# A note regarding Thelin customer service...



## CMMartin (Feb 16, 2014)

Having found a wealth of good information here I decided to join and share my experience dealing with Thelin this last couple of weeks.

I moved into a house that had a Thelin Parlor 3000.  It has a manufacture code on it that indicates 2005 manufacture and has the newer control board.  

The stove had been maintained annually by the local Thelin dealer at a cost of $130-150 per year.  During their service they replace the door gasket with several pieces of fiberglass (not one long piece that fit well) and the glass seal (it was only sealed on the left and right sides).  The fan assembly had been re-installed with no gasket.  It certainly was burning poorly.


Early in the burn season (Oct) the burn pot overflowed and caught fire burning hot enough to destroy the wiring to the ignition.  I was on the hunt for a replacement part starting in early November.  

I realized that I also needed to replace the burn pot.
After the third cleaning in one season trying to increase the airflow I decided to try a new fan assemble.  

I called and talked to Barney at Thelin.  She took my serial number and gave me a list of parts and told me to call a dealer to arrange the sale.  Well ok...kinda a bummer but...  I placed the order at just under $700 for a fan/burn  pot holder/ss igniter, using the provided part numbers.  

I received an invoice from the stove company that made sense and listed an appropriate description of each part with the part number.   Thelin asked me to provide serial number and date from my stove, before they would ship, to ensure that they would ship the correct parts. In about a week I received the package from Thelin.

The fan was correct with gasket.  It is much quieter now and it no longer sounds like there is an angry squirrel in the stove.

Neither of the other parts were correct:  I received a  burn pot which shared part numbers with the igniter ordered...and a burn pot holder for another line of stoves.

My first call was to Thelin to inquire about how this happened?  Tried to reach Barney; got hung up on before I could say a word.  Call 2 to Thelin I talked to someone else (similar position to Barney), for some reason this call also got disconnected just as we were making progress.  Call 3 I asked to talk to a manager...got disconnected as the call was transferred.  Call 4  Got a service manager named Jeff on the line.  This is when the experience went down hill FAST.  He is very rude and condescending.  He scoffed at the idea of me fixing this stove.   QUOTE "when you car breaks down you take it to a dealer to get repaired...same with a Thelin you take it to a dealer"  He questioned how I could determine that the parts I was ordering even needed replacing. (lets see fan does not move...has new brushes...humm....hole in the burn pot holder....humm...wires burnt through on the igniter....Seem easy to me)  
I made it about 20 minutes before I could take no more.  I am done with supporting this company and will do everything I can to help prevent anyone from buying one of their products.  When friends ask me about this stove I am very honest and direct.

I must commend anyone that has to share space with Jeff, I am amazed that you can interact with a person like that daily and not snap.

I am awaiting a RMA number to return the parts to Thelin. 

I plan on fabricating the fire pot holder.  I will post plans as I build the parts so that you can also build your own.  I expect to use about $25 in metal and an hour in the shop to fab one which is much cheaper than the $180 they charge for a metal box.

Not sure about the igniter at this point.  I might try to rewire the old one.  

On this long epic adventure I did receive the advice from a Thelin authorized service tech that I try burning the stove outside not attached to a flue pipe to see how it burns.  followed by "once you have it outside, go get a different stove to put in its place".  AWESOME

Hope to help others avoid future headaches.  Don't get a Thelin.

Chris


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## Bioburner (Feb 16, 2014)

I can see so many ways this can go into the ash can. Will see how Johns experience goes next week on the repair of his insert.


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## Lake Girl (Feb 16, 2014)

Was the Thelin tech working independently or through the dealer?  Sounds like sage advice...


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## wsar10 (Feb 16, 2014)

I personally would be looking for a used more reliable stove, If I had to spend $700 on it. I've read all over this forum that theese stove go through motors and are hard to find parts for.


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## CaptSpiff (Feb 16, 2014)

Chris,
Please do not limit your description of your experience to this forum. Every Corporate Officer of a struggling/failing company wishes for specifics on "what went wrong" in the customer experience. You have the details, and you need to get these to the people in charge.

While Thelin may have lost you as a customer, there will be 200-500 similar customer interactions with Thelin over the next 12 months. You may help them.

A bit pollyannaish perhaps, but maybe some good will come of it (info from BBB of California):

Mr. Tim Rice, President
Thelin Hearth Products
4244 S. Market Court Suite A
Sacramento, CA 95834

Now on your specifics, it sounds like a parts mix-up that's resolvable. They sent the original parts in one week, all be it the wrong parts. Did you contact the local dealer who handled the original order?


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## CMMartin (Feb 16, 2014)

Yea I am going to send back the parts... the frustration came from multiple conversations with Thelin to prevent the wrong parts from being sent in the first place.  Second the price of the parts is way high for what you actually receive.  Third is the time it took to get the parts and the communication with multiple dealers to get the parts ordered.  I will most likely get the parts I need just as the garlic breaks the ground and I no longer need the stove.

When I asked if Jeff (manager @Thelin) if he would like me to email a copy of the invoice to determine where the miss-communication happened he had no interest in fixing it or helping to make sure it does not happen again in the future.  

The stove is look nice...that is about all.


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## Lake Girl (Feb 16, 2014)

Write the owner with your specific complaints especially regarding the lack of assistance Jeff was able or willing to provide... at the same time praise up Barney!


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## stillersnut (Feb 16, 2014)

Owned a Thelin Gnome for 10 yrs, used to deal with Jay Thelin directly when I called, he even sent me parts free of charge.  When he sold the Co. I tried to deal with them & got hung up on 3 times....I sold my stove on Craig's List & purchased a Englander PAH.  Will never own a  Thelin again, or recommend any of their products If Jay only knew how bad they've shamed his name & hard work.


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## webbie (Feb 16, 2014)

Yeah, it seems (from many reports, not just this) that it was one of those companies that had "love" as it's main reason for existence. Many of us who met Jay over the years saw a guy who was really into it from an engineering point of view. He spent many decades doing it and then, I guess, moved on.

From a technical point of view, it's hard to get anyone to fill his shoes. But, on the other hand, it's not hard to try to help people. 

