# Old pre EPA chainsaws



## woodhog73 (Feb 6, 2016)

I was reminded today how much I still like old saws and how well they run.

So I don't hardly ever pinch a bar these days , it's rare as I think I'm skilled enough to avoid it. And usually I do but I was bucking some red oak today on a downed tree in the woods and I had it happen. So I went to grab my smaller modern saw to cut out my big saw.

Instead I figured what the hey I'll give the old Stihl 031 some exercise. It hasn't been run in over a year. Fired up right away. Smokes more than a room full of guys smoking cigars until it's warm.

Although we are talking about a 50cc saw these things have massive torque. The saw refuses to bog down even though it's lucky if it's pulling 9500 rpm ( didn't put a tack on it) these saws were not screamers. It was made in the late 1970s . It's pulling an 18 inch bar with 3/8 full chisel on it. It's sloooow cutting but man it just does not bog. Great rescue saw. I don't use it often there is no chain brake. It gives the impression as though while it's slow, it's also not working very hard and could go on for hours like that.

Everytime I think I should sell this old thing, days like today remind me why I like it so much. And not because it's a Stihl cause I almost exclusively purchase Husky /Jonsered saws.

Anyone else have an old saw that refuses to give out ?  I may start running this thing more often.


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## Giles (Feb 6, 2016)

woodhog73 said:


> I was reminded today how much I still like old saws and how well they run.
> 
> So I don't hardly ever pinch a bar these days , it's rare as I think I'm skilled enough to avoid it. And usually I do but I was bucking some red oak today on a downed tree in the woods and I had it happen. So I went to grab my smaller modern saw to cut out my big saw.
> 
> ...


I have worked on chainsaws for over 50 years and buy repair and sell. I will buy older Craftsman, Homelite, Polen but not newer models. With modern saws it has to be Makita/Dolmar, Echo, Husqvarna and Stihl--in that order.
I have several older saws but the one I bought new in 1980 is a Craftsman (Roper) 3.7 and it has more torque then saws bigger then it is. With a chainsaw, torque is your friend--not high RPM, and I have to agree with whar you suggest, that older saws have more torque-for their size-- then modern saws.
Lots of people will argue but, in most cases, they have not run an older saw in years--if ever!
What I don't like is their weight and the lack of chain brake on some and difficulty of working on some.
When I cut big wood, I grab the Craftsman or a Makita although I have other modern saws.


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## Jon1270 (Feb 6, 2016)

I haven't put in much time with the older saws, but I have a few that I picked up just because they were too cheap to pass by.  When I got a Homelite Super E-Z Automatic going the first time, I was amazed at the punch of such a small package.  I wasn't used to seeing full-size 3/8" chain on a 41cc saw, but it can pull it.

I also have a huge 1050 automatic.   The one and only thing I've done with it is to mill a 7' by 26" honeylocust trunk.  It's very loud and so heavy that I wouldn't want to carry it around as a bucking saw or (egads!) actually fell trees with it but, hung from a Granberg contraption it proved to be both mild-mannered and relentless.


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## woodhog73 (Feb 6, 2016)

I don't know what a 1050 automatic is but if it's milling wood it must be big 

The 031 I have came with a hard nose 16 inch bar in 3/8. I put a sprocket nose 18 inch bar on it. What I should have done was put a .325 on it. Still it reminds me of a diesel vs gas engine in the sense it has very little top end but nothing slows it down. I can have the 18 inch bar buried in oak and nothing bogs the saw down. Nothing it just stays steady at the low rpm as if to say it will get there when it gets there.

It's a cool saw. Ok I'm probably wrong but I think I could put a 24 inch bar on it and it would still be slow and steady it's really so different than my modern saws.


