# Bio bricks and Envi blocks...



## mwhitnee (Sep 22, 2015)

Both selling for right around $290/pallet in Mass, sound about right?

Does anyone have experience with Fuel Blocks?  They are at Lowe's I called $480/pallet (96 packages of 3, 288 blocks total).


----------



## mwhitnee (Sep 22, 2015)

Found Fuel Blocks for $373 a pallet.


----------



## owingsia (Sep 22, 2015)

I used them last year when we were running low on wood and a storm was coming. I found that they were hard to light but once going they burned very hot. No coals just ash when done. You should pack the stove as full and tightly as possible or they just burn up fast. I found that I could mix in not so great wood with these and get nice long burns.... 

Cat stoves have been reported to love these things and put out a great deal of heat... I have not first hand experience with that.


----------



## Wisneaky (Sep 22, 2015)

I bought close to a pallet of bio bricks last season. I mixed them in with my wood. I tried to not use too many at a time because they burn really really hot.


----------



## ekg0477 (Sep 23, 2015)

Im kicking around the idea of using these blocks. A local company is selling a pallet for 290.00 + 45 delivery. The idea of being able to have the pallet stacked in my garage for quick and easy access seems like a good selling point.


----------



## mwhitnee (Sep 24, 2015)

Im thinking of spending a few hours and putting them in the cellar myself.  I have a window seats that have storage underneath and could fill one with them every now and then. Even buying two pallets might be a good idea for me.


----------



## mwhitnee (Sep 24, 2015)

Anyone have a suggestion on whether I should get the bigger or smaller envi-blocks?  I have a BK King.


----------



## Babaganoosh (Sep 24, 2015)

mwhitnee said:


> Anyone have a suggestion on whether I should get the bigger or smaller envi-blocks?  I have a BK King.



For mixing in with subpar wood use the  smaller ones. Stand alone use the bigger ones.


----------



## lostDuck (Sep 24, 2015)

I like them to help fill the stove in the winter and when I get sick I just go to the basement to get fuel for the fire instead of out to the wood shed


----------



## iamlucky13 (Sep 24, 2015)

owingsia said:


> You should pack the stove as full and tightly as possible or they just burn up fast. I found that I could mix in not so great wood with these and get nice long burns....



I've never burned bricks, so perhaps what I've read doesn't apply here, but isn't packing the stove as full as possible not recommended because some bricks expand as they start to burn, and can crack the secondary tubes or cause other damage?


----------



## Bret Chase (Sep 24, 2015)

I bought the "trial pack" from the local biofuel dealer a couple of years ago...  I thought the enviblocks were ok.. and ended up buying a pallet of Riologs. The biggest problem I found with my old smoke dragon... is the firebox is just too damned big for optimal use of any biobrick product.  But hell.... if work keeps up the way it is... I may buy a new stove... and maybe a pellet stove too (can't fill the stove if you're not home)


----------



## hamsey (Sep 25, 2015)

Used envi blocks (big ones) last year with good results. Just bought a ton to use this year. I mostly use them in the morning when I am running late and do not have the time to wait for the wood to catch. I put 3 in at a time. I have never tried to start a fire with them though, always put on a bed of coals. I get them from CT Pallet.

There is another product similar to NEILS that is produced in Waterbury, CT. I have not tried them yet but plan on picking some up and giving them a go.


----------



## mass_burner (Sep 25, 2015)

Bio bricks really create more whispy ash in your box I found. I've tried them all, Niels/all nighter's being the gold standard. But at the end of the day, nothing is as good as wood. It's the latter part of the cycle where these substitutes fall short, they can't match the intense heat of a wood coal bed.


----------



## mwhitnee (Sep 25, 2015)

lostDuck said:


> I like them to help fill the stove in the winter and when I get sick I just go to the basement to get fuel for the fire instead of out to the wood shed



Mine are going in the basement. Not looking forward to lugging them down there as there is no easy access but it will be handy.


----------



## newburner (Sep 26, 2015)

We go through a ton a season. We mix 3 with wood at night to sustain an overnight fire.

I just got these last week. I thought I was early but the place I got them from last year was already sold out so I had to pay more from another place.


----------



## Beer Belly (Sep 26, 2015)

owingsia said:


> . You should pack the stove as full and tightly as possible or they just burn up fast.


