# What I was told at the fireplace store



## dave11 (Jul 10, 2008)

I have a large, old masonry fireplace that I want to convert to either NG, wood, or pellets. I visited a local FP shop, very large, and was told the following:

1. There is no difference among the brands Heat&Glo;, Quadrafire, or Heatilator, as they are all made in the same factory, so buy whichever has the better deal. This particular dealer sold certain models of the first two only. 

2. There is no cost advantage to using wood or pellets, as their cost is rising with the cost of gasoline, and their installation cost is higher. The cost savings that remain are offset by the work involved. So everyone should be using gas except those who have cheap/free wood. 

3. The risk of fire and liability is somewhat higher with wood stoves, both to the installer and the homeowner, compared to NG. 

Clearly, I was being led, but I was wondering if those here would like to agree or not with any  or all of these sentiments. 

Thanks.


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## savageactor7 (Jul 10, 2008)

Huh! I'm shocked...no difference between brands. But they all have different efficiency ratings. 

My only comment is that if you have to buy wood...do you really save money? It's been so long since I've bought fuel oil 20+ years... I dunno. As far as pellets go I think the salesperson may be wrong cause they're made from waste material....so imo they'll be the most competitive.

Western Pa is remote I'm thinking you can get wood at a reasonable price or consider burning coal...still has to be less expensive than nat. gas or LP...and it might be worth the ride to hear what other stove dealers are recommending.


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## Jay777 (Jul 10, 2008)

Well I'm sure different people have different reasons for going to wood..

In my case, I've been told that a cord is about 125 gallons of heating oil.  So let's call it $280/cord should save me $500/125-gal at current prices, so every cord burned saves $200 in rounded down numbers.  Of course, if oil prices go up, any cords I stack now save extra money on top of that.

Obviously even with bought wood there's a lot of work going into it..  stacking, hauling, stoking, cleaning ash, etc.  So it's more a work-for-money arrangement where I make a few extra bucks an hour for moving wood around 

But the most important thing for me is self-sufficiency.  If something happens in the world and there's no heating oil available for a period, I can still heat my house.  If I run out of wood, I can still cut down trees (though okay, I don't have a chainsaw at the moment  but I do have a maul, etc.).  And, eventually, I can get several YEARS ahead on my heating needs.

For what it's worth, I also have a solar oven, a number of kerosene lamps, several barrels of water...  I'm a suburban survivalist


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## fossil (Jul 10, 2008)

https://www.hearth.com/econtent/index.php/articles/fuel_cost_comparison_calculator/


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## begreen (Jul 10, 2008)

And if gas is not available? Sounds like a lot of smoke and not much help.

What do you want as a final product?


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## Jay777 (Jul 10, 2008)

fossil said:
			
		

> https://www.hearth.com/econtent/index.php/articles/fuel_cost_comparison_calculator/


Hmm.. that comparison seems to indicate 25M BTU for a cord of hardwood, and 15M BTU for 100 gallons of oil (with the same efficiency for the furnace).  So that would be about 165 gals = 1 cord, so saving even more.  Of course, the house is set up to heat the space more efficiently with oil, so I have no problem downgrading that back to 125 gals to be conservative.


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## dave11 (Jul 10, 2008)

Hi everyone. Thanks for the thoughtful replies. I admit I was surprised by what I heard the salesman say, but I'm sort of new to this alternative-heating world, and wanted to hear what others had to say.

Does anyone know if it's really true that Quadrafire, Heat&Glo;, and Heatilator are all made in the same place? I had heard good things about Quadrafire, but this particular shop only sold gas inserts from Heat&Glo;, and I was told there was no difference.

As for the wood vs. pellets. vs NG, I can't say much, because I've never heated with wood or pellets. So I don't know how bothersome the extra work would become. I like the self-sufficiency aspect, and the lower cost, and so I still might try it. The salesperson sure seemed against it though. 

I will definitely visit some other shops.


