# 55 to 60 cc chainsaw opinions



## max384 (Sep 6, 2016)

Hey guys

I'm in the market for a new chainsaw. I currently have a Husqvarna 435, a craftsman 38 cc, and an electric pole trimmer. I love the Husqvarna, but it's lacking in the power department. It's probably ten years old or better, and has seen a lot of use, but is a great saw. It's just to too small for what I'm using it for. I hate the craftsman; it vibrates so bad that it's miserable to use... And is also underpowered.

I'll be using it to cut firewood, about two cords a year. Most of the wood I cut is red or white oak. The largest diameter trees are about 24" in diameter, most are 12-18". The 435 simply struggles too much with this job.

So I'm looking for a chainsaw in the 55 to 60 cc range. Since I already have a Husqvarna that I like, the 455 and 460 are on my list. I'm also looking at the Stihl MS 291 and MS 311. I recently was looking at the Echo CS 590. The Echo is very enticing, considering the price. The warranty is great, as are the features, and it has excellent user reviews online. But why is it so much cheaper than similar Husqvarna and Stihl offerings?

What are everyone's opinions? Is this size chainsaw appropriate for my intended use?

And I know I can get more saw for less money if I buy used, but I want a brand new saw. I'm comfortable wrenching on my own equipment, but quite frankly I don't enjoy it or have the time for it. 

Thanks in advance!


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## Jon1270 (Sep 7, 2016)

The 590 gets excellent reviews because it's a good value, priced like a homeowner model but built like a professional saw, with a vertically split magnesium crankcase and easily removable cylinder instead of the plastic chassis and clamshell motor used on what we call "homeowner" saws.  All of the other models you mentioned are of the latter type, though they're marketed as farm and ranch saws because they're larger than anything an average homeowner needs.  Saws built on plastic chassis are usually heavier than comparable professional-style saws.  They also tend to perform a little worse, and are often harder to work on.  The 590 enjoys some of the benefits of a pro-style saw, being more durable and easy to work on, but it's kinda heavy for the power it produces.  Despite its construction style, it doesn't perform like a real professional saw.

To get a similarly constructed machine from Stihl, you'd have to step up to the 261 or 362, which would out-perform the 590 but be a lot more expensive.  The Husqvarna analogues would be the 545, 550XP, 555 and 562XP.  Those are cheaper than the Stihls, but still significantly more expensive than the Echo.

Echos in general are positioned as a value brand, not the bestest machines ever but solid and reliable, at prices that are hard to argue with.  Stihl and Husqvarna own most of the market for premium saws, though they both offer cheaper models like the ones you mentioned.

In your position I would not consider any of the Stihl or Husqvarna models you mentioned.  The pro-model Stihls are probably outside your budget.  My list of candidates would be the 590, Husqvarna 555 and Dolmar 6100.  Given that most of the trees you cut are 12-18" I might even consider a Husky 545 or 550XP, but only if the 24" trees are fairly rare.  All of these Husky models (545, 550XP, 555) have self-adjusting carburetors that use an onboard computer to keep them in tune.


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## firefighterjake (Sep 7, 2016)

If you like Huskys another alternative may be their sister brand -- Jonsered. I recently bought the 2258 which is very similar to the Husky 555. I bought it to replace a quite old Husky 350 that was a real work horse, but was quite frankly ready to be fixed up (plus I was ready for just a bit more power.) Quite honestly, I liked my Huskqvarna and it owed me nothing . . . and so I looked pretty hard at that brand along with Jonsered.

I don't know if it would be the case with you, but I found the Jonsered prices were a tad lower than the Huskys.


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## max384 (Sep 7, 2016)

Jon1270 said:


> The 590 gets excellent reviews because it's a good value, priced like a homeowner model but built like a professional saw, with a vertically split magnesium crankcase and easily removable cylinder instead of the plastic chassis and clamshell motor used on what we call "homeowner" saws.  All of the other models you mentioned are of the latter type, though they're marketed as farm and ranch saws because they're larger than anything an average homeowner needs.  Saws built on plastic chassis are usually heavier than comparable professional-style saws.  They also tend to perform a little worse, and are often harder to work on.  The 590 enjoys some of the benefits of a pro-style saw, being more durable and easy to work on, but it's kinda heavy for the power it produces.  Despite its construction style, it doesn't perform like a real professional saw.
> 
> To get a similarly constructed machine from Stihl, you'd have to step up to the 261 or 362, which would out-perform the 590 but be a lot more expensive.  The Husqvarna analogues would be the 545, 550XP, 555 and 562XP.  Those are cheaper than the Stihls, but still significantly more expensive than the Echo.
> 
> ...



