# Chainsaw Chains....Need Some Advice!



## BurnIt13 (Mar 30, 2011)

My chainsaw chain has had it and I'm sick of buying the cheapies from the big box stores.  I'm going to buy a nice one from Baileys.  When I went on their website I was taken back by the options chainsaw blades seem to have.  For example, there is you standard "anti-kickback" which I'm probably used to and then thier is the _"Death will result unless you're a professional with 75 years of experience"_ chains.

Are the _non_ anti-kickback chains really that dangerous?  I like to think of myself as a safe person who pays attention and uses the appropriate safety gear....but the ability to cut though a log like a hot knife through butter does seem nice.  

Is any one particular brand better than most?   As a homeowner I've spent the last 5 years maintaining my small property cutting up downed trees and what not.  Now that I've got a wood stove I plan to cut on much more regular basis.  

Thanks!


----------



## Adios Pantalones (Mar 30, 2011)

The non-anti kickback chains really do perform a lot better.  They are not super dangerous- take normal precautions.  If you've burned through safety chains then you probably have enough experience.  

Stihl chains are the bomb.


----------



## Monkey Wrench (Mar 30, 2011)

Heres A Good Start


http://www.stihlusa.com/chain-guide-bar/saw-chain.html


----------



## Thistle (Mar 30, 2011)

When I started using a saw almost 30 yrs ago there was no 'safety' chains.Sure,they can seem aggressive if you've never used one,but they're perfectly fine after some experience.Just watch what your doing & take a break when you're tired.(Always a good idea regardless) I wouldnt use any of those newer safety chains on a regular basis,I do have an older worn out one hanging on wall of shed incase I get some yardbird or near a fenceline though.


----------



## smokinj (Mar 30, 2011)

Woodland pro is a good chain for the money. Semi chisel a great choice when cutting already downed dirty wood.


----------



## lukem (Mar 30, 2011)

If you have some experience and treat the saw with the right amount of respect you'll be fine.  

I would warn you against thinking a good full chisel chain will blow your mind...because it may not depending on your saw (not enough oomph to pull a full chisel).


----------



## zzr7ky (Mar 30, 2011)

If you've worn out a few 'ordinary' chains it is time to get a good performing chain.  

I noticed only better performance, and the ability to bore cut when needed (rare for me).


----------



## TreePointer (Mar 30, 2011)

What saw model?  How long is the bar?


----------



## BurnIt13 (Mar 30, 2011)

TreePointer said:
			
		

> What saw model?  How long is the bar?



I was afraid of this question.  The saw is a  :red: Ryobi :sick: .  It has a 16" bar and I'm sure is way low on power.  I bought the Ryobi 5 years ago when all I thought I'd have to do is cut up the occasional fallen tree or branch.   Now that I have a wood stove that story has changed.  The Ryobi has gotten me through about 5-7 cords on my property just fine although most of my trees are less then a foot in diameter.  I'll be upgrading to a Husky 445 this summer, for now it will have to do.   The Ryobi will handle branch and junk duty once the Husky comes around.

Regardless, the Ryobi needs a new blade now.  Unless someone can convince me otherwise I'll probably go with a semi-chisel _without_ the anti-kickback.


----------



## TreePointer (Mar 30, 2011)

BurnIt13 said:
			
		

> I was afraid of this question.  The saw is a  :red: Ryobi :sick: .  It has a 16" bar and I'm sure is way low on power.  I bought the Ryobi 5 years ago when all I thought I'd have to do is cut up the occasional fallen tree or branch.   Now that I have a wood stove that story has changed.  The Ryobi has gotten me through about 5-7 cords on my property just fine although most of my trees are less then a foot in diameter.  I'll be upgrading to a Husky 445 this summer, for now it will have to do.   The Ryobi will handle branch and junk duty once the Husky comes around.
> 
> Regardless, the Ryobi needs a new blade now.  Unless someone can convince me otherwise I'll probably go with a semi-chisel _without_ the anti-kickback.



All saws have a place, and there's nothing wrong with owning a saw that does the job for you.  In fact, some of those little Ryobi's are gems.  The reason I asked for more info is to give you a specific chain recommendation.

In .325" pitch, I like Stihl RSC (full chisel, regular chain) and RMC (semi-chisel, regular chain).  Stihl RMC3 (semi-chisel safety chain) is disappointing.  Oregon LPX is also a pretty good .325" pitch chain.

Or maybe your saw takes a 3/8 Low Profile chain instead of .325" pitch?


