# DOLMAR 5100



## mike bove (Dec 1, 2008)

I am looking for a good saw  is the makita  version the same saw , or should i go with the dolmar. Iwas looking at previous threads and i am a liitle confused.


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## sl7vk (Dec 1, 2008)

Lord of the Flames said:
			
		

> I am looking for a good saw  is the makita  version the same saw , or should i go with the dolmar. Iwas looking at previous threads and i am a liitle confused.



Makita owns Dolmar.  Makita saws are rebadged Dolmars (made in Germany).  Makita does not offer the 5100 in their brand.  

If you want the 5100, then Dolmar it is.

I can tell you, that you won't be disappointed if you do.


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## skinnykid (Dec 1, 2008)

I have heard great things about the Dolmar 5100. I was pretty close to ordering one. Price is great! But in a recent thread o another site, some are saying that they have alot of issues. Of course then there are guys saying no way.

I get kind of afraid seeing on I need to spend my money wisely and don't want a problematic saw. I started looking at Stihl in the beginning and find myself looking at Stihl again. I might get a Big used Stihl seeing on how it will be my primary saw and buying used will save me $$.


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## sl7vk (Dec 1, 2008)

skinnykid said:
			
		

> I have heard great things about the Dolmar 5100. I was pretty close to ordering one. Price is great! But in a recent thread o another site, some are saying that they have alot of issues. Of course then there are guys saying no way.
> 
> I get kind of afraid seeing on I need to spend my money wisely and don't want a problematic saw. I started looking at Stihl in the beginning and find myself looking at Stihl again. I might get a Big used Stihl seeing on how it will be my primary saw and buying used will save me $$.



I'd love for you to link that.... "recent thread" you speak of.

I've read nothing but great things from the pro's on arboristsite.....


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## Outdoorsman (Dec 1, 2008)

I've been cutting a good deal more than normal this year, and my 5100 is working very well.

The thing I like about the Dolmar vs my Stihl saws is the weight to power ratio of the Dolmar is a bit better than it is with my Stihls.

I like all three of my saws, don't get me wrong.  But the Dolmar is clearly the way to go for someone buying new right now, you'll get a lot more saw for your money with Dolmar than with Stihl.

With Stihl you'll be paying a premium price for what everyone in this country knows to be a premium saw.  With Dolmar you'll get the same premium saw quality, but at a much lower price as Dolmar is relatively unknown in the USA.


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## skinnykid (Dec 1, 2008)

www.arboristsite.com/showthread.php?t=82145

Thread is pretty much back and forth about good and bad, seems like alot of people are having the same type of troubles.

Happy reading!

As I said, I might still get a Dolmar, but the thread is making me think a little more!


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## sl7vk (Dec 1, 2008)

skinnykid said:
			
		

> www.arboristsite.com/showthread.php?t=82145
> 
> Thread is pretty much back and forth about good and bad, seems like alot of people are having the same type of troubles.
> 
> ...



Thanks for that skinny... I'm only to page 10, but I've laughed my a@@ off so far....

The 5100s is a high performance saw.   Don't run a dull chain, and don't run 50:1 unless you're using Domar synthetic.... It says so in the manual.

I run Huskqvarna XP at 45:1 and the saw just rips like a ***** ape.

If I find a better quote then the following, I'll let you know.....



> I have cut all my firewood for the last 3 years with my 5100, and this summer this fragile time-bomb was still able to take first place at Washington county fair contest. I think the stihl/husky guys are jumping at the chance to bash this saw which embarrasses them with performance and price. When you buy a pro saw, you should know how to tune it. I couldn't imagine leaving my mixture needles as set from my dealer. I tweek my mixture whenever the temp changes. And why would you buy cheap blended gas anyway. I always use 93 octane, no ethanol, with synthetic oil.


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## skinnykid (Dec 1, 2008)

I remember reading that quote! Like I said the thread goes 6 different directions. But like I said, I was all ready for a Dolmar and then WHAMMO all this bashing starts!! Kinda scared me!


What to do, what to do!


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## sl7vk (Dec 1, 2008)

skinnykid said:
			
		

> I remember reading that quote! Like I said the thread goes 6 different directions. But like I said, I was all ready for a Dolmar and then WHAMMO all this bashing starts!! Kinda scared me!
> 
> 
> What to do, what to do!



If you are worried, then get a 346xp ne, or a 260 pro, or a shindaiwa 488.....

Don't want you losing sleep at night!   :lol: 

Just get the freaking dolmar already.  Run her as hard as you can during the warranty period and see what happens......  

The comparable saws are more expensive (expect the Shindaiwa....) so the choice was easy for me..... and I haven't regretted it at all!

The most recent post is interesting as well.....



> Well, we'll have to wait and see about this storied demise of the 5100.
> 
> My Dolmar dealer is still selling 5100s here in Ohio and I stop in and BS with him regularly when passing through and in 3 years of doing that, I've seen one 5100 that was smoked from an air leak.
> 
> Strange thing is, there's always a lot more Stihls in his shop, waiting for repairs than Dolmars.


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## WOODBUTCHER (Dec 1, 2008)

I've hacked up close to 7 cords with mine since May, no issues here.

WoodButcher


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## Gooserider (Dec 1, 2008)

FWIW, if you read that thread CAREFULLY, it appears that there are at most TWO posters that have actually had a problem with a 5100, and a large part of the bashing is coming from someone that from his handle appears to be either a Stihl dealer, or otherwise heavily involved in Stihl service / sales - not the worlds most unbiased source...

That said, there also seems to be a good bit of useful advice about the need to richen up the carb settings on the saw in order to avoid problems with overheating due to the EPA forcing the makers to sell the saw set to an over lean configuration, not to mention running a sharp chain, using good gas and oil, etc...

I wouldn't let that thread scare me away from the 5100 for sure, but I'd definitely listen to the advice on saw maintainance in it...

Gooserider


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## smokinj (Dec 1, 2008)

For a "50 cc" saw that dolmer is the best at any price!


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## Shipper50 (Dec 1, 2008)

Dolmar 5100 is the best feeling saw I have ever run, I would buy another, but I have 2. :lol: 

Shipper


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## day52 (Dec 2, 2008)

Another vote for the 5100. I put off getting one for too long.


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## johnn (Dec 8, 2008)

Borrowed a "true" friends Dolmar 5100, a few months back. Think I would sleep with it! The saw that is!


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## skinnykid (Dec 8, 2008)

ml said:
			
		

> The saw that is!



Nice recovery!!