Thanks for your reply. Yes, trees in the 24" range are a rarity for me, but occasionally I'll tackle them (and what a pain with the 435). The 590 is seeming like the best option for the price so far.


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## max384 (Sep 7, 2016)

firefighterjake said:


> If you like Huskys another alternative may be their sister brand -- Jonsered. I recently bought the 2258 which is very similar to the Husky 555. I bought it to replace a quite old Husky 350 that was a real work horse, but was quite frankly ready to be fixed up (plus I was ready for just a bit more power.) Quite honestly, I liked my Huskqvarna and it owed me nothing . . . and so I looked pretty hard at that brand along with Jonsered.
> 
> I don't know if it would be the case with you, but I found the Jonsered prices were a tad lower than the Huskys.



I had seen the Jonsered brand saws at Tractor Supply Co. before, but hadn't heard if the brand, so I never paid much attention to them. I'll have to check out their offerings. Thanks.


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## TheAardvark (Sep 7, 2016)

I bought the Echo cs590. I love it.  Stihl and Husqvarna cant touch it for what you get with how little it costs compared to them.


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## woodhog73 (Sep 7, 2016)

If you need dealer support then I'd shop dealers over brand. 

I have no experience with echo but like the others have said, they are positioned as a value brand. Their blowers and trimmers are excellent so im sure their saws are darn good too.

For what your cutting I think a 60cc saw makes sense. Oak is hard dense wood and is harder on saws than other types of wood. A 60cc saw will make short work of oak in the size range of wood your looking at.

I only buy commercial grade pro saws because I use them a lot. I also find it easier to work on. But if your only cutting 2 cords a year I wouldn't rule out the farm and ranch models all together. They are targeted at someone who cuts probably the volume your looking at. 

If your buying a pro saw though, you can't go wrong with any brand really, Stihl, Husky, Jonsered, Echo , Dolmar, etc they are all well designed rugged saws. That's why I say shop dealer over brand especially if your not going to work on the saw yourself.


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## max384 (Sep 7, 2016)

TheAardvark said:


> I bought the Echo cs590. I love it.  Stihl and Husqvarna cant touch it for what you get with how little it costs compared to them.



That's good to hear. How long have you had it and how much have you cut? Any problems so far?


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## max384 (Sep 7, 2016)

woodhog73 said:


> If you need dealer support then I'd shop dealers over brand.
> 
> I have no experience with echo but like the others have said, they are positioned as a value brand. Their blowers and trimmers are excellent so im sure their saws are darn good too.
> 
> ...



Thanks for your reply. Good to know I'm on the right track size-wise for my next chainsaw. I'm all caught up on wood for the year, so I've got ask winter to shop around.

I plan to do the work myself... I'd just rather buy new this time. With the exception of my push mower and weedwacker, I've bought all of my gas operated toools and toys used, both chainsaws, riding mower, snow blower, many dirt bikes and motorcycles... And wrenching is part of buying used (and eventually new too, of course). But I'm at the point now that I'd rather buy new, and know exactly how it was used (or abused).


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## MaulMan (Sep 8, 2016)

I've got a Husqvarna rancher 455 and a few or six other saws.  I had acess to an echo 590 for a while a did some timed cuts and it blew the doors off of my Rancher 455.  Admittedly it wasn't a fair fight because the Husky is older, but the difference in performance was HUGE.
I also have an echo trimmer, pole saw, and backpack blower.   They've all been great tools.  Super reliable and powerful and lots of bang for the buck.  There's nothing wrong with Echo stuff at all.


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## drz1050 (Sep 8, 2016)

I have an Echo 590 with a 20" bar, have been very happy with it. With a sharp chain, I can bury the bar in oak and it keeps pulling. If the chain is dull, it logs a bit.


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## TheAardvark (Sep 9, 2016)

max384 said:


> That's good to hear. How long have you had it and how much have you cut? Any problems so far?



