# Hole under Pilot preventing correct operation



## donbixby (Jan 13, 2011)

The first year or two in our house, our fireplace worked properly.  Without changing anything besides the usual turning off the pilot light over the summer and turning it back on in the fall, last year the pilot started having a hard time staying lit.  If I could get the pilot to stay lit, the main fireplace had a hard time starting up.  I just turned it off and forgot about it.

So this year, I got back to looking at it again, taking out the logs that were preventing me from seeing what was actually going on.

What's happening is there is a hole, which you can see in this picture.  When the pilot lights, the flame comes out of that hole down below instead of the pilot hood, which means the thermopile and thermocouple don't get a direct flame, which is why the pilot won't stay lit and/or the rest of the fireplace won't light.

That obviously isn't an accidental hole, but what is it?  Is it supposed to provide aeration or something?  Is there some type of valve or plug that's supposed to be there?


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## North of 60 (Jan 13, 2011)

That looks to me to be your fixed primary air for your pilot burner. When it lights from there it must look orange and lazy?
The path above it must be obstructed. I would remove the pilot burner/whole assembly, Disassemble the ignitor,powerpile,thermocouple etc... and boil it in hot water and use compressed air afterwards.
The residential gas hearth gurus here may have a different approach or know this style off by heart.
Good luck and welcome to the forums.


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## spoonfed (Jan 13, 2011)

hello mr spider,you more than likely have a spider web in there,has made a nest just above that hole,or has crawled into the top ports and made a nest there,either way the pilot orfice needs to be removed and the area cleaned,careful with that type of pilot assembly,once the clip is removed they are a groan to get back on correctly,call a service guy


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## DAKSY (Jan 13, 2011)

spoonfed said:
			
		

> hello mr spider,you more than likely have a spider web in there,has made a nest just above that hole,or has crawled into the top ports and made a nest there,either way the pilot orfice needs to be removed and the area cleaned,careful with that type of pilot assembly,once the clip is removed they are a groan to get back on correctly,call a service guy



I don't believe that one has the spring clip. The pilot "spud" (orifice)will drop 
out of this type when the pilot tube retainer is unscrewed from the bottom.
I've never seen the dreaded spider make her little nest in this area, 
but I don't doubt that she could.
Because that IS an intake, it will draw household dust into the 
assembly & when that dust mixes with the moisture from the fuel, it can cause a blockage.
Remove the pilot spud & use a can of compressed air to clear any obstructions.
Make sure you can see daylight thru the spud.
Before you reassemble, turn the On-Pilot-Off knob to Pilot & depress it for a few
seconds MAX & use the gas line pressure to clear anything that may be in that area...
Reassemble & let us know how you made out.


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## Wood Heat Stoves (Jan 13, 2011)

good advice Bob,

op, are you on LPG? maybe ask your gas company to add drying agent to your tank...


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## donbixby (Jan 14, 2011)

It is NG, not LPG.  Things went pretty quickly once I committed to actually taking pretty much the whole thing apart.  They don't make those so you can just pop a piece out and back in.

There was an obstruction above the hole.  Judging from the number of dead spiders all over the place down under the logs and underneath by the blower, I'm guessing it was spider-caused, although it could have been accumulating dust as well.  Perhaps it was dust caught in spider webs.  Hard to say, but whatever it was, some compressed air worked its magic.

The thermopile, thermocouple, and igniter all slid right out of the unit when unscrewed; the pilot itself was permanently mounted to the housing, and the only thing that disassembled on it was the spud, which did just fall out, so I just set it back on top of the supply line when it came time to reassemble.

The pilot lights up beautifully now.  Thanks for your help.  It was just what I needed.

Now I have to figure out if there's something wrong with the pressure for the main supply.  It lights up just fine, but then the flames are a lot lower than I either remember or expected them to be.  Not having lit this puppy up for what is almost 3 years now, I can't say that I remember exactly how big the flames ever were.  The first part between the front and back logs lights up fine, although the flames aren't huge, and then after it U's around between the front log and glass, only about half of that lights up.  It's kind of strange, because there are flames at the end right by the crimp, then a space with no flame, and then right at the U-turn there are flames again.  I'm not overly concerned with it, but it does make me wonder if I should be.  If there are holes with no flame, does that mean gas is leaking out unburned?  I know I don't have to worry about it pooling and exploding like LPG, but it would be nice to not waste it.


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## spoonfed (Jan 14, 2011)

mr spider has probably gotten in behind the burner orfice burner should be removed ,orfice should be removed,check orfice and check burner supply tube


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## DAKSY (Jan 14, 2011)

spoonfed said:
			
		

> mr spider has probably gotten in behind the burner orfice burner should be removed ,orfice should be removed,check orfice and check burner supply tube



+1. Pesky little critters...Generally she'll build her nest right behind the orifice. 
A pipe cleaner or Q-Tip will clear it...


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## spoonfed (Jan 14, 2011)

yes they are,worst case ive ever seen is when we supplied 6 dv,s to a builder in one house in june never got them fired until the end of nov,all units the spiders blocked the pilot orifice and on one unit behind the burner orifice.


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## Install fire 1 (Jan 15, 2011)

I have seen them make nests in that exact spot 100 times or more in the past. 

The newer hoods with the snap clip are much easier to clean for sure.


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