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## mr2autoxr (Dec 14, 2008)

I just picked up a 5100 but haven't had the chance to use it yet.  I'm new to this (cutting firewood) for the stove and wanted a good saw.

I've read the thread on arboristsite and the only thing I'm concerned about is the carb settings and mixture ratio.

For the carb my H and L are all the way CCW or set to max rich as I can understand.  I haven't started the saw yet so I'm just nervous now about not having things set correctly and seizing the saw.  I've run plenty of 2 stroke dirt bike motors so I should know what a good tune sounds like on these saws.  Am I just overly worried?  Should I just follow the carb settings instructions in the manual on my first start?

And for mixture ratios it says in the manual if you aren't using Dolmar oil to use a 40:1 ratio.  I assume I should use this then with any Husky or Stihl synthetic oil which is easier to come by around here.

Thanks
Mike


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## Brian VT (Dec 14, 2008)

I'm a newb too. My dealer tuned mine before I left. He said to bring it back after 15hrs. for retune.
I just went to check my settings for you but I couldn't see how to adjust them. There's some rubber Philips looking things hiding the adjustments
and I didn't feel like messing with them because I've got a few beers in me.
I don't know what the 40:1 deal is about. I asked him if I could run the same 50:1 Amsoil synthetic that I run in my bike and he said that should be fine.


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## Gooserider (Dec 14, 2008)

mr2autoxr said:
			
		

> I just picked up a 5100 but haven't had the chance to use it yet.  I'm new to this (cutting firewood) for the stove and wanted a good saw.
> 
> I've read the thread on arboristsite and the only thing I'm concerned about is the carb settings and mixture ratio.
> 
> ...



The dealer SHOULD have given you the saw with a good setup and in proper running condition.  One of the problems is that EPA mandates require throttle limiting stops on the adjustment screws, which sometimes leaves you on the lean side of where you really ought to be - this can be fixed "surgically" but many dealers won't do it because that can theoretically get them in trouble...

On the mix ratio, my 7900 says the same thing, and IMHO it's just corporate CYA...  They know what's in Dolmar oil, they don't know about anyone elses, so they tell you to run it rich to be on the safe side...  However, there is a set of "alphabet soup" SAE specs on the oil in your manual - I forget just what they are offhand, but any of the brand name chainsaw mix oils should meet them (Don't use Outboard motor mix, I'm not sure about bike mix - different service ratings)  As long as you are using quality oil, stick with the 50:1 ratio...  I would also insist on picking an oil that contained a fuel stabilizer, or adding my own.

More important, especially these days w/ gov't mandated crap-gas, is to use high quality gas - Dolmar specs 91 octane minimum, and says not to burn alcohol blends.  You can't easily avoid the booze blend in a lot of the US, but I would stick with a "name brand" gas, and get their highest grade...  I would also only get one gallon at a time (unless you are doing a LOT of cutting and will go through it in less than a month) and not keep it more than about 6 months in a tightly sealed can....

(I won't go into the oil brand battles, though my own personal choice is to run dino oil for the break in, then switch to synthetics after the first gallon or two of mix)

Gooserider


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## day52 (Dec 14, 2008)

If it were me, I would find someone who knows what they are doing to help you. I can't imagine the saw will run very well with jets set at max CCW, but each saw is a bit different. This particular saw runs a bit faster than most, so tuning by ear isn't quite as reliable unless you know what you are doing. It isn't hard to tune a saw usually, but you can fry one pretty easy if it is too lean. Those @#$%$ limiter caps make it more difficult. I usually take them off first thing, but I have to admit my 5100 runs great set by the dealer, so this far I haven't messed with them. On my 401, I wasn't as lucky,  but have it running really well right now with some minor mods. The nice thing about the 5100 at least from what I've heard and read is that tinkering with it doesn't do much. Hence it is a pretty good saw to start with. Hope you get to cut with it soon, I know you'll like it.


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## Bigg_Redd (Dec 14, 2008)

Gooserider said:
			
		

> mr2autoxr said:
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Air cooled 2 strokes (like in chainsaws) are the least picky of all 2 strokes in terms of premix oil.   Outboard motors and liquid cooled 2 stroke motorcycles run with about half of the internal tolerances that air cooled engines do and the oil requirements are more stringent.  I don't use TCW-III oil in my saw but I _have_ and would again without a second thought.


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## Gooserider (Dec 14, 2008)

Bigg_Redd said:
			
		

> <snip>
> Air cooled 2 strokes (like in chainsaws) are the least picky of all 2 strokes in terms of premix oil.   Outboard motors and liquid cooled 2 stroke motorcycles run with about half of the internal tolerances that air cooled engines do and the oil requirements are more stringent.  I don't use TCW-III oil in my saw but I _have_ and would again without a second thought.



The argument against using TCW-III is that the operating temperature ranges are different, and the oil for the liquid cooled engines can't take the heat of the air cooled units - also worth noting that while a liquid cooled engine has tighter tolerances on the bench, the air-cooled engine will have more dimensional changes as the parts heat up, and both end up about the same tolerances at operating temperatures.  Problem is the AC engine gets a lot more abuse, and is closer to the edge of catastrophic failure...  One of the big reasons LC engines are popular with engineers is that they are far easier to design for both durability and performance in the same unit.

What I think is a telling indicator is that you don't see many oils that have both ratings - if they were interchangeable I'd expect that you would as it would presumably be worth doing it for the oil companies.

Gooserider


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## Brian VT (Dec 14, 2008)

Are you talking only about TCW-III or are you talking about synthetic vs castor ? I just googled TCW-III and I guess it's like any other quality synthetic.


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## Gooserider (Dec 14, 2008)

Not sure about the earlier post, but my comments were in regards to using oil listed for liquid cooled two-strokes (i.e. outboard boat motors and most modern dirt bikes) as opposed to oil listed for air-cooled outdoor power equipment (chainsaws, weed whackers, blowers, etc)

IMHO, based on reading equipment manufacturer manuals and web pages, these are two very different applications w/ different service requirements, that should have their own appropriately rated oil used, and not use oil labeled for one application in the other....

Gooserider


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## Brian VT (Dec 15, 2008)

Gooserider said:
			
		

> Not sure about the earlier post, but my comments were in regards to using oil listed for liquid cooled two-strokes (i.e. outboard boat motors and most modern dirt bikes) as opposed to oil listed for air-cooled outdoor power equipment (chainsaws, weed whackers, blowers, etc)
> 
> IMHO, based on reading equipment manufacturer manuals and web pages, these are two very different applications w/ different service requirements, that should have their own appropriately rated oil used, and not use oil labeled for one application in the other....
> 
> Gooserider



Sorry. I still don't understand the discussion. I'm not busting on you. I'm just a sponge for new info. and am afraid I'm missing something.

