# Banning incandescent bulbs canada



## Swedishchef (Jan 3, 2014)

I knew this was coming so I stocked up on incandescent bulbs.

I just don't get it. With my $0.06/KWh electricity rate, I love incadescent bulbs. Making fluorescent bulbs uses lots of electricity, produces tons of greenhouse gases and let's not mention all the mercury years from now that is found in the bulbs (fluorescent bulbs are lit when current passes through mercury gas in the bulb)? I have a degree in Chemistry and let's just say picking up mercury in it's pure form is like picking up jello with oven mitts. It's a liquid metal. There are products that help the cleanup but you can't just sweep it up. And considering it accumulates on the brain stem, my brain needs no more help in self destruction. It does enough of that on it's own.

LED bulbs are great. But paying $30 each for an equivalent 50W recessed light gets expensive when you have 18 recessed lights in your basement.

My 2 cents.

Andrew

PS, I bought enough incandescent bulbs to last me 2-3 years


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## Frozen Canuck (Jan 3, 2014)

Interesting, wonder if this will include the "rough service" bulbs we use on site. House is about halfway converted to LED from CFL now so I assume I can just keep on with that replacement as needed. We needed the LED for all the dimming lights so that was the reason for that switch. 

Ah yes Mercury…played with that stuff as a kid I expect many of my generation did. Correlation between that & the spike in Alzheimer's….I wonder now. Or could be that we are living longer….perhaps past our best before dates. 

Have a good one Andrew & if you have some spare time on your hands slide some of that -51 down to visit our friends in the south….no reason we should have all the fun. 

Well at least until mid Feb….crew is going to Orlando then so 40 days of normal winter for our friends. Then they can have their spring like winter back.


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## semipro (Jan 3, 2014)

Frozen Canuck said:


> wonder if this will include the "rough service" bulbs we use on site.


These are exempted along with many other types of bulbs.

Good reference on the American legislation: http://www.gelighting.com/LightingWeb/na/consumer/inspire-and-learn/lighting-legislation/


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## windchaser (Jan 3, 2014)

As far as I know right now only 100W incandescent light bulbs are banned...with 40W & 60W bulbs being added to the ban list  in the future.  Service and specialty bulbs I believe will remain exempt.


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## semipro (Jan 3, 2014)

Andrew, 
You may have missed this recent thread.  You'd probably find it interesting. 
https://www.hearth.com/talk/threads/incandescent-outlaw.120878/


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## eclecticcottage (Jan 4, 2014)

Dang...I was hoping to bootleg in some when we needed them, lol.  CFLS are pure evil to migraine sufferers like myself, and my only experiance with LEDs was christmas lights that I had to return because of the flicker that would have surely given me a migraine....The funny thing is DH gets them (migraines) too and couldn't see the flicker. I hear people all the time claiming florecents, etc don't flicker, the thing is they just aren't sensitive enough to it to know.  I guess I need to see if I can find a few boxes now....we use less electric than most people so anyone that thinks I should suffer to use a little less electric...well...I won't go there.  People should try unplugging the microwave and shutting off their cable box when not in use instead of telling me their greener because of a few lightbulbs.


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## Swedishchef (Jan 4, 2014)

Frozen Canuck said:


> Interesting, wonder if this will include the "rough service" bulbs we use on site. House is about halfway converted to LED from CFL now so I assume I can just keep on with that replacement as needed. We needed the LED for all the dimming lights so that was the reason for that switch.
> 
> Ah yes Mercury…played with that stuff as a kid I expect many of my generation did. Correlation between that & the spike in Alzheimer's….I wonder now. Or could be that we are living longer….perhaps past our best before dates.
> 
> ...


 
I couldn't afford $400 worth of bulbs for my recessed lights. And the day I pay $30 for A SINGLE BULB is the day U build my dreamhome for retirement. Otherwise someone else gets to enjoy my sexy lights!

yes, I would LOVE to pass along the cold.

A


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## Swedishchef (Jan 4, 2014)

windchaser said:


> As far as I know right now only 100W incandescent light bulbs are banned...with 40W & 60W bulbs being added to the ban list  in the future.  Service and specialty bulbs I believe will remain exempt.


