# UPDATE: New Harman Advance pellet stove, rumbling noise and auger motor noise



## bcb1

Looks like I'm in the same boat as some other Harman owners.  I've got the dreaded woofing sound when my stove is burning at a medium to high flame, it sort of vibrates and sounds like a train or a helicopter outside the house.  And in addition to that, my auger motor is loud, I read someone else describing the noise as a cheap rotisserie oven motor, and that's exactly what it sounds like.  It wouldn't be so bad if it were a constant noise like the distribution fan blower, but the fact that it only feeds once every 5-10 seconds makes it very noticeable.

Very disappointing on a new $3800 stove.  My old 2004 Quadrafire Santa Fe was dead silent.  Yeah, it was a pain in the rear to have to clean out the burnpot every single day, but it sure was nice to have a stove that was quiet.  I'm afraid I've spent a pile of money to get a stove that I don't have to clean as often, yet is driving me crazy with the noises it makes.

So, all you Harman experts:

1.  Is there a way to quiet down the auger motor?  I see a guy on ebay that sells replacement motors made by a different company for about $130.  I don't care about the money, I'd gladly pay $130 for a new auger motor if it were as quiet as my old Quadrafire stove.  Would my dealer replace my motor on my brand new stove simply because it's "too loud"?

2.  For the stove rumbling, subwoofer sound, what I've done so far is put a piece of foil tape over part of the air intake port.  That has calmed down the sound, but it also makes for a lazier flame.  Take the tape off and the flame goes crazy, but the rumbling comes back.  Arrrrrgh.  All gaskets seem okay - door gasket, ashpan gasket, pellet bin gasket.  I'm running on inside air, not the outside air kit if that makes any difference.  

Help!  Any advice is appreciated.


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## forya

I have noticed that mine will do this every once in a while and only with certain pellets.  I am running Lignetecs now and have not heard it in the last few days


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## humpin iron

whats the feed rate at?  what kind of pellets?  There is a 98.7% chance it is NOT the stove


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## lbcynya

Those are my threads you are referring to.  

Relative to the woofing, you'll have to stay tuned for that one.  Hopefully it's a hopper gasket issue, not an inherent flaw in the design.  I've ruled out the lower hopper gasket, but the upper one could be suspect.  It's a royal PITA to get to on the XXV, so I haven't had much time to figure out a way to seal it properly.  Hard to say, might be inherent in the design because the volumetric pressure for the hopper and the burn area are different causing this anomaly.  Now that I have a Skytech thermostat, the stove burns on hi or low, so the woofing is VERY minimal as the flame ramps up.  

Gear motor for the auger - yes, it's reasonable to request a replacement if it makes too much noise. IMO, then the combustion and distribution fans are on hi, the auger gear motor should be "invisible" from a reasonable distance.  While he's replacing the gear motor, discuss the woofing and see what they say. My dealer and Harman seems to be avoiding it like the plague.


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## bcb1

I'm using Greene Team pellets from my local stove dealer.  Very good in past years, they seem to be a bit smaller and have a bit more ash this year.  I got 25 bags of Hamer's Hot Ones with the stove, so I'll try them as soon as I get them delivered.

Feed rate is 4, though I've lowered it to 3 and it helped a little bit but not much, so I turned it back to 4.  Putting the piece of foil tape over about 1/2 of the air intake seemed to help the most, it just doesn't burn with that real fast, active flame.  It's not real lazy, just not as active as with no tape on the intake pipe.  I suppose I can live with it, I just found it rather annoying. 

I read in another thread that a guy cured his by replacing the door gasket, and his stove was only a year old.  I suppose I could call the dealer for a service call and have them replace the door gasket and check/replace the noisy auger motor at the same time.  Another guy said it was his flame guide.  I was thinking about putting a small piece of steel behind the flame guide to make it stick out another 1/8 inch or 1/4 inch.  Maybe that would be enough to change the flame pattern and keep it from woofing...?

Interestingly enough, when the stove burns for a day or two without cleaning it, I don't notice the woofing nearly as much.  I guess the ash builds up and it makes the flames burn at a different rate or angle?  I definitely notice it more when the stove is nice and clean, no ashes.


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## bcb1

Update as of 12/29:

Cleaned out burnpot thoroughly.  Set pellet feed to 4, temperature to 70 degrees.  Blocked a little less than 50% of the intake air pipe with aluminum foil tape.  As of now, the rumbling "train" noise is liveable.  It's most noticeable at startup when the fire is big.  Once the room heats up, ashes build up in the burnpot and the stove starts to crank down the fire to a smaller flame, the rumble sound is completely gone.

