# Kerosene as replacement for gel fire starter--



## sandpipe (Oct 13, 2013)

My friend doesn't like spending $9 for a bottle of fire starter (and neither do I) and he has used scented lamp oil for a couple of years now. I didn't have this product on-hand but I do have 10 gallons of kerosene that I use for a garage heater in the winter. 

Since keorsene is also defined as...
ker·o·sene also *ker·o·sine* 
_n._
A thin oil distilled from petroleum or shale oil, used as a fuel for heating and cooking, in lamps, and as a denaturant for alcohol. Also called _ coal oil_, _ lamp oil_.

...I figured I'd experiment with it. I put about an ounce of kerosene in an old 1lb coffee can and addded pellets one small handful at a time and mixed them around in the liquid until the can was about 7/8 full. I let the concoction sit overnight. Happily the pellets didn't melt apart into a muddy mush but retained their shape and solidity.

Outside the house I put about 20 pellets on the ground and covered them with some dry twigs and stuck a wood match into the pellets. The tiny pile burned slowly and steadily for a good 10 minutes. About 85% was ash but there was still about 15% left of smoldering unburned pellets in one part of the pile. (The pile was on dirt and somewhat spread out over about a 6" circle so there was certainly a lack of excellent air circulation as found in a pellet stove burn pot). 

My experiment outside was a test before trying this in my Harman Invincible insert to make sure there was no explosion or weird behavior that I would live to regret. Since nothing dramatic occurred I plan to try the kerosene in the stove next time I make a fire. How everything reacts with the increased oxygen of the combustion blower will be interesting and hopefully noneventful.

I'm not breaking any new ground here since my friend has been using lamp oil for a couple of years but since I didn't come up with any hits on the Pellet Mill when I searched for kerosene I figured I'd toss this idea into the mix to see if anyone has done the above or if there are any reasons why it should not be done.


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## RKBAGUY (Oct 13, 2013)

Sounds dangerous, potentially messy and definitely smelly to me. Why not just buy a propane torch to light a handful of pellets right in the burn pot?


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## P38X2 (Oct 13, 2013)

I have no comment on using kerosene except it sounds a bit sketchy. You can buy a GIANT bottle of hand sanitizer for $5. It works just as well as gel and isn't gonna stink up the house. Even better, get yourself a propane torch and use that.


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## MCPO (Oct 13, 2013)

Kerosene is safer than gel or any other accelerant that I've ever used used to light wood pellets due to it`s low flash point . It`s also safer to store.
Even the vapors have a much lower flash point than gel or alcohol. I`ve been using it in my pdvc out in the rear shop for years .  Kerosene really has to be atomized to be prone to flash ignition. .  The only issue I have with it is the odor. It lingers on for a while but in the shop it`s no problem. An equally good alternative is odorless charcoal lighter fluid. It works like a charm but not as cheap as kerosene.

It doesn`t work as well in my Harman P-38 though . The manual P-38 stoves aren`t always the easiest to light anyway so I use a mixture of 91% isopropyl alcohol and 62% hand washing gel . The gel itself is too thick and the isopropyl too thin. Mixing creates the  perfect blend and consistency .(at least for starting my stove)
Other folks use what suits them best and that`s understandable too.

The manufacturers warnings insisting only an approved fire starter , usually ("EXPENSIVE" gel) be used is intentionally exaggerated and meant to err on the side of the safest possible way due to the constant threat of legal litigation from idiots who would throw a live accelerant on  hot coals.
Unfortunately common sense isn`t always used or is understood so those ignorant users have to be protected by someone and often at the expense of others. 
Of course manufacturers have an obligation to protect the end user too so I can`t fault them. My whole point is do your research , experiment safely, and used what works best for you without endangering yourself ,others, or your equipment.


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## nailed_nailer (Oct 13, 2013)

When I used my manual lighted Enviro EF-2 I used a propane torch.

When the torch is coupled with a push button starter it is easy and quick.

I use this one and have had great success for years
http://www.bernzomatic.com/item.html?id=19

Can be had for about $30.00 and a bottle of propane lasts for years.

Found it much easier than the gel.

---Nailer---


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## Bioburner (Oct 13, 2013)

Unfortunately idiots and fools abound. What may well be safe to a learned or trained person can be a total nightmare for others. I still do pyrotechnic and special effects and you can't believe the things I can make burn. The simple and safe use of a propane torch is probably the best as flame is instant and not affected by a hot pot etc. Vapors of almost all liquid fuels will ignite with explosive force! October is fire prevention month. Think safe, not cheap when it comes to a fire in your home.


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## m159267 (Oct 13, 2013)

RKBAGUY said:


> Sounds dangerous, potentially messy and definitely smelly to me. Why not just buy a propane torch to light a handful of pellets right in the burn pot?


+1


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## fmsm (Oct 13, 2013)

Torch with map gas. Works great in my old Whitfield.


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## midfielder (Oct 13, 2013)

What's wrong with Germ-X?


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## Bioburner (Oct 13, 2013)

midfielder said:


> What's wrong with Germ-X?