 
Agreed. But when you want to see something, ya need 100W. Outside, bathroom vanity etc etc. I use smaller wattage light if the recepticle requires it (lamps, etc) That's about it....What about you?


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## Swedishchef (Jan 4, 2014)

semipro said:


> Andrew,
> You may have missed this recent thread.  You'd probably find it interesting.
> https://www.hearth.com/talk/threads/incandescent-outlaw.120878/


 
Yes I did miss it..and now it's in the can.  Canada is a little behind the US on this ban. We just banned 100 watt bulbs.

While I understand the reasoning of banning the bulbs, what about the cost it takes to make an LED of CFL bulb? The greenhouse gases during manufacturing? We always say "100 watts could be replaced by 20 watts of LED" but perhaps we need to look at the bigger picture....maybe not.

A


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## billb3 (Jan 4, 2014)

Swedishchef said:


> Agreed. But when you want to see something, ya need 100W.


Or more.
Our kitchen light used 5 40watt bulbs and would be on 16 hours a day.
5x40=200 watts
Right over the kitchen table. Fantastic light for projects, reading the paper, surfing with the ipad .....
200x16=3200watts per day
3200/1000=3.2kwh/day
electric is 21¢ per kwh here, so cost $0.672 per day to use
for which the power company sent me a bill every month for $20.16 , just for the light over the table.

I replaced all  5 with Sylvania LED A19 bulbs that cost $15.00 each.
which use 7 watts each
and the light output is even better than the incandescents

5x7=35
35x16= 560/day
560/1000= 0.56 kwh/day
0.56 x 21¢ =11.7¢ per day
for which Nstar sends an electric  bill every month for $3.52

$20.16 -$3.528= $16.63
That $16.63 savings paid for the 5 bulbs with change leftover, in 5 months.
I now have almost 17 bucks extra a month for other things. plus I'm not screwing in a burnt out $1.00 each  incandescant bulb once a month

15x5=75
A 75 dollar investment is putting $200 in my pocket every year.


Those LED bulbs are now 3 years old and still glowing
They are now $7 each with a electric company instant rebate  incentive to buy  and use _ green _ power.


After 3  years, I now have not given away $525 to Nstar.
That's also $525.00 I didn't spend to pollute the air that you breathe, as 99.9% of the power generated for me is with non-renewable fossil fuels.


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## jharkin (Jan 4, 2014)

This same discussion has come up many times over the years here. Its NOT a ban, just a higher efficiency standard. If you don't like led/cfl then buy halogen.

Do you oppose CAFE standards also? And energy star?

Btw I can find LEDs under $10, don't know where you shop......


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## eclecticcottage (Jan 4, 2014)

jharkin said:


> Btw I can find LEDs under $10, don't know where you shop......



In Canada


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## jharkin (Jan 4, 2014)

I know... And I was a bit harsh ( sorry Andrew) but always surprises me when otherwise very well read and environmentally conscious folks read into the light bulb conspiracy theories and freak out.

It will all be ok


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## Swedishchef (Jan 4, 2014)

I do shop in Canada. Things are simply more expensive here.  LEDs are expensive here! And my electricity rate is cheap. It's not everywhere that generates most of their electricity with coal 
http://www.lowes.ca/led-light-bulbs_1527.html
http://www.homedepot.ca/catalog/led-bulbs/172458

TO convert all the lights on my house right now it would cost me about $1500 in LED bulbs.

I do have halogens, lots of them already Jeremy 

I like the idea of saving energy. I love it even. Hence why I have R24 basement walls. But people need to do their research first before just jumping on a bandwagon. Remember Asbestos? Wow that stuff was great! Cheap and an amazing insulator. Yet now if the word is mentioned people run away screaming for the purchase of a house that contains any...The government (in Canada anyways) was supporting the Asbestos mines (until recently).