We don't want this forum used as a complaint board, but in this case it's not about a dealer or an installer or single stove - I've had inside knowledge of the same type of problems with the "new" company. Sad to say, I don't think the letter writing and griping is going to help.


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## Lake Girl (Feb 16, 2014)

I know it's sort of off topic but while looking to find out when the Thelin company was sold, I came across this interesting interview with Jay Thelin....
http://www.billiondollarhippie.com/interviews/jay-thelin/


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## webbie (Feb 16, 2014)

Lake Girl said:


> I know it's sort of off topic but while looking to find out when the Thelin company was sold, I came across this interesting interview with Jay Thelin....
> http://www.billiondollarhippie.com/interviews/jay-thelin/



He's quite famous in some circles and ties in with a lot of the old hippies we knew from The Farm! But that was before the stoves!

"Thelin: Profit eventually became god in the Haight and that was too bad. Don’t get me wrong: I have always loved business and I didn’t ever NOT want to be successful in business. But I am comfortable now, and we don’t live extravagantly. You never lose your anti-establishment edge. The pellet stoves I created are clean burning and non-polluting. They run on a fuel product gotten from waste, stuff they take to the landfill. Any organic material can be pelletized and used for fuel. You see, my life and my business are all the outcome of the hippie philosophy. These businesses and my lifestyle, my spirituality – all these are the fruit of those days in the Haight."

Ah, the hippie creed.


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## John Fortier (Feb 17, 2014)

Very interesting to say the least.


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## rick31797 (Feb 17, 2014)

I also have a Parlour 3000, its a older model then yours 2002, at the moment i have posted another thread about getting help repairing the control board, i refuse to pay the close to 600.00 for a replacement board.

I phoned thelin twice.The first call i got a Lady( more like a witch), very rude,she did give me a part number, but was not much help, and i was glad to end the call.

The second call i ask for a Tech, and got Matt. Matt was help-full and at the time i was trying to diagnose the problem and if there would be any-other item that would cause my issue..Of course he suggested buying sensors and a switch which did nothing to correct the problem.

The rest of our conversation was through Email. the problem with a newer board is they had changed, so the new board will not fit my stove.. with-out an adapter.. so 349.00 for the board 170.00 for an adapter and 13 percent taxes.

I would ask Matt several questions in an email, and he would answer one question and disregard the rest. 

I ask Matt if he had an older board around he could send me direct.. No reply.. I ask him if he could send me a new board from the factory, at a factory price... no response..

The last email i sent was about a lesson on Customer service..

*Customer service is usually the downfall of alot of companies and there satisfied customer base is there lively-hood........ Jay Thelin knew how to look after his customers, you can get a good since of how a company treats there customers, buy just doing a quick search and read the many forum results of people that have dealt with Thelin since Jay retire. 
*
I had a buyer send me an email the other day asking me about my thelin, and i told him exactly my experience with them, and his reply was, he would stay away from them..

MY dealer can still order parts from them, but they dont sell the stoves since they had been bought out..There will never be another Jay Thelin, i guess he retired, Jay was the company and knew the stoves much better then anybody i have talked to there..


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## Titanmatt (Feb 17, 2014)

Yeah let's not blame the Dealer in this case let's immediatly


rick31797 said:


> I also have a Parlour 3000, its a older model then yours 2002, at the moment i have posted another thread about getting help repairing the control board, i refuse to pay the close to 600.00 for a replacement board.
> 
> I phoned thelin twice.The first call i got a Lady( more like a witch), very rude,she did give me a part number, but was not much help, and i was glad to end the call.
> 
> ...


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## Titanmatt (Feb 17, 2014)

Hi everyone my name is Matt and I currently work for Thelin. I really think their is plenty of unwarranted criticism on this site about our company. Rick if I remember who you are, I am not sure if you were the one I talked to on the phone about rebuilding a Circuit Board or were you can go to fix it but I was pretty clear on how Thelin Hearth Products runs there business through Dealers. That was clearly not acceptable to you and I am sorry you feel that way but I would appreciate you know putting my name through the mud. When I look at this Forum I believe it should be about how everyone can help each other out and not bash companies. No one is perfect in any Industry. Jay Thelin is a great guy and I myself have learned a thing or two from him but he did sell the business in 2010 and things had to change otherwise there was gonna be no more Thelin. 
My background is 20 years in the Hearth business. 18 years Installing, Servicing and Selling for a Dealer. I came on about a little over a year ago with Thelin Hearth Products and was shocked at some of the things I saw go on at a daily basis whether it was Dealers trying to return unwarranted to Parts because that's what Jay did, we'll that is what almost closed the doors on this unique Stove line. It's is the Dealers responsibility to take care of the customer all the way through as they were the ones that sold and made money on the product. They were the ones that sold it serviced it and should know everything about the stove.  Thelin has some bad Dealers left over from bad business decisions that I would like to get rid of but sometimes it's easier said then done. 
 As I have explained to Rick I am not at your house I am not in front of your stove all I can do is try and give advise as to what the problem may be. Everyone is trying to save a buck I understand that but how is it fair to the good Dealers I have to sell direct to a consumer at a lower cost?? 
 We also have decided to sell some items Motors, Circuit Boards as Assemblies because of all the Headaches of people not ligning up.
When Thelin Hearth Products bought Thelin Co they did some nice things like change the problematic Brushed Feed Motors for Brushless Feed Motors that has been great but we still struggle with the Brushed Fan Motors but again easier said then done. We like our stove simple and as a former Service guy I can appreciate that. 
The other issues I have out there again coming from my experience previous to Thelin is Installation issue. I will tell you a good percentage of these stoves are installed wrong not with there minimum guidelines totally ignored. Nothing will work right if it is not installed correctly I don't care what stove or fireplace you have. Our stove uses on motor for convection and combustion so It tends to work a little harder and needs adjustments.
 As far as John With the Providence insert. I tried to help early on with this on the site but did not get much luck. We were not made aware of this issue till late. We came in and decided that we were gonna send the entire Control Panel complete with all electronics on a stove from 2011 no questions asked and we were praised heavily on this site until it was not good enough. Once again as a former Dealer we would the last thing we would have done is got the manufacture involved until it was necessary. The Dealer should have Parts in stock to deal with any problems that arise on any stove they carry as well as the service trucks that should be stocked to deal with these problems. So it's easy to always blame someone else. Should we have maybe have sent the Control Panel sooner? Yes our bad on that but we felt it would get there sooner and John was able to use the stove still just without electronic ignition.