What's not gone is the annoying whrrrr-rrrrr-rrrrr noise of the auger motor.  I've got the local Harman dealer coming to look at it on Tuesday next week but I bet he says it's normal.  I'm hoping that he might humor me and swap it out with another one, but we'll see.


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## Dougsey

bcb1- I would push hard for him to swap out the auger motor.

Mine became really noisy when my stove was about 2 weeks old. I could hear in turn when I was upstairs in bed.

I pulled it out myself and brought it to the stove shop. Interestingly, it was quiet when it was not mounted in the stove. It seemed like the vibration was resonating when it was in the stove. 

Dealer said it checked out normal so I asked him to give me another one just to humor me. The new one was much quieter.


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## bcb1

Dougsey:  Thanks for the advice, I will definitely ask the tech to swap it out.  According to the chimney sweep guy that installed my pellet pipe years ago, the tech at the Harman dealer where I got my stove is very good, so hopefully it won't take too much convincing.  

By the way, your issue with the auger resonating is the exact same issue I'm having.  It seems like it's vibrating, or maybe the sound is bouncing off all the metal nearby.  I figure if they swap it out and it helps, great.  If it doesn't help, it's not so bad that I can't live with it.  In fact if it's no different with the new motor from Harman, I'm going to try one of the motors from Merkle-Korff.  There is a dealer that sells them on Ebay for $130.  Supposedly built to very exacting tolerances and much quieter.  He said he'd even ship it, allow me to install it and take it back if it wasn't quieter.  That's a very generous return policy!


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## Matt715

I've got a older (2005) Accentra and it has rumbled since day one. Mine mostly does it once the stove is hot and idling, mostly after a high/hot burn. My local dealer has been out at least 15 times trying different things to fix it but we were never able to correct it. We have been able to quiet it down by lowering the fan speed at idle, covering the intake with tape, replacing the front panel gasket (not the door), and trying a smaller fan blade. Originally, they had also removed the damper because I have a direct vent (as recommended by Harmon) but now it's no longer recommended. All of these things stopped the rumbling but made my flame lazy and stove inefficient. I had them remove all the modifications, install a new damper, and leave the fan idle speed low.

4 years and tons of wasted time later, Harman finally decided to give me a new stove. I had it for about a week before I got my old stove back. My new stove rumbled worse than my old one and the new direct drive motor was unbearably loud compared to my old chain drive model which I have managed to get completely quiet.  

IMHO, I think the rumbling is just a problem with their stoves as I have heard other models in my dealer's showroom do the same thing while I'm there.

Good luck!


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## Lineman30

Matt715 said:
			
		

> I've got a older (2005) Accentra and it has rumbled since day one. Mine mostly does it once the stove is hot and idling, mostly after a high/hot burn. My local dealer has been out at least 15 times trying different things to fix it but we were never able to correct it. We have been able to quiet it down by lowering the fan speed at idle, covering the intake with tape, replacing the front panel gasket (not the door), and trying a smaller fan blade. Originally, they had also removed the damper because I have a direct vent (as recommended by Harmon) but now it's no longer recommended. All of these things stopped the rumbling but made my flame lazy and stove inefficient. I had them remove all the modifications, install a new damper, and leave the fan idle speed low.
> 
> 4 years and tons of wasted time later, Harman finally decided to give me a new stove. I had it for about a week before I got my old stove back. My new stove rumbled worse than my old one and the new direct drive motor was unbearably loud compared to my old chain drive model which I have managed to get completely quiet.
> 
> IMHO, I think the rumbling is just a problem with their stoves as I have heard other models in my dealer's showroom do the same thing while I'm there.
> 
> Good luck!




So it sounds like there really isnt a cure for this illness.  I have a 06 I bought used and have tried everything to cure it.  I've actually just learned to live with it and just enjoy the awesome heat that it puts out


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## bcb1

Thanks for the replies.  I agree, the rumbling train sound is just something that I'm going to have to live with.  I made it better by partially blocking the air intake tube with foil tape, but it still does it sometimes.  Not the end of the world or anything, just a little annoying at times.

What I can't live with is the stupid loud auger!  The rrrr-rrrr-rrrr grinding noise is driving me nuts.  I can hear it from the next room when it runs.  And in my bedroom next door, I can even feel the vibration caused by the auger motor running.  It's definitely not something that I should have to live with on a brand new $3700 stove.  

I read in other threads that some folks have had their auger motors replaced, only to have the 2nd one just as loud as the first one.  But then they replace it again, and the 3rd motor is finally quiet.  Seems to be a quality control issue with either Harman or the people that make the auger motors.  Mine is a Gleason Avery motor.