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## myzamboni (Jul 10, 2008)

If you do go wood(not pellets), you better get going on getting some or you will have a frustrating winter trying to burn green wood.


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## fossil (Jul 10, 2008)

Dave, before you jump right off the deep end into the wide wonderful world of woodburning, take some time to learn about all the ramifications.  It really takes a lot of work and a personal comittment/love for it, or else you'll hate it.  NG is so incredibly convenient...flip the button on the thermostat, and you're done.  Heating with wood, even pellets, isn't nearly so simple as that.  It goes far beyond just the "cost comparator"...it's your time, and your effort, and how you choose to spend them.  Rick


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## bartlett920 (Jul 10, 2008)

As far as the pellets I know about Jan. and Feb. people are scrambling around in Kansas trying to find them every year. If you did decide to go pellet I would go Multi Fuel stoves because you can always find corn even though the price maybe higher!


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## Girl (Jul 10, 2008)

I have lived in two places that heated via natural gas even though it was a long time ago, heating with wood a lot less if my memory serves me right.
I get so much satisfaction heating with wood and if I move from here it will be a major adjustment not just pocketbook wise, I love wood burning.


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## Dix (Jul 11, 2008)

Definately do some leg work. I hit 3 semi local stores, got lucky at the 3rd (3rd times the charm, so they say )

I started scouting the net, then ended up here. Got ALOT of info. 

The first stop left me very 
	

		
			
		

		
	






	

		
			
		

		
	
, so I kept reading here.

My second stop was 
	

		
			
		

		
	





	

		
			
		

		
	
.  I read here more, and asked a couple of questions.

3rd stop 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




It'll come to you, like a door, opening and closing


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## stoveguy2esw (Jul 11, 2008)

dave11 said:
			
		

> I have a large, old masonry fireplace that I want to convert to either NG, wood, or pellets. I visited a local FP shop, very large, and was told the following:
> 
> 1. There is no difference among the brands Heat&Glo;, Quadrafire, or Heatilator, as they are all made in the same factory, so buy whichever has the better deal. This particular dealer sold certain models of the first two only.
> 
> ...


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## stoveguy2esw (Jul 11, 2008)

shogun , that was probably the most entertaining post ive seen yet, love the smilies bro


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## RedRanger (Jul 11, 2008)

Dave if you like paying yourself for exercise then go with wood.  Don`t be fooled though, wood heat will spoil you rotten.  Once you start enjoying that constant heat you won`t ever be happy with anything else.  The other "problem" with wood heat is that you will soon get used to 75-80 degree temps and won`t want to settle for anything less in the winter.  Kinda sucks, huh?

Seriously, I am in my sixties and will never enjoy any other kind of heat.  But then again, like most of the other (nut cases) on this forum, I also enjoy the work involved with splitting , stacking, and most important of all--when that is done--like the rest of the crazies here, I go constantly to my wood piles and just look at them with admiration. 

So if you want to be independent, and save tonnes of money, then by all means, welcome to the loonie wood  bin. :-S


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## dave11 (Jul 11, 2008)

Thanks everyone for the suggestions. And thanks to Eileen for the inspiring emoticons. 

I'll visit some more shops tomorrow.


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## burntime (Jul 11, 2008)

If they are all the same then why be in business of selling them, comodity sellers have no control over price!


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## Dix (Jul 11, 2008)

Ah, I gave this MUCH thought

Mike before you read further, you need to have a camera handy for when you read the  next line. Please. Trust me. I want a pic. I really do. Of your face, or atleast the recorded laughing !



*insert needed pause here***




Mike, my name is Eileen. (I wish I had a camera)






Shogunjack is my 28 YO Quarter Horse gelding.











Glad you like the emoticons


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## joustinghill (Jul 11, 2008)

Shogunjack said:
			
		

> Ah, I gave this MUCH thought
> 
> Mike, my name is Eileen. (I wish I had a camera)



Heh!  Nice to see another horsewoman here.  Was starting to think I was the only girl around.

