# Electric Lawn Tractors



## Ashful (Jun 25, 2019)

Just filled my truck, and hauled along three 5-gallon gas cans for the mower, and it reminded me of something I’ve pointed out before.  I luse more gas mowing my lawn for half the year than I use in my cars, maybe almost as much as I use in all of my cars for the entire year in just 6 - 7 months of mowing, and I drive vehicles with some pretty horrendous MPG’s.

Where are the EM’s (Electric Mowers) of any real merit?  By “any real merit”, I mean something rated above 4 acres per hour, and good for reliably running 2+ hours at full bore by end of life.


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## begreen (Jun 25, 2019)

Lawnmowers are major emissions sources. Estimate from 10-40x worse than a car. The current electric riding mowers are too small. I've toyed with the idea of using a 48v battery bank section from a Volt for powering a mower. Seems like it would work well enough.
https://sites.psu.edu/math033fa17/2017/10/10/american-lawn-care-emissions/

The Ryobi zero-turn 42" (RY48ztr100) looks good for 2-3 acres, but not appropriate for our hilly property and somewhat pricey, but one would save a lot on gas. (ethanol free is >$5/gal here)
https://todaysmower.com/2019-electric-riding-mowers/

This site is interesting and helpful:
https://electriclawntractor.com/

Still, there are the emissions issues from all that turf too.
https://www.onlynaturalenergy.com/grass-lawns-are-an-ecological-catastrophe/


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## Ashful (Jun 25, 2019)

I’ve reduced our turf by a half acre already, with more planned in the near future.  Unfortunately, two new neighbors have cleared about 3 acres of lawn immediately adjacent to me, so it’s a net increase in turf.


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## Where2 (Jun 27, 2019)

begreen said:


> (ethanol free is >$5/gal here)


*Really*? I bought 15 gallons of ethanol free last weekend for $2.99/gal. (planning ahead for hurricane season) On the same trip, I bought 32 gal of diesel for $2.65/gal. (Filled up the VW TDI wagon, and stocked up three 5 gal cans of diesel for hurricane season, so technically I have enough fuel to drive from my house in South FL to Cincinnati, OH). 

If you feel the need to have an electric mower to park next to your EV (so you can stop making fuel runs to mow the lawn), take your credit card and find a Mean Green Mower dealer. Gravely's electric mower is still at prototype stage. (I live in the land of year round mowing). The Mean Green looks every bit as stout as my old Snapper 48" commercial walk behind.


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## begreen (Jun 28, 2019)

Yeah, we're in a captive rural market. Regular gas is almost $4/gal. It's better in Seattle, but still around $3.25-3.45 for regular gas.

The Mean Green Machine looks cool, but a zero turn like that is not the best for our hilly rural cutting.


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## Ashful (Jun 28, 2019)

I evaluated the Big Mow in 2011, electric autonomous mower (think Roomba for your lawn) when we bought our current lot with 4 acres of mowing.  They wanted $15,000 for the machine, and they had doubts as to whether it could really keep up with 4 acres of mowing at that time.  They were suggesting I consider purchasing at least two.

At the time, they were the only autonomous option for larger properties.  I don’t recall looking for non-autonomous electric mowers at that time, but I don’t recall seeing any, either.

Mean Green looks interesting, but at $12k for a 500 lb. homeowner-grade machine with a 48” deck, they’re a long way from being a viable option for most.  Competing machines are one quarter of that price, typically around $3k.  They rate it at 2 acres per hour, which is just as absurd as Deere saying my 60” mower does 5 acres per hour.  Their Nemesis will likely do around 1 acre per hour under most real-world yard conditions, which means you’re limited to < 2.5 acres per charge with a brandy-new battery, and less as it ages.

Not very useful, yet... but it’s a good step in the right direction.  Improvement will come with time.

Edit:  I just found pricing on the CXR52 commercial mower, which I had left out, since there was no pricing on the top of the page.  This is a serious mower, more comparable to a commercial Deere or Exmark, but it’s $25k for a 52” mower!  They do some back-of-the-envelope math to show the savings in a commercial application, given $5500 in Federal tax credits, but the financials just don’t work out for non-commercial users.  I can buy a commercial Deere or Gravely with a 60” deck or $7k - $9k, from a dealer in my neighborhood, without driving to a different state to find a dealer.