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## PJPellet

bcb1 said:
			
		

> Thanks for the replies.  I agree, the rumbling train sound is just something that I'm going to have to live with.  I made it better by partially blocking the air intake tube with foil tape, but it still does it sometimes.  Not the end of the world or anything, just a little annoying at times.
> 
> What I can't live with is the stupid loud auger!  The rrrr-rrrr-rrrr grinding noise is driving me nuts.  I can hear it from the next room when it runs.  And in my bedroom next door, I can even feel the vibration caused by the auger motor running.  It's definitely not something that I should have to live with on a brand new $3700 stove.
> 
> I read in other threads that some folks have had their auger motors replaced, only to have the 2nd one just as loud as the first one.  But then they replace it again, and the 3rd motor is finally quiet.  Seems to be a quality control issue with either Harman or the people that make the auger motors.  Mine is a Gleason Avery motor.




I agree, mine is rather loud too.  You've got me thinking about buying one of the other brand motors from ebay to try.


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## bcb1

Dougsey said:
			
		

> bcb1- I would push hard for him to swap out the auger motor.
> 
> I pulled it out myself and brought it to the stove shop. Interestingly, it was quiet when it was not mounted in the stove. It seemed like the vibration was resonating when it was in the stove.




Dougsey:  Was the auger motor hard to remove?  I can definitely take the side panel off and see the motor.  I only have a limited amount of space on the left side of the stove to work, would I need to disconnect the pipe and move the stove in order to get the auger motor off, or is it something that you can easily do with the stove in place?


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## bcb1

PJPellet said:
			
		

> bcb1 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I agree, mine is rather loud too.  You've got me thinking about buying one of the other brand motors from ebay to try.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> PJPellet:  The Harman dealer is coming to check mine out today, hopefully he'll have an extra auger motor to swap in there and we'll see how that goes.  If it's not any better, then I'm definitely going to order the Merkle Korff motor from the guy on ebay.  It'll be well worth the $130 to have a quiet auger motor.
Click to expand...


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## PJPellet

I agree.  Besides the auger motor the stove is quiet.  It would be great to fix that issue.  Keep us posted.  Good Luck!


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## bcb1

Update:  Harman dealer tech was here today and I really like him, he's a great guy.  He said the auger sounds pretty normal to him, but that he would call Harman and get it replaced under warranty.  I made him a deal:  he gets a new motor from Harman, I'm going to buy the Merkle Korff motor off the guy on ebay and I'll have it here for him when he comes back to install my new Harman motor.  If the new Harman motor makes the same amount of noise as the old motor, he'll swap in my other motor and we'll see if that one is any better.  

He said changing out the auger motor is a breeze, it's only held in by one bolt so it only takes a couple minutes.  No need to move or disconnect stove.

As far as the rumbling "subwoofer" noise (a totally seperate issue), he said that Harman tech support usually sees that issue on insert stoves.  They say on some of them, the rumbling is loud and powerful enough to actually feel in the next room, literally like a train right outside the door.  Mine isn't that bad.  On inserts, they say it's caused by the cold air in the chimney versus the warm air in the pellet pipe, and the fix is to insulate the pellet pipe with high temperature insulation wrap.  Mine is a free standing Advance stove, but my pellet pipe does run through about 12" of unheated ceiling space before it exits the roof.  Not real easy to get to without totally disassembling the pipe, wrapping it, and putting it all back together.  

First thing he's going to try is replacing the pellet pipe rain cap on the outside, he said mine is the wrong style and it's blocking too much airflow.  If that doesn't work, then he'll either insulate the pipe in the unheated chase, and/or replace the existing 3" pellet pipe with 4" pellet pipe.  

I really like how he isn't just shrugging off the issue, he is genuinely interested in helping get it fixed.  

Oh, and I have my old top vent adapter off my Quadra Fire stove that I wanted to put on my new Harman stove.  It has this nifty little latch door at the bottom that allows you to open it up and suck the ash right out of the pellet pipe at the very bottom, right where it all accumulates.  Very easy to clean out the pellet pipe that way.  Only problem is, both the Quadra Fire adapter and the Harman stove pipe are exactly 3" in diameter.  He's going to fabricate a heavy metal sleeve that will slide over each piece to join them together, and fabricate brackets to secure the adapter to the back of the stove.  Again, this guy is really interested in making his customers 100% happy.

So - no fix as of yet, but I'm very optomistic that we'll get it tracked down and solved - both the auger motor noise and the rumbling subwoofer noise.


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## lbcynya

bcb1 said:
			
		

> Update:  Harman dealer tech was here today and I really like him, he's a great guy.  He said the auger sounds pretty normal to him, but that he would call Harman and get it replaced under warranty.  I made him a deal:  he gets a new motor from Harman, I'm going to buy the Merkle Korff motor off the guy on ebay and I'll have it here for him when he comes back to install my new Harman motor.  If the new Harman motor makes the same amount of noise as the old motor, he'll swap in my other motor and we'll see if that one is any better.
> 
> He said changing out the auger motor is a breeze, it's only held in by one bolt so it only takes a couple minutes.  No need to move or disconnect stove.



