# Talkin' Tractors



## Battenkiller (Dec 7, 2011)

OK, I'm gonna be mowing about four times as much grass come spring as I have been here.  Over 4 acres, with probably three full acres of lawn.  I'll need some sort of tractor/riding mower since I really can't see mowing four hours a day with my old self-propelled one.  There are so many options and I am a bit confused about which way to go.  Ideally, I'd love a real tractor with a bucket loader and a mowing deck/attachment.  Something I can transform the land a wee bit with.  Never had an opportunity like that before.

The only tractors I've ever run were the big farm tractors we used on the horse farms I worked on as a kid.  A little out of my budget and a bit overkill for my needs.  So, what are some options - new or used - that might fit into a $5K or less budget?  An smaller old farm tractor would be great, and give me something to tinker with and have pride of ownership in.  But foremost in my needs, it has to be able to cut grass well.


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## oldspark (Dec 7, 2011)

An older tractor is nice but the new stuff in so much more user friendly, think a bull in a china shop vs a gazelle in the forrest.


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## LLigetfa (Dec 7, 2011)

A lot of will depend how thick the grass will grow and how nice you want the results to look.  I wide deck and decent ground speed gets the job done quicker but not all mowers are created equal.  Too fast in thick/tall grass can result in missed strips or heavy clumping.

Do you want to mulch or discharge?  Will you do a lot of towing (sweeper/aerator/roller/trailer)?  Will you take it out in the rough and want to remove the deck?  Did you want want to go with a manual gear or hydro?

A garden tractor would have a tougher drivetrain.  HDAP or ag tires would give better traction.


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## oldspark (Dec 7, 2011)

If you go with an older tractor, make sure you know what you are getting, live hyd., live power and power steering are needed for mowing unless you like PITA's.


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## Battenkiller (Dec 7, 2011)

LLigetfa said:
			
		

> A lot of will depend how thick the grass will grow and how nice you want the results to look.  I wide deck and decent ground speed gets the job done quicker but not all mowers are created equal.  Too fast in thick/tall grass can result in missed strips or heavy clumping.
> 
> Do you want to mulch or discharge?  Will you do a lot of towing (sweeper/aerator/roller/trailer)?  Will you take it out in the rough and want to remove the deck?  Did you want want to go with a manual gear or hydro?
> 
> A garden tractor would have a tougher drivetrain.  HDAP or ag tires would give better traction.



I basically just want to knock it down every week, I'm not a lawn person.  The grass doesn't look heavy like the 99% quack grass I've been mowing by hand here for over 20 years.  I want something powerful enough to pull a cart with 1000 pounds in it around the property (or a 1000 pound log suspended in my log arch).  I also don't want something that will be in the repair shop every spring, so tough is good.  Manual tranny, I don't mind that at all, as long as it holds up well.  Are the hydros more durable?


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## gzecc (Dec 7, 2011)

If I had that much to spend I would look for a used JD 430 GT. Its a 3cyl diesel with a 60" deck and 3 point hitch. You can put all kinds of attachments on it.


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## oldspark (Dec 7, 2011)

You might get some ideas here, a friendly bunch I think with good info. http://www.tractorbynet.com/


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## JustWood (Dec 7, 2011)

I've been to a half dozen farm sales or better in the last year and you can buy a lot of tractor for less than $5000.


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## ISeeDeadBTUs (Dec 7, 2011)

New is nice, but it's out of your budget right now.

Plenty of 8N and 9N available. A great site is tractorhouse.com

Why would you want to mow 3 acres?! :roll:  Unless yer buildin' a golf course??

For the price you are going to want to spend, you prolly will have to forgo

FEL
PS
4wd
mid-mount remotes
live independent multi-speed PTO

I recomend getting the mower as soon as you get the tractor, otherwise you've got a tractor that you can't actually do anything with.

Or. . .  reconfigure the house deal to finance a nice new 'bota in with that crazy new mortgage yer gonna pay :coolsmirk:


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## ewdudley (Dec 7, 2011)

http://philadelphia.craigslist.org/grd/2686894413.html


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## LLigetfa (Dec 7, 2011)

Battenkiller said:
			
		

> Manual tranny, I don't mind that at all, as long as it holds up well.  Are the hydros more durable?


Hydros are not more durable but if you stay away from the light duty lawn tractor series and go with garden tractor series you should be OK.  If you need to be speeding up and slowing down a lot, a hydro is the way to go.  www.mytractorforum.com is another good site.


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## bluedogz (Dec 7, 2011)

gzecc said:
			
		

> If I had that much to spend I would look for a used JD 430 GT. Its a 3cyl diesel with a 60" deck and 3 point hitch. You can put all kinds of attachments on it.



+1.

Wish I had done this when I had the chance. My GT245 hauls a lot of stuff, but I failed to forsee the need for a PTO and available attachments.


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## wkpoor (Dec 7, 2011)

A cheap tractor that can easy power a woods L59 and easily pull a trailer probably up to 7K is an Allis Chalmers B, C, or CA. The Bs are wide front, the Cs, CAs wide or narrow. Very reliable easy to work on and maintain. I've owned Farmall, Fords, Deers and I gotta say those little Bs are nice and can be found cheap.


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## Danno77 (Dec 7, 2011)

ISDBTUs  beat me to it, but a good old 8n/9n would be great. Other than that, I'm pretty partial to the nicest JD (with GT somewhere in the model #) that you can afford.

$5000, if you are willing to go that high, will get you something really nice to do this with and something that will probably outlast you.


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## bpirger (Dec 7, 2011)

If you need to mow, I suggest thinking carefully about tire style.  Ags will give great traction, but they will wreck your grass/yard.  Especially if it is at all wet...you leave ruts.  Turf tires are great for grass and mowing, not good on snow/ice.  But tire chains will fix that in a hurry.  If I had to mow three acres, I'd make sure I had turf tires....and then put on the chains for snow work.

Do you have woods to play in?  

I don't think $5K is going to get you into a used Kubota or similar at all, not with a loader anyways.

The older Deere's, as has been mentioned, are little tanks....not sure you can go wrong.  You might have to tinker a bit to keep them going, but they are strong.  Much more reliable than the craftsmans and similar, in my experience.  But you will be looking at a machine at least 10 years old I think....others will know more.