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## begreen (Jun 28, 2019)

Yes, there are 52 and 60" and 48" Mean Greens too.
https://meangreenproducts.com/cxr5260/
Looks like a dealer isn't too far, in NJ next door.
http://www.centraljerseyequipment.com/

Yes, it's pricey. Might be worth calling the dealer to see if there are other incentives and if they are selling below sticker price. The economics are different. There is a lot less to go wrong and service. That means a lot less time spent in maintenance. After 2000 hrs of duty one might be considering engine and tranny work on an ICE mower. The MGM should be still perking along.

Looks like it has a 3KW inverter option, so it could be a sweet portable power supply too.


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## Ashful (Jun 28, 2019)

Yeah, for commercial customers, I can see the justification.  But the usage scale makes the present cost unjustifiable for a homeowner.  I put 65 - 70 hours on my machine every year... I’m not sure I’ll ever see 2000 hours.  I also do all my own maintenance, at an average annual cost too insignificant to even consider.

Central Jersey Equipment is over an hour from my house, but I have three Deere dealers within ten or fifteen minutes drive.  No way I’m making a 2+ hour round trip for parts, when something breaks and I need my mower every 4 - 5 days, when I can swing by the Deere dealer any day on my lunch break.

I am sure that will change over the next decade, but that’s where we are today.


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## blades (Jun 28, 2019)

way back in the day there were a couple of battery run garden tractors, a guy a couple blocks away was into collecting them it was in the 80's when I met him , they looked to be from the early to mid 70's can't remember any brand name  though. He was in the process of tying to get a permit for wind generator- primarily to be used to charge the tractors up.


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## semipro (Jun 28, 2019)

I picked up one of these units and replaced the bad lead-acid batteries with Li-ion.  Its good for a small yard or trim work but not nearly something I'd wanted to mow even an acre with. It feels really archaic and clumsy compared to my ZTR John Deere F525.  



begreen said:


> The Ryobi zero-turn 42" (RY48ztr100) looks good for 2-3 acres, but not appropriate for our hilly property and somewhat pricey, but one would save a lot on gas. (ethanol free is >$5/gal here)
> https://todaysmower.com/2019-electric-riding-mowers/


I'm interested in one of these but plan to wait until the lead-acid batteries start dying off to find one used.


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## Where2 (Jun 28, 2019)

Ashful said:


> I put 65 - 70 hours on my machine every year... I’m not sure I’ll ever see 2000 hours.  I also do all my own maintenance, at an average annual cost too insignificant to even consider.
> 
> Central Jersey Equipment is over an hour from my house, but I have three Deere dealers within ten or fifteen minutes drive.  No way I’m making a 2+ hour round trip for parts, when something breaks and I need my mower every 4 - 5 days, when I can swing by the Deere dealer any day on my lunch break.



I grew up on the leading edge of suburbia, and grew quite accustomed to having parts for mower engines and equipment I was working on within a short radius drive. Going off to college was like taking a step back in time, because I moved from suburbia to a small city/predominantly college town. I used to think I'd never want to live in a city of less than 30,000 people, because getting parts for things was such a hassle. Fast forward a quarter century... With modern internet retail shops and two day delivery on many items, I find I can easily get along in the woods in northern Maine, 40 miles this side of Canada and 80 miles from the nearest "large city (33,000 residents)". The UPS driver easily finds my house, 2.5 miles off the interstate, and delivers anything from mower belts, to name brand car tires. (Things I cannot easily find in a rural community.) I'm all for supporting my local retailer, but much of small town rural America is not blessed with a dealer for everything.

The 60-70 hour per year comment is intriguing, the last "scrap" mower I picked up in FL has 265 hours on the 25hp Kohler engine. (engine and hydrostatic drive is fine, deck is rusted garbage) I never realized how quickly northern grasses grow in early spring, until I spent a summer in Maine and had to mow the 1.25 acres I considered "the yard" twice a week to keep up...


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## Ashful (Jun 28, 2019)

Where2 said:


> The 60-70 hour per year comment is intriguing, the last "scrap" mower I picked up in FL has 265 hours on the 25hp Kohler engine. (engine and hydrostatic drive is fine, deck is rusted garbage) I never realized how quickly northern grasses grow in early spring, until I spent a summer in Maine and had to mow the 1.25 acres I considered "the yard" twice a week to keep up...


