# It wasn't as cold as we thought!



## TradEddie (Apr 30, 2014)

NOAA finally got their website fixed up, and once again it becomes apparent that our memories are very selective. 5202 HDD for this region for the season to end of March. Ranked only 18th coldest of the last 100 years. The few dozen HDDs left in April/May are not likely to change that much.

https://www.ncdc.noaa.gov/cag/time-series/us

A good year for me to insulate my basement walls, and a good year to have truly well seasoned oak in stock, but overall, not as cold as we thought. We quickly forget how mild it was in December and early January, I was running in shorts and a t-shirt to work off my new-years hangover.

Well, the good news is that despite the outrageous cost of propane, my BTU/HDD/SQFT for propane was below 4.0 for the second year in a row, although if I add in the cord of firewood, it's 5.8. That's still a 20-30% reduction in propane use since moving in ten years ago. It's nice to see the benefits from all my insulation, window replacement and air-sealing work, and there's still more to be done.

TE


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## begreen (Apr 30, 2014)

That's still in the top 20% coldest. 2014 was the tenth coldest January for Michigan.


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## Slow1 (Apr 30, 2014)

Still looks like the coldest winter for us in the last 10 years if I'm reading the data correctly.  Cold enough for me


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## Circus (Apr 30, 2014)

Actually, heating wise, it wasn't so bad. The many arctic vortexes were always sunny.
As for frozen buried pipes, it was awful.


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## BrotherBart (Apr 30, 2014)

It was exactly as cold as I thought it was.


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## ihookem (Apr 30, 2014)

I burned about 10% more wood this winter than the year before, but it was a few degrees colder in the house,, but this year we hd hydronic heat, and that makes it seem warmer than it is. It was a lot colder here this winter than the winter before.


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## TradEddie (Apr 30, 2014)

ihookem said:


> I burned about 10% more wood this winter than the year before, but it was a few degrees colder in the house,, but this year we hd hydronic heat, and that makes it seem warmer than it is. It was a lot colder here this winter than the winter before.



Looking at the NOAA website, Wisconsin had the second-coldest Winter since 1914, and the forth coldest since records began, so for you it really was exceptionally cold. For us, there were a several weeks with almost every day reaching record lows, but the heating season as a whole was tempered by a mild early winter, and a relatively mid spring. "Top 20%" may sound cold, but statistically every five years should be in the "top 20%", your winter was a once in fifty years event (hopefully).

TE


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## woodgeek (May 1, 2014)

Meh.  Philly got a typical Boston winter this year, in terms of temp and snowfall, maybe a little over 5000 HDD and 70" of snow.

2003 was colder, 2007 had more snow.  Nice combination.

A good year to have the pro energy retrofit done preceding summer.  I am running about 5-6 BTU/sqft.HDD, versus 11-12 when I moved in in 2005.

OK, that icestorm Nika that caused Sandy-level tree damage, and killed power to >1 M people for several days.....let's not do that again.


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## velvetfoot (May 1, 2014)

I'm not getting into naming every storm that comes along.


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## velvetfoot (May 1, 2014)

Are degree days missing on that link?
Never mind, I read the fine print:  Please note, Degree Days are not available for Agricultural Belts, NWS Regions and Cities; Palmer Indices are not available for NWS Regions and Cities.


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## TradEddie (May 1, 2014)

velvetfoot said:


> Are degree days missing on that link?
> Never mind, I read the fine print:  Please note, Degree Days are not available for Agricultural Belts, NWS Regions and Cities; Palmer Indices are not available for NWS Regions and Cities.


You can get degree-days for your "climate division" within a state, but not for individual cities. Climate divisions are much smaller than NWS regions. Within a CD, the HDD is calculated based on multiple weather stations, but weighted for population density.

To get HDD available on the first box, you must have a CD selected, not a city.


TE


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## TradEddie (May 1, 2014)

woodgeek said:


> Meh.  Philly got a typical Boston winter this year, in terms of temp and snowfall, maybe a little over 5000 HDD and 70" of snow.
> 
> 2003 was colder, 2007 had more snow.  Nice combination.



Yes, our "extreme" winter was just an average for Boston, we're only about 100HDD behind them this year.