My concern if that of the CFL. That's all. We are allowed to install mercury containing lightbulbs withina  household? Because, according to the US EPA, it saves coal burning (and some mercury is found in coal). And since our economy does whatever yours does, we (Canada) jumped on board. "Small amounts of mercury can be released into the environment when CFLs break, or if they are improperly disposed of at the end of their useful lives. Despite these emissions, the use of CFLs actually helps reduce total mercury emissions in the U.S. because of their significant energy savings.  Using energy-saving CFLs reduces demand for electricity, which in turn reduces the amount of coal burned by power plants, which reduces emissions of mercury when the coal is burned." http://www2.epa.gov/cfl/what-are-connections-between-mercury-and-cfls

Not to change the subject but look at what Ontario did: every NEW house construction MUST have R20 FULL basement walls. Also needed are high attic R values, etc. In Quebec it is mandatory on all new buildings to have an air exchanger, R5 foam (taped) on the outside, Low E ARgon windows, etc etc. Personally I feel that these new higher efficiency standards are much better than changing a lightbulb design. If I have R 5 in my walls and it is -25 outside, changing a few lightbulbs will be the least of my worries.

In fact, $1000 in lightbulbs is a lot of extra insulation/air sealing on a house! 

But I do understand that the only retrofitting change that can be implemented nationwide is...lightbulbs!


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## jharkin (Jan 4, 2014)

I can understand the concern, but the mercury amount is really tiny and only an issue if they break. Long tube florescent have much more mercury and we have all lived around those for decades.  Both are inconsequential in the big scheme of things compared to power plant commissions.

Part of the reason I get worked up about this issue is my background as an engineer.  Engineers don't discover new theory (scientists do), rather our job is to take the best new ideas from science and put them to practical use in the simplest and most efficient (cost, energy, etc) way possible.  From that point of view, the incandescent lamp is one of the least efficient engineering solutions ever.  A 60w light bulb only uses 2 % of the input energy to do its primary function.  two percent!   Put in perspective, if your woodstove was 2% efficient, rather than burning 3 cords a year you would burn over 100. Or your 30mpg car would be getting only 3mpg.

Even 19th century steam locomotives are more efficient than incandescent lamps. So are rumford style open fireplaces!


CFL is marginally better at around 3-5%.  LED has the potential to go to 20% or better but so far the commercially available ones are 10 at best.  I'm waiting for some real innovation here... eventually.


(Disclaimer - I don't love CFL. I use them where there is no better option but I'm trying to convert to LED as much as is financially feasable.  At over $0.15/kWh its a much better return here)


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## Swedishchef (Jan 4, 2014)

jharkin said:


> A 60w light bulb only uses 2 % of the input energy to do its primary funciton. two percent!


That is something I did not know.! Crazy!

I understand why people aren't worked up about mercury in light bulbs. They have only heard of it in old school thermometers. But I did work with it in my past life.

There's only 3-5mg per bulb. I just hope they tell people to sweep it up, put it in a bag for disposal and not suck it up with a vaccuum (which blows the vapours everywhere).

After reading about this bulb change all AM, I am sold. (I still have CFL lighting).

The Department Natural Resources says new regulations would deliver between $749 million and $2.4 billion in energy and greenhouse gas savings for Canadians, including 7.5 megatonnes of reduced annual greenhouse-gas emissions in 2025!


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## greg13 (Jan 4, 2014)

OK, just a few thoughts. 

First, greenhouse gas during manufacture. Are the figures on a bulb to bulb build? if so remember that you are only building 1 CFL to 7 incandescent bulbs and 1 LED to 20 incandescent bulbs so if you are looking at just figures they may not be telling the whole truth. 

The prices on LEDs HAVE come down here. They were in the $30 range, they have dropped to under $10 in places.

Bulbs & Migraines. I have them at times too. An observation that I have made is LED tail lights on cars. There are some that just plain bug me, They almost seem to have a very high speed strobe to them, others I am fine with. I do know that there are many types of CFLs that offer differing bulb hues from a cool Yellowish white to bright white, there are also some that take a few seconds to warm up and others that are instant on. 
I guess that if you are bothered by bulbs, try a few different types and color ranges and see if you can find one that works for you.

