# What kind of winter tires are you using?



## Swedishchef (Feb 2, 2015)

Hey guys

Just checking out what people are running on their cars as winter tires (for those of you who are using them...for those who aren't, you should be!   )

On my 2 Subarus I have nokian hakkapeliitta 5s installed. A subaru becomes a snowmobile when you put on the Hakkas!

Andrew


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## bobdog2o02 (Feb 2, 2015)

General altimax arctic, on the forester....   Its a tank.


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## bioman (Feb 2, 2015)

Firestone Winterforce on my outback & haven't had any snow yet !


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## Knots (Feb 2, 2015)

Hercules (rebranded Cooper weather masters) on the commuter car.

Studded Master Craft (rebranded Cooper weather masters) on the truck.


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## dougstove (Feb 2, 2015)

Michelin X-Ice.
The Quebec mandatory snow tire requirement had a big effect on accidents there.


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## Swedishchef (Feb 2, 2015)

dougstove said:


> Michelin X-Ice.
> The Quebec mandatory snow tire requirement had a big effect on accidents there.


That's right Doug, they do!

Bioman, where do you live if you have not had snow yet? Bermuda? lol.

Subarus with winter tires become tanks indeed..my 2005 impreza and 2010 forester are like an A1!

A


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## firefighterjake (Feb 2, 2015)

Nothing right now . . . but on my wife's old Subaru I was running General Altimax Arctics . . . I need to figure out what to do with the winter tires since her new Legacy is running 17 inch wheels and those were 16 inch tires/rims.


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## bioman (Feb 2, 2015)

Swedishchef said:


> That's right Doug, they do!
> 
> Bioman, where do you live if you have not had snow yet? Bermuda? lol.
> 
> ...


Central missouri, This has been my kind of winter so far. & it could all change in the morning. I'm already planing my garden.


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## velvetfoot (Feb 2, 2015)

Skinny tires with studs.  Forget the make.  Getting a little worn.


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## fossil (Feb 2, 2015)

I like Bridgestone Blizzaks. but I'm sure there are many good ones on the market.  Better traction then studs, no road damage.  Oregon and Washington are seriously looking at either prohibiting studded tires or charging an extra road maintenance/repair fee if you want to run them.  The damage they do is significant.  Rick


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## velvetfoot (Feb 2, 2015)

When our driveway was covered in ice for weeks this winter, the only way we got in or out was on studded tires.  They work.


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## mopar440_6 (Feb 2, 2015)

Winterforces on the Outback, Blizzaks on the Acura TL, and whatever cheap used snows I can get for the 2.5RS (pretty sure its got a beat up set of $40 Hankooks on it now) since I run them for the winter races...


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## Swedishchef (Feb 2, 2015)

fossil said:


> Better traction then studs, no road damage


Stud technology is light years from what it was. Nokian studs run flat on the surface of the road therefore not tearing it up. They are also square and not pointy as they used to be.

I understand that some people feel studs destroy roads. but I am quite certain that a 100 000 lb pulp truck driving over frost heaves in the spring does more damage than my 3100 lb car with studs. 

Andrew


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## bobdog2o02 (Feb 2, 2015)

Swedishchef said:


> Stud technology is light years from what it was. Nokian studs run flat on the surface of the road therefore not tearing it up. They are also square and not pointy as they used to be.
> 
> I understand that some people feel studs destroy roads. but I am quite certain that a 100 000 lb pulp truck driving over frost heaves in the spring does more damage than my 3100 lb car with studs.
> 
> Andrew


Have to agree on the trucks but the studs are HELL on roads.  Look into the studies.  They are available through tire rack.


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## Swedishchef (Feb 2, 2015)

here's an interesting link to Norway's Automobile Federation's winter tire testing...use google translate to read it in english.
https://www.naf.no/forbrukertester/dekktester/vinterdekktest-2014/


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## johneh (Feb 2, 2015)

I use Nokian R2 on the Hyundai Tucson all wheel drive
best snow tires I've ever used  they even out perform the Michelin Snows
on my 4X4 GMC


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## Swedishchef (Feb 2, 2015)

bobdog2o02 said:


> Have to agree on the trucks but the studs are HELL on roads.  Look into the studies.  They are available through tire rack.


Perhaps pave (ashphalt) in Canada has a different composition than the US? Studs are legal in every province. With date restrictions.

Andrew


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## bobdog2o02 (Feb 2, 2015)

> May pave in Canada has a composition than the US?



Sorry I don't understand that?


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## Swedishchef (Feb 2, 2015)

LOL. try again, I edited. My 4 year old is climbing on me as I try to type.

