# Western Washington under stage 1 burn ban



## Elderthewelder (Jan 30, 2007)

No burning unless you have a "certified" wood/pellet stove
http://www.pscleanair.org/airq/status.aspx

differences between stage 1 and stage 2
http://www.pscleanair.org/airq/burnban/

Stage I. During a Stage I burn ban:

No burning is allowed in fireplaces and uncertified wood stoves, unless it is your only adequate source of heat. This includes the use of manufactured logs such as Duraflame or Javalogs.

You can use pellet stoves, EPA-certified wood stoves and natural gas or propane fireplaces.

No visible smoke is allowed from any solid fuel burning devices, beyond a 20 minute start-up period. 


Stage II. During a Stage II burn ban: 

No burning is allowed in any fireplace, pellet stove or wood stove (certified or not), unless it is your only adequate source of heat. 

You can use natural gas or propane fireplaces. 

No visible smoke is allowed from any solid fuel burning device at any time. 

All outdoor burning is prohibited during a burn ban, even in areas where otherwise permitted by law.


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## kevinmoelk (Jan 30, 2007)

Thanks for the update Elder.  Don't think Yakima is under a ban, but I'll have to keep an eye on it.  

-Kevin


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## babalu87 (Jan 30, 2007)

Do they make you stop driving too?

What about tractor trailers and shipping interests?


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## Eric Johnson (Jan 30, 2007)

Can you smoke?

How about trans fats?


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## stoveguy2esw (Jan 30, 2007)

what brought that about? was it dry conditions??? thought you guys up in wash were getting hammered this winter?

EDIT, ok i went back and re read, guess its air quality


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## babalu87 (Jan 30, 2007)

Eric Johnson said:
			
		

> Can you smoke?
> 
> How about trans fats?




I bet they have guys that follow you around after too many draft beers and pickled eggs


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## restorer (Jan 30, 2007)

Had a red alert here for almost three weeks and on and off for three additional weeks. Salt Lake is in a Basin, mountains on three sides. When we get an inversion (temperatures lower in the Valley and warmer a 5,000+ feet elevation), the air stagnates and sits here. This might last another week, but I think it's been red for 20 of the last 30 days. It is totally unhealthy. Seniors should stay inside, kids should not play outside, etc. They shut down major polluters, the power company's coal fire generators (they are forced to use NG) used to close the steel plant when it was still operating. Car pooling is recommended. 

To give you an idea, I'm pretty healthy respiratory-wise. Today, my eyes have burned since I got up. My sinuses are stuffed and draining like I have a cold. The back of my mouth burns when I breath heavy. When it's like this I do nothing in the shop that irritates my lungs like sanding, using solvents, using dust making equipment.

It's not a joke. Serious condition especially for those with respiratory problems like asthma, allergies, emphysema, lung disease.


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## Elderthewelder (Jan 30, 2007)

We have talked about this subject here in the past as well
https://www.hearth.com/econtent/index.php/forums/viewthread/4376/


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## begreen (Jan 30, 2007)

We have a high pressure system parked over us that ain't moving. Air gets trapped between the Olympics and Cascades. At 10-14,000 feet they make a formidable barrier, even to weather systems. Add a few million of humans to the mix and you get the picture. This is when a product like manufactured logs and pellets are an asset. Much cleaner burning while keeping you warm .


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## Roospike (Jan 30, 2007)

BeGreen said:
			
		

> We have a high pressure system parked over us that ain't moving. Air gets trapped between the Olympics and Cascades. At 10-14,000 feet they make a formidable barrier, even to weather systems. Add a few million of humans to the mix and you get the picture. This is when a product like manufactured logs and pellets are an asset. Much cleaner burning while keeping you warm .



BeGreen , I see you have mentioned the "clean burning" or much cleaner burning manufactured logs in many post , Do have a link showing the manufactured logs burning cleaner and or other test of the cleaner burning logs. I seen the video and seen where you mentioned clean burning logs but cant find the review link showing the logs burn clean and or other such data. TKS


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## begreen (Jan 30, 2007)

I searched for web data, but wasn't too happy with the results. The literature that Idaho Energy logs prints has a lot more data than their somewhat wimpy website. Their literature shows a 61.5% reduction in particulate emissions between cordwood and the Energy Logs burned in a phase 2 stove. In an uncertified stove, the results are much more dramatic. They report a 93.5% reduction there.  I have an email into them to get more details like the lab that did the testing, type of cordwood, etc.. 

HomeFire's website is down right now so I can't check up on it. But I'll email them.


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## MrGriz (Jan 30, 2007)

babalu87 said:
			
		

> Eric Johnson said:
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They do, they are from a government licensing bureau.  You need to apply and pay them to be licensed as a natural gas producer  ;-P


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## detmurds (Jan 31, 2007)

EPA Certified?  I'm burning right now and I live in Kitsap County!  What is EPA Certified,...the pdf file won't open up to say which stoves are EPA Certified!  Anyone know?