Bottom line is that we all will just HAVE to learn to live with it, so try to make the best of it. Just don't get me started on health insurance.

Greg


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## semipro (Jan 4, 2014)

Swedishchef said:


> That is something I did not know.! Crazy!
> 
> I understand why people aren't worked up about mercury in light bulbs. They have only heard of it in old school thermometers. But I did work with it in my past life.
> 
> There's only 3-5mg per bulb. I just hope they tell people to sweep it up, put it in a bag for disposal and not suck it up with a vaccuum (which blows the vapours everywhere).


Major sources of mercury in houses are older thermostats and gas meters, probably much more so than fluorescent bulbs, at least in terms of volume/mass. 
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC1480493/
http://www.dtsc.ca.gov/hazardouswaste/mercury_therm_act.cfm

As mentioned in another post the form of mercury makes a big difference in the risk.  Elemental mercury is a lesser risk that methylated mercury.
http://rd.tetratech.com/DraftHgBrochurev2.pdf


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## semipro (Jan 4, 2014)

I've also found I find many LEDs annoying.  It took a long time to find acceptable LED lights for our tree and some car tail lights are really bad.  It seems to depend, in part, on the presence and nature of the lens rather than the LEDs themselves.  

We've been buying the Cree models at HD and found them very pleasant to be around.  They look very much like a legacy bulb and put out a great quality light. 
http://www.homedepot.com/p/Cree-40W...ht-Bulb-BA19-04527OMF-12DE26-2U100/204476612#


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## Swedishchef (Jan 4, 2014)

Jeremy: why are halogen bulbs still accepted when the lifespan is the same as an incedescent?


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## Swedishchef (Jan 4, 2014)

semipro said:


> Major sources of mercury in houses are older thermostats and gas meters, probably much more so than fluorescent bulbs, at least in terms of volume/mass.
> http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC1480493/
> http://www.dtsc.ca.gov/hazardouswaste/mercury_therm_act.cfm
> 
> ...


 
I understand...but I guess I am just a little paranoid since I worked with mercury in a lab...


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## woodgeek (Jan 4, 2014)

Swedishchef said:


> Jeremy: why are halogen bulbs still accepted when the lifespan is the same as an incedescent?



In the US, it was a 'backdoor' on the ban, in case substitutes did not become available.  They are ~25% more efficient than other incandescents, so they made the cut.  They will be phased out in 2020 down here.


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## flyingcow (Jan 4, 2014)

eclecticcottage said:


> In Canada




A 99 cent cheeseburger we have over here is 1.39 in Canada. A gallon of milk is $6 to $7. A liter of gas is $1.25- ish. Makes up for 6 cents a KWh electricity.


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## flyingcow (Jan 4, 2014)

Somewhere. probably here, i read that LED's last a lot longer than CFL's?? Hence the high prices?


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## eclecticcottage (Jan 4, 2014)

flyingcow said:


> A 99 cent cheeseburger we have over here is 1.39 in Canada. A gallon of milk is $6 to $7. A liter of gas is $1.25- ish. Makes up for 6 cents a KWh electricity.



We can see Toronto some nights, our neighbors live there (and use the house next door as a cottage).  They get a lot shipped here, for them, friends and family-they stay for a few days and take it home so no GST/PST and it's cheaper even with shipping.  We see a lot of Ontario plates at the grocery store even.


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## flyingcow (Jan 4, 2014)

Most of my travels have been into New Brunswick. Holidays is usually a good time for cnandian shoppers over here. One advantage of money close to par. Our stores do benefit.


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## Swedishchef (Jan 4, 2014)

flyingcow said:


> Most of my travels have been into New Brunswick. Holidays is usually a good time for cnandian shoppers over here. One advantage of money close to par. Our stores do benefit.


 


greg13 said:


> OK, just a few thoughts.
> 
> 
> Bulbs & Migraines. I have them at times too. An observation that I have made is LED tail lights on cars. There are some that just plain bug me, They almost seem to have a very high speed strobe to them, others I am fine with. I do know that there are many types of CFLs that offer differing bulb hues from a cool Yellowish white to bright white, there are also some that take a few seconds to warm up and others that are instant on.
> ...