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## DickRussell (Feb 6, 2016)

I have to wonder if torque at lower rpms is related to engine displacement. I couldn't help but think of the first new boat I bought back in 1976, with an Evinrude 75HP outboard engine. That engine was a three-cylinder, 50 cu.inch block that started its life cycle some years before as a 50HP engine. With carburetion, they found a way to stuff more gas into it at higher rpms to get the extra HP out of it at top rpms. That was fine for top boat speed at WOT and light load, but lousy at low rpms, where you need pulling power to haul a water skier up out of the water. Two years later I upgraded to a 100HP four-cylinder Evinrude, with fully double the displacement. That block was the same for the 85, 100, 115, and 140 HP models, with just a difference in carburetion. What a difference that doubling of displacement made in low end torque and pulling power! Is the OP's comment about the old chainsaw engines basically the same thing?


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## heavy hammer (Feb 6, 2016)

I have ran an stihl 090g the thing is a monster.  Pure torque never bogs down.  My friend who has many gear driven saws, was cutting a large diameter oak when he realized he wasn't making anymore progress he stopped and saw the teeth on the chain were all gone.  A steel bar in the tree tore all them off, the saw never bogged down.  Older saws were built to last and to run I just don't like the no chain brake.  The manual oiler you get used to, and even the weight.


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## 2broke2ride (Feb 6, 2016)

Jonsereds 70e, 70cc, 20" bar 3/8" full chisel chain. No chain brake


McCulloch 10-10 auto, 52cc, 16" bar 3/8" full chisel chain, no chain brake, no trigger safety, straight stack muffler, by far my favorite saw and a Husqvarna 266xp, 66cc, 18" bar 3/8" full chisel chain. This one actually has a chain brake lol circa 1987.
All my saws are old lol, but they cut like a mother.


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## Giles (Feb 6, 2016)

Jon1270 said:


> I haven't put in much time with the older saws, but I have a few that I picked up just because they were too cheap to pass by.  When I got a Homelite Super E-Z Automatic going the first time, I was amazed at the punch of such a small package.  I wasn't used to seeing full-size 3/8" chain on a 41cc saw, but it can pull it.
> 
> I also have a huge 1050 automatic.   The one and only thing I've done with it is to mill a 7' by 26" honeylocust trunk.  It's very loud and so heavy that I wouldn't want to carry it around as a bucking saw or (egads!) actually fell trees with it but, hung from a Granberg contraption it proved to be both mild-mannered and relentless.



I just finished


Jon1270 said:


> I haven't put in much time with the older saws, but I have a few that I picked up just because they were too cheap to pass by.  When I got a Homelite Super E-Z Automatic going the first time, I was amazed at the punch of such a small package.  I wasn't used to seeing full-size 3/8" chain on a 41cc saw, but it can pull it.
> 
> I also have a huge 1050 automatic.   The one and only thing I've done with it is to mill a 7' by 26" honeylocust trunk.  It's very loud and so heavy that I wouldn't want to carry it around as a bucking saw or (egads!) actually fell trees with it but, hung from a Granberg contraption it proved to be both mild-mannered and relentless.



I just finished a  Homelite Super E-Z Automatic that a friend found in an old tool shed. Saw appeared to have been in storage for, who knows how many years. Since I knew the quality of Homelite, back in the day, I agreed to check out. The fuel tank was unbelievable at how it was corroded with stale gas. The saw had decent compression but was tight turning. It had electronic ignition and fire was good. I tore the engine down and could not find piston rings. I found a used cylinder because, although the cylinder was not galled and the piston cleaned up without issue. I had to modified a set of Dolmar 100 rings because Homelite had square ends that butted against the piston ring pins. A slow and tedious procedure that I don't want to do again! I had to rebuild the carb and I started  it yesterday and it ran flawless.
Easy to see why these were one of the most popular homelite saws years ago.
My friend was very happy to add it to his collection.


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## duramaxman05 (Feb 6, 2016)

We have an old 041av that has cut tons of wood and we still use. I have a 031av and while old saws, they refuse to give up.