It takes me almost exactly 2 hours to mow this lawn on a Deere 757 ZTrak with 60" deck, so that 70 hours is about 35 mows per year.  That's every 4th or 5th day from mid-April thru late-June, but I can sometimes go a month without a single mowing from early July to early August.  Having zero weeds is key there, my lawn goes dormant in summer drought, while my neighbors weeds keep growing.  Fall mowing is weekly, tapering to every second week at the end.


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## peakbagger (Jun 29, 2019)

Sears had version of the old Electric Lawn Tractors. I think GE may have been the manufacturer. Home Power had a couple of articles on the history and restoring of these lawn tractors. If I remember there were not a lot of moving parts.

BTW there used to be an electric ATV called the Gorilla. I think it was golf part components with all terrain tires but something you would ride like an ATV. It was small manufacturer that built them mostly to order.


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## SpaceBus (Jun 29, 2019)

A lawn mower seems like it would be the easiest candidate for electrification with the least return on investment for dealers. I think many people forget that tons of money is made on in service departments.


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## Ashful (Jun 29, 2019)

SpaceBus said:


> A lawn mower seems like it would be the easiest candidate for electrification with the least return on investment for dealers. I think many people forget that tons of money is made on in service departments.



Seems like you skipped reading most of the last ten posts.  Yes, an easy candidate, but cost is currently prohibitive.  $24,590 for a mower with less capability than any $7500 commercial zero turn, is the current state of the art.

They show how it’s a cost savings, based on commercial utilization rates.  Of course they’re ignoring battery depreciation and replacement, while inflating the real costs of ICE maintenance to worst case.  Unfortunately, even with their skewed math, it just doesn’t work out for private owner utilization rates.


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## spirilis (Jun 29, 2019)

Looked into this briefly the past week (looking at a 5 acre residence tho probably not going for it).  Was also underwhelmed with what's out there.


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## SpaceBus (Jun 29, 2019)

Ashful said:


> Seems like you skipped reading most of the last ten posts.  Yes, an easy candidate, but cost is currently prohibitive.  $24,590 for a mower with less capability than any $7500 commercial zero turn, is the current state of the art.
> 
> They show how it’s a cost savings, based on commercial utilization rates.  Of course they’re ignoring battery depreciation and replacement, while inflating the real costs of ICE maintenance to worst case.  Unfortunately, even with their skewed math, it just doesn’t work out for private owner utilization rates.



You have selected one small part of the market share. I'm just saying in the long run mowers will become less profitable due to less servicing. Think about labor rates, shipping, and entire fluid recycling infrastructures. Electrification will have a huge impact over time. Even at $23k the dealer will lose money even if every single commercial mower is replaced. Repeat business and service visits keep the lights on.

I read this whole thread before my previous comment. It's exciting to see Husqvarna is working on an electric rider. Maybe by the time I can afford a decent electric mower they will bring it to the US. Electric lawn equipment is definitely the future. I even feel like I'm old fashioned with my Stihl Kombi, but electric pruning and trimming equipment just isn't there yet, as Ashful has pointed out. I'm excited for the future, but like Ashful, I still like gas powered race cars and stuff. My wife's car comes from the factory without mufflers and I love it. I hope to have an EV and more electric equipment in the future, but I'm glad petrol stuff is still around.


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## Seasoned Oak (Jun 29, 2019)

Most mowers sit around between uses too much to make a big battery investment pay off. You have to keep a log of hours to see if it would ever pay off. I know it would NOT be a good choice for me. Those mowing large lots may benefit.


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## peakbagger (Jun 29, 2019)

Here is some info on "new technology" for sale fifty years ago

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Elec-Trak


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## Easy Livin’ 3000 (Jun 29, 2019)

Ashful said:


> Just filled my truck, and hauled along three 5-gallon gas cans for the mower, and it reminded me of something I’ve pointed out before.  I luse more gas mowing my lawn for half the year than I use in my cars, maybe almost as much as I use in all of my cars for the entire year in just 6 - 7 months of mowing, and I drive vehicles with some pretty horrendous MPG’s.
> 
> Where are the EM’s (Electric Mowers) of any real merit?  By “any real merit”, I mean something rated above 4 acres per hour, and good for reliably running 2+ hours at full bore by end of life.