"Description: Royal Purple® 2-Cycle TCW III is recommended for use in both pre-mixed and oil injected gasoline two-cycle engines in outboard motors, motorcycles, jet skis, chain saws, etc."


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## Bigg_Redd (Dec 15, 2008)

Gooserider said:
			
		

> Bigg_Redd said:
> 
> 
> 
> ...



I think the reason you don't see many with both ratings is that API ratings are VERY expensive.  I'd bet my next 6 paychecks that any TC-WIII would rate better in any lab test for viscosity and film strength than anything that said "Stihl" or "Echo" or whatever on the bottle.


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## Gooserider (Dec 15, 2008)

According to the manual, Dolmar requires oil that meets at least JASO FC or ISO EGD standards.  

Per Wikipedia, JASO = Japanese Automotive Standards Organization



> JASO FC is a performance quality classification for two stroke engine oil, for engines of Japanese origin.
> Oils are granted the JASO FC certification by the Japanese Automotive Standards Organization, under the test sequence M345. JASO FC is the highest rating for 2-stroke oils. JASO FC oils leave little deposits and create very little smoke. They also pass lubricant and detergent tests. A JASO FC oil will have a rectangular seal. In the upper quarter of the rectangle will be a serial number and the lower three quarters will just have the letters M.
> Again, there is an official JASO seal if the oil has been independently tested. The seal is a rectangle; in the upper quarter of the rectangle will be a serial number, and the lower three quarters will just have the letters MA. JASO FC -has now been superseded as the highest rating by JASO FD.
> JASO FA – original spec established regulating lubricity, detergency, initial torque, exhaust smoke and exhaust system blocking.
> ...



I wasn't able to find anything real authoritative on ISO EGD, but did find this quote on a forum


> ISO EGD is the “European” specification that slightly exceeds the “Japanese” JASO-FC. There is a new JASO-FD spec, as the ISO and JASO testing sequences have come closer together with the latest ‘’FD'’ and ‘’EGD'’ designations. Previously, the only difference was a 1 hour and 3 hour detergency - lubricity - ring groove - sticking test with JASO-FC and ISO-EGD respectively. Now, they are the same set of tests.



Some of the other stuff I found seemed to say that JASO FD is an improvement over FC, and is the approximate equivalent of ISO EGD, and that there were a FEW Dino oils that could meet FC, but that to pass the FD or EGD specs you needed a synthetic base.

I also found this page from AMSOIL on their different two-stroke oils - with ratings and application reccomendations...  They have a chart with different applications - it says the TCW-III oils are reccomended for boats, and are OK for bikes, but are NOT reccomended for chainsaws and other OPE uses...  

My feeling on Bigg_Redd's statement 





> I think the reason you don’t see many with both ratings is that API ratings are VERY expensive.  I’d bet my next 6 paychecks that any TC-WIII would rate better in any lab test for viscosity and film strength than anything that said “Stihl” or “Echo” or whatever on the bottle.


 is that he is probably right that getting ratings is expensive, it should be less expensive to run one oil through the tests rather than having to make multiple formulations to get tested seperately - each rating has several parts, and in many cases the results from one part can be used in other ratings, for a lower total cost...  Judging from that Amsoil page, they seem to find it necessary to make multiple formulas for different applications....  I'm not saying that TCW-III is bad oil, just that it's not the right oil for a chainsaw, and IMHO it's worth the money / hassles to use the right oil...

Gooserider


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## downeast (Dec 15, 2008)

[quote author="Gooserider" date="1229260311
*Dolmar specs 91 octane minimum*, and says not to burn alcohol blends.  Gooserider[/quote]

The Dolmar spec is the German ROZ ( and Euro) fuel rating. 91 ROZ is the equivalent of U.S. 86 octane...the "regular" at the pump is 86-87 octane.
We use the mid-grade 89 octane ( ~ 95 ROZ ) year-round in all saws. Works fine.
Save the 91 octane gas for your Aston Martin.


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## Brian VT (Dec 15, 2008)

Welp, I use Amsoil Dominator at 50:1 so I guess I'm okay. The chart says Saber 100:1 is best for chainsaws. My racing buddy, who owns a motorcycle shop, has been running Saber 100:1 in his bike for 2+ years with good results. I still cain't bring myself to run it. He says the other Amsoils can be run at 100:1 but if they print it on the label noone will buy it 'cuz they're like me, old school. My race buddy is 10 yrs. older so I have no excuse for my stubbornness.
If you ever come back mr2, sorry for the hijack.


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## Gooserider (Dec 15, 2008)

downeast said:
			
		

> [quote author="Gooserider" date="1229260311
> *Dolmar specs 91 octane minimum*, and says not to burn alcohol blends.  Gooserider



The Dolmar spec is the German ROZ ( and Euro) fuel rating. 91 ROZ is the equivalent of U.S. 86 octane...the "regular" at the pump is 86-87 octane.
We use the mid-grade 89 octane ( ~ 95 ROZ ) year-round in all saws. Works fine.
[/quote]

Per the Dolmar manual - 


> Fuel mixture
> The engine of the chain saw is a high-efficiency two-stroke
> engine. It runs on a mixture of gasoline and two-stroke engine
> oil.
> ...



There is endless debate on oils over on Arboristsite - very little on gas, and most of the gas debate has been on whether high test is OK, or if you are better off getting AVGAS at the local airport...  I see very few suggesting use of regular gas w/ alcohol in it...  The reason given is less to do with octane than it is to avoid the alcohol, which is seen as a major problem.  Another reason given is that high test takes a bit longer to degrade, which makes a big difference for those of us that don't go through mix as fast as we might like.

Gooserider


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## mr2autoxr (Dec 15, 2008)

I'm still here, just reading along and gathering this information.  Tonight I'm stopping at the store to get some gas and oil.  I'll try to fire the saw up soon and I do have a tach now so I can see what the saw is doing.  I'll keep everyone posted as what I find out


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## downeast (Dec 15, 2008)

The Dolmar spec is the German ROZ ( and Euro) fuel rating. 91 ROZ is the equivalent of U.S. 86 octane...the “regular” at the pump is 86-87 octane. 
We use the mid-grade 89 octane ( ~ 95 ROZ ) year-round in all saws. Works fine.

Worth a repeat: "ROZ" is a Euro rating usually ~ 4-5 points HIGHER than U'S. octane numbers. The Dolmar fuel rating is at the German "ROZ".


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## mr2autoxr (Dec 15, 2008)

Now I've come across another question...

