# Outdoor Biomax 60 installation complete (pictures attached)



## termite (Dec 26, 2007)

Wrapped up installation and fired her up last night.  Fired for about 4 1/2 hours and got the tank temp to 120 degrees at 2/3 from the bottom, 90 degrees on the very bottom.  I don't yet have a thermistor on the very top of the tank but its real hot to the touch.  Steca 301 controls tank charging pump.  Tank is equipped with headers top and bottom.  Tank charging and retrieval flows are reversed via a 4 way mixing valve.  Tekmar 153 controls the boiler return temp.  When boiler pump stops at end of firing the boiler loop mixing valve automatically isolates the boiler loop and the tank flow reverses to retrieve heat from tank.


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## Eric Johnson (Dec 26, 2007)

Beautiful setup, termite. As I recall, you have a big steel tank for storage, and your boiler is in an outbuilding.


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## termite (Dec 26, 2007)

Yes, 1200 gallon pressurized.  Both the boiler and tank in the outbuilding.  I'm going to wall off the tank and insulate (heavily) after I'm sure I have no leaks.


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## Eric Johnson (Dec 26, 2007)

What are you doing for an expansion tank, termite?


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## termite (Dec 26, 2007)

Expansion tank is a cash acme TV-160 (acceptance volume of 64 gallons).  It's hidden behind the boiler in the photo.  Its connected to the tap on the bottom of the air scoop.  Since the boiler loop is isolated from the rest of the system when it isn't circulating I also tee'd it into the storage tank.  I couldn't find any examples of tying a single tank to multiple locations in a system (worried about a short circuit) but I did it anyway.


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## Eric Johnson (Dec 26, 2007)

I think pressure is pressure. As long as it has access to the tank, I don't see why it wouldn't work.

I did the same thing you did with the tee. The only potential problem I could see is that you need an isolation valve somewhere so that you can drain one side and not the other. And you're not supposed to be able to isolate expansion, but most installations that I've seen have a valve right ahead of the tank so that you can easily isolate it for service, anyway. Amounts to the same thing, I guess. What I eventually wound up doing was putting an Extrol 60 on both sides. Since I had a spare, it was no big deal. In your case, obviously, you'd want to put the smaller tank on the boiler side of the equation.


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## termite (Dec 26, 2007)

I thought about using a small tank at the scoop and plumbing the big tank low on the storage tank to keep the temperature down on the big expensive tank.  For various and likely wrong reasons I thought it would be best to keep the pressure the same across the system.  Not to mention I didn't want to tell my better half that all I need is one more part (for the hundredth time).


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## leaddog (Dec 26, 2007)

Very nice. I bet that your boiler room is really toasty with out all the pipes being insulated. And that Tank is one big radiator. I think you made a wise move not insulating untill you have run it up to temp for a short time as the change in temp does strange things and it's a pain to take all the insulation off to fix things. 
leaddog


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## termite (Dec 26, 2007)

leaddog,
Very toasty indeed.  I have a bunch of that black foam stuff you see on the feed water line.  For the tank I have 2.5"x4'x8' sheets of log cabin roof insulation and R33 fiberglass batts.  Do you have any suggestions on a radiant barrier (material, placement) for the tank?


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## leaddog (Dec 26, 2007)

termite said:
			
		

> leaddog,
> Very toasty indeed.  I have a bunch of that black foam stuff you see on the feed water line.  For the tank I have 2.5"x4'x8' sheets of log cabin roof insulation and R33 fiberglass batts.  Do you have any suggestions on a radiant barrier (material, placement) for the tank?


I'm no expert so I hope Nofossel jumps in as he has done more in this area but I think I would rap the tank with foil/bubble/foil  first to cut the radiant. or even just foil, Then put the rest of the insulation. It's interesting that you are getting good stratification in your tank while you are heating it. I thought you might not because of the turbulance.
I helped my bil tear out a bunch of copper from a store that they were selling to be completely remodeled and I took off the insulation. some of the stuff is 1-1/2in thick as it came off the freezer compressors. Also some was for 2in copper so I put that over some of the small insulation you buy in the stores. It really makes a difference. I wish I had saved a bunch of the copper as we sold it for scrap. Alot of it was long lenghts but then the $2500 was nice. We only had 2 days so had to work fast. I didn't know I had the boiler project comming up at that time.
leaddog


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## Eric Johnson (Dec 26, 2007)

I reuse fittings all the time. The only thing going in my scrap bucket is the stuff mangulated beyond repair.


