# My Windhager BioWin 100/150 Install Thread



## velvetfoot

Hey, I just saw Dana B's install thread.  Looks like his was installed one day and running the next!  Hah!  It'll take months for me.  I still thought I'd start memorializing my project now.  Maybe it'll prompt me to take progress photos.  I hope I'm not jinxing it though.

I put a down payment on this demo unit:
https://www.hearth.com/talk/threads...t-boiler-52-000-btu-hr-showroom-model.117934/
Nice that it has the vacuum unit, and saved a few bucks.

While probably not initially doing bulk pellet storage, I'm pretty sure I will.  Nice project, labor savings.  Bulk deliverers are starting to serve this area.

Initially thinking gasifier, I had 11 sections of 8" Duratech chimney pipe installed in the existing exterior chase.  Now, when he comes back to finish the job installing the chase cover, the chimney guy will be installing an insulated Simpson Duraflex Pro liner.  This'll turn out to be the world's most expensive pellet vent!  Probably not, but still.  I can definitely recommend the installer though, Actual Chimney Specialists; they installed that 8" insulated chimney without removing any siding-did the work from inside the chase!

That's about it for now.  Still at least a foot of snow on the ground down to the basement door.  Next post in a month.


----------



## maple1

Is that your FINAL decision?


----------



## velvetfoot

velvetfoot said:


> I put a down payment on this demo unit:


I sure as heck hope so!


----------



## NE WOOD BURNER

I was trying to dent his show model this past weekend, but he had eagle eyes on that one! She folds a mean star from construction paper.


----------



## PassionForFire&Water

NE WOOD BURNER said:


> I was trying to dent his show model this past weekend, but he had eagle eyes on that one! She folds a mean star from construction paper.


Yes, watch out for those Ninja Stars .... .
show turned out to be great after a slow start on Friday!


----------



## DBNH22

velvetfoot said:


> Hey, I just saw Dana B's install thread.  Looks like his was installed one day and running the next!  Hah!  It'll take months for me.  I still thought I'd start memorializing my project now.  Maybe it'll prompt me to take progress photos.  I hope I'm not jinxing it though.



Are you doing your install yourself?

My install only took two days and it was up and running but the legwork/homework prior to that actually took quite a bit of time.  i had to have a SS liner dropped down one of the flues in my chimney.  Finding the right guy to do that and have it done took a few weeks.  Then I had to find a decent plumber who was going to do a quality job without screwing me on the price.  I had to call at least 15 - 20 different plumber sin my area and there were quite a few jokers out there.  The plumber I settled on and had do the job turned out to be a great plumber and I got the job done at a very reasonable price.  Marc met the plumber during the install/commissioning and commented on how knowledgeable he was and that I had picked the right guy to do the job.  My install was the first Biowin he did but I'm pretty sure he's done a few more since mine.  It's too bad you don't live in NH because I'd give you his name.

Anyhow it's looking like the heating season might be wrapping up in the next 2-3 weeks (finally.)  I'm at slightly under 5 tons burned in a 2400 square foot home so I'll probably end up burning about 5.5 tons give or take a few bags.  I have a spreadsheet I created of my oil use for the past five years and I will probably save somewhere between 35 - 50% over oil this year, most likely somewhere in the middle of that range but I'll know for sure when I'm done heating.


----------



## velvetfoot

I'm doing it myself.  I'm retiring in May and I'm telling my wife this is my hobby.    As long as there aren't any extended outages....

This winter has been pretty darn cold so 5.5 tons might be a worst case scenario for you.  Whatever, you still would have to normalize your previous years' consumption  for the severity.  May I ask if that's all you use to heat your house?


----------



## DBNH22

velvetfoot said:


> I'm doing it myself.  I'm retiring in May and I'm telling my wife this is my hobby.    As long as there aren't any extended outages....
> 
> This winter has been pretty darn cold so 5.5 tons might be a worst case scenario for you.  Whatever, you still would have to normalize your previous years' consumption  for the severity.  May I ask if that's all you use to heat your house?




Yeah, I'm thinking that having six tons on my basement floor come October 1st in the coming years should serve me well as I don't expect to see another winter quite as long and cold as this one was in quite some time.  I have an oil boiler that's only 12 years old (age of the home) that I left in pace.  I left it in place both as a redundant heating appliance in the event that something happens with the pellet boiler and also for the fact that if I ever sell the home I don't want potential buyers to be scared away by only having the option of a manual feed (I bag feed mine) pellet boiler for heating.

Are you pretty handy when it comes to plumbing?  When I purchased my boiler Marc asked me if I was going to do the install myself but I never even considered it for a minute.  I am a network engineer and plumbing/installing boilers just isn't the world I live in so I knew better.  i really did luck out with the guy I had do it though.


----------



## velvetfoot

You turn off your propane boiler when you don't need it or does the propane boiler come on automatically when the pellets run out?  

I'm fairly handy when it comes to plumbing.  Maybe not so much with design, but my mechanical engineering degree would indicate that I at least have an interest in things mechanical.  

How do you find manually feeding the hopper?  I understand it can hold 8 bags.  Do you have to use a step stool to make it easier?


----------



## velvetfoot

Well, the chimney guy just now completed the job.  I took pictures of the nice stainless chase cover, but wouldn't you know, I didn't have a memory card in the camera.  Anyway below is a picture of the final product.  It was my concept to have the heights graduated because of smoky oder from downdraft in the flues and prevailing winds.  The tall one is the 8" chimney with a 6" insulated liner for the pellet boiler.  The middle one is for the wood fireplace insert and what is seen is a single wall stainless extension of the 6" liner (was going to be a lot more to possibly match the air cooled-hoping creosote won't be an issue), and then the oil stack.  As I said, world's most expensive pellet vent.


----------



## chken

I like the staggered heights.


----------



## velvetfoot

chken said:


> I like the staggered heights.


Thanks.  Like I said, the tallest one is pointing into the prevailing winds, so I'm hoping no smoke impingement.

You can see the edge of the stainless chase cover in that picture.


----------



## velvetfoot

The storage bag, fill kit, 15' of conductive hose, and clamps came in.  People put them on concrete blocks and plywood, but they say it's okay to put it directly on concrete, so I'm thinking I'll glue three 2" xps foam boards together and trim it to a 6' diameter circle, (or keep it square), as a base that might discourage condensation.  I can't put any pellets in until the vacuum pickups arrive, and I'm not sure when is a good time to buy bulk pellets anyway-I'm thinking fall, but I really have no idea
I did see some 4" conduit hangers at HD yesterday, so I may pick up several of those nd see how they fit.  They might also fit on whatever pipe I use for the radon removal.


