# Scandanavian Stoves.



## Mr Morso. (Dec 17, 2018)

Hi

thanks for allowing me on the Forum.

Hi everybody, I'm British but spend a most of my time in the winter in Denmark buying secondhand woodburners which I refurbish & take back to the UK to resell. 

I started in the UK but found the superior stoves to be readily available in Denmark.

I'm thinking of moving into the US market & was wondering what was desirable, valuable & basically worth shipping to the US?

I have access to all stoves, from antique to modern. Mostly Morso but also Scan, Rais, Hwam all the Danish stove manufacturers. Also Contura & Jotul are available.

Any advice, questions etc would be greatly welcomed & appreciated.  

Again thanks for allowing me to post here & look forward to any feedback I might get.


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## bholler (Dec 17, 2018)

Mr Morso. said:


> Hi
> 
> thanks for allowing me on the Forum.
> 
> ...


I will allow this post but be aware you can't use this site to advertize.  This isn't quite that but it's close.


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## Mr Morso. (Dec 17, 2018)

Hi

wasn't trying to advertise. And if it appears that way well I apologise. Was just looking for good ole advice.


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## bholler (Dec 17, 2018)

Mr Morso. said:


> Hi
> 
> wasn't trying to advertise. And if it appears that way well I apologise. Was just looking for good ole advice.


And that's fine.  No problem


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## peakbagger (Dec 18, 2018)

I expect its a niche market. Many insurance companies in the US require a listed stove so if the units are old enough not to have a rating plate then fewer folks will want them. I dont know if there is particular market for old European woodstoves (although I must admit I have a couple of Jotuls in storage). Unless you are getting them for scrap price, by the time you refurb the unit and ship it, I dont know how much margin you have. Generally if folks have to pay much over $1,000 they are going to buy a new EPA stove rather than a refurb. On occasion I see a few private dealers who do refurb old Jotuls and they tend to be on the market for quite awhile. Note some areas of the US require EPA rated stoves and dont allow the installation of ued  non rated stoves. 

The exception might be wood cookstoves, there really are not a lot of small cookstoves on the market in the US except for utilitarian beasts that dont fit in an average house. Cookstoves are EPA exempt.  There are some imports, like Esse but they tend to very pricey. Small stoves like my Jotul 404 will fit in a cabin or smaller house. I dont know the depth of the market but I ran into someone who picks up 404s, cleans them up and resells them to interior decorators for the Boston market.

A general comment is how is your general familiarity with the US? Maybe you have visited but the scale of the country is lot bigger so the logistics of running a business selling heavy bulky objects is more difficult.Over the years I frequently have found great stoves located beyond driving distance  but the logistics of getting them shipped means I dont buy them as the seller is unwilling to package them and get them shipped which can cost a minimum of $300. Inevitably to service a large market, the stoves would need to be trucked by freight and that means packaging them on a pallet so they dont get damaged and having the customer have the capability to receive pallet shipments (few do). Ideally you would import to central location and then ship to dealers but then you need to give them their cut.


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## Mr Morso. (Dec 19, 2018)

Thanks for your informative & thought provoking comments.

I appreciate that the US is geographically large. Interesting that you brought up the subject of cooking stoves. I do occasionally come across Morso cooking stoves. Have uploaded image so your opinion would be much appreciated. I have access to EPA approved stoves so that is not a deal breaker & I'm not to fussed about giving a few crumbs to dealers.

Again thanks for your informative post & look forward to your response.


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## Connecticut Yankee (Dec 19, 2018)

There might be a small niche market in stoves for decorative purposes only, but PeakBagger's comments would still apply.  As far as working cookstoves go, I suspect Aga pretty much gets all the business from people who want that look.

Also, getting goods through Customs is slow going without an expediter on site.  Shipping by boat would be economical but slow, shipping by air, fast but very expensive.  Do you have any contacts among antiques dealers in New York and Los Angeles?  I imagine they'd be the only people who'd be willing to pay the prices you'd have to charge (and they might already have a relationship with an expediter, to take that headache off your hands).


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## Mr Morso. (Dec 19, 2018)

Thanks for your input CY!

There is a million zillion Aga stoves readily available in the UK but you have my attention. What do people in the US generally go for? Gas, wood, oil more curious then anything.

I've looked at import duty into the US for new stove related products but would be interested in used prices. I've requested this information before from US customs but never received a reply.

I appreciate that this is no simple task & if I was to load a container with stove related articles, I guess like most people I would be interested in the most lucrative.

Again thanks for your response.


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## Connecticut Yankee (Dec 19, 2018)

I would imagine that anyone buying an Aga would probably choose gas or electric, whichever would make Cook happier.  (Remember Saki's line?  "She was a good cook, as cooks go; and as cooks go, she went.")