Ive only had it about 6 months so probably only a cord cut during this hot spring and summer.  My other saw is an Echo cs352. I have ran that little saw way harder than recommended and no problems with it either.


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## rowerwet (Sep 9, 2016)

I ran a husky 460,  and currently run an echo cs490 and 590. The 490 beats the doors of the husky, and the 590 spoiled me so bad I'm selling the 460.
The 490 revs high, but will bog with the 20" bar buried in a log, I use it for limbing. The 590 revs high and has serious guts, it is heavier,  but about the same as the 460.
From what I read,  the echo brand is older technology,  and needs to be tweaked when new, as they come extra lean from the factory to deal with EPA garbage.


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## mountainlake (Sep 9, 2016)

Get the Echo CS590, best buy out there by far. Open up the muff a little, just the deflector which has a peanut sized opening and make sure its not running lean.  With those 2 thing done it will cut really close to Husky and Stihl pro saws that cost a LOT more.  Steve


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## max384 (Sep 10, 2016)

Thanks for all the replies everyone. It's seeming like the Echo is the way to go for my budget


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## DodgyNomad (Sep 10, 2016)

Echo or Dolmar to save a few bucks.  Stihl if money is no object in that class.


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## woodhog73 (Sep 11, 2016)

DodgyNomad said:


> Stihl if money is no object in that class.



Opinions are all over the map.

To the original poster if money is no object in that class how about the Husky 562xp or sister company Jonsered 2260. Lighter than the Stihl ms362, more RPMs, and you actually get a metal handle bar instead of plastic. 

Just saying

All joking aside it's easy to buy more saw than you need. As I mentioned above in my honest opinion if your only cutting 2 cords a year, there's nothing wrong with a farm and ranch saw from any of the brands mentioned in this post. You save a ton of money and at 2 cords a year the saw will last a very long time if you take care of it.


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## Catfish Hunter (Sep 19, 2016)

I have a Dolmar 510 and 6100 - the 510 could cut two cords per year really well with the oak you are talking about. The 6100 would make real short work of the oak you described. Mine pulls a 20" bar really nice through oak. Price for these saws is really good. Also, some people are really liking the 421 Dolmar (I'm looking at one of these next...)

Have fun shopping!!


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## jetsam (Sep 19, 2016)

I asked the same question here. I had done a lot of research and narrowed it down to 55-60cc Stihl, Husky, and Echo saws.

After tons of helpful discussion I wound up buying a 64cc Dolmar, and I'm glad I didn't go smaller. (It's a great saw too, and as you can see in that other thread, used blue ones are regularly available at Home Depot tool rentals.)


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## Handsonautotech (Sep 19, 2016)

I have no experience with oak but I love my Sthil271. It starts like a charm and chews through everything i have thrown at it. It's easy to maintain also. Keeping your chain sharp is critical. One thing i have to admit is that my while i can start it every time after two or three pulls my wife always needs help getting it running.


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## Aranyic (Sep 20, 2016)

Figured I'd chime in I went through this last year and ended up with the CS590 and have not had any issues with it.  Running the 20" bar (have a 24" bar wrapped as a birthday present I'm not allowed to have for another month) as an option.  Won't get a whole lot of use but I wanted a second bar I could swap to if I got something stuck.  And this gave me a little more versatility; will probably rarely be used though.  

I'm 32 so I know that this won't be my last saw.  It's a little heavier than the stihl and husq for the same power but at this point in time I am willing to settle for more weight to spend less money.  10-15 years from now that will probably change and hopefully I'll be in a better position to spend more money on a saw once kids are out of the house, etc.


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## D8Chumley (Sep 25, 2016)

I'm a Stihl guy but bought the Echo 590 when my MS360 blew up (again). No regrets, but since CAD bit me it doesn't see as much use as it used to. As mentioned, open up the muffler and it rips. My .02


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## CTYank (Sep 29, 2016)

Good option to shop for factory-refurb non-pro Husqies: VMInnovations-dot-com
I've owned 455, now own a Dolly 6100. No comparison. The Dolly sings- peak power at 10K. Smooth, powerful, badass. Handles 24" effortlessly.
Yes, the 590 is a good-un, but the 6100 is a fun badass. Don't need no steenkin dealer. Or training wheels.