Greg, I am from NB. Lived there for 25 years. MIss it dearly and hope to return within the next year or two.

My cheap electricity rates in Canada are rare. In fact, my rates are some of the cheapest in North America. It's just how things are. I do appreciate my wife's 2 free C-section/7 days hospital stay though. And in Quebec we have subsidized daycares for $7/day/child.

I agree things are cheaper in the US and always will be. Your volume is 10 times ours. Not to change course for this OP, but check out these links.
http://www.cbc.ca/news/business/canadian-car-buyers-blocked-from-cheaper-u-s-prices-1.2435299
http://www.cbc.ca/marketplace/episodes/2013-2014/price-wars


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## flyingcow (Jan 4, 2014)

When the American dollar was strong, almost impossible to buy a new car in CA.


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## flyingcow (Jan 4, 2014)

Back to the OP. My buddy tried to convince me to buy a trailer truck load of incandescent's a few yrs ago. Said it would be money in the bank.


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## Swedishchef (Jan 4, 2014)

flyingcow said:


> Back to the OP. My buddy tried to convince me to buy a trailer truck load of incandescent's a few yrs ago. Said it would be money in the bank.


 
Ha ha.


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## billb3 (Jan 4, 2014)

You don't use electricity during the day ?
http://www.ontarioenergyboard.ca/OEB/Consumers/Electricity/Electricity+Prices


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## Swedishchef (Jan 4, 2014)

billb3 said:


> You don't use electricity during the day ?
> http://www.ontarioenergyboard.ca/OEB/Consumers/Electricity/Electricity Prices


 
I think you need to look deeper into the actual costs.
There are abot 35-40 companies that provide electricity in Ontario. This site, http://www.ontarioenergyboard.ca/OEB/Consumers/Electricity/Your Electricity Utility, let's you pick a utility company. And then it compares costs. The actual rates are the same for the electricity. However the delivery charge, regulatory charge vary from company to company (an example was 800Kwh/month the bills went from $110-$175). And then there's the debt retirement charge (This 0.7¢/kWh charge is set by the Ontario Ministry of Finance and is used by the government to pay down the residual stranded debt of the former Ontario Hydro).

Not to mention Ontario are supposed to see their electricity rates rise by 40% (that's not a typo) within 5 years. There had been a thread on this forum about the rising rates...

Andrew


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## jebatty (Jan 5, 2014)

I have a bunch of unused incandescent bulbs I would give away, but NOT, because using them is so wasteful in energy use. They are headed for a bag for crushing and disposal. 

I just bought 30 LED A19 bulbs, 10 - 40 watt equivalent (6.5w-450 lumens) and 20 - 60 watt equivalent (9.5w-800 lumens) from Earth LED. The 6.5w were $5 each and the 9.5 were $10 each, round numbers. Our power company gives a $3/bulb rebate on the 6.5w because they are Energy Star labeled, the 9.5w were not, so just $2/bulb for the 6.5w, almost the same price as would be replacement CFL's. The LED's are replacing the last of our dimmable incandescent bulbs and our high use CFL's. The bulbs are SunSun brand, 3000K, and very pleasant light, dimmable.

I also gave each of our three adult children two of the 9.5w LED's for Christmas gifts to help them get started on the move to LED's. They already heavily use CFL's and all are very energy conservation conscious.

My wife and I also have a rental house, tenant pays his own electricity, but I pulled out all of the incandescent bulbs and replaced with CFL's a long time ago at my cost, tenant's savings, because it was the right thing to do.


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## woodgeek (Jan 5, 2014)

I bought 7 CREE Edison-style bulbs yesterday at Home Despot.  2 were the 75W size, for an area that needed more light than the 60W could provide.  The rest were 60W size for $7 each.  Appears my local utility (PECO) is kicking in an 'instant rebate' on these guys at the HD register.  The 40W size were $5!

Almost cheap enough for Joful to buy some.


