# Hearth Pad shock!



## stejus (Aug 20, 2008)

Has anyone orderd their hearth pad online?  I just went to look a tiled pad (41x41 corner with 3.5" base) at the stove place and they want $480.   I don't want to sound cheap, but is this the going price?

Thanks,
Steve


----------



## schenkp (Aug 20, 2008)

Just make one you can do this really cheap form home depot just use concrete board and some tiles, you can do it for under $50 and have a nicer one.


----------



## cncpro (Aug 20, 2008)

I paid $249 for mine (36 x 36 for straight wall install) at this place...

http://www.robbinsgarden.com/

I appreciated the fact that the outer edge is constructed of steel angle iron custom bent and welded.  I figured it was worth it because it would have taken me quite a while to make the equivalent plus I'd have to rent a tile cutter, etc...  My projection was for a lot more than $50 for materials and if I charged myself labor it could've gone into the thousands...   :cheese:

EDIT:  I just realized that your price was for a base too...  I think the price they gave you is fair.  My $249 was just for the pad and I built a nice pedestal for it.

Robbins had lots of pads but no pedestals in stock when I was there last...


----------



## stejus (Aug 20, 2008)

schnkp said:
			
		

> Just make one you can do this really cheap form home depot just use concrete board and some tiles, you can do it for under $50 and have a nicer one.


I tried googling for a design plan on how to make one.    I havn't had much luck finding one.  I am fairly confident I could frame this and do the concrete board backing (or what ever) because I have all the dimensions.  My only lack of experience is with laying tile or field stone and grouting.


----------



## schenkp (Aug 20, 2008)

You don’t really need a design per say, I just bought a 3x5 piece of concrete board, cut it up so it matched the 41 x 41 dimensions I needed.  Then I used some 400PL to temporally hold the pieces together.  I then used a thin set mortar to put the tile in place this in turn holds the joint so the concrete board in place.  Then I just used some ½ inch round molding to make the edges look nice and used 400PL to hold that in place.

Walla you have a nice hearth for 50 bucks 


----------



## stejus (Aug 20, 2008)

cncpro said:
			
		

> I paid $249 for mine (36 x 36 for straight wall install) at this place...
> 
> http://www.robbinsgarden.com/
> 
> ...



I didn't even think of them.  I live about 15 miles from them.  Do they have them onsite or do you order?


----------



## stejus (Aug 20, 2008)

cncpro said:
			
		

> I paid $249 for mine (36 x 36 for straight wall install) at this place...
> 
> http://www.robbinsgarden.com/
> 
> ...



How did you frame the pedestal?  Did you use 2x4's wrapped with some nice oak?    Also, how did you mount the pedestal to the pad?


----------



## bungalobob (Aug 20, 2008)

I am going to be building my own raised pedestal as well. Those prices for prefab just were too much in addition to what I am forking out for the pellet stove. The way I look at it is if you have the basic tools to build the base it should be simple. The tiles on the other hand could be a little more difficult. I am making one to fit in a corner, so it will not be perfectly square, so I will have to cut out the front section, which will require a tile saw. If you are making a square one, buy the tiles you want and lay them out and make the base the same size so there is no tile cutting involved. Tiling is relatively simple for a small project like this, there is info all over the place on how to do it, even the big box stores can help you out with that. The only stumbling block I am on is how to finish the front edge where the tile edges will be exposed. The base beneath will be fronted with oak board that will be stained and finished. Good luck.


----------



## cncpro (Aug 20, 2008)

2 x 4's to form the outer shape, a few 2 x 4's to brace up the middle so it wouldn't flex then sandwiched top & bottom with 3/8 plywood and all screwed & glued.  I also had a floor that was way out from level so I cut a 3/4" taper into the 2 x 4's before installing the plywood.  Finally to finish it up I wrapped with oak boards from Lowes.  It is hardly even visible because it is recessed under the hearth pad but if anybody ever bends down to look underneath they'll be impressed.

Robbins had only pads when I went there last and who knows now...  Maybe worth calling before you go.


----------



## cncpro (Aug 20, 2008)

Oh, um...

Gravity (and nothing else) is securely holding the stove in place on the pedestal.  ;-)


----------



## humpin iron (Aug 20, 2008)

Everyone make sure you check your stoves requirements for the "K" value of what goes on the floor.  Alot of stoves need more than a piece of dura rock under the tile.  And what your paying for is the UL testing that went into those boards, don't forget the lawyers that made all this possible.

CB1200= parts made in America, shipped to China, assembled, shipped back as a stv and the price went down.  Its a global economy.  