I found an interesting article that stated " Studded tires were originally banned in Ontario in 1972 after a technical review established that the studs then in use were causing extensive damage to roads. Several other North American jurisdictions also banned them at that time. However in 2005, Ontario introduced legislation permitting them in the north and synchronizing with Manitoba and Quebec the period (October 1 to April 30) when studs were permitted. MTO also prescribed the use of Scandinavian standard lightweight studs, which are lighter than those used in the tires banned in the 1970s, resulting in only one-third as much damage to the pavement".

I doubt my next set of tires will have studs. They are just too noisy for me.

Andrew


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## wenger7446 (Feb 2, 2015)

What type of gas mileage decrease are you guys seeing when you start running your winter tires?


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## Swedishchef (Feb 2, 2015)

I lose roughly 1-2L/100Km.


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## TMonter (Feb 2, 2015)

I'm running X-Ice 3's on my car and my wife's van has several year old X-ice 2's. There is a very noticeable difference between the all-season tire and the X-ice tire on snowy or Icy conditions. The vehicles handle much better in wintery conditions and I've even passed people in 4WD vehicles in my car during icy conditions because of the sure footing.

I dropped from about 31.9 MPG average down to about 31.1 MPG on the dry freeway when I switched tires.


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## bobdog2o02 (Feb 2, 2015)

We have seasonal restrictions here.  I live in Amish country, the places where the horse hooves and steel wheels from the buggies run are FAR more worn than the rest of the road surface.  Hard metal is bad for the paving.  It works and when used responsibly it shouldn't be a problem.  In our region studs are really not warranted unless you have a bad driveway etc.


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## velvetfoot (Feb 2, 2015)

They are indeed very noisy.


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## Charlotte987 (Feb 2, 2015)

The winter nokia's on my car are not studded, I've had no problems with them. The awd really helps along with the tires.


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## Charlotte987 (Feb 2, 2015)

> May pave in Canada has a composition than the US?


  Highways are slightly different in Canada than in the US. Made with the same materials the real difference is that when the highways were built in many parts of Canada, the govt used the lowest bidders, many of whom were corrupt and used less gravel and sand, that's why they heave and crack more than usual in the colder climates. 
In the US highways were designed by military engineers and have to support military vehicles in case of war. US highways are well maintained for that reason. Roads in Canada are federally maintained in every province, but somehow each province seems to use those dollars for other things.


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## dougstove (Feb 3, 2015)

When I lived in northern Sweden they intentionally left an ice cushion on the road, and everyone drove on studs, including the bicycles.
The old ladies skooted around on kicksleds.
That saved the pavement, but you need a steady cold winter for it to work.


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## firefighterjake (Feb 3, 2015)

Studs or studless.

This make or that make of winter tire.

Truth . . . the worse snow tire usually beats out the best all season tire when it comes to snow and ice.


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## KB007 (Feb 3, 2015)

I run Hankook Ipikes on my winter beater (RWD 03 MB C320) and they run pretty good. This is the third winter on them and they still have good traction.  I have Hankook icept Evos on the other car (10 MB C63 AMG) which really only gets driven when the roads are dry.  The iCept are supposed to be a performance winter tire, but when it does snow, they just don't grip very well, even with a very light right foot.

I've had Blizzaks, Pirellis and Firestones in the past.  The Pirellis and Firestones were OK, but didn't have quite as much grip for some reason.  Blizzaks are great for 1-2 winters, but as soon as the top tread layer wears off they don't work nearly as well.

For my money, the Hankook iPikes work pretty good for our winters.


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## ewdudley (Feb 3, 2015)

These days there are many very good snow tires to choose from,  just look for an 'open' tread pattern and plenty of sipes.  We're seeing a wide variety of brands performing well in 'rubber-to-ice' street-tire ice-racing.

I still prefer Nokia(n)s, but they are much more expensive than they used to be.  Now I'm quite happy with the Hankook copies of Nokian treads, although the rubber compound isn't quite as nice as a real Nokian. 

My wife has an irrational preference for studded tires so she gets the new Nokian studded tires.


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## sportbikerider78 (Feb 3, 2015)

I have hankooks on my Acura.  I like them.  First season with snow tires, but it is my first real winter in the snow belt.


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## Chimney Smoke (Feb 3, 2015)

I drive a 4x4 truck and run all seasons on it all the time.  Honestly I hardly ever use 4x4 unless there's a lot of snow on the road or I'm in town and it's slushy.  2x4 and drive a little slower usually works for me.


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## Bret Chase (Feb 3, 2015)

firefighterjake said:


> Studs or studless.
> 
> This make or that make of winter tire.
> 
> Truth . . . the worse snow tire usually beats out the best all season tire when it comes to snow and ice.




