesn't make any sense, but you see it everyday in the newspaper. Particulary, with medical malpractice claims.  I'd plan on suing them for the emotional stress of finding them and saving their lives!  Also, as a healthcare professional, I'd also bill them for my time. :cheese:


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## Duetech (Mar 2, 2009)

jdscj8,
It may be advisable to contact your lawyer with a plausible counter suit. Something like "they knew if they got hurt they could try to sue and used that for the basis of their suit" so you sue for mental distress 10-20 times what they hope to get from you and your lawyers fees and then you sue the lawyers for being profiteers at the expenses of the innocent." What a mess...I hope they don't try to sue. If there is a judge who would allow a case like that they should be forced to face impeachment proceedings. Just because they got elected, or selected like the federal Supreme Justices, doesn't mean we have to let them keep their job if they fail to support faithful public trust. The real reason we have the "justice" travesty in this country that we do is we ignore the bad decisions that are made instead of doing something about it. Now they can act with impunity and we get to pay the price.


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## Apprentice_GM (Mar 2, 2009)

I'm gobsmacked. They cut a lock on a gate with fence designed to keep out trespassers, walk on your land without permission, cut down your trees without permission, hurt themselves, you rescue them, and everyone is talking about YOU getting sued? Unbelievable!

We did have a case here in my shire (county) which made national headlines where a drunk and stoned idiot jumped off rocks, in the middle of the night, into the sea, at a beach which is patrolled during the day by volunteer lifesavers but (obviously?) not at night, he got injured (paraplegia) and sued the council . . . and won $5 million (initially). Fortunately for justice and sanity the appeal over turned the case so personal responsibility still carries some weight Down Under.

I would have thought at a very minimum:

1) They replace the chain / lock at their cost.
2) Upgrade the fence / gate if needed, at their cost, to avoid future idiots repeating this episode.
3) 100 hours of community service, as in cutting, splitting and stacking firewood for you, at their cost (gas and equipment)
4) A written apology.

I am amazed at the hide of these people. Wow. I hope it turns out alright for you, I too would like to hear what happens in terms of lawsuits and court findings.


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## rphurley (Mar 2, 2009)

Apprentice_GM said:
			
		

> I'm gobsmacked. They cut a lock on a gate with fence designed to keep out trespassers, walk on your land without permission, cut down your trees without permission, hurt themselves, you rescue them, and everyone is talking about YOU getting sued? Unbelievable!
> 
> We did have a case here in my shire (county) which made national headlines where a drunk and stoned idiot jumped off rocks, in the middle of the night, into the sea, at a beach which is patrolled during the day by volunteer lifesavers but (obviously?) not at night, he got injured (paraplegia) and sued the council . . . and won $5 million (initially). Fortunately for justice and sanity the appeal over turned the case so personal responsibility still carries some weight Down Under.
> 
> ...



I'm glad to hear that personal responsibility still counts for something.  When I was in Australia back in 2000, ( New Years under the bridge in Sydney) my buddy from Melbourne was concerned that Australia was following the US's lead and throwing personal responsibility out the window!  You should see how we have to accommodate illegal immigrants and people who don't want to actively participate in taxpaying, productive society.  Have you heard of the Octomom?


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## Apprentice_GM (Mar 2, 2009)

A lot of Aussies are very concerned about us following in the litigious footsteps of the US, and want to avoid it if possible. The big story that still gets circulation over here around BBQ's is the one of the woman who sued McDonalds and won millions when *she* spilt hot coffee on her lap in drive-thru. We can't believe she won. Ummm, everyone knows coffee is hot, it's made with boiling water, but putting a small-print warning on the lid as Maca's does now avoids future lawsuits?

Yes, we've heard of the octomum - my understanding is she convinced a platonic friend to donate sperm, used IVF to get 8 babies, the hospital doesn't want to send them home because she can't care for them properly (understandable) and she's been offered a million dollars to do a porn film. Is that the one or are there more?