Check the installers guide on hearth requirements to get the "K" values


----------



## kpereyra (Aug 20, 2008)

humpin iron said:
			
		

> Everyone make sure you check your stoves requirements for the "K" value of what goes on the floor.  Alot of stoves need more than a piece of dura rock under the tile.  And what your paying for is the UL testing that went into those boards, don't forget the lawyers that made all this possible.
> 
> CB1200= parts made in America, shipped to China, assembled, shipped back as a stv and the price went down.  Its a global economy.
> 
> Check the installers guide on hearth requirements to get the "K" values



Many people have posted that pellet stoves do not have K or R value specifications.  Only a non-combustible material needs to be used to meet the setback dimensions.  I don't think many of the manuals even state an R or K value.

Am I wrong?

As for me, I made my own using 1/2" plywood, 1/2" durock, slate tiles and oak trim.  if you have the time, skill and patience, it certainly costs much less than the prefabbed ones.  you can see mine here:
My hearth pad


----------



## bungalobob (Aug 20, 2008)

Non-combustible is all I need for mine as well. Think that is just in case a hot spark or something or another comes out and lands on the floor if you open the door.  From what I have read of others on here, you can go pretty basic and just lay some bricks down and place your stove on them. The thing you have to look out for is the clearances though from the edges of the stove to the end of the non-combustible hearth material. I believe mine says 18". Making my pad extra large, 48X48, plenty of room all around.


----------



## bungalobob (Aug 20, 2008)

Hope my pad comes out as nice as yours, Kpereyra!


----------



## DiggerJim (Aug 20, 2008)

kpereyra said:
			
		

> Many people have posted that pellet stoves do not have K or R value specifications.  Only a non-combustible material needs to be used to meet the setback dimensions.  I don't think many of the manuals even state an R or K value.
> 
> Am I wrong?


Don't know about "many" but my manual states that the hearth pad or alternate material used as a floor/hearth protector must be constructed of a durable noncombustible material having an equal or better thermal conductivity value (lower k value) of k=.84 BTU / IN FT2 HR F or a thermal resistance that equals or exceeds r=1.19 HR F FT2 IN/BTU with a minimum thickness of 3/8". 

They provide a table of various materials and their R & k values as well as calculation formulas for thickness needed to get the equivalent to k=.84.... 

Consider that steel is a noncombustible surface but laying a piece of it on the floor isn't going to do you much good as it transmits heat very well to the wood underneath and soon you'd find yourself with charring or burning under you noncombustible surface. Durock an inch thick meets the standard but it takes 5" of marble to make it due to the low R value for marble. Correspondingly a ceramic based insulator called Kaowool (often used for furnace, forge, etc. insulation) would take less than 1/4" to meet the standard.

Definitely check the manual for your stove.


----------



## stejus (Aug 20, 2008)

If you make the pad yourself, how do you pass the UL and ULC code?  

I pulled this straight from the Manual of a Castile.  

C. Hearth Pad Requirements (UL and ULC)

Use a noncombustible floor protector, extending beneath appliance and to the front, sides and rear as indicated.


----------



## humpin iron (Aug 20, 2008)

thank you Digger Jim

You can get your hearth pad approved by going to UL or ULC and paying 10-20K for testing, like the mfg does


----------



## lessoil (Aug 21, 2008)

Here is what I threw together for about $125 in materials.
Of course, my time does not count!
Before cutting the 2 back corners, the pad was 36"X36"

I used the specs from the brochure which showed the required
pad extension beyond each side of the stove. 6" front and sides and 1"-2" out back. 

I had to make mine 5.5" tall so as to clear the hot water baseboard.
2X4's for the frame (on their side)
2 layers of 1/2" plywood
2 layers of 1/4" cement board
Layer of 6"x6" tile.

I had never worked with tile/grout before.
If you are a bit of a handyman it is doable!

Hope this helps!
$480 is pretty steep. My neighbor paid $120 for a plain jane black pad.


----------



## bungalobob (Aug 21, 2008)

I am building my hearth for a Harman P68, and this is the requirement they have written up in the user manual. I guess alot of pellet stoves are different, so you must refer to the one that you are installing.


'Place the stove on a noncombustible floor protector
that extends a minimum of 6 inches to the front,
2 inches to the sides and flush with the rear of the
hopper. See Fig. 6.The minimum floor protector material
is 20 gauge sheet metal. Other floor protector
materials are ceramic tile, stone, brick, etc.'


----------



## stejus (Aug 21, 2008)

lessoil said:
			
		

> Here is what I threw together for about $125 in materials.
> Of course, my time does not count!
> Before cutting the 2 back corners, the pad was 36"X36"
> 
> ...



lessoil - Thanks for the pics.  The old saying a picture is worth a thousand words.  This is true.  Do you have a finshed view of it installed?


----------



## lessoil (Aug 21, 2008)

stejus,
We are waiting for a call from the dealer as to what the install date will be.
I will post pictures as soon as that happens.