I'm not up on U.S. import law, so I have no idea what the duty would be, except that it would probably be based on the valuation of the item--which would be whatever you charged the buyer, in most cases.  There might be a rate for antiques, I just don't know.  Have you spoken to the consulate in London?  The consul's office is much more likely to respond helpfully than Customs bureau heaquarters in the U.S.


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## begreen (Dec 19, 2018)

I think you will find the cost of shipping prohibitive unless shipping a container full of stoves and warehousing them in the US. There is not a big market for one off items due to this.


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## bholler (Dec 19, 2018)

Mr Morso. said:


> Thanks for your informative & thought provoking comments.
> 
> I appreciate that the US is geographically large. Interesting that you brought up the subject of cooking stoves. I do occasionally come across Morso cooking stoves. Have uploaded image so your opinion would be much appreciated. I have access to EPA approved stoves so that is not a deal breaker & I'm not to fussed about giving a few crumbs to dealers.
> 
> Again thanks for your informative post & look forward to your response.


Are the stoves also ul listed.  If not none of their stated clearances are valid here.  And no dealers should touch them.


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## TWilk117 (Dec 20, 2018)

Mr Morso. said:


> Hi
> 
> thanks for allowing me on the Forum.
> 
> ...



Hello, I am also new to this forum. It has been extremely helpful.

I felt inclined to give my two cents to Mr.Morso.

First I will tell you that Scandinavian imports are a growing niche in the states.

Secondly, small or tiny wood stoves is a hugely growing market. The kind you would find in a sail boat or a tiny house on wheels.
I’v seen them installed in school bus homes and even an airstream travel trailer. So I would be looking for the smallest of stoves for that trending market. And they would be cheaper to crate and ship. A lot of folks are building tiny or small houses, and they may be looking for something that sets there’s apart from the rest of the pack.

Cheers 
Skål


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## wooduser (Dec 22, 2018)

To change the subject if you don't mind----

How is Brexit likely to affect your business?


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## TWilk117 (Dec 22, 2018)

A Lunenburg Foundry, Nova Scotia; replica. The NSW2 (Little Cod.)
(#Oh No! Not another Heatilator thread!.)


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## begreen (Dec 22, 2018)

TWilk117 said:


> Hello, I am also new to this forum. It has been extremely helpful.
> 
> I felt inclined to give my two cents to Mr.Morso.
> 
> ...


Good point, though one needs to keep in mind that there is also an increasing amount of stoves built in North America to satisfy this market.


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## TWilk117 (Dec 22, 2018)

begreen said:


> Good point, though one needs to keep in mind that there is also an increasing amount of stoves built in North America to satisfy this market.



Yes It is growing... still a little variety never hurts..  I’m not going to mention any brand names, but I question how many are actually 100% made in America or UK.


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## begreen (Dec 22, 2018)

Some are made in Canada and some overseas.


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## TWilk117 (Dec 22, 2018)

Mine was forged on Orcas Island, Washington state. USA.

There is a waiting list to get one of these not unlike a new Harley Davidson.


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## bholler (Dec 22, 2018)

TWilk117 said:


> Yes It is growing... still a little variety never hurts..  I’m not going to mention any brand names, but I question how many are actually 100% made in America or UK.


Most stoves sold here are made in the USA and or Canada.  Not many from the UK.  A few Scandinavian.  And a few imports from Asia.  But not many of them ironically the biggest company selling Chinese stoves is us stove company.


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## TWilk117 (Dec 23, 2018)

bholler said:


> Most stoves sold here are made in the USA and or Canada.  Not many from the UK.  A few Scandinavian.  And a few imports from Asia.  But not many of them ironically the biggest company selling Chinese stoves is us stove company.



I was thinking of the Hobbit Stove by Salamander Stoves, UK. The parts are forged in China.


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## SpaceBus (Dec 23, 2018)

TWilk117 said:


> View attachment 236389
> 
> A Lunenburg Foundry, Nova Scotia; replica. The NSW2 (Little Cod.)
> (#Oh No! Not another Heatilator thread!.)



I've never seen anything like this


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## TWilk117 (Dec 23, 2018)

SpaceBus said:


> I've never seen anything like this



http://www.marinestove.com/


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## SpaceBus (Dec 23, 2018)

TWilk117 said:


> http://www.marinestove.com/


Wow, that's really neat! I wish I knew about these stoves when I was living in my RV! Propane gets expensive...


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## TWilk117 (Dec 23, 2018)

SpaceBus said:


> Wow, that's really neat! I wish I knew about these stoves when I was living in my RV! Propane gets expensive...