I imagine this picture will explain my username.


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## Dix (Jul 11, 2008)

Oh, how cool   I have friends who do the jousting thing  Mostly western pleasure here.

I have 2 other mares, both paints.

I'm waiting for a thread on "Post A Pic Of Your Truck"


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## webbie (Jul 11, 2008)

In some ways, that dealer told the truth - when it comes to wood or pellet against Nat Gas - Pellets can often be more money when everything is figured in, and it does take a lot more work. Wood can save money, but it takes work......

As to those brands, they are all made by the same company...but, they are made to serve various markets. For instance, only Quad makes pellet stoves - and Quad does not make cheapo builder grade fireplaces (like Heatilator). 

I think you have to take one step at a time - narrow it to the fuel you want to burn, and then start thinking about the brands.


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## fossil (Jul 11, 2008)

Shogunjack said:
			
		

> I'm waiting for a thread on "Post A Pic Of Your Truck"



Eileen, you don't have to wait, nor do you have to hijack Dave's thread...there's a whole forum here called "The Perfect Picture" where you can start your own thread with pictures of your truck, or your horse's butt, or anything (well, almost anything) else you want.  Of course, finding at least some obtuse relationship to woodburning is a plus.  There's a thread on there filled with pics of folks' tractors, one filled with pics of folks' woodpiles, and on and on.  Rick


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## skamp (Jul 11, 2008)

sonnyinbc said:
			
		

> Dave if you like paying yourself for exercise then go with wood.  Don`t be fooled though, wood heat will spoil you rotten.  Once you start enjoying that constant heat you won`t ever be happy with anything else.  The other "problem" with wood heat is that you will soon get used to 75-80 degree temps and won`t want to settle for anything less in the winter.  Kinda sucks, huh?
> 
> Seriously, I am in my sixties and will never enjoy any other kind of heat.  But then again, like most of the other (nut cases) on this forum, I also enjoy the work involved with splitting , stacking, and most important of all--when that is done--like the rest of the crazies here, I go constantly to my wood piles and just look at them with admiration.
> 
> So if you want to be independent, and save tonnes of money, then by all means, welcome to the loonie wood  bin. :-S


Sonnyinbc your my hero. Your mindset is what I hope mine will be at your age. I have exercised since I was young guy I love all kinds. When I used to hunt deer I loved the exercise I got from hiking around. So anyways your my new hero. ;-)


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## Dix (Jul 11, 2008)

No hijack intended, my apologies if it came off that way.

Once you start talking horse, well, I guess it's like talking stove, boiler, or insert.

They are both an addiction


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## stoveguy2esw (Jul 11, 2008)

Shogunjack said:
			
		

> Ah, I gave this MUCH thought
> 
> Mike before you read further, you need to have a camera handy for when you read the  next line. Please. Trust me. I want a pic. I really do. Of your face, or atleast the recorded laughing !
> 
> ...



 thanks for the warning , i would have painted your gelding with crown. im still laughing! 

pleasure is all mine Eileen nice to make your aquaintence


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## gibson (Jul 11, 2008)

I found many of the stove dealers that I dealt with to be fountains of misinformation.  There are good ones though.


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## dave11 (Jul 11, 2008)

As I reread the comments on this thread I started earlier today, I find myself saying: "Wow, what a great and interesting group of people."

All comments have been thought-provoking.

And two women equestrians to boot.

To the Webmaster--I probably should have specified the context of the salesman's comment regarding the three brands. They sell Heat&Glo;gas inserts, but not Quadra-fire gas inserts. I had asked about the Quadra-fire gas inserts initially, and was told they carried only Heat&glo;, and that there was no difference. I'm wondering if anyone knows that to be true or false. 

Thanks to all.


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## stoveguy2esw (Jul 11, 2008)

Shogunjack said:
			
		

> Oh, how cool   I have friends who do the jousting thing  Mostly western pleasure here.
> 
> I have 2 other mares, both paints.
> 
> I'm waiting for a thread on "Post A Pic Of Your Truck"



i can do that...