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## termite (Dec 26, 2007)

leaddog,
Stratification is due to the headers in the tank.  The tank has a 12"x16" manway.  I welded up some 1-1/4" standpipes and fitted them through 2" bungs on the top and bottom of the tank.  After watching what I ate for two days I crawled into the tank and put elbows and 6 1/2' long headers on each of the standpipes.  Heat is delivered through the top header which is located about 3" from the top of the tank.  Retrieval is accomplished through the same upper header by reversing flow.  Headers are capped on the ends and have a series of (27) 3/8" holes drilled along their length getting closer together as they approach the capped end.


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## Donl (Dec 26, 2007)

Congratulations Termite on the successful startup of your heating system.  By any chance do you have a diagram of your setup that you could post? I am way down on the learning curve path and I am studying the pictures you have posted. A diagram would help me sort things out.


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## termite (Dec 26, 2007)

Don L,
I have a diagram of the plumbing and a schematic of the electrical.  I don't have either with me now.  I need to reverse the leads for one of the actuator motors on the schematic.  I posted a rough version of the plumbing diagram in an earlier thread.  I have since simplified the reversible flow plumbing for the storage tank.  I'll fix that and add the plumbing for the expansion tank and post them to this thread tonight or tomorrow.


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## henfruit (Dec 26, 2007)

what size pipe did you use from the boiler room to the house? how much time do you expect to get off the tank?


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## termite (Dec 26, 2007)

henfruit,
Pex is a little over 1.25 ID so I suspect its listed as 1 1/2".  I'm hoping for 10-12 heat reserve in tank at 35,000 btu/hr into radiant floor.  Way more if everything goes right.


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## jklingel (Dec 26, 2007)

Noting to say. I just want to be attached so I can be notified when the pics are posted. Looks like a very well made setup. Congrats on the nice work, esp since it WORKS. j


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## brad068 (Dec 26, 2007)

termite said:
			
		

> leaddog,
> Very toasty indeed. I have a bunch of that black foam stuff you see on the feed water line. For the tank I have 2.5"x4'x8' sheets of log cabin roof insulation and R33 fiberglass batts. Do you have any suggestions on a radiant barrier (material, placement) for the tank?



termite, 
High E and I were throwing around the idea of surrounding our tanks with sand then insulate the walls really good. I believe garn uses vermiculite to insulate there tanks. We are thinking that the sand would absorb some heat and then radiate back into the tank. I read somewhere that soil can absorb and release heat twice as fast as water. Theory is more heat storage.


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## Eric Johnson (Dec 27, 2007)

Dry soil?

I like the sand idea. Plenty of that where you are.

Vermiculite is going to run some bucks with a tank that big. Same thing with perlite. Have you seen the pic of his tank, Garnification? It's pretty impressive. I guess you know what a 1,300 gallon tank looks like. I like the manhole. What's the inside of that tank like, termite? What did it contain before?

I really appreciate you guys posting these pics of your projects. It's great how everyone is doing something a little different. When I was shopping for gasifiers last year at this time, there was basically nothing independent on the EKO, other than a few dead threads at the Mother Earth News site, and then they shut it down for maintenance. Now we've got people using at least five different brands and a couple of pretty impressive homemade rigs that anyone who wants information can interact with.


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## leaddog (Dec 27, 2007)

Garnification said:
			
		

> termite said:
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## brad068 (Dec 27, 2007)

leaddog said:
			
		

> Garnification said:
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> ...


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## leaddog (Dec 27, 2007)

I really think you should look for a second tank and use it for more storage. The sand really was slow and didn't tranfer either way very fast. I had a plate for the top of the fire box and then I had a copper heatexchanger on that to move the heat up thru the sand. The pvc was about 8in above the plate so you didn't melt it. They stressed SMALL fires but I wanted more heat and over fired it and the pvc bulged out the size of a softball in places where the heat moved faster. The sand just wouldn't move it fast enough. I had to shut it down in the middle of winter and the center of the sand was still over 50f in the spring so you can see the heat didn't move very fast. Plus the sand was a pain to work with when I tried to repair it and I had to take it all out by hand. Water is so much easier to work with.
leaddog


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## Eric Johnson (Dec 27, 2007)

Vermiculite is a pain to work with as well. Not to mention, potentially a health hazard.