Tires....stay away from the Ags.  Whenever I drive over my yard, I know it....for quite some time, especially if it is soft.


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## firefighterjake (Dec 7, 2011)

For less than $5K I think you could get a decent Kubota . . . quick search here in Maine brought up two Kubotas for less than $5,000.

A B7100 with a snowblower for $4,500 (this is a 3-cylinder diesel, 16 hp with 4WD and PTOs) . . . also a B7100 for $4,000 with a snow blower and mower deck.


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## Dill (Dec 7, 2011)

Or a lates 80s/early 90s deere compact, which are actually yarmars, I've seen 850,950 and 1050s in that price range. And what I think is the best deal on used compact tractors are the 80s Fords, very well built usaually low hour and your price like a 1210 Ford.
I'm not a huge fan of 8ns or 9ns. But you can get a great deal on IH utility tractors in the 60s and 70s vintage. Like a 460, 350 ect. I bought my 62 IH 606 for 1100 with a parts tractor. Its gas so I don't use it for farming, but it has a loader and a quick hydro pump so I use it all winter on the splitter.


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## gzecc (Dec 7, 2011)

There is an very nice JD 430 with a 60" deck in Mount Joy PA on Craigslist for 4k as we speak. Only 1200 hours.
Let us know where your located. Unless your a secret agent?


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## ironpony (Dec 7, 2011)

mid 80's Kubota are available here 2500-3500 diesel
personally for that much grass I would go with a zero turn mower
then a tractor for other chores
going to be a little more but now is the time to buy going into winter
I mowed with my JD 420  60" cut for years, picked up a zero turn last year
and boy is it nice
also have a 4wd Kubota b 7100 great for everything else
so I would vote used Kubota and a used zero turn
might get closer to 5000 than you think
if I search craigs list right now
I know I could find both for that


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## ISeeDeadBTUs (Dec 7, 2011)

Yanmar :sick: 

'bota with a 'B' or an 'X' in th model :-/


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## Battenkiller (Dec 7, 2011)

gzecc said:
			
		

> Let us know where your located. Unless your a secret agent?



Well, I am a secret agent, but I thought the whole world knew that the "Blue Line" is the boundary of the Adirondack Park in upstate New York.  :roll:  ;-) 

I am about 30 minutes north of Albany, NY.

Lots of options and good info here, guys.  Keep it coming if you can.  It'll take me a bit of time to research all these tractors, but by looking at them and reading some specs I can get a better idea of how they might suit my needs.


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## mrfjsf (Dec 7, 2011)

The amount of tractor you are looking for and the quality of tractor you are looking for scream sub-compact. But your price range does not. Im in your shoes right now. I have 5.5 acres, 4.5 is grass. Ive been mowing my arse off with a 2000 Simplicity Landlord and it is completely run into the ground. Too much grass for not enough mower. Im also looking for a tractor that I can do something other than mow grass with. I used to work at a heavy equipment dealer.  Ive ran a TON of Kubota BX tractors. It is definately my tractor of choice for its versatility and quality. The problem is the price. New, you will spend $14000 + for a 2660 with a 60" MMM. No loader, no nothing. You may be able to find one used with a loader in the $7K-10K range that isnt stacked with hours. Ironpony may have the right advice for you. Buy a z-turn for the grass and a cheap old b7100 with a pile of hours on it for the dirty work. I might be doing the same.


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## bpirger (Dec 7, 2011)

I referred to the BX series when saying I think they are too pricey....and I still think they are.  If you plan to mow these many acres every week once, a zero turn is likely a good bet.  The used commercial ones can be had in your range...and from what I know, they last a long time.  They are much faster than a garden tractor.  Not sure how much hauling you can do with it though...


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## NH_Wood (Dec 7, 2011)

BK - I was just goofing on CL and found this - gives an idea for price range I guess. http://nh.craigslist.org/grd/2735349434.html - Cheers!


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## ironpony (Dec 7, 2011)

NH_Wood said:
			
		

> BK - I was just goofing on CL and found this - gives an idea for price range I guess. http://nh.craigslist.org/grd/2735349434.html - Cheers!




thats a deal right there


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## flyingcow (Dec 7, 2011)

All good ideas. I'd try to go for turf tires, if possible. A unit finish mower on 3 point is a way to go also. I've seen some bush hogs do a nice job even. especially if you want to do it every couple of weeks.

as mentioned  www.tractorbynet.com  is a good and very active bulletin board. Good people, just like here.                     

www.tractorhouse.com is a good site to see whats out there for tractors and prices.


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## nate379 (Dec 8, 2011)

I would spend 3-4k on a pro series ZTR mower and deal with a tractor later.

That is what my Dad is setup with, said he would NEVER waste time trying to mow with a tractor after getting the ZTR.

Decent new tractor to do what you want is going to run in the low 20K area with a deck and FEL.  Something like a JD series 1 or Kabota BX


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## SolarAndWood (Dec 8, 2011)

How far is Broadalbin?  JD 1010 with loader, 6' brush hog, chains $4500.

http://albany.craigslist.org/grd/2697163147.html


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## babzog (Dec 8, 2011)

This summer, I bought a used (5 yr old) JD L118 w/ 42" deck from my Husqvarna dealer.  He treated me right when I bought my saw (was actually able to get it in in less than a week) and helped me avoid buying a lemon tractor I spied on kijiji (told me how to read the S/N to determine the age.. turned out, it was 10 years older than the seller was listing it as).  Called him on the way home from that seller and asked him to call me when the JD was ready.  Picked it up the following weekend.  The JD has shaved an hour off my grass cutting time - used to take me 2.5hrs to mow probably 2 acres around the house.  With the hydrostatic drive and increased power over its tired old predecessor, I literally fly around now.  

My suggestion is to find a local dealer or repair shop you trust and ask there for good used equipment.  It'll be inspected and serviced before being sold and will carry the fellow's reputation with it.  Dealers get used equipment on trade all the time so it's only a matter of time before "your" tractor arrives and you get that phone call.

Good luck!