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## fossil (Jul 11, 2008)

Shogunjack said:
			
		

> No hijack intended, my apologies if it came off that way.
> 
> Once you start talking horse, well, I guess it's like talking stove, boiler, or insert.
> 
> They are both an addiction



Oh, don't get me _started_ on boilers!   :bug:   Rick


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## fossil (Jul 11, 2008)

stoveguy2esw said:
			
		

> ...i can do that...



Oh boy.  Here we go...straight to the Ash Can.   :lol:  Hang in there, Dave...stick with us, buddy!  Rick


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## stoveguy2esw (Jul 11, 2008)

fossil said:
			
		

> stoveguy2esw said:
> 
> 
> 
> ...



sorry was baited, ok back to buisness folks , my bad


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## dave11 (Jul 11, 2008)

Woa, Rick and Steve. If you want to talk about boilers, let's have at it. I just decided AGAINST replacing my ancient gas hog furnace with a radiant system, BECAUSE of the boiler issues. That was after two months of research. I'm game if either of you are.


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## dave11 (Jul 11, 2008)

Sorry, I should have directed that to Rick and MIKE.


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## fossil (Jul 11, 2008)

dave11 said:
			
		

> ...If you want to talk about boilers, let's have at it.



Just a really abstract reference, Dave...I was a Navy ship propulsion engineer for 30+ years...those are the boilers I know about (and how I got my nickname).  I don't know beans about home heating-type boilers.  I don't even own a horse.  But I _do_ have a truck.   :coolsmile:   Rick


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## dave11 (Jul 11, 2008)

Rick--very nice ride. I mainly drive an old Blazer, but I love my John Deere and all-powerful Husqvarna chainsaw even more. But no one wants to see pics of those. Hopefully we'll get to see Eileen's truck too. My curiosity has been piqued...


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## fossil (Jul 11, 2008)

dave11 said:
			
		

> ...Hopefully we'll get to see Eileen's truck too. My curiosity has been piqued...



Yeah, mine too, I'd like to see it.  You may have to start a whole new thread to get any really useful information out of this crowd...but believe me, the crowd here has _lots_ of useful information to give.  Just gotta put up with a little summertime wandering off-topic.     Yer doin' great, Dave...and I don't think I ever said "Welcome to the forum!"  Rick


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## begreen (Jul 11, 2008)

Enuf trux,  could we possibly hear about what brought you into the stove store in the first place and what the goal is?


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## RedRanger (Jul 11, 2008)

[quote author="skamp" date="1215755344"

So if you want to be independent, and save tonnes of money, then by all means, welcome to the loonie wood  bin. :-S[/quote]
Sonnyinbc your my hero. Your mindset is what I hope mine will be at your age. I have exercised since I was young guy I love all kinds. When I used to hunt deer I loved the exercise I got from hiking around. So anyways your my new hero. ;-)[/quote]

Sorry skamp:   wrong guy for a hero--I am even more evil than brother bart. Talk about deer hunting?  My brother-in-law shot our first deer when I was only 21 and when we went to clean it, well, we had a "gut fight"  that is to say throwing the guts and stuff at each other to see who would look the worst at the end of the day?  Can`t recall who got the worst of it, but just goes to show "hero`s "  ain`t what ya think?

Texan`s are evil!!  Canadians are even more evil!! ;-P 

Sniff, sniff, I smell Ash Can.


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## jtp10181 (Jul 11, 2008)

Ok you want to info about those three brands.... I can tell you anything you want to know.

Ok...

- All the wood or pellet STOVES and INSERTS are labeled Quadrafire and made at the Quad plant in Colville, WA.
- All the open face ZC prefab wood units (branded heat & glo or Heatilator) are made at the Heatilator plant in Muscatine, IA
- Most (maybe all) of the direct vent gas units (ZC and insert) with all three brands are made at the Heat & Glo plant in Lave City, MN
- I think Quad makes all the cast and FS gas stove at their plant, and also Heatilator might make some gas units at their plant.