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## Jon1270 (Feb 6, 2016)

woodhog73 said:


> I don't know what a 1050 automatic is but if it's milling wood it must be big



Yep, 100 CCs.  My saw, but not my workbench:


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## dougand3 (Feb 6, 2016)

Stihl 011AVT - Got as a nonrunner and fixed carb/fuel lines. It was missing kill switch but wires and computer PS switch work fine. Good little saw. I tend to grab it first for small jobs. Circa 1980.


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## Giles (Feb 6, 2016)

dougand3 said:


> Stihl 011AVT - Got as a nonrunner and fixed carb/fuel lines. It was missing kill switch but wires and computer PS switch work fine. Good little saw. I tend to grab it first for small jobs. Circa 1980.
> 
> View attachment 174177


Back when I was about 13 years old---70 now---, I would go to junk yards and buy old chainsaws, lawnmowers or what ever they had and work on for resale. Made a lot of spending money back then.
I remember buying several 2 stroke lawnmowers, even a gasoline washing machine with foot start, and remember buying and old chainsaw that weighed about 30 pounds that had a wrap up pull cord with a float type carb. It had a rotating bar because saw had to be held somewhat level when felling and cutting up. I think it was a McCulloch but might have been a Sears.
Built a go-cart with two McCulloch MC10 chainsaw engines. That thing would FLY--wonder I hadn't been killed!
Like a lot of things--wish I still had them.


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## three feathers (Feb 8, 2016)

I have an old Remington PL4 that I have owned for a lot of years. I don't know what cc it is but I ran a 16" bar and I cut very well, if you could stand the noise.


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## baseroom (Feb 8, 2016)

Ok I still use my Dads Stihl 020.  I have a 16 " bar on it......I can't kill it.  I don't get into much big stuff here.  Usually up to 18" max. I use it for 80% of my work. I also have an 015 that still winds out.  I think the adage " don't make them like they used to" applies.


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## firestorm (Feb 9, 2016)

Have been burning wood since around 1980 when I bought my 031 with a 20 inch bar. It has cut between 5 and 6 cords of wood every year since. Changed it to electronic ignition from points a couple of years ago and put a rebuild kit in the carburetor. Besides one bar, chains, and odds and ends, it has been a workhorse. Used it yesterday to work up a dead cherry that was 24 inches at the base. Does seem to be getting heavier though, added a top handle saw recently to help with the small stuff.


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## woodhog73 (Feb 9, 2016)

firestorm said:


> Have been burning wood since around 1980 when I bought my 031 with a 20 inch bar. It has cut between 5 and 6 cords of wood every year since. Changed it to electronic ignition from points a couple of years ago and put a rebuild kit in the carburetor. Besides one bar, chains, and odds and ends, it has been a workhorse. Used it yesterday to work up a dead cherry that was 24 inches at the base. Does seem to be getting heavier though, added a top handle saw recently to help with the small stuff.



Those 031 were a great saw. They made them I think starting in 1971 and ended in perhaps 1979 or 1980 but new old stock was probably around until the early 1980s. Then the 032 replaced it but it seemed to be the same saw. I think the 028 then replaced both the 031 and  032 and was built on a more modern lightweight design.


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## CountryBoy19 (Feb 13, 2016)

DickRussell said:


> I have to wonder if torque at lower rpms is related to engine displacement. I couldn't help but think of the first new boat I bought back in 1976, with an Evinrude 75HP outboard engine. That engine was a three-cylinder, 50 cu.inch block that started its life cycle some years before as a 50HP engine. With carburetion, they found a way to stuff more gas into it at higher rpms to get the extra HP out of it at top rpms. That was fine for top boat speed at WOT and light load, but lousy at low rpms, where you need pulling power to haul a water skier up out of the water. Two years later I upgraded to a 100HP four-cylinder Evinrude, with fully double the displacement. That block was the same for the 85, 100, 115, and 140 HP models, with just a difference in carburetion. What a difference that doubling of displacement made in low end torque and pulling power! Is the OP's comment about the old chainsaw engines basically the same thing?



