# "Stupid" Energy Saving Tips



## semipro (Jan 2, 2014)

I came across this today and found it interesting. Thought I'd share. I definitely don't agree with No. 8. No. 2 was mentioned here lately. No. 7 has been seen floating around Hearth for a while as I recall. 

From: http://www.greenbuildingadvisor.com...r&utm_campaign=green-building-advisor-eletter

*The Top Ten List of stupid energy tips*
Here’s my top ten list — common tips that show up repeatedly.

*1. Fill your half-empty refrigerator or freezer with plastic bottles filled with water.* This stupid tip will never save you enough energy to show up on your electric bill. Nevertheless, the advice is provided by the California Energy Commission, an electric utility called NV Energy, Avista Utilities, Wisconsin Public Service, Georgia Natural Gas, an electric utility called National Grid, Connecticut Light & Power, EnergyRight Solutions, and many others.

*2. Clean the dust off your refrigerator’s heat-exchange coils.* As I’ve noted before, researchers haven’t been able to measure any energy savings resulting from this measure. But a lack of data hasn’t stopped the following sources from advising homeowners to get out the vacuum cleaner: NV Energy, Connecticut Light & Power, and EnergyRight Solutions.

*3. Schedule an annual furnace tune-up.* As Michael Blasnik has shown, there is no evidence to support the idea that the cost of an annual furnace tune-up can ever be recouped by energy savings. This tip (often referred to as the “make-work-for-HVAC-techs” tip) is trumpeted by an electric utility called WE Energies, Wisconsin Public Service, a New Mexico electric utility called PNM, EnergyRight Solutions, and a utility named Alliant Energy.

*4. Change your furnace filters monthly.* Monthly? Really? Yes — according to Wisconsin Public Service and EnergyRight Solutions.

*5. To reduce the rate of air leakage in your home, start by caulking around windows.* Actually, the big leaks are in your attic and basement, not around your windows. That doesn’t stop many sources from offering the “caulk your windows” advice. Among the guilty are the
California Energy Commission, NV Energy, WE Energies, the California Natural Resources Agency, Virginia Energy Sense, and a utility called NSTAR Electric & Gas. (The tip from NSTAR even includes a definition of the word “weatherize.” The site advises, “Weatherize your home by caulking and weather-stripping all doors and windows.”)

*6. Install foam gaskets under your electrical outlet covers.* There are only two problems with the advice: electrical outlets aren’t a major air leakage point, and gaskets don’t stop air leaks at this location. These two small problems don’t prevent the following sources from providing the tip: the California Energy Commission, a gas utility called PSNC Energy,  Alliant Energy, and CNN.

*7. Run your ceiling fans backwards during the winter.* No researcher has ever been able to show that this practice saves energy. This tip may even make you uncomfortable enough to turn up the thermostat, raising your energy bills. But the advice is provided by Duke Energy, Alabama Power, an electric utility called Xcel Energy, and  a Sustainability blog on the University of Illinois at Chicago web site.

*8. Run your air conditioner and ceiling fans simultaneously.* According to a 1996 paper (“Are Energy Savings Due to Ceiling Fans Just Hot Air?”) by P. James, Jeffrey Sonne, R. Vieira, Danny Parker, and M. Anello, “Data from 386 surveyed Central Florida households suggests that although fans are used an average of 13.4 hours per day, no statistically valid difference can be observed in thermostat settings between households using fans and those without them.” In other words, homeowners who run their ceiling fans and air conditioners simultaneously would be better off if they turned off their ceiling fans. This bad advice is provided by WE Energies and a utility called PSE&G.

*9. Locate your air conditioner condenser in the shade to keep it cool.* This myth was debunked many years ago by researchers at the Florida Solar Energy Center. Yet it still keeps cropping up, most recently in advice provided by PSNC Energy.

*10. During the winter, close your curtains at night to save energy.* When this advice is repeated, the authors usually fail to mention that you need a way to stop air from flowing between the curtain and the window — or else convection currents will sabotage your efforts to save energy. This incomplete tip is provided by many sources, including Connecticut Light & Power and the website of the National Association of Certified Home Inspectors.