Yeah.. they are pretty cool. I was planning on building a tiny house in 2013 when I ordered mine. 
I ended up buying a 1150sq foot rancher on a wooded lot instead. The living room is probably about 400 feet squared. I’ve had two different fireplace guys out here.. both told me not to install this stove through my fireplace because it wouldn’t be worth it. Not enough heat. Not a long enough burn time, and they wanted me to buy an insert off of them.. I realize this stove won’t burn through the night or an 8-10 hour work day and I’m okay with that. I just want some supplemental heat to save oil and electricity. 
The original 1950 Heatilator is a beast that eats a ton of wood. I stoped using it all together. Hate wasting all this wood. So I have this little epa certified 74% efficient stove.. It’s going in as soon as can buy a liner kit and all the parts. 
Tim


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## begreen (Dec 23, 2018)

This is posted in the main forum. Now back to the original thread, or are we done here?


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## Mr Morso. (Dec 24, 2018)

bholler said:


> I will allow this post but be aware you can't use this site to advertize.  This isn't quite that but it's close.





peakbagger said:


> I expect its a niche market. Many insurance companies in the US require a listed stove so if the units are old enough not to have a rating plate then fewer folks will want them. I dont know if there is particular market for old European woodstoves (although I must admit I have a couple of Jotuls in storage). Unless you are getting them for scrap price, by the time you refurb the unit and ship it, I dont know how much margin you have. Generally if folks have to pay much over $1,000 they are going to buy a new EPA stove rather than a refurb. On occasion I see a few private dealers who do refurb old Jotuls and they tend to be on the market for quite awhile. Note some areas of the US require EPA rated stoves and dont allow the installation of ued  non rated stoves.
> 
> The exception might be wood cookstoves, there really are not a lot of small cookstoves on the market in the US except for utilitarian beasts that dont fit in an average house. Cookstoves are EPA exempt.  There are some imports, like Esse but they tend to very pricey. Small stoves like my Jotul 404 will fit in a cabin or smaller house. I dont know the depth of the market but I ran into someone who picks up 404s, cleans them up and resells them to interior decorators for the Boston market.
> 
> A general comment is how is your general familiarity with the US? Maybe you have visited but the scale of the country is lot bigger so the logistics of running a business selling heavy bulky objects is more difficult.Over the years I frequently have found great stoves located beyond driving distance  but the logistics of getting them shipped means I dont buy them as the seller is unwilling to package them and get them shipped which can cost a minimum of $300. Inevitably to service a large market, the stoves would need to be trucked by freight and that means packaging them on a pallet so they dont get damaged and having the customer have the capability to receive pallet shipments (few do). Ideally you would import to central location and then ship to dealers but then you need to give them their cut.





Connecticut Yankee said:


> There might be a small niche market in stoves for decorative purposes only, but PeakBagger's comments would still apply.  As far as working cookstoves go, I suspect Aga pretty much gets all the business from people who want that look.
> 
> Also, getting goods through Customs is slow going without an expediter on site.  Shipping by boat would be economical but slow, shipping by air, fast but very expensive.  Do you have any contacts among antiques dealers in New York and Los Angeles?  I imagine they'd be the only people who'd be willing to pay the prices you'd have to charge (and they might already have a relationship with an expediter, to take that headache off your hands).





TWilk117 said:


> Hello, I am also new to this forum. It has been extremely helpful.
> 
> I felt inclined to give my two cents to Mr.Morso.
> 
> ...





wooduser said:


> To change the subject if you don't mind----
> 
> How is Brexit likely to affect your business?



Well thanks for all the input.

Brexit is a tough one because i don't know what is going to happen. Difficult to plan, just stumble on as usual I guess but not making life easy. 

I do sell a few small Morso's in the UK which often end up in boats. Morso 1410's spring to mind. 

As always more questions arise then answers but all interesting & thought provoking stuff. Again thanks for all relevant answers & opinions.


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## webfish (Dec 24, 2018)

Hearthlink from Vermont used to advertise on this site for many years. They sold both Rais and Morso. 

https://www.hearthlink.com/home.html


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## jatoxico (Dec 24, 2018)

I'm confused. Can older non-epa stoves legally be advertised and sold as burners? Are these refurbed stoves sold as decorations?


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## bholler (Dec 24, 2018)

jatoxico said:


> I'm confused. Can older non-epa stoves legally be advertised and sold as burners? Are these refurbed stoves sold as decorations?


In most states yes.  Being unlisted poses more of a problem


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## jatoxico (Dec 24, 2018)

bholler said:


> In most states yes.  Being unlisted poses more of a problem


So only newly manufactured stoves have to meet emissions requirements, did not know that. I thought sales of older stoves were limited to craigslist type stuff that was under the radar.