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## rphurley (Mar 2, 2009)

[

Yes, we've heard of the octomum - my understanding is she convinced a platonic friend to donate sperm, used IVF to get 8 babies, the hospital doesn't want to send them home because she can't care for them properly (understandable) and she's been offered a million dollars to do a porn film. Is that the one or are there more?[/quote]

That's the one, but I don't want to hijack this thread.  I hope you're near Byron Bay and Nimbin or someplace cool like that!
Rich


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## jdscj8 (Mar 2, 2009)

I've talked with my attorney (our families have farmed next to each other for over a hundred years) he thought it was funny. I like the 100 hours of community service, i'll remember that.   And they didn't walk in, they drove in, with there volvo station wagon with a 12 foot trailer, THATS STILL SITTING HERE, we should ask for impound/storage fees.  I need to call the sheriff and have um come get it. Or should i pull it up to the house and try and get i tow fee?? haha


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## BrowningBAR (Mar 2, 2009)

jdscj8 said:
			
		

> I've talked with my attorney (our families have farmed next to each other for over a hundred years) he thought it was funny. I like the 100 hours of community service, i'll remember that.   And they didn't walk in, they drove in, with there volvo station wagon with a 12 foot trailer, THATS STILL SITTING HERE, we should ask for impound/storage fees.  I need to call the sheriff and have um come get it. Or should i pull it up to the house and try and get i tow fee?? haha



I say go for the tow fee! Or quickly register your property as an impound lot and charge them for the length of time the car was "impounded".

So, was this a newer model Volvo Station wagon? If so, were these a couple of yuppie idiots trying to "get back to nature" and cut down their own wood?

Might I also suggest you set up webcams throughout your property so the next time this happens you can post videos up on YouTube so you can share with the rest of us.


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## jdscj8 (Mar 2, 2009)

I wish i had the money to put up web cams all over i'd be rich. Between the skinny dippers in the river and everyone wantin to hunt my deer herds, i could set up huntin tours.

Its a older 80's tan volvo with tinted widows and lots o rust.  

The lady was really hot, the guy reminded me of ozzy.


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## rowerwet (Mar 2, 2009)

the macdonalds case was appealed, the final settlement was 30k for her medical bills, (the most insane part was she was a passenger on the back of a big motorcycle) of that 30k her lawyer got 1/3 so she lost 10k for her trouble. (good!) AND you all pay for that case every time you eat at Mcd's. ( I worked there, they told all of us the final outcome)


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## Backwoods Savage (Mar 2, 2009)

jdscj8 said:
			
		

> I wish i had the money to put up web cams all over i'd be rich. Between the skinny dippers in the river and everyone wantin to hunt my deer herds, i could set up huntin tours.
> 
> Its a older 80's tan volvo with tinted widows and lots o rust.
> 
> The lady was really hot, the guy reminded me of ozzy.



Definitely time to set up a few trail cams. If possible, mount them high and aim them down. You won't cover as much area that way but you won't get as many stolen either. 

I sure wish you good luck with this mess. I also like the community service part and yes, I'd definitely keep that car locked inside your fence and charge for storage fee.


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## ashpanannie (Mar 2, 2009)

Those two owe you more than an apology, and I sincerely hope you get one of those in court.  I think your idea of calling the sheriff to come get the car is the best thing to do.

I was delighted to hear your stacked wood was not found!  They would have turned into rabid beavers and started gnawing on it every night.  Shame on them both.  I hope their woodstove stays cold for the duration, and that they have to stay busy picking icicles off of their butts.


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## Gwleo (Mar 2, 2009)

I would not worry about a lawsuit.  If it happens, it happens but my belief is that most judges and juries here in the midwest wouldn't give 'em a penny.

Call the law center and have them deal with the vehicle.  Oh, take pictures and keep them.  Pictures of their vehicle and where it is, pictures of where they were cutting, pictures of where they where injured, pictures of everything and I mean everything.  I would do this as soon as possible.  Pictures are a huge help in the legal system.  

A report by you of what happened might help and takes up little space on the computer.  There usually aren't any statute of limitations on civil lawsuits (I believe) and a report could help if it comes up in the years to come.  Of course, your attorney should be advising you to do all of this!


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## Yamaha_gurl (Mar 2, 2009)

Alright, I have to comment on this one. 