We'll I said what I had to say.
Matt.


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## John Fortier (Feb 17, 2014)

Tech is here and hoping for the best.


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## Titanmatt (Feb 17, 2014)

So are we


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## kinsmanstoves (Feb 17, 2014)

As a dealer for other brands I hope this all works out.  

One thing I have learned is there are stoves made well and stoves made not so well.  With both types of stove they have to be installed correctly or they will not work correctly.  The stove maker HAS to stand behind their product and their dealers.  The dealers HAVE to be trained on the units and that HAS to be done from the stove maker.  This is more than "buy ten stoves and you are now a dealer" type thinking from the stove maker.  The dealer has to insure the stove is installed correctly and also cleaned properly and the stove maker has to make sure the dealer knows how to instruct their customers to do the cleaning.  If this is not done the system will fall apart.  If this is all done correctly this forum would not exist (Oh please don't go).

Eric


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## Titanmatt (Feb 17, 2014)

Right on Eric so you and I are on the same page as I worked for a former Dealer we knew more about the Product at times then the manufacture or the Sales Rep. When you sell a line wouldn't you think the Dealer would get familiar with the Product they are selling? This is what trade shows regional shows and training is for. I have tried to give these Dealers training manuals etc to make them better. You should know how hard it is for people to learn our Hearth business. It's not as easy as it sounds.


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## CMMartin (Feb 17, 2014)

RMA received...they will take the incorrect parts back but the real bummer is that I have to eat the shipping again on the wrong parts. When I do get the correct parts ordered I will have to pay once again to have them shipped.

The dealer that sold this particular Thelin stove is an unscrupulous person and has since shuttered his doors.  He did not perform the maintenance correctly on the stove nor did he install the door/glass gaskets properly.  It is good that he is out of business.  That said there is no other local dealer to rely on or fall back to.

I am still on the fence with what to do next.  If I could have a burn pot holder in hand and had some assurance that it would be the correct one within the week I would do it.  I have had a difficult time sourcing 309 SS in a sheet large enough to easily fab it myself, I guess that I could use a less heat tolerant alloy. 

Matt my aggravation with Thelin was greatly amplified after talking to Jeff.  I had seen this as easily resolvable up until that point.  I have not encountered that type of customer service nor had I been treated like that before.


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## Titanmatt (Feb 17, 2014)

Ok Chris I believe you are talking about Jim not Jeff. We have no Jeff their. Furthermore you bought the Parts through the Dealer which means you then deal with that person Direct. As far as having the wrong Parts that honestly is a shame and I am not sure exactly how or why that happened. I generally will ask for photos of older parts to make sure they are correct as these stoves had changed so much over the years. I am not sure what happened in that regards.


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## CMMartin (Feb 17, 2014)

I will have to shut the stove down soon (it can only burn about 8 hours) and then I will send photos to Barney.   The name I wrote down in my notes is Jeff, but I guess that could have been Jim.  He said he was the service manager.  A very disrespectful man whom should not be allowed to talk to customers on the phone. 

I was trying all along to avoid this situation of the wrong parts being sent.   The RMA# was sent to the dealer this AM and he sent it to me with the instructions to ship the parts back to Barney @Thelin.  I will get them packaged back in the original shipping materials and pay the $ to ship.

Still on the fence about spending more money trying to get the correct parts...At this point I will be out at least $50 just in shipping.


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## Titanmatt (Feb 17, 2014)

What stove do you have a Gnome or Parlour and what year is the stove? Photos of old Parts always help with these older models. I want to make sure you are getting the correct Parts. Also can you provide me with the Part numbers you received that we're wrong.
Thank You


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## John Fortier (Feb 17, 2014)

Board was put in and stove fired up as it should, all seems fine again. Titanmatt, Thanks for  the parts needed. That being said I am very worried about making it through an entire heating season without a problem. My warranty expires in Oct. from there on I will have to put out of pocket. Now its just wait and see.


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## Titanmatt (Feb 17, 2014)

John good to hear, let's get this stove working consistently. Be aware of your air adjustment on the left side. Try it about half way closed and see what works best, it's always good to make adjustments after the stove has been on for about 30 mins and then give it 15 or so to see how it is burning.


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## Bioburner (Feb 17, 2014)

Monday came and your back in business. Will hope that the stove will operate as it should. About a month and half of real stove weather yet.


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## CMMartin (Feb 17, 2014)

Parlor 3000 SSN #6340   Date Code:  37-05

I needed a fan assembly/Fire pot holder/ignition


Part numbers first given to me by Barney
00-0035-0020 Ignition
00-0005-0175 Fan assembly
00-1005-0033 Firepot holder

Copy and pasted from my Invoice from a Thelin dealer...

Products
------------------------------------------------------
1 x Pittman Fan Mounted W/Metal Fan Blade assy (00-0005-0009) = $380.00 
1 x Firepot Holder (00-1005-0033) = $140.00
1 x Parlour/echo s//s electronic ignition (00-0005-0103) = $110.00
------------------------------------------------------
Sub-Total: $630.00

It was noted that the fan pn was changed to ensure that i would get the correct fan...

What I received in the box.
00-0005-0175 Fan Assembly  (seems to be working much better than the old fan)
00-0005-0103 Turns out to be a fire pot
00-1005-0033 Fire pot holder for another model of stove.


After talking with Jim (I thought it was Jeff) he gave me the following part numbers after grumbling about how it was going to take a long time to find them...

00-0035-0137 Ignition
00-1005-0130 Fire pot holder


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## Lake Girl (Feb 17, 2014)

Matt, you totally ignored the issue of the original poster - his and the dealer's due diligence with getting parts numbers for the serial number - and received the wrong parts.  There would be no story if he received the appropriate parts.  There would be no story if your customer service staff had done their job without being rude or dropping his calls.  He was not blaming you for the poor quality of previous repairs - just supplying the reason why he wouldn't allow the dealer to do any further repairs. And now he has to pay extra shipping???