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## Highbeam (Jan 2, 2014)

I would like to add my pet peave. The supposed vampire loads of wall warts are often touted as the evil energy hogs of a house. They're not.


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## bmblank (Jan 2, 2014)

But come on, those Wall warts are drawing milliamps per day!


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## Slow1 (Jan 2, 2014)

Highbeam said:


> I would like to add my pet peave. The supposed vampire loads of wall warts are often touted as the evil energy hogs of a house. They're not.



I can't agree more.  When I was on my extensive "kill-a-watt" kick I found that these loads (even with the older non-switching power supplies) make such a small percentage of the power used that they effectively don't matter.

However - exception to this is (as mentioned in another thread) TV and cable boxes that are actually running when folks think they are turned off - these really draw power.  I don't have a TiVo type device here but I imagine keeping one running 24/7 is bound to become significant.  So, the actual wall warts don't draw a whole lot, but some things plugged into them do even when not in use (poor designs in my opinion).


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## WarmBluthner (Jan 2, 2014)

When I draw the curtains the temperature in
my room rises significantly.


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## bmblank (Jan 2, 2014)

Curtains definitely work... As long as you have decent curtains and there isn't a convection current constantly rotating cool air around.


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## woodgeek (Jan 2, 2014)

A lot of what people sense with curtains is lower radiant cooling making them warmer.


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## fossil (Jan 2, 2014)

Some of the things on that list make sense to me, some don't.  In any case, whenever I see any sort of list by someone calling everyone else "stupid", I tend to pretty much ignore the arrogant bastard.


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## woodgeek (Jan 2, 2014)

I'd recommend reading the full article and skimming the comments.  The author has a lot of cred in the building science community.


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## fossil (Jan 2, 2014)

I don't imagine the guy is "stupid".  But why does he have to call a whole bunch of other people and organizations "stupid"?  It's his attitude I have a problem with, not whatever it is he knows.


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## semipro (Jan 2, 2014)

Above at least he calls the tips "stupid" not the ones that share them.  (I didn't go back an review the article)
I have to admit I've provided some stupid advice here on occasion but I'm hoping that doesn't make me stupid.


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## woodgeek (Jan 3, 2014)

I think the author, self-described 'Energy Nerd' Martin Holladay, is honestly trying to educate folks with a free blog, and is a little fed up that a lot of other sources, mostly utility companies, are putting out a continuous noise of 'stupid' suggestions that don't work, wasting honest folks' time, energy and money.

He's written different versions of this post every year around this time, and he gets a little outspoken in the post (typical for a long-form blog) and maintains a civil comment thread.

His bio is former hippie in the energy eff and related business since the 70s, with a significant multi-author web presence widely considered the go-to source for best practice info. 

Reminds me of *Craig*.


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## Circus (Jan 3, 2014)

These idea's aren't that bad, I've seen much stupider. "Solar air collectors for inside your window" go's beyond stupid, it's a ripoff.



WarmBluthner said:


> When I draw the curtains the temperature in my room rises significantly.


 Naughty, naughty



semipro said:


> Run your ceiling fans backwards during the winter. No researcher has ever been able to show that this practice saves energy


 Depends on ceiling height. A  high ceiling  is warmer than the floor. People live near floors.



semipro said:


> the big leaks are in your attic and basement, not around your windows.


 Ten minutes and $.50 of clear chalk between the moulding and  an uneven wall lowers infiltration. Worth doing.



semipro said:


> fill refrigerator with water bottles


 fewer start cycles equals longer life.


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## maple1 (Jan 3, 2014)

I wouldn't have thought No.9 was stupid.


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## starfoxACEFOX (Jan 3, 2014)

No. 2 wouldn't apply to newer refrigerator, ones with smaller condenser and uses fans. Would have to be clean, I have 4 husky and I get a lot of fur. I went without cleaning mine for 3 years one day I got error message saying refrigerator was overheating. It was because condenser was full of doggie fur. Because of that like any refrigerant base system, less heat moved longer it going to run.


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## Bret Chase (Jan 3, 2014)

Circus said:


> These idea's aren't that bad, I've seen much stupider. "Solar air collectors for inside your window" go's beyond stupid, it's a ripoff.
> Ten minutes and $.50 of clear chalk between the moulding and  an uneven wall lowers infiltration. Worth doing.
> .