I have the optical tach that needs the reflective tape stuck on to get a reading....where does everyone stick the tape on a chainsaw?

Thanks


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## Bigg_Redd (Dec 15, 2008)

Gooserider said:
			
		

> downeast said:
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Per the Dolmar manual - 


> Fuel mixture
> The engine of the chain saw is a high-efficiency two-stroke
> engine. It runs on a mixture of gasoline and two-stroke engine
> oil.
> ...



There is endless debate on oils over on Arboristsite - very little on gas, and most of the gas debate has been on whether high test is OK, or if you are better off getting AVGAS at the local airport...  I see very few suggesting use of regular gas w/ alcohol in it...  The reason given is less to do with octane than it is to avoid the alcohol, which is seen as a major problem.  *Another reason given is that high test takes a bit longer to degrade, which makes a big difference for those of us that don't go through mix as fast as we might like.*

Gooserider[/quote]

I don't know about pump premium, but AvGas degrades, very, very slowly.  And AvGas stored on a sealed metal can has an indefinite shelf life, and it WILL NOT gum your carb regardless of how long it's left.


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## downeast (Dec 15, 2008)

All our saws have enjoyed 89 octane ( mid-grade ) gas for years without complaint. Use Stabil if the fuel is not used for a month or two, but not much longer. Aviation fuel is expensive and overkill for small 2-cycle engines. Great for your Ferrari or twin engine Bonanza however.
I never used an optical tach.....interesting.


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## Gooserider (Dec 15, 2008)

mr2autoxr said:
			
		

> Now I've come across another question...
> 
> I have the optical tach that needs the reflective tape stuck on to get a reading....where does everyone stick the tape on a chainsaw?
> 
> Thanks



Interesting question, I'm not really sure about the answer - most of us use inductive tachs that read the magnetic field off the ignition system, so it's not a problem.  You can't really go on the chain side of the engine as that will be covered by the chain cover (and you definitely need to have the bar and chain installed when setting the RPM...)

The recoil side is mostly covered by the saw case, but there may be some slots or ventilation holes you could shoot the tach through and hit a length of tape on the flywheel.  (I suspect you might have to do some disassembly to get the tape on) - I think the solution is going to be very dependent on the saw, not to mention exactly what your tach requires.  It may not even be possible, in which case you would need to get an inductive tach.

Gooserider


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## Bigg_Redd (Dec 15, 2008)

downeast said:
			
		

> All our saws have enjoyed 89 octane ( mid-grade ) gas for years without complaint. Use Stabil if the fuel is not used for a month or two, but not much longer. *Aviation fuel is expensive and overkill for small 2-cycle engines.* Great for your Ferrari or twin engine Bonanza however.
> I never used an optical tach.....interesting.




I use it in my dirtbikes, so I use it in everything else too.  It's only about $.40 per gallon more expensive than pump premium.


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## downeast (Dec 16, 2008)

Bigg_Redd said:
			
		

> I use it in my dirtbikes, so I use it in everything else too.  It's only about $.40 per gallon more expensive than pump premium.



The old 2-cycle Bultacos and a Suzuki we had worked fine on regular 87 gas. Besides, the nearest full service airport is Bar Harbor, in Trenton, Maine, an hour away. With all the Homeland Security BS I don't know if non-aviation vehicles could get fuel.
Besides, isn't aviation fuel more like refined kerosene rather than gasoline ?


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## carbon neutral (Dec 16, 2008)

With all the Homeland Security BS I don't know if non-aviation vehicles could get fuel.  I doubt there would be a problem at a small airport like Bar Harbor.  I keep my plane at a small airport and I have never been stopped when going out to my plane even when I drive my truck out to the plane.  Anybody interested in buying av fuel should just talk to the lineman and ask how it should be done.  Most people at airports are very helpful.   

Besides, isn't aviation fuel more like refined kerosene rather than gasoline ?  No, most small air planes powered by recipricating engines run on 100 low lead.  Jet fuel is similiar to kerosene.


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## Bigg_Redd (Dec 16, 2008)

downeast said:
			
		

> Bigg_Redd said:
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First of all, set aside your binary, on/off outlook.  I've run my saws and my bikes on pump gas many times and had no problems with it, and if it was a major PITA to get AvGas I wouldn't bother.  I'm not saying pump gas is horrible and that AvGas is the savior of mankind, but I am saying it's better, and I'm saying it's well worth the extra $.40-$.50 extra I pay.  And it's better because it lasts forever, it makes starting easier, it runs cooler (high octane and no ethanol), and it gives much better throttle response (not that big of a deal for a firewood saw).  If I had to drive an hour for it I wouldn't bother, but I bet it's a lot closer than you think.  

I've never heard of DHLS taking any interest whatsoever in the sale and distribution of AvGas.  As a flammable it is no different than pump gas.  There's no road tax levied on it so it's illegal to burn in on-road licensed vehicles.    

And no, it is not kerosene.  Jet fuel is basically kerosene.  100LL AvGas is 100 octane leaded gasoline.


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## mr2autoxr (Dec 16, 2008)

I started my saw last night for the first time and it fired right up really easily.  The limiter straps are still in place as I didn't remove those.  I kept the H setting just a slight bit off the full rich side and the L setting about the same.  The idle S set very easily as well and I have no chain creep.  I let it warm up and played around with it for a good half hour and it runs great.

It revs very nice and I attempted to use two different tachs.  The first was the optical tach I mentioned earlier and I couldn't find a good spot to mount the tape and be able to use the tach easily.  After further thought last night, just below the sproket (maybe on the clutch) it looks like I could have a piece of tape mounted there, but I'd need someone else to hold the tach while I ran the saw (safety 1st).

Therefore I didn't get far with the optical tach so I tried a clamp that went on the spark plug wire and ran to a FLUKE meter.  I had the meter set on HZ and figured I would have to divide the reading of HZ by 60 to get RPM of the engine.  Well at idle my FLUKE was reading near 300 HZ.  This didn't divide out properly to a correct RPM number so I'm not quite sure why that didn't work.  The only reason I can think of right now is that the clamp on the wire was very large and it was difficult to get around the wire and was touching the cylinder head.

I might attempt to try the optical tach again tonight and I'll let you know if it works.


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## downeast (Dec 16, 2008)

clarkharms said:
			
		

> With all the Homeland Security BS I don't know if non-aviation vehicles could get fuel.  I doubt there would be a problem at a small airport like Bar Harbor.  I keep my plane at a small airport and I have never been stopped when going out to my plane even when I drive my truck out to the plane.  Anybody interested in buying av fuel should just talk to the lineman and ask how it should be done.  Most people at airports are very helpful.
> 
> Besides, isn't aviation fuel more like refined kerosene rather than gasoline ?  No, most small air planes powered by recipricating engines run on 100 low lead.  Jet fuel is similiar to kerosene.