VERY interested in how this turns out.  I almost did the same thing and might still do this if the 3rd gear motor doesn't solve the racket!  Please keep us posted as I know you will.  



			
				bcb1 said:
			
		

> As far as the rumbling "subwoofer" noise (a totally seperate issue), he said that Harman tech support usually sees that issue on insert stoves.  They say on some of them, the rumbling is loud and powerful enough to actually feel in the next room, literally like a train right outside the door.  Mine isn't that bad.  On inserts, they say it's caused by the cold air in the chimney versus the warm air in the pellet pipe, and the fix is to insulate the pellet pipe with high temperature insulation wrap.  Mine is a free standing Advance stove, but my pellet pipe does run through about 12" of unheated ceiling space before it exits the roof.  Not real easy to get to without totally disassembling the pipe, wrapping it, and putting it all back together.
> 
> First thing he's going to try is replacing the pellet pipe rain cap on the outside, he said mine is the wrong style and it's blocking too much airflow.  If that doesn't work, then he'll either insulate the pipe in the unheated chase, and/or replace the existing 3" pellet pipe with 4" pellet pipe.
> 
> I really like how he isn't just shrugging off the issue, he is genuinely interested in helping get it fixed.
> 
> Oh, and I have my old top vent adapter off my Quadra Fire stove that I wanted to put on my new Harman stove.  It has this nifty little latch door at the bottom that allows you to open it up and suck the ash right out of the pellet pipe at the very bottom, right where it all accumulates.  Very easy to clean out the pellet pipe that way.  Only problem is, both the Quadra Fire adapter and the Harman stove pipe are exactly 3" in diameter.  He's going to fabricate a heavy metal sleeve that will slide over each piece to join them together, and fabricate brackets to secure the adapter to the back of the stove.  Again, this guy is really interested in making his customers 100% happy.
> 
> So - no fix as of yet, but I'm very optomistic that we'll get it tracked down and solved - both the auger motor noise and the rumbling subwoofer noise.



Hmmm, this makes no sense to me. Does your flame "quake" when it makes with woofing sound?  If so, that would lead me to believe this is a stove pressure issue, not a chimney insulation issue.  I like his enthusiasm, and, maybe this does happen with inserts, but we're talking about something different, I believe.  

I have a simple up and out vent (Tee, 5' vertical, 90, 2' horizontal) and I've had 2 different brands of vent pipe (Duravent Pro and Selkirk DT -currently), both 4 inch.  The woofing between the 2 pipe types is identical.  

Sorry, but on a freestanding stove, with a 12" uninsulated section, their explanation sounds like a wild goose chase to me.  If his solution does fix your problem (and I hope it does), than there's more than 1 source for the woofing...


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## Matt715

I'm interested in finding out if the insulation does anything for you too. I have 4" Selkirk venting like what is advertised at the top of the page. It carries the intake air in a larger pipe that encases the exhaust. I just have mine directly vented out the side of the house with no rise. We tried a rise and restricting the exhaust but that didn't seem to help either.


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## bcb1

Darn it, I was thinking the same thing when he explained the woofing sound being caused by the pipe going through a cold air space.  Seemed like it just didnt make sense to me either, cause when I crack the door open or even the ash bin open just a little bit to relieve the pressure, the woofing goes away.  I've sort of resigned myself to living with it.  Luckily mine only does it when the stove is really clean and the flame is medium to large.  After building up ash it doesn't woof nearly as much.

Still, I'm hopeful about getting a quiet auger motor.  Looks like it will be 7-10 days so I'll post an update when it's done.


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## superchips

*Auger Motor Gear Noise:* The easy fix. Auger motor is removed by unpluging the stove. Removing the right hand bottom side plate by loosening the screws. Disconnect the two wires going to the motor. Using a 1/2" wrench or socket loosen the one bolt that connects the motor to the auger and slide it off. 
Install in reverse order.

Set the motor on a flat surface. Remove the 2 screws that hold the motor to the gear box.
Carefully pull the motor up away from the gear box.
Remove the 4 screws holding the lid on the gear case. Carefully remove the top cover. Using high temp grease (same stuff the auto parts store sells for wheel bearings) scoop a good portion using a piece of cardboard and smear it over the gears. Take care not to move the gears out of position.
Replace the cover and reinstall the motor to the gear box.
Re install the gear motor to the auger and reconnect the 2 leads. Re install rear cover and retest.

That should take care of the motor noise. Cost $4 - high temp grease 45 minutes

*Air noise and burn problems:* 1st install a proper OAK (outside air supply). That will cure 80% of no oak issues and save you a lot of $. Otherwise don't complain.