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## jebatty (Jan 5, 2014)

For the LED's be careful of xx-watt equivalent claims. Look at the lumens instead. I have seen advertised 60-watt equivalent having lumen output from about 650 to 800. 60-watt equivalent should be 800 lumens, and 40-watt equivalent should be 450 lumens. Also then look at cost/lumen and cost/price of the bulb. It's not always easy to know if the lower price is actually the best priced LED.


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## Swedishchef (Jan 5, 2014)

woodgeek said:


> I bought 7 CREE Edison-style bulbs yesterday at Home Despot.  2 were the 75W size, for an area that needed more light than the 60W could provide.  The rest were 60W size for $7 each.  Appears my local utility (PECO) is kicking in an 'instant rebate' on these guys at the HD register.  The 40W size were $5!
> 
> Almost cheap enough for Joful to buy some.


 
I have a light fixture in my kitchen with 3 bulbs like that. Very stylish.

Andrew


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## woodgeek (Jan 5, 2014)

jebatty said:


> For the LED's be careful of xx-watt equivalent claims. Look at the lumens instead. I have seen advertised 60-watt equivalent having lumen output from about 650 to 800. 60-watt equivalent should be 800 lumens, and 40-watt equivalent should be 450 lumens. Also then look at cost/lumen and cost/price of the bulb. It's not always easy to know if the lower price is actually the best priced LED.



The CREE bulbs would satisfy you...the '60W' are 800 lum and the '75W' are 1100 lum.  Both are a v respectable 80-85 lum/W (in a warm-white 2700°K color bulb).  No CRI listed, but seems ok.  And the prices are awesome in the smaller bulbs.  And dimmable (with LED-rated dimmer).


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## Swedishchef (Jan 5, 2014)

Here's a site with nice bulbs. The ones in our kitchen are similar...

Andrew

http://www.restorationhardware.com/catalog/category/products.jsp?categoryId=cat550006


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## woodgeek (Jan 5, 2014)

Definitely more attractive than the CREEs (sorry, my promotional contract with them requires me to SHOUT it).







I have seen some lovely bulbs like yours in different settings...including the RH store..seems like a small indulgence to me.


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## Swedishchef (Jan 5, 2014)

woodgeek said:


> Definitely more attractive than the CREEs (sorry, my promotional contract with them requires me to SHOUT it).
> 
> 
> I have seen some lovely bulbs like yours in different settings...including the RH store..seems like a small indulgence to me.


I find it adds to the rustic/old school look I am aiming for.

The CHEAPEST Cree bulb in Canada is $12 (40watt)! You got a really good price...

http://www.homedepot.ca/webapp/wcs/...=mode+matchallpartial&Dx=mode+matchallpartial


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## woodgeek (Jan 5, 2014)

Well, that should get better with time....The old L-prize bulbs that were roughly equivalent (but had better CRI) had an MSRP of $40 less than 2 years ago.

DId I mention the dimmers were $30 a piece??


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## woodgeek (Jan 5, 2014)

Swedishchef said:


> I find it adds to the rustic/old school look I am aiming for.



I went for a slightly different effect in another fixture...


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## Swedishchef (Jan 5, 2014)

That is awesome!! Where'd ya get those bulbs?

Andrew


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## woodgeek (Jan 5, 2014)

Swedishchef said:


> That is awesome!! Where'd ya get those bulbs?
> 
> Andrew



Plumen


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## midwestcoast (Jan 5, 2014)

Swedishchef said:


> That is something I did not know.! Crazy!
> 
> I understand why people aren't worked up about mercury in light bulbs. They have only heard of it in old school thermometers. But I did work with it in my past life.
> 
> ...


This post stopped me & I had to comment. Haven't even continued reading the thread from here yet...

Wow, this is the single most encouraging post I have ever seen on a green issue! Andrew started a thread about a piece of enviro legislation (with a kinda misleading title) made some very valid points against it, then actually read the responses! Asked more questions, made more good points, did some reading on his own and partly CHANGED HIS MIND based on facts instead of pre-conception!
Andrew, thank you for keeping an open mind and being willing to evolve thinking on a subject that inspires much fear-mongering and demagoguery!