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## nate379 (Dec 8, 2011)

For 3-4 acres I would look at 60" deck width or something near that.  I mow about 2.5 acres total between 3 properties and it sucks with only a 46" deck on my tractor.  Have better things to do than burn up several hours sitting on a tractor drinking beer.... or... well.... hmmm... I think a smaller deck is better! hahaaahahaha


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## lukem (Dec 8, 2011)

I was in the exact same boat when I moved a couple years ago.  Tractors are really great at a lot of stuff...but mowing a yard isn't their string point....but as with anything, it all depends.

If you have wide open spaces, and well drained soil, then a tractor would be a good fit.  If you have a lot of obstacles to navigate, or a yard that is soft when wet, then a tractor with ag tires will be a nightmare for mowing.

I have 3 acres with a lot of stuff to mow around, and damp springs, so i bought a commercial grade ztr mower with low hours.  It will probably outlast me, and has been ultra reliable.  Most lawn crews put more hours on the machine in three weeks than i do in a year.  Probably overkill, but i'm ok with that.  It is a Bad Boy Pup 60" deck with a 31hp kawasaki engine.

It can pul 1000 lbs around the yard fine, and gets better than expected traction....but it weighs 1200 lbs...so weight is helping there.  I would recommend it for dragging stuff around in the woods though.

The best part is i can knock out the mowing in about and hour....and my goal was to keep mowing time to a minimum.

Good luck with your purchase.


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## MasterMech (Dec 8, 2011)

Batenkiller, nothing will touch a Zero-Turn for speed.  If you intend to finish mow that 3+ acres then a zero will get 'er done the quickest by far.  You will need a tractor of some sort for other duties like hauling wood and snow removal.  With regard to tractors Jack of all trades, master of none  certainly applies here.

Hydro vs. gear - In general there is less to go wrong in a hydro vs a gear trans.  Power transmission efficiency is superior with a gear trans but the convenience of a hydro makes it the choice for everything other than dedicated brute force pulling.  In utilty tractors, the hydro will usually not have a clutch which is often a big $$ maintenance item on older tractors.

Small farm/utility tractors do a lot things well.  Often much better than garden tractors or sub-compacts.  Mowing is not one of those things.  If you need the capability offered by the larger machines, then you're going to need a separate mowing machine.  Nobody wants to attach/detatch 3 pt finish mowers whenever you need the tractor for something else and having that big mower behind you makes it tough to maximize each pass and not skip grass.  Plus looking down and back all the time is a neck killer.

If you need or want this to be a one machine solution, look for a Deere 400 series super garden tractor.  They are built like sub-compacts and have great attachment capabilities.  425, 445, 455 are the models to be looking for, any of which are easily located for under 5K with attachments.  Any of the 3 will mow your 3 + acres without it seeming like purgatory and pull your 1000+ lbs with ease.

425 - Gas Kawasaki V-twin, carbureted
445 - Gas Kawasaki V-twin, EFI
455 - Diesel - Yanmar 3 cyl

All 3 have:

Hydro trans - Check
Liquid Cooled - Check
Differential Lock - Check
48, 54, or 60" Mowers - Check
46/47" Snowblowers - Check
54" Snow plows - Check
Power steering - Check
Hydraulic attachment lift/lower/angle - Check

Front end loaders are even available for these units although they are rare and pricey.  3 Pt Hitches (Limited Cat 1 I believe) and rear PTO were options too and are also pricey to add unless it's already there.

It's worth noting that these models use attachments that are still produced today so parts availability is not a concern.  Also the ease of switching attachments on these units is a great time saver.  The front quick hitch is a common component that's used with the snowblower, plow, and rotary broom so you only need one and then all the front attachments mount up with no problems.  Most often you can do it with your bare hands without tools.  Don't be afraid of machines with 1000+ hours on them either as these units typically go for many thousands of hours before they are worn out.

You can find countless youtube vids of these tractors in action with any of the attachments.


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## SolarAndWood (Dec 8, 2011)

If going the 2 machine route as opposed to a tractor that can also knock the lawn down, I would also look at the JD 9 or 11 series front mows from that era.  They are often the cheapest way to get into the 5 to 6 foot mower decks and are a pleasure to operate.  Might even leave you enough dough to get an older 2wd utility tractor with a loader.  

From what I've seen and I've been looking for a while, getting a single machine solution 4wd 5-6 ft hydro mower with a quick detach loader for under 5 grand will be a tall order for anything that isn't beat.  

If the loader isn't a requirement, a 4WD diesel hydro 3pt dual PTO 855 or 955 can be had for under 5 grand in good shape.  There are lots of used attachments for these available if you decide you want them later.


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## ISeeDeadBTUs (Dec 8, 2011)

I'd have to concur with the general consensus here . . . if MOWING is your chief concern the ZT is going to do WAY better than the tractor you will want later for everything else.

I don't 'mow lawn', but I have a flail out the backend of my 'bota. Though you COULD mow your lawn with it, you'd only do it once a year, cause the sod would be gone from 4wd and R1's :roll: 

Once you get mowing taken care of, you can get the right tractor. You won't want/need hydro on the tractor, and that will save you money.

When is the closing?


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## firefighterjake (Dec 8, 2011)

I've been thinking . . . there is another option here possibly . . . let part of the lawn go natural, plant some trees and wait . . .


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## Danno77 (Dec 8, 2011)

firefighterjake said:
			
		

> I've been thinking . . . there is another option here possibly . . . let part of the lawn go natural, plant some trees and wait . . .



The lot two houses up has some sort of unintentional prairie restoration thing going. it looks just like the intentional one at the local university. Just sayin....


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## lukem (Dec 8, 2011)

Danno77 said:
			
		

> firefighterjake said:
> 
> 
> 
> ...



 You could probably get a grant to not mow your yard....just call it a protected area.


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## LLigetfa (Dec 8, 2011)

flyingcow said:
			
		

> All good ideas. I'd try to go for turf tires, if possible.


I'd go with HDAPs as a minimum, possibly ags.  If you don't drive it like you stole it, you won't be tearing up the turf.

Turf saver tires don't really save the turf when you are spinning out on them.  A lot of Z-turns have HDAP tires.