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## fmsm

Funny, I thought I might be going crazy! My new stove is making the same noise (like a train) every once in a while. It must be a stove issue as I had an Englander insert in there for 2 years that never made that noise. I kept the blockoff and the pipe the same, all the installer needed to do was drop in the new insert.


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## namz111

I have a 2003 advance that would rumble at random, heres what I found out so far, I have the stove set to room temp and feed rate at 3. I have a 4' straight run with a 45 deg end cap. I also have the wall thimble with the OAK built into it. I have have run about 8 diff brands of pellets so I can rule out its the type of pellet making that sound. I also thought it might be caused by the wind blowing over the top of the pipe but ruled that out when its happened and there was no wind blowing. I will say the rumble only seemed to happen after the stove was running at least 24hrs, here is what I did so far. I replaced the door gasket but I am not sure if it fixed it or not because the problem was always random. But I did notice that when ever I opened the feed hopper door to load more pellets I could almost duplicate that sound just not as loud. I replaced the hopper gasket and to date I have not heard the rumble, So at this stage I am thinking the hopper lid was never sealing 100%? If the stove does decide to rumble again I will replace the ash pan gasket next. Also when ever I do a stove cleaning I always use a nail to make sure each and every hole in the burn pot is free and clear of carbon, it might be worth a shot to make sure all the burn pot holes are opened fully. I have also made sure the ash pan gasket is always clean and not covered in ash. I hope this helps some one.


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## bcb1

Superchips:  thanks for the advice on greasing the gear motor.  I was considering doing that - but since my stove is only a couple weeks old I'm going to go with the dealer's offer to replace it for free.  If the new motor makes just as much noise I'll probably disassemble and grease it as you suggested.  Seems like an easy enough fix.

Regarding the OAK, I was thinking about trying it on a temporary basis as a test.  Get a piece of long flex pipe and running it outside - just leave the door propped open enough to get the pipe through it - and see if that helps the rumbling.  If it helps, then I'll pop a hole through the wall and do it proper.  

FMSM:  My old Quadra Fire Santa Fe never rumbled either.  Just my new Harman Advance that it replaced.  And just like your install, all my installer had to do is pull out my old stove and put the new one in it's place.  The only thing he had to change was a small section of pipe since the Harman's outlet is lower than the Quadra Fire's outlet.

NAMZ111:  Interesting that yours rumbled when you opened up the feed hopper door.  Mine does the opposite, it stops rumbling when I open up the hopper door.  It also stops when I crack open the front door or the ash bin door.  It's like there is so much vacuum in the stove, just relieving that pressure a little bit stops the rumble.  

After talking to the Harman tech yesterday, clearly the issue is well known by the folks at Harman, but maybe there is no definitive fix across the board on every stove.  My tech has been to the Harman training classes and he seems very well versed in the stove's technology.


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## Dougsey

bcb1-  Please keep us updated on how it goes.


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## bcb1

I definitely will update as soon as I get my new auger motor installed.  I'm going to try and convince him to leave the old motor so I'd have a backup - I'm not sure if he can do that or not.  I'd like to be able to have an extra motor that I could disassemble, add some grease inside the motor gears and then put it back in the stove and see if that quiets it down.

Also, I just ordered an OAK from ebay, $51 delivered.  The Harman tech said installing outside air might help with the woofing and definitely would not hurt.  The threads on this site mostly lean towards recommending OAK, in that it makes the stove run more efficiently and reduces or stops drafts inside the house.  So I figured for $50, it was worth trying.


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## superchips

bcb1 said:
			
		

> ...NAMZ111:  Interesting that yours rumbled when you opened up the feed hopper door.  Mine does the opposite, it stops rumbling when I open up the hopper door.  It also stops when I crack open the front door or the ash bin door.  It's like there is so much vacuum in the stove, just relieving that pressure a little bit stops the rumble.
> 
> After talking to the Harman tech yesterday, clearly the issue is well known by the folks at Harman, but maybe there is no definitive fix across the board on every stove.  My tech has been to the Harman training classes and he seems very well versed in the stove's technology.



Well sure looks like you need an oak.


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## Lineman30

Your chances it curing your woofing is probably slim. I've got an OAK on my Accentra and it still does it. But a OAK sure will help in the efficiency of your home.


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## mepellet

Lineman30 said:
			
		

> Your chances it curing your woofing is probably slim. I've got an OAK on my Accentra and it still does it. But a OAK sure will help in the efficiency of your home.


+1  My OAK is integral to my venting (Selkirk) and I get the woofing pretty frequently.  Mine however is not loud enough to hear in the next room.  Can barely sense it when sitting in the same room.  I find the visual "strobe" effect more annoying than the audible woofing sound.