Then there's John's problem - His dealer has done his best to rectify the problem with the insert (as is his responsibility and you underlined).  For all intents, it was a new stove.  Since it sat unused for a couple of years in a protected environment (a showroom), it should be expected to function as advertised by both the dealer and the customer.  According to the warranty statement on your website:  "Thelin Hearth Products warrants its new stoves against defects in material and workmanship for a period of five (5) years from the date of purchase with the exception of the electrical components, gaskets, logs, moving parts, gas valve and control, and burner which are warranted for a period of one (1) year from date of purchase."  It was purchased in September ....  When a company wants to "make it right" and doesn't spend a few more dollars to expedite shipping, wouldn't you be frustrated if you were in his shoes?

As for helping others, yes, that is what this forum is about if you look beyond the above issues.  It is also a place to post buyer beware statements to save someone else the expense and aggravation they have encountered when having a substantial purchase for their home go wrong.

PS - See you did notice the original issue.  Good...


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## Titanmatt (Feb 17, 2014)

Lake girl what am ignoring here? Everything should have been done through the Dealer plain and simple. I do not know about any dropped calls or why that would have happened??
It's not all about serial number Lake Girl because before us the serial number only tells us what motors are in it, not the type of igniter, type of burn pot etc. it's very limited info from the original Thelin. 
These older stoves can be challenging at times and people are allowed mistakes the Dealer should have contacted us directly with this issue. 
So Lake Girl you mean to tell me possibly nothing was ever messed with on a floor model? How do you know that? Let's go easy on praising the Dealer because that is what they are supposed to do.. How bout replacement parts? Why are they selling the floor model for $1000 less?? 
I am not ignoring anything Lake Girl I've put my neck on the line trying to explain our side which I am sure the owner would like me doing this but I DO Care or I would have never said nothing in the first place.
Remember I was in this position of a Dealer for many years.


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## Titanmatt (Feb 17, 2014)

CMMartin said:


> Parlor 3000 SSN #6340   Date Code:  37-05
> 
> I needed a fan assembly/Fire pot holder/ignition
> 
> ...





Chris have you shipped this stuff back yet? The original parts look to be for a Gnome that you received. I am out sick today, can I get back to you tomorrow?
Thanks Matt


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## CMMartin (Feb 17, 2014)

Matt
I appreciate what you are doing and the help you are offering.  I had been trying to go through a Thelin dealer since early fall. I was told by my local dealer (now out of business) that I should go through someone else for the parts and was encouraged to look for anything aftermarket that could fit the stove. I was warned of very long lead times for them to get parts...Less than 1 month later they were abruptly closed and he split town.  I tried several other dealers in the region with most of them not returning calls or not replying to emails.  

I am currently working through a dealer in another state that Barney had recommended to me.  I have not met them directly nor do I hold any angst towards them.  I just want the correct parts.  I don't want to be fleeced in the process.

I have sent the images of my burn pot holder to Barney...Let me see what she has to say.

What was bothering me was that I had several differing part numbers quoted to me (all different than in the owners manual that I have) and I wanted the correct parts.  That is why I contacted Thelin directly.  One less loop in the telephone relay game and I had hoped for one less layer of possibility of error. 

I understand that there is a lack of documentation and that this is now a new/different company...it still should not be this difficult.


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## Titanmatt (Feb 17, 2014)

Chris the problem with those old part numbers at that time is that all have changed. So it can be very difficult to match them up. Every time I think I have these older stoves down something comes up that we have never seen before. My fear on your stove is the fire pot holder. I need to see the photos for myself. 
I will talk with Barney tomorrow.


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## BrotherBart (Feb 17, 2014)

Gentlemen. Lets take one to one conversations to the "conversation" function please. 

Thanks.


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## CMMartin (Feb 17, 2014)

I have not shipped the box of gnome parts yet.  It is here beside my desk and will have to go out tomorrow or wed...

I can email you the images of this burn pot as well if that would be helpful.  Or post them here...

I have started a layout cut/break pattern for this fire pot.  If I can find a chunk of decent 3/16" stainless I should be able to get it knocked out in less than an hour in the shop.  I would like to make it out of 309SS I am not sure what this current one was made of.  I have not found a local source for 309 without an appreciable lead time.  Other stainless should hold up ok but just not as well as the enriched Cr/Ni 309.

I can also post this pattern here if it would be helpful to other stove owners.


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## Mt Bob (Feb 17, 2014)

I think it is great Matt jumped in here,helps calm things down,He should consider sticking around to chime in and help people with problems.But,the company he works for knew about all the parts changes,conversions,updates when they bought the company.Appears the need to spiff up their dealer/customer support,appears now they are going to do so.Also his perception of a stove shop having all parts in stock,including stocking service trucks,is about 15 years behind what has been happening in commercial buissness.Even auto dealers are no longer required to stock large parts inventories,as it ties up too much capital.However,parts are received in 3 days.A small shop selling 4 different brands,all parts?Not even logical.Even pelpro sends parts to customers in 3 days,direct.Time to progress forward.Anyway it always helps to have a factory person in on forums,current info is great.Thanks,again.


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## CMMartin (Feb 17, 2014)

I agree...

I think that it is a huge help to have a nice discourse with a responsive employee of the company (and a knowledgeable one at that).  I am feeling much more hopeful of a positive outcome now...I was ready to weld this one to the anchor chain or use it to heat the chicken coop.  Kudos Matt...Thank you.

I am ok dealers not stocking all of the parts if they can be in hand in a reasonable time frame.


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## John Fortier (Feb 17, 2014)

Titan, Pretty much where Im at. Seems to be burning well. Nice to be back on the stat Already shut down 4 times and refired.


