# Home Made Boiler Up and Running



## allan (Nov 15, 2009)

I just wanted to let everyone here know that I now have my "Garn" like boiler up and runnng. It works better then my expectations. I want to thank all my friends on this site for the wealth of information I have and still am gleaning from this site. I made my boiler (really hydronic heater), from a 3000 gallon tank that I bought off Ebay. I have been running it for the last week, I realize that the temperatures are not really cold yet, but I do live in the U.P. of MI so the temps are going down to the low 20's overnight. Right now I fire once a day (I should say my wife fires once a day). The temperature on the boiler usually read a starting temp of around 160 degrees and an ending temp of between 185-195 degrees. Friday night I was home and the temperature was 195 near the end of the burn (about 6 pm) the next afternoon about 4:30 pm it was still 173, but it was a nice day with outside temps around 50 degrees. Right now I put 3 pcs of paper, 4 pcs of kindling wood, 3-4 pcs of regular wood, turn on fan, light fire with match, shut door, wait 3-4 minutes, fire is roaring by then, load 4-6 pcs of wood in the fire, wait 45 min, reload 6-8 pcs of wood turn timer to 3 hours and forget about the fire. Come back and the temperature has climbed from about 160 to 185-195 depending on how much wood was put in the second load. My wife finds it very easy to operate (she did not grow up on wood). You can't tell the boiler is running except you hear the fan, other wise there is no visible smoke coming out the chimney. I will post some pictures later of the completed project.


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## stee6043 (Nov 15, 2009)

Must....have.....pictures.  Otherwise it never happened!

Sounds cool though.  Can't wait to see some shots of this beast....


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## brad068 (Nov 15, 2009)

Sweeeeet


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## TCaldwell (Nov 15, 2009)

congratulations!, cant wait to see pictures, is this the boiler that dectra asked you to keep hidden?


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## allan (Nov 15, 2009)

This is the project after welding was completed


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## allan (Nov 15, 2009)

More pictures of welded project


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## allan (Nov 15, 2009)

Inside fire box


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## allan (Nov 15, 2009)

Installed and operating


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## allan (Nov 15, 2009)

Insulated and operating


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## allan (Nov 15, 2009)

More completed photos


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## allan (Nov 16, 2009)

TCaldwell said:
			
		

> congratulations!, cant wait to see pictures, is this the boiler that dectra asked you to keep hidden?



Thanks Tom. Dectra never contacted me directly, but I rec'd a PM from someone who said that they were unhappy that I had posted the internal pictures. I'm not out to make anybody upset so I took down those pictures. This was my own design that utilized the principles of the Garn. I modified a 3000 gallon tank that I found on ebay and basically made a 5 pass heat exchanger out of 5-inch pipe. It works great so far I must say. I will need to start working on the control side to make my overall heating system more efficient.


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## shoeboxlen (Nov 16, 2009)

Congrats on the build and the design. if someone gets bent that you showed pics tell them to talk to a admin. Its your design and your build and you have as much of a right to post pics of it as the guy who spends a boat load on their garn or other boiler. Sure wish I had the skills needed to make that boiler.


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## allan (Nov 18, 2009)

I have a new problem now. My wife tells me the house is too hot! I noticed that my temperature feeding the infloor heat is hoter, so I will have to make adjustments to my 3-way mixing valve. This is my first time heating with wood were I'm using energy stored in the water. I can't imagine anything else now. No wonder the Europeans all use storage.


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## shoeboxlen (Nov 18, 2009)

its a gender thing they are required by law to find something to complain about lol


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## magnumhntr (Nov 18, 2009)

Dude, I along with countless others would love to see any pics you care to share. As stated before, this is your design. Noone should have a problem with you sharing your ideas/designs.... Please share ~ others may be able to improve upon your design...

Chris


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## TCaldwell (Nov 19, 2009)

Eup,when you get clothes back on, do you have a way to check your fluegas temp, also what "garn like" combustion chamber size did you go by , 2000 or 3200 design, how much do you think it all cost to fabricate?


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## allan (Nov 19, 2009)

TCaldwell said:
			
		

> Eup,when you get clothes back on, do you have a way to check your fluegas temp, also what "garn like" combustion chamber size did you go by , 2000 or 3200 design, how much do you think it all cost to fabricate?


Tom

I used a 36-inch diameter pipe 3 ft long for the wood chamber and a 12-inch diameter pipe 3 ft long for the secondary burn chamber. I made the insulation 1.5-inches thick in the secondary chamber. I have a temp guage in the exhaust stream right after the fan (forth pass) that reads anywhere from 350-400 degrees. I have seen it higher for a short while, upto 450 degrees. I think I have about $6,500.00 into building the boiler not included installation costs. I would like to figure out how efficient I'm burning, but I have not had a chance to weight the wood, figure moisture content, etc. I know that I have no visible smoke, and the inside of the boiler is clean with just some fine ash that brushes off easily. Reading some of your posts, I see that you have figured out how to control the air supply so that you don't have too much excess air.