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## Bartman (Dec 27, 2007)

Termite, a beautiful job, congrats! The use of the weatherproof breaker panel enclosure looks like it works well. The plumbing looks great too. The best of luck to you on it's performance, now you're required to keep everyone posted on it's progress.


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## brad068 (Dec 27, 2007)

Eric Johnson said:
			
		

> Dry soil?
> 
> I like the sand idea. Plenty of that where you are.
> 
> ...



 I just looked back and seen termite's tank.  It looks alot like the tank that High e built his boiler out of.  It had a tag on it ( 100psi @ 650*f)  No capacity tag. But calc. it to @ 2100gal.  It has convex ends and has a .375" wall thickness.  I had numerous bungs and flanges welded on it with a manway access too.  After looking at  termites setup, I can't help but wonder why didn't he just buy a Garn.  You were building a seperate shed to house the buffer tank anyway and you could of eliminated some of the piping and pump.  "Simple is better" - High E.


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## Eric Johnson (Dec 27, 2007)

Oh you Garn guys have really got religion. I admire that. I suspect termite got himself a really good "cold war downdraft boiler" and a pretty cool, discrete storage tank to boot, for less than the retail on your favorite boiler, and had fun installing it all himself, to boot.


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## termite (Dec 27, 2007)

Here's the plumbing diagram I promised Don L.  I'll post the electrical schematic tomorrow.
Eric, I'm not sure what was in the tank before but it has a concrete lining.  I think it was a boiler blowdown tank.
Garnification, I agree simple is better.  I tried to make it as simple as possible and still provide the functionality I wanted.  In retrospect I probably should have looked a little harder at a Garn considering the time and money I have invested.  Oh well.  Did High E's tank have the manway cover?  I had to fabricate one.


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## brad068 (Dec 27, 2007)

Eric Johnson said:
			
		

> Oh you Garn guys have really got religion. I admire that. I suspect termite got himself a really good "cold war downdraft boiler" and a pretty cool, discrete storage tank to boot, for less than the retail on your favorite boiler, and had fun installing it all himself, to boot.



 You know,  I think if you downdrafters were to install and operate a Garn, I think you guys would have to get a second job with all of the free time you will have on your hands.  just kiddin'.   I asked this question before but don't remember if I got an answer.  What is the life expentancy of the nozzle and secondary refractory of the downdrafters.  According to a Tarm dealer, he said that they recommend nozzle replacement after 4-5 years.  Is this true for other downdrafters?  I seen a Tarm solo 40 in service.  It has a nice fit and finish and burns clean and quiet.  But after seeing and hearing a Garn burn, its like comparing a cutting torch to a Big lighter. Amen!


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## termite (Dec 27, 2007)

Don L, Here is the control schematic.


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## Eric Johnson (Dec 27, 2007)

They say you get five years out of a nozzle in an EKO. They cost $50 each to replace. My boiler has two.


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## termite (Dec 27, 2007)

Some tank photos for your viewing pleasure.  Manway cover is made of 1/2" steel and 3/4" bolts.  It seems to be holding up pretty well.  There is no measurable deflection or leaks at 18psi and full fill.  I haven't heated the tank up all the way but it works well so far.  Also shown are the manifolds I installed in the tank.


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## Eric Johnson (Dec 27, 2007)

Howdja like to be the guy who skimmed that layer of cement in there? I bet that gives you a little more storage mass. Neutralize your water, too.

What does that tank weigh?


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## termite (Dec 27, 2007)

Eric,
I'm not sure what it weighs.  It's very heavy.  The lining is built up to about 3/4".  I left the sheathing off the back of the building and pulled it up into the building with a block and tackle stretched across the creek to a large tree (1/2" cable, double block, ratcheting come along, long day).  I hope the lining helps.


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## Eric Johnson (Dec 27, 2007)

I gotta give you credit for having the coolest boiler room, termite.