YES they should have asked to go on your property and and cut, I totally agree with that. However, I don't think punishing them to the fullest extent is a must. They seem like very poor people, the old car, their only source of heat might be wood...why ruin someones life intentionally? These are tough times right now, they might be going through hell in their own lives and getting hurt was kind of like a sign from above saying "you shouldn't be on this property"...lol, right? Just think of it if you were in their shoes.


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## firefighterjake (Mar 2, 2009)

Some random thoughts.

1) Sweet . . . sometimes there truly is justice in this world.

2) Why borrow trouble . . . don't get all worked up about whether they'll sue or not sue. Cross that proverbial bridge if and when it happens . . . not everyone is sue happy. 

3) Geez . . . it sure would be their bad luck if you happened to be out cutting some of your own firewood and a tree accidentally dropped on top of the car and trailer, huh?   

4) I can't feel very sorry for these folks even if times are tough . . . maybe if they had "accidentally" come to a stand of woods and begun cutting without knowing this is stealing . . . but when folks cut a chain to gain entrance ? It only takes a minute or two to ask permission or a few more minutes to ask others for help.

5) To the original poster . . . you're handling this remarkably well . . . I honestly would be quite livid with these folks.


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## jdscj8 (Mar 2, 2009)

I agree with you totally Yamahaurl. 
And if these people were poor with no money only using wood for heat, or just didn't have the extra money right now. I know i've been there.  I would have invited them back made a deal with them, that if they helped lump some wood to me while i split it or helped with horse or yard chores for a few hours. I would have had no problem giving them a good cord ready to burn to get through the rest of the season, ya know it wouldn't have been the first time doing that. I don't have to pay for the wood, and i don't hoard it, so its not a big deal. I figure it takes me about 3 or so hours a cord to cut, split, stack, and clean up, so if someone don't have the money to buy it all i ask is for them to work off the time i have into it. But, and heres the big, BUT, this guy has a trust fund, more then i would see in 5,6,7,?? lifetimes. Whe asked why they did it they said  " just to do it, i didn't think it would hurt anything"  So theres were i stand on why i didn't just drop it.  I have never nor would never even think of ruining someones life intentionally. 
As for the car, maybe they were trying to see how the other side lived. I've heard of people doing that. But i don't know.

My daughter shes 12 goes by Yama-gurl, she named her barrel racing horse Yamaha.  She said it made him faster, i give her crap, saying to make sure you kick him out the gate or he'll just coast.


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## gpcollen1 (Mar 2, 2009)

I do believe that if the property is posted, they can sue all they want but will get nothing.  My neighbor posted his - and we only have 2 acre lots - because kids were crossing his property to get to the mountain behind us.  He cited chapter and verse why he did this and how he was protected just by posting the property.


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## jdscj8 (Mar 2, 2009)

O yah about the car, a tow truck showed up here at 7:30 this morning wanted in the gate, he was upset it was locked and that he had to come up to the house. He was more upset when i wouldn't let him take the car with out a sheriff here, to look over it and prove he was suppost to be there. Ya never know, so cover your ass, is what dad always told me. But the tow truck driver would not take the trailer, he said he was not told about any trailer so its not his problem. I told him i hope i never have to call you with my boat behind my truck, it would still be sittin on the road.  I'm trying to figure out what kind of poeple are living around here anymore. I feel like i'm living in a CARTOON.


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## Lumber-Jack (Mar 2, 2009)

Well that's a pretty funny story, especially the part about the guy almost falling the tree on his wife and she has to jump in the creek to save herself. No wonder you feel like you're living in a cartoon.   LOL
Good thing you found them when you did, it wouldn't be nearly as funny a story if you just found a couple corpses in the creek the following day.

Thanks for the laugh.


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## KarlP (Mar 2, 2009)

rowerwet said:
			
		

> the macdonalds case was appealed, the final settlement was 30k for her medical bills, (the most insane part was she was a passenger on the back of a big motorcycle) of that 30k her lawyer got 1/3 so she lost 10k for her trouble. (good!) AND you all pay for that case every time you eat at Mcd's. ( I worked there, they told all of us the final outcome)



If its the McDonalds case everyone normally thinks about there is a TON of misinformation in that post. 