----------



## chken

The foam sounds like a good idea.


----------



## sinnian

Anything some with the kit to prevent static?


----------



## velvetfoot

sinnian said:


> Anything some with the kit to prevent static?


The hose is conductive.  I didn't take a good look at it, but the Windhager install manual says that for its vacuum transfer system, to expose some of the wire and bend it inside pipe and then hook up to equipment.  The kit I got had no directions like that.  I assume it has a wire, but it may not.  It's hard to find out a lot of info on that.  Maybe I'll call them.


----------



## velvetfoot

I installed a couple of EcoCirc Vario circulators today.
Now I have to dial them in.

https://www.hearth.com/talk/threads/ordered-a-couple-varios.127093/

I have the first floor set on 2 and the second on 3, which seems to work.


----------



## velvetfoot

Removed piping from oil tank yesterday.  Went quick-teflon tape had been used.  Still, was the first time I ever had to crank hard on a three foot long pipe wrench!


----------



## Don2222

velvetfoot said:


> The hose is conductive.  I didn't take a good look at it, but the Windhager install manual says that for its vacuum transfer system, to expose some of the wire and bend it inside pipe and then hook up to equipment.  The kit I got had no directions like that.  I assume it has a wire, but it may not.  It's hard to find out a lot of info on that.  Maybe I'll call them.



Does the vacuum transfer hose have a wire along the inside? I believe that is for the ground. You do not want any sparks to ignite the pellets while they are being blown in!


----------



## velvetfoot

Don, thanks for reminding me.  I should follow up on my own posts.  I went downstairs and took a look.  I could see no wire.  The hose seems to be very heavy rubber with a smooth inside and a reinforcing coil of a plastic of some sort.  NOTHING is conductive, according to my multimeter.  I got the kit from Maine Energy Systems, so they should know what they're doing.  I'll give them a call.


----------



## Don2222

velvetfoot said:


> Don, thanks for reminding me.  I should follow up on my own posts.  I went downstairs and took a look.  I could see no wire.  The hose seems to be very heavy rubber with a smooth inside and a reinforcing coil of a plastic of some sort.  NOTHING is conductive, according to my multimeter.  I got the kit from Maine Energy Systems, so they should know what they're doing.  I'll give them a call.



Good idea to check that all out and let us know. Thanks for the info!


----------



## velvetfoot

There were markings on the pipe:  TigerFlex UF-1 400.
Here is a reference:  http://www.plastixs.com/tiger_ureflex1.html

Key statement: 
"Black HMW PVC convoluted cover formulated with static-dissipative compound"

So, it's taken care of.  That pipe is very hard to cut, as I discovered when I cut off some small pieces to look at.  I'm hoping bdub has a tip on how best to do it.


----------



## kopeck

A little late to the game here but I can't believe you pulled the trigger!

It will be fun watching it come together.

K


----------



## velvetfoot

kopeck said:


> It will be fun watching it come together


It will be a very long watch, since I don't do things too fast.  But, maybe there will be some value in a project progress type of format.


----------



## DBNH22

When will you take delivery on the Biowin and start the install?

Also did you check  out what rebates you might be eligible for in NY?


----------



## velvetfoot

Dana.....my install will not take a day like yours!    Delivery should be in May, I would think.  Install...it's already begun!  And when it will end?  Hopefully before winter!

In NYS:  Nothing.  Not that we don't pay a lot for electric and everything else.


----------



## velvetfoot

The boiler and buffer tank are in the basement.


----------



## Mpodesta

Nice, looking forward to seeing the instal pics.

Cat yours? I have a 226b


----------



## velvetfoot

Mpodesta said:


> Nice, looking forward to seeing the instal pics.
> 
> Cat yours? I have a 226b


Project is very slow.  

Cat is not mine.  I paid a local landscape contractor $100 to move it.  He and his son also helped me get it through the door.  He set it on my pallet jack and that's how we moved it through the door.


----------



## velvetfoot

I drilled  a couple of 4" holes through my 8" basement wall today for the relocated oil tank supply and vent pipes..  I rented a Husqvarna wet drill with stand and diamond core bit.  I hung plastic around it and gathered a portion of it into a plastic tote, so the water was routed into it.  The inside edges are very sharp, but not so much the outside, but as sharp as possible.  It went very smooth-no dust, no mess, but I should've worn ear protection for the first hole I drilled.  Hopefully the pipes will fit okay.  I'll attach some pics.


----------



## velvetfoot

Well, I managed to get the boiler off the pallet and onto some 2x4s.  Now I can pick it up with the pallet jack, move it where I want to and set it down on some concrete patio blocks, or whatever the 4" thick 8x16" units are called.  I might cut a couple blocks so there are a couple of slots for the pallet jack forks.

I wouldn't necessarily recommend the way I did it, although it wasn't dangerous or required any muscle.  I used the levelers as little jacks to jack it up a little at a time, block it off and do it over again until a couple of 2x4s could fit underneath.  Thing is, the levelers were never meant for that kind of duty, and the thing that the levelers screwed in to broke its hold somehow and just spun in place.  I put a vice grips on it and that worked.  It was a little dicey, and it happened on two of the levelers; luckily they were on the pellet bin side and there was access to the keeper for the vice grip, as opposed to the boiler side.  Anyway, all's well that ends well.  Here's a pic:


----------



## velvetfoot

Here is a picture of the moved oil tank.  I did some sheet rock and window and door trim while the area was open.  I put 20 gallons of diesel in it and purged the burner-easy.  The flare fittings don't seem to be leaking, but that took a little repetition.  I sealed the outside of the oil fill and vent pipes with that clay penetration sealer stuff.  I will spray some great stuff in there-will attempt to mask off the sheetrock to avoid mess.  I got a gun for the great stuff which I like.  Will call the oil man.  Hopefully the fill will go smoothly-can't imagine why not and the 2" fill and vent pipe can't hurt.  Still not sure how much oil to order-I'm currently thinking 100 gallons.


----------



## DBNH22

velvetfoot said:


> Here is a picture of the moved oil tank.  I did some sheet rock and window and door trim while the area was open.  I put 20 gallons of diesel in it and purged the burner-easy.  The flare fittings don't seem to be leaking, but that took a little repetition.  I sealed the outside of the oil fill and vent pipes with that clay penetration sealer stuff.  I will spray some great stuff in there-will attempt to mask off the sheetrock to avoid mess.  I got a gun for the great stuff which I like.  Will call the oil man.  Hopefully the fill will go smoothly-can't imagine why not and the 2" fill and vent pipe can't hurt.  Still not sure how much oil to order-I'm currently thinking 100 gallons.