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## Danno77 (Dec 8, 2011)

Anything I ever get will have ags put on it. Still haven't splurged for the new mower, but it's on the list of things to-do


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## oldspark (Dec 8, 2011)

My ford came with turf tires (back ones are huge) and I would liked to have had ag's but the tractor was used so I no options, so far they are fine and some claim with chains they are good in the snow. I have had it on the lawn a couple of times and no damage is nice, I have pulled down a couple of trees and the traction is not too bad.


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## Kenster (Dec 8, 2011)

My 1952 8N does everything I need it to do.  A five foot wide brush hog or finish mower is the perfect size as it is as wide as the rear tire treads.  I have a back blade that I use to maintain the driveway and, of course, it can be used for clearing snow, though we don't have much cause for that around here.   I have a boom pole that helps lift all sorts of heavy items and is very useful for bringing in logs from the woods.  (see my avatar.)  A dirt/pond scoop moves materials around, digs flower beds and moves rounds and splits to where ever you want to stack em.   I've never really felt the need for a front end loader but you can also attach one of those to an N tractor.  

For your needs, you won't care about "live" PTO.   And an N tractor doesn't need power steering.  It is easily steered without it, unless, perhaps, it does have a front end loader that is loaded down.  

It's a very simple machine.   I've never had any major problems with mine.  I'm not a mechanic but I can read a shop manual and have taken care of most issues myself.  Parts are easily obtainable right off the shelf at Tractor Supply and, of course, on line.  It's probably the cheapest operating, most bang for the buck, tractor you could buy.  The fact that there are still hundreds of thousands of them out there earning their living every day speaks volumes for the durability of these things.   If you're not so much into cosmetics you should easily be able to find a good running N tractor for $1800 to $2000.  I paid $3500 five years ago for a very nice looking one with a fresh overhaul and a bush hog.  I've added the other implements over the years.  

For $2500 a ZTR will just give you a fancy lawnmower but $2500 will buy you a really nice N tractor than can be used for many, many things.  
I would suggest an a late model 8N.  8Ns have four speed trannys instead of 3 speeds on the 9N/2N and the ones built between mid 50s through 52 have a side mounted distributor that is much easier to work on than the front mounts.    Also, be aware that you don't shift gears like a car.  You just select the gear for the job and keep it in that gear.  Second gear is just about perfect for mowing.  

In case you are not aware:  9Ns were first built in 1939 (hence the '9.')  2Ns were first built in 1942.  8Ns were first built in 1948 and ended their run in 1952.


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## oldspark (Dec 8, 2011)

For a mower wouldn't you want a live PTO?


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## Kenster (Dec 8, 2011)

oldspark said:
			
		

> For a mower wouldn't you want a live PTO?



Why?  I have PTO, that's what turns the blades.   Live PTO would only allow the blade to keep turning at full speed if I have the clutch in.  If I have the clutch in I'm probably stopped, so why would I need the blades to keep spinning.

However, I do have an ORC that allows the blades to keep free spinning if I do push the clutch in.


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## oldspark (Dec 8, 2011)

For me I want the mower blades running all the time, in case I am in some really tall stuff of a tight area where I might have to push the clutch in, my one tractor does not have live PTO and just cant see mowing with it but if it works for you  thats fine, I dont think I would tell some one they dont need it as it might come as a surprise how it works.


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## Kenster (Dec 8, 2011)

oldspark said:
			
		

> For me I want the mower blades running all the time, in case I am in some really tall stuff of a tight area where I might have to push the clutch in, my one tractor does not have live PTO and just cant see mowing with it but if it works for you  thats fine, I dont think I would tell some one they dont need it as it might come as a surprise how it works.



Oldspark, I see where you are coming from.  Yes, sometimes it's a little harder to get going if I come to a stop in thick grass.  If need be, I can raise the mower up a bit to get it to spinning, then lower it.   It's not perfect but I do not have the luxury of having multiple tractors.  I bought one that would suit MOST of my needs at a price I could afford.  One that could be easily and cheaply maintained.   I

Saying that you don't NEED live PTO to mow is true, as a few hundred thousand N tractor owners will attest to.  Your point that live PTO might make mowing a bit easier is also true.   I just wouldn't want someone to think that, because an N tractor does not have live PTO, he can't mow with it.  That would be FAR from the truth.  

Some guys have a different chainsaw for every day of the week and every diameter of branch they are cutting.  Some of us have to make due with the best saw we could afford and be content to live with any compromises that may require.  

Cheers!


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## oldspark (Dec 8, 2011)

I think we are on the same page, does your tractor have live hyd's, my old M does not have live power or PTO. Those 8N's are one heck of a tractor.


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## Kenster (Dec 8, 2011)

oldspark said:
			
		

> I think we are on the same page, does your tractor have live hyd's, my old M does not have live power or PTO. Those 8N's are one heck of a tractor.



I have to have the clutch out (or be in neutral) for both the PTO and the Hydraulics to operate.


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## Dairyman (Dec 8, 2011)

4+ acres is alot to mow once a week, a commercial zero turn if probably your best option if time is in play. Everyone has pointed out all the tractor options I can think of, maneuverability, speed, and vision will all be hindered. Hydro's are great on the newer compacts I'm personally leery of them before the late eighties. And I have found that I'd do more with my little kubota if it had live pto . The only other thing I'd want to mention is loaders on any tractor especially the compacts can make them very tipsy so if you go that route make sure to ballast well.


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## benjamin (Dec 8, 2011)

I use an Allis B with a 59" woods to mow about an acre only as often as I have to, and it works alright.  

I'd agree with all of the conflicting advice so far.  If you have obstacles to mow around or under, then a ZT would be much faster than any tractor.  If the lawn is sandy loamy soil then ag tires probably won't work.  I have heavy clay and I only mow when it's dry enough, so the ag tires never leave a mark, not that it would matter to me.  Live pto would be very nice in heavy grass, but so would a few more HP.  Another issue with an old farm tractor is stability if you have hills to mow.


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## Kenster (Dec 8, 2011)

I use a bush hog MAYBE four times a year to mow our seven acre meadow.  I only did it once this year due to our drought.  There is about two and a half acres around the house that I plowed up three years ago (also with the 8N and a two bottom plow - try doing that with your ZTR!) and planted in Bermuda.  Depending upon rainfall, I mow it at most once a month with a 60 inch wide finish mower.   Less often this year.  My wife maintains the lawn immediately around the house with her self propelled push mower.