Where did you get that data? Is it specifically for Philly, I'd be curious to see how that differs from the NOAA CD data. I know the NOAA page I use isn't specifically for Philly, but taking the season as a whole, I don't see any combination of heating season that shows 2002/2003 to be anything close to being a cold winter, certainly not as cold as the winter we just had.

Your point about 2007 is also a good example of selective memory. It might be remembered as being a "cold" winter due to all the snow, however it was in fact a relatively mild winter, which is often that case for snowy winters; the warmer air holds more moisture leading to more snow.

TE


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## Slow1 (May 1, 2014)

If you want degree days for your town, try degreedays.net.  They pull their info from individual weather underground stations which are pretty much all over the place, likely you can find one very local to yourself.


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## woodgeek (May 1, 2014)

velvetfoot said:


> I'm not getting into naming every storm that comes along.



Agreed.  I only name storms that make my community a federal disaster area.


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## TradEddie (May 1, 2014)

I'd only bother to name them if I decide to sleep in the basement. Looking at all the ice damage the next day, I wished I had slept in the basement that night too, although we survived with almost negligible tree damage compared to almost everyone else nearby.

TE


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## velvetfoot (May 1, 2014)

Who's naming these non-hurricanes, anyway?  The Weather Channel? Nobody asked me.


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## BrotherBart (May 1, 2014)

The Weather Underground used to have a great radar site until The Weather Channel bought them and screwed it up. Thankfully the National Weather Service finally has a nice one in beta.

http://preview.weather.gov/edd/


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## Doug MacIVER (May 1, 2014)

BrotherBart said:


> The Weather Underground used to have a great radar site until The Weather Channel bought them and screwed it up. Thankfully the National Weather Service finally has a nice one in beta.
> 
> http://preview.weather.gov/edd/


take a look here http://weather.cod.edu/


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## WiscWoody (May 15, 2014)

I checked HDD's for my area from 10/15/2013 to 4/01/2014 and it was 9180. And we set a record for snowfall at 124". That explains why I see so many pole sheds destroyed this winter.


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## john193 (May 21, 2014)

We ended up burning 3 tons of pellets just like last season. I likely netted a delta of 0 because this year we installed electric radiant floor heating in the kitchen. With my open floor plan, it helped take some off the load of the pellet stove. My electric bills were only about 20/month higher than last year.


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## WiscWoody (May 25, 2014)

Speak for,yourselves, it was colder than usual up here! Our heating degree days for the season was over 9,800 and there is still ice on Lake Superior as of this morning. This winter did in many of the smaller pine trees where they had survived other winters. Too many 30 below and colder nights.


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## Doug MacIVER (May 25, 2014)

oh well?


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## WiscWoody (May 25, 2014)

Doug MacIVER said:


> oh well?


Oh yeah, my X  would be out sunning herself on a beach like that! We would be in California and we were the only ones on the beach, everyone else from the area were still wearing wind breakers! Lol


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## Bret Chase (May 26, 2014)

second coldest winter in the last 40 years in ME... according to NOAA.... seems about right... I remember the coldest... 2002.  that one really, really sucked, and I wasn't paying for heat at the time


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## maple1 (May 27, 2014)

What the heck is with all this 'was' stuff?

It's STILL bloody cold....


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## begreen (May 27, 2014)

All depends on where you're located. The Pacific coast is warm. Australia is having record warm fall temps. So much so that trees are reblooming and bearing fruit. It's driving the farmers nuts. These are the current temps in Sydney, going into winter there.


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## Doug MacIVER (Jun 2, 2014)

wasn't as warm as we thought. Houston chart, first time since 1970 didn't hit ninety there? have a day


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## Doug MacIVER (Jun 24, 2014)

begreen said:


> All depends on where you're located. The Pacific coast is warm. Australia is having record warm fall temps. So much so that trees are reblooming and bearing fruit. It's driving the farmers nuts. These are the current temps in Sydney, going into winter there.
> View attachment 133666


local weather changes http://www.news.com.au/travel/trave...the-megablizzard/story-e6frfqdr-1226963855196


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## Doug MacIVER (Jun 30, 2014)

on the other side of things http://dailycaller.com/2014/06/30/noaa-quietly-reinstates-july-1936-as-the-hottest-month-on-record/ 2012 wasn't as hot as we thought


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## BrotherBart (Jun 30, 2014)

Yeah I remember that summer in 36. Hot one.


