# Empire 100 by Profab



## rglazier65 (Sep 15, 2010)

looking for some input on this boiler please
website is www.profab.org/home/
it is an indoor gassifier

thanks in advance


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## Donl (Sep 15, 2010)

rglazier65 said:
			
		

> looking for some input on this boiler please
> website is www.profab.org/home/
> it is an indoor gassifier
> 
> thanks in advance



They don't offer very much information do they?. I would be very skeptical about this product. They really do need to provide some useful information instead of just hype!


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## WoodChoppa (Sep 16, 2010)

Seeing as this is the same company that produced the Greenwood I would be very wary of there products.


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## Singed Eyebrows (Sep 16, 2010)

You don't know if your getting a decent firetube boiler or a pot of water on top of a wood stove. I wouldn't even bother to call them to find out, Randy


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## ISeeDeadBTUs (Sep 16, 2010)

ProFab did not 'produce' the GreenWood, though they service it now, supposedly. I say supposedly, because, I emailed them about parts and am still waiting to hear back . . .


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## rglazier65 (Oct 23, 2010)

thankyou you all for the input. Right or wrong i bought one anyway and will begin the install and will post pictures and my ups and downs along the way. I will need to draw on the boards experence im sure.  basicly it came down to the fact this was the only indoor gassifier sold in my town.... so i could deal with any waranty issues localy. it has a large firebox as well (6.1ft3), takes a decent length of wood (24 inch).

wish me luck....the move into the house happens tommorow


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## Deere10 (Oct 23, 2010)

Inside the house??  UGH   not the best move IMO.  Many threads have said with these units to try and place them in an out building due to heavy smoke when loading the boiler. Good luck with the install.


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## bigburner (Oct 23, 2010)

any one using draft inducer on these up-drafters, [except they have to travel down to vent] if you had the 125.00 inducer on a door switch that would/might make the difference. My home made job has a smoke problem when the new logs are loaded only after the bark starts to burn then the smoke comes back out the door unless less there is a very hot fire then the draft will be < .05 I have a built in by pass damper goes directly to the stack, haven't quit got around to dialing that in yet. PS my unit has it's own living quarters.


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## rglazier65 (Oct 24, 2010)

OK... The boiler made it in to its new room. This room is actually an old indoor pool that we recently filled in. I too will build it its own sealed off room, and will be able to utilize the old pool exhaust fan i suppose if this thing smokes while loading. The empire 100 does have a smoke curtain...hope it works, i am gona find out soon enough i guess. Anyway the chimney goes in tomorrow... will take closer pictures of the unit and final resting spot for all to see tomorrow....


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## ISeeDeadBTUs (Oct 24, 2010)

Looks like firecap and you are our test team https://www.hearth.com/econtent/index.php/forums/viewthread/61151/

Well, you've bitten the bullet so please keep us posted. From the website -lacking in any sort of details- these units are NOTHING like a Greenwood. These units appear to be a forced downdraft, similar to many of the Euro models.

I assume the Cozyburn was more or less their original product. Looks like they bought up a few companies along the way.

Anyway, please take pics inside the unit before you fire it up and post them here. Seems to me most companies prefer to make outrageous claims and bash their competition. We consumers on the other hand, don't give a dayum what the salesmen think, preferring to hear about the weaknesses of each unit. Since we are the R&D, I say we should benefit fully.

Oh, did I forget to say . . . more pics please? :coolsmile:


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## kabbott (Oct 24, 2010)

I am not familiar with these units at all so I don't know if it will smoke. If it becomes a problem just build
a hood over it with an exhaust fan. I have had a "smoker" in the past and this was one of the biggest factors
in deciding on a new boiler, Wife said that it "better not smoke" and be easy to load...

Good luck with the new unit.


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## bigburner (Oct 24, 2010)

Hey don't for get to hook that thing to your pool, at my house we like swimming when its cold out and the water and room are heated by wood


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## rglazier65 (Oct 24, 2010)

Pictures as promised


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## ISeeDeadBTUs (Oct 25, 2010)

This is very close to boiler porn . . .

Looks good so far . . . fired it up yet?