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## Elderthewelder (Jan 31, 2007)

What kind of a stove do you have an how old is it?If it is certfied it should have a label on the back of it something like this


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## detmurds (Jan 31, 2007)

My stove is an Avalon stove, and it is an insert so I can't even see the back of it.  I had it installed last June brand new.


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## restorer (Jan 31, 2007)

detmurds said:
			
		

> My stove is an Avalon stove, and it is an insert so I can't even see the back of it.  I had it installed last June brand new.



If it was NEW, it's certified. Ask your dealer for a copy of the certification if you are concerned.


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## begreen (Jan 31, 2007)

Is that a Ranier insert? If yes, way to go @ 2.0 gms/ hr. It's EPA certified as are all new Avalons.


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## Highbeam (Jan 31, 2007)

I just kept right on burning as though nothing happened. I did manage to verify that my 1992 model Lopi is "certified" or at least as certified as you could get back in 1992. The problem is that the label is sitting on the rear of the 500 lb insert smacked up against the masonry wall. No inpector will be able to read it but I know it's there and have recorded the serial number. 

The news folks that announce these bans don't do a very good job of pointing out that vertified stoves and pellet burners are still legal. 

Supposedly a stage 2 burn ban is very rare. Does anyone recall the last phase 2 ban? No solid fuel burners allowed? As though anyone would know that you are burning pellets.


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## Jags (Jan 31, 2007)

UncleRich said:
			
		

> Had a red alert here for almost three weeks and on and off for three additional weeks. Salt Lake is in a Basin, mountains on three sides. When we get an inversion (temperatures lower in the Valley and warmer a 5,000+ feet elevation), the air stagnates and sits here. This might last another week, but I think it's been red for 20 of the last 30 days. It is totally unhealthy. Seniors should stay inside, kids should not play outside, etc. They shut down major polluters, the power company's coal fire generators (they are forced to use NG) used to close the steel plant when it was still operating. Car pooling is recommended.
> 
> To give you an idea, I'm pretty healthy respiratory-wise. Today, my eyes have burned since I got up. My sinuses are stuffed and draining like I have a cold. The back of my mouth burns when I breath heavy. When it's like this I do nothing in the shop that irritates my lungs like sanding, using solvents, using dust making equipment.
> 
> It's not a joke. Serious condition especially for those with respiratory problems like asthma, allergies, emphysema, lung disease.



Please don't take this personal, but, why in the heck would you live someplace that you have to chew the air before you can breathe it in?  From what I understand, Salt Lake is a pretty place, but your description of the air sounds more like a commercial for "Cambells Chunky Soup".  Air is kinda one of the things I need to live, so I want it to be good quality.  To me, its like drinking tainted water.  Doesn't make sense.  Really, this is not meant personally, more of a question I guess.


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## restorer (Jan 31, 2007)

Jags said:
			
		

> UncleRich said:
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No offense taken, but this is not typical. Overall air quality is much better than most major metropolitan areas, especially the West Coast. Just happens that once in a while we get stuck. Hasn't been this bad in 20 years. When it's over, I'll quote the broken records and the impact. Outside of Magcorp and Kennecott Copper we have very little heavy industry, so it blows away in a few days. If you go back to past threads, we have been cold. averaging 10-20 degrees below normal, but it is Brown. No Famous Dave's BBQ, but the real nasty kind. Last two times it was this bad was when California was burning up, and we caught their air and got stuck against the Mountains. 

Air quality is always an issue in basins, river valleys and bays where the air gets inverted. We just have a Air Quality Control mechanism that does help. I have seen pictures of this valley back in the twenties, with 80% fewer people and most heated with wood or coal. That was air like charcoal briquettes. If we curbed Magcorp, and controlled the auto/truck emissions we would have it whipped.


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## Jags (Jan 31, 2007)

So this is actually a pretty rare thing.  I got it.


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## Elderthewelder (Feb 1, 2007)

Highbeam said:
			
		

> Supposedly a stage 2 burn ban is very rare. Does anyone recall the last phase 2 ban? No solid fuel burners allowed? As though anyone would know that you are burning pellets.



I don't recall a phase 2 in the recent  past. Also the phase 1 has now been lifted 
http://www.pscleanair.org/airq/status.aspx


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## detmurds (Feb 1, 2007)

UncleRich said:
			
		

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I called the store, they said I can "burn as I wish!"

....Thanks!


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## detmurds (Feb 1, 2007)

BeGreen said:
			
		

> Is that a Ranier insert? If yes, way to go @ 2.0 gms/ hr. It's EPA certified as are all new Avalons.



No,...it is the smaller model,...the "Pendleton."


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## wg_bent (Feb 1, 2007)

UncleRich said:
			
		

> Jags said:
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and Jersey get's the bad rep.  I've never been able to actualy SEE the air even in Hoboken.


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