Get a few small goats, some fence, and a small mobile shed.  No more gas or electricity.  

 I'm only half "kid"ding, because I think having animals mow my lawn would be awesome, but in the spirit of your question, in 5 years or less, the electric mowers will be up to snuff and cost competitive with gas.  This tech is moving fast, but if you transition now, you'll be at the bleeding edge, and it will $ting.


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## semipro (Jun 29, 2019)

Seasoned Oak said:


> Most mowers sit around between uses too much to make a big battery investment pay off.


What if they were grid-tied? -- basically a self propelled PowerWall with grass cutting blades. 
Come to think of it, I'm a bit surprised that Elon hasn't jumped into this market. It seems a lot more relevant than Tesla Tequila anyway.


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## Ashful (Jun 29, 2019)

SpaceBus said:


> You have selected one small part of the market share.


This is true!  But it's _my _small part of the market share.

I think we all see the direction this is headed, it won't be that long until we're telling our grand kids about how our mowers used to run on gasoline, speaking with the same fondness my own grandfather directed toward the LaSalle.


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## Seasoned Oak (Jun 30, 2019)

ED 3000 said:


> Get a few small goats, some fence, and a small mobile shed.  No more gas or electricity.
> 
> .


 Iv done exactly that. Fenced off a few acres and started raising beef cattle 2 at a time for personal use. Kept the grass and weeds mowed all summer, fed the family all year. Thats something no electric or gas mower can do.


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## begreen (Jun 30, 2019)

And they fertilized the area while at it.


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## Seasoned Oak (Jun 30, 2019)

begreen said:


> And they fertilized the area while at it.


Organically!


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## SpaceBus (Jun 30, 2019)

begreen said:


> And they fertilized the area while at it.


Some folks near us are giving us an alpaca and I'm really excited for his compost.


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## begreen (Jun 30, 2019)

SpaceBus said:


> Some folks near us are giving us an alpaca and I'm really excited for his compost.


Get it a companion. Alpacas are social herd animals. And yes, their poop is good garden fertilizer.


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## SpaceBus (Jun 30, 2019)

begreen said:


> Get it a companion. Alpacas are social herd animals. And yes, their poop is good garden fertilizer.


That's part of why we are adopting him. For years this alpaca had a companion, but he died and his current caretakers are getting too old to take care of him anyway. We hope to find another alpaca, but are also on the lookout for goats. The alpaca owners also have six peacocks that I think they need to let go. For some reason they thought they wanted a bunch of animals? Two of the six pea fowl are females, one white, one green. There are also two white males and two green males. I hope to get at least one of their males and one female, I've read pea fowl eggs are delicious.


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## Easy Livin’ 3000 (Jun 30, 2019)

Seasoned Oak said:


> Iv done exactly that. Fenced off a few acres and started raising beef cattle 2 at a time for personal use. Kept the grass and weeds mowed all summer, fed the family all year. Thats something no electric or gas mower can do.


Love it, although steer yoga is hell on the back compared to goat yoga with mini Nubians.  Two steer would keep me in red meat for a decade, if I decide to keep eating cows.


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## SpaceBus (Jun 30, 2019)

ED 3000 said:


> Love it, although steer yoga is hell on the back compared goat yoga with mini Nubians.  Two steer would keep me in red meat for a decade, if I decide to keep eating cows.


With a deep freezer I think it would last us the same. A cow has a lot of meat.


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## Seasoned Oak (Jun 30, 2019)

Did that for a couple years and ended up giving some meat to friends ,freezing some. You only butcher 1 per yr as they take 2 yrs to mature. As much as i love good beef, i eat it sparingly ,mostly just  the tenderloin and ribeye. Nothing like home grown grass fed and grain finished beef. After that most other beef doesnt ever measure up.


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## Circus (Jul 3, 2019)

If folks were really concerned with the environment impact of lawns they would plant low mow, deep rooted turfs that you mow ever 7 week, not days. Roots that are two feet, not inches.


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## Easy Livin’ 3000 (Jul 3, 2019)

Circus said:


> If folks were really concerned with the environment impact of lawns they would plant low mow, deep rooted turfs that you mow ever 7 week, instead of days. Roots that are two feet instead of inches.