I haven't ran a "winter tire" since I put Snow-Kings on my '78 F100... when I was a teenager... a couple decades+ ago.  My little 2wd ranger does surprisingly well on whatever tires it has on it..... (I literally paid $100 for the truck).  The wifes 4wd 'burb  has BFG long trails on it... maybe its the weight... but that thing just doesnt slide around... I only use 4wd when I have to leave before I can snow-blow the end of the driveway.


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## Swedishchef (Feb 3, 2015)

A friend of mine had BFG all terrains and hated them in the snow. I guess different models work better than others.

The fact is, as Jake mentioned, some of the cheapest winter tires (EXCEPT those cheap knock off ones made in Asia) are better than a regular all season. Especially around here where the cold starts in November and lasts until April.

Some people use the excuse "it's too expensive to buy winter tires". Well guess what: you'll roughly double the life of your "summer" tires and winter ones will last 3-6 winters (depending on mileage). So in the end it may cost you an extra $500 over the lifespan of your vehicle. To me it's a worthwhile investment!

Andrew


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## Bret Chase (Feb 3, 2015)

Swedishchef said:


> A friend of mine had BFG all terrains and hated them in the snow. I guess different models work better than others.
> 
> The fact is, as Jake mentioned, some of the cheapest winter tires (EXCEPT those cheap knock off ones made in Asia) are better than a regular all season. Especially around here where the cold starts in November and lasts until April.
> 
> ...



I had a set of BFG All-Terrain k/o's on my old pickup... they were AMAZING in the snow... and lasted for 65,000 miles of complete abuse... if I had the $$ I'd have a set on the 'burb now.  BFG all terrain and BFG Long trails are not the same tire at all....long trails are far more mild... much more of an all season than an all terrain.


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## BrotherBart (Feb 3, 2015)

I had the BFG A/T on my old S-10 Blazer and loved'em in the snow. Now I have the Commercial A/T Traction on the Suburban and those things turned it into a mountain goat on my snow and ice covered 1,300 foot uphill driveway. A soft compound and damned expensive tires. But I average six miles a week since I retired so they ain't gonna wear out too fast.


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## Swedishchef (Feb 3, 2015)

I think my definition of snow is different. I don't mean 8 inches of the fresh stuff..I mean " the plow has gone by and there is now a 1 inch snow pack remaining and it is -20 out".
Lol


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## velvetfoot (Feb 3, 2015)

The greasy stuff can be tough going.


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## Swedishchef (Feb 4, 2015)

velvetfoot said:


> The greasy stuff can be tough going.


That is the worse type of snow, it just clogs the treads, reduces the ability to contact the road. No matter what tires you have, it is slick indeed!

Andrew


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## riverat (Feb 4, 2015)

Coopers all the way around on the Tacoma

   Jeff


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## mopar440_6 (Feb 4, 2015)

Bret Chase said:


> I had a set of BFG All-Terrain k/o's on my old pickup... they were AMAZING in the snow... and lasted for 65,000 miles of complete abuse... if I had the $$ I'd have a set on the 'burb now.  BFG all terrain and BFG Long trails are not the same tire at all....long trails are far more mild... much more of an all season than an all terrain.



Sounds like you've had better luck with BFG than me. My '94 Ram had a brand new set of A-T K/Os on it when I bought it and that truck hated them. I rotated those tires every 1500 miles, checked the air weekly, and checked every single suspension component on the truck. Constantly cupped the tires and never drove right. Those things flaked apart in less than 12K miles. Never have figured out why, only guess is that the extra weight from the Cummins up front was messing with them. And yes, they were the proper load range and inflation for the truck. Had BFGs on my '04 GTO and my wife's '04 Acura when we bought them and neither of those sets lasted for more than 20K either. Not bashing BFG, just haven't had the same experience most everyone else seems to have had with them.

I've had Pro-Comp M/Ts and Fierce M/Ts on the truck since and the Pro-Comps were probably the best LT tires I've run in the snow and just about every other surface.


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## firefighterjake (Feb 4, 2015)

I had a set of BFG All Terrains on my old 4Runner . . . expensive, but for the most part I liked them. Wore well and were great in pretty much anything.


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## firefighterjake (Feb 4, 2015)

Bret Chase said:


> I haven't ran a "winter tire" since I put Snow-Kings on my '78 F100... when I was a teenager... a couple decades+ ago.  My little 2wd ranger does surprisingly well on whatever tires it has on it..... (I literally paid $100 for the truck).  The wifes 4wd 'burb  has BFG long trails on it... maybe its the weight... but that thing just doesnt slide around... I only use 4wd when I have to leave before I can snow-blow the end of the driveway.



I was thinking winter tires on cars . . . I like my trucks to have All Terrain tires . . . although I am still on my original tires with my Nissan . . . which I am not particularly fond of . . .


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## Chimney Smoke (Feb 4, 2015)

firefighterjake said:


> I had a set of BFG All Terrains on my old 4Runner . . . expensive, but for the most part I liked them. Wore well and were great in pretty much anything.