----------



## BurnIt13 (Mar 30, 2011)

TreePointer said:
			
		

> In .325" pitch, I like Stihl RSC (full chisel, regular chain) and RMC (semi-chisel, regular chain).  Stihl RMC3 (semi-chisel safety chain) is disappointing.  Oregon LPX is also a pretty good .325" pitch chain.
> 
> Or maybe your saw takes a 3/8 Low Profile chain instead of .325" pitch?



Don't remember....I'll check when I get home and report.


----------



## smokinj (Mar 30, 2011)

BurnIt13 said:
			
		

> TreePointer said:
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Probally 1/4
http://www.baileysonline.com/itemdetail.asp?item=WP14+10SC&catID=11796 You buy it by the # of drive lenks you need. Will not swear to it but would bet on it lol


----------



## BurnIt13 (Mar 30, 2011)

smokinjay said:
			
		

> BurnIt13 said:
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Okay, according to the manual my Ryobi RY10532 uses 3/8 pitch, .05 chain gauge, 62 drive links, with low-profile full skip tooth.  Its an 18" not a 16" as I said before.  And just for the record it has a 40cc engine.

Question...what exactly is a low-profile chain?  Do I absolutely have to use a low profile?  I was thinking about replacing my bar.  Will any 18" bar do or it manufacturer specific?   It looks like I've got an oddball chain too with 62 links, do I have any options here?


----------



## smokinj (Mar 30, 2011)

BurnIt13 said:
			
		

> smokinjay said:
> 
> 
> 
> ...




Yes low pro only!  if its low pro the sprocket is just a little different.(not much but enough to tear thing up) t I would go with semi-chisel if your working down trees and full if its standing trees.


----------



## TreePointer (Mar 30, 2011)

BurnIt13 said:
			
		

> Okay, according to the manual my Ryobi RY10532 uses 3/8 pitch, .05 chain gauge, 62 drive links, with low-profile full skip tooth.  Its an 18" not a 16" as I said before.  And just for the record it has a 40cc engine.
> 
> Question...what exactly is a low-profile chain?



That's one of the Ryobi gems!  It has the newer more eco-friendly "strato" design that adds a little more weight, but also gives it a little more grunt.  The stock setup on that is indeed 3/8 Low Profile chain.  There are many detailed discussions of that saw on ArboristSite.com.  Some folks put a 16" and even a 14" bar on that model.

There is 3/8 pitch chain, which is common on 60cc saws or larger, and there is 3/8 Low Profile chain.  The Low Profile chain is similar in the number of cutters per length, but the tooth is not as tall or wide, so it takes a smaller bite.  The smaller bite is important for lower powered saws and some other applications where a smooth cut and narrower kerf is important.


----------



## BurnIt13 (Mar 30, 2011)

Thanks guys....I'm starting to get things here.  Last question...when I replace the bar do I have to go with the genuine Ryobi part or can I go with any old 18" bar?  

Looks like I can go with Oregon's 91VX (chamfer chisel), 91VXL (semi chisel), and M91VX (chamfer chisel multi-cut).  Bailey's will assemble the chain to the correct number of drive links.

Okay....any clue which one is best?  All of the trees are still standing.


----------



## TreePointer (Mar 31, 2011)

BurnIt13 said:
			
		

> Thanks guys....I'm starting to get things here.  Last question...when I replace the bar do I have to go with the genuine Ryobi part or can I go with any old 18" bar?
> 
> Looks like I can go with Oregon's 91VX (chamfer chisel), 91VXL (semi chisel), and M91VX (chamfer chisel multi-cut).  Bailey's will assemble the chain to the correct number of drive links.
> 
> Okay....any clue which one is best?  All of the trees are still standing.



Genuine Ryobi bar is not necessary.  Bar must fit bar mount on powerhead.  Pitch of sprocket in bar tip must match pitch of drive sprocket on powerhead (note that 3/8 pitch sprockets are different from 3/8 LP sprockets).  That saw is a Redmax GZ400 clone, so any bar that cross-references with that saw should fit. 

Chain must match pitch of powerhead drive sprocket, pitch of bar tip sprocket, gauge of bar, and number of drive links (DL) specified on bar.

I prefer chisel chain for the wood I cut (mostly treetops from timber harvests) over semi-chisel.  In Oregon, the 91VX or 91VXL should be fine (never tried the harder multi-cut chain).  Alternatives would be Stihl PMC or Woodland Pro 30LP.


----------



## JeffT (Mar 31, 2011)

TreePointer said:
			
		

> BurnIt13 said:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Yes,re-badged Redmax.