FYI,
I bought the cement board, tile, tools and grout at Home Depot.
The rest I picked up at a local store. The trim is plain old pine 1"x 6"
stained with Minwax.


----------



## TruePatriot (Aug 31, 2008)

On the topic of an inexpensive hearth board:

Can sheets of Durock be purchased and laid down--and that's it?  As in, no tile or top cover, or does Code 211 (?) require a steel, tile or other noncombustible surface to be put down *on top of the Durock?*  (Put another way, is the "skin" of the Durcock truly noncombustible, and is it treated as such, under the NYS code?)  

I have no extra time this year but would redo it with something more aesthetically pleasing, next year, if I could slide by like this, this year.

Also, I seem to remember that sheets of Durock come in some oddball size?  If I had to cut an extra foot strip, or whatever, to do a 5' x 5' hearth pad, is there some adhesive I could use, and assemble a "sandwich" of sheets of Durcock, with the extra-width strips staggered on alternate sides, or is there no "noncombustable" type of construction adhesives?

Thanks,

TruePatriot


----------



## imacman (Aug 31, 2008)

lessoil said:
			
		

> ...FYI,  I bought the cement board, tile, tools and grout at Home Depot.
> The rest I picked up at a local store. The trim is plain old pine 1"x 6"
> stained with Minwax.



I think it came out real nice....especially like the simple edging w/ the Minwax....great job, nice pics too! :coolsmile:


----------



## DiggerJim (Aug 31, 2008)

TruePatriot said:
			
		

> Can sheets of Durock be purchased and laid down--and that's it?  As in, no tile or top cover, or does Code 211 (?) require a steel, tile or other noncombustible surface to be put down *on top of the Durock?*  (Put another way, is the "skin" of the Durcock truly noncombustible, and is it treated as such, under the NYS code?)


You need 7/8" of Durock to make k=.84 (or r=1.19) so you can layer sheets to make the number you need. You don't need to glue them - you can screw Durock sheets together. You can also use Hardibacker in the same thickness (7/8") - you can nail that together with hot dip galvanized roofing nails. (Hardibacker 500 needs to be an inch thick though.)


----------



## terryjd98 (Sep 1, 2008)

You guys have done a nice job building them hearth pads. My Enviro Evolution came with its own. Just a piece of steel with about a 1 inch bend in sides. Not as pretty as what has been built but will do the job it suites my budget.


----------



## oliver5528 (Sep 1, 2008)

I helped a buddy of mine build a hearth.  We used a old sheet of 1/4" diamond plate, wrapped the edge with 1/2" rod iron and painted it flat black.  Made a nice hearth. I like it better than my tile hearth.  this is my PC45 notice the baby guard I made to keep my baby away


----------



## lessoil (Sep 1, 2008)

That looks real good!
I like the rod iron and kettle. Will have to get our kettle out of storage.
Good to put moisture into the air.
We bought a "Fence" for our babies(See below) at a pet store. 
Hopefully we will remove it shortly.
Not as nice looking as your setup.

Can you remove it easily to do maintenance ect?


----------



## cntbill (Sep 1, 2008)

Last year... I put a fireplace in and what I ended up using to meet the K value was Micore board.  Here is a link to that post with the info as this might help with ideas and design. The Micore board is easy to work with and if you put that under the backerboad  / Durok you should meet the K value easily. 

https://www.hearth.com/econtent/index.php/forums/viewthread/14069/


----------



## oliver5528 (Sep 2, 2008)

lessoil said:
			
		

> That looks real good!
> I like the rod iron and kettle. Will have to get our kettle out of storage.
> Good to put moisture into the air.
> We bought a "Fence" for our babies(See below) at a pet store.
> ...



The top rail is like channel iron upside down and it straddles two l brackets attached to the walls


----------



## 56 chevtruck (Sep 11, 2008)

i you have time and skill resources make one i  am into mine 100.00 - 125.00 max 1/2  plymood and cement board from homedepot along with cheep tiles. some 1 1/4" steel angle. prices are kinda pround buying one premade imho


----------



## Adios Pantalones (Sep 11, 2008)

Dogs basically just understand fire appliances.  Our guys stay a respectful distance away.  Chloe worships near it, though, and when it's not going she sits near it and looks at me.


----------



## pelletguy (Sep 15, 2008)

Just had my Mt. Vernon delivered Sept. 5  I built the hearth pad myself.  I saw the prices for the pre-fabs and got quite a shock.  around 400.00 in my area.  I thought I would give it a try.  Here is what I came up with.  Here are a few pics of the progression of the pad and the new stove.


----------



## lessoil (Sep 15, 2008)

Very Nice!!
The color blends well with the stove!