The new BFG AT's don't look that great to me.  I haven't used them but I definitely prefer the look of the old style better than the new ones.


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## Quentin2 (Feb 4, 2015)

I commute 100 miles total a day for 12 years, I have run a lot of different studs on different vehicles.  Currently got hankook I pikes on the wife's Acura MDX and my 300.  Bfg all terrain on the dodge 3/4.  The worst studs ive ran are winter forces, the I pikes are almost as good as nokians but are way cheaper.  Michelin xice are good but not as good as blizzaks.  You have to take the stud less off just like a studded tire of they will burn up quickly in the summer.  I believe the bfg at are living off their old reputation as their are better tech in newer all terrains, decent all around, not particularly good on ice but not many all terrains are.


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## mustash29 (Feb 5, 2015)

01 S-10 ZR2 - 32 x 11.50 BFG AT KO's, but I don't drive it in the snow anymore.

03 S-10 Blazer ZR2 - Stock 31 x 10.50 BFG Long Trails, believe it or not those damn things have 85 K on them, never had an allignment & still have the stock ball joints & wheel bearings.  When they finally die I have a set of BFG AT KO's to put on.

06 Jeep Unlimited - lifted 4.5" with 33 x 12.50 BFG MT KM2's.  Absolutely scary to drive in wet snow or slush, expecially in 2 hi with the rear limited slip that kicks in very easily.

06 Duramax - Crap Hankook fronts / crap Firestone Transforce rears, all 4 are all seasons.  Don't drive it in the winter either, unless towing the sleds to Maine.  Need to find something good for it because everyone says the BFG's will not wear well or very long on a 2500 with a heavy ass motor.


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## OhioBurner© (Feb 8, 2015)

I put Goodyear Duratracs on both my trucks and they seem to do pretty well in the snow. Slightly oversized tires on the F150, and factory skinny pizza cutters on the F350. Was debating studding them but we don't have that bad of winters. Though we do tend to get ice a few times a winter since the temp seems to often cross the freezing point where it melts during the day then refreezes at night. My entire driveway has been solid ice most of the week since it got up in the 40's a week ago and turned to wet slush then froze solid. My truck struggled in 4wd trying to start on the ice even... as soon as the tires would spin it would start sliding backwards towards the road. Once I backed all the way onto the road and bare pavement and got a running start I made it up though. Not steep really just a very slight incline. But I had no weight in the truck since I've been hauling stuff a lot lately in both trucks I've had to keep the beds empty. Weight over the rear axle seems to make a huge difference in a truck, especially my long wheel base F350 (8 foot bed and full 4 door crew cab).


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## Blackjack Dan (Feb 8, 2015)

mustash29 said:


> 06 Jeep Unlimited - lifted 4.5" with 33 x 12.50 BFG MT KM2's.  Absolutely scary to drive in wet snow or slush, expecially in 2 hi with the rear limited slip that kicks in very easily.


Nice rides: I like the jeep the best!

We don't have a lot of snow in Oklahoma but we do get a lot of ice. One of my employees parked on the hill in front of our office  and his truck start sliding down the hill while he was in the office. I thought this would be a perfect time to try out my Blizzaks I just put on my F150 FX4 these things are unbelievable all ice! Someone else said on this forum they burn up in the summer, and this is true, winter driving only.

Jury is still out on my Winterforce studded tires on my 1 ton van, so far they seem okay on ice, really sucks with snow.

I got 35,000 out of my BFG AT/TA KO on my 06 Jeep Unlimited. Had close to 50% left on them when I change them out from 32-11:50 to 33.10:50s same tread pattern, for year-round performance snow off road they are hard to beat.
They were kind of chewed up here's a pic of the type of trails I run in Colorado were its garaged.






Here's one with it with my 33's they did great in about 10 inches of snow.


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## festerw (Feb 8, 2015)

I really wish I would have looked harder for an LJ when I bought mine the extra wheelbase would have been nice.

I've been very surprised by my Treadwright Guard Dogs they get way more traction on hard pack than I'd have ever thought.


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## Swedishchef (Feb 8, 2015)

I know as much about offroad tires as I do unicorns. I am wondering: are they a soft rubber compound? That is the key with winter tires. When the temperatures drop, they stay soft.

Andrew


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## OverlookEGR (Feb 8, 2015)

I am running general altimax arctics on my front wheel drive fusion and Winterforce tires on my 96 Buick Regal. I don't go off roading, but I find that a good set of four snow tires gets me where I need to go.


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## Blackjack Dan (Feb 8, 2015)

Swedishchef said:


> I know as much about offroad tires as I do unicorns. I am wondering: are they a soft rubber compound? That is the key with winter tires. When the temperatures drop, they stay soft.
> 
> Andrew


Like I said my BFG AT TA  KO are great all-around (all around, daily driver, Snow, off-road, rocks and mud) tires. 