----------



## CTYank (Mar 31, 2011)

BurnIt13 said:
			
		

> TreePointer said:
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Chainsaws do NOT have blades. Each has a BAR and CHAIN. ('cept for Wright Reciprocating.)

You need not fear any proper-cutting chain IF YOU:
1) Maintain a proper grip on both handles; no "monkey-grip" on the front (thumb must be opposed to fingers.)
2) Lock your left elbow (the front-grip one) with that arm fully extended.
3) Keep all your bodily components out of the plane of the chain. (That way the saw can kick back or up and back and not dispense your precious bodily fluids.) If the saw breaks through the cut suddenly, you won't be there to greet it.

Chainsaws WILL kick back and do other things you've not scripted, and most suddenly. If you're not in a "firing bearing", no ER visit.

My understanding is that some Ryobi chainsaws are REALLY good; don't jump to dis them. All mfgs make lesser and better models.


----------



## BurnIt13 (Mar 31, 2011)

You guys have been a HUGE help!  The cross reference to the RedMax saw made things alot easier.  Just in case anyone cares, the Oregon replacement bar is thier "Double Guard 91" 180DGEA041.

For _chains_ I can go with the following.  I'm not sure what chisel type the Woodland and Husqvarna chain uses, but I'd prefer full chisel.

Oregon -      91VXL - Semi Chisel
Woodland -  30LP    - ???
Husqvarna - H35X   - ???


----------



## Intheswamp (Mar 31, 2011)

I'm no pro...cut more wood over the last month or so than in my lifetime.  But here's a couple things I'll mention...

I, too, had the "safety to non-safety" concern.  Do as everyone has said...posture, straight left arm, left hand wrapped around the handle (fingers in one direction, thumb in the other...kinda like you'd hold a rattle snake below the head, they bite, too!), good grip with both hands, cut with saw to the side with the edge of the bar *not* in the same plane with any of your body parts.  Don't force the saw.  I'll add (and probably duplicate others)...

PPE PPE PPE....be sure and where protection equipment.  All I've acquired so far is chaps, steel toe boots, and hearing protection.  Now, if I can just make myself wear the chaps and hearing protection *every* time I cut.<sigh>

Know where the saw tip is every second that you're cutting.  Know where any objects are that are near the saw tip...every second that you're cutting.  Everytime you crank your saw and until you switch it back off *expect* a kick-back encounter and be prepared for it.  If you're prepared. then when it happens it will be one of those "WHOA" moments that you sit and reflect on and see where you messed up...if you're not prepared it could very well be a bad situation.  When you crank your saw you need to instantly go into defensive mode.

Start each cut full-throttle...no mambi-bambi half-throttle stuff.  So far I have experienced more pull-in and push-out than kickback....one pull-in was when cutting a short log and did not a full throttle when the chain engaged the wood...rolled the log toward me/saw toward the log...should have had the dawgs up against the log to start with and full throttle.  The push-out was when starting an undercut simply and again without enough throttle.  If you run the saw with too little throttle it acts like a minature piece of track equipment and wants to "move" the equipment...and fast!  Non-safety chains have better "traction" than safety chains.

Stability...I've been cutting in some clear-cuts where limbs and small trees are in a jumble, pile, twisted mess.  What I've found is that I have to get a good place to plant my feet.  If I'm unstable on my feet that means the saw will be unstable.  Have a good stance and don't over-reach.

PPE, stability, stance, grip, out of plane of bar, full throttle, knowledge of tip location and close-by objects, and expectation that you *will* get kickback, push-out, or pull-in every time you crank the saw.

I like the semi-chisel chain that I've been running...there is definitely an increase in performance coming from the safety chain I've always used.

One last thing....if something just doesn't seem right....STOP!  Use those gut feelings!!...99% of the time they're tellin' you the truth...the other 1% is gas.

Best wishes,
Ed


----------



## smokinj (Mar 31, 2011)

my .0002 

http://www.baileysonline.com/itemdetail.asp?item=WP365+30LP&catID=11805


----------



## BurnIt13 (Mar 31, 2011)

Thanks for the responses guys!  I just bought the WoodlandPro 30LP chain and Oregon bar.

As far as safety equipment goes, I've got steel toe boots, safety glasses, and hearing protection.  Chaps and a helmet with a shield are going to be next.


----------



## mecreature (Mar 31, 2011)

I have been getting tons more life out of my chains recently.. the regular Oregon 2pk for like 22 bucks at lowes...

but I do want to try the 91VXL - Semi Chisel next time just to see whats up.. 

but a quick sharpening the regular safety chain has been cutting great... 


Give us a report back and let us know what you think BurnIt13


----------