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## Paso (Nov 19, 2009)

EUP of MI said:
			
		

> TCaldwell said:
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I have let this sink in for a few days  ( stewing)  and I can't understand why that person would have the gall to send you a PM complaining about you posting pictures of the inside. WTH  this is your design , you built it,  you built it for your use and are not producing the design for profit so why not share the pictures for the rest of us that are interested in what you did.

As far as somebody getting mad I think more people are mad that the pictures were pulled.  Like I said I waited 4 days to comment so I could tone down a little.


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## fabguy01 (Nov 19, 2009)

EUP, how did you make the insulation in the secondary?,castable refactory? Also what is the big framework around the loading door?  thanks nate


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## allan (Nov 20, 2009)

Paso said:
			
		

> EUP of MI said:
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Paso

I just want to set the record straight. Dectra did not ask me to pull the photo's, I did that on my own. 

I will think about posting some of my photos. I'm working away from home right now, so I don't have access to them right now.  I must say that Garn makes an excellant product. It is simple and simple things work best in my opinion


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## allan (Nov 20, 2009)

fabguy01 said:
			
		

> EUP, how did you make the insulation in the secondary?,castable refactory? Also what is the big framework around the loading door?  thanks nate



Fabguy

I ordered my insert from Insulation Specialties out of Indiana if I remember correctly. I sent them my drawing and they made it up for me. They could only make pieces 12-inches long so I have three pcs. If I remember correctly, I paid about $250 or so for the insert. It is not a castible ceramic, more like a  ceramic insulation with a hardener in it. It is not very heavy. The steel framework is the path for air to enter the combustion chamber. Basically, there is a 6-inch pipe that runs through the boiler that preheats the air, it then circles around the door and enter the fire box at 12 and 6 o'clock.


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## brad068 (Nov 20, 2009)

EUP,

In some ways I think garn should be thanking us for the over whelming support that we give to their product. I do believe that our comments on this site have sold a few units to members here. Not many people have the skills that you and I do but there are alot of people that appreciate a well made piece of equipment no matter what the cost. And as far as I know, I don't know of anyone ever complaining of poor design or complex operation of the garn.

When people see pics of the inside and out regardless of the original or a home built clone, they start to realize the uniqueness of it.I think these garns are in a class like a M Farmall or A John Deere. Legendary pieces of American design and ingenuity that will stand the test of time. I just wish I would of thought of this design 40 years ago!


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## allan (Nov 20, 2009)

I agree whole heartedly with your comments Garnification.  The Garn is simplicity in itself. My wife can handle the unit while I'm away and actually does not mind building a fire every day. She builds a fire, and reloads once right now to bring 3000 gallons of water from 155-160 to 180-185. My supply temp in actually hotter then my guage reads on the front of my boiler when I use my IR temp gun. I tried to shoot the fire in the secondary burn chamber by my IR just says "OH"


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## heaterman (Nov 20, 2009)

Somebody has to say it Alan  .............

 Imitation is the sincerest form of flattery.

Nice work. Still want to get up there for that tour of the locks someday. I was within sight of the bridge last week but running a tight schedule this time of year. I'll give you a jingle someday. I'd love to see your craftsmanship firsthand.


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## Jim K in PA (Nov 20, 2009)

EUP - congratulations on getting this project to "light off" :lol: .  I know we traded a few PMs about the fan.  What did you wind up using?  Your flue/HX piping is larger than the WHS200, so you can move more air, but do you need to?  Did you fab your own impellor, or find something off the shelf?

Your flue and water temps look great.  510k-765k Btus is your average input during a burn per your last post.  Over what period of time are you getting the temp rise?

Again, kudos to you for starting, and COMPLETING, a project of this size.  If I had the tools and skills I would attempt something like this too, but I am a woodworker, not a metal worker.   ;-)


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## fabguy01 (Nov 20, 2009)

EUP of MI said:
			
		

> fabguy01 said:
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 I wonder if Garn would sell thier secondary chamber to a non-owner


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## brad068 (Nov 20, 2009)

GARN PARTS.com


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## maplewood (Nov 20, 2009)

I greatly admire your ingenuity and boldness to attack such a project.
American Spirit! (North American, if I may say, because I'm in Canada.)  
Great job.  Hope it satisfies you for decades.
Happy burning.


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## btuser (Nov 21, 2009)

That friggin thing is gynormous!  3000 gallons?  How big is your house?


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## allan (Nov 21, 2009)

heaterman said:
			
		

> Somebody has to say it Alan  .............
> 
> Imitation is the sincerest form of flattery.
> 
> Nice work. Still want to get up there for that tour of the locks someday. I was within sight of the bridge last week but running a tight schedule this time of year. I'll give you a jingle someday. I'd love to see your craftsmanship firsthand.



Heaterman

If your going to make something, you might as well base it off of something that is the best IMHO. Or at least the simplist. There are many good designs out there, but none this simple as far as I can tell. I really like some of the European boiler designs, but I could not build one of those very easily. 

You are welcome anytime, all though, I'm working away a lot right now. I appreciate all your input on different post. I checked out your website, looks like its still in the building stage, but looks good just the same. Good luck!.