I would say these tires are medium to hard compound I feel the best thing that makes a great tire is the tread style and of course airing down when you're in off road of conditions. 

A lot of people think a great snow tire is a great mud tire I haven't found that to be the case, MUD is a different animal! 

I Don't like to play in mud much, I like rocks here's a picture of a rock buggy I have you can see I don't run much air in the tires that is not me in the photo btw.







That's my two cents worth on tires.


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## OhioBurner© (Feb 9, 2015)

Blackjack Dan said:


> A lot of people think a great snow tire is a great mud tire I haven't found that to be the case, MUD is a different animal!


Dan you mention how a mud tires iren't necessarily a good snow tires, then show a vehicle that's completely not good in snow at all? lol Might want to start a different thread if you want to show of rock crawlers.

Here is a more applicable pic... my truck with Kumho MTs (that are snow rated actually).



Remember there are different kinds of snow... if we are talking about doing >50mph or whatever on the highway in possible snowy or icy conditions then no, most mud tires are not going to be a good choice, especially wide ones. However if your talking about going through 10" deep of fluffy stuff, at lower speeds, fat mudders can do pretty good. I use my F150 with slightly oversized mudders for going into the woods when there was snow down to cut firewood (the pic above), or hunting, etc. Did pretty good. But put it on the road and most factory tires probably would perform as good or better.

I really don't know how those tires were ever snow rated. A pretty hard rubber compound as well, and lasted forever. Deep snow ok, but not so great on the highway. I slipped once on ice at 50mph and ended up whacking the guard rail backwards. After that I had the center lugs siped at the tire shop. Not sure if it really helped.

This is one reason I like the Duratracs, they are nearly as aggressive as a MT but lots of sipes and studdable. However I lost significant gas mileage switching to them, even compared to my mudders!


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## Wisneaky (Feb 9, 2015)

I use General tire altimax arctic tires. Check out the reviews and videos on tirerack.com. I can literally drive through anything with them on my awd car. They grip on snow and ice and provide great stopping on both also. There is also some videos on YouTube with people literally pushing snow with them on their cars.


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## Blackjack Dan (Feb 9, 2015)

OhioBurner© said:


> Dan you mention how a mud tires iren't necessarily a good snow tires, then show a vehicle that's completely not good in snow at all? lol Might want to start a different thread if you want to show of rock crawlers.



Nice ride Burner: 

The pic of the rock buggy showed how low the tire pressure was, it's hard to show that in 10 inches of snow. My Ford has 18 inch rims on it and it works with the big rims, you can't get as aggressive I went from 36# to 24# and got me out of a sand bar.

And I do believe the OP asked the question about off-road tires. 

And my point is it doesn't matter what tire or brand or style if you get stuck in the snow or mud or sand (unless your already high centered) try airing down.


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## Holzstapel (Feb 9, 2015)

I have Nokian Nordman 5's on my 05 Jetta TDI.  This is the first car I have ever put snow tires on and this is the first season with them too.  What a difference!!  I'm amazed how well it handles in the snow and icy conditions.  I live in a very hilly neighborhood and I have had no issues with these tires.


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## scooby074 (Feb 9, 2015)

Hakkapeliitta 7 with studs. Hands down best snow tires out there, and Ive run Xice and Blizzaks prior. 

BFG ATs on the ford. Garbage in snow.


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## velvetfoot (Feb 9, 2015)

It's funny how Nokian changes the numbers on the Hakkapeliittas.  I had ones a long time ago, and last time I shopped they told me they were back to one again.


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## Swedishchef (Feb 9, 2015)

scooby074 said:


> Hakkapeliitta 7 with studs. Hands down best snow tires out there, and Ive run Xice and Blizzaks prior.


+1000 

I have Hakka 5s, I had Hakka 2s. THey are great!

Andrew


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## Swedishchef (Feb 9, 2015)

velvetfoot said:


> It's funny how Nokian changes the numbers on the Hakkapeliittas.  I had ones a long time ago, and last time I shopped they told me they were back to one again.


They are actually at 8 now. Whoever told you that was full of Bologna 

Andrew


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## bwise.157 (Feb 9, 2015)

Cooper AT3's on a 2005 Honda Pilot.  They will climb a mountain side in almost any condition.  I have a steep driveway that will make your butt cheeks pucker, and they have never failed!  Most visitors chicken out and won't even try my drive.  I just laugh at them with these!