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## Kenster (Dec 8, 2011)

benjamin said:
			
		

> I use an Allis B with a 59" woods to mow about an acre only as often as I have to, and it works alright.



*Is that a Woods belly mower? *



> If the lawn is sandy loamy soil then ag tires probably won't work.  I have heavy clay and I only mow when it's dry enough, so the ag tires never leave a mark, not that it would matter to me. .



That's another pretty generalized statement.  Ag tires work just fine on sandy soil.  We live on a sand hill.  The nearest clay is about three miles in any direction or about 80 feet straight down.   I have three rib ag tires on the front and big ag tires on the rear of my 8N.  I just need to take it easy on the turns and there is little, if any,  evidence of tire marks.  Those front tires can sure do a number on the turf if you do a sharp turn, though.  I may put auto tires on the front.  Can't really afford to go with turf tires all around.


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## Dill (Dec 8, 2011)

http://burlington.craigslist.org/grd/2742222285.html
Kubota B1750 4x4 Tractor W/Front Snow Blower, Mid Mower,Cab - $3400 (Derby)

Live PTO isn't a big deal with a brush hog. But try and run a haybine or a baler without it. I know its not an issue here.  Those old guys could slip those tractors in and out of neutral pretty slick.


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## flyingcow (Dec 8, 2011)

lukem said:
			
		

> Danno77 said:
> 
> 
> 
> ...



It would be re-establishing a natural habitat. Go for the Fed money.  :coolsmile:


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## gzecc (Dec 8, 2011)

Dill said:
			
		

> http://burlington.craigslist.org/grd/2742222285.html
> Kubota B1750 4x4 Tractor W/Front Snow Blower, Mid Mower,Cab - $3400 (Derby)
> 
> Live PTO isn't a big deal with a brush hog. But try and run a haybine or a baler without it. I know its not an issue here.  Those old guys could slip those tractors in and out of neutral pretty slick.


Looks like a good price, but also looks driven hard and put a way wet!


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## benjamin (Dec 9, 2011)

Kenster said:
			
		

> benjamin said:
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Yes that's a Woods belly mower, the B has plenty of power as long as the grass is cut to lawn length, but it is usually much longer and thicker so more power and/or live pto would really help.  Or a different tractor and a bush hog would be more appropriate sometimes.   

I should have said that ag tires won't leave tracks unless the ground is soft.


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## SolarAndWood (Dec 9, 2011)

gzecc said:
			
		

> Dill said:
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May be rough, but that is a whole lot of mowin, blowin and towin for $3400 with a cab on top of it.  If that thing was clean, he would easily get twice that around here for it.

Here is your 445 5' mower, blower, 3pt and cab for $4500.  http://syracuse.craigslist.org/grd/2742571597.html


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## NH_Wood (Dec 9, 2011)

This '47 is just plain pretty - would like to have it in my yard, but if I ever get a tractor, I want a loader. Cheers! http://nh.craigslist.org/grd/2658827473.html


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## Danno77 (Dec 9, 2011)

Man, that 2N is super nice. I'm a JD fanboy, though, so that cabbed 445 is just about the coolest option I've seen posted here!


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## wkpoor (Dec 9, 2011)

I had a 2N. And at the same time I've had a Farmall H and an Allis Chalmers CA. I got rid of that 2N. It was about the most worthless antique I ever owned. Bout the only thing they are good for is pulling a rear mount mower and they aren't all that great at that. The Farmall H was at least twice the tractor and the Allis CA is about 1/1/2 times.


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## Battenkiller (Dec 9, 2011)

SolarAndWood said:
			
		

> gzecc said:
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Now that's a sweet machine!   Pretty far away but I might call on that one.  Is that a good deal?  I have no idea what it would cost new.


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## MasterMech (Dec 9, 2011)

Battenkiller said:
			
		

> Now that's a sweet machine!   Pretty far away but I might call on that one.  Is that a good deal?  I have no idea what it would cost new.



Worth the drive and def. worth the $$.  3 pt is a sweet option on that.

To buy that new in an x700 series, thats about a $15K+ setup. 

Tractor is $10K, Cab is $2K+ (at least, heat, wipers, etc are more), Blower is $3k+

That doesn't include the 3pt or all the weights on there for ballast.  I see the cab is heated and has lights and wipers. Sweet!

In your situation Batten, I'd be all over that thing.  60" Mower will chew up that acreage nicely too!


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## SolarAndWood (Dec 9, 2011)

Battenkiller said:
			
		

> Now that's a sweet machine!   Pretty far away but I might call on that one.  Is that a good deal?  I have no idea what it would cost new.



Guys usually want $7-10K for a setup like that.  That is the bad a$$ blower.    However, my guess is he got something bigger as he is right in the middle of the Tug snow bands off Lake Ontario.  

If that is what you want and you want something in that condition, I would jump on it.  That setup fits easily in a Uhaul 6x12 open trailer.


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## ironpony (Dec 9, 2011)

Definately worth the money
with a little tlc it will run forever
don't wait to long
around here it would be gone already


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## Jack Straw (Dec 9, 2011)

I have a friend who buys and sells used tractors. He buys used tractors at auctions and fixes them up for resale. He claims that  when the small compact and subcompact tractors get around 2000 hours that for the most part they worn out. I think he said that you really can't rebuild those engines, you have to replace the block. Does this sound correct? IF you maintain the engine good will it last longer?


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## Danno77 (Dec 9, 2011)

Battenkiller said:
			
		

> SolarAndWood said:
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Sounds like a good deal, IMO, but I'd offer him 3800 and see what he says.


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## oldspark (Dec 9, 2011)

Danno77 said:
			
		

> Battenkiller said:
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 Pick of the litter.


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## Dill (Dec 9, 2011)

That 2N is way over priced. Even with the shiny new paint. It doesn't even have hydraulic remotes, so you won't be able to run a splitter or a loader without adding a pto or front mounted pump. That tractor would bring maybe 1500 at auction. I go to a lot of  ag auctions and the compacts don't bring as much at a real ag sale. Deals can be had if you know what your looking for.