Are you still using your oil for domestic hot water int he non heating months?  I got a Nyle heat pump water heater for that but I wanted to have some oil in my oil tank for emergencies and to exercise the oil boiler periodically.   I called the oil company the other day, after not having purchased oil from them for at least a year and asked what the minimum delivery they will make is.  The lady told me 150 gallons despite the fact that they've always done 100 gallon deliveries in the past.  I asked if she could do 50 and she copped an attitude with me.  I guess it's not worth their time, even this time of year, to work a 50 gallon delivery in.  Screw'em.   I'll find an oil company that will deliver 50 gallons.


----------



## velvetfoot

Dana B said:


> Are you still using your oil for domestic hot water int he non heating months?


No, I too am using a Nyletherm attached to an electric water heater; it's been working great.  I'll probably be using the pellet boiler for hot water in the winter time.
I'm getting a 100 gallon delivery day after tomorrow.


----------



## velvetfoot

Got 100 gallons today-whistled like a top and no leaks.  Filled in pipe penetration space with foam. Again, I love that foam gun.

I measured 100' to the window from where a bulk truck could park.  The pellet guy's hose is 100'.  I'm thinking I could put the bin next to the oil tank and run some hoses through the window.  If that works, I could drill another couple holes through the foundation and supply a couple of extension hoses, because I can't see an easy way to get the hose through the rim and adjoining joists because the hose (more like 'pipe') is quite stiff.


----------



## DBNH22

I'm curious, what did you pay per gallon?


----------



## velvetfoot

3.55


----------



## velvetfoot

I took the cardboard off the Froling tank.  It is tall.  Here's a pic, in hopefully approximate final position.


----------



## velvetfoot

I got a package in the mail yesterday.  It is a Windhager barometric damper with pressure release and a Tee with clamps.  The baro damper intrigued me because there is a gasket that provides a seal in the event of some transitory positive pressure.  It also has a spring loaded ring that pops off in the event of an explosion, which doesn't intrigue me as much, but is interesting.

I'm having trouble getting my head around how the whole assembly goes together in the system.  The Tee is of very rugged construction: 2mm (.079") thick wall and welded.  It also came with two very heavy steel bands that are lined with a sticky kind of material.  

The trouble for my mind are the diameters and where to locate the damper.  The baro damper seems to be meant to slip into the 6" diameter right angle section of the Tee, which incidentally has 5 holes in it.  That's fine, except for the 4 holes that have to be plugged since the damper is only lone enough to engage the one screw.  The other two ends of the Tee are 5-7/8" in external diameter, so that would seem to  mean that they both would slip into a 6" pipe with the heavy steel clamps holding things together.

I guess things will become evident at some point.  I'm going to order the DVL double wall smoke pipe shortly.


----------



## heaterman

I've never used one although I saw something similar installed in the factory training room in Austria.
It is a very well designed barometric damper (pricey) 

As far as how in particular it all goes together..........I would say that depends on where the metric/US adapter comes into the picture. 
Is the Tee the same diameter as the back of the flue outlet on the boiler?


----------



## velvetfoot

heaterman said:


> Is the Tee the same diameter as the back of the flue outlet on the boiler?


No.  The tees two ends are just shy of 6", so I guess it could plug into an adapter.  
The Tee is INCREDIBLY heavy and well built.  Maybe in Europe the smoke pipe is thicker than here.  I'm now leaning on going DVL all the way from the adapter and plugging the baro into a DVL tee, not using the Windhager tee, and also using Tarm's datasheet on their boilers and mount the baro in a tee under the chimney cleanout tee.  It's gonna be a little tricky at the chimney termination because my chimney guy but an insulated liner through a 8" double wall chimney-it may be that I'll need to call him, but I'll order the parts and try to fit it up myself first.


----------



## velvetfoot

I've been ordering the doo dads; they sure are expensive.


----------



## velvetfoot

I've been bummed out because after ordering a bunch of DVL stove pipe ($$) the 5-6" increaser didn't fit.  The mfr's tech dept said they didn't make anthing suitable, and maybe I could modify it by crimping.  I tried that this morning with no luck.  While in the hardware store buying some metal duty jigsaw blades (!) I found two 5-6" adapters:  one with the crimp on the 6" end and one with the crimp on the 5" end.  The one that fit was the first one, what they call an "increaser", but I can't see that, only it had to go in backwards.  It is a very nice tight fit even though not technically the most desireable.  I can put some sealant in at the crimp end and 3 screws, and the other end goes over the heavy duty flue extension on the BioWin and which I'll probably just put a hose clamp on.  The BioWin extender comes off easy as well, so removing for future cleaning, either the extender or the hose clamp and adapter/extender connection will be a snap.

It's amazing how my mood has improved.  It may prove transitory, but I'm loving it!


----------



## velvetfoot

Back to earth.  I'm fitting up the DVL pipe and it's not super easy.  The liner came down crooked (chimney guy did that), the T didn't wind up going in just like it should, but I think it should be all right.  I'll put some rtv on the interior seams, maybe some tape on exterior, but I don't think I'll be taking that down again for maintenance if I can help it.  I  think if I had to do it over again I'd do it in single wall.  It's lighter (I might need an add-on support just for the sliding section-that'll be a great look, it assembles (and disassembles easier), I don't need the clearance relief, and it's much cheaper; I just don't think I'm getting the value out of it.


----------



## velvetfoot

DVL stove pipe fit up.  Will mark, take down as unit, assemble and seal, and store elsewhere for better access.  
The telescoping section is pretty heavy.  I think I will use a hanger but not sure what's best.  I'll post a question in wood stove forum.

Boiler is now where it's going to be.  Will arrange termite blocks (some cutting of same is in the works).


----------



## velvetfoot

DHW is now tapped into for the new tank with isolation valves.  Took an outage today since the better half was out for the day.


----------



## velvetfoot

Took on a diversion yesterday and loaded 4 tons of pellets into the basement.  Shoulder aches.  I can see the attraction of bulk pellet delivery.


----------



## velvetfoot

I finished sweating the domestic hot water pipe today and had only one a connection that leaked, a 1.5"/.75" threaded brass bushing that I was luckily able to tighten a little with a couple 24" wrenches.
I'm pretty certain I'm going to set it up to load pellets manually for this winter and maybe use the bag next winter.
I thought about controlling the oil boiler backup and I think I'm going to use DZL_Damon's approach of a time delay/temp reading of the pellet boiler water, as I explained in another thread.
I'll take some pictures when I get the boiler piping tight, knock on wood.