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## kabbott (Oct 25, 2010)

ISeeDeadBTUs said:
			
		

> This is very close to boiler porn . . .
> 
> Looks good so far . . . fired it up yet?



So I get off work a few hours early today and here I am... Wife calls... what you doin?... Ahh lookin at boiler porn.... Huh? ahh nevermind.


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## ISeeDeadBTUs (Oct 25, 2010)

What is that flap at the top of the load door opening??


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## kabbott (Oct 25, 2010)

Anti smoke flap?


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## ISeeDeadBTUs (Oct 25, 2010)

The thing the OP is holding up out of the way. Top 1/2 of the primary CC.


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## rglazier65 (Oct 26, 2010)

More Porn
You must be over 18 to enter 

ya i think that is some sort of a cutain to help direct the smoke from coming out the loading door. Also when the lever at the frount is swithced to load it opens a bypass door near the (see picture) stove pipe..... so as it does not need to forced down threw the combustion chamber. I am not sure how it works in other down forced boilers but that is what appeards to happen on this beast.
i have not started it or will likely be a few weeks to hook this up, but i cant wait thats for sure.


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## hoosierhick (Oct 26, 2010)

If it works half as good as it looks you have a nice piece .


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## ISeeDeadBTUs (Nov 5, 2010)

rglazier65 said:
			
		

> . . .
> i cant wait thats for sure.



Nor can we. You;re the demo project on this unit, so get a goin' will ya? :coolsmirk:


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## NNYorker (Nov 5, 2010)

Looks like a nice quality built unit. I like how you can easily access the heat exchanger tubes=much easier cleaning w/o dismantling half the unit. Would the door gaskets happen to be a silicone type? I see the lower chamber changed shape from the original design. Good luck with the rest of the install!!


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## rglazier65 (Nov 22, 2010)

Empire update....
I have the unit all hooked up... and the unit is working as promised. It has been quite cold the last five days -23C this morning, and the unit is working great. I really dont have any complaints. Nice large firebox, i currently fill twice a day and there are always coals to start the new load. No smoke when loading ( if its full of wood and you open the door it wants to smoke a little) but if you load twice a day certainly no smoke. Its actually amzing how little ash these gasification stoves produce, one week of burning maybe 4 cups of ash ? Thats about it.... any questions ask away.

(oh and yes it has the silcone type gaskets)


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## leaddog (Nov 22, 2010)

Is this an open system boiler? Looking at the brochure it shows a water level indicater on top which makes me think it is an open system. If it is make sure you treat and test your water. It is a good looking unit. It will be interesting to see how they hold up. 
leaddog


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## rglazier65 (Nov 22, 2010)

yes the boiler is an open system .... and yes i did treat the water with the treatment that came with the boiler.
Question ? how do you test ?i assume one is testing ph ? but how do you do that ?


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## Dino57 (Nov 22, 2010)

Good to hear the unit is up and working as you wanted. Can you post some pics of your plumbing hookup. I am hooking up one as well.
Did the unit come with a plastic bottle to send away a sample for testing the chemical treatment of the water ?
What kind of wood are you using out there ?


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## mikefrommaine (Nov 22, 2010)

rglazier65 said:
			
		

> OK... The boiler made it in to its new room. This room is actually an old indoor pool that we recently filled in. I too will build it its own sealed off room, and will be able to utilize the old pool exhaust fan i suppose if this thing smokes while loading. The empire 100 does have a smoke curtain...hope it works, i am gona find out soon enough i guess. Anyway the chimney goes in tomorrow... will take closer pictures of the unit and final resting spot for all to see tomorrow....



I'm thinking the pool would have made a great storage tank -- just start heating it around August and you should be good for the winter by the holidays.