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## Doug MacIVER (Jul 12, 2014)

begreen said:


> All depends on where you're located. The Pacific coast is warm. Australia is having record warm fall temps. So much so that trees are reblooming and bearing fruit. It's driving the farmers nuts. These are the current temps in Sydney, going into winter there.
> View attachment 133666


just a local temperature update  http://www.theaustralian.com.au/new...986116278?nk=9fe3cbf4f5bf37a6dc3f771dfd4654b8 and


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## WiscWoody (Jul 12, 2014)

You've  probably seen that our high for Monday will be around 55. I better got going on the stove cleaning! Last fall I started to burn wood on a regular basis in early October, it might be sooner this fall?


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## Doug MacIVER (Jul 12, 2014)

WiscWoody said:


> You've  probably seen that our high for Monday will be around 55. I better got going on the stove cleaning! Last fall I started to burn wood on a regular basis in early October, it might be sooner this fall?


watch out for those models?


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## Doug MacIVER (Jul 13, 2014)

so much for frost, they do call it "the desert southwest", or used too. can anybody say hot?


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## Doug MacIVER (Jul 13, 2014)

just for the fun of it?


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## begreen (Jul 13, 2014)

You need your own weather blog Doug.


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## Retired Guy (Jul 14, 2014)

velvetfoot said:


> Are degree days missing on that link?
> Never mind, I read the fine print:  Please note, Degree Days are not available for Agricultural Belts, NWS Regions and Cities; Palmer Indices are not available for NWS Regions and Cities.


You can get DD info for zip codes here.
http://www.weatherdatadepot.com/


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## WiscWoody (Jul 14, 2014)

And meanwhile up here in "Winter" Wisconsin our low tonight will be around 48 and 40! For tomorrow night. I've never had the stove going in July before but Wednesday morning might be my first!


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## Grisu (Jul 22, 2014)

Doug, just for you: *A double scorcher: June joins May with heat record *http://www.usatoday.com/story/weather/2014/07/21/june-record-heat/12943367/


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## Doug MacIVER (Jul 22, 2014)

hot it is, ncep( a noaa partner) had .58*c vs noaa .72. uah had.30*C. a lot of folks out there are looking for much warmer temps with a predicted el nino . so far that el nino is slow to get going . there are some new projections that it may barely reach moderate levels. to bad California needs the rain it would bring.

ncep had  warmer june temps in 2010 @.75* and 2012 @ .89*

noaa assumes the arctic and antarctic  react as the rest of the globe ,thus the gray area at the poles shown on their map. here is todays Danish site temp for the arctic


colder than norm since may. overall worldwide temp really still flat lining.


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## Doug MacIVER (Jul 22, 2014)

here is the ncep june output compared with noaa


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## begreen (Jul 22, 2014)

"The global temperature data for 2013 are now published. 2010 and 2005 remain the warmest years since records began in the 19th Century. 1998 ranks third in two records, and in the analysis of Cowtan & Way, which interpolates the data-poor region in the Arctic with a better method, 2013 is warmer than 1998 (even though 1998 was a record El Nino year, and 2013 was neutral)." - See more at: http://www.realclimate.org/index.php/archives/2014/01/global-temperature-2013/#sthash.wuizeFFE.dpuf

The boreal forests of the Northwest Territories must not have gotten this year's flatline news. 
http://www.climatecentral.org/news/nw-fires-weather-climate-change-boreal-forests-17778


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## granpajohn (Jul 24, 2014)

Get ready to do it again.
(de FirstHandWeather. Young mets who have a short-but-good track record)


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## Doug MacIVER (Jul 25, 2014)

granpajohn said:


> Get ready to do it again.
> (de FirstHandWeather. Young mets who have a short-but-good track record)
> 
> View attachment 135757


 garrett bastardi, son of joe bastardi involved with "first hand weather". something about the apple and the tree. going to follow dad to penn state I guess.