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## OhioBurner© (Feb 10, 2015)

scooby074 said:


> Hakkapeliitta 7


Where do they come up with these names lol? Never heard of those. Bwise... I was debating between coopers when I put the duratracks on my trucks they seem to make some good tires. Had em on my work 3/4 ton vans and they did pretty good in snow, think they were the CTs. A fellow on a truck forum I'm on who lives in Alaska always seems to be the point of reference when snow tire discussion comes up since he is in it pretty much every day if the winter including driving through often deep snow. As I recall he's tried many and recommends 2 or 3, one if which was a cooper but I can't remember which. 

Of course truck and car tire selection is going to be a little different, and I've mainly just delt with trucks, but on my wife's last car, a Lexus rx300 we actually put 'truck' tires on it and it worked so much better than what came on it. Got a super deal on Michelin LTX m+s. Now awd does wonders for cars, and even on the crappy maintained city roads when there was a couple inches of snow that RX could power through turns at intersections without slipping. She traded it for a similar Acura RDX but it takes low profile car tires so no more option of LTX or similar.


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## bwise.157 (Feb 10, 2015)

Only have 5,000 miles on my Cooper AT3's.  They have been great, and American Made!!


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## firefighterjake (Feb 10, 2015)

OhioBurner© said:


> Where do they come up with these names lol? Never heard of those. Bwise... I was debating between coopers when I put the duratracks on my trucks they seem to make some good tires. Had em on my work 3/4 ton vans and they did pretty good in snow, think they were the CTs. A fellow on a truck forum I'm on who lives in Alaska always seems to be the point of reference when snow tire discussion comes up since he is in it pretty much every day if the winter including driving through often deep snow. As I recall he's tried many and recommends 2 or 3, one if which was a cooper but I can't remember which.
> 
> Of course truck and car tire selection is going to be a little different, and I've mainly just delt with trucks, but on my wife's last car, a Lexus rx300 we actually put 'truck' tires on it and it worked so much better than what came on it. Got a super deal on Michelin LTX m+s. Now awd does wonders for cars, and even on the crappy maintained city roads when there was a couple inches of snow that RX could power through turns at intersections without slipping. She traded it for a similar Acura RDX but it takes low profile car tires so no more option of LTX or similar.



Comes from the Finish light cavalry way back when who were known as the Hakkapeliitas for their war cry "Cut them down" as they charged the enemy. Guessing the idea is that with the name of these snow tires you will cut down the enemy -- snow -- and charge through all conditions no matter what comes your way.


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## woodgeek (Feb 10, 2015)

I've got X-ice3's on my giant iPad, I mean Nissan Leaf.  I looked at the Hakka's, but my winter roads are clear/dry 90% of the time, and the X-ice3s are supposed to be better for dry.

The spouse has already had a couple icy commutes with lots of SUVs off the road in ditches.  She's already killed one tire/rim in an epic pothole and got it fixed. Just another winter here in 'The South'.

Its awesome climbing my 20° grade driveway covered in black ice with a 3400 lb EV.


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## jharkin (Feb 16, 2015)

OhioBurner© said:


> Of course truck and car tire selection is going to be a little different, and I've mainly just delt with trucks, but on my wife's last car, a Lexus rx300 we actually put 'truck' tires on it and it worked so much better than what came on it. Got a super deal on Michelin LTX m+s. Now awd does wonders for cars, and even on the crappy maintained city roads when there was a couple inches of snow that RX could power through turns at intersections without slipping. She traded it for a similar Acura RDX but it takes low profile car tires so no more option of LTX or similar.



The LTX M/S2's come in P-metric sizes, so you might actually be able to get them on that RDX?  I run P-metric M/S2 on my wife's Pilot.

Speaking of the M/S2's they are pretty decent in the snow for an all season.  Never any trouble getting up to go, though that s probably as much due to the automatic 4WD as anything. Braking and cornering are fairly decent.


On the Tacoma, per advice here I put a set of Nokian Rotivva's.. A p-metric  AT tire with snowflake rating.  So far they have been pretty darn good in the snow we had this winter.. I did get a little stuck once, but that was when I followed my buddy in his Ranger down a dirt road with 18inhces of unplowed powder on it.  A brief shot of 4low with the locker engaged backed me out. of the ditch  

Having real 4WD now has helped me understand why you see so many SUVs in the ditch when it snows... The traction under acceleration is so good its too easy to forget you wont have that same advantage when its time to stop.  I have to keep reminding myself to take it easy.


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## blackdoglabrador (Feb 18, 2015)

Nokian Hakkapeliitta studded on F250 Supercab and General Altimax Studded on Subaru Outback.  Do not have complaints on either.  Both are great in snow and ice.  Nothing better then not having to worry about sliding off the road in winter.  I have to try to get either of the to slip.  This winter I think half of the commuting days the roads have been covered.  Worth the expense.  Let it snow!