The coffee was WAY too hot.  She was in a car and not the driver.  She got third degree burns on her crotch in a matter of seconds and had to spend several days in the hospital from spilling the coffee.  The woman wanted ~$20k to cover her medical expenses and pain and suffering and McDonalds refused.  McDonalds knew their coffee was too hot to be safe for many years and several hundred other people were burned.  The huge number was because jury decided to punish the company for two days worth of coffee sales because the company had *repeatedly* ignored the safety issue.


http://lawandhelp.com/q298-2.htm

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Liebeck_v._McDonald's_Restaurants


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## jdemaris (Mar 2, 2009)

Brian VT said:
			
		

> If they didn't ask, they were trespassing and stealing. Plain and simple.



I wish it was that simple, but it's not.  In most if not all states an illegal trespass has happened only when the land is posted and you can prove the intruder saw and read the sign.   I.e., the landowner has to prove the intruder knew he or she was trespassing.  Very hard to prove the first time.  To  make things even worse, a landowner has to prove ownership of the trees if someone came in and cut them. My "next-door" neighbor has 140 acres of woods where I caught a logger stealing trees last year.  Before the police would even charge the guy, the land-owner had to pay for a $3000 survey. And, even such a survey does not prove ownership all the time, but it helps.  When the case gets done, if the guy gets found guilty, he won't be paying any replacement costs for trees, just a small preset rate.


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## jdscj8 (Mar 2, 2009)

Im not worried about getting paid for anything. its more the point of respect and safty. the sign is on the fence they cut the lock off of and the trees are inside our fenced horse pasture.


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## CowboyAndy (Mar 2, 2009)

I think there is no question wheather these people knew they were trespassing... they had to cut the friggin gate!


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## dvellone (Mar 2, 2009)

Amen to asking first! I had to ask a fellow this past fall with a pickup truck full of hardwood to kindly remove himself from my property where he had just arrived and was sawing up a cherry that had fallen. He was a bit off the shoulder of the road which many folks think is free range for firewood scrounging neglecting to consider that even though it may be within the road right-of-way someone is still paying the taxes on it. He commented that he didn't think it was private property which is sort of amusing since here in the Adirondacks if it's not private it's Forest Preserve, and you generally can't cut and remove any wood from it. I had to explain to my puzzled 6 year old that before we owned property we had to buy all of our firewood or get it in exchange for clearing a site, and that even though we don't hand over money to anyone for our firewood now we still pay for it in terms of the cost of our land and the taxes we pay on it and because of that the guy was, in a sense, stealing from us since he'd neither earned the right to cut there nor made us any offer for the wood.


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## jdscj8 (Mar 2, 2009)

some pics, i think i did it right  http://picasaweb.google.com/jdscj8/20090302?authkey=Gv1sRgCKihr42m_-WR7wE


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## madrone (Mar 4, 2009)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EqP3wT5lpa4


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## savageactor7 (Mar 4, 2009)

Well hell there's no way they can deny trespassing and malicious mischief with that fence and sigh. I don't think you have anything to worry about jdscj8.


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## ashpanannie (Mar 4, 2009)

Could they have picked a worse spot????  Sheesh!  I nominate them for the Darwin Awards.


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## rphurley (Mar 5, 2009)

jdscj8 said:
			
		

> O yah about the car, a tow truck showed up here at 7:30 this morning wanted in the gate, he was upset it was locked and that he had to come up to the house. He was more upset when i wouldn't let him take the car with out a sheriff here, to look over it and prove he was suppost to be there. Ya never know, so cover your ass, is what dad always told me. But the tow truck driver would not take the trailer, he said he was not told about any trailer so its not his problem. I told him i hope i never have to call you with my boat behind my truck, it would still be sittin on the road.  I'm trying to figure out what kind of poeple are living around here anymore. I feel like i'm living in a CARTOON.