Add it to a hot stove and will get some bad results. Alcohol base Napalm. If you your aware and never get it near a hot stove there is no problem. Think I am just a negative ninny? Google hand sanitizer fire.


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## MCPO (Oct 13, 2013)

midfielder said:


> What's wrong with Germ-X?


 Nothing is wrong with it.
It`s not any more dangerous than any gel made specifically for igniting pellets. Maybe even less since there`s probably less alcohol in it.


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## MCPO (Oct 13, 2013)

Propane torches may work fine in some stoves but it doesn`t work good in my P-38 and you have to leave the door open while lighting so the stink permeates the air.
 I`ve also got a smoke detector close by and don`t wish to activate it.
 As I said before , whatever works best for the user. There are many different choices that work as well or better than the maker`s recommendation .
We all don`t have the same stove or situation so we do whatever it takes .
The one common denominator is stove gel is usually significantly higher priced and that motivates folks to use something less costly. .


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## Shaw520 (Oct 13, 2013)




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## P38X2 (Oct 13, 2013)

MCPO, if you're lighting with a torch, don't look for the pellets to stay aflame. I FINALLY figured this out a couple weeks ago. Stick the torch end in the pile and give it 20 or so seconds. Enough to get a ball of pellets glowing. Shut the door. 2 min later POOF, off and running. No different than ignition by an auto igniter. Works the same on both my 38's.


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## MarkinNC (Oct 13, 2013)

I have noted people to use some small splits soaked in kerosene while viewing youtube videos.  If one uses common sense, I think you will be alright.  Start small.  I go through maybe $20 of fire starters per year and I start a lot of fires owing to the fact we do not always burn 24-7 like more northerly located folks.  I can live with that and there is no mess etc.


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## MCPO (Oct 13, 2013)

P38X2 said:


> MCPO, if you're lighting with a torch, don't look for the pellets to stay aflame. I FINALLY figured this out a couple weeks ago. Stick the torch end in the pile and give it 20 or so seconds. Enough to get a ball of pellets glowing. Shut the door. 2 min later POOF, off and running. No different than ignition by an auto igniter. Works the same on both my 38's.


 I`ll try that sometime.


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## DneprDave (Oct 13, 2013)

I make my own fire starters by filling paper egg cartons with sawdust and pouring melted paraffin wax on the sawdust. After the wax hardens, I cut up the egg carton into individual cups. They light easily and stay burning for a while. I set one in the burn pot where the pellets land right on top of it and light it. 

I also use them to start the wood stove.

Dave


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## rayttt (Oct 13, 2013)

P38X2 said:


> MCPO, if you're lighting with a torch, don't look for the pellets to stay aflame. I FINALLY figured this out a couple weeks ago. Stick the torch end in the pile and give it 20 or so seconds. Enough to get a ball of pellets glowing. Shut the door. 2 min later POOF, off and running. No different than ignition by an auto igniter. Works the same on both my 38's.



Thanks for the Info..I bought a torch just for that and never had it work..Ill try that tonight when I light it


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## P38X2 (Oct 13, 2013)

Just make sure you get the torch head in there a bit...maybe 3/4" into your pellet pile. Give it a good 20 second shot with the torch, or til you get maybe 8-10 pellets glowing real good, then shut the door. It get real smokey and then catch. Option B is give it 45 seconds of the torch, or enough to actually get flames out of the pellets. Leave the door open a crack for 30 seconds then shut it. I like the first method. Less propane  Sooooo much easier than marinating pellets in, kero, gel, sanitizer, thermite, sweet baby ray's, italian dressing, etc.


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## hoverfly (Oct 13, 2013)

I have used, veg oil, canola oil, corn oil, lamp oil with citronella, k-1, WD-40, charcoal lighter fluid, motor oil, and home heating oil. Just put the pellets in a can or leak proof bag. Add just enough to coat the pellets and let it sit for a few minutes before dumping into the pot.  Light the pellets and close the door, give it a bit before turning the stove on.


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## krooser (Oct 13, 2013)

MCPO said:


> Kerosene is safer than gel or any other accelerant that I've ever used used to light wood pellets due to it`s low flash point . It`s also safer to store.
> Even the vapors have a much lower flash point than gel or alcohol. I`ve been using it in my pdvc out in the rear shop for years .  Kerosene really has to be atomized to be prone to flash ignition. .  The only issue I have with it is the odor. It lingers on for a while but in the shop it`s no problem. An equally good alternative is odorless charcoal lighter fluid. It works like a charm but not as cheap as kerosene.
> 
> It doesn`t work as well in my Harman P-38 though . The manual P-38 stoves aren`t always the easiest to light anyway so I use a mixture of 91% isopropyl alcohol and 62% hand washing gel . The gel itself is too thick and the isopropyl too thin. Mixing creates the  perfect blend and consistency .(at least for starting my stove)
> ...



The *flash point* of a volatile material is the lowest temperature at which it can vaporize to form an ignitable mixture in air.

A lower flash point means the fluid is more likely to burn not less...