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## allan (Nov 21, 2009)

Jim K in PA said:
			
		

> EUP - congratulations on getting this project to "light off" :lol: .  I know we traded a few PMs about the fan.  What did you wind up using?  Your flue/HX piping is larger than the WHS200, so you can move more air, but do you need to?  Did you fab your own impellor, or find something off the shelf?
> 
> Your flue and water temps look great.  510k-765k Btus is your average input during a burn per your last post.  Over what period of time are you getting the temp rise?
> 
> Again, kudos to you for starting, and COMPLETING, a project of this size.  If I had the tools and skills I would attempt something like this too, but I am a woodworker, not a metal worker.   ;-)



Jim

I followed your progress with mush interest. I used a Garn wheel based on the 1500 model. If I had to do it over, I might be temped to use the wheel for the 2000 model as it is slightly larger. 

I usually burn for no more then 4 hours a day from starting the fan to shutting it off. I get most of my heat rise during the first 2.5 to 3 hours, after that I'm just burning down the coals. I think that I get about 10 degrees per hour rise on my guage. When my boiler guage reads in the low 190's, I have readings on my supply blk iron pipe of over 200 degrees. I have not run my boiler temp guage past 195 becasue I had 207 degree water in my supply pipe. I'm not sure that I want to "boil the beast" just yet.


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## allan (Nov 21, 2009)

maplewood said:
			
		

> I greatly admire your ingenuity and boldness to attack such a project.
> American Spirit! (North American, if I may say, because I'm in Canada.)
> Great job.  Hope it satisfies you for decades.
> Happy burning.


Maplewood

I too was born and lived in Canada my first 24 years. I enjoy challenges but once I got into this project and with the help of a great my folks on this site, it was not really that big of a deal. The hardest part is not knowing if my changes to the design would pan out. I wanted a longer secondary burn chamber and a shorter fire box. I'm glad I made the secondary chamber longer As I see flames a good way down when the fire is really going.


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## allan (Nov 21, 2009)

btuser said:
			
		

> That friggin thing is gynormous!  3000 gallons?  How big is your house?



It is commonly know in these parts as the "beast" .


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## taxidermist (Nov 22, 2009)

EUP of MI said:
			
		

> I just wanted to let everyone here know that I now have my "Garn" like boiler up and runnng. It works better then my expectations. I want to thank all my friends on this site for the wealth of information I have and still am gleaning from this site. I made my boiler (really hydronic heater), from a 3000 gallon tank that I bought off Ebay. I have been running it for the last week, I realize that the temperatures are not really cold yet, but I do live in the U.P. of MI so the temps are going down to the low 20's overnight. Right now I fire once a day (I should say my wife fires once a day). The temperature on the boiler usually read a starting temp of around 160 degrees and an ending temp of between 185-195 degrees. Friday night I was home and the temperature was 195 near the end of the burn (about 6 pm) the next afternoon about 4:30 pm it was still 173, but it was a nice day with outside temps around 50 degrees. Right now I put 3 pcs of paper, 4 pcs of kindling wood, 3-4 pcs of regular wood, turn on fan, light fire with match, shut door, wait 3-4 minutes, fire is roaring by then, load 4-6 pcs of wood in the fire, wait 45 min, reload 6-8 pcs of wood turn timer to 3 hours and forget about the fire. Come back and the temperature has climbed from about 160 to 185-195 depending on how much wood was put in the second load. My wife finds it very easy to operate (she did not grow up on wood). You can't tell the boiler is running except you hear the fan, other wise there is no visible smoke coming out the chimney. I will post some pictures later of the completed project.




10:05 on November 15 in the U.P. and you are on the computer???? Did you forget it is opening day of  deer season in MI.......LOL you did not miss much

Rob


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## allan (Nov 22, 2009)

Here is some photos of building the "Beast" Enjoy.


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## allan (Nov 22, 2009)

More Photos


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## brad068 (Nov 22, 2009)

Nice work EUP. I was thinking to myself why did he cut the firebox hole so big and not use the existing steel sheet for the air nozzle cutout but I then remembered that you didn't cut the entire end of the tank off, Duhhhh! How else would he get the firebox inside the tank!

I made "nozzles" to fit in the top and bottom air inlet holes to more or less ,experiment with the right combo. Some of the early garns had a turn knob I think to regulate the upper inlet or the inlet right in the door. I found that with wetter wood, close off the top inlet and dry wood open up the top inlet.
Did you weld in any couplings to install anode rods? And, I do believe supply from the top and return in the bottom is working out better. Again, nice job!


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## deerefanatic (Jan 11, 2011)

Very nice setup. I think if one is going to build a gassifier from scratch, that the garn design would actually be easier than the downdraft style..... And much simpler.... Heck, with one of those, I wouldn't even need my NFCS....

One advantage though with a downdraft setup and external storage is if you pull a "dumb" moment and let your storage run waayyy down, you can get heat in the house fairly quickly by firing up the downdraft... VS the garn setup where you have to heat the storage to a usable level before you can heat your house...

Maybe not a big deal though.


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