# Replacement window suggestions



## SE Iowa (Feb 1, 2008)

I built a very efficient home with all but one exception. The windows. I thought I had bought a mid-line window, and maybe it is. If it is a mid line window I would hate to see the low end cheap-o's. We built the house 3 years ago. They are double hung (which I'm told are not the most efficient). I am not sure how you go about replacing them though. Does the whole window frame need to be ripped out? And if so, how do "replacement" windows differ from just regular new windows? What brand does anyone recommend? Any questions/comments welcome.


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## ericjeeper (Feb 1, 2008)

Double hung windows indeed are not the most efficient. But The modern day seals are pretty tough to beat considering the sashes still have to be able to slide to function.
 To replace them lots to consider. Is the home brick? Vinyl sided, if so is the J channel built in to the existing window.
 In my opinion no one makes a good new construction window. Simply because no one will ever pay the kind of money that is required to get a good window. back in the 50s The dollars spent on windows in a home was about 10% of the homes cost.Today it is probably less than 2 percent. People will spend big money on kitchen cabinets, granite counter tops, stainless appliances..Then build a home with six inch walls to achieve an R-19 wall value then toss in an R-2 window.
 There are a lot of good replacement windows on the market.Look for a U value of 18 and Under on the entire glass,not just a nickel spot in the center. In other words look for a glass package with "warm edge"technology. Either Super Spacer premium, TPS or the like.
    Are your current windows wood? Vinyl? Aluminum?


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## billb3 (Feb 1, 2008)

3 years and they are falling apart or three years and  you wish you had bought better ones ?

My brother built when he had no money, cheaped out on windows and doors.
The doors went first, the windows took 15 years and mostly his fault for staining them and not  inspecting for the wood rotting away. They were quite weather tight. The glue in the finger joints started to fail and the sills were practically gone.

No warranty ?


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## Highbeam (Feb 1, 2008)

In my case, the replacement windows are going to be new windows. In my area the very dominant style is the sliding window which slides half of the total window horizontally to open. Remove the siding on top of the nail flange and take out the old window. Put new nice one in its place and fix the siding. Windows are pretty cheap it is the labor that seems to add up. Same deal with doors.


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## ericjeeper (Feb 1, 2008)

But are you going to just nail in a new window that is still not worth a hoot for efficiency? Good quality window are not cheap.. and are generally not available at the lumberyard. I am not going to push one brand over another. But you need to at least get a decent window or why bother?


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## TMonter (Feb 2, 2008)

> But are you going to just nail in a new window that is still not worth a hoot for efficiency? Good quality window are not cheap.. and are generally not available at the lumberyard. I am not going to push one brand over another. But you need to at least get a decent window or why bother?



Depends on what type of windows you currently have, how long you will spend in your house, future plans ect.

Spending a fortune on windows only to move a few years later means lost dollars on investment. Most "excellent" rated windows don't see R-Values better than 4 or 5 no matter what you do anyway.

For myself I'm thinking of installing a set of cheap windows because we currently have really bad leaky aluminum frame windows and they can be replaced for about $175 each for a cheap vinyl window or I can spend $1000+ for a good wood or fiberglass frame casement which are the best.


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## ericjeeper (Feb 2, 2008)

TMonter said:
			
		

> > But are you going to just nail in a new window that is still not worth a hoot for efficiency? Good quality window are not cheap.. and are generally not available at the lumberyard. I am not going to push one brand over another. But you need to at least get a decent window or why bother?
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 No todays "excellent" windows are rated between an R7 and an R10
 When tightening the envelope we need to bring the little numbers up. Adding more insulation in that attic to bring it up to an R50 is in vain if you have an r next to nothing window.


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## Highbeam (Feb 2, 2008)

Tmonter is my hero. It totally depends on what you are replacing. I too have leaky aluminum framed single pane windows. ANY cheap, double pane, vinyl, Estar rated window that I can find at the home depot will be worlds better. The incremental benefit of pouring huge sums of money into a fancy window will be essentially wasted. 

I'm trying to polish a turd. Turtle wax is fine.


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## ericjeeper (Feb 2, 2008)

wax on. LOL


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## jebatty (Feb 2, 2008)

Sometimes everybody is right. I used to buy a Chevy Impala rather than the Cad for the same reason. Now I buy the best selling model in the US which happens to carry a foreign name because never have seen such quality and efficiency at a competitive price.

You get what you pay for. We replaced all windows 14-15 years ago with R8 rated (yes, R8, center of glass), paid a steep price, and could not be more satisfied. When 30 ft of glass faces into howling winter winds with way below zero temps, a good window pays for itself in comfort regardless of the energy saving. In our case Cad luxury and price with that best selling model quality was the ticket.