Maybe a cyclone came and transported you to New England! Tap your heels and you'll be back in Nebraska.  There's no place like home. ;-)


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## jdscj8 (Mar 5, 2009)

I got a letter today from the couple. In the letter they said they were sorry about the incedent and that a guy i had let get some wood last year told them where it was. I guess he had told them to just go in and get it, no one would know who did it. So the law wants to talk with him now. there asking if we can work something out between us, if i would drop the charges. Whats your take on it.


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## KarlP (Mar 5, 2009)

jdscj8 said:
			
		

> asking if we can work something out between us, if i would drop the charges. Whats your take on it.



I don't think this was a case of "We were freezing.  We honestly thought the no tresspassing signs were old and the property was abandoned." which MIGHT get some sympathy from me.  

If they knew someone who had gotten wood there before and CUT the gate open, they knew EXACTLY what they were doing.  I wouldn't let them off easy.

Either let the law deal with them or offer some hard labor.  Do you have plenty of trees and know of some charity willing to accept firewood for the poor.  Have this couple cut stack and split 20 cords from your land with hand saws and axes.  You can write off the value of split seasoned firewood.  Four or five poor families will get heat they need.  The theives can do some hard labor for their crime.


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## Lumber-Jack (Mar 5, 2009)

I know of several places around here where people put up gates and post no trespassing on mountain access roads that are legally suppose to be kept open for the public. You see there is no real law against posting signs like that because the access roads do cut though their property and if you venture off the road you are trespassing.
The key point here though seems to be that they cut the lock and made no attempt to contact you the land owner before doing so, both go against them very strongly. I guess you gota decide what you think is fair. Personally I would just get them to replace the lock and promise never to cut anyone's lock again or access property with out asking. Posted (no trespassing) or not.
Punishment is over used and has little effect. The prisons are full off people being punished, most come out with a chip on their shoulder.

Forgive them, it will teach them a lesson.


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## jdscj8 (Mar 5, 2009)

Thats what i was thinking get them to do something and let it go. Maybe let it go to the last day before court make um think about it for awile longer then tell um what i want um to do. I like the charity, give it or sell it and donate the money. We have plenty of trees.


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## KarlP (Mar 5, 2009)

jdscj8 said:
			
		

> Maybe let it go to the last day before court make um think about it for awile longer then tell um what i want um to do.



I think you'd be better off saying "If you want to avoid the courts, I'll drop the charges if you X by the court date."  Otherwise a theif will just agree to it and then walk away.


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## Apprentice_GM (Mar 5, 2009)

I'm with KarlP above - I would get them to do some cutting and splitting either for you or for charity (or a bit of both) by a fixed date. They do it, you drop charges. They still should pay for new lock and/or chain. Their attitude so far is good, apology not a lawsuit, I would forgive them - a mistake by them (which could have been fatal) and a lesson learned is a fair bit short of a criminal record which seems to be the 2 options.


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## JustWood (Mar 6, 2009)

A lock is a lock. Doesn't matter if it's on your house,shop ,tree stand,bicycle ,safe or jewelry box.The fact that they had the right tools to cut the lock shows malicious intent. Let the charges ride! They knew what they were doing


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## stoveguy13 (Mar 6, 2009)

make them sing a realeas you from any liabillty and have a lawyer draw it up so they cant try and get you later and forget it just protect your ass and make them pay the lawyer fees


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## savageactor7 (Mar 6, 2009)

jdscj8 I wouldn't advise you to have that couple back under any circumstances. Forget about the replacement chain and lock too...just be pleased if they sign a consent to avoid the place. DONE!


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## rphurley (Mar 6, 2009)

jdscj8 said:
			
		

> Thats what i was thinking get them to do something and let it go. Maybe let it go to the last day before court make um think about it for awile longer then tell um what i want um to do. I like the charity, give it or sell it and donate the money. We have plenty of trees.



I'd get them to sign a legal document promising not to sue you.  Trust me on this one.


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## LLigetfa (Mar 6, 2009)

Blah Ho Vick said:
			
		

> Let the charges ride!


Don't let down your guard.  Follow through with the charges.  They may talk a nice talk but later decide to sue.  The criminal convictions would go a long way in your defense in the court of lower standards.