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## rglazier65 (Nov 23, 2010)

ya the pool would make a good sink .....  problem is it was a energy pig...  
i use bettle killed pine and birch. i seem to throw a couple large round pine in first ... then i some nice seasoned birch split that i plug it full with. What is great about this thing it takes quite a chunk of wood, it says 24 but a 28 will fit and a 12 inch diameter (one of) ... and it like it. loves the large rounds. I will post my piping but i have a uniquie situation. The house has two furnace rooms, one for the pool (which is now filled in and covered with cement), it has a geothermal heater that heats the slab, then a large house with another furnace room with yet another geothermal heater. So I had to connect the two furnace rooms and do the nessesary plumbing to make all this work. My plumber/pipe fitter was a friend who does theboiler work for our llocal school board... did a great job.  I do have one hicupand that was the sizing of my heat exchanger. I had for the pool a 125,000btu heatexchanger.... and thats what the boiler is rated for so i thought great .....  but it just wont exchange the heat fast enough to bring the house water above 140 dgrees. The boiler is set at 170 degrees and it idles quite a bit...  so i think i may need a bigger heat exchanger. what is someone elses experence ? do you need a larger than rated heat exchanger to do the job ?
Also no i did not get the complimentry water testing bottle.... damm ..  down to the dealer


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## ISeeDeadBTUs (Nov 23, 2010)

Part of your problem is . . .ya haven't posted enough pics yet  

Sorry, I'd be no help on the HX size questions.

But I do have some more questions for you . . .

You say you load it right up and get a 12 hour burn . . . Is that recommended by the manufacturer considering you have no storage?

WTH is the temps there *in real numbers* aka  °F 

Jimbo


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## rglazier65 (Nov 24, 2010)

ok > more pictures i get it..... ill work on that.
-30c thismorning equals -22F . 
not sure if 12 hour burn is ok or not with the manufacturer.... but thats what its doin. The manufacturer actually does not discuss storage as it is made to cycle. Would storage be better ? absolutely, I have 200 gallons now, but need to get another 800 i figure. But thatl be next summers worry. 

let me figure out more pictures for you guys


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## ISeeDeadBTUs (Dec 1, 2010)

Still successfully makin hot water?


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## rglazier65 (Dec 5, 2010)

Yep....still making hot water.

a couple things to report ....

the manual states target wood moisture content is 19%.  i was burning some seasoned bettle kiled pine and some dry kilned trim ends and it started to chirp and pop a little. Not so happy about this i phoned the factory, they asked me to load the stove with a more balanced aproach, some dry some not so dry. This solves the popping but goes against the common theory of dryer is better. Not sure if I like it or not, but knowing how i need to load it ....it now seems fine.

it gets a great long burn, i am quite impressed so far. i need a better water hx. What is a good quality hx i will be happy with ?

another question ? what do most use to clean the boiler tubes ... it came with a wirebrush dealy thingy.... but is there some thing better ... like on a drill or something ?

thats it


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## ISeeDeadBTUs (Dec 6, 2010)

I'm gettin a neckache lookin at yer pics . . . Make sure the ones of your wife loading the Empyre are right side up . . .ya don't want gravity doing anything strange ;-) 

I can't recall what you have for a HX. Why don't you like the one you have?

Also can't help you on cleaning since your unit is NOTHING like my GW. Hence my interest.


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## rglazier65 (Dec 7, 2010)

opps crap sorry about the photo's
get the lap top out  and is that the thing ... get the wife loading it ? wish me luck
i have a hx that says its rated for 125000 btu's ...but clearly it isnt as the unit cycles alot and i cant get my water storage (200 gallons only) above 135 degrees.
so i beleive  i need a better or more efficient exchanger.


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## ISeeDeadBTUs (Dec 7, 2010)

Sorry, Man! I know nothing about storage. But I'd assume if I had storage I'd want it a lot hotter than 135.

I use a 20-plate W2W HX.


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## flyboy01g (Dec 21, 2010)

Hi rglazier65,
     I've just purchased the same unit and the company suggested a 40 plate heat exchanger. 
I don't see why it couldn't heat 200gal more than 135deg. 
     I'll let you know how I make out.  I'm hoping to make a fire before Christmas. I'll try to 
send pictures.


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## rglazier65 (Jan 6, 2011)

hi firestarter ....  makin hot water yet ?


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## flyboy01g (Jan 6, 2011)

Hi rglazier,

Sorry I haven't gotten around to the pictures yet. I'll be forced to sooner or later. Things are still being finalized  
in my mech room. I've added an inverter with 12volt battery last night.   