----------



## DBNH22

Shouldn't be much longer now before the party starts eh velvet.......


----------



## velvetfoot

Well, I put in another fill line-it didn't occur to me that the mixing valve would block the flow when flushing and filling.  Perhaps not necessary.  This morning I cleaned up the basement, partly so that not as much stuff would get wet, lol, and partly to delay the inevitable.  I'll start putting water in it after lunch.  Nervous.
There's still the electrical work to go as well, but if I can get it to hold water, I'll be a happy camper.  Wish me luck.


----------



## BoilerBob

good luck


----------



## maple1

Yes, filling everything up with water is nitty gritty nervous time.

Every little noise sounds like a drip or squirt - even noises coming from outside.

Good luck.


----------



## velvetfoot

Well, there are two serious leaks.  One at the 1.5"/1.25" copper threaded adapter at the BOTTOM of the tank.  A 1.5" plug leaked as well, but that just required more torque.  Memo to me:  don't be shy with the torque on 1.5" fittings.  The other problem leak is nearby on the return manifold leading to the tank: a sweat coupling is leaking.

It's too tight to cut the pipe at the bottom on the tank with a pipe cutter.  I might go out now and get a better hacksaw.  Coul;d I use my jigsaw with a metal blade?  I suppose square ends are desireable.  I might even try to melt the solder at  the coupling at one end of the pipe and crank it down with a wrench on the other.  Not sure if I can get a good drain out of the pipe though-can't see it.  

The foam insulation on the Energy Tank got wet at the leak. (It consist of 4" of flexible foam covered by a flexible plastic wrap).  Not sure what to do about that.

Right now the tank is draining its 110 gallons.  I wanted to do that anyway.


----------



## velvetfoot

The one at the coupling, I FORGOT TO SWEAT!  Pressure tested.  Looks good.  Filling system now.


----------



## maple1

Ha - I did that trick too, on one fitting. D'oh...


----------



## velvetfoot

System filled to 12 psi.  No leaks, knock on wood.  Had to refill zones (drained by mistake);  took a lot of running the water before bubbles left, and not sure if they all left.
Next up, a couple of loose plumbing ends and then on to electrical!


----------



## Luvmesomesamples

Any update? It's getting cooler outside. Btw I just got done installing my fill and vent pipes and the ground wire is buried on the inside. My installer recommended carefully pulling about 3 inches of wire out and folding it under there fill kit ends in each side to eliminate static. I did but agree probably not necessary. My system we firing up for the first time on Tuesday. Can't wait!


----------



## Luvmesomesamples




----------



## Luvmesomesamples

Disregard the pic of my daughter, ha.


----------



## velvetfoot

That's awesome!  Where are you getting your bulk pellets?  Vincents out of Russia, NY, near Utica I think, said they'd deliver down to me.  I don't think I'll be putting in, or at least filling, the bag this year though.

I'm trying to figure out the electrical and how to lay it out.  I'm making progress.  The wood insert is keeping things cozy.


----------



## Luvmesomesamples

Vermont renewable fuels delivering out of the Rutland mill.  What pellets were thinking?  Pellet quality makes a huge difference.


----------



## Luvmesomesamples




----------



## velvetfoot

I forget what kind.  He told me they were the same as at Home Depot near me last winter.  I don't think the type of pellets are that critical with this boiler.
I see the wire.  The hose I got for the bag load does not have a wire; the vacuum hose to the boiler does.


----------



## Luvmesomesamples

Yea I forgot you have self cleaning with the biowin. I had an accentra insert with an accordion heat exchanger this past year and pellet quality made a huge diff. I would lose a lot of btu after a few days with lower quality pellets due to the Ash acting like insulation on the exchanger.  
I am sure it will be great!


----------



## DBNH22

velvetfoot said:


> I forget what kind.  He told me they were the same as at Home Depot near me last winter.  I don't think the type of pellets are that critical with this boiler.
> I see the wire.  The hose I got for the bag load does not have a wire; the vacuum hose to the boiler does.




I burned mostly MWP pellets and Fireside Ultra last year but also a few bags of other brands such as NEWP, Vermont, Boundary Bay, and a few others.  The Biowin seems to treat them all the same and I did not have any issues with a particular brand nor did any one brand significantly outperform the others.  Right now I have seven tons in the basement for this season.  I have 5 tons of MWP, 1 ton of NEWP and 1 ton of Fireside Ultra.


----------



## velvetfoot

I'm testing the controls on the kitchen counter; so far, so good.
I took some photos of the piping.  Yes, I still have to put in a pipe to the floor for the pressure relief valve, and my sweated joints are very globby.

There was some discussion over where to put the supply connection on the tank.  I made an executive decision to put it on top to maximize storage, (even though it is only a buffer tank); decreased domestic water capacity might be a result, but I can heat the water with the Nyletherm if it becomes an issue.

You can see the inline check valve on the boiler supplies, but there is also a redundant check valve in the B&B flextrol valve on the discharge side of the pellet boiler circ pump. I initially got flextrols for both pellet and oil boiler pumps, but then it wouldn't fit on the oil boiler supply, and THEN I thought about ghost flows, so I put in the check valves closer to the supply manifold; hopefully it'll flow okay.

You can see the Caleffi anti scald valve, mixing valve, and strainer.  I left the air scoop in-thought it might have been an issue changing it out, and got tired of piping-oh well.  

The circ pumps, as well as the zone circs, are B&G Ecocirc Varios.

The floor standing expansion tank, I think 32 gal total, is peeking out from behind the Energy Tank in the last picture; it is connected to the return header, near the  buffer tank.

The boiler drain valve at the top of the Energy Tank proved useful during flushing and filling; I put a Hy Vent up there as well.

The shiny dryer pipe is for the radon fan.

We'll see if it works, at some point!  Back to the electrical...


----------



## JAF

Dana B said:


> Are you doing your install yourself?
> 
> My install only took two days and it was up and running but the legwork/homework prior to that actually took quite a bit of time.  i had to have a SS liner dropped down one of the flues in my chimney.  Finding the right guy to do that and have it done took a few weeks.  Then I had to find a decent plumber who was going to do a quality job without screwing me on the price.  I had to call at least 15 - 20 different plumber sin my area and there were quite a few jokers out there.  The plumber I settled on and had do the job turned out to be a great plumber and I got the job done at a very reasonable price.  Marc met the plumber during the install/commissioning and commented on how knowledgeable he was and that I had picked the right guy to do the job.  My install was the first Biowin he did but I'm pretty sure he's done a few more since mine.  It's too bad you don't live in NH because I'd give you his name.
> 
> Anyhow it's looking like the heating season might be wrapping up in the next 2-3 weeks (finally.)  I'm at slightly under 5 tons burned in a 2400 square foot home so I'll probably end up burning about 5.5 tons give or take a few bags.  I have a spreadsheet I created of my oil use for the past five years and I will probably save somewhere between 35 - 50% over oil this year, most likely somewhere in the middle of that range but I'll know for sure when I'm done heating.