There are primarily 2 things at work. Low-end torque vs high-end HP is largely a part of cylinder and port dimensions/design/timing/etc. The largest factor is the balance between bore size & stroke. Shorter stroke can give a higher max HP but less torque on the bottom end; longer stroke will give more torque.

The other thing at work is the "emissions" of the saw. Make no mistake, the most torque/HP come when the saw is running just a tad bit rich. More recent emissions regs say that can't happen and that the saw must be closer to stoichiometric (perfect mix of air & fuel). So a newer saw is hampered by the air-to-fuel ratio (AFR) which is either fixed or has a limited adjustment carb and then they throw a catalytic muffler on that restricts exhaust flow further hampering the engine's ability to produce torque and properly scavenge (technical term regarding engines) during operation.

ETA, All my saws are non-catalytic. My MS170 was not fully adjustable before swapping the carb. My 034 (recently given to me by my father) is the oldest saw I have. I don't know for sure how old it is but it had to have been made shortly after they started putting brakes on them. It has a brake but dad has had it ever since I was a child (I don't remember a time that dad didn't have it). Of all of them I think the 034 is my favorite because it has sentimental value. I didn't really need another saw but it really means something to have that one in my hands running (or sitting on the shelf).


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## Jon1270 (Feb 13, 2016)

CountryBoy19 said:


> The largest factor is the balance between bore size & stroke. Shorter stroke can give a higher max HP but less torque on the bottom end; longer stroke will give more torque.



I can't claim any expertise in the fine points of engine design, but I've read things to this effect before, and so was surprised to find that the bore and stroke numbers for the 031 and 026 are identical.


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## woodhog73 (Feb 13, 2016)

Jon1270 said:


> I can't claim any expertise in the fine points of engine design, but I've read things to this effect before, and so was surprised to find that the bore and stroke numbers for the 031 and 026 are identical.



They may be identical bore and stroke however the 2 saws produce power very differently.

Much like country boy said, if you took the 2 saws apart, you would see differences in cylinder head design, and intake and exhaust port efficiency and timing which will be determined by the design of the ports in the cylinder and the skirts on the piston, etc,  

Also I'd imagine the carburetor on the 026 is better.

None of my saws have catalytic converter mufflers either and didn't come with them, and both are newer saws.  My jonsered 2252 is an auto tune saw. It probably has numbers similar to the 031. However it's night and day different and would out cut my 031 by a very large margin.


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## Jon1270 (Feb 13, 2016)

Oh, I know there are big differences.  I haven't puttered with an 031, but I have disassembled an 041 and it's very different from the more modern saws I'm accustomed to.


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## woodhog73 (Feb 13, 2016)

I think the 031 might have been like the 290 farm boss is today ? Sort of the saw most dealers recommended in the 70s if you said you needed a firewood saw and something for storm clean up and taking down medium or medium large trees on occasion. Just a good workhorse of a saw. 

Back then I really don't think there were homeowner , farm , and pro type builds. Sure the 031 was sold mostly to homeowners and farm users, but all of the saws were constructed with metal cases, and infact much more metal everywhere than today's saws.


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## heavy hammer (Feb 13, 2016)

My father still runs his 039 not sure on the year I know it was purchased brand new for him and I was just a kid.  Still runs amazing to this day it cuts about three to five cords a year since bought.  Saw won't die, he has a newer 361 bought for him new but he always goes back to the 039.  I agree with earlier statement they were built to last.


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## CTYank (Feb 22, 2016)

Some months back I was handed a ball of oily sawdust wrapped around a Homelite 150. After scraping off many cubic inches of that oily crud (made good fire-starters), cleaning out the tank and making some basic repairs and upgrades (spark-arrester & bucking spikes), it runs like new. The chain was fiended, but rather than toss it I gave it a few filing sessions, and now it's properly dangerous. 