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## OhioBurner© (Feb 20, 2015)

jharkin said:


> The LTX M/S2's come in P-metric sizes, so you might actually be able to get them on that RDX? I run P-metric M/S2 on my wife's Pilot.


I of course looked when we needed tires on the RDX and they didn't. 235/55/18. Wish all these new fancy cars didn't all jump on the huge rim & low profile tire bandwagon.  The lil Acura has bigger diameter wheels than either my F150 or F350 does.




blackdoglabrador said:


> Nokian Hakkapeliitta studded on F250 Supercab


I didn't figure those were available in E-rated truck tires but now I see they are. Might look into them when I wear out these GY DuraTracs if I get another set of rims to have a dedicated winter and summer set.


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## Hansson (Mar 4, 2015)

This year I bought winter tires without studs. It actually works really well.
It was the Nokian Hakkapeliitta R 2.
A little warning. Nokian Nordman is manufactured in Russia and are not the same class as the Hakkapeliitta. It is usually ranked poorly in tests here in Sweden.
Hakkapeliitta is always at the top in the tests.


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## velvetfoot (Mar 4, 2015)

They must be less noisy than studs?
I noticed the Nordmans were made in Russia when I was shopping a while ago, but they didn't have my size in Hakka or Nordman because, SUPPOSEDLY, there was some kind of problem with storms and the container ships, too late in the year, blah, blah, blah. 

Love the e-logger, as always.


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## Swedishchef (Mar 4, 2015)

Hansson said:


> Hakkapeliitta is always at the top in the tests.


AMEN! Finally someone who can confirm what I have read/think.

I am part of the Nokian cult...nothing else will go on my car in the winter. Swedes know tires: compulsary country wide (right?)

Andrew


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## ewdudley (Mar 4, 2015)

Swedishchef said:


> AMEN! Finally someone who can confirm what I have read/think.
> 
> I am part of the Nokian cult...nothing else will go on my car in the winter.


There was a time thirty or forty years ago when nothing but Nokia, Vredestein, Blizzak, or Gislaved would do, but more often these days we're seeing many other brands that compete successfully on the track; Cooper, Pirelli, Continental, General, Hercules, Goodyear to name a few.  What excellent winter tires have in common is hydrophylic rubber compounds, an 'open' tread pattern, and plenty of siping.  The brand seems to matter much less these days.


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## Clarkbug (Mar 4, 2015)

Ran Hankook IceBear tires on my little Mazda for a long time.  Great grip, didn't wear much, and I even ran them in the summers once I got past the winter wear bars.  

Now running some Dunlop's on my Impreza which are OK, and have Cooper Weather masters on the wifes Forester.  Goes great and they are pretty sure footed.  When I have to shop for some again I will be looking at the Nokian lineup...  They are really great tires.  Worth the cost if you will own the car for more than a few seasons.


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## BlackGreyhounds (Mar 4, 2015)

Blizzaks.


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## john193 (Mar 5, 2015)

Great thread, just what I was looking for. ive got another point to ponder. I'd like my snow tires to be mounted on dedicated wheels, so I can just switch them out in my garage. I'm planning to go with a negative rim size, but can't decide if I should get steel wheels or a cheap alloy set?

Any opinions out there? I read steel wheels tend to be heavier, so sturdier? But is there a big mpg penalty?


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## firefighterjake (Mar 5, 2015)

Last year when I had a set of winter tires for my wife's old Subaru I went to a nearby junkyard and picked up a set of alloy wheels cheap -- $100 for four of them. I doubt I could get a deal like that on the newer wheels, but a salvage yard may still be cheaper than even buying new steel wheels depending on where you go.


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## ewdudley (Mar 5, 2015)

john193 said:


> Great thread, just what I was looking for. ive got another point to ponder. I'd like my snow tires to be mounted on dedicated wheels, so I can just switch them out in my garage. I'm planning to go with a negative rim size, but can't decide if I should get steel wheels or a cheap alloy set?
> 
> Any opinions out there? I read steel wheels tend to be heavier, so sturdier? But is there a big mpg penalty?


I think steel wheels are highly underrated.  They're light, strong, and much more sturdy and resilient than run-of-the-mill alloy rims, which are often quite heavy compared to the forged alloys on your wife's Mercedes.  Plus alloy rims can suffer bad cosmetic damage from the salt.

That said, used alloys are cheap and plentiful.  Sand them down and paint them flat black and you're good to go.


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## BlackGreyhounds (Mar 5, 2015)

Go with steel for better price (New and repair/replacement from potholes.)  Alloys if you want better looks.  Mileage should be nearly identical.


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## john193 (Mar 5, 2015)

ewdudley said:


> I think steel wheels are highly underrated.  They're light, strong, and much more sturdy and resilient than run-of-the-mill alloy rims, which are often quite heavy compared to the forged alloy on your wife's Mercedes.  Plus alloy rims can suffer bad cosmetic damage from the salt.
> 
> That said, used alloys are cheap and plentiful.  Sand them down and paint them flat black and you're good to go.