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## bcb1

Yep, I'm pretty much at peace with the fact that the woofing might be a non-curable thing with the stove.  But installing an OAK for a minimal cost of $50 and having it operate more efficiently, using cold outside air rather than my nice warm inside air seems like a very good thing to me.


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## greg13

Newbe here. Our's rattled so bad the other night that it woke me up a few times. One thing I did find was the flame guide did not appear to be fully seated in the grooves. I wiggled it around and it did seem to help. 
Now I question the door gasket, I can slide a paper sheet easily between the door & stove body in places, not at all in others. like others, if it move the door handle slightly the noise stops. I have outside air and the temp. was down around 5* that night, so that may raise a temperature differential question. 
Wide open for ideas.

I just found part of the rattle - the metal strip between the glass panes is loose.


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## greg13

Replaced the glass gaskets & resealed the metal strips between the panes, BIG difference


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## bcb1

Ok, update as of today, Jan 12:

Harman tech was just at the house and brought a new auger with him.  Before he installed it I had him plug it into a test cord and plug it into the wall so we could hear it run.  It was silent!  He pulled out my auger motor, then we plugged it into the test leads and ran it.  It was much noisier, it made the rotisserie oven type sound.  So the new auger motor is now installed, it's silent (or nearly silent), and all is well with the universe again.  Happy customer!  

So for all you fellow Harman owners with loud augers - no, it's not your imagination.  Some auger motors are nearly silent, some are loud.  If yours is loud, then swapping it out will help.  But a word of advice - before you go to the trouble of pulling the old one and installing the new one, take a test lead and plug it into the wall and make sure your new motor is quiet.

As far as the train rumbling, subwoofer noise:  Not as much success.  He brought his magnahelic gauge, it was pegged when the stove first turns on, which is normal.  But even after it calmed down it was still far too much draft.  He turned down the draft adjustment setting, and for 5-10 minutes - until he left, it burned just fine.  No woofing at all.  I thought wow, problem fixed.  But a few minutes later, after I turned the stove off, guess what?  It started woofing again, just like before.

I can see how the woofing noise is a draft issue, and I guess turning down the draft adjustment screw helped in some regard, but still it's obvious that it's not totally resolved.  I'm not even sure if it's fixable, since so many other Harman owners experience the same thing.

So basically I'm batting .500.  Noisy auger totally fixed.  Woofing noise not totally fixed.

The noisy auger was by far my most annoying issue, so I'm still happy.


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## Dougsey

Glad to hear the auger issue is fixed!


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## Honda

Have the same whoofing issue on a 5 year old p61.  same as all the rest does it on low to med burn, worse right after cleaning. have OAK.  not sure of the brand but it is a double wall flue pipe, sucks the intake air through the space in the double wall.  7" outside, 3" inside. Going to do hopper lid gasket, it is the only suspect one, all the rest seem fine.  Also have a noisy auger motor, has been since stove was new, I always just assumed that was the way it was supposed to be. Great to read about other people discovering that there is a quieter solution. Just wondering if this is a warranty job or not.  I'm coming into my last year for warranty replacement, would like to get anything cleared up before it expires.


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## bcb1

Update after three days with new auger:  It's started to make that low-hum grinding noise again every time it feeds pellets, I'm beginning to think it's just a Harman trait of all their stoves, it's just that some of us notice it more than others.  The new motor is a little quieter than the old one - it doesn't make that annoying rotisserie oven sound nearly as much, but I still notice the low hum every time it feeeds pellets.

Yeah and as far as the woofing noise goes, that most definitely seems to be a trait of all the Harman models.  Since I've been searching these threads and google for the past couple weeks, I've run across people having that issue on their Accentra, Advance, P61, P63, and P43 stoves so it's definitely not model specific.  Probably just something we'll have to live with.


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## lbcynya

bcb1 said:
			
		

> Update after three days with new auger:  It's started to make that low-hum grinding noise again every time it feeds pellets, I'm beginning to think it's just a Harman trait of all their stoves, it's just that some of us notice it more than others.  The new motor is a little quieter than the old one - it doesn't make that annoying rotisserie oven sound nearly as much, but I still notice the low hum every time it feeeds pellets.
> 
> Yeah and as far as the woofing noise goes, that most definitely seems to be a trait of all the Harman models.  Since I've been searching these threads and google for the past couple weeks, I've run across people having that issue on their Accentra, Advance, P61, P63, and P43 stoves so it's definitely not model specific.  Probably just something we'll have to live with.



Yep.  As the grease goes out of the gears, the noise comes back.  I packed a "surplus" gear motor with wheel bearing grease and I'm waiting for the stove to cool down and do the exchange.  We'll see.  They run soo silent for the first few hours, I know it's possible to quiet these things down...