A homie 150 with 16" bar is super-light, great for hiking deep into the woods. Serious power for 43cc- makes a stihl 250 look anemic. I just got a replacement 3-shoe clutch to replace the fragile 2-shoe. This saw was made between '71-73 and I'm betting it'll survive me. Noisy little beast though.

I freshened up a well-used one for a bud a few years back. Still runs great. He likes it. Some sneer at 150s- ignorance or jealousy. Not me.


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## Fishnuts2 (Apr 8, 2016)

My 1969 Mac 1-10. Dad bought it new and I've had it since 1974. Ran it a little bit tonight and man is it loud!  Cuts real good yet. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## three feathers (Apr 9, 2016)

I bought a 20" bar and chain for my old Remington PL4 that I posted above. It cost more than the saw is worth, but what the hay. It only turns 9500rpm's but man it has the torque. Have to really try to bog it down.


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## Jon1270 (Apr 10, 2016)

woodhog73 said:


> Back then I really don't think there were homeowner , farm , and pro type builds.



My dad's 1970's homeowner saw looked like this:


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## Hasufel (Apr 10, 2016)

Jon1270 said:


> My dad's 1970's homeowner saw looked like this:
> 
> View attachment 177865


I still have one of those (maybe even that exact model), and it still works quite well. Great for jobs that are too small to make it worth firing up the chainsaw, or for those early morning cuts when you don't want to disturb anyone.


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## Jazzberry (Apr 15, 2016)

Just picked up a nice oldie. Homelite Super E-Z. Before plastic made in America even. Little thing runs like a ***** ape. Impressive little saw. Almost want to keep it.


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## woodhog73 (Apr 15, 2016)

Wow sweet old saw man it looks like new old stock !  Just keep it she is a garage queen no doubt


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## Jazzberry (Apr 15, 2016)

It was one of the local fire depts rescue saws. Nothing but the best for maintenance. I have too many saws now but I really do wish I could keep this one. It really rips. Looking at my censored post above it appears r--e  ap is a bad word?


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## Wildo (Apr 15, 2016)

Huh, I thought running like a r8ped ape was a good thing...


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## woodhog73 (Apr 16, 2016)

Jazzberry said:


> It was one of the local fire depts rescue saws.



Two thoughts. First I'm glad the fire department upgraded their rescue saw hopefully to something more modern   considering it is used in emergency situations !

Second that explains the condition. It's probably been used very little mostly in practice situations. It certainly was not a firewood or loggers work saw. But that's fine nice old saw for you to collect !


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## Jon1270 (Apr 16, 2016)

Jazzberry said:


> View attachment 178012
> View attachment 178013
> 
> 
> ...



I've got two of those in the garage waiting for me to get around to figuring them out. They seem like elegantly engineered little machines, even if the ergonomics leave something to be desired -- I keep skinning my knuckles on the air filter cover when I pull the rope. One runs as it is, but something's wrong with the clutch and I haven't dug into it.  

I've fallen into the trap of collecting too many project saws.  I recently turned off my eBay bargain saw alert, and have averted my eyes from some good deals, in hopes of digging myself out of the hole.

Here's a couple of recent acquisitions that barely qualify as projects because, as far as I can tell, they need almost nothing: an old Echo 440-EVL and the oddball two-cylinder CST-610-EVL.  They were stowed in a middle-aged arborist's shed with gas in the tanks for years, and he advertised them as 'parts saws' for next to nothing, because he wanted the shelf space back.  I brought them home, emptied the tanks, fueled them up with fresh stuff, and they both roared to life.




Practically speaking there's no contest between these and the newer European saws for doing serious work, but I'm starting to wonder why I should care.  I have access to cheap natural gas, and only heat with wood because it's fun.  These quirky old saws are also fun. If they cut slower, so what?


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## Jazzberry (Apr 17, 2016)

I heard about a couple 2 cylinder saws but never seen one. I would like to hear what a 2 cylinder sounds like. 2 cylinders sounds like it would be very cool but if it was I guess it would be common practice now. Pics of it don't look that much bigger than a single.