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## Lumber-Jack (Mar 6, 2009)

If having possession of a signed letter from them admitting their mistake and apologizing for it doesn't protect you from being sued, charging them sure the heck isn't gona help, especially in the arena of creating goodwill. 
Also, asking them to sign some piece of paper promising they won't sue you could backfire on you, it would be a strong piece of evidence that you feel you are somehow at fault for their injuries, and they could use it against you if they ever did decide to sue you. Heck it might be just catalyst to get them thinking they are somehow the victims and you are the perpetrator. 
Remember, even bad people have friends, can appreciate kindness and can be nice to people when they want to. The last thing you want to do is make an enemy of a truly bad person who knows where you live. There are worse things they could do to you than sue you.
Of course there is always the chance they aren't really bad people, just stupid.  ;-)


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## firefighterjake (Mar 6, 2009)

Apprentice_GM said:
			
		

> I'm with KarlP above - I would get them to do some cutting and splitting either for you or for charity (or a bit of both) by a fixed date. They do it, you drop charges. They still should pay for new lock and/or chain. Their attitude so far is good, apology not a lawsuit, I would forgive them - a mistake by them (which could have been fatal) and a lesson learned is a fair bit short of a criminal record which seems to be the 2 options.



I concur with Apprentice and KarlP as well . . . the fact that they apologized and sort of took responsibility for their actions says quite a bit about them -- especially in this day and age where folks seem to be more inclined to blame everyone else but themselves for their actions. In terms of punishment, being injured is one form of punishment . . . I do think they should replace the lock though and give up some of their time and energy into helping you or a charity of your choice. They should learn one way or another however that what they did was wrong . . . as Apprentice said a lesson learned is what it sounds like they need.


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## daveswoodhauler (Mar 6, 2009)

Lets the courts decide the punishment. If you let them off easy, they won't learn the lesson.. and they will be more likely to commit a similar act in the future....probably not to you, but one of your neighbors. I realize they they got hurt, and wrote you a sob letter......but doesn't make up for the fact that they broke the law, and must now face the consequences.......just hate the idea of letting people off easy...seems to be a common theme in this nation lately with no responsibility. (Hopefully, your county/district does not have a judge like the ones you find up here in liberal land)


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## Backwoods Savage (Mar 6, 2009)

Only because of the way they entered your property, I would not settle with them. We've seen that sort of thing too often around these parts and these type of people just do not learn. Shaking hands and saying it's okay this time gets nothing accomplished other than strengthening their resolve. I say take it to the court.

Had they been poor and needy, I would perhaps say to be more lenient, but not with what they did. Right is right and wrong is wrong. People need to have accountability!


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## struggle (Mar 7, 2009)

Jd out of curiosity where about are you located in East Ne? Not exact location though. I am curious as I am from NW Iowa, Sioux City area and find it odd that someone would go to such an extreme to cut wood. This area as absolutely no pressure for wood harvesting. Around my area all you have to do is mention you would like to find some fire wood and there a many farmers that would be happy to let me cut trees down for their benefit asa well as mine. 

I also would echo what others have said keep criminal charges against them. I would in no way let this go off easy. You are unfortunately from what you describe in a tight spot even though you are in the right you need to make it stick that way. After this couple gets running around and this story expands to their circle of friends you can bet they are going to say sue them. They will find anyway possible to blame you they will and there will be at least three attorneys waiting to defend them.


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## jdscj8 (Mar 8, 2009)

We are just south of Omaha, As for finding wood its not all that hard to find around here if you look, but i have to say it is getting harder, more and more farmers dont like poeple around that much any more, its getting hard to trust anyone. To many things are getting stolen and people getting hurt. Last summer my 12 yr olds motorcycle and 3 yr olds electric jeep, along with some other stuff, was stolen from the shed, we had 6 big bales of hay taken. How can someone steal from children, its not like just anyone can go out and replace it the next day, OK 1800 on a motorcycle, 500 on the jeep, i can't so then you have to tell your children that there christmas presents is gone and you don't know when your getting it back. Then comes the WHY. **** i can't go there cause i'll F****N lose it,  and i promised my wife i wouldn't, i can't break that one cause i have to sleep with her. I just think town is getting closer so it might be time to move farther away.