No they are not all the same, Heatilator is the "value" brand, Heat & Glo is all about "innovation" and Quad is the "rugged" brand.

- Heatilator usually is a basic unit with less features and less accessory options, they give you a basic quality fireplace with a good price.

- Heat & Glo is always looking for the newest and best technology and designs, they also have many designer fronts and accessories. This sometimes comes with a hefty price.

- Quad is all about being rugged and tough looking, they have all the wood stoves and pellet units, and the 7100FP has more features and bigger firebox than the HNG and HTL alternatives. Their gas units have fronts make out of things like hand hammered steel give them that high end look.

Any questions?


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## dave11 (Jul 11, 2008)

Hi all. 

BeGreen asked about my motivation for visiting the FP store. That's a really drawn-out story, but the very short version is that I have the need to add a large supplementary heat source, and I have a large, long-dormant masonry fireplace (firebox is 42.5 wide x 24.5 deep x 29 high). From what I've read here and elsewhere, the most sensible thing is to put an equally large insert in the FP, which would be aesthetically pleasing and make the FP actually useful, instead of just letting warm air leak up the chimney.

So mainly, I want a big supplementary heat source. I agree NG would be easiest, but I'm open to at least the idea of "working" with wood. But probably for that location in the house, NG makes more sense, so I guess that's where I'll focus. Maybe later I'll put a wood insert in the basement FP.

Comments from jtp10181 about the three brands cleared up a lot. If i'm reading them right though, it would seem the salesman was wrong to say that since the gas inserts made by HNG and Quad were made in the same factory, there's no difference between them. And so if I'm mainly looking at gas inserts at this point, I should consider the two brands separately. (That particular store only sells gas inserts from HNG)

Today I'm off to visit three more FP stores. I'm sure I'll learn some more surprising things along the way. If so, I'll post them for critiquing.


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## jtp10181 (Jul 11, 2008)

If you want a gas insert that looks like a cast iron stove, look at the Quad units. Otherwise, you have seen what Heat & Glo has to offer (not cast iron). They are probably similar in the BTU, heat output, and the firebox itself. But the surrounds and fronts that Quad offers are much different.  Out of the three brands that we sell, probably 98% of the gas inserts are Heat & Glo.


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## dave11 (Jul 11, 2008)

Hi jtp10181. If the 75% AFUE for the HNG FB-Grand is to be believed, it's pretty hard to beat. The Quad Hudson has AFUE listed at 66%, a significant difference. Since I plan to use it quite a lot in the colder months, performance is more important than looks or style.


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## Dix (Jul 12, 2008)

How did you make out at the stove shops, Dave?

If'n I were closer, I could give you a hand hauling her home 






The vehicle affectionately known as "The Beast". 

I'll be using it to tow home the "feel free to use it, it's just sitting here" splitter, amongst other things. I also have a friend taking out a tree in her yard, to big for the truck alone, so I'll be using the trailer to put wood in as well.

Now back to your regularly scheduled Dave Thread


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## fossil (Jul 12, 2008)

I just _knew_ she was gonna do that, didn't you, Dave?  (Nice rig, Eileen!)  Rick


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## Dix (Jul 12, 2008)

It's got the Tow Command sytem. Hook up your trailer, get going to 50 MPH, set your _in dash_ controls, and it's done. Pretty much forever.

Helps for hauling heavier loads.

Quite handy for hauling wood. I've never had a really heavy load in the bed, aside from compost. I hauled that 25 miles... never even knew that I had a heavy load, in "haul" mode, once I got going.

And yes, I was safely able to stop


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## dave11 (Jul 12, 2008)

LOL--yeah Rick, I knew she couldn't resist. Equestrians are all about "showing."