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## Jon1270 (Apr 17, 2016)

Jazzberry said:


> I heard about a couple 2 cylinder saws but never seen one. I would like to hear what a 2 cylinder sounds like. 2 cylinders sounds like it would be very cool but if it was I guess it would be common practice now. Pics of it don't look that much bigger than a single.



The main advantage seems to be how smoothly it runs, which is kind of neat but not a great practical advantage.  I've read that as a sales trick, dealers would balance a half-full cup of coffee on one of these saws while idling, and it would take a long time to fall off.  Having putzed around with one, I can easily believe that.  But, the tradeoff is that it's substantially heavier and probably less reliable and more expensive to repair, which is not a good set of trades when spring antivibe on single-cylinder machines is almost as good.  So, to me at least, it's a novelty.  From what I can tell these saws are valuable at least in part because the motors are useful in large model airplanes.


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## D8Chumley (May 7, 2016)

My dads girlfriend has one of those 610 EVL saws. I saw it when I was at his new house, it was her late husbands. Pretty neat, didn't get to run it but I told her if she ever wanted to part with it please let me know


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## Ashful (May 7, 2016)

Jazzberry said:


> View attachment 178012
> View attachment 178013
> 
> 
> ...


Had one identical to that.  Impressive torque for a little 40cc saw.  Again... for a little 40cc saw.  Weighed as much as my Stihl 036 Pro, tho.


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## Jazzberry (May 7, 2016)

I have a 360 pro and it sure seemed much lighter to me. Didn't do a side by side though. I would do it now but its moved on to a new happy owner.


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## Jon1270 (May 7, 2016)

Jazzberry said:


> I have a 360 pro and it sure seemed much lighter to me. Didn't do a side by side though. I would do it now but its moved on to a new happy owner.



I just grabbed one of mine and checked.  Not counting bar and chain, the SEZ is right at 10 pounds with a bit of fuel and oil in the tanks.  An 036 is a little over 12.5#.


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## Vikestand (May 17, 2016)

It's going to be hard to convince me my Mac won't run forever. I remember dad using it when I was a kid(30). It's just fires right up every year.


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## Ashful (May 17, 2016)

True, old saws can run forever.  But the day you switch from an old Mac to a modern saw, you'll hate yourself for having waited so long.  The old Macs, Homelites, and Echo EVL's had gobs of torque, but pathetically low chain speeds, compared to modern saws.  They'll cut forever... very slowly.


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## Jazzberry (May 17, 2016)

I agree with you sorta. My favorite saws are all at least 20 now and they are runners for sure. I buy and sell butI don't collect, mine are strictly users. If they don't seriously seduce me they get sold. My 064 is around 35 and money aside I don't think I would trade it.


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## woodhog73 (May 17, 2016)

Well there's a difference between antique, real old, and just old in my opinion.

The old Macs and Homelights your talking about are to me antiques. Garage queens if you collect them. Then there is real old . Like my 031 which I think was around mid 1970s. Can be used to cut with but they are slow. Low RPM and low chain speed. Even my old 056 from what I remember will not keep up with my modern 70cc saw.

But then there is old . I here lots about the 064 and to me it's old but modern. I remember my dad bought one brand new In 1985 the year they came out. Awesome power to weight ratio. But fairly modern design and still very usable if in good condition. saw is long gone . Was around for about 5 years until it got crunched by a work truck.


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## 2broke2ride (May 17, 2016)

I personally feel that anything from the early 70s on up can hang just fine. I would put my 1971 Mac 10-10 against any modern 50cc class saw any day. (And I'm pulling full size 3/8" full chisel, not that girly .325 stuff all the new 50cc saws run lol)


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## Jazzberry (May 17, 2016)

That thing is sweet! Looks like it will hang with anything.