If you have wood windows... caulking around them is just about the most efficient way to rot out the sill, particularly in older houses.  if you've got plastic or aluminum (They suck) windows.... knock yourself out....


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## DawsonBuck18 (Jan 3, 2014)

I live in Georgia.   It may be 24 degrees right now but it gets very hot here in he summer.   I have seven ceiling fans.  Personally, I can tolerate the thermostat set to 78 in August when the fans are all running, otherwise I would have to set the thermostat to 74.  It equates to significant savings in my all electric house.   

Running the monster 72 inch ceiling fan located in my living room just in front of my stove insert this winter is moving heat up the stair case to my second floor somehow.  I can verify this with my Kintrex infrared thermometer and I can see the cob webs on the stair case wall flap in the warm breeze when the ceiling fan is doing its thing.   I'm a believer in celing fans


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## Circus (Jan 3, 2014)

Bret Chase said:


> Circus said: ↑ These idea's aren't that bad, I've seen much stupider. "Solar air collectors for inside your window" go's beyond stupid, it's a ripoff. Ten minutes and $.50 of clear chalk between the moulding and an uneven wall lowers infiltration. Worth doing. .
> 
> Bret Chase,  Click to expand...If you have wood windows... caulking around them is just about the most efficient way to rot out the sill, particularly in older houses. if you've got plastic or aluminum (They suck) windows.... knock yourself out....


 
Caulk go's on the inside moulding/wall


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## peakbagger (Jan 4, 2014)

I must admit I run my ceiling fan backwards in my office on occasion in winter. I have tray type ceiling that is about 10 feet high at the top of tray. Heat tends to collect in this space even on cold days. If I run the fan forwards, I get draft from the fan which cools me down due to increase in convective heat loss on my upper body. By running the fan backwards, the draft is far less noticable as the air hits the ceiling and spreads out horizontally across the tray picking up heated ari and reducings its velocity until it drops down the tray into the main room at a far lower velocity.


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## semipro (Jan 4, 2014)

Circus said:


> Caulk go's on the inside moulding/wall


Sealing on the inside is effective only if the inside wall is constructed as a true air barrier (e.g. airtight drywall).
This is uncommon in the U.S.
http://www.finehomebuilding.com/how-to/departments/energy-smart-details/airtight-drywall.aspx

Edit: this applies to no. 6 above also.  Putting the foam gaskets on does no good because the boxes and outlets are leaky unless you go with airtight models (very uncommon).


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## semipro (Jan 4, 2014)

maple1 said:


> I wouldn't have thought No.9 was stupid.


Same here.  
Maybe its because condensers are convective devices and the radiation from the sun in insignificant comparatively.  You could say the air is cooler in the shade but if the condenser fan is operating as it should the cooler shaded air would be quickly mixed with that from sunlit areas negating any benefit.


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## woodgeek (Jan 4, 2014)

semipro said:


> Same here.
> Maybe its because condensers are convective devices and the radiation from the sun in insignificant comparatively.  You could say the air is cooler in the shade but if the condenser fan is operating as it should the cooler shaded air would be quickly mixed with that from sunlit areas negating any benefit.



If you read down the comments, that's exactly right. If you had a fan blowing a gale right in your face, could you feel the difference whether the sun was shining on it or not?


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## flyingcow (Jan 4, 2014)

Highbeam said:


> I would like to add my pet peave. The supposed vampire loads of wall warts are often touted as the evil energy hogs of a house. They're not.




I wish someone could convince my wife of that. Maddening sometimes....cell phone charger. And puts it away, the nerve, cleaning up after me.


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## Bret Chase (Jan 4, 2014)

Circus said:


> Caulk go's on the inside moulding/wall



caulking is used, at least in my area, on the inside, for entirely different purpose.  Caulks like Alex-Plus or S-W 950A are used to fill the gap between finish and the wall to provide a nice paint finish.  There is NO consideration given to air sealing in this application.  In my experience, the building envelope is closed from the outside, particularly in LEEDS certified structures.  Also, in my experience, caulking around wood windows, on the outside, in a 20+ year old structure will do nothing more than make them rot.