I am looking for a decent plumber and do live in NH --Can you give me the name. I am having trouble getting quotes and always try to get at least 3 quotes. I am considering BioWin, Ketel etc, but it seems the installers are costly and far between for pellet boilers in the Keene area, looking at the Froling etc.


----------



## DBNH22

JAF said:


> I am looking for a decent plumber and do live in NH --Can you give me the name. I am having trouble getting quotes and always try to get at least 3 quotes. I am considering BioWin, Ketel etc, but it seems the installers are costly and far between for pellet boilers in the Keene area, looking at the Froling etc.




I know my plumber won't go to the Keen area because he is in eastern NH.


----------



## velvetfoot

I noticed a problem with the Froling Energy Tank while I was installing the sensors on the sensor bar.  You have to unzip the cover, which is a plastic of some sort, covering a flexible foam insulation(I don't know  the right term, it's like a sponge).  Turns out the foam is all squished to one side underneath the tank.  I must have done that when moving it, but I hadn't noticed, and now it seems to be too late.  My current plan is to blow some great stuff rigid foam under there.  That might be better than the original, but I don't think I'm going to try to take it out.  Maybe look for similar foam, but don't know where.  Maybe a craft store.  

Maybe I'll just stuff some fiberglass in there.


----------



## velvetfoot

I've been testing the "controls" and it looks like it will work.  Here are some pictures.  I will write up what they're supposed to do.


----------



## mustash29

I like your labeling.  That definatley deserves an adult beverage (aka wobbly pop) type of pat on the back.


----------



## velvetfoot

The tank temperature control uses a latching relay scheme as described by ewdudley to make more use of the buffer tank's stored heat and its stratifying potential.  When the tank's bottom controller AND the top controller hit their setpoints - differentials, I'm going to say 155F, a call for heat goes out.  BOTH tanks setpoints, say, 175F, have to be satisfied to stop the call for heat.

The pellet boiler will start, but the pellet circ pump won't start up until the pellet boiler reaches, say, 130F.

When the pellet boiler shuts down, the pellet boiler circ will continue to run for approximately 10 minutes to drain (I call it purge) the heat from the boiler to the buffer tank.

To test If the pellet boiler doesn't start up, like if it ran out of pellets, using a scheme suggested by Dzl_Damon, it will wait about 15 minutes for the pellet boiler to reach, say, 130F.  If it doesn't, it will start the oil boiler and its circ pump.

The water from the manifold, fed by either boiler, will recirculate through the 130F Caleffi 280 ThermoMix valve and then onward to the tank and/or zone circs, if there is a demand for heat.

The zone circs won't start up unless the top of the tank is a certain temp, say, 130F.

I think that's about it.  After I tie up some loose ends, I'll see how the oil burner heats things up and then it'll be on to the pellet boiler.  That's the plan anyway.


----------



## velvetfoot

mustash29 said:


> I like your labeling.  That definatley deserves an adult beverage (aka wobbly pop) type of pat on the back.


I got a label maker for Christmas years ago.  This was the first time I used it!


----------



## PassionForFire&Water

velvetfoot said:


> The tank temperature control uses a latching relay scheme as described by ewdudley to make more use of the buffer tank's stored heat and its stratifying potential.  When the tank's bottom controller AND the top controller hit their setpoints - differentials, I'm going to say 155F, a call for heat goes out.  BOTH tanks setpoints, say, 175F, have to be satisfied to stop the call for heat.
> 
> The pellet boiler will start, but the pellet circ pump won't start up until the pellet boiler reaches, say, 130F.
> 
> When the pellet boiler shuts down, the pellet boiler circ will continue to run for approximately 10 minutes to drain (I call it purge) the heat from the boiler to the buffer tank.
> 
> To test If the pellet boiler doesn't start up, like if it ran out of pellets, using a scheme suggested by Dzl_Damon, it will wait about 15 minutes for the pellet boiler to reach, say, 130F.  If it doesn't, it will start the oil boiler and its circ pump.
> 
> The water from the manifold, fed by either boiler, will recirculate through the 130F Caleffi 280 ThermoMix valve and then onward to the tank and/or zone circs, if there is a demand for heat.
> 
> The zone circs won't start up unless the top of the tank is a certain temp, say, 130F.
> 
> I think that's about it.  After I tie up some loose ends, I'll see how the oil burner heats things up and then it'll be on to the pellet boiler.  That's the plan anyway.



Looks great!

Just one question:
what will happen if the pellet boiler temperature drops back under 130F again (at start-up) ?
What is the differential to cut the circulator?

Looking forward to come over and do the commissioning.


----------



## velvetfoot

PassionForFire&Water said:


> what will happen if the pellet boiler temperature drops back under 130F again (at start-up) ?


If the pellet boiler drops back under 130F, its circ pump won't be allowed to come back on again until the pellet boiler is again above 130.  That Ranco controller, is two stage and there is a timer for each stage.  Stage 1 is the test for if the pellet boiler is indeed cold with a call for heat, and stage 2 only allows the boiler pump to come on if it's more than 130F and then keeps it running for 10 minutes or so after the call for heat is over. The sensor for that Ranco controller is located in the thermowell, which I've sealed with a little electrical penetration sealer putty (clay), but I might change that.



PassionForFire&Water said:


> What is the differential to cut the circulator?


1 degree F.  The controller, stage 2 as noted above, is set at 130, Cooling, Normally Open, with a differential of 1.  So, when it gets to 130, it will close, allow the pellet pump to run, and then when it drops to 129 the contacts will open.



PassionForFire&Water said:


> Looking forward to come over and do the commissioning.


Me too.  I don't think I'll have time to mess with the bin this year, so taking off the vacuum feeder is also on the list.  I will read the install manual first and take pictures of the way it currently is, so I don't forget, lol.


----------



## velvetfoot

Turns out, it doesn't return that gracefully from a power outage.  The timers come on first.  The result is that when power is restored, the pellet pump will run for 10 minutes, whether or not there is a call for heat.  I don't think it's a big deal:  there still is the Caleffi thermomix valve and power outages don't happen all that much.