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## woodhog73 (Sep 29, 2016)

CTYank said:


> now own a Dolly 6100. No comparison. The Dolly sings- peak power at 10K



10,000 rpm seems way too low. Should be couple thousand rpm higher than that. Have you put a tach on it and tuned it ? If all your getting is 10,000 rpm your missing a good amount of power. Since that saw is non auto tune you can actually tune it and if it's seeing use in both winter and summer climates will have to tune it ( for optimal performance) so I'd double check your tuning. There's no way I'd ever be happy with that saw only spinning 10,000 rpm. 

My Jonsered 2166/2172 which is a 70cc pro saw I tune it to roughly 12,500 rpm. My ported 50cc pro saw spins dam near 15,000 rpm.

10k seems way low rpm for that saw. Older saws from 30 or 40 years ago that would sound about right but not on a modern pro 60cc saw.


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## Dairyman (Sep 30, 2016)

woodhog73 said:


> 10,000 rpm seems way too low. Should be couple thousand rpm higher than that. Have you put a tach on it and tuned it ? If all your getting is 10,000 rpm your missing a good amount of power. Since that saw is non auto tune you can actually tune it and if it's seeing use in both winter and summer climates will have to tune it ( for optimal performance) so I'd double check your tuning. There's no way I'd ever be happy with that saw only spinning 10,000 rpm.
> 
> My Jonsered 2166/2172 which is a 70cc pro saw I tune it to roughly 12,500 rpm. My ported 50cc pro saw spins dam near 15,000 rpm.
> 
> 10k seems way low rpm for that saw. Older saws from 30 or 40 years ago that would sound about right but not on a modern pro 60cc saw.




He said peak power. Which is @ 10,200 on your 2172 according to specs.


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## woodhog73 (Sep 30, 2016)

Dairyman said:


> He said peak power. Which is @ 10,200 on your 2172 according to specs.



Ok good point I was thinking wide open tuning unloaded. Still on my 2172 I tune it to 12,500 and it doesn't drop much in the cut. Certainly doesn't drop 2,000 rpm.

Just seems to me on a 6100 it should be making peak power higher than 10,000 rpm. But I'm not a saw builder or anything just my gut impression. I've run a 6100 a fair amount although I don't own one and haven't tuned one, but in the cut it seems to be running faster than 10k but who knows.


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## gerry100 (Sep 30, 2016)

Handsonautotech said:


> Keeping your chain sharp is critical



+++1

a sharp. chain on my Stihl 026 adds feels like added power, also decreases WOT time so a tank of fuel cuts more wood


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## CTYank (Oct 3, 2016)

woodhog73 said:


> 10,000 rpm seems way too low. Should be couple thousand rpm higher than that. Have you put a tach on it and tuned it ? If all your getting is 10,000 rpm your missing a good amount of power. Since that saw is non auto tune you can actually tune it and if it's seeing use in both winter and summer climates will have to tune it ( for optimal performance) so I'd double check your tuning. There's no way I'd ever be happy with that saw only spinning 10,000 rpm.
> 
> My Jonsered 2166/2172 which is a 70cc pro saw I tune it to roughly 12,500 rpm. My ported 50cc pro saw spins dam near 15,000 rpm.
> 
> 10k seems way low rpm for that saw. Older saws from 30 or 40 years ago that would sound about right but not on a modern pro 60cc saw.



That's not what I said: *peak *power at 10k. Peak power is where it's at, under load, not spinning wildly unloaded. And, IMO it's crazy to "tune" a saw with a tach, when what's important is the AFR @WOT under load. That really can't be checked/set with a tach, but an ear will do the job nicely. That makes it easy to check carb adjustment and adjust it to track atmospheric changes.

And my 576 peaks at 9600, which is plenty to get my juices flowing, spitting chips.

Spinning a recip way above the usable power-band puts large stresses on piston skirts, something I don't do, thanks. Longevity a big PLUS.


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## woodhog73 (Oct 4, 2016)

CTYank said:


> And, IMO it's crazy to "tune" a saw with a tach, when what's important is the AFR @WOT under load. That really can't be checked/set with a tach, but an ear will do the job



I guess it comes down to how good your ear is. I trust my ear when tuning to a certain degree but then I still use my tach. But I'll admit I don't always trust my ear. That's just me though.