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## MasterMech (Dec 9, 2011)

Jack Straw said:
			
		

> I have a friend who buys and sells used tractors. He buys used tractors at auctions and fixes them up for resale. He claims that  when the small compact and subcompact tractors get around 2000 hours that for the most part they worn out. I think he said that you really can't rebuild those engines, you have to replace the block. Does this sound correct? IF you maintain the engine good will it last longer?



I personally have seen many examples of the Deere 400 series machines go 5000+ hours.  Some of them weren't pretty but they all were strong runners.  I've seen them trashed after 8-900 hours too due to neglect.  The 445 in the pictures looks to be very well kept indeed.

Some of the small _diesel_ engines are indeed "sleeve-in-block" designs but that doesn't mean it can't be rebuilt.  So long as oversize pistons are available you could have the engine re-bored.  However it is often more economical to "short-block" (replace block, crank, rods, pistons) a worn engine than to re-machine the old one.  This is almost always the case with the gas engines like the ones used in 400 series machines.

Anything you give proper maintenance will last a lot longer than something neglected.

+1 on the 47 Snowblower being "bad ass"!  We used to use 'em to clean up the parking lot corners and reclaim parking spots after the plows got done piling the snow.  Would chew right thru 4-5' of plow-packed snow.  Only thing better was the 59" big-brother on a mid-frame compact. Hell yea!


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## MasterMech (Dec 9, 2011)

Here's hoping the silence means that Batten is strapping that machine to a trailer right now.....


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## oldspark (Dec 9, 2011)

Jack Straw said:
			
		

> I have a friend who buys and sells used tractors. He buys used tractors at auctions and fixes them up for resale. He claims that  when the small compact and subcompact tractors get around 2000 hours that for the most part they worn out. I think he said that you really can't rebuild those engines, you have to replace the block. Does this sound correct? IF you maintain the engine good will it last longer?


 Dont think that is true at all, not sure what his experiences have been for the most part those tractors will run way longer than that with the right care.


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## 2late (Dec 9, 2011)

I mow 4 acres of yard and another 4.5 acres of wooded horse lot with a JD 855 and a belly mount 6 foot deck. Also have a 5 foot JD bush hog for mowing in the woods and the 59 inch snow blower. I put about 300 hours a year on the 855 and it has never needed anything other than filters, oil changes and a battery. Tough to beat a JD for endurance and reliability. I do have turf tires and wheel weights and have had no traction problems. Quite a few around here have various flavors of Cubs that they swear by for mowing and utility. My 2 cents.


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## oldspark (Dec 10, 2011)

JD 855 is a Yanmar, just saying.


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## SolarAndWood (Dec 10, 2011)

After the experience I had with the 3 cyl 27hp Yanmar in my sailboat, I would not hesitate to rely on one.  My next tractor will be green and Yanmar powered.


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## oldspark (Dec 10, 2011)

SolarAndWood said:
			
		

> After the experience I had with the 3 cyl 27hp Yanmar in my sailboat, I would not hesitate to rely on one.  My next tractor will be green and Yanmar powered.


 That was my point, he thinks his JD is bullet proof but is a Yanmar, very tough and relible tractor.


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## SolarAndWood (Dec 10, 2011)

Gotcha and agreed.  I've been eyeing this one:  http://syracuse.craigslist.org/grd/2741659784.html


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## oldspark (Dec 10, 2011)

SolarAndWood said:
			
		

> Gotcha and agreed.  I've been eyeing this one:  http://syracuse.craigslist.org/grd/2741659784.html


 Nice and low hours, looks like a good deal, maybe even get the price down a little.


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## Danno77 (Dec 10, 2011)

Dad has a JD ZTR with a Yanmar in it. I blew out a driveshaft in it (didn't know they even had those until I did it). I've been begging him to give me the engine to drop in a Geo or something for a 100mpg vehicle like I saw on the Internet once. how cool would that be?


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## oldspark (Dec 10, 2011)

Danno that sounds like an interesting project.


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## SolarAndWood (Dec 10, 2011)

oldspark said:
			
		

> SolarAndWood said:
> 
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My primary motivation is replacing my lawn mower or I probably would buy it.  Figure that same tractor with green paint would be 2 or 3 grand more.


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## Danno77 (Dec 10, 2011)

oldspark said:
			
		

> Danno that sounds like an interesting project.


Probably will never happen. Been sitting in the shed for 5 years or so with the new-in-box shaft sitting on the hood. He's already replaced the mower with a bigger one. It sits in the shed right next to the dead VW diesel Suzuki Samurai that he also refuses to give up, even though he has two other Samurais! That's been dead for about 5 years, too, just needs the head put back on it...


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## Gasifier (Dec 10, 2011)

Batten,

How is that new place man? Are you in and settled? 

I drive a Simplicity Broadmoor. http://www.simplicitymfg.com/products/lawn-tractors/broadmoor/ More money, worth every penny. I would do it again in a heartbeat. Probably do everything you need to do for under your budget. Automatic traction control in rear end! Hydraulics for up front. etc.

My next one will be one of these though. http://www.simplicitymfg.com/products/yard-and-garden-tractors/legacy-xl/ Check out all the capabilities. 

Your federal credit union will finance at a good rate under recreational equipment. 4.5% or close to that. I would not suggest financing with the Yard Card, or whatever the financing is from the dealer. Do your own local financing. If you go with any new tractor and you finance.


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## Danno77 (Dec 10, 2011)

I don't doubt that your simplicity is a good little yard tractor, but with 20hp and the k57 hydro it isn't up to the beating of mowing 4 acres and towing stuff on a regular basis.

Can you do it? Heck yeah. I beat the snot out of my LX188 that has a K61 if I remember correctly and it seems to be holding up. 

There is just no way I'd drop that amount of cash on a new Simplicity. Now, those bigger garden tractors seem a little more capable, but their starting price scares me! I don't have much room to talk because I like JD, but you won't catch me buying a NeW JD anytime soon, either...


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## Danno77 (Dec 10, 2011)

Now, if you could find this used for 3k then you would be in business. That K92 hydro is bulletproof from what I hear.
http://rachmans.net/products/Simplicity-Legacy-XL-27HP-Diesel-Garden-Tractor,-4-Wheel-Drive.html

Winter cab, snow plow or blower, I bet they even make a FEL kit for it...