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## granpajohn (Jul 25, 2014)

Doug MacIVER said:


> garrett bastardi, son of joe bastardi involved with "first hand weather". something about the apple and the tree. going to follow dad to penn state I guess.


FHW is quite young, working on a shoestring, and often wrong... but worth following; I've found.
I thought GB was being recruited to play NCAA golf somewhere. Maybe he'll go to PSU anyway. 
I think his Grandfather was a weatherman too.


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## Doug MacIVER (Jul 25, 2014)

granpajohn said:


> FHW is quite young, working on a shoestring, and often wrong... but worth following; I've found.
> I thought GB was being recruited to play NCAA golf somewhere. Maybe he'll go to PSU anyway.
> I think his Grandfather was a weatherman too.


you got it. texas a&m ? as far as golf, like a lot of kids he has to show stronger in local tournaments, not just the scores report for your handicap. first your the big fish in h.s. and show up in state am. then place high in some invitaionals. go form there. think jb said latest interest was umiss.


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## Doug MacIVER (Jul 27, 2014)

ten minutes to five pm, 55*. any body need to raise some heat in the house?http://w1.weather.gov/data/obhistory/KSAW.html


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## begreen (Jul 28, 2014)

Local wearther is just that. It was 92 yesterday at a wedding we went to near Portland, OR.


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## jharkin (Jul 28, 2014)

And today we had the craziest downpours Ive seen in years and a confirmed tornado a couple miles north of Boston.


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## begreen (Jul 28, 2014)

Yes, sounds like it hit the Revere area. Hope all are ok. Lot's of pictures here:
http://www.bostonglobe.com/metro/20...ston-area/niu44DD0yg1PiTCbOsVyXL/picture.html


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## Doug MacIVER (Jul 29, 2014)

ef-2,lucky that it only was  on the ground for some 4 mins.. best story heard here, two guys stuck on roof and held on. somebody used up their St. Jude passes.


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## granpajohn (Jul 30, 2014)

I had 53f this morning (new record low). That is my 5th day this July reaching into the 50s. All records. BWI is the same:
https://www.facebook.com/pages/Justin-Berk-Meteorologist/54875673475

I know this is rather ho-hum to you northerners, but this is just amazing for us. The only way we get a cool July normally is if it rains all month. This summer has been mostly beautiful.

more from NWS  LWX:
.CLIMATE... CHILLY MORNING WITH A RECORD LOW OF 48 AT DULLES. THIS IS THE COOLEST MORNING LOW IN JULY SINCE JULY 12TH 2002. NOT TO BE OUTDONE...EVEN IN THE URBAN CENTER...THE MORNING LOW OF 60 AT REAGAN WAS THE COOLEST IN JULY SINCE THAT SAME DATE IN 2002. AT DULLES...WE ARE ON TRACK FOR THE COOLEST JULY SINCE 2001...AND THE YEAR-TO-DATE AVERAGE TEMPERATURE OF 51.5 DEGREES IS THE 5TH COOLEST ON RECORD /DATING BACK TO 1962/. AT BWI...A RECORD LOW WAS SET OF 55 DEGREES...THE COOLEST IN JULY SINCE JULY 3RD 2007.

If you're not familiar with the DC area, Reagan National has been a hotspot for years. Generally warmer than stations deep into VA and NC.

Notice the 2002 analog keeps popping up. Polish up them snow shovels.

Edit: Well, make it 6 days in the 50s. I had 58 this morning.
Appologies to the northerners for making this seem like a big deal, but.....well, it is. (You can mock us when we rave over a 20" snowfall too, I suppose.)


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## Doug MacIVER (Aug 29, 2014)

Doug MacIVER said:


> you got it. texas a&m ? as far as golf, like a lot of kids he has to show stronger in local tournaments, not just the scores report for your handicap. first your the big fish in h.s. and show up in state am. then place high in some invitaionals. go form there. think jb said latest interest was umiss.


well here is the high school domination http://www.centredaily.com/2014/08/29/4326432/boys-golf-st-josephs-bastardi.html


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## begreen (Sep 2, 2014)

Time to put this tired old thread to bed.


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