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## stillersnut (Feb 17, 2014)

Sounds like Thelin needs to hire more Matts! Way to face the firing squad Bro.  Wish I would of dealt with you, when I called for help/info


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## Titanmatt (Feb 17, 2014)

I t


bob bare said:


> I think it is great Matt jumped in here,helps calm things down,He should consider sticking around to chime in and help people with problems.But,the company he works for knew about all the parts changes,conversions,updates when they bought the company.Appears the need to spiff up their dealer/customer support,appears now they are going to do so.Also his perception of a stove shop having all parts in stock,including stocking service trucks,is about 15 years behind what has been happening in commercial buissness.Even auto dealers are no longer required to stock large parts inventories,as it ties up too much capital.However,parts are received in 3 days.A small shop selling 4 different brands,all parts?Not even logical.Even pelpro sends parts to customers in 3 days,direct.Time to progress forward.Anyway it always helps to have a factory person in on forums,current info is great.Thanks,again.




You are semi right bob however these Dealers know what Parts typically go bad in these stoves and a good Dealer would stock Parts. You are either in the business or not in my opinion. I mean these guys can't carry multiple sensors if anything? 
Fan motors, Feed Motors. Those are the Dealers I want out. They need to buck up and get into the game instead of pointing fingers that's all. 
Bob as far as the auto dealer analogy maybe that's true but all of our pellet stoves are basically the same parts except for some of the older models.


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## Mt Bob (Feb 17, 2014)

Titanmatt said:


> I t
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 Yep now you explained it well,no sense embelishing.Basic common parts,just as any hvac company does.So far you are a spark of bright light for thelin.


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## John Fortier (Feb 17, 2014)

bob bare said:


> Yep now you explained it well,no sense embelishing.Basic common parts,just as any hvac company does.So far you are a spark of bright light for thelin.


Agreed.


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## kinsmanstoves (Feb 18, 2014)

Titanmatt said:


> Right on Eric so you and I are on the same page as I worked for a former Dealer we knew more about the Product at times then the manufacture or the Sales Rep. When you sell a line wouldn't you think the Dealer would get familiar with the Product they are selling? This is what trade shows regional shows and training is for. I have tried to give these Dealers training manuals etc to make them better. You should know how hard it is for people to learn our Hearth business. It's not as easy as it sounds.



Yes but as a dealer it takes more than a manual and trouble shooting guide.  I can not afford to go to Utah or Florida for the "Big Show".  The stove maker has to provide hands on training prior to the dealer selling the product and that is not the case all the time.  I spend more time fixing other dealers problems more than service calls on my stoves.  Some stove makers just want to push products and blame it on the dealer or the customer if there is a problem.  There are a lot of stove brands that I will not touch because it is a bad product period.  I so many examples I can list but as a dealer to you, pick and choose your dealers.  Don't just look at who can send a check for the minimum stove order.  My $.02.

Eric


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## rick31797 (Feb 18, 2014)

kinsmanstoves said:


> Yes but as a dealer it takes more than a manual and trouble shooting guide.  I can not afford to go to Utah or Florida for the "Big Show".  The stove maker has to provide hands on training prior to the dealer selling the product and that is not the case all the time.  I spend more time fixing other dealers problems more than service calls on my stoves.  Some stove makers just want to push products and blame it on the dealer or the customer if there is a problem.  There are a lot of stove brands that I will not touch because it is a bad product period.  I so many examples I can list but as a dealer to you, pick and choose your dealers.  Don't just look at who can send a check for the minimum stove order.  My $.02.
> 
> Eric




I agree with what you are saying , and alot of dealers may have 5 or more different brands of stoves. It would be near impossible to know everything about each stove,and with older stoves that have no diagnostics, not even the manufacturer can always help,its like a guessing game, try this and that at your expense, well i can do that myself, i expect when i call a manufacturer and am specific about the problem, they can direct me in the proper direction in order to repair it.
I like to do the work myself, i cannot afford to send my stove to a dealer for 125.00 per hr,and  that's taking the stove to them, i would hate the have them do a house call,might better just give them the broken stove.


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## Mt Bob (Feb 18, 2014)

I a


rick31797 said:


> I agree with what you are saying , and alot of dealers may have 5 or more different brands of stoves. It would be near impossible to know everything about each stove,and with older stoves that have no diagnostics, not even the manufacturer can always help,its like a guessing game, try this and that at your expense, well i can do that myself, i expect when i call a manufacturer and am specific about the problem, they can direct me in the proper direction in order to repair it.
> I like to do the work myself, i cannot afford to send my stove to a dealer for 125.00 per hr,and  that's taking the stove to them, i would hate the have them do a house call,might better just give them the broken stove.


I agree.This forum is lucky to get input from dealer people,like mike and stacey,and stove techs that learned the hard way.Having a thelin rep. responding will only help them.Now if the phone service gets better,it will also help their bussiness.


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## rick31797 (Feb 18, 2014)

bob bare said:


> I a
> 
> I agree.This forum is lucky to get input from dealer people,like mike and stacey,and stove techs that learned the hard way.Having a thelin rep. responding will only help them.Now if the phone service gets better,it will also help their bussiness.




Bob i get the impression that Thelin really do not like or want customers calling, they want you to contact your dealer and if they are  actually are hanging up on customers,that says alot..


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## Mt Bob (Feb 18, 2014)

rick31797 said:


> Bob i get the impression that Thelin really do not like or want customers calling, they want you to contact your dealer and if they are  actually are hanging up on customers,that says alot..


 That's kind of my point.They need to take lessons from englander to move forward.Guess I didn't say it very well.


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## Bioburner (Feb 18, 2014)

Heres a wrinkle, called closest dealer and they don't handle pellet stove but can order and had no idea of the workings of a Thelin pellet stove. Sales without service. There is several around and for sale but how to maintain without a knowledgeable dealer without some company support?


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## CMMartin (Feb 18, 2014)

So after sending in images of my burn pot holder I received this reply.  BUT yet no correct part number to reference to said dealer.



Hi Chris,


Thank you for the picture but you will now need to send it to (Dealers name removed) for the order and they can look at the picture so we are all on the same page and make sure your order is correct.


Thank you,


Barney Barnaby-Customer Service

Thelin Hearth Products

4244 S. Market Court

Suite A

Sacramento, CA 95834-1243

530-273-1976 ext. 301  phone

530-273-3707  fax


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## Bkins (Feb 18, 2014)

Thelin wants the dealer to be their contact, not the customer.  Other stove company's work liken this, or want to work like this.  Matt said this right from the start.  Very bad way to handle customer business but that is my opinion.