Sounds great.  Where do you get the seed/what kind of grass is it?


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## SpaceBus (Jul 3, 2019)

ED 3000 said:


> Sounds great.  Where do you get the seed/what kind of grass is it?


I think everyone would jump on a that kind of grass if it worked well.


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## begreen (Jul 3, 2019)

SpaceBus said:


> I think everyone would jump on a that kind of grass if it worked well.


It costs more. 
https://www.pearlspremium.com/our-story/secret-roots


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## semipro (Jul 3, 2019)

SpaceBus said:


> That's part of why we are adopting him. For years this alpaca had a companion, but he died and his current caretakers are getting too old to take care of him anyway. We hope to find another alpaca, but are also on the lookout for goats. The alpaca owners also have six peacocks that I think they need to let go. For some reason they thought they wanted a bunch of animals? Two of the six pea fowl are females, one white, one green. There are also two white males and two green males. I hope to get at least one of their males and one female, I've read pea fowl eggs are delicious.


Donkeys make good companion animals in general and seem readily available in our area. 
We have friends with goats and if they perceive a threat they all gather around the donkey for protection.  Apparently, a donkey that knows what its doing can handle most predators.


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## semipro (Jul 3, 2019)

begreen said:


> Get it a companion. Alpacas are social herd animals. And yes, their poop is good garden fertilizer.


Just be careful of herbicides like Grazon that are making their way through the digestive systems of animals only to stunt vegetables. 
https://www.growingagreenerworld.com/killer-compost-it-happened-to-us/

Between this and the juglone from Black Walnut tree chips we've had several adverse impacts in our garden.


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## begreen (Jul 3, 2019)

Yes, there are lots of reasons not to use toxins on a lawn or chemical fertilizers. The original purpose of big manor lawns was for sheep grazing. Now everyone is trying to play lord of the manor, but the ties to the original purpose of providing food and fiber for the manor has been forgotten. I think that idea should be put back into play today.


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## SpaceBus (Jul 4, 2019)

semipro said:


> Donkeys make good companion animals in general and seem readily available in our area.
> We have friends with goats and if they perceive a threat they all gather around the donkey for protection.  Apparently, a donkey that knows what its doing can handle most predators.



Thanks for the tip about the donkey. I've read that alpaca can defend themselves as well. My goal is to have a little barn and fence up by the end of August. If not I'll probably call up one of the local large alpaca farms and they will take him. Either option is better than staying were he is.


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## SpaceBus (Jul 4, 2019)

begreen said:


> It costs more.
> https://www.pearlspremium.com/our-story/secret-roots


Yeah, that's not too surprising. If we have to plant any grass, that seems like a good option. I didn't see pricing on the website, how much more does it cost?


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## Ashful (Jul 4, 2019)

begreen said:


> It costs more.
> https://www.pearlspremium.com/our-story/secret-roots



I’m finding zero information on the actual blend of species used, here.  The site reads like a bad infomercial for snake oil.  Without disclosing the species, which I had always thought was a requirement by law on the bag, it’s hard to take him seriously.


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## SpaceBus (Jul 4, 2019)

Ashful said:


> I’m finding zero information on the actual blend of species used, here.  The site reads like a bad infomercial for snake oil.  Without disclosing the species, which I had always thought was a requirement by law on the bag, it’s hard to take him seriously.


Wouldn't every business on this planet use such a grass if it were easily available? I get that a grass that needs less mowing is bad for the lawn care industry, but I doubt that matters to other companies.


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## begreen (Jul 4, 2019)

Ashful said:


> I’m finding zero information on the actual blend of species used, here.  The site reads like a bad infomercial for snake oil.  Without disclosing the species, which I had always thought was a requirement by law on the bag, it’s hard to take him seriously.


Links to the product specifications are listed at the bottom of the FAQ page.
https://www.pearlspremium.com/faqs/frequently-asked-questions


SpaceBus said:


> Wouldn't every business on this planet use such a grass if it were easily available? I get that a grass that needs less mowing is bad for the lawn care industry, but I doubt that matters to other companies.


I suspect that long rooted turf-grass does not make good sod. A lot of new housing gets a sod lawn rolled out in a day.


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## Ashful (Jul 4, 2019)

begreen said:


> Links to the product specifications are listed at the bottom of the FAQ page.
> https://www.pearlspremium.com/faqs/frequently-asked-questions
> .