I think this is more a Gleason Avery gear motor issue vs. a "Harman" issue.  Yes, they choose to use GA, but these motors are crap, IMO.  Maybe they're reliable, but they aren't a good fit with Harman since the noise can be amplified through the auger.  If this doesn't work, I'm probably going to try a different MFG of gear motors.  

I'll report back in a week or so to see how my packed gearbox performs.


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## bcb1

Ibcynya, let me know about greasing the motor.  You're right, the new motor was dead silent for a few hours - probably about enough time for the grease to work its way through all the gears and get spread out.  Once it does that, I guess the noise comes back.  If packing it full of grease helps yours, I'm going to try it on mine too.

And I'm still thinking about ordering the Merkoff motor.  They make 4rpm counter-clockwise motors, but the thing is, my GA motor has the motor and the auger drive on the same side of the case.  The pictures I've seen of all the Merkoff motors have the motor on one side, and the auger drive pin on the other side.  They'd probably make me what I need though if I ordered it directly through their company...?


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## lbcynya

Just put the old gear motor with new grease in.  This one was removed for originally being too noisy.  Not silent like I hoped, but acceptable.  Pretty sure the gear box is 99.5 percent filled, so I can't believe there will be any deterioration in sound level, but my expectations are low.  Amp draw was the same as the old one, so no worries there.  Only possible issue is a small leak after everything heats back up.  We'll see.  

If this doesn't work, duct tape or chicken wire are the next options aside from trying another brand of gear motor.


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## bcb1

You know, I was just listening to my stove feed pellets a little while ago and now I'm trying to figure out if there is a way to isolate the noise.    

My initial thought was dynamat.  I cut out a piece and put it on the outside of the auger cover.  That might dampen it a bit?  Or how about a rubber or RTV silicone gasket where the auger bolts to the stove?  Somehow the noise of the auger seems to be amplified by the metal structure of the stove.  I've even thought about getting some foam/rubber isolation pads and sitting the stove on those.  You can get heavy duty ones that are used for HVAC equipment and could handle the weight.

I just can't believe that the big brains at Harman can't come up with a relatively simple, low-cost way to isolate the noises the stove makes.  Years ago when I had a problem with my Quadrafire stove I made some phone calls and eventually got through to factory tech support, and they helped me right away.  I wonder if could somehow get through to Harman tech support and get some advice from them?


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## fmsm

bcb1 said:
			
		

> You know, I was just listening to my stove feed pellets a little while ago and now I'm trying to figure out if there is a way to isolate the noise.
> 
> My initial thought was dynamat.  I cut out a piece and put it on the outside of the auger cover.  That might dampen it a bit?  Or how about a rubber or RTV silicone gasket where the auger bolts to the stove?  Somehow the noise of the auger seems to be amplified by the metal structure of the stove.  I've even thought about getting some foam/rubber isolation pads and sitting the stove on those.  You can get heavy duty ones that are used for HVAC equipment and could handle the weight.
> 
> I just can't believe that the big brains at Harman can't come up with a relatively simple, low-cost way to isolate the noises the stove makes.  Years ago when I had a problem with my Quadrafire stove I made some phone calls and eventually got through to factory tech support, and they helped me right away.  I wonder if could somehow get through to Harman tech support and get some advice from them?



You can reach a Harman tech, try 717-362-9080 or 717-896-8077.


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## bcb1

Hey, that's cool!  Thanks for the phone numbers, fmsm!  It's worth a shot giving them a call and seeing what they say.


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## lbcynya

bcb1 said:
			
		

> You know, I was just listening to my stove feed pellets a little while ago and now I'm trying to figure out if there is a way to isolate the noise.
> 
> My initial thought was dynamat.  I cut out a piece and put it on the outside of the auger cover.  That might dampen it a bit?  Or how about a rubber or RTV silicone gasket where the auger bolts to the stove?  Somehow the noise of the auger seems to be amplified by the metal structure of the stove.  I've even thought about getting some foam/rubber isolation pads and sitting the stove on those.  You can get heavy duty ones that are used for HVAC equipment and could handle the weight.
> 
> I just can't believe that the big brains at Harman can't come up with a relatively simple, low-cost way to isolate the noises the stove makes.  Years ago when I had a problem with my Quadrafire stove I made some phone calls and eventually got through to factory tech support, and they helped me right away.  I wonder if could somehow get through to Harman tech support and get some advice from them?




Hmmm, chain drive conversion to make it like the good old days. That would isolate the auger...........................grrr...


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## timjk69

I had bad auger noise and re-greased the box and replaced the front motor bearing. A lot better now. One thing I noticed is the motor is almost silent with the fan removed. Seems to act like a megaphone. Wondering how much difference in motor life with the fan removed?