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## Swedishchef (Jan 5, 2014)

Ha. Thanks Midwest.

A man thinks he is right...a REAL man knows when he is wrong.

I am a believer in facts. Often times we make decisions on information received via media. We can't all be engineers/testers/professionals and do the testing ourselves. So we must take what we read as somewhat valid information but still be uncertain about it and be open to learning more. Otherwise the world would still be flat (isn't it flat??? lol)

I have learned to trust some people and their statements on these forums.

During my chemistry degree my profs would not allow us to use websites as references. Only scientific journals (they were not online back in the day). Journals are always reviewed by people in the field before being published. whereas media articles and the internet is not. 
A


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## woodgeek (Jan 5, 2014)

midwestcoast said:


> This post stopped me & I had to comment. Haven't even continued reading the thread from here yet...
> 
> Wow, this is the single most encouraging post I have ever seen on a green issue! Andrew started a thread about a piece of enviro legislation (with a kinda misleading title) made some very valid points against it, then actually read the responses! Asked more questions, made more good points, did some reading on his own and partly CHANGED HIS MIND based on facts instead of pre-conception!
> Andrew, thank you for keeping an open mind and being willing to evolve thinking on a subject that inspires much fear-mongering and demagoguery!



I had the same take!  Plumens for everyone!!


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## Swedishchef (Jan 5, 2014)

Ha ha. Tks.


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## jharkin (Jan 5, 2014)

I wish Philips had not discontinued the L-prize lamp. My utility started giving them out for $10, I only got 3.


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## woodgeek (Jan 5, 2014)

jharkin said:


> I wish Philips had not discontinued the L-prize lamp. My utility started giving them out for $10, I only got 3.



Me too.    

IIRC, I read that they were expensive for Phillips to make.  They were willing to take a loss on a small number, but not to ramp up the numbers.


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## area_man (Jan 7, 2014)

I've been replacing my light bulbs with LEDs from Costco for the last year or so.  The LEDs are bright enough, and cheap enough, to get the job done without compromising my ability to get things done.  In the kitchen some of the LEDs are so much brighter than what they replaced that I no longer need the overhead lights at all.  I'm very happy with LEDs and will continue to replace any of my existing lights with LEDs as the price/performance ratio is more than good enough.

As it is, I'm not going to throw functioning light bulbs away just to replace them.  As they burn out, I will do so.  I have an LED light/motion sensor fixture on hand to replace the next incandescent one that goes bad.  The one on the deck outside my kitchen just threw a bulb... I guess that will be the first one to be decommissioned.  There are six more that remain functional.   I just don't have the money handy to put to the task.  Also, I bet LED light/motion sensor fixtures will go down in price over time.


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## PapaDave (Jan 7, 2014)

Been giving my cfl lights to my brother as I replace with LED.
They've started complaining that the light output sucks. Went to their house the other night and they had put them in lamps next to the sofas and the lamps all have dark shades on them.
DOH! No wonder you can't see anything.
I sometimes wonder how they make it through each day.
I have a 3 light fan/light combo in the kitchen that now has 2 LEDs in it and the light is actually better than the CFLs that were there. It's a somewhat high use area.One's a Cree, and the other is a Phillips. 
Really depends on the fixture sometimes.
I mentioned this in another thread, but I only have 3 fluorescent t-8 fixtures in the shop so far, and now I'm considering putting in LEDs.
Prices keep dropping.


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## seige101 (Jan 7, 2014)

area_man said:


> I've been replacing my light bulbs with LEDs from Costco for the last year or so.  The LEDs are bright enough, and cheap enough, to get the job done without compromising my ability to get things done.  In the kitchen some of the LEDs are so much brighter than what they replaced that I no longer need the overhead lights at all.  I'm very happy with LEDs and will continue to replace any of my existing lights with LEDs as the price/performance ratio is more than good enough.
> 
> As it is, I'm not going to throw functioning light bulbs away just to replace them.  As they burn out, I will do so.  I have an LED light/motion sensor fixture on hand to replace the next incandescent one that goes bad.  The one on the deck outside my kitchen just threw a bulb... I guess that will be the first one to be decommissioned.  There are six more that remain functional.   I just don't have the money handy to put to the task.  Also, I bet LED light/motion sensor fixtures will go down in price over time.