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## bholler (Dec 24, 2018)

jatoxico said:


> So only newly manufactured stoves have to meet emissions requirements, did not know that. I thought sales of older stoves were limited to craigslist type stuff that was under the radar.


That depends on the state


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## TWilk117 (Dec 24, 2018)

SpaceBus said:


> Wow, that's really neat! I wish I knew about these stoves when I was living in my RV! Propane gets expensive...



So does oil.. I stayed in parents “park model” camper one spring. Earlier in the season I would crank up the heater when it got real cold, I hardly felt the heat. Ended up under lots of blankets.


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## TWilk117 (Dec 24, 2018)

jatoxico said:


> So only newly manufactured stoves have to meet emissions requirements, did not know that. I thought sales of older stoves were limited to craigslist type stuff that was under the radar.



I think if you’re a younger guy looking at staying put for the next 30+ years. And if you’re not in a city or suburb, it’s quite possible to DIY without permits and all that stuff. As long as you do everything correctly and to code. Being handy and having handy friends is good. 

But if you’re an older fella or someone who may be selling their house within 5-10 years. Having it done to code is a lot more important. 

Just my opinion. And again everything should at least be done to code and with safety As a main objective.


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## TWilk117 (Dec 24, 2018)

Mr Morso. said:


> Well thanks for all the input.
> 
> Brexit is a tough one because i don't know what is going to happen. Difficult to plan, just stumble on as usual I guess but not making life easy.
> 
> ...



That is an awesome looking little stove. Maybe I’ll get one of those for the bedroom one day!

Honestly I saw the Brexit coming a mile a way, I would not be surprised if The Nordic Council does the same and maybe unites with UK?

Who the hell is Belgium to ban snus for the EU?!


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## bholler (Dec 24, 2018)

TWilk117 said:


> That is an awesome looking little stove. Maybe I’ll get one of those for the bedroom one day!
> 
> Honestly I saw the Brexit coming a mile a way, I would not be surprised if The Nordic Council does the same and maybe unites with UK?
> 
> Who the hell is Belgium to ban snus for the EU?!


You can't put a wood stove in your bedroom


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## TWilk117 (Dec 24, 2018)

bholler said:


> You can't put a wood stove in your bedroom



Awe shucks.. I’ll just make my living room my bedroom full time. Than I gain two rooms.. or one room.. never liked arithmetic.


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## SpaceBus (Dec 24, 2018)

TWilk117 said:


> That is an awesome looking little stove. Maybe I’ll get one of those for the bedroom one day!
> 
> Honestly I saw the Brexit coming a mile a way, I would not be surprised if The Nordic Council does the same and maybe unites with UK?
> 
> Who the hell is Belgium to ban snus for the EU?!


You can get those in the US. We bought a Morso 2B Classic, also has the squirrel, a few weeks ago here in Maine. They have US dealers, but you might have to wait. We got lucky and got the floor model at a discount. The 1410 and 2B Classic both have an ash pan and riddling grate which is nice.


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## TWilk117 (Dec 24, 2018)

Cool!  @SpaceBus your 2b is really a thing of beauty! 
I will seriously look at them closer, someday down the road, when I have the money for another stove. I’ve been on the website several times.. I’m jealous.


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## TWilk117 (Dec 24, 2018)

@SpaceBus this ones near me.. 
https://philadelphia.craigslist.org/atq/d/lenhartsville-morso-1bo-woodstove/6776644558.html


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## SpaceBus (Dec 24, 2018)

TWilk117 said:


> Cool!  @SpaceBus your 2b is really a thing of beauty!
> I will seriously look at them closer, someday down the road, when I have the money for another stove. I’ve been on the website several times.. I’m jealous.


We love it. Obviously it won't have burn times over 6 hours, which is only possible with red oak or the like. I've gotten 5 hrs of usable heat with birch and maple with good coals to re-light the fire. I run spruce during the day and save my birch and maple for night. If our house were any less insulated it probably wouldn't work for us. We wanted the Jotul F118, but the EPA version has issues and the Morso was tied with it for our favorite.


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## TWilk117 (Dec 24, 2018)

I’m okay with having shorter burn times and getting to play with the fire!
I also like the idea of having another stove somewhere else in the house one day. A bit larger, for the option of having a longer burn time and a warmer house. But not too huge. It’s a shame the f118 has those problems. May be it should just be a regular catalyst.. I don’t know.. but I do know I would seriously consider buying one of them when the time comes,  although not so sure with the current issues, even though I know they said they corrected the problems.. still not sure. Have time to think about it


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## begreen (Dec 24, 2018)




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