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## sgcsalsero (Feb 3, 2008)

Biomass grower said:
			
		

> I built a very efficient home with all but one exception. The windows. I thought I had bought a mid-line window, and maybe it is. If it is a mid line window I would hate to see the low end cheap-o's. We built the house 3 years ago. They are double hung (which I'm told are not the most efficient). I am not sure how you go about replacing them though. Does the whole window frame need to be ripped out? And if so, how do "replacement" windows differ from just regular new windows? What brand does anyone recommend? Any questions/comments welcome.



Whatever you choose, check the rating on www.nfrc.org, maybe you also should check your existing windows for their rating. . .


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## SE Iowa (Feb 4, 2008)

Sorry so long to respond. The house is all brick and is on our farm which I will live in until I die. The windows I installed are not falling apart but just leak alot of air. We live out on the edge of the "prairie" so swift, cold canadian winds are common. When it is windy, we actually hear/see some of our blinds move (not much but obviously enough to notice). In addition we see condensation along the bottoms of the glass regularly when the temps are <25F. When it gets really cold (0F to -20F) we have ice/frost on the bottoms of the wood window frames too. Oh yeah, They have aluminum outsides and wood interiors. The other night we had 50 mph wind with -10F temps. It was "good" in that I could run my fingers around the fram to see where it was coming in at. It seemed to be mostly at the corners and where the bottom window slides in the frame. It is not the end of the world, I'm just disappointed because I spent 2 yrs building an ICF home on our farm and expected them to be better. As a side note, we do have 2 HRV's to vent the house so there is not really alot of moisture problems on the inside.


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## loneeagle15 (Feb 5, 2008)

We just replaced our bedroom windows with Shuco brand and have never been able to leave the bed under the window in the winter and that was using the heater it's our first years with a wood stove as our sole source of heat and we left the bed under the window
They are a little pricey but we think worth it we have decided to replace the front windows also so now the stove should really cook


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## ericjeeper (Feb 6, 2008)

jd said:
			
		

> We just replaced our bedroom windows with Shuco brand and have never been able to leave the bed under the window in the winter and that was using the heater it's our first years with a wood stove as our sole source of heat and we left the bed under the window
> They are a little pricey but we think worth it we have decided to replace the front windows also so now the stove should really cook


 Schuco windows were an excellent window. They have been sold to "Four seasons"  If you are seriously considering replacing the rest of the windows. You need to order them now if matching colors and exterior frame style matters.
 There is another nice window out there called Home Guard Regency line. They use the same AFG glass as Schuco. But use a super spacer premium. They are listed on the NRC site. 
 Their service is far better than Schuco Two week turn around. Plus they offer a glass breakage original ower lifetime gurantee.
 Sorry not trying to sell anything here. Just advising of a high quality product.


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## kjklosek (Feb 6, 2008)

Biomass grower said:
			
		

> Sorry so long to respond. The house is all brick and is on our farm which I will live in until I die. The windows I installed are not falling apart but just leak alot of air. We live out on the edge of the "prairie" so swift, cold canadian winds are common. When it is windy, we actually hear/see some of our blinds move (not much but obviously enough to notice). In addition we see condensation along the bottoms of the glass regularly when the temps are <25F. When it gets really cold (0F to -20F) we have ice/frost on the bottoms of the wood window frames too. Oh yeah, They have aluminum outsides and wood interiors. The other night we had 50 mph wind with -10F temps. It was "good" in that I could run my fingers around the fram to see where it was coming in at. It seemed to be mostly at the corners and where the bottom window slides in the frame. It is not the end of the world, I'm just disappointed because I spent 2 yrs building an ICF home on our farm and expected them to be better. As a side note, we do have 2 HRV's to vent the house so there is not really alot of moisture problems on the inside.



Sounds like an installation problem as well.

If the windows were not installed square then they will not seal properly.  Especially at the meeting rail in the center of the window, where the bottom rail meets the sill, and at the top along the header.

Also if they were not flashed properly on the outside and/or the installer skipped the silicone on the nailing flange, that also adds to air leakage.

You may be able to pull the casing from the inside of the house from one window to see if there is insulation between the window jamb and the framing as well.  If not. then a can of minimal expanding foam can help that.  As long as you don't mind removing all the casing and putting it back.  Of course that assumes you have wood casing and not a drywall wrap.  However if the unit was installed out of square, there really is no good fix except for a re-install.

Even mediocre windows will perform poorly if improperly installed.  However, with careful attention paid to the details, they can be quite efficient.

About 90% of the homes I worked on as a finish carpenter had poorly installed windows with incorrect flashing details or no flashing or insulation at all.  Most were slammed in and were lucky to have a few nails to hold them in place to keep them from flopping out of the hole.

J.P.


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