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## begreen (Jan 4, 2014)

I find the attitude of the writer somewhat condescending. At times the author appears to be grasping to make a point. Several of tips are partially stated or partial truths. For example, true that *some *insulated curtain installations are less effective than they could be. But,  insulated curtains can work and the fact that you need to be aware of cold air spill doesn't negate their effectiveness. Running a ceiling fan backward can be very effective at breaking up heat stratification in high and cathedral ceilings in a draft free fashion. It doesn't make one uncomfortable unless the fan is maybe at high speed. And just because this person hasn't found research on the topic, that doesn't mean it doesn't exist. Overall this fellow lost me after the first 5 refutes due to his arrogance and nit picking to make a point.


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## Circus (Jan 4, 2014)

semipro said:


> Sealing on the inside is effective only if the inside wall is constructed as a true air barrier (e.g. airtight drywall).


 
I once had a rude surprise, looking with a flashlight, under my kitchen cupboards. Mice chewed holes between the wall and the floor. I could see the exterior wall and could feel cold air bypassing all that carefully installed insulation.
"I hate meeces to pieces" Mr Jinks


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## Bret Chase (Jan 4, 2014)

Circus said:


> I once had a rude surprise, looking with a flashlight, under my kitchen cupboards. Mice chewed holes between the wall and the floor. I could see the exterior wall and could feel cold air bypassing all that carefully installed insulation.



mice will do that...


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## stoveguy2esw (Jan 5, 2014)

ive pulled the trim off from the inside of my windows and filled the cavities with "good stuff" and noticed a dramatic difference and have no evidence of rot at all in my wooden windows, might depend on climate though in VA where I live it does tend to be humid.

still its important to note that "hypersealing" a house causes all kinds of issues so as much as we want to seal her up and trap the heat, there is a point where the minuses outweigh the plusses


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## Bret Chase (Jan 5, 2014)

stoveguy2esw said:


> ive pulled the trim off from the inside of my windows and filled the cavities with "good stuff" and noticed a dramatic difference and have no evidence of rot at all in my wooden windows, might depend on climate though in VA where I live it does tend to be humid.
> 
> still its important to note that "hypersealing" a house causes all kinds of issues so as much as we want to seal her up and trap the heat, there is a point where the minuses outweigh the plusses



the problem comes not with insulation around the windows.  that is behind the "drain plane" of the wall. the drain plane being the housewrap, tar paper, rosin paper or whatever behind the siding.  the problem comes when the cold side of the wood window frame is sealed to the outside of the siding.  the water being driven through the wood from hot and humid (inside) and cold and dry (ouside). sealing it up super tight doesn't let the water *out*... particularly with tarpaper.

climate may play a large part of it... you're not going to see a temp differential (I/O) approaching 100 degrees in VA in a house, nor the massive difference in actual humidity between 68F humidified air and -15F that has almost zero water in it.


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## stoveguy2esw (Jan 5, 2014)

Bret Chase said:


> the problem comes not with insulation around the windows.  that is behind the "drain plane" of the wall. the drain plane being the housewrap, tar paper, rosin paper or whatever behind the siding.  the problem comes when the cold side of the wood window frame is sealed to the outside of the siding.  the water being driven through the wood from hot and humid (inside) and cold and dry (ouside). sealing it up super tight doesn't let the water *out*... particularly with tarpaper.
> 
> climate may play a large part of it... you're not going to see a temp differential (I/O) approaching 100 degrees in VA in a house, nor the massive difference in actual humidity between 68F humidified air and -15F that has almost zero water in it.


 

maybe so, currently its 38F outside with 83% humidity,raining, indoors its 75F and 28% humidity (according to my weather station) typically at that temp humidity outside on a non rainy day here is in the 50's in the summer for the most part we open the windows a lot only when its unbearable do we succumb and switch on the AC. so indoor and outdoor humidity tend to favor the indoors being either dryer or equal in my case


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## Cynnergy (Jan 6, 2014)

Re: 6

There is a 'cold cupboard' in the cabin (hole in the floor of the cupboard to the exterior, hole at the top of the cupboard leading up the wall cavity, hole at the top of the wall cavity in the attic to the exterior) and someone put an outlet box in that same wall cavity.  No insulation in that wall cavity.  A nice example of the stack effect for something other than flues.  And a perfect spot to keep the root veg and ales 6 months of the year.