Much better, but they say blends will vary from bag lot to lot, based on what... current seed pricing?

He claims drought tolerant, which would be true of the proportion of tall fescue is the majority of the blend.  The tall fescue species he has chosen are pretty good in that regard, but they have zero natural damage recovery.  The rye and bluegrass provide that, and faster germination, but rye will die damn near 100% in the very first draught.  It just can’t weather any summer stress.  

Without knowing the percentages, it’s impossible to really make a conclusion.  Overall, it looks like he probably has a good blend for homeowner application, but nothing magic.

Seed blend requirements vary a lot by zone (region), and age of lawn.  For my zone, that is tall fescue for mature lawns, which is unfortunately the most expensive of the three.  I wouldn’t waste any time with rye, in our normal climate, except to get some fast coverage on a new lawn.  Some like to include some bluegrass, as it has some self-healing properties that tall fescue lacks, but that gives your lawn a non-uniform appearance. 

This appears to me as another person making claims of something special about their product, which it simply isn’t.  It may be a very good quality blend, but there is no magic, here.

His FAQ does have great advice, though.  Use quality seed appropriate for your zone and lawn age, test and manage your pH and nutrient levels, and you will have a beautiful lawn.  That’s whether you mow it with Dino juice, lithium ion, or alpaca.


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## sloeffle (Jul 5, 2019)

FYI - this probably more for @SpaceBus since it sounds like he might be a grass farmer shortly.

Fescues that used for lawns and for forage are two different animals. The lawn fescues have something called endophyte in them. If you graze animals long enough on endophyte infected grasses their hoofs can actually develop lameness. The horse people call it founder. Us folks that eat our animals call it fescue foot. Endophyte free or novel endpohyte forage grasses are great to have in your pasture mix. Just like anything else, I'd use them in moderation with other forage species such as orchardgrass, festolium, rye grass, brassicas, clovers and various other species.

http://oregonstate.edu/endophyte-lab/files/tall-fescue-endophyte-booklet.pdf

http://oregonstate.edu/endophyte-lab/files/ext-pub-nov-2016.pdf

Endophytes: The Friendly Fungi in Turfgrass

https://turf.umn.edu/news/endophytes-friendly-fungi-turfgrass


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## begreen (Jul 5, 2019)

Has anyone besides Jags actually put together an electric riding mower? I think a 48v section of a Chevy Volt battery would be ideal, but haven't found anyone doing this yet.


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## semipro (Jul 5, 2019)

begreen said:


> Has anyone besides Jags actually put together an electric riding mower? I think a 48v section of a Chevy Volt battery would be ideal, but haven't found anyone doing this yet.


I'm not sure what you mean by "put together" but I did put 48VDC of Chevy Volt battery in an Ariens Amp rider per post 
https://www.hearth.com/talk/threads/electric-lawn-tractors.175836/#post-2366079
My son used it this weekend to mow.  I hope to squeeze two of these battery modules in there eventually.


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## begreen (Jul 5, 2019)

I was thinking a more complete conversion like the fellow in the post I put up earlier where the chassis and transaxle were reworked to convert an ICE to battery power. The Arien 38" is a little small and already electric, but that's also a cool idea. Was the mower 48v to start with? How many hours before recharge? What are you charging it with?


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## semipro (Jul 5, 2019)

begreen said:


> I was thinking a more complete conversion like the fellow in the post I put up earlier where the chassis and transaxle were reworked to convert an ICE to battery power. The Arien 38" is a little small and already electric, but that's also a cool idea. Was the mower 48v to start with? How many hours before recharge? What are you charging it with?


It was 48VDC to start with so the conversion was easy, not like replacing the ICE anyway.   I charge with the same charger I use on my e-bike.  Limited use so far so I'm not sure how long it runs between charges.  
I'm trying to standardize on 48VDC though as it seems somewhat universal for solar PV, mowers, even vehicles (in series).  

In general, mowers and tractors seem like a great opportunity for electrification -- tractors especially where weight is typically an asset rather than a detriment.