But a very nice rig there, Eileen. We have some good ol' gals here in PA who would be jealous.

Was that photo taken where you live? It reminds me of the sandy forested shores of the FLA panhandle, where once I roamed. I assume though it's NY.

Three FP stores today. One was OOB, though their ad just came out in the new phone book.

At the second, no sales pitch at all. The proprietess was busy arguing with her credit card rep at the bank. I picked up the relevant brochures as I checked out the models, and left.

Third one--the sales woman basically read the respective brochures to me. She didn't seem to know any more than that about it.

But as I mentioned earlier, i'm leaning toward the HNG Grand-FB gas insert, because of the (relatively) high AFUE of 75%. I decided after that I'll pursue a wood burning stove for my basement workshop. My goal this winter is to not use the central furnace at all.


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## fossil (Jul 12, 2008)

Dave, if your focus for the time being is gonna be on a NG insert, which it sounds like it is...there's a whole other forum on this site, "It's a Gas!", where you're more likely to find the experts.  Over here in the Hearth Room, we're just a bunch of log schleppers.  I'm certainly not trying to dissuade you from participation here, but the folks over there may have more information and less off-topic inanety to offer (from what I understand, those gas-heads are a pretty serious bunch).  When it's time to talk about that woodburner for downstairs, we'll still be here trying to impress and amuse each other.  Of course, there's no rule you can't be participating in both places...or as many as you like.  Hearth.com is a world unto itself.  Rick


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## iceman (Jul 12, 2008)

Jay777 said:
			
		

> Well I'm sure different people have different reasons for going to wood..
> 
> In my case, I've been told that a cord is about 125 gallons of heating oil.  So let's call it $280/cord should save me $500/125-gal at current prices, so every cord burned saves $200 in rounded down numbers.  Of course, if oil prices go up, any cords I stack now save extra money on top of that.
> 
> ...



lmao!!   yes you are going green but where in west mass are you???    nhamp?  pitt?  blanford? savoy?   
hopefully you are close to me...  i am going to start a west mass club on here ... we all get together cut split stack and go house to house !!


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## dave11 (Jul 12, 2008)

Hi again Rick. When I started this post, I was still undecided about wood vs. gas, but now I can see the right way to go. Gas insert in the big LR firebox, wood stove in the basement workshop, and maybe a gas stove in the Master BR. All local heat, and no ducts. If it works out, then scrap the ancient furnace.

I was pretty much thinking this particular post was getting stale anyway, and probably no one wants to scroll all the way to the end. I still haven't figured out what the Ash Can is, but we're probably tempting fate nonetheless.   

Hopefully Eileen will continue her emoticon artistry. And I'll keep lurking/learning from you folks who are further ahead on this road.

Talk to you soon.

Dave


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## fossil (Jul 12, 2008)

Dave, when you're posting a post here like you just posted, can't you just scroll up the page and see the line that reads:  "Forum Home > Forums > The Hearth Room > Thread" ?  Click on "Forums"...opens up the whole world of places to meet and greet on Hearth.com  See ya around the site!  Rick


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## dave11 (Jul 12, 2008)

Rick, yeah I can. I meant to say that those who haven't been following this from the beginning probably don't want to read four pages of stuff to figure out what the last comments are about. Especially since along the way we've wandered off into horses and trucks.

Tonight I'm looking online at all the choices for a wood stove for the basement shop. I'll probably be by tomorrow with questions for you folks.

Take care.


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## fossil (Jul 12, 2008)

Yeah, man...you too.  I saw you were active on the gas forum.  See ya!  Rick


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## begreen (Jul 12, 2008)

Dave, sounds like the decision is for a gas insert. I moved this to the gas forum for further discussion. If you want to start up a new thread with inquiries about the basement wood stove, no problem.


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## Ken C. (Aug 21, 2010)

RedRanger said:
			
		

> most important of all--when that is done--like the rest of the crazies here, I go constantly to my wood piles and just look at them with admiration.