Hopefully these relays have some longevity to them.  I think I might buy some spares.


----------



## Paste

velvetfoot said:


> Me too.  I don't think I'll have time to mess with the bin this year, so taking off the vacuum feeder is also on the list.  I will read the install manual first and take pictures of the way it currently is, so I don't forget, lol.



The bin and suction probe take about 30 min to setup.  If you have any questions or want photos let me know.  Go vacuum and enjoy months of freedom from hauling pellet bags.


----------



## velvetfoot

I already have 4 tons in bags in the basement and I'm still using a wood insert.  
The main thing is how the tubes will get into the house.  My basement window is on the far side for the hose from the truck, especially in the winter.
The preferred location is problematic because of the way the joists are running and the porch fence.  I'm leaning towards the porch and parallel to the joists, but I'll have to make some 'modifications' to the fence so that the hose can go through.


----------



## velvetfoot

As far as the feed goes, I'm thinking about putting the pellet bag silo in one place and building a rectangular box with a pickup and hoses in another place.  That way, to switch from bulk to  bags, say if I run out and want to bag it, I'd just have to switch some hoses at the vacuum unit.  I'm going to try to take the vacuum unit off today and put on the cover:  we'll see how that goes.

In another note, I managed to take the scrunched up foam from underneath the Froling Energy Tank.  It's about 2" thick.  I tried putting a cut piece of foam back in, but there was no way, with the braces and limited access.  I stuffed fiberglass in there instead.  The Energy Tank has 4" of foam, like a sponge,  around the whole unit (except the bottom), that is covered with a plastic jacket that is held together with a zipper.  It makes it easy to mount external sensors on a rail that is bolted onto the tank.  There is a plastic cap that goes over the top, but that was a little problem too, since I left it off when I put the valves, fittings, etc on top of the tank, and there are only two holes on top of the cover.  I cut a slit in it and managed to get it over the fittings without cracking the cover (which I felt was miraculous since the boiler drain valve and elbow and Hyvent protruded quite a bit.


----------



## velvetfoot

It's not THAT easy to take off the vacuum unit.  I decided to keep it there for now.  It looks like I can feed pellets through the top access cover.  I think I will build a box with a pickup in the middle, probably square, to empty bags in, and work on the bag later.

I started up the oil boiler a little while ago and had it charge up the tank.  Interesting notes:  the top tank sensor got warm, 115f, while the boiler temp was 130, just when the Caleffi is supposed to start opening.  The return line was indeed felt cool that whole time.  Somehow the water was circulating.

Another interesting thing:  with the oil boiler aquastat set at 190 or so, based on the boiler temp gauge which is new (the aquastat did not agree), the tank got to 186 top and 172 bottom when the boiler turned off.  The call for heat continued since both top an bottom were set at 175, and therefore the pump kept running.  I let the pump keep running for a while and there was no change in temperature, except the boiler temperature went down, mostly slowly.  I changed the bottom setpoint to 170 and the heat call and pump went off.  I'm thinking that the boiler aquastat is 15 degrees or so, so the pump might run a long time and the field controls oil flue damper would stay open, losing heat.   I wonder how the pellet boiler will react and whether I should do anything about it, especially since the max temp of the pellet boiler is 176.  

I might pose this situation on another thread.


----------



## PassionForFire&Water

velvetfoot said:


> It's not THAT easy to take off the vacuum unit.  I decided to keep it there for now.  It looks like I can feed pellets through the top access cover.  I think I will build a box with a pickup in the middle, probably square, to empty bags in, and work on the bag later.



On page 26 of the installation manual: you can unscrew the top and bottom inspection panel. Now you can slide the vacuum feed turbine in or out.


----------



## velvetfoot

I think it also said to use two people, lol.  The power and proximity switch cables also must be disconnected at the boiler.  The power disconnects with no problem, but the proximity cable is routed nicely and attaches at the circuit board-I'm not sure how often I want to disconnect those wire from those push in connectors.  Then, it's not exactly light.  I'd have to remember to tape up the flap, and then place it gently on the ground and protect it while it was stored, maybe on the pallet.  With my box concept, I'd be able to dump a ton and a quarter or so into a 4x4x4 box.  If I got the bag silo going, it'd be easier to change the vacuum connections.
That's the way I'm thinking now, anyway.


----------



## velvetfoot

Here's a thread on the buffer tank temps:   https://www.hearth.com/talk/threads/buffer-tank-questions.132489

Bottom line:  tweaking of the tank controller settings will be required to extract the most heat on a charge, and the modulating, lower firing rate of the pellet boiler should help with that.

I think I'm gonna petition to commission!


----------



## velvetfoot

Another observation.  My scheme for checking whether the pellet boiler is firing by observing the pellet boiler's jacket temperature for 20 minutes might not be that great when operating on oil alone, since the buffer tank will continue to be depleted by dhw and the heating zones (down to the 130 top sensor setpoint).  There has to be another way, like a current sensing scheme, that can sense whether the pellet boiler is operational.


----------



## velvetfoot

Well, I thought about building a box, but I'm no carpenter, and I thought I'll wait to do the bag silo, and so, convereted it over to manual.  It was kind of a pain, because it was a little awkward and heavy-ish, and sort of 'adjusted' my back on the way off and down; not too much harm done, and I still plan on playing golf tomorrow.     The hopper didn't have any studs for the grate to mount on in the back, so I drilled a couple of holes and used some screws and nuts to secure it.  The lid also took a little time to install.  I disconnected the AC from the plug and threaded the proximity sensor and cable out of the vacuum unit (that was easiest).  The vacuum turbine unit is on a dolly, out of the way for now. It'd go smoother the second time, but if I switch back to automatic, I'd want to keep it there.  I going to feed it manually for now, until I get the storage bag set up.


----------



## velvetfoot

Here are some pictures.


----------



## velvetfoot

Having some air issues.  It's gonna get to 80 here today, so not too much running in the cards.  The basement is now 68-will have to do some insulation.


----------



## velvetfoot

I looked at what it takes to adjust the baro damper.  The install manual commissioning checklist calls for .1-.15 mbar, which is .04 - .06 inches of water.  I figure .05 is a target.  The Windhager baro damper has a sticker on it that says each millimeter from the weight bracket  to the weight equals 1 pascal.  So, for .05 in. of water, the distance should be 12.45 mm.  That's what I set the weight to using a digital caliper.  

There is a plugged hole on the flue collar for a manometer probe, picture below.  The plug is just a flattish piece of metal held on by a clip (not airtight or anything).  I have an inexpensive digital manometer coming in the mail.  