Look into led spot light bulbs in your existing fixture (about $35 for 2) as opposed to the $100 led fixtures i have been seeing in the box stores


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## semipro (Jan 7, 2014)

PapaDave said:


> I mentioned this in another thread, but I only have 3 fluorescent t-8 fixtures in the-*  shop so far, and now I'm considering putting in LEDs. Prices keep dropping


It'll be nice if the price of these LED plug in replacements for T-8s becomes affordable. 
http://www.eledlights.com/product-info.php?T8-4FT-LED-tube-pid7.html


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## loadstarken (Jan 8, 2014)

I can't wait to convert my T8 bulbs to LED!

I have replaced all of the bulbs in my house with the CREE 60w equivalent bulbs and put my old CFLs in a box at the end of my driveway for free. 

My Home Depot has instant rebates from the power company on the CREE bulbs so the 40w equivalent bulb is under $5 and the 60w equivalent is under $8.

For Christmas I bought my parents a dozen of them to get them started on switching over to LED.  I switched them out in their TV room where there was 6 - 60watt bulbs on for a good 12+ hours a day.   The new bulbs are 60watt equivalent 6 - 9.5watts and are using 303watts less now in that room. 

My sister had me buy 30 of them last year and send them to her and she saved a bunch of money that way vs buying them in her state.


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## lobsta1 (Jan 8, 2014)

Unfortunately for me, every fixture in the house was put in place based on a 100W incandescent bulb. All controlled by rotary dimmers mounted with oak fixture plates. I have not seen 100W general purpose led bulbs yet.  So now I will have to start placing extra lamps everywhere plus replacing all the dimmers at $20 apiece.

It seems that every time the government tries to save me money, IT COST ME A FORTUNE. When they went to ethanol to bail out Cheney's friends at ADM, it cost me $5000 to replace the 275 gal. fiberglass gas tank in my boat.
Al


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## Swedishchef (Jan 8, 2014)

Just remember: they are not doing it to save money (lke I thought as well...) They are doing it to save energy....It's a technological advancement and like everything else, we hate swallowing pills pushed down our throats. And in 4 years we won't remember a thing about it.


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## begreen (Jan 8, 2014)

Conservation is the cheapest form of energy right now.


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## Laurent Cyr (Feb 16, 2014)

Hey Andrew.

I was at Ikea in Ottawa this weekend, and found some LED bulbs at $6.99 each.  In fact, they didn`t have any LED bulbs over 10$.

Next time you`re in Montréal, you should take a look.

Laurent


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## Laurent Cyr (Feb 17, 2014)

You can also order online from Ikea.

L.


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## Dustin92 (Feb 21, 2014)

I don't mind CFL's, and they are getting cheaper over time, but I don't like being forced to buy them (or LED's for that matter). While they are more energy efficient, the ones we have (every fixture in the house), have terrible light quality, and take forever to warm up. I have bought exactly one LED bulb, and have no plans of buying any more. It is a globe style bulb over the bathroom vanity, and while claiming to be a 60 watt equivalent, it puts off less light than the 25 watt bulbs it replaced. For the time being, I'm dragging my feet, digging in with both heels, and fighting against them. I almost bought a few packs of incandescent bulbs today and replaced every bulb in this house. If I want to pay the bill for running incandescent bulbs, I should be able to buy them, and in any wattage I please. I hate having to turn on lights 5 minutes before they are actually needed, in order to warm up. I have to turn on the light over the dining room table as I'm setting the table, instead of as dinner is being served, I have to turn on the bathroom light a few minutes before I need to take a shower, etc. I truly wonder how that is saving any energy, they may be lower wattage, but have to warm up before they are actually useful.


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## begreen (Feb 22, 2014)

Excuse my lack of knowledge here on what is happening in Canada. Will incandescents be banned outright or will there be halogens replacing them like in the US. If halogens, that is great. They have little downside and use less power to create the same illumination. What is not to like?


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