A foam gasket turned the air coming out of the outlet from a gale-force wind into a light breeze.  So they aren't useless in every situation .


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## Sully (Jan 6, 2014)

Both refrigerator ones make sense. Dusty coil stopped my fridge from being cold, vacuumed it and it was all good. Keeping the empty space filled with ice bottles is more for a extended power outage. The more ice I. Freezer the longer it stays cold when electric is out


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## woodgeek (Jan 10, 2014)

I thought Mr. Hollidays' latest blog entry would fit in around here.....

http://www.greenbuildingadvisor.com/blogs/dept/musings/twenty-below-and-grid


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## semipro (Jan 10, 2014)

woodgeek said:


> I thought Mr. Hollidays' latest blog entry would fit in around here.....
> 
> http://www.greenbuildingadvisor.com/blogs/dept/musings/twenty-below-and-grid


No kidding.  A lot of folks on Hearth would appreciate this.


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## begreen (Jan 10, 2014)

Yes, that was funny. Repost that to the Inglenook thread on the cold weather .


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## Galt (Jan 14, 2014)

Love the blog article. Hit the proverbial nail with the insulation/air movement comment. Air tight is great as long as you manage humidity and air quality. Nothing like new carpet degassing or somebody using hair spray to make your air tight cabin in the woods its own little Auschwitz.
I seem to recall that Ted Nugent found out the hard way about the whole moisture thing when his cabin got so over run with black mold that they finally just abandoned it.


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## jharkin (Jan 14, 2014)

Slow1 said:


> I can't agree more.  When I was on my extensive "kill-a-watt" kick I found that these loads (even with the older non-switching power supplies) make such a small percentage of the power used that they effectively don't matter.
> 
> However - exception to this is (as mentioned in another thread) TV and cable boxes that are actually running when folks think they are turned off - these really draw power.  I don't have a TiVo type device here but I imagine keeping one running 24/7 is bound to become significant.  So, the actual wall warts don't draw a whole lot, but some things plugged into them do even when not in use (poor designs in my opinion).



+2 or +3    This one just keeps coming up in news articles, and as best I can tell must date back to before the days of switching power supplies _*if *_it was ever valid at all.  I've put cellphone chargers and even laptop bricks on the kill-a-watt and most of them read precisely zero when no device is connected.

But this is so engrained into people that you see behavior like my MIL who to this day still unplugs her toaster and coffeepot ever day after breakfast


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## Slow1 (Jan 14, 2014)

jharkin said:


> +2 or +3    This one just keeps coming up in news articles, and as best I can tell must date back to before the days of switching power supplies _*if *_it was ever valid at all.



My guess is that someone did a 'study' of some sort where they took the total number of these 'vampire' devices in the USA, calculated the total use and came up with some big scary number (probably expressed as MWh or "enough for xyz homes" or zzzlbs CO2) and didn't mention how this number relates to the total amount of energy used.


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## Bret Chase (Jan 14, 2014)

jharkin said:


> +2 or +3    This one just keeps coming up in news articles, and as best I can tell must date back to before the days of switching power supplies _*if *_it was ever valid at all.  I've put cellphone chargers and even laptop bricks on the kill-a-watt and most of them read precisely zero when no device is connected.
> 
> But this is so engrained into people that you see behavior like my MIL who to this day still unplugs her toaster and coffeepot ever day after breakfast



For me... having at fresh, hot pot of coffee waiting for me when I wake at 5am is worth any "vampire" power use.....


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## Dune (Jan 14, 2014)

Having a freezer full of jugs of ice is a good thing if you lose power for a couple days in the summer.


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## maple1 (Jan 15, 2014)

jharkin said:


> But this is so engrained into people that you see behavior like my MIL who to this day still unplugs her toaster and coffeepot ever day after breakfast


 
We unplug our toaster.