Edit: NICE http://www.simplicitymfg.com/Lawn-and-Garden-Videos/featured/legacy-xl-front-end-loader/


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## SolarAndWood (Dec 10, 2011)

Danno, how do you figure out which hydros are in the machines and compare them?  For instance how does an 855 compare with my F910?


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## Danno77 (Dec 10, 2011)

SolarAndWood said:
			
		

> Danno, how do you figure out which hydros are in the machines and compare them?  For instance how does an 855 compare with my F910?



Google or just go straight to tractordata.com

The 855 has the Sundstrand Series 17 hydrostatic, which I know nothing about. I'll google that in a second, the f910 has a Sundstrand in it, too but I need to look a little more to get the specific model on it.

Edit: I can't find much about your f910. My guess is that it has a similar transmission to the 300 series JDs from whenever yours was built. Probably a pretty good transmission, but I'm just not sure.


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## Battenkiller (Dec 10, 2011)

Gasifier said:
			
		

> Batten,
> 
> How is that new place man? Are you in and settled?



Oh, not even close.  USDA is killing us with one "we need more information on..." thing after another.  Each time it sets us back another week.  The credit union told us they haven't done a USDA backed loan yet (seems pretty hard to believe), but we just assumed they'd get all their ducks in a row so we could do the same. 

For example, during the inspection period (many weeks ago) we paid for all of the recommended inspections.  Septic and water quality were high on our priority list, so we had the septic pumped and inspected and the water quality tested.  Results were submitted to the bank and we felt we were good to go.  Well, about two weeks later we find out that USDA wants to know the distance between the well head and the septic system.  Now, if we knew that when the thing was serviced, we could have paid to have the leach field scoped.  After the fact, they would have to come back out and dig the thing up again at our expense... $275.  That would almost double the cost to us. 

So, we had the realtor call the town office and get the original engineered plan.  Turns out the only woman who could provide us with this info was out on vacation.  When she came back we got the plan and submitted it and we thought we were good to go. 


Oh, no.  Now they needed three more bits of info.  We needed a certificate of potability of water (yes, we submitted this before but USDA wanted it from the testing lab itself).  They also wanted other financial info, like a signed and notarized statement of earnings.  

Yup, two years of tax returns and bank statements weren't enough, they need us to swear on papar that we have no other income. This ran us into the weekend, so we lost another week. 

This morning, we get an e-mail that USDA needs proof of rental at our current place, and proof of repayment on my wife's student loans.   That's right, two years of rent receipts weren't enough, they had to hear it directly from the landlord.  So they means the application won't get submitted until at least Monday. 

I'm getting the sneaking feeling that USDA is stalling on this whole thing until after the first of the year for budget reasons and to prevent us from claiming deduction on this year's tax return.  Problem is, we were supposed to be out of here by Nov. 30.  The landlord here is breathing down our necks and we may be forced to move all our stuff - about two 26' trucks worth - into storage for a lousy couple weeks and the move it all into the new house after we close.  Plus, spend the holidays in a motel room. 

We were initially very excited to have the kids and grandkids in our new home for Christmas.  My wife is pretty distraught.  We haven't bought a single gift for the grandkids yet because we don't even know where to put the stuff.  Plus, it is not too likely that we will get the help we were counting on if we have to move around the holidays.  Can't expect folks to drop their holiday plans to come help lil' ol' us.  

So, anyway, keep it coming guys, I am reading it all.  But I ain't pulling the trigger on anything until I have my fat fist wrapped tight around those keys.


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## oldspark (Dec 10, 2011)

That's a bummer but I am sure it will work out BK, if you lived closer I could help over the holidays, tell the wife to hang in there, next christmas you will be laughing about it (or not).


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## Flatbedford (Dec 10, 2011)

Sorry about all the hassles. I hope things work out. I'll watching. My '68 IH Cub Cadet 125 is serious overkill for my 1/4 acre, but would probably com up short for you. I'll just live vicariously through you as you move to your acreage and shop for a bigger, faster, better tractor.


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## Battenkiller (Dec 10, 2011)

Flatbedford said:
			
		

> Sorry about all the hassles. I hope things work out. I'll watching. My '68 IH Cub Cadet 125 is serious overkill for my 1/4 acre, but would probably com up short for you. I'll just live vicariously through you as you move to your acreage and shop for a bigger, faster, better tractor.



I used to have an old Wheel Horse on loan from my FIL when we moved here over 20 years ago.  One day I went to the shed and it was gone.  Turns out the old geezer needed it to trade in on a new Cub Cadet he was buying.  Pissed me right the ef off, taking it back without telling me.  He got a whopping $150 in trade for it.  I would have paid double just to keep it.  It did the job OK here, but I only mow about an acre here.  Since then it's been a two-hour run behind the self-propelled Honda... twice a week in the spring.  Man, that quack grass grows fast in the early season.  :sick:


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## Gasifier (Dec 10, 2011)

Batten,

One of my big things with anything I buy now is service. I want the back up of a place that will service anything I buy with people who are knowledgeable and can fix anything I bring to them. That is just one reason I went with a Simplicity. A local business around here has three places and is getting ready to add another right in my area. (The store they have and I have been buying things from over the last five years is 20 miles away.) Before I bought a new, larger lawn mower/tractor from a big box store with no service, I would buy a tractor from a local company that can service it for you if you have any problems. We have a place called The Wood Chop Shop. They sell several manufacturers lawn mowers, tractors, chain saws, wood splitters, weed eaters, UTVs, Zero Turn movers, generators, etc. etc. etc. and they service all of it. A full mechanical shop to do all the work. Very cool place. Something for you to think about as well. All I have had done to my mower is oil change and sharpen the blades. 