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## fmsm (Oct 13, 2013)

MCPO said:


> Propane torches may work fine in some stoves but it doesn`t work good in my P-38 and you have to leave the door open while lighting so the stink permeates the air.
> I`ve also got a smoke detector close by and don`t wish to activate it.
> As I said before , whatever works best for the user. There are many different choices that work as well or better than the maker`s recommendation .
> We all don`t have the same stove or situation so we do whatever it takes .
> The one common denominator is stove gel is usually significantly higher priced and that motivates folks to use something less costly. .


I start my stove so that the smoke is sucked out while the fire is starting. Same as I "run" the stove while cleaning to contain fly ash.


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## MCPO (Oct 13, 2013)

krooser said:


> The *flash point* of a volatile material is the lowest temperature at which it can vaporize to form an ignitable mixture in air.
> 
> A lower flash point means the fluid is more likely to burn not less...


 Thanks krooser for correcting me on that.. You are right. I should have said higher flash point.


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## glenc0322 (Oct 13, 2013)

I like auto ignition but have a pellet stove in my upstate cabin and either use a torch or hand sanitizer.  Never tried kerosene or Doritos for that matter I heard they burn really well


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## sandpipe (Oct 14, 2013)

Thanks, all, for all the input. I never tried to light the pellets with a propane torch since I figured I'd have to squat down for 45 seconds and hold it in place. I thought of balancing the lit torch on the edge of the burn pot while I go get a cup of coffee from the kitchen but then I figured, nah.

I've used gel for the 3 years I've been burning pellets and was getting tired of buying something that I might be able to safely replace from supplies around the house.

I don't see the danger in the kero approach as the pellets are soaked so they are isolated from fire and yet ready to go. If there is a good draft in the stove the smell should be minimal.

I like this potential formula and will try it if I run into negatives with the kerosene approach:


MCPO said:


> I use a mixture of 91% isopropyl alcohol and 62% hand washing gel . The gel itself is too thick and the isopropyl too thin. Mixing creates the perfect blend and consistency .(at least for starting my stove)



It's been too balmy here in Northern Mass. these last few days to need to fire up the stove so I haven't tried the kero mix yet. I should be doing so in the next day or two and will report back with the results.


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## steamguy (Oct 21, 2013)

I used to have an Austroflamm Integra, and it had no self-igniter. It wasn't long before I got fed up with the exorbitant price for the starter and tried all the methods named above.

Kerosene is quick, but can flash out at you. Needless to say I took that as a sign from God and didn't try gasoline!!
Same with barbecue starter. Keep in mind both of these methods generate greasy soot which is not so good for the insides of pellet stoves.
Gel hand sanitizer wasn't available then, so I tried rubbing alcohol. Not enough heat for long enough to get a fire going. The combustion draft would dry it out and snuff it before it would take off.
Tried breaking up fire-starter cubes, those worked pretty good, but were a PITA to handle, plus I always had to make sure I cut up enough that my wife could start a fire. Plus they really gum up a pair of garden shears.
The local feed store sells something that looks like fir shavings; those work good but are just as expensive as the alcohol napalm.

Then I discovered how well the torch works. Takes 30 seconds of bending over with the torch, ease the door shut, and in 2 minutes you have a blasting fire. AND it works every time.

Hope that helps.


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## IHATEPROPANE (Oct 21, 2013)

I used the propane torch method .....turn stove on so fumes get sucked out....30 Mississippi's and good to go.   Seems like 30 seconds with a torch is less time than getting kerosene, soaking the pellets, pouring them in the burn pot, then lighting.  And probably safer and cheaper


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## sandpipe (Oct 21, 2013)

Just an update on my kerosene experiments-- It was finally cold enough to get a fire started so I put about 20 kerosene soaked pellets on top of the cup of pellets in the burn pot and easily lit it, closed the door, waited about 20 seconds and then started up the Invincible. The fire seemed to build up better than when I use gel. A second time I made a fire with the kerosene pellets but I mixed the pellets in with the dry pellets in the pot. This did not work well at all.

I will definitely give the torch technique a try at some point soon. Everyone seems to swear by its ease. 

All in all I am happy with kerosene as a starter so far. I have about 5 gallons I use in a garage heater so it's virtually free compared to $8 for a bottle of gel.


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## Pellet-King (Oct 22, 2013)

tried hand sanitizer few times, wouldnt light


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## rayttt (Oct 22, 2013)

Pellet-King said:


> tried hand sanitizer few times, wouldnt light


You have to find one that has at least 63% alcohol.
GermX works.
Not sure what other brands work.

I have a small bottle of another brand I tried and it works also..Dont have that one in front of me to see the brand.


I have the torch and it works well...it just takes too long for my lazy ass.
I put 5 squirts of GermX into my stove and light it an close the door/start stove in about 6 or 7 seconds..
Much quicker than the torch.


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## P61 PelletPig (Oct 22, 2013)

Torch. Tried and true.


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## briansol (Oct 22, 2013)

Make friends with a local restaurant that does a lot of buffets.  they probably throw away sterno's that are under 50% full or so....   you can get a spoon and make your own bucket of fire starter.


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## jlupi (Oct 22, 2013)

_yes you can use it.  _big thread for such a mundane topic


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## briansol (Oct 22, 2013)

manuals say you shouldn't.  at least mine does.


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