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## ashpanannie (Mar 8, 2009)

I'm glad to hear you got an apology.  A truly sincere apology goes a long way with me.


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## jdscj8 (Mar 10, 2009)

an apology does go a long way with me 2. Its going on 2 weeks and from what i'm gathering around here is if we go to court all there going to get is a slap on the hand on a fine, i don't think thats going to bother someone that has money. Now if i put them hands to work doing something they don't like, insted of buming around on family money all day, i might get a little more satisfaction out of it. The kids(hes in his 20's) father contacted me this weekend and i think hes in more trouble with him then the law. I told him what i would like to do and he liked my plan he thought it would make him respect what he has alittle more, and respect what other people have to go though to get what they have. Being on a farm with trees cattle and horses i always have some pretty clean jobs to do :smirk: 
 And now i know who his father is and im shocked i know that when he told me his son will be here i know he will. He also told me to have his son help with the worst jobs out here.


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## JustWood (Mar 10, 2009)

What if  he gets hurt doing your "punishment work" and then sues for that. Let the charges ride and forget about it.


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## mike1234 (Mar 11, 2009)

This is your opportunity to show some Mercy, I bet someone has shown you some in the past.  In fact, if it was me, I might go cut up the tree and take it to their house and sit and have a cup of coffee with them.  What a chance to make a difference in somebodies lives.  Don't miss this.



			
				jdscj8 said:
			
		

> I got a letter today from the couple. In the letter they said they were sorry about the incedent and that a guy i had let get some wood last year told them where it was. I guess he had told them to just go in and get it, no one would know who did it. So the law wants to talk with him now. there asking if we can work something out between us, if i would drop the charges. Whats your take on it.


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## savageactor7 (Mar 11, 2009)

yup! what Blah Ho Vick said.


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## CowboyAndy (Mar 12, 2009)

Blah Ho Vick said:
			
		

> What if  he gets hurt doing your "punishment work" and then sues for that. Let the charges ride and forget about it.



That is a VERY valid point, and I hope the op certainly considers what could happen. I am with sticking to the charges even if it only nets them a slap on the hand and a fine.


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## jdscj8 (Apr 14, 2009)

UPDATE for you that was wondering. We did end up going to court, made a deal that way it was court ordered to make sure they kept there end, and if they get hurt im not reliable, covering my butt that way also, the charges were droped as long as they agreed to and carried out my tems and if they dont do it then the charges will come back in then there lookin at jail time.  They are not doing any work here at the farm (Sorry guys). I took them to a local low income nursing home for the elderly that my wife helps out at. The judge thought it was a great idea buy the way. I let them meet and get to know all the people there and then i told them they will be putting in a outside sitting area with benches, flowers and other landscaping so it will be a park like setting. Then after we left they volunteered to pay for all the materials out of there pocket and they would continue untill all of the work was done no matter how long it takes.

As for not working here at the farm i figured there was others that could benifit from this more then i would so why not give them something to enjoy that they have not been able to do for a long time. Im more then able to do my work around here myself.  And who knows maybe getting to know these folks in the home might give them a different outlook on things, well at least i can hope.


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## Apprentice_GM (Apr 14, 2009)

Bravo!

It sounds to me like they have genuinely changed and are sincerely sorry:



			
				jdscj8 said:
			
		

> Then after we left and they were in tears seeing how they lived they volunteered to pay for all the materials out of there pocket and they would continue untill all of the work was done no matter how long it takes.



That's the kind of attitude that shows a good heart to grace shown. I think the outcome you have arrived at is much better for everyone than jail time.



			
				jdscj8 said:
			
		

> As for not working here at the farm i figured there was others that could benifit from this more then i would so why not give them something to enjoy that they have not been able to do for a long time. Im more then able to do my work around here myself.  And who knows maybe getting to know these folks in the home might give them a different outlook on things, well at least i can hope.



And that just shows a good heart  I reckon you've done the best thing in these circumstances. I'd still be interested to see the final outcome, assuming it's completed satisfactorily.


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## KarlP (Apr 14, 2009)

Thanks for the update.  I think you make an excellent victim of crime.   :-/  Good job.


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