Woops, another binary error: I was thinking of jet turbines and then high octane aviation fuel. Forgive. 

Check your charts and airport listings: Bar Harbor Airport is small but one of the many DHS 'secure', 24/7 IFR, fully staffed airports. There is NO civilian access except for aircraft owners....not for chainsaw geeks. This is not an 18 dirt runway.


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## carbon neutral (Dec 16, 2008)

downeast said:
			
		

> clarkharms said:
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> ...


  Here is the information on Bar Harbor airport.  http://www.airnav.com/airport/BHB
It is not attended 24/7 and does allow public access.  If someone wanted to buy avgas there I would recommend contacting the FBO and asking about the proceedure for doing so.  Like I said from my experience as a pilot most fbo's and line workers are happy to help people out.


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## downeast (Dec 16, 2008)

[quote author="clarkharms" date="1229455885 Here is the information on Bar Harbor airport.  http://www.airnav.com/airport/BHB
It is not attended 24/7 and does allow public access.  If someone wanted to buy avgas there I would recommend contacting the FBO and asking about the proceedure for doing so.  Like I said from my experience as a pilot most fbo's and line workers are happy to help people out.[/quote]

As was posted before: " I don want no stinkin' AV fuel." Read: the saws run fine on mid-range fuel. 

Another non-binary binary error caught again. Wow ! You were asked to "check YOUR charts and listings", not a search. 
You people Google well. So, we once again are humbled. Oh the binary of it all.

Oh yes, access to BHB IS restricted....on the ground, in this real world. I guess I cannot play in the sandbox.


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## carbon neutral (Dec 16, 2008)

downeast said:
			
		

> [quote author="clarkharms" date="1229455885 Here is the information on Bar Harbor airport.  http://www.airnav.com/airport/BHB
> It is not attended 24/7 and does allow public access.  If someone wanted to buy avgas there I would recommend contacting the FBO and asking about the proceedure for doing so.  Like I said from my experience as a pilot most fbo's and line workers are happy to help people out.



As was posted before: " I don want no stinkin' AV fuel." Read: the saws run fine on mid-range fuel."
 Sorry I didn't mean to upset you.  I was just trying to show that avgas is available to most people should they choose to try it after reading the posts on this thread.

Another non-binary binary error caught again. Wow ! You were asked to "check YOUR charts and listings", not a search. 
You people Google well. So, we once again are humbled. Oh the binary of it all. "
 I did check my flight guide which has more information on an airport than a chart does, my charts are currently in my airplane so I couldn't reference them.  I supplied the airnav link because it is a way anyone with a computer can check for information on their local airport and get the fbo's contact information.  My charts would simply show that bar harbor is uncontrolled air space, the length of the longest runway, if it were lighted and that the airfield is unattended at night.  The FBO's contact information is what is critical for somone looking for fuel.

"Oh yes, access to BHB IS restricted....on the ground, in this real world." 
Really, it wasn't last summer when I drove there?!?  All airports are restricted to a limited degree.  Like I said if someone wants to pursue buying avgas call the fbo.  Obviously you don't, fine.  Personally I don't either but if someone wants to try avgas why throw up hurdles that don't exist?


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## Bigg_Redd (Dec 16, 2008)

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_airports_in_Maine


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## carbon neutral (Dec 16, 2008)

Bigg_Redd said:
			
		

> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_airports_in_Maine


I really hope you didn't google that! :ahhh:


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## downeast (Dec 16, 2008)

clarkharms said:
			
		

> "Oh yes, access to BHB IS restricted....on the ground, in this real world." Really, it wasn't last summer when I drove there?!?  All airports are restricted to a limited degree.  Like I said if someone wants to pursue buying avgas call the fbo.  Obviously you don't, fine.  Personally I don't either but if someone wants to try avgas why throw up hurdles that don't exist?



This airport is commercial, it is not a private 18 grass strip. There are locked gates, video monitors, Homeland Security passenger checks, random police patrols 24/7, HS walkabouts during flight hours. Your vehicle will ( not cannot ) not have access to the fuel or runways. Unless you decided to crash the fences. ( They do that in CT ? )You need a serious ID for your aircraft access. Now of course this is what it is on the ground; your non-binary   ( whatever ) virtual reality may vary.

Welcome to Downeast however.  Nice place huh ?  Enjoy.
Binary out.


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## Bigg_Redd (Dec 17, 2008)

downeast said:
			
		

> clarkharms said:
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Just for the record, I'm the one calling your worldview binary.  

Binary.


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## sl7vk (Dec 17, 2008)

Here's how it works.  You take a gallon of gas, you know the stuff that comes out of a pump in your neighborhood.  You take a little tiny bottle of that Husky XP low smoke synthetic.  You mix it all together.  

Put into saw without spilling.  

Start saw.

Use saw.

Repeat.





Easy peasy....


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## downeast (Dec 17, 2008)

Bigg_Redd said:
			
		

> Just for the record, I'm the one calling your worldview binary.
> 
> Binary.



And who the H cares what the record is. We don need no stinkin record.

Get out of the virtual sandbox--there's a real world outside. 

You calling "worldview binary" ? Any other name calling before you come down ? 

I have been warned; it's like a "No Trespassing" sign. Fun to get these virtual bullies. Name calling, huh ?

Hey, you don't want Inconvenient Truths.


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## mr2autoxr (Dec 17, 2008)

I was able to tune the saw last night with the optical tach.  I had a small reflective piece of tape placed on the clutch??? right behind the chain sproket.  From the bottom right of the saw I was able to have my wife shine the optical tach in there while I ran the saw.  It was pretty easy to get the high speed set once it was warmed up.

I ended up with the max RPMs on the meter reading about 14300.  I felt this was enough and I had to tweek the L setting a little as well to make it not stall with a small blip of the throttle.

So I am confident the saw is tuned well now and I don't think it is over reving, especially not over reving while it is digging into wood.

This weekend I should be out cutting for the first time with the saw, can't wait!


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## Bigg_Redd (Dec 18, 2008)

downeast said:
			
		

> Bigg_Redd said:
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I just didn't want to share my credit.  I'm the name caller.  Not that other fella.