My understanding is that they tend to expand, so I'm not sure about packing the stove as full, and tightly as possible


----------



## mass_burner (Sep 26, 2015)

Packing tightly keeps them from expanding.


----------



## Wisneaky (Sep 26, 2015)

I have burned a half pallet of bio bricks and I never had an issue with them expanding.


----------



## mwhitnee (Sep 27, 2015)

I was just going to use them as a supplement. Now that I'm thinking about it I'm not entirely sure how to go about using them for my purposes.

What's the theory behind using them as a supplement for dried wood? I know it will reduce the overall moisture content, but what if the fire is going just fine after I use bricks/wood then reload with only wood and it's fine? Is that good practice or should I always use the bricks?


----------



## newburner (Sep 27, 2015)

Here's how I do it...

I always use them to supplement the wood. I put 3 bricks on top of a few splits. On reload, I load only wood.

At night, before bed, I load another 3 bricks over splits. My firebox is only 1.4 cu.ft. but it burns all night like that. Then, first thing in morning, I reload with another 3 on top of some wood. Throughout the day, I reload with wood only until the last load when the cycle starts over.

I never burn only bricks.


----------



## mwhitnee (Sep 27, 2015)

newburner said:


> Here's how I do it...
> 
> I always use them to supplement the wood. I put 3 bricks on top of a few splits. On reload, I load only wood.
> 
> ...



I just got a BK King for a few reasons, but one of them was the overnight burns. I want to be able to walk over to the stove, pack it, and heat the house all day while I'm gone and not have to be starting the fire again in the morning or when I come home from work.

Although I don't know how the new stove is going to behave/heat the second floor yet, I would imagine I would be turning it down at night so flue temps would drop and creosote might be a problem.  So using the bricks at night consistently sounds like a good idea, as well as on startups.

The only time I might even consider only using the bricks is if I were really sick, which I typically never get. If you have a BK, you only need to load it once anyway.


----------



## drz1050 (Sep 27, 2015)

I've called around a little here, and prices seem high... does anyone know a good supplier around the Albany/ Saratoga area of NY?


----------



## mass_burner (Sep 27, 2015)

I found that you want to place them flat and support on as many sides as possible. I would make a brick floor then walls at the back/sides, 2 brick high max.  and make my fire in the open middle. I would get about 7-8 bricks in my small stove.


----------



## newburner (Sep 27, 2015)

My experience has been the opposite. I've tried all different ways and found I get longer burn times and quicker starts placing them on top with about 1" of space between them.

When I pack them tightly, especially underneath the wood, they never burn completely.


----------



## mass_burner (Sep 27, 2015)

They do separate, and tend to do so when allowed to move or when not supported by other blocks. Whatever way you set them up, you need to allow some space for air movement.


----------



## edge-of-the-woods (Sep 29, 2015)

newburner said:


> My experience has been the opposite. I've tried all different ways and found I get longer burn times and quicker starts placing them on top with about 1" of space between them.
> 
> When I pack them tightly, especially underneath the wood, they never burn completely.



This has been my esperience with BioBricks.  If I pack them tight, they don't burn well at all.  They just smolder after a while.


----------



## mass_burner (Sep 29, 2015)

If you start a nice hot kindling fire they burn.


----------



## drz1050 (Sep 29, 2015)

Found envi blocks for 290/ pallet here, think I might pick up a ton later this week. Bio bricks are 310/ pallet.


----------



## mass_burner (Sep 30, 2015)

BTW, for anyone that's interested bgreen did a great synopsis here of the compressed products out there. Just search it out.


----------



## MaintenanceMan (Sep 30, 2015)

I've not burned any of these products yet, but they have me curious. I was at Tractor Supply the other day and picked up one six pack to try at some point in my new Super 27. The only thing I am interested in is to see if they would extend the burn times any. I have more than enough wood and would not pay money for them for any other reason than to see if I could get an extra hour of so overnight. I've got all the hardwood I can store right now so I don't see the need to spend money for an other reason. But there seems to be mixed reviews on them as far as extending burn times goes.


----------



## mwhitnee (Oct 14, 2015)

So I finally get to getting the 2nd pallet of Envi 8's inside the cellar. Took around 2 weeks, got the first in right away.  It was sitting in the driveway.