      I've been fired up since December 28th. Making lot's of hot water. 14f outside last night and I've maintained
165deg. I have no water storage other than 40gal domestic indirect tank. I loaded the unit last night and a family
member forgot the front door of the house opened for a period of time and the house never got cold. The output ratings seem
quite conservative from my experience. If your boiler is cycling it must be meeting it own demand. If there's no feedback 
to the 200gal it doesn't know it's there. I would guess the pump/heat exchanger is not supplying enough to the storage tank. I don't know
the Btu rating of my heat exchanger but it's 40 plates. (think it's in the 200,000 range)
      I've learned a trick from my plumber to make instant DHW. I turn the on the pump that controls the loop on the 
DHW and presto super fast 40gal tank of hot water. I also notice how fast it draws down my "delta t" . I can remove
about 20 degrees of heat in about 30 seconds. Heating large storage tanks of water may be harder to do for the output this boiler has.
My rep/dealer knows of one client who heats a 500gal tank. I'll ask if he's has any feedback from him.
I plan to do some type of water storage in the future for DHW in the summer but have to do more research on the subject.
How many plates does your h/xchanger have? 
     I'm still learning how to burn but it's fun. 

Pyrol-assist


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## rglazier65 (Jan 7, 2011)

my heat exchanger is a pool type. no plates... a simple tank with a coil inside it circulating the boiler water. the 500 gallons storage tank guy would be interesting. i agree with you as this boiler is desighned to cycle so ... i spose what u would gain is a clean burn but this thing with my seasoned pine burns clean anyway. what is cool is i put a 28 inch long .... 14 inch diameter log in it when i got home, and the boiler loves it.
some problems i have had to date: handle to open the fire box door got so stiff from creosot that i could barely open the door...... solution wd40... makes it work like new. Door seal was leaking the first few weeks but has seemed to self heal ??? i like a boiler that self heals...

thats about it.... good to here from another dtove owner

rich


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## kuribo (Jan 7, 2011)

If it is burning clean, where is the creosote coming from?


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## rglazier65 (Jan 8, 2011)

ya that does sound confusing...
the burn chamber smolderes away and does its thing. there is a water jacket around that so it has some creoset. the smoke is forced into the gasification chamber underneath.... i have yet to clean the tubes as they look great.


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## flyboy01g (Jan 12, 2011)

Here's a couple of pictures:


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## rglazier65 (Jan 12, 2011)

very nice setup... looks great..
what type of wood do you burn it ? do you have the right length ?

rich


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## djblech (Jan 12, 2011)

How many SqFT are you heating? How often do you need to stoke fire? I just talked to a dealer in MN, he said Empyre is coming out with a 200 soon. He advised me to wait for that as I burn mostly birch, popple, and maple.
Doug


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## rglazier65 (Jan 13, 2011)

im heating 5000 sq ft in northern bc canada. the house is 35 years old but very well insulated. im loading it every 8 hours on average. a 200 would be great though. i wonder if the fire box would be even larger ? if it was me id wait to look at the 200. 

rich


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## 101x81 (Jan 13, 2011)

rglazier65 said:
			
		

> im heating 5000 sq ft in northern bc canada. the house is 35 years old but very well insulated. im loading it every 8 hours on average. a 200 would be great though. i wonder if the fire box would be even larger ? if it was me id wait to look at the 200.
> 
> rich



5000 sq ft, wow! do you have a full time maid


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## djblech (Jan 13, 2011)

Yes, the dealer said the firebox would be larger on the 200. Because I burn mostly birch, he was concerned that I would be stoking fire all the time with the 100. I have a GW 100 that is to small to heat my 2400 sqft with lots of windows. I was interested in the Empire because the dealer is close. 
Doug


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## rglazier65 (Jan 14, 2011)

after thinking about it for a day .... the extra btu's when needed would be great, exspecialy on a day like today. -30 degrees celcius.  for me its amount of wood u can put in a firebox and efficency. i want the longest burn time possible and this boiler is givin it to me..... but the 200 will be better.  i spose time will tell how tough this boiler will be.

rich


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## RickH (Jan 31, 2011)

Can you give us an update on how well the 100 is working? Hows your burn time? Any major issues?
Went and looked at a 100 versus a Pro 200 this weekend. What was your sqft again?
Thanks.


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