But this is why I like my auto tune and mtronic saws. I've got a few older saws that don't have that technology and that's fine. But for me personally give me the auto tune any day of the week. Just this past weekend I was running my 2172 and it was fairly warm out. I thought it's just not what I remembered and sure enough I retuned it. Me mtronic saw just pulled the cord and it was perfect on the 1st cut.

Just my opinion


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## Jon1270 (Oct 4, 2016)

CTYank said:


> what's important is the AFR @WOT



I suspect I agree with this, but I'm not sure because I can't figure out what AFR stands for.


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## CTYank (Oct 5, 2016)

Jon1270 said:


> I suspect I agree with this, but I'm not sure because I can't figure out what AFR stands for.


Given that it's associated with carb adjustment/overall engine running, I thought it obvious: air/fuel ratio. Target: 12.5:1 mass ratio.


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## CTYank (Oct 5, 2016)

woodhog73 said:


> I guess it comes down to how good your ear is. I trust my ear when tuning to a certain degree but then I still use my tach. But I'll admit I don't always trust my ear. That's just me though.
> 
> But this is why I like my auto tune and mtronic saws. I've got a few older saws that don't have that technology and that's fine. But for me personally give me the auto tune any day of the week. Just this past weekend I was running my 2172 and it was fairly warm out. I thought it's just not what I remembered and sure enough I retuned it. Me mtronic saw just pulled the cord and it was perfect on the 1st cut.
> 
> Just my opinion


 I find it pretty easy to differentiate clean, single-note 2-stroking from the partial misfiring of "4-stroking". With non-AutoTune saws, if in doubt, or weather change, I'll routinely check carb adjustment, after a few cuts to warm things up properly, by lifting slightly in a cut. Takes a second or two to check things. Much preferable to melting some aluminum. Yes, I like the AutoTune on the 576, for the occasions where I get to use it on wood big enough to make it work. The engine covers just look funny, to me, with no access to adjust carb for mixture or idle speed. Great insurance policy!


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## woodhog73 (Oct 6, 2016)

My only fear with auto tune is if and when someday it decides it's tired of being accurate and incorrectly adjusts the fuel / air to the point of being lean enough to cause damage.

Hopefully I will be able to detect that and shut it down before hand. There's been a few times I've thought my auto tune Jonsered was running slightly lean but within a minute it seems to self adjust. The spark plug looks tan colored so I've assumed all is ok I guess.


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## Jon1270 (Oct 6, 2016)

Autotune devices certainly can and do fail at times, but statistically I bet they fail less often than human users.  Also, if an air leak develops and causes the saw to run so lean that it can't be adjusted out, Autotune has the potential to prevent engine damage by simply shutting the saw down completely.  Again, the computer is likely to be more vigilant than most operators.  There have been problems with air bags and antilock brakes, too, but they are exceptions that prove the rule.


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## VAfarmer38 (Oct 13, 2016)

I bought the CS-590 (Echo Timberwolf) about 2-3 years ago and haven't looked back.  I upgraded the bar to an Oregon Armor Tip (200ATMD176) and the chain I use is an Oregon Super 70 (72LPX070G).  I even went and bought the smaller CS-310 for light limbing work.  IMO, you cannot beat the price of the Timberwolf.  I also own a Stihl 025 but rarely use it anymore.


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## mcdougy (Oct 13, 2016)

I'm very happy with my bone stock Dolmar 6100 cutting the hard woods in this part of ontario.


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## CTYank (Oct 14, 2016)

mcdougy said:


> I'm very happy with my bone stock Dolmar 6100 cutting the hard woods in this part of ontario.


Ditto that. I just can't figure why some folks pay big bux to someone in a backyard workshop to tweak their saw(s) for more, especially with a saw like a 6100. That kind of power, measured in excess of 4.6 hp @ 600' elevation, and low-toxicity air in its vicinity, sure does it for me. IMO, there's a lot more to be said for durability than a "flash in the pan".
Have you tried a 24" bar yet? Mine sure seems happy with one, in any sort of wood. Where it can be put to good use, of course. Helps to be able to keep the engine under proper load/speed, without feathering throttle.