Around 25-30 of them were "blown out" from rain getting in.  I'm sure many of you know that if these hit water they expand, make a big mess, and are bordering useless.

Tried to call the company but no luck yet.  I specifically asked them if they would be ok outside for a while.

Do you think they should replace them?


----------



## jatoxico (Oct 14, 2015)

mwhitnee said:


> I specifically asked them if they would be ok outside for a while.
> Do you think they should replace them?


Were they good when they dropped them?


----------



## edge-of-the-woods (Oct 14, 2015)

mwhitnee said:


> View attachment 163788
> 
> 
> 
> ...



I feel your pain, b/c I had this happen to a pack of mine when rain blew in under our leaky garage door seal.  That said, there is a big difference between "ok outside for a while" and "outside for weeks and getting rained on".  Did you have a tarp over them?


----------



## mwhitnee (Oct 14, 2015)

jatoxico said:


> Were they good when they dropped them?



I don't know as I left them covered in the driveway.


----------



## mwhitnee (Oct 14, 2015)

edge-of-the-woods said:


> I feel your pain, b/c I had this happen to a pack of mine when rain blew in under our leaky garage door seal.  That said, there is a big difference between "ok outside for a while" and "outside for weeks and getting rained on".  Did you have a tarp over them?



Nope. It rained a couple times but it didn't pour on them.  Why can't they just make the cover without holes in it though? Ventilation? Is the cover supposed to have holes in it?  I couldn't see any.


----------



## jatoxico (Oct 14, 2015)

mwhitnee said:


> I don't know as I left them covered in the driveway.


I'd complain then as some of those seem like they were crushed with damaged packaging.


----------



## spirilis (Oct 14, 2015)

Packing them tightly means the outsides expand, but the insides don't .... until they burn down far enough that the insides are exposed.  A long burn with wood briquettes involves setting up isolated zones of packed bricks with appropriate amounts of space between them.  That provides a balanced burn rate (enough air space and fuel facing each other across a short gap to foster a burn rate high enough to sustain efficient hot secondary combustion, but not so much loose air space that every brick is generating smoke out of most of its sides to overwhelm the secondary combustion with excessive smoke and/or burn through them too fast).


----------



## edge-of-the-woods (Oct 14, 2015)

spirilis said:


> Packing them tightly means the outsides expand, but the insides don't .... until they burn down far enough that the insides are exposed. * A long burn with wood briquettes involves setting up isolated zones of packed bricks with appropriate amounts of space between them.*  That provides a balanced burn rate (enough air space and fuel facing each other across a short gap to foster a burn rate high enough to sustain efficient hot secondary combustion, but not so much loose air space that every brick is generating smoke out of most of its sides to overwhelm the secondary combustion with excessive smoke and/or burn through them too fast).



Wait, whoa!  So you mean instead of a single packed block, have multiple packed blocks?

Not this.....

@@@@@@@@@
@@@@@@@@@

But this...?

@@@   @@@   @@@
@@@   @@@   @@@


----------



## spirilis (Oct 14, 2015)

edge-of-the-woods said:


> Wait, whoa!  So you mean instead of a single packed block, have multiple packed blocks?
> 
> Not this.....
> 
> ...


Pretty much.  In my old Jotul it was more like-

@@@@ @@@@
@@@@ @@@@

with a nice "upside down waterfall" of fire in the middle there.  Quite a spectacle.
Be mindful of the airflow architecture of the stove... my Jotul had a primary air inlet right at the dead center, so that made sense.  My new Madison has its doghouse air in the center too so that'll probably continue to make sense for me.


----------



## Shane Collins (Oct 14, 2015)

mass_burner said:


> BTW, for anyone that's interested bgreen did a great synopsis here of the compressed products out there. Just search it out.


I tried to find his thread but had no luck, do you have any idea where it is or how to find it?  Thanks.


----------



## hamsey (Oct 15, 2015)

https://www.hearth.com/talk/threads/biobrick-review.6270/


----------



## Shane Collins (Oct 15, 2015)

hamsey said:


> https://www.hearth.com/talk/threads/biobrick-review.6270/



Thanks, I was searching using bio bricks instead of biobricks.  Guess that's why it didn't show up? thanks again.


----------