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## bcb1

timjk69 said:
			
		

> I had bad auger noise and re-greased the box and replaced the front motor bearing. A lot better now. One thing I noticed is the motor is almost silent with the fan removed. Seems to act like a megaphone. Wondering how much difference in motor life with the fan removed?



You must have one of the older models?  Mine is a direct drive, auger motor directly to the auger.  My auger motor doesn't have a fan on it.  There is no question that my noise is coming from my auger motor though.


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## gfreek

> Wondering how much difference in motor life with the fan removed?



 The tech told me that the fans were causing the bearing to wear..


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## timjk69

Interesting. I could see how the fan could put load on the bearing. I'll go ahead and pull mine off.


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## jabo

Hello fellow pellet pirates.  I have been a lurker and a burner for 10 years.  I have gained a wealth of knowledge through everyones trial and errors.  Thank you.
Now to the point.  A friend has a  harman accentra manufactured 2003.  Auger motor failed.  Went to Grainger to get motor and gear box assy. The concern is that the old motor is 1.5 amps,120 volts and 1 3/16 thick.  New motor 1.19 amps, 115 volts and 1 3/4 thick. The fan is bigger,motor sticks out further but fits and has plenty of clearance.  Will difference in amps and volts affect circuitry short or long term?  Thanks in advance. 
                                                                                                                                                                         Jabo


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## SmokeyTheBear

jabo said:


> Hello fellow pellet pirates. I have been a lurker and a burner for 10 years. I have gained a wealth of knowledge through everyones trial and errors. Thank you.
> Now to the point. A friend has a harman accentra manufactured 2003. Auger motor failed. Went to Grainger to get motor and gear box assy. The concern is that the old motor is 1.5 amps,120 volts and 1 3/16 thick. New motor 1.19 amps, 115 volts and 1 3/4 thick. The fan is bigger,motor sticks out further but fits and has plenty of clearance. Will difference in amps and volts affect circuitry short or long term? Thanks in advance.
> Jabo


 
Nope, as long as the new motor doesn't pull any more amps than the OEM one, the rotation direction, and RPMS match you are all set to go.


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## jabo

Thanks for the quick response.  Will install and follow up with results and part # from Grainger if it works.


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## Lousyweather

SmokeyTheBear said:


> Nope, as long as the new motor doesn't pull any more amps than the OEM one, the rotation direction, and RPMS match you are all set to go.


 
Pay particular attention to the RPM's....probably the most important aspect after direction.......


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## Keneth Ryno

Jabo's friend here.  Jabo came up and we installed a Dayton Auger motor AC Gearmotor, Parallel Shaft, Voltage Rating 115, 1 Phase, 60/50 Hz, Nameplate RPM 4, Full Load Torque (In.-Lbs.) 175, Overhung Load (Lb.) 55, Input HP 1/60, Gear Ratio 796:1, Full Load Amps 1.2, Insulation Class B, Open Enclosure, Auto Thermal Protection, All Position Mounting, Motor Type Shaded Pole.  The only difference with this motor then the Avery Gleason that was in my Accentra wood pellet stove was the fact that the shaft was turning clockwise and we needed it to turn counter clockwise.  So after further review we reversed the winding of the motor so the power posts were towards the gear box and this made the shaft turn counter clockwise.  Brilliant right, so it is working fine and all is well in Pellet stove land again.  Once again the Motor is a Dayton 5CFL1 Shaded Pole Gearmotor and can be purchased at Grainger.  Thanks for all of your input and hope this little ditty might be of help to others when it comes to replacing the auger motor.


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## Burt

I've had my XXV about two years now, it's a beautiful stove, works well and is solid in construction. However, the auger noise is very annoying and the "woofer" issue pops up frequently. I'm with the rest of the members when I find it difficult to understand why Harmon's engineers are not able address these issues.

At my own expense, I've ordered a new auger motor (my dealer is virtually worthless) and hoping for some relief. As per a members suggestion, I'll try the high temp grease on the old motor and see what happens...I like the idea of isolating this thing but haven't figured out an elegant way to accomplish it...yet.

I guess there's comfort in knowing I'm not the only one with these issues. One would think Harmon could (or would) correct their shortcomings and make the perfect stove...and happy customers!

Oh well...


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## mepellet

Burt said:


> One would think Harmon could (or would) correct their shortcomings and make the perfect stove...and happy customers!


 
After all, their slogan is "Built to a standard. Not a Price."


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## Burt

While your at it Harman (as if your listening) why not add a center detent to the on/off potentiometer. A bit of tactile feedback would be VERY helpful when trying to negotiate the "off" (or on) sweet spot. It's almost like Harmon people never use their own product...


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