My Buddy is still waiting for his Mt. Vernon.
He ordered his in May.
What dealer did you go through?

Thanks!


----------



## cntbill (Sep 15, 2008)

Pelletguy

Looks Good !  

Nice tile work.


----------



## pelletizer (Sep 16, 2008)

Looks real nice good job, 
 Hearth mark up's are unreal and if anyone can find a good deal for one of the materials sold in the hearth stores at a provider of brick, stone, and masonry supplies in your local area good for you there are always left over remnants of counter tops and custom installs.


----------



## bungalobob (Sep 16, 2008)

Great job! Mine is still a work in progress. Just need to lay the tiles, and of course put a stove on it when it comes in. Hope mine looks as good as yours. I'll post when complete, even if the stove is missing from the picture. Happy burning!


----------



## Firenutz (Sep 16, 2008)

I have a question. I guess code requires my pellet stove in my double wide mobile home to be bolted to the floor. I haven't picked my stove up yet and I was wondering if there are provisions on the stove to bolt it down? It's a Kozy Heat woodland. Normally I wouldn't care but if I decide to sell my house, I don't want some picky home inspector to ding me on that. I'm also in the beginning stages of my hearth. I already cut a hole in my carpet so that is motivating me to get it finished. It's a corner hearth. I'm planning on a thin baseboard border stained to match the panelling and chair rail. Then I plan on building the hearth up to the height of the baseboard 3-1/4" with the top 2 layers being the non combustible under some Pennsylvania bluestone that I'm having cut into tile like pieces and grouted. The hearth will have the natural look of the shale. I'm hoping it will be fairly level.


----------



## pelletguy (Sep 16, 2008)

lessoil, I went through finest hearth and home in Bangor.  

By the way, I spent around $125.00 in materials for the hearth pad.


----------



## DiggerJim (Sep 16, 2008)

Firenutz said:
			
		

> I have a question. I guess code requires my pellet stove in my double wide mobile home to be bolted to the floor. I haven't picked my stove up yet and I was wondering if there are provisions on the stove to bolt it down?


That's probably a "fabricate on location" item  Shorthand for "not our problem, figure it out for yourself". Seriously, you can fashion what works for your location. Typically you run bolts through the feet into the floor. 

You also need to electrically ground it to the frame of the mobile home. And, while you're at it, you have to screen in the vent pipe (less than 3/4" openings) up to 7' off the ground if you do a horizontal vent.


----------



## slls (Sep 16, 2008)

Firenutz said:
			
		

> I have a question. I guess code requires my pellet stove in my double wide mobile home to be bolted to the floor. I haven't picked my stove up yet and I was wondering if there are provisions on the stove to bolt it down?



Bolt it using the same holes that attach the pallet to the stove for shipping.


----------



## MrKLeen (Sep 16, 2008)

Lowes has a very simple fireproof hearthpad for like 30-50 dollars in 2 different sizes made especially for pellet stoves. They are just thin fireproof material. I plan on building something myself but this would be the super cheap/lazy way to go. I cannot find it on their website, but they had them at the store near the venting supplies.


----------



## firewarrior820 (Sep 16, 2008)

i hear they warp and curl


----------



## Panhandler (Sep 16, 2008)

xpellet freakx said:
			
		

> i hear they warp and curl



 I used one for 3 seasons and had no trouble. I would suggest that a user put a little more towards the front tho to protect floor or carpet during cleaning. Just put down a tile hearth this summer.


----------



## wdosmer (Jan 9, 2009)

pelletguy said:
			
		

> Just had my Mt. Vernon delivered Sept. 5  I built the hearth pad myself.  I saw the prices for the pre-fabs and got quite a shock.  around 400.00 in my area.  I thought I would give it a try.  Here is what I came up with.  Here are a few pics of the progression of the pad and the new stove.




What are the dimensions of this?  I am installing a Quadrafire MtV and I need to build a hearth.


----------



## 56 chevtruck (Jan 9, 2009)

hi wdosmer i sent you a pm with a link to where i got my measurements from


----------



## www_godzilla (Jan 10, 2009)

I just received my Quadrafire Santa Fe today.  I too looked at the hearth pads that you can buy. Way too expensive. I went to Lowes in Portland. I looked at their tileslooksthey had in the store. Their selection wasn't very good. I ended up ordering tile that looks like Mica. It cost me $143 just for the tiles. I bought a 48 x 48  3/4 plywood, 1/2 cement board and box of black tile,because the 1 box of the mica wasn't enough to cover the whole pad. So I will make a pattern. This will cost me about $250 anyways for the pad. It will look awesome and be worth it.


----------



## MACHINE1 (Jan 10, 2009)

For those of you worried about having to get a tile saw to cut your tiles. My father bought his tile from Lowes and they cut them for him right in the store.


----------