Matt stated that the dealers are making the money from the sale of the stove and the sale of the parts.  The stove maker makes a nice profit from both operations so it's not a one way street.  It's nice to haven Matt try to help out but I feel from reading this thread that Thelin needs to buck up and provide the return shipping for the wrong parts and also the shipping to get the correct parts to the customer.  If Thelin needs to open up a discussion with the dealer to get them to pick up the shipping because of mistakes so be it but to make the customer pay again and again isn't the correct answer.

Nice to have you on board Matt.


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## Titanmatt (Feb 19, 2014)

Their is always two sides to every story. He bought the Part from the Dealer. We tried to provide the advise the best we could but he apparently went on his own to order a Parts.


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## Mt Bob (Feb 19, 2014)

Titanmatt said:


> Their is always two sides to every story. He bought the Part from the Dealer. We tried to provide the advise the best we could but he apparently went on his own to order a Parts.


OK Communication,Matt.Read first post.Thelin told him to order from dealer.Let us not take a giant leap backwards.


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## rick31797 (Feb 19, 2014)

bob bare said:


> OK Communication,Matt.Read first post.Thelin told him to order from dealer.Let us not take a giant leap backwards.



Thelin also provided the part numbers...Like how really hard is this..In my 2002 manual i have 10 parts listed for the Parlour 3000, and i would bet that none of the part numbers are right because, the new owners decided too change them.., that was there first mistake ,Now the stove owners have the older numbers, the Manufacturer has another and the dealer, if they have been selling thelin before the where bought out, could have both numbers.

In this case with a mix up in the parts, that Thelin provided the part numbers, its pretty simple, give the guy the right parts, and cover the costs..it was Thelin mistake , not the owner , and not the dealer. The owner did the right thing he called the manufacturer to make sure he would get the correct parts.


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## CMMartin (Feb 19, 2014)

WOW...

Ok so this AM I just received an angry email from the dealer that I have been working through.   First he told me that the burn pot holder is extinct and that he was told that I was bad mouthing him on the web.  I only spoke very negatively about Jeff (that is the name he gave me...turns out might actually be a Jim) who is a service manager for Thelin. 

So the other day when I sent the images to Barney, she could have easily told me that they no longer support this stove or parts for it and that I was on my own...She did not.  She passed it back to this dealer to tell me and wanted to toss a bit of mud at the same time. 

I do not believe that I had spoken anything negative about the dealer nor had I identified him.  I did encourage him to find this forum and read through for himself.  After working through this mess I completely understand that none of this is the dealers fault.

This is just crazy.  This is not a company that cares about customer service nor do they communicate well with the customers.  Matt I appreciate your attempt to help and I would encourage you to find a better company to work for.  Also to be very clear I did not go on my own to order the parts...I went to the dealers web site and searched for the numbers Barney had given me, added the items to my cart and checked out (with a cringe due to the very high cost). Then there was an additional layer of communication from the dealer and Thelin to ensure the correct parts would be shipped.

I am going to go buy the sheet metal stock today to start making it myself.  It won't be 309 stainless but it will last at least long enough to buy a new stove from a more reputable manufacture. 

Chris


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## CMMartin (Feb 19, 2014)

This saga has 2 more chapters...

Actually getting my money back for the incorrect parts.  I will not hold my breath on the shipping, I believe that I will just be out that cash.

Selecting a manufacture and a new stove...  Now that is a whole new problem.


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## Titanmatt (Feb 19, 2014)

Chris it is hard for me to believe that if you gave the correct Serial # of your stove that you could have been given the wrong Part #'s. So crazy to me but it is what it is at this point.

As far as Rick's comment. Manufactures especially in the Hearth business change Part #'s all the time along with a new staff of people working their. So what happens? Miss communications changes in product, etc. without necessary notice to the Staff or the training.

All we ask for is a Serial # which only goes so far at times. Tells us what Fan Motor, Feed Motor what chip is installed & Igniter.
The Motors are easy but Firepots, Types & lengths of Igniters, Types of Switches were all different. Since I came on to the Company I have revamped the Parts List to reflect Measurements of every Igniter that I know of that was used in a Thelin Stove. 
I try to train anyone that either answers a Phone or Emails to request not only the Serial # but a Photo & measurement of the Part. It has gotten rid of a lot of issues with returns etc.

It is not a perfect science Rick but I think what happened with you is I was not given you the answer that you liked or wanted to hear & I am sorry for that.

Chris I am sorry you are going through what you are & honestly I am surprised at how this went down.


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## CMMartin (Feb 19, 2014)

Matt I have given the same ssn and date code from the back of the stove from moment one on this.

I just received an apology from the dealer.  I sent him a link to this thread and he sent a sincere email...

Mr Martin: Needless to say I didn't have access to this and was told by Thelin that you did say bad things about me. I have now read the article, and I will apologize for believing them. Thank you for enlightening me.

WOW...Just WOW...


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## Polar Bear (Feb 19, 2014)

I'm still laughing about Barney Barnaby


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## rick31797 (Feb 19, 2014)

Matt i have moved on , with a brand new stove, and this thread is not about me, its about Chris and i am really not that surprised what he is going through,my negative feeling about Thelins customer service since Jay retired is correct.As i said in a previous post you tried to help,  but you can only do so much. 

 Chris is fortunate he is handy enough to be able to make his own part, that is no longer available,but should not be out of pocket.


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## stillersnut (Feb 19, 2014)

Just like I've (gratefully) moved on from my Thelin, I'm moving on, from this thread...gotta load up 120 lbs of Pennwoods into my PAH hopper & let it rip!  Good luck to all involved in this issue w/Thelin


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## Titanmatt (Feb 19, 2014)

Guys a few bad apples do not make this stove line bad. Yes obviously people have had some bad luck but there are plenty of happy people out their burning their Thelin stoves proudly for many years and many more to come.
Matt


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## stovelark (Feb 19, 2014)

Hello    Chris sounds like he has been amazingly patient.  I've worked with 3 dealerships, sold, installed and serviced many different pellet stoves.  We sold a handful of Thelins- they offered a unique look, but their price was outrageous.  Funny reading Matt gouging on dealers with the cost that his stoves have.  For the few customers who did have Thelins, most liked them.  Cleaning one wasn't too difficult, maintenance wasn't bad, but getting parts were always a nightmare.  (My time for dealing with them was 2009-2012).  Sorry Matt, too many better stoves for a better price being made.  It is refreshing though hearing a MFR getting thrashed on here instead of a dealer taking advantage of someone, or providing no customer service as is published here often.