I will measure the draft, but if the baro damper is set correctly as per the directions, I'm not sure what measuring the draft will do, except for verification, or that it's really wild and crazy.  There is a history of downdraft in the basement, so I hope everything will work as it should.


----------



## velvetfoot

First fire tonight, now on its pre-commissioning shakedown run!  Very quiet.  Some control tweaks still needed.  Must put insulation on pipes: waiting for elbows to arrive.


----------



## velvetfoot

I've sent this as an email to Marc, who's been very helpful, and I thought I'd also put it here for posterity:

I just charged up the tank.  It does take a while to do. 

I set the boiler protection pump controller at 135.  With the original (cooling) differential of 1, the pump was turning on and off a lot.  I felt sorry for it, even though it probably isn't a problem, and set the differential to 5.  

The tank controller was set at 175 top and 165 bottom.  It actually got to 176/165 with a boiler temp of 177.  I set the differential to 10.  I can see a problem with the sensor location at top, the warmup time of the pellet boiler, along with a demand for heat.  I set the circ pumps at 135/5 like the boiler protection. 

The ten minute heat drain period worked as envisioned.  It didn't seem to have that much of an effect on boiler or tank temps. 

The pellet function test module is set at 115 within 20 minutes.  The boiler probably will slowly cool, but maybe there should be a hurry to start the oil boiler.  I did notice that if it does go on, once the temp is over 115 the oil burner turns off.  I noticed the flue temperature didn't get much over 220 F, which is the max temp. for the Ranco controller, and the IR gun on the black single wall flue increaser section showed something like 183, so maybe that sensor could be used on there.  I just checked and the boiler temp is at 179 (increased) while the flue temp is down to 163.  I'm leaning towards giving it a try instead of using another controller with a thermocouple. 

I experimented with the pump speed.  It didn't seem to make that much difference, so I have it at about in the middle of the range.

Oh, I put in 6 more bags before I started.  8 bags is a really tight fit, lol.


----------



## PassionForFire&Water

Wonderful!

Just so you understand, from now on it will get very boring.
There is really noting to watch with the BioWIN, besides it collecting dust.

More time for playing golf, or mini golf in winter.


----------



## velvetfoot

I'll still be fiddling with the tank and pellets out sensors.  I'm thinking I don't have enough headroom with the high top sensor mounting on the tank and that the bottom sensor might be useless because the delta T with the top is so low and the top sensor measures close to the boiler temperature.  I'm still looking for a way to detect pellets out.  

I am becoming a basement dweller.

It's a smooth running machine, for sure.


----------



## velvetfoot

I'm watching another buffer tank load cycle.  Hey, this is what I do now.    I mounted a couple Azel temp sensors on the tank to measure intermediate temps, between top and bottom. I have to say, I'm not seeing much stratification on loading.  The tank top started at 165 or so, and then dropped like a stone to 145 when the thermomix valve opening and the pump running more.  The boiler pump is cycling nicely:  boiler temp 140 comes on, 135 shuts off.  There're no other head loads at the moment, just the tank.  

I'm still thinking of using only one sensor maybe 1/3 of the way down.  That way the tank will get charged to about the same amount, and there will be some more heat left on top to circulate.  Not sure though.  More 'research' required.

It feels like I'm talking to myself, but in my circle, nobody wants to talk about this.


----------



## velvetfoot

I've been spending a lot of time in the basement, lol.
I did indeed take out one of the tank sensors and relocated the one remeaining to about one third down.
Things seem to be running just fine.
The tank got charged til that sensor was 175.  The boiler was modulating at 30% for only a couple of minutes.  Right after the tank heat call was satisfied the pellet boiler was at 179, (it reallly only goes to 176), and after the ten minute heat drain run of the pump, the boiler got down to 177 or so which was the final temp. of the tank sensor.

Questions are, will I need to bump up the output from 10kw to 15kw (dip switch) when it gets cold?  Maybe how to do oil boiler takeover when out of pellets-I think my current temp method should work well enough though.

Life is good.  I always love it when things work out, knock on wood.


----------



## PassionForFire&Water

I would suggest to leave it at 10 kW.
Also, I do remember you have a lot of seasoned firewood sitting in your yard.
You will need to get rid of that also.
So keep this firewood for the real cold days, in the event the BioWIN100 does not keep up.


----------



## velvetfoot

Marc,

Yep, have to burn wood as well, but we like burning wood too!

Are there advantages to running it at 10kw rather than 15kw?  Is it the modulating aspect-running for longer periods of time?  Does the buffer tank enter the mix?  It does take a pretty long time to charge the buffer tank at the current 10kw setting, with only a smidgeon of 30% modulation.


----------



## heaterman

Here's a tip to keep your run times longer on the Windhager when piped into a storage vessel of some type. 
Set the Windhager control at 155-160* and then set your tank aquastat at 165-175 or there abouts.
The Windhager will see the temp coming up to its internal setpoint but still see a call for heat from the tank aquastat as it over shoots where it is set. This causes it to throttle down and reduce output but still remain in modulation mode. The tank temp will gradually creep up to the set point and shut things down when it hit the 165-175 setting. The Windhager gets a nice long burn and you enjoy maximum efficiency.


----------



## velvetfoot

Thanks!  I had noticed that it modulated right down to 30% when the BioWin controller was intially set at 167.  At the time I didn't have any insulation on the pipes, and it seemed like it didn't shut off-only heat the basement, lol.  Since it's been at 176, it'll modulate down to 70% or so right before it shuts off.  It still takes a fairly long time (an hour and a quarter maybe) to get the tank up to temperature.

Could you explain why have long, modulated burns like that is good a good thing?  Could creosote become an issue?  I can see too many stop/starts being bad, and I can see a quick reaction time on the boiler's part if there is a heat draw because it doesn't have to go through the ignition stage.  Could even better support a wider tank differential on the setpoint (I have it at 25 right now, and will keep it there for now).  I'm just worried that more hours is good for it.

I'll try it.  Tank at 175, (25 diff), boiler at 160.

Thanks much.  Any more BIoWin tips gratefully welcomed, or maybe start another thread for more visibility.

Hey, I got my first alarm for low pellets.  I think the reserve may be around 2 bags.


----------



## velvetfoot

I set both boiler and external parameters to 165.


----------



## heaterman

velvetfoot said:


> I set both boiler and external parameters to 165.




You can leave the boiler max at 175 or whatever. The external demand temp is what you want to change.  

Is it cold enough to burn there? We have an absolutely perfect late fall day going here. About 60, bright sun not a cloud in the sky.