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## SpaceBus (Jul 5, 2019)

sloeffle said:


> FYI - this probably more for @SpaceBus since it sounds like he might be a grass farmer shortly.
> 
> Fescues that used for lawns and for forage are two different animals. The lawn fescues have something called endophyte in them. If you graze animals long enough on endophyte infected grasses their hoofs can actually develop lameness. The horse people call it founder. Us folks that eat our animals call it fescue foot. Endophyte free or novel endpohyte forage grasses are great to have in your pasture mix. Just like anything else, I'd use them in moderation with other forage species such as orchardgrass, festolium, rye grass, brassicas, clovers and various other species.
> 
> ...



We have zero turf, but I appreciate the reading material all the same. So far it's wild blueberries, strawberry, buttercups, daisies, tree seedlings, and wild grasses. I just use a string trimmer around the house.


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## Circus (Jul 6, 2019)

Ashful said:


> Where are the EM’s (Electric Mowers) of any real merit?  By “any real merit”, I mean something rated above 4 acres per hour, and good for reliably running 2+ hours at full bore by end of life.



On first blush you would think an electric tractor, without a rotary mower, towing reel mowers would need far less power.


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## Ashful (Jul 6, 2019)

Circus said:


> On first blush you would think an electric tractor, without a rotary mower, towing reel mowers would need far less power.


I wonder if that's true.  I've pushed old-school reel type mowers, and they take a massive amount of energy to propel.  There's probably no free lunch here, the same amount of "work" is ultimately done.


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## blades (Jul 6, 2019)

When a reel mower is properly set up it does not take all that much power in tow behind set up. I had a 5 gang 36" each set I used to use back in the 60's. 7.5 horsepower 2 wheel tractor with a sulky behind and then the gang.  Course if you went too fast they would skip.  Back 20 years ago when my shop was in a different location I would see about 3 push reel mowers a week.  Some were so bad that there was nothing I could  do for them others were ok and just needed attention and lapping. Bit of an art to servicing those. I do not miss them at all. And yes when I was around ten or so it was my job to mow Grandparents city lot with one.


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## MTY (Jul 7, 2019)

We use goats.  The hillside is too steep to mow or weed whack.  When the we get the new place done, the goats are going with us.  The new place is flat  enough to mow behind the house, however a large portion of that area will be reforested.   The goats will be in charge of all that is not reforested except the flower beds. 

Goats will follow you around like a dog.  They are pretty interesting critters.  I open their pen up, and they head for the pasture.  When it is time for them to be put up, they head for their pen. 

Three will go through about 60 bales of hay at $3.00 per bale per year.  This is in additon to grazing.


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## SpaceBus (Jul 8, 2019)

MTY said:


> We use goats.  The hillside is too steep to mow or weed whack.  When the we get the new place done, the goats are going with us.  The new place is flat  enough to mow behind the house, however a large portion of that area will be reforested.   The goats will be in charge of all that is not reforested except the flower beds.
> 
> Goats will follow you around like a dog.  They are pretty interesting critters.  I open their pen up, and they head for the pasture.  When it is time for them to be put up, they head for their pen.
> 
> Three will go through about 60 bales of hay at $3.00 per bale per year.  This is in additon to grazing.



$180/yr seems like a good deal. I've been reading accounts by folks with fiber goats and they actually make a bit of money. Probably not that much, but enough to feed the animals.


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## MTY (Jul 8, 2019)

SpaceBus said:


> $180/yr seems like a good deal. I've been reading accounts by folks with fiber goats and they actually make a bit of money. Probably not that much, but enough to feed the animals.


There are a few other expenses.  I give them about a cup to a cup and a half of grain daily.  Then there is the cost of bedding.  We use pine shavings, and the used shavings are then used for mulch. 

And if your tractor upsets you, you can shoot it, but you cannot eat it.


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## begreen (Jul 8, 2019)

MTY said:


> And if your tractor upsets you, you can shoot it, but you cannot eat it.


But your tractor is less likely to bust in the house and start eating the furniture.


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## Seasoned Oak (Jul 8, 2019)

MTY said:


> And if your tractor upsets you, you can shoot it, but you cannot eat it.


Goats are pretty tasty. So much more then the John deere.


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## Seasoned Oak (Jul 8, 2019)

Im totally happy with my mower. Dont fix it if it aint broke


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## Ashful (Jul 8, 2019)

Anyone try one of these?


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## begreen (Jul 8, 2019)

Here are some serious boy toys


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