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## ebengel (Feb 19, 2014)

I'm one who has been happy with my Thelin,this is our sixth winter with it.I did replace the fan motor this winter and the feed motor is getting weak and will need to be replaced soon but this stove has been our primary heat source since it was installed. The only other things we have replaced is a T-1 sensor and a couple of ignitors, one of which I pulled the wires out of while cleaning the stove. This is only my experience, but we are very happy with it and also with our dealer who has always taken care of us.


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## Mt Bob (Feb 19, 2014)

Make a customer happy and you may gain 1 to 4 new ones.Piss off a customer and you will lose 10 to 15.Don't forget,there were happy vega owers at one time.


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## John Fortier (Feb 19, 2014)

Folks, 
I am not going to stand on a soapbox and praise Thelin to the heavens. That said, I will say, with all the headaches I have had , they have come through for us. Myself and my better half have always loved the look and heat this stove puts out. Problems and wait times have been a major issue. Stoves and Stuff ( which now repair but do not carry this brand anymore) have been great. As of now it is running as it should and this harsh winter will be ending soon, fingers crossed. Matt and Thelin, thank you for getting this stove where it should be. IF the belief in your product is what you truly believe, then please make us believers. All we are asking for at this point is to help us get through next winter with no problems... extend our warranty by 6 months so we may have a trouble free heating season.


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## rick31797 (Feb 19, 2014)

ebengel said:


> I'm one who has been happy with my Thelin,this is our sixth winter with it.I did replace the fan motor this winter and the feed motor is getting weak and will need to be replaced soon but this stove has been our primary heat source since it was installed. The only other things we have replaced is a T-1 sensor and a couple of ignitors, one of which I pulled the wires out of while cleaning the stove. This is only my experience, but we are very happy with it and also with our dealer who has always taken care of us.



IF your Thelin is the same as mine, when you or your dealer pulls out the auger motor, make sure you/they change the, plastic or nylon bushing that is inside the stove that the auger shaft sits in. Over time the auger will wear and break this plastic part..


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## CMMartin (Feb 19, 2014)

I have liked this stove...It looks nice. Puts out a fair amount of heat and I do really like the battery backup option.  It was not until I tried to get parts that everything went south.  Maybe if I had gotten to talk to Matt from the get go things would have been different.  (I am glad that I did receive the correct fan. It did have a positive impact on the performance of this stove).  It seems well built.

Now at this point I am going to make this stove preform the best it can until I can find a replacement.  I did just invest $380 for a new fan.  

One of my first projects: since I now realize that the auger feed motor will spin in reverse with a change in polarity...I am going to build a daughter board that will spin the auger backward when it jams.  This should cost less than $25 in parts to build an automatic version, in the short term I will just wire a switch.  This will resolve the biggest problem I have with the stove which is the feed jamming and needing to dig all of the pellets out to fix it.  I will let you know if/how this works...

All things considered the stove was purchased for less than $4k and has paid for itself in the saving in LP costs over the years.  I still hate hearing that LP kick on and I do like the convenience of  loading the hopper and waking up warm.  My last wood stove always died out about 4 or 5 AM and the house was cold as I needed to get out of bed.

My remaining question is:
If they don't make the fire pot holder anymore; why did they not just say that when I had sent the images to Barney?  They had the dealer do it the next day, and told him that I was bad mouthing him.  There are several time this could have been made better from a customer point of view.  This should not be this hard...


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## Lake Girl (Feb 19, 2014)

I wonder who went back to Thelin to spread a erroneous ray of sunshine to the dealer?  I also read an intimation that a dealer may have "messed" with an insert when it was on the showroom floor and then reduced the price - my take was it probably was time to get it off his showroom floor so he could display a model that was actually selling well.  I didn't see a regular forum member bad mouthing a dealer...


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## CMMartin (Feb 19, 2014)

Rick thank you for that...I will check that next time I have it apart.


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## CMMartin (Feb 19, 2014)

I will say this as many times as I need to...The dealer that was helping me was at no fault in this.  They have changed some of their product descriptions now to avoid future confusions.  Seems like a good stand up guy.


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## CMMartin (Feb 19, 2014)

Titanmatt said:


> Guys a few bad apples do not make this stove line bad. Yes obviously people have had some bad luck but there are plenty of happy people out their burning their Thelin stoves proudly for many years and many more to come.
> Matt



The stove is not my problem here...It is how the Thelin Co. handled this. 

Chris


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## rick31797 (Feb 19, 2014)

I never thought the thelin stove were a bad stove or not a good design.. they do look good, when they are working they put out good heat.I liked how they were simplified.

But the best stove in the world is no good without customer support, and the high cost of parts and getting parts makes the thelin stove not as pretty as it looks.


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## Bioburner (Feb 19, 2014)

? For Thelin followers, when did the gnome get auto ignition? Or was it a option for a period of time? With my inquiry of 12 volt stoves I was lead to one without igniter for 1k, supposedly very light use and clean.


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## Titanmatt (Feb 20, 2014)

Bioburner said:


> ? For Thelin followers, when did the gnome get auto ignition? Or was it a option for a period of time? With my inquiry of 12 volt stoves I was lead to one without igniter for 1k, supposedly very light use and clean.


Bio I believe some were around 2006 2007 is when EI started


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## bondo (Feb 20, 2014)

So let me get this straight. The serial number and parts numbers are hard to match up for the company. How is that the customers fault in any way? Pictures are needed for the correct parts. Yet apparently no pictures were requested otherwise the customer would have gotten the correct parts. Then the fact that someone from the company told the dealer he/she was getting slammed here on the forum. Even though that did not happen. OUCH that is pitiful customer service. A company is measured by customer service. No matter what is said or done now I can guarantee there is one stove now I will never have in my home.