----------



## velvetfoot

Yeah.  Your weather finally came this-a-way.  We played golf today.

We're also using it for dhw at this point, but mostly testing, and getting the air out of the lines, lol.


----------



## velvetfoot

Today I restored the original dual tank temp. sensor setup.  I think it will be more flexible. 
I noticed that if I set the tank temp., down 1/3, to 179, it would actually get there without shutting down, and not too much modulation at minimum.
I set the top and bottom sensors this evening to 150/175.  Naturally, I fell asleep on the couch, but when I went down there, it did appear that 175 was indeed achieved in the bottom with 179 at the top.  I'll have to monitor a cycle more closely to see if it can be tweaked more.


----------



## velvetfoot

Watching a cycle this morning it looks like the max it'll get to is 182/171 before the boiler shuts itself off while the call for heat (and pump) is still on.  The running pump acts to remove heat as well, and the tank temp goes up while it runs, so it could maybe have been used instead of the ten minute timer.  I wll try to set the bottom at 168.


----------



## velvetfoot

Put up a pellet storage box for the bagged pellets:
https://www.hearth.com/talk/threads/built-a-pellet-storage-box.134840/

Have to figure out timing of reload.


----------



## velvetfoot

I have abandoned the installation of the 3 ton bag silo.  I drilled a couple of pilot holes through the rim joist, and apparently the concrete for the porch floor is up against it, because the holes came out very close to the floor.  I took it as a sign and gave up.  Silo, flexible pipe, cam lock fill fittings, and clamps are now for sale.


----------



## Deering

Are you just going to stick with the box system?  Or come up with some other form of bulk storage/delivery?


----------



## velvetfoot

I think I'm just going to stick with the box for now.
I've thought about taking a shop vac and grafting in to the top lid, so that the box becomes a big shop vac.  I still have to string hoses though.  

I think I'll just get the 8 tons, or whatever ultimately I'd need for pellets only plus reserve, into the basement the old fashioned way:  garden tractor and trailor, restack on pallets, move with pallet jack.


----------



## Deering

My similar bin works well, but possibly in the future I'll construct a much larger bin, maybe 4-5 tons, along the exterior of my garage, then tie it into the boiler in the same fashion.  This would make it simpler to have several pallets of pellets delivered right next to the bin, which I could then hand-load with minimum hassle, and it would hold an entire winter's supply.  And I'd be well positioned if we ever have commercial bulk delivery here.


----------



## velvetfoot

It'd have to look good since it'd be visible from the front of the house.


----------



## Deering

Sure.  Side it and trim it to match your house.  Slope the top of it at the same pitch as your house roof.  It'll look like it belonged there.


----------



## velvetfoot

Well, I turned it down to 10 kw just now with the dip switch, realizing that the switch likely only has x number of operations in it, lol.
Interesting that the hours to clean increased from 1259 to 1839.  Things happen more slowly, which on low load use is what I'm shooting for I guess.
Also interesting that the vacuum unit kicked on during startup;  it's done that several times when starting up from power off.


----------



## velvetfoot

I modified the controls so that either boiler is started by a two stage Ranco controller and made to continue to operate until either boiler ceases to operate as evidenced by the oil burner for the oil boiler, and the induced draft fan for the pellet boiler.   It's the cat's meow! 
More here:
https://www.hearth.com/talk/threads/tweaking-the-biowins-buffer-tank.134134/page-3#post-1849355


----------



## velvetfoot

The burnout time is 13 minutes.  The pellet boiler pump is running during that time.


----------



## velvetfoot

The tank regularly gets to 179 now.


----------



## velvetfoot

I just topped up the pellet box because the suction terminal was exposed:  it took 41 bags.  The pellets were not disturbed.  So 41 bags is the usable capacity, without disturbing the pellets, divided by a total capacity of 55 = 75%


----------



## NE Poultry Supply

Dana B said:


> I know my plumber won't go to the Keen area because he is in eastern NH.


I am looking for a local installer.  Would you give me the name/number of the plumber you liked?


----------



## Sparky978

velvetfoot said:


> The sensor for that Ranco controller is located in the thermowell, which I've sealed with a little electrical penetration sealer putty (clay), but I might change that.



Velvet 
I used this heat conductive compound from Honeywell. I put the Ranco probe inside the well and packed this compound so that there was no air space. I was told it would give me more accurate readings. Just thought I would mention it.


----------



## velvetfoot

I considered that, but the mfr. didn't do it with its sensor which is in the same thermowell.  Plus, it might make it easier to take stuff out of it without the glop.  My reasoning, anyway.


----------



## velvetfoot

For this season I am trying it at the 10 KW setting.  That's a little weak for the real cold days, but looking at last year's testing (no wood, -2F temps) on the Ecobee thermostat data, it seems that the boiler might hold the temperature, if not too much recovery from a setback was required. With the insert running, keeping up shouldn't be a problem. 

I have the oil boiler set up to be switched on by thermostat as stage 2 when there is a three degree difference between actual and set temp, AND, if a Ranco controller sensing outside temperature says it's cold enough for it: 5F currently.  So, the oil boiler will run until actual room temp gets to within setpoint differential, currently .5F or its aquastat is satisfied.  

Testing has shown that even with stage 2 still calling, the oil boiler will drop out before the pellet boiler, so that's a good thing since the pellet boiler will continue to run to supply heat.  If, room temp drops to 3F below setpoint, and it's still cold, the oil boiler will fire up again.


----------



## velvetfoot

For my own benefit, mostly I guess, here are the current settings:

Max Pellet Boiler Output  10kW
Max Set Temp  176
Ext Htg Rqt  170
Tank,1/3 From Top-Pellet Boiler Start  135
Tank, 1/3 From Top-Oil Boiler Start  133
PB Circ Pump Min Temp  130
Tank, Top-Zone Pumps Min Temp  130
Thermostat Differential  .5
Stage 2 Delta T  3


----------



## velvetfoot

A friend took this panoramic image:


----------



## velvetfoot

Recent changes:
-closed off autofill since boilers get isolated from tank by the protection valve, leading to incremental addition of makeup water which led to a relief valve actuation.
-approx 6 minutes run of oil boiler pump after shutdown to scavenge heat.
-added ranco with sensor on oil supply line to allow heat to be removed from tank to zones while boiler is warming up
-moved honeywell sensor for 3 way mixing valve to right after the valve rather than downstream of the zone returns. 
--- This is working quite well.  No more oscillations after a short-lived slug of cool water gets introduced.  Finer control.  Doesn't take into account the returns, but close enough.  Currently have return at 165.


----------