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## mcdougy (Oct 14, 2016)

CTYank said:


> Ditto that. I just can't figure why some folks pay big bux to someone in a backyard workshop to tweak their saw(s) for more, especially with a saw like a 6100. That kind of power, measured in excess of 4.6 hp @ 600' elevation, and low-toxicity air in its vicinity, sure does it for me. IMO, there's a lot more to be said for durability than a "flash in the pan".
> Have you tried a 24" bar yet? Mine sure seems happy with one, in any sort of wood. Where it can be put to good use, of course. Helps to be able to keep the engine under proper load/speed, without feathering throttle.




I have not tried a 24" bar. My saw is a bit unusual as it came from dealer with the .325 sprocket and chain on a 20" bar. I had never ran the .325 and was willing to try it out. The semi chisel works hard for a long time.....but I think I will buy a sprocket and 24" bar as well, because there is not many .325  24" bars that I have found. Do u have a bar that your liking on your saw?


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## MaintenanceMan (Oct 15, 2016)

VAfarmer38 said:


> I bought the CS-590 (Echo Timberwolf) about 2-3 years ago and haven't looked back.  I upgraded the bar to an Oregon Armor Tip (200ATMD176) and the chain I use is an Oregon Super 70 (72LPX070G).  I even went and bought the smaller CS-310 for light limbing work.  IMO, you cannot beat the price of the Timberwolf.  I also own a Stihl 025 but rarely use it anymore.



Same here. I got the CS590 a few years back and couldn't be happier. I did score a new Stihl 271, but have not touched a piece of wood with it yet.


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## Fishnuts2 (Oct 16, 2016)

I'll chime in with what most of the others have stated. 
Get the 590 and go cut wood like never before. You'll have a good 2 saw plan to tackle most anything you might come across. I'd recommend buying from a dealer that will tune it for you initially though unless you're skilled at it. There are quite a few tuning vids on YouTube with a 590 that you can follow. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## jetsam (Oct 17, 2016)

I don't think the dealer is going to bore out the muffler for you.

I don't know about the 590, but my little Echo limbing saw was a whole new machine with an unobstructed airway and a retuned carb.

(Screw a drywall screw into the limiter caps just until the threads bite, pull 'em out, shave the tabs off the sides of the caps, tune the saw, and put 'em back to help keep crud from getting in.)


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## Fishnuts2 (Oct 17, 2016)

I wasn't about to tell someone to drill the muffler on a new saw. He can figure that out for himself after doing a little research. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## CTYank (Oct 17, 2016)

mcdougy said:


> I have not tried a 24" bar. My saw is a bit unusual as it came from dealer with the .325 sprocket and chain on a 20" bar. I had never ran the .325 and was willing to try it out. The semi chisel works hard for a long time.....but I think I will buy a sprocket and 24" bar as well, because there is not many .325  24" bars that I have found. Do u have a bar that your liking on your saw?


 Yeah, that's one big plus with rim-drive. Different rim-sprocket and bar (nose-sprocket) and just mount the chain. To KISS with the various saws here, I stick with 3/8" and 3/8" LP. I run a 24" Oregon "Power-Match" bar on the 6100, which works just fine. I'm not looking for a few milligrams' weight saving on a bar. Good prices avail from Frawley's (Oregon) www.loggerchain.com or Bailey's- Frawley's is much quicker turnaround.
I'll second that motion re semi-chisel. Just got to wear out (slowly) a fistful of loops of full-chisel before I spin up some semi-chisel. Even in clean wood, I find I need to touch up a full-chisel chain (with Granberg clamp-on guide) every other fillup. Saves having the chain make the abrupt transition to dust-maker. Happy chips!


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## jetsam (Oct 19, 2016)

You only need to mod the muffler if you want more power out of the saw. It voids your warranty, and you could actually fry the motor if you just mod the muffler without tuning the carburator. (Any engine can run too hot if it's too lean, but a 2-stroke engine is getting less lubricant than it needs on top of being too hot, which is an unpleasant double whammy.)

My Echo was a good saw without modifications, too


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## Catfish Hunter (Jan 1, 2017)

I'd get a Dolmar 5105, this saw could easily handle your two cords of oak and make pretty good time of it. I guess it might be a blue saw by now (Makita). Otherwise if you don't like Dolmar perhaps the 550xp? I'm sure Stihl makes a good saw that size too. So many options, so little time...


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## max384 (Aug 28, 2017)

Thanks everyone for all of the replies.