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## woodhog73 (May 17, 2016)

You had me until the girly comment no just kidding nice old saw. Sounds like it runs well and also well cared for

Not sure id bet money or saws on a race with a modern 50cc saw though  that's some soft wood your cutting 

Just busting man thanks for posting cool vid


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## 2broke2ride (May 17, 2016)

Never had so much as a carb kit, dad bought it brand new in 71, the year after he got out of high school. He cut 20+ cords of firewood a year with it plus him and gramp cut saw logs to pay the taxes. Then it sat unused for almost 20 years till I dragged it and his Jonsereds out, fueled them up and off we went.


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## 2broke2ride (May 17, 2016)

woodhog73 said:


> You had me until the girly comment no just kidding nice old saw. Sounds like it runs well and also well cared for
> 
> Not sure id bet money or saws on a race with a modern 50cc saw though  that's some soft wood your cutting
> 
> Just busting man thanks for posting cool vid


That first cut was red oak lol [emoji12][emoji106]


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## Jazzberry (May 17, 2016)

woodhog73 said:


> Well there's a difference between antique, real old, and just old in my opinion.
> 
> The old Macs and Homelights your talking about are to me antiques. Garage queens if you collect them. Then there is real old . Like my 031 which I think was around mid 1970s. Can be used to cut with but they are slow. Low RPM and low chain speed. Even my old 056 from what I remember will not keep up with my modern 70cc saw.
> 
> But then there is old . I here lots about the 064 and to me it's old but modern. I remember my dad bought one brand new In 1985 the year they came out. Awesome power to weight ratio. But fairly modern design and still very usable if in good condition. saw is long gone . Was around for about 5 years until it got crunched by a work truck.





I have never researched the age of mine. I was told they came out in 1982 and for the first two years they had metal badges on the side cover. These first 2 years were built on a lighter chassis than the later version which was shared with the 660. I haven't been around a 660 recently to compare the weight so just going by what others have said.


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## 2broke2ride (May 17, 2016)

Another old Mac, still in the tuning stages[emoji106]
This saw is more of a slow but steady wins the race type of saw. It's a Mac 380 circa 1963-64, 87cc, weighs 18 lbs


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## woodhog73 (May 18, 2016)

2broke2ride said:


> That first cut was red oak lol [emoji12][emoji106]



You got me there your right I just saw the other logs first and was thinking it was soft..... ya that saw does pretty good no doubt it will cut with a modern saw. 

And it's old ! Did you say 1971 ? That's getting up there in age. Obviously those saws were well built. My stihl 031 is I think a 1976 something like that it's dead on reliable. Slow and steady. It never bogs down but the rpm and chain speed are so slow it cuts slower than what I'm used too.


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## woodhog73 (May 18, 2016)

Jazzberry said:


> I have never researched the age of mine. I was told they came out in 1982 and for the first two years they had metal badges on the side cover. These first 2 years were built on a lighter chassis than the later version which was shared with the 660. I haven't been around a 660 recently to compare the weight so just going by what others have said.



I'm not completely sure on the age. I know my dad bought his in 1985 and I always went with him to the dealer ( they sold motorcycles too so I would go to look at the dirt bikes ) anyways I  remember the dealer talking about how the saw just came out. 

So I just assumed it was 85. Could have heard wrong it was so many years ago. For sure it's in the early 80s though.

I'm the opposite. I haven't been around an 064 in probably 20 years. I do however run a 660 from time to time. And it's heavy. I'm a big guy I can handle it but when I put it down and grab my 70cc I immediately feel the difference. 

The 064 I think is lighter than a 660. That's what I think makes that saw desirable it produces power close to or same as a 660 but the weight is in line with a 70cc. I read that somewhere not from experience just something I remember reading.

064 is desirable but around here you never see any for sale. They are older saws and either people locally in my area don't sell them or they are all beat to crap. Not sure I just never see them.


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## Jon1270 (May 18, 2016)

It depends what you're cutting, too.  RPM's are only a bottleneck in small wood that doesn't tax the saw at all.  When the wood gets big enough that the saw has to actually work for a living, it's all about horsepower.


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