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## Bioburner (Feb 20, 2014)

Titanmatt said:


> Bio I believe some were around 2006 2007 is when EI started


Thanks, Got a Manufacture date this AM and the owner was off by a long ways. 2001. Doubt company has much in repair parts if needed in the future Would the control board be analog with simple timer circuitry? No way I would be willing to pay 1K for a 14 year old stove.


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## rick31797 (Feb 20, 2014)

CMMartin said:


> Rick thank you for that...I will check that next time I have it apart.





Bioburner said:


> Thanks, Got a Manufacture date this AM and the owner was off by a long ways. 2001. Doubt company has much in repair parts if needed in the future Would the control board be analog with simple timer circuitry? No way I would be willing to pay 1K for a 14 year old stove.





Bioburner said:


> Thanks, Got a Manufacture date this AM and the owner was off by a long ways. 2001. Doubt company has much in repair parts if needed in the future Would the control board be analog with simple timer circuitry? No way I would be willing to pay 1K for a 14 year old stove.




That stove is a 1 yr older then mine..mine is a parlour 3000, not a gnome..I am thinking there are common parts in both stoves, mine is also manual start...Circuit board is analog, and you cannot get the same board for it, The newer circuit boards will not fit the stove so they also sell you an adapter so it will plug into the wiring harness .. For me the cost is  600.00 ..... 349.00  circuit board .....adapter for 170.00  plus shipping and taxes .My circuit board went this year.I would say a 1,000.00 for a stove that old is quite high..


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## rick31797 (Feb 20, 2014)

*I took the time to take some pictures of the Plastic Auger Bushing in my thelin stove, I would think most of the stoves have this wearable part in them..
If it wears and breaks as you can see in the picture, the auger shaft will be spinning metal on metal and the inside metal hole the plastic bushing sits in will start to go out of round and get larger..If it gets this far ,you will have a problem.

An easier way to check this, instead of taking the auger out,is to run your stove dry, unplug it and reach in and see if you have any play in the auger.If you can move it up and down , then the bushing is worn and needs to be replaced..But if you are planning on taking the auger out, for the cost, i would just put a new one in ...Hope this helps..














*


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## ebengel (Feb 20, 2014)

rick31797 said:


> *I took the time to take some pictures of the Plastic Auger Bushing in my thelin stove, I would think most of the stoves have this wearable part in them..
> If it wears and breaks as you can see in the picture, the auger shaft will be spinning metal on metal and the inside metal hole the plastic bushing sits in will start to go out of round and get larger..If it gets this far ,you will have a problem.
> 
> An easier way to check this, instead of taking the auger out,is to run your stove dry, unplug it and reach in and see if you have any play in the auger.If you can move it up and down , then the bushing is worn and needs to be replaced..But if you are planning on taking the auger out, for the cost, i would just put a new one in ...Hope this helps..
> ...


 
Rick, Thanks, I will order the bushing too since it will be apart and emptied anyway.


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## Lake Girl (Feb 20, 2014)

bondo said:


> Then the fact that someone from the company told the dealer he/she was getting slammed here on the forum. Even though that did not happen. OUCH that is pitiful customer service.



....and dealer relations


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## Titanmatt (Feb 20, 2014)

stovelark said:


> Hello    Chris sounds like he has been amazingly patient.  I've worked with 3 dealerships, sold, installed and serviced many different pellet stoves.  We sold a handful of Thelins- they offered a unique look, but their price was outrageous.  Funny reading Matt gouging on dealers with the cost that his stoves have.  For the few customers who did have Thelins, most liked them.  Cleaning one wasn't too difficult, maintenance wasn't bad, but getting parts were always a nightmare.  (My time for dealing with them was 2009-2012).  Sorry Matt, too many better stoves for a better price being made.  It is refreshing though hearing a MFR getting thrashed on here instead of a dealer taking advantage of someone, or providing no customer service as is published here often.



Stovelark, I worked for a Dealer for 18 Years so you are damn right I am going to call out some of them because they are not providing their Customers with the service from start to finish. They tend to walk away when there is a problem then throw it on our plate. Sorry bud that is a bad Dealer. My former Dealer that  I worked for, we were always attentive to our customers & got the Manufacture involved only if necessary. 
As far as our Stove prices go we are not the Cheapest & never claimed to be we are unique, never said we were the best but do you know the Labor involved in making that Stove & the Parts that go with it? Obviously you do not. That stove is Hand welded & can take Hours to build & can be very frustrating. 
 Believe me when I was an Installer I wanted nothing more than to blast a Manufacture because as a Dealer we were the ones taken all the heat.


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## Titanmatt (Feb 20, 2014)

Bioburner said:


> Thanks, Got a Manufacture date this AM and the owner was off by a long ways. 2001. Doubt company has much in repair parts if needed in the future Would the control board be analog with simple timer circuitry? No way I would be willing to pay 1K for a 14 year old stove.



Bio Most of the Parts are still available. I know we do not have the wiring Harness but have most of everything else.


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## stovelark (Feb 20, 2014)

Hey Matt     don't understand most of your rant above.  Since when does hand welding something mean it is better??  I think there's a reason machine welding is the preferred method used today.  That's not much justification for your stoves being so high in price either.  I myself seem to believe it is you who knows little about the cost per unit equation.  As for building a stove being frustrating???  The only frustration I've seen so far is someone trying to get the correct parts from you guys..... from what I've read here, don't forget all of your so-called installation skills, you might need them again.  Have a nice day.


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## Titanmatt (Feb 20, 2014)

Hey Stovelark you don't know anything about me or my back round and OBVIOUSLY know nothing about manufacturing. Please do not question my Installatioon experience either. I helped build my former company from the ground up. i never said hand welding makes our Stoves better I said they require more labor and time then some stove made from a machine. So please don't question my experience in this business. People are getting the right parts everyday and obviously a mistake was made. Geez


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## CMMartin (Feb 20, 2014)

Mistake or not...I still have not gotten the correct parts.


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## BrotherBart (Feb 20, 2014)

Not a chat room folks. Take it to the personal message conversation function as I suggested a long time ago.

This one is closed.


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