As far as the Simplicity doing the job. The size and model all depends on how much of that property you decide to mow. Do you need to mow all of it? If you do I would suggest the larger Simplicity. You can get three size decks with them, I think they are 46,54, and 60" if I remember right. From what I have seen, if you want to stay under five thousand dollars, I would buy a used Simplicity Legacy that is a couple of years old before I would buy a larger brand new model of some of the other brands. You could find a two wheel drive one of those if you don't need four wheel drive. Just look at the manufacturing/construction of them. Solid cast iron axles, hydraulic driven drivetrain, automatic traction control in the rear, and so on. Very nice. They have one pedal for going forward, and one pedal for going in reverse. The more/less you press the pedal the faster/slower they go. So easy to control them precisely. And if you have a lot of straight mowing you can just lock it in the speed you want and mow away. It will last you a very long time if you simply take care of it with regular preventative maintenance.

Anyway, check them out, do your own research of course, as I am sure you will. Just wanted to share what I have learned with you. The Simplicitys are a great machine. The quality is outstanding compared to some of the others. Most of them are made elsewhere now.


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## Flatbedford (Dec 10, 2011)

Gasifier, Is this what you are talking about?
http://newyork.craigslist.org/lgi/grd/2705539177.html


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## Danno77 (Dec 10, 2011)

Is that the exact same as this or is it just me?
http://www.simpletractors.com/deutz/1920_&_1918.htm

And the transmission is a Sundstrand 15, where as the 855 posted earlier is the Sundstrand 17. What's that mean? I dunno, but 17 is a bigger number than 15, so it's got to be better, right? LoL.


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## LLigetfa (Dec 10, 2011)

The simple city mowers are highly sought after for their striping but those that are into lawns in a big way.

If speed is paramount, how about towing an offset mower to double the coverage?


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## Gasifier (Dec 10, 2011)

Gasifier, Is this what you are talking about?

:lol: No, that is a really older one. How about something like this. 

http://www.ebay.com/itm/2007-SIMPLI...732?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item415ac35804

The used ones are hard to come buy because when people buy them they don't sell them very often and they last a long time!  :lol: 

You can find them though. Tractorhouse, fastline, etc. Or at a Simplicity dealership that just took one in on trade! Helllloooooo.  :lol: 

I am often a smart ass in some of my responses. Just in fun of course. What comes around goes around I guess.  :lol:


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## Battenkiller (Dec 10, 2011)

OK... what would work at the lower end?  Just for mowing.  The current owners have been using a JD  LA145.  It looks to be in good shape.  I thought of asking what they want for it, but since they want to sell me three ton of pellets at retail price, I don't think there's any bargains to be had from them.  Is this a total POS or can something like this ($2K new) work for mowing.  That would allow me to shop around for a nice old farm tractor with a loader when one comes along cheap.  After reading all the pros and cons, I really think the best thing for me may be two machines.


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## Danno77 (Dec 10, 2011)

Battenkiller said:
			
		

> OK... what would work at the lower end?  Just for mowing.  The current owners have been using a JD  LA145.  It looks to be in good shape.  I thought of asking what they want for it, but since they want to sell me three ton of pellets at retail price, I don't think there's any bargains to be had from them.  Is this a total POS or can something like this ($2K new) work for mowing.  That would allow me to shop around for a nice old farm tractor with a loader when one comes along cheap.  After reading all the pros and cons, I really think the best thing for me may be two machines.


I like them for a nice smooth lawnmower, but ony for mowing and don't beat the hydro on it. I think I'd rather spend my money on a 5 year old upper end craftsman than a new lower end JD, but those LA series mowers sure do look pretty sitting at Lowes. Just not sure I'm sold on the idea.
Anybody know what a used Craftsman GT5000/6000 goes for?


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## Flatbedford (Dec 10, 2011)

For what you'd probably pay for his JD lawn mower you could pick up a pre '81 IH Cub Cadet garden tractor. You'll get a bullet proof hydro drivetrain and Kohler engine. The later ones even have hydraulic lift,  3 point hitches and can run a front end loader.


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## SolarAndWood (Dec 11, 2011)

or a diesel Ford with a bunch of attachments

http://albany.craigslist.org/grd/2745829907.html


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## Battenkiller (Dec 11, 2011)

SolarAndWood said:
			
		

> or a diesel Ford with a bunch of attachments
> 
> http://albany.craigslist.org/grd/2745829907.html



Hell, that looks nice!  And I could could practically drive it to the new place from Charlton (still truckless).


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## oldspark (Dec 11, 2011)

Battenkiller said:
			
		

> SolarAndWood said:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 Not sure about that model but some of those fords were considered bullet proof and most any thing you read about them is positive. 895 hours and all those attachments I think that is one hell of a deal.


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## Flatbedford (Dec 11, 2011)

If that Ford is in good shape it would be great! You could probably get a FEL for it too down the road. Sounds like a pretty complete setup.


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## gzecc (Dec 11, 2011)

Flatbedford said:
			
		

> Gasifier, Is this what you are talking about?
> http://newyork.craigslist.org/lgi/grd/2705539177.html


Flatbed, thats a great machine but overpriced with that many hours.


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## Gasifier (Dec 11, 2011)

OKâ€¦ what would work at the lower end?  Just for mowing.  The current owners have been using a JD LA145.  It looks to be in good shape.  I thought of asking what they want for it, but since they want to sell me three ton of pellets at retail price, I donâ€™t think thereâ€™s any bargains to be had from them.  Is this a total POS or can something like this ($2K new) work for mowing.  That would allow me to shop around for a nice old farm tractor with a loader when one comes along cheap.  After reading all the pros and cons, I really think the best thing for me may be two machines. 

If you are going with a John Deere you may want to look at one of these. Would be fast, but I don't know about the quality of the cut. ?


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## Battenkiller (Dec 11, 2011)

Gasifier said:
			
		

> OKâ€¦ what would work at the lower end?  Just for mowing.  The current owners have been using a JD LA145.  It looks to be in good shape.  I thought of asking what they want for it, but since they want to sell me three ton of pellets at retail price, I donâ€™t think thereâ€™s any bargains to be had from them.  Is this a total POS or can something like this ($2K new) work for mowing.  That would allow me to shop around for a nice old farm tractor with a loader when one comes along cheap.  After reading all the pros and cons, I really think the best thing for me may be two machines.
> 
> If you are going with a John Deere you may want to look at one of these. Would be fast, but I don't know about the quality of the cut. ?



Damn!  I gotta have it!

Wonder if I can make it to Sturgis with the old lady on the queen seat.


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