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## carbon neutral (Dec 19, 2008)

This airport is commercial, it is not a private 18 grass strip. There are locked gates, video monitors, Homeland Security passenger checks, random police patrols 24/7, HS walkabouts during flight hours. Your vehicle will ( not cannot ) not have access to the fuel or runways. Unless you decided to crash the fences. ( They do that in CT ? )You need a serious ID for your aircraft access. Now of course this is what it is on the ground; your non-binary   ( whatever ) virtual reality may vary.

As I said all airports have some security restrictions as mandated by the FAA, the F in FAA stands for Federal so yes even in Connecticut they have these rules.  The airport I buy my avgas from does have commercial flights but I am going to the GA side of the airport not the commercial.  Even so I was able to get clearance for my vehicle by simply asking the airport manager for access.  I had to give him $25 as a deposit on a clicker that opens the security gate.  No ID was checked and no credentials were needed to obtain this clicker other than a drivers license, I now have 24/7 access for myself and my vehicle to the entire airport.  You may not be allowed to drive your car onto the tarmac that will depend on the airport manager but you will most likely be able to walk out with a jerry can.  Airports by design are meant to be intimidating because they don't want people who don't have business being there loitering about.  I can only say from my personal experience as a pilot that I have never been denied access to an air strip, I have never been asked for any documentation for access to the GA side of an airport, I have been to many airports, many of the times I have gone it was to just look at the different planes and watch them do take offs and landings.  How much experience do you have with GA and dealing with airports?  I would love to hear your personal experience, do you have any?


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## Gooserider (Dec 19, 2008)

As I understand it, most airports of any size will have companies that do parts and service for general aviation aircraft - including fuel, or at least w/ access to it.  

These outfits are usually built with at least some sort of entrance on the outside of the fence, if only to make it easy for the UPS / Fedex guys to make deliveries - so it is possible to get to a service counter of some sort in order to talk to a guy that DOES have access...  

As I understand the rules, they aren't allowed to put fuel into a non-aircraft, especially not a street licensed vehicle, but there is no restriction on filling a jerry can...

Gooserider


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## carbon neutral (Dec 19, 2008)

Gooserider said:
			
		

> As I understand it, most airports of any size will have companies that do parts and service for general aviation aircraft - including fuel, or at least w/ access to it.
> 
> These outfits are usually built with at least some sort of entrance on the outside of the fence, if only to make it easy for the UPS / Fedex guys to make deliveries - so it is possible to get to a service counter of some sort in order to talk to a guy that DOES have access...
> 
> ...


You are correct however most FBOs will work with people to accomodate their needs.  The airport where I keep my plane does fuel up cars and motorcylces on occassion.  If you have ever been to a GA hangar you will notice these are toy shops for grown ups.  The hangar where my plane is has all sorts of these toys in it, from custom Harleys to high end Porches.  The owners fill their toys with 100LL because on top of being high performance vehicles they also sit idle for long periods of time between uses.


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## downeast (Dec 20, 2008)

clarkharms said:
			
		

> This airport is commercial, it is not a private 18 grass strip. There are locked gates, video monitors, Homeland Security passenger checks, random police patrols 24/7, HS walkabouts during flight hours. Your vehicle will ( not cannot ) not have access to the fuel or runways. Unless you decided to crash the fences. ( They do that in CT ? )You need a serious ID for your aircraft access. Now of course this is what it is on the ground; your non-binary   ( whatever ) virtual reality may vary.
> 
> As I said *all airports have some security restrictions as mandated by the FAA, the F in FAA stands for Federal *so yes even in Connecticut they have these rules.  The airport I buy my avgas from does have commercial flights but I am going to the GA side of the airport not the commercial.  Even so *I was able to get clearance for my vehicle by simply asking the airport manager *for access.  I had to give him $25 as a deposit on a clicker that opens the security gate.  No ID was checked and no credentials were needed to obtain this clicker other than a drivers license, I now have 24/7 access for myself and my vehicle to the entire airport.  *You may not be allowed to drive your car onto the tarmac that will depend on the airport manager but you will most likely be able to walk out with a jerry can.  Airports by design are meant to be intimidating because they don't want people who don't have business being there loitering about*.  I can only say from my personal experience as a pilot that I have never been denied access to an air strip, I have never been asked for any documentation for access to the GA side of an airport, I have been to many airports, many of the times I have gone it was to just look at the different planes and watch them do take offs and landings.  How much experience do you have with GA and dealing with airports?  I would love to hear your personal experience, do you have any?



Yes. Private ticket. 
You think all this on-the-ground info comes from the internet ? What are you smoking tonight ?
Want to tell the unwashed what "GA" is so they may know your extreme level of knowledge ? We did not realise that the "F" in "FAA" was. Thank you.
BTW: the manager that gave you access by you showing only your Drivers License was violating mandated security regs---country wide. The "F".


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## carbon neutral (Dec 20, 2008)

downeast said:
			
		

> clarkharms said:
> 
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You are wrong on everything you have said, deal with it.  Off with you now go find a different sand box.


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## Brian VT (Dec 20, 2008)

So...I'm pretty happy with my 5100. I have dealers of all the other brands locally but I drove 1 hr. to get the Dolmar.
Now I've got my eyes peeled for my local HD selling their Makita rentals for cheap and building a big saw (which I probably have little use for).


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## carbon neutral (Dec 20, 2008)

Dolmar...oh yeah that's what we were talking about.  I always ask my HD when they are going to sell their saws.  I already have a 7900 with very few hours on it, I just ask figuring if they do have one for sale I could post it here.  I was told they are given a print out in the spring with what equipmet they should put up for sale.  How's that 5100 working out for you?


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## Brian VT (Dec 20, 2008)

Thanks for the tip on the Spring sales at HD.
I do like the 5100 so far, and I'm still running the stock Vanguard chain, but I'm just bucking 5-12" firewood right now.
Now that deer hunting is done and there's some snow on the ground I'll get into dropping a few of my older cherry trees. The 5100 should be perfect for those.
I'm anxious to get a few more tanks of gas through it and then throw a better chain on to see what this screamer can really do.


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## kevin j (Dec 20, 2008)

Q hr. to get the Dolmar. 
Now I’ve got my eyes peeled for my local HD selling their Makita rentals for cheap and building a big saw (which I probably have little use for).    Q




HD returns are a bit hard to find here, they are catching onto the game.
Eric Ritchey on arborist site has some connections and picks up the HD 6400 and does the 7900 conversion. Bought mine from him already done that way. and it has the makita 6400 plastics instead of red dolmar, which I sort of wanted just to be  the 'sleeper' in disguise.
I think it is brad snelling who is proptyping an 85 cc big bore kit from Baileys on the dolmar. Cheaper and bigger than the OEM 79 kit. Since it is a chinese knockoff kit, the jury is still out on reliability. For pro work and alot of hours, probably not the answer. For fun firewood cutting, might be a really fun kit. I like the 79, but 85 cc would be even better, by another 10% so of fun....    : )


k


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## mr2autoxr (Dec 29, 2008)

I FINALLY was able to use my new 5100.  I was able to get about 3 tanks of gas through it today and WOW I like this saw.  It cuts super fast IMO with the .325 pitch 18" stock chain.  I just ordered an Oregon 20LP which should cut even faster.  I can't wait to see how that does.  