I ended up deciding on the Echo CS-590. I just ordered it last week, and it will be delivered on Wednesday. I'm pretty excited to give it a try... and I'm behind on my firewood for the year (well for next year, as I have a 2 year rotation). I'll keep the thread updated on how I like it once I start cutting!


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## WoodyIsGoody (Aug 29, 2017)

woodhog73 said:


> Opinions are all over the map.
> 
> To the original poster if money is no object in that class how about the Husky 562xp or sister company Jonsered 2260. Lighter than the Stihl ms362, more RPMs, and you actually get a metal handle bar instead of plastic.



It might be counter-intuitive, but the plastic handle on the Stihl pro saws is higher performance than the metal handles that come on cheaper saws. It's fiber-reinforced and costs more to make than simply bending a metal pipe. It's lighter, absorbs more vibrations and doesn't transmit hot/cold as much as metal. The end result is you can cut more wood with less fatigue. I'm sure it could be broken but it wouldn't be easy to do.

I would never go back to metal handles. They're inferior. They exist because, especially at low saw volumes, it's prohibitively expensive to produce fiber reinforced plastic handles.


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## beatlefan (Aug 29, 2017)

I have a Husqvarna Rancher 455 that I've had for several years.  I also just bought an Echo CS-590 a couple months ago.  Both good saws, but I like the Echo better.


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## sportbikerider78 (Aug 29, 2017)

max384 said:


> Thanks everyone for all of the replies.
> 
> I ended up deciding on the Echo CS-590. I just ordered it last week, and it will be delivered on Wednesday. I'm pretty excited to give it a try... and I'm behind on my firewood for the year (well for next year, as I have a 2 year rotation). I'll keep the thread updated on how I like it once I start cutting!


I got one.  I love it.  

Between that and a cheap 14" Poulan for limbing...I have a good combo.


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## WoodyIsGoody (Aug 30, 2017)

Jon1270 said:


> Autotune devices certainly can and do fail at times, but statistically I bet they fail less often than human users.  Also, if an air leak develops and causes the saw to run so lean that it can't be adjusted out, Autotune has the potential to prevent engine damage by simply shutting the saw down completely.  Again, the computer is likely to be more vigilant than most operators.  There have been problems with air bags and antilock brakes, too, but they are exceptions that prove the rule.



Very good points. I'm not afraid of Auto-tune at all. It is a very simple and robust system that has been used successfully for many years. And, unlike the complex FI systems in cars, Auto-tune saws do not rely on sensors that can drift out of calibration or become fouled by exhaust gasses. It's a very simple rpm based system using a solid state timing sensor as the primary input. The big advantage of Auto-tune systems is that it can dynamically adjust not only the fuel mixture but also the timing advance.

This can give a 50cc saw the power of a 55cc-60cc saw while making it start effortless and idle perfectly. I still like my old school Stihl 026 but the M-tronic 261 C-M is the better saw in almost every respect. The 026 was the pinnacle of 50cc saws before Auto-tune in terms or durability, cutting power and robustness but I expect the 261 C-M to last longer due to it's ability to always be in tune regardless of fuel quality, temperature or altitude.

It doesn't adjust for altitude or fuel quality or temperature by measuring those things, it adjusts the same way a human would only it does it hundreds of times faster and can measure small changes in rpm much more accurately than your ear. It only takes itself a fraction of a second so it's constantly checking it's state of tune. It adjusts as wood chips build up on your air filter or the humidity changes and it has a much wider range of fueling adjustment than the mixture screws on my 20 year old 026 allow.  It will even adjust automatically for muffler/intake mods. Non-auto tune saws are rated for HP when tuned perfectly. An auto-tune saw is always in perfect tune.

At 4.0 HP and only 10.8 lbs., there's not a lot to dislike.


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## max384 (Aug 30, 2017)

The saw came in today. Didn't get a chance to use it, on account of getting home from work too late. Looking forward to doing some cutting tomorrow, or over the weekend at the latest!


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## WoodyIsGoody (Aug 30, 2017)

max384 said:


> The saw came in today. Didn't get a chance to use it, on account of getting home from work too late. Looking forward to doing some cutting tomorrow, or over the weekend at the latest!



OK, get that puppy dirty!

Are you going to upgrade the bar/chain?


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## max384 (Aug 31, 2017)

WoodyIsGoody said:


> OK, get that puppy dirty!
> 
> Are you going to upgrade the bar/chain?