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## Donl (Dec 27, 2007)

termite said:
			
		

> Here's the plumbing diagram I promised Don L.  I




Thanks for the diagram!  Much appreciated.


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## termite (Dec 30, 2007)

Some observations on firing:
 I seen in an earlier thread that reihart was getting a "FUEL" message on his RK-2001U controller during fires.  Same here.  The controller was set by default to check that the boiler has reached operating temp within one hour of starting.  If it doesn't you will get the "FUEL" message and fans will stop.  Also it will give the "FUEL" message if, after reaching operating temp, the boiler drops back below it and stays there for 30 minutes.  Both of these conditions are likely if you are charging a tank.  I set both of these values in the controller to 4hrs and get no more fuel messages.  Boiler just keeps on cranking.  Thought you guys who are talking about getting one of these for your EKO's might like to know this.  
 Other than that this thing is a beast so far.  I built a wood/coal fire yesterday that kept the boiler between 173-192 degrees for hours.  The fan cover is off the boiler in the photo so I can get the fan dialed in.  I have the tank at 145 on the bottom and 165 2/3 the way up.  I'm going put another thermistor on the very top of the tank and insulate it today if I can stand the heat.


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## Eric Johnson (Dec 30, 2007)

Yeah, that's a pretty big radiator you've got heating your boiler room.

I found on my EKO that the factory air settings were all too low for my situation. I was getting wispy smoke beyond startup at times. Opening up the secondary air valves a few turns solved that problem. Now it doesn't even smoke during idle most of the time.

Have you run a wood-fired boiler before, termite? I remain amazed at the difference. With the extra heat, it's almost like having a new house.


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## wdc1160 (Dec 30, 2007)

Termite,

Nice looking setup. I have a question.  I think the TV-160 holds 80 gal,  but you said you had a 60 gal E-tank.  In one diagram it show a 96 gal E-tank.  What expansion tank are U using?  Sorry to ask the same question twice, but I am easily confused?


Bill


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## termite (Dec 30, 2007)

Eric,
This is my first experience with a gasification boiler.  I've been showing it to my friends who still have OWB's.  They are blown away by the fact that even when burning coal there is no smoke.  I haven't idled much yet.  Lots of heat.
ABGWD4U,
Yes, its a Cash-Acme TV-160.  Their spec sheet lists it a having 96gal capacity with 64 gallons of acceptance volume.


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## Donl (Dec 30, 2007)

I have been looking at the Steca 301 Manual that is being used to monitor temperature on the 1200 gallon tank. Can the Max temp of 140 set at the factory be changed?  If so how.   Nice boiler setup Termite!


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## begreen (Dec 31, 2007)

That's a mighty awesome project termite. It's great to see this thread. The documentation and photo accompaniment for these installations must be a first for the internet. It's inspiring. Makes me want to hook up a boiler just to play with all those pipes again. Keep up the good works folks!


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## Eric Johnson (Dec 31, 2007)

We're a dedicated bunch, BG. Wish this forum existed when I was shopping for a gasifier last year. I'm amazed at all the interest we've seen since getting the Boiler Room going. Apparently there was some pent-up demand for information in this department. I't great to be able to compare notes with other owners from all over the country running different kinds of equipment.

Did your BIL ever get a boiler? I think you said he was considering one.


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## Donl (Dec 31, 2007)

Eric Johnson said:
			
		

> We're a dedicated bunch, BG. Wish this forum existed when I was shopping for a gasifier last year. I'm amazed at all the interest we've seen since getting the Boiler Room going. Apparently there was some pent-up demand for information in this department. I't great to be able to compare notes with other owners from all over the country running different kinds of equipment.
> .




This group has been an indispensable source of knowledge for me. Where else are there knowledgeable people so willing to show and tell all in an area that is not so well understood by many. My background has been electronics, computer hardware, and network design. I don't have any experience with boilers, pump, piping etc. I do hope that once I have learned enough to get my boiler up and running well I will have learned enough to help others on this form who are in the same position I am in now.