All of the carb tuning I did earlier seemed to work fine.  I just had to dial back the H setting at first as I believe I was bouncing off the rev limiter a couple of times in the first cut.  

After that it was great.  I think I got about 1.75 cords cut and split today.  Now my back hurts! LOL.  I'll get it all stacked tomorrow.

Mike


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## Brian VT (Dec 29, 2008)

Only 1.75 cord and you didn't get it stacked today ? loljk
I'm liking the 5100S too but I don't have anything to compare it to. Mine came with 3/8" Oregon Vanguard (safety) on 18" bar. I'll probably try a loop of 72DP or Stihl RMC when I get some more experience under my belt.


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## sl7vk (Dec 29, 2008)

Brian VT said:
			
		

> Only 1.75 cord and you didn't get it stacked today ? loljk
> I'm liking the 5100S too but I don't have anything to compare it to. Mine came with 3/8" Oregon Vanguard (safety) on 18" bar. I'll probably try a loop of 72DP or Stihl RMC when I get some more experience under my belt.



I run 3/8's and love it.  Most all my cutting is with a 16" bar.  I have a dusty 20" in my garage.....

Amicks has that Oregon chain for like 12 bucks a loop.  Great deal.  Do yourself a favor and order some.


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## Gooserider (Dec 29, 2008)

sl7vk said:
			
		

> Brian VT said:
> 
> 
> 
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Note that you can also save even more by ordering multiple loops - Tony ships stuff like chain loops in one of those flat rate priority mail envelopes - I forget just how many loops he can stuff into one, but you can order as many loops as he can cram in the package for the same shipping cost...  I give Amicks a lot of credit, they are one of the better places I've done business with - friendly, good pricing, fast, and w/ customer service that really goes the extra mile...

Gooserider


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## Brian VT (Dec 29, 2008)

sl7vk said:
			
		

> Amicks has that Oregon chain for like 12 bucks a loop.  Great deal.  Do yourself a favor and order some.



The 72DP or should I stick with the Vanguard for a while ? What makes the "safety" chain safer, anyway ?


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## sl7vk (Dec 29, 2008)

Brian VT said:
			
		

> sl7vk said:
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The rakers on the safety chain are deeper, thus reducing the risk of kickback.

Wear PPE, when you engage a cut make sure that if the saw does kick back that it will miss your head.... there are some good diagrams online regarding this.  

My feeling is that the non-safety chain is more dangerous because it doesn't cut as well.  Nothing like a dull knife to get hurt.....  You have to apply more force, take more risks etc....  

Always use a sharp knife IMHO....


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## Gooserider (Dec 29, 2008)

Brian VT said:
			
		

> sl7vk said:
> 
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I would move up to the Pro-chain as soon as I could, as even that is now designed with a fair amount of anti-kickback features, just not as much so.  Remember that "safety chain" isn't - it will still do you serious damage if misused, it can still kick back under the right (wrong) conditions, etc...  Seems to me like the shrinkology people might even be concerned about the name generating false overconfidence in it's anti-kickback performance....  It really ought to be called "REDUCED kickback" - with emphasis on reducing it, NOT eliminating it...  You will be far safer using pro-chain and keeping material from getting into the kickback danger zone than using safety chain with bad cutting habbits...

The key thing that makes "safety chain" safer is the "bumper links" that most such chain has in between the cutting links.  These links are supposed to not get in the way on the straight sections of the bar, but stick up far enough to "bump" the chain away from digging into the wood if you touch it on the curved tip of the bar (the upper half of which is the "danger zone") and thus reduce the chances of a serious kickback.  The problem is that the bumper links also prevent effective "plunge cutting" or other cutting with the tip of the bar - which is a useful, albeit somewhat advanced, technique.   

One use that I often do when bucking (and see others doing as well) is when bucking a log on the ground, I cut from the top as far down as I can (or dare) and then roll the log over to finish the cuts, which I do by using the top of the bar to continue the existing cut UP and out of the log rather than starting a new cut down from the top with the bottom of the bar and hoping they line up perfectly...  Works great with pro-chain, not as well w/ safety chain.  (Note that this WILL sometimes give minor kickbacks if you aren't lined up with the existing cut well enough, but it isn't a problem if you have a proper hold on the saw)

Pro-chain and some of the less radical "safety chains" don't have the bumper links, but have differently shaped "rakers"  that are alleged to produce a reduction in the likelyhood of kickback over the old traditional style chains, but not reduce the ability to cut with the tip as much.

In my limited personal experience, using modern saws with narrow bars, modern designs, etc., I have not found that pro-chain has a significantly bigger problem with kickback than safety chain.

Gooserider


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## downeast (Dec 29, 2008)

Gooserider said:
			
		

> I would move up to the Pro-chain as soon as I could, as even that is now designed with a fair amount of anti-kickback features, just not as much so.  Remember that "safety chain" isn't - it will still do you serious damage if misused, it can still kick back under the right (wrong) conditions, etc...  Seems to me like the shrinkology people might even be concerned about the name generating false overconfidence in it's anti-kickback performance....  It really ought to be called "REDUCED kickback" - with emphasis on reducing it, NOT eliminating it...  You will be far safer using pro-chain and keeping material from getting into the kickback danger zone than using safety chain with bad cutting habbits...
> 
> The key thing that makes "safety chain" safer is the "bumper links" that most such chain has in between the cutting links.  These links are supposed to not get in the way on the straight sections of the bar, but *stick up far enough to "bump" the chain away from digging into the wood if you touch it on the curved tip of the bar (the upper half of which is the "danger zone") and thus reduce the chances of a serious kickback.  The problem is that the bumper links also prevent effective "plunge cutting" or other cutting with the tip of the bar - which is a useful, albeit somewhat advanced, technique.   *
> One use that I often do when bucking (and see others doing as well) is *when bucking a log on the ground, I cut from the top as far down as I can (or dare) and then roll the log over to finish the cuts, which I do by using the top of the bar to continue the existing cut UP and out of the log rather than starting a new cut down from the top with the bottom of the bar and hoping they line up perfectly...  Works great with pro-chain, not as well w/ safety chain.  (Note that this WILL sometimes give minor kickbacks if you aren't lined up with the existing cut well enough, but it isn't a problem if you have a proper hold on the saw)*
> ...