What he said!   I caught myself tonight looking down at a pile of oak that I've been working on...


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## DanCorcoran (Aug 21, 2010)

My 2-cents worth:

Although there are differences in cost, to me the biggest differentiator among gas/pellets/wood is TIME.  Gas requires virtually no time, pellets more (buying, hauling, cleaning), and wood the most.  I've used all three.  My favorite (ignoring time) is wood.  I won't use pellets in my home again (in my shop is okay) due to messy cleaning.


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## PapaDave (Aug 21, 2010)

DanCorcoran said:
			
		

> My 2-cents worth:
> 
> Although there are differences in cost, to me the biggest differentiator among gas/pellets/wood is TIME.  *Gas requires virtually no time*, pellets more (buying, hauling, cleaning), and wood the most.  I've used all three.  My favorite (ignoring time) is wood.  I won't use pellets in my home again (in my shop is okay) due to messy cleaning.




Dan, I have to somewhat disagree. How much time does it take you to earn the money to pay the gas man? Rhetorically speaking, since that's none of my business.
I'm really not trying to be argumentative, but I worked for almost 35 yrs., retired, then started burning wood. If you have no time left at the end of your work day, then you just pay the gas man from your salary/wages and move along. Been there, bought the t-shirt, etc......
Burning wood saves me at least 200-300/month, for the 7 months we burn. When working, I could make that extra money in pretty short order, but retired, not so much. They ALL require time/money............which one do you have most?
For me, it turned into a lifestyle change. LOTS of work, but I don't do it all in a weekend, and now that I'm ahead of the game, life has gotten more retiring-like. :cheese: 
Cool avatar,...your house?


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## spirilis (Aug 22, 2010)

wow someone dug up a blast from the past... I love it when people do that on web forums


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## firefighterjake (Aug 23, 2010)

spirilis said:
			
		

> wow someone dug up a blast from the past... I love it when people do that on web forums



That's been happening a lot lately . . . maybe we should have a contest to see who can dig up the oldest thread on this forum . . . and still be able to post a relevant comment to that thread.


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## 70marlin (Aug 23, 2010)

RedRanger said:
			
		

> Dave if you like paying yourself for exercise then go with wood.  Don`t be fooled though, wood heat will spoil you rotten.  Once you start enjoying that constant heat you won`t ever be happy with anything else.  The other "problem" with wood heat is that you will soon get used to 75-80 degree temps and won`t want to settle for anything less in the winter.  Kinda sucks, huh?
> 
> Seriously, I am in my sixties and will never enjoy any other kind of heat.  But then again, like most of the other (nut cases) on this forum, I also enjoy the work involved with splitting , stacking, and most important of all--when that is done--like the rest of the crazies here, I go constantly to my wood piles and just look at them with admiration.
> So if you want to be independent, and save tonnes of money, then by all means, welcome to the loonie wood  bin. :-S





ditto!!


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## jtp10181 (Aug 24, 2010)

Nevermind.... after I posted I see this post if super old. I never read it to the end before I posted...


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## daleeper (Aug 24, 2010)

dave11 said:
			
		

> I decided after that I'll pursue a wood burning stove for my basement workshop. My goal this winter is to not use the central furnace at all.



Dave11, your confusing me a bit.  You don't want to use the central furnace, yet you are willing to install a nat. gas insert?  Maybe we don't see the whole picture here?

If your gas furnace is an older less efficient model, I would think that a new efficient one would be better money spent than the gas insert.  Then work toward updating both fireplaces with wood burning inserts.  

Wood pellet market is unreliable, you need to be able to purchase and store a whole season of pellets to be cost effective (at least in this area).  

If you have the wood to cut, or enjoy wood heat and the work that goes with it, then wood heat is wonderful, and you help out whoever you are buying wood from.  But you have to enjoy it, or you will be using that gas heat, and if you are going to do that, then you might as well be doing it with a good efficient furnace.


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