Thanks.  I'm not concerned with the look.  Looking at this from a performance/cost perspective.  For example, on tire rack, going from an alloy to steel wheels saves $125 total.


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## BlackGreyhounds (Mar 5, 2015)

Here's some great info on winter tires. http://www.tirerack.com/winter/tech/index.jsp
It's nice to hear all the real world experiences here on this thread too.


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## john193 (Mar 5, 2015)

woodgeek said:


> I've got X-ice3's on my giant iPad, I mean Nissan Leaf.  I looked at the Hakka's, but my winter roads are clear/dry 90% of the time, and the X-ice3s are supposed to be better for dry.
> 
> The spouse has already had a couple icy commutes with lots of SUVs off the road in ditches.  She's already killed one tire/rim in an epic pothole and got it fixed. Just another winter here in 'The South'.
> 
> Its awesome climbing my 20° grade driveway covered in black ice with a 3400 lb EV.



I'm seriously considering the x-ice xi3.  Glad you guys are liking it, and we are practically in the same neck of the woods in PA.  How many season do you anticipate you'll see out of them?  I'm impressed that Michelin is willing to warrant them to 40K miles.  And when do you typically do the switch?


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## Swedishchef (Mar 5, 2015)

Personally I get steel ones. I always negotiate them when buying my new car. Alloys will cost more and I don't think there is a significant MPG difference at all.

4 steel rims - $300. After 10 years they are sort of rusted but still working fine.

Andrew


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## Clarkbug (Mar 5, 2015)

I get whatever wheels I can find on the local CL cheap.  Got a set of beat up ( but painted ) alloys for my wife's car for $50.  Car before that I had a set of steelies I found for $75.  Well worth the cost to save the yearly mounting and balancing fee.


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## john193 (Mar 5, 2015)

Clarkbug said:


> I get whatever wheels I can find on the local CL cheap.  Got a set of beat up ( but painted ) alloys for my wife's car for $50.  Car before that I had a set of steelies I found for $75.  Well worth the cost to save the yearly mounting and balancing fee.


Keeping an eye out on CL. Finding the bolt pattern an offset I need is the challenge.


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## Clarkbug (Mar 5, 2015)

If you need some 5x114.3 with a +48 offset in 16", and want to come to Upstate NY, I can help


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## velvetfoot (Mar 5, 2015)

I shopped around and got some cheap skinny alloy wheels on Craigslist.  I liked them so much I got some cheap all seasons and use them in the summer instead of the alloys with low profile tires that came with the car.  For winter I found some cheap wheels/snow tires with studs on Craigslist. I think the tires will last me two years. The steel wheels can be surprisingly expensive when new, never mind oem wheel covers.  I got my wheel covers at the auto parts place, but they don't look fantastic.


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## john193 (Mar 5, 2015)

Clarkbug said:


> If you need some 5x114.3 with a +48 offset in 16", and want to come to Upstate NY, I can help


Thank for the offer.  It is not the size i'm looking for, but a very common one I see on CL locally.


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## woodgeek (Mar 6, 2015)

john193 said:


> I'm seriously considering the x-ice xi3.  Glad you guys are liking it, and we are practically in the same neck of the woods in PA.  How many season do you anticipate you'll see out of them?  I'm impressed that Michelin is willing to warrant them to 40K miles.  And when do you typically do the switch?



I've got a 3 year lease, and plan on doing 3 k miles per winter season.  I'll prob sell them or give them away on C-list in 2 more years, with < 10k miles total.

My financials are that saving 10k miles on the regular tires will prob keep me from having to replace those during the lease period...so buying the snows saves me the price of a new set of all seasons == free.


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## velvetfoot (Apr 7, 2015)

As a side note, I took off the studded snows on one of our cars yesterday.  Man, what a quiet ride without them!


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## Swedishchef (Apr 7, 2015)

LOL. Yeah, I tend to forget how noisy they are until I take them off...in 2 weeks!

Andrew


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## woodgeek (Apr 7, 2015)

My X-ice3's aren't studded, but do make a clear 'roaring' sound, but only when I accelerate.  They came off yesterday.


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## Swedishchef (Apr 8, 2015)

Are you sure that's not the sound of your car "roaring"?


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## woodgeek (Apr 8, 2015)

Yup.  The car just makes a little whirring noise when I step on the accelerator.  Like in a bad sci fi movie from the 80s.


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## cpttuna (Feb 25, 2017)

B F Goodrich All Terrain 235/75 R 15 load range C on jeep Cherokee XJ's


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## begreen (Feb 25, 2017)

These are old threads. Closing.


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