Not because of saving electricity, but because of an ingrained habit formed from hearing past stories within both sides of our family of plugged-in toasters mysteriously going up in smoke.

Anybody else hear such stories, or do we both have nutty families? Some of them were VFD members who claim to have seen house fires started by a plugged-in but unattended toaster.


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## jharkin (Jan 15, 2014)

maple1 said:


> We unplug our toaster.
> 
> Not because of saving electricity, but because of an ingrained habit formed from hearing past stories within both sides of our family of plugged-in toasters mysteriously going up in smoke.
> 
> Anybody else hear such stories, or do we both have nutty families? Some of them were VFD members who claim to have seen house fires started by a plugged-in but unattended toaster.



Thats actually the same reason my MIL unplugs hers.  Also leaves the door open to 'cool' after using it.   She could really care less about saving energy, every year her heat stays on till the day she turns on the central AC in may which in turn stays on till the day it switches back to heat in fall. I would guess that nobody in my parents generation in either my or my wifes family has any interst in anything 'green/conservation' beyond the saving money aspect...


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## Highbeam (Jan 15, 2014)

maple1 said:


> We unplug our toaster.
> 
> Not because of saving electricity, but because of an ingrained habit formed from hearing past stories within both sides of our family of plugged-in toasters mysteriously going up in smoke.
> 
> Anybody else hear such stories, or do we both have nutty families? Some of them were VFD members who claim to have seen house fires started by a plugged-in but unattended toaster.


 
I pull all plugs for all devices that aren't being used as soon as I'm done. It is an old habit and I'm not sure it's a bad habit. I also put the toaster and other counter top junk away in a cabinet after it cools. Clean.


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## Bret Chase (Jan 15, 2014)

Highbeam said:


> I pull all plugs for all devices that aren't being used as soon as I'm done. It is an old habit and I'm not sure it's a bad habit. I also put the toaster and other counter top junk away in a cabinet after it cools. Clean.



 My coffee pot, toaster and kitchenaid mixer get used at least 6 out of 7 days a week... so they stay on the counter


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## Bret Chase (Jan 15, 2014)

Dune said:


> Having a freezer full of jugs of ice is a good thing if you lose power for a couple days in the summer.



I keep a bunch of "cooler packs" in my chest freezer... that is certainly a side benefit... but they are in there for the warmer months to keep the beach cooler, well cold.


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## firebroad (Jan 16, 2014)

I have always been convinced that the person who thought placing radiators under windows for convection was a man.  No woman would dream of that design, for she knows that CURTAINS go over windows, and the warm air just goes right up behind them.   And 84" drapes are out of the question.


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## blades (Jan 17, 2014)

drapes that block air flow past a window can cause problems in some locations. We made our own and they did work very well to cut down on heat loss, but the down side was in areas that see high humidity spikes like a bath room or maybe bed room connected to bath they caused moisture to condense on the window assemblies as a whole this lead to water staining due to frost on window inside and in one case some mold formation on the sashes on the inside. At the time these were single pane 50 year old windows, certainly not the best infiltration wise either.
Over the past 4 years I have cut energy usage at home by 75% based on bills I was shown at time of puchase. Course some of that is just that I am single so not as much used.  Things I have done; gas furnace replaced by  smaller HE unit, hot water heater up graded, electric dryer replaced by gas, HE washer tub type not one of the front loads ( them things were problems with seals 40 years ago, hasn't changed much since.) Course the wood stove makes a big impact in the winter.  There some more areas needing attention  but due to being an all brick house they difficult to do/ pricy also- pay back might not even balance out in a reasonable time length.  Pay back time /cost ratio is what I look at. value at resale is nothing for the most part.


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## jdp1152 (Jan 18, 2014)

Circus said:


> I once had a rude surprise, looking with a flashlight, under my kitchen cupboards. Mice chewed holes between the wall and the floor. I could see the exterior wall and could feel cold air bypassing all that carefully installed insulation.
> "I hate meeces to pieces" Mr Jinks


Likewise.  Just pulled all my lower cabinets off and air sealed where numerous mice had made their way in. I put up a wire mesh barrier to at least prevent this from happening again though I also had new siding on the house recently with a foundation cap to prevent such unwanted visitors.


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