Nemesis and binary here Gooserider et al ...sorry that I don't have the time to be online hours every day to respond to often bad advice and the usual flames.

Let's start with the more dangerous advice: the design of "safety chain". As you say "in (your)  limited experience.." with chainsaws, what you call "pro chain" does have a major danger with kickback with inexperienced users with limited experience.
They are a different animal from LOW KICKBACK chain. What the manufacturers call " non-safety chain" ( Stihl marks it yellow ) is engineered for efficiency in the right hands. 
"Safety chain" ( Stihl marked green ) is engineered as LOW kickback chain. The "bumpers" definately do NOT "BUMP the chain anywhere. Just partially prevent the chain from KICKING Back with extreme torque out of a cut. 

And please, NO ONE ( not even the Mr. Machos here  ) can avoid kickback with "a proper hold on a saw"; forget it. There are too many foot-pounds of force to manhandle a kickback at WOT. It is technique, training, experience, thinking that is not gotten online or a few hours cutting a pile of wood in someone's yard.

The "plunge cut" ( really termed "bore")  is learned . It is usually called "bore cutting"--part of professional and safe techniques for felling and cutting. I've bore cut good size trees with a "by accident" use of a Stihl green "safety chain"; when sharpened right and rakers to the specified height, they bore as well as any of the  yellow non-safety chains. Slower, yes. Come and watch ? 

Sorry: a slice of reality that certainly will not sit well in this crowd. Given in the wish that some will at least get out and try and not be always right.
JMNSHO


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## Bigg_Redd (Dec 30, 2008)

downeast said:
			
		

> Gooserider said:
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AvGas prevents kick-backs.


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## downeast (Dec 30, 2008)

Bigg_Redd said:
			
		

> *AvGas* prevents kick-backs.



????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????


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## slinger (Dec 31, 2008)

I've priced a 5100s w/20" bar and 3/8ths chain for 430.00  + tax at a dolmar dealer.  I'm thinkin... I was told to use AvGas in my 2165 J-red by my dealer.  I did for awhile but it was a PITA to drive 18 miles to the airport to get 5 galllons/time.  Now, because of Homeland security the airport is going to require an N number to buy any fuel at all.   I've switched back to pump gas and detuned my saw a little and haven't had issues yet. I really like the way that 5100 feels-- light and 14,500 rpm would be fun!


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## Shipper50 (Dec 31, 2008)

slinger said:
			
		

> I've priced a 5100s w/20" bar and 3/8ths chain for 430.00  + tax at a dolmar dealer.  I'm thinkin... I was told to use AvGas in my 2165 J-red by my dealer.  I did for awhile but it was a PITA to drive 18 miles to the airport to get 5 galllons/time.  Now, because of Homeland security the airport is going to require an N number to buy any fuel at all.   I've switched back to pump gas and detuned my saw a little and haven't had issues yet. I really like the way that 5100 feels-- light and 14,500 rpm would be fun!


I agree that the 5100 feels great. Best handling saw I have ever run. Mine has a 18 inch bar with 3/8 chain that it came with.

Shipper


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## downeast (Dec 31, 2008)

slinger said:
			
		

> I'm thinkin... I was told to use AvGas in my 2165 J-red by my dealer.  I did for awhile but it was a PITA to drive 18 miles to the airport to get 5 galllons/time.  Now, *because of Homeland security the airport is going to require an N number to buy any fuel at all.*   I've switched back to pump gas and detuned my saw a little and haven't had issues yet. I really like the way that 5100 feels-- light and 14,500 rpm would be fun!



Hey look guys, that "N" is usually on the tail/rudder. So, just solo, get your instrument rating and a private ticket, join AOPA, then you can get all the "AvGas" ( called Aviation Fuel really ) you want. You mean to say that all airports now have real security ? Who woulda known.

Or, as an option, get an N number for your saw.  :lol:


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## slinger (Dec 31, 2008)

The reason for the N number requirement according to the fuel jockey is that some people have been using Avgas in their hot rods and the FED wants to make sure road use taxes are paid if the fuel is used on the highway... I'm all for preventing terrorism but downeast is correct I'm not going to register my saws as aircraft so I can buy a little gas... ;-)  A friend of mine buys his for antique tractor pulls to get a little more umph from his 50 horse farmall.. Pulls his tractor right on the tarmac (actually one runway airport) and gasses up. You won't see that at O'Hare Intl.!


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## slinger (Jan 1, 2009)

Wow!  I really hit the jackpot on my first post!  I really am not an airport expert I just enjoy being outdoors and cuttin wood. 

The last canful that  I bought from this little airport I had a eye opening conversation with the attendant/fuel jockey/ chief bottle washer about why I "won't" be able to buy my fuel there anymore.  I don't recall the entire conversation (It's been a couple of years) but both homeand security regs. were discussed  (Although he didn't give me specifics) but, taxes were the main issue.  I could still get some if I need it but for me the PITA value was too high.  

Anyway back to Dolmar 5100s...  After splitting a little firewood this eve. That lightweight saw has got me intrigued


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## Bigg_Redd (Jan 1, 2009)

downeast said:
			
		

> slinger said:
> 
> 
> 
> ...



It's called AvGas, really.


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## LLigetfa (Jan 1, 2009)

downeast said:
			
		

> All fuel is always taxed. So ?


I don't know how taxes are applied in the US of A but here there are different taxes for different things.  We even get to pay tax on tax.  It is not beyond the realm of possibility that gas sold for cars have a different tax load from avgas.

Anyway... since I don't drive my chainsaw, my splitter, my tractor, my tiller, etc., on the roads, I shouldn't have to pay the excise (road) tax.
http://fuelfocus.nrcan.gc.ca/faq/faq5_e.cfm


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## smokinj (Jan 2, 2009)

Stihl # 1 lol


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## Gooserider (Jan 2, 2009)

This thread has gotten out of hand - I'm requesting that it be closed, and I will be deleting several of the last messages...

Gooserider


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## Bigg_Redd (Jan 2, 2009)

Gooserider said:
			
		

> This thread has gotten out of hand - I'm requesting that it be closed, and I will be deleting several of the last messages...
> 
> Gooserider



The Goose is right.


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## carbon neutral (Jan 2, 2009)

Bigg_Redd said:
			
		

> Gooserider said:
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> 
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Agreed, sorry to the people that were involved, Happy New Year!


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