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## begreen (Dec 31, 2007)

Eric Johnson said:
			
		

> We're a dedicated bunch, BG. Wish this forum existed when I was shopping for a gasifier last year. I'm amazed at all the interest we've seen since getting the Boiler Room going. Apparently there was some pent-up demand for information in this department. I't great to be able to compare notes with other owners from all over the country running different kinds of equipment.
> 
> Did your BIL ever get a boiler? I think you said he was considering one.



Yeah, it's neat to see the energy here. I have sent a couple friends over to learn before designing and installing. 

My BIL solved his problems for now, so he is sticking with his current setup. I've told him about the forum and hope he'll join in and contribute.


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## Eric Johnson (Dec 31, 2007)

I should have said "the world" instead of "the country," Don. My apologies to our Canadian members and anyone else--anywhere else--who is into alternative central heat. It would be nice to get some English-speaking Poles and Czechs and Danes, Finns, Swedes and others who know a lot more about this stuff than we do, to participate. And can't forget the Germans and Austrians.


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## termite (Dec 31, 2007)

Don L said:
			
		

> I have been looking at the Steca 301 Manual that is being used to monitor temperature on the 1200 gallon tank. Can the Max temp of 140 set at the factory be changed?  If so how.


Don L,
Yes the Steca 301's maximum T2 (bottom of tank) sensor temp is 205 degrees.  It's programmable via the three buttons on the front.


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## Nofossil (Dec 31, 2007)

termite said:
			
		

> leaddog,
> Very toasty indeed.  I have a bunch of that black foam stuff you see on the feed water line.  For the tank I have 2.5"x4'x8' sheets of log cabin roof insulation and R33 fiberglass batts.  Do you have any suggestions on a radiant barrier (material, placement) for the tank?



Radiant barrier requires an air gap, ideally with a low emissivity material on both sides of the gap. 3/4" is pretty near ideal for gap width, and aluminum foil is about as good as it gets for low emissivity material. On a vertical surface, you need some horizontal baffles to break up the convection currents that will otherwise form. You want your radiant barrier at the points with the greatest temperature differential - right at the tank and right at the outside, most likely. The foil needs to be protected from moisture, though, or it will get chalky and not work any more.

I bought a commercial restaurant aluminum foil roll from Costco. 3M makes a spray adhesive that you can get at auto part stores that's awesome for attaching aluminum foil to flat surfaces.

I used strips of foam as spacers on my flat surfaces. On curved surfaces, I used bubble wrap with the bubbles facing the foil.

Foil faced foam board with air gaps works great, too. The secret is making sure that there is no air flow through the gap - you don't want to make little chimneys that convect heat out of your insulation. Seal tops and bottoms aggressively.

It's also really important to control evaporation, or that will not only carry heat away, but also condense inside your insulation and get it wet and thermally conductive. I threw some wax on the surface and floated a sheet of EPDM on that, caulked to the tank lip.

I finally got hard data. My tank is outdoors, and loses about 1 degree per day per 100 degrees temperature difference (water to outside air). Hope you do even better.


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## Eric Johnson (Dec 31, 2007)

That's a pressurized tank he's got there, nofossil. I don't think evaporation is going to be a problem.


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## termite (Jan 1, 2008)

Thanks for the insulation tips nofossil.  I'm about half way through insulating now.  Thankfully I've applied some of what you suggested.  The tank is in a building with 2x6 R19 walls and R49 in ceiling above tank.  Inside the building, around the tank, I'm putting 2.5" thick log cabin roof insulation on the walls.  I put foil on one wall where there would be a gap to the insulation.  On the top of the tank I have a layer of R30 then a layer of the silver hvac bubble wrap then another layer of R30 on top of that.  On the sides and bottom of the tank I intend to put R19 against tank, then hvac bubble wrap, then the log cabin insulation.  I'm walling off the tank from the boiler to make it easier to insulate.  Do you think all this will keep it hot?


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## Seyiwmz (Jan 1, 2008)

Termite,,, I'm a believer.  I think that tank will be hot and stay hot.  I think you could launch it to outer space and it would survive the re-entry into our atmosphere.  Nice job,,, well done.....  Seyiwmz


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## Nofossil (Jan 1, 2008)

Sounds good - only time will tell. The standard R and U value calculations don't apply very well and don't take radiant loss into account. Seems like you hav a pretty comprehensive insulation system in place. I'd be very interested to see the data on heat loss.


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