I'm happy with the 20" bar. I don't foresee a need to go any bigger or smaller. I may get a different chain if I'm not happy with how the stock one cuts, but I'm not really planning on upgrading anything just yet.


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## sportbikerider78 (Aug 31, 2017)

I tune my dirtbike with a laptop..and I love that.


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## bfast250 (Aug 31, 2017)

Check the tune. I read a ton of folks saying Echos come a bit lean.


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## max384 (Sep 4, 2017)

I finally got to use the 590 today. I went into the woods and cut about a cord or so of oak into rounds. I'm VERY happy with it. It's amazing how much faster it is than my Husqvarna 435 (duh!). It just chewed through that oak like butter. Very happy with my purchase so far!


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## Tar12 (Sep 4, 2017)

What gauge of chain are you running on that saw?


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## max384 (Sep 4, 2017)

Tar12 said:


> What gauge of chain are you running on that saw?



Stock chain. 0.050" gauge, 3/8" pitch.


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## Tar12 (Sep 4, 2017)

max384 said:


> Stock chain. 0.050" gauge, 3/8" pitch.


Thats a very good combo! I wasn't sure as I am not familiar with the Echo saws but I am very familiar with that chain and run nothing but full chisel on all of my saws...try one and you will be very impressed with the performance of a full chisel chain.


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## max384 (Sep 18, 2017)

Not happy.

On my third time using this saw, over the weekend, it wouldn't start for me. Followed regular starting procedure as recommended in the manual. Air filter was clean, pulled the spark plug, and it was wet, so it was getting fuel. I know it was getting spark because it ran for a couple of seconds. I pulled and pulled and pulled, and after I was drenched in sweat and ready to throw the saw, it finally started up, and ran beautifully. This is NOT what I expect from a new saw purchase, used two times previously...


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## WoodyIsGoody (Sep 18, 2017)

Sorry to hear that. Was it a cold or hot start?


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## TreePointer (Sep 18, 2017)

max384 said:


> Not happy.
> 
> On my third time using this saw, over the weekend, it wouldn't start for me. Followed regular starting procedure as recommended in the manual. Air filter was clean, pulled the spark plug, and it was wet, so it was getting fuel. I know it was getting spark because it ran for a couple of seconds. I pulled and pulled and pulled, and after I was drenched in sweat and ready to throw the saw, it finally started up, and ran beautifully. This is NOT what I expect from a new saw purchase, used two times previously...



Sounds like it needs a proper tuning.


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## blades (Sep 19, 2017)

Plug wet - flooded- takes quite a bit the clear it out.  Particularly with with automatic chokes


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## sportbikerider78 (Sep 19, 2017)

max384 said:


> Not happy.
> 
> On my third time using this saw, over the weekend, it wouldn't start for me. Followed regular starting procedure as recommended in the manual. Air filter was clean, pulled the spark plug, and it was wet, so it was getting fuel. I know it was getting spark because it ran for a couple of seconds. I pulled and pulled and pulled, and after I was drenched in sweat and ready to throw the saw, it finally started up, and ran beautifully. This is NOT what I expect from a new saw purchase, used two times previously...


If the plug was wet, it will be a really hard start on any saw.

Since you already took the plug out, hit it with starter/brake fluid to dust it off and it will fire right up.  Unless something else is amiss.

I don't follow any standard procedure because I'm a know-it-all engineer and I know better!    I see what works for each saw and do what works.  I find each saw is a bit different, even from same make and model.  Just like cars, trucks and motorcycles.

I hit the bulb a few times.  Pull the choke all the way out.  If that doesn't immediately fire it up, I half choke or cut the choke and that works.  That's sort of my "go-to" procedure for anything.  Flooding is the worst so I err on the side of not flooding it. 

My first echo...2 pushes on the bulb.  Full choke, 2 pulls.   No choke 1 pull.  Every time.

Oh....I like your bar!


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## WoodyIsGoody (Sep 19, 2017)

sportbikerider78 said:


> I hit the bulb a few times.  Pull the choke all the way out.  If that doesn't immediately fire it up, I half choke or cut the choke and that works.  That's sort of my "go-to" procedure for anything.  Flooding is the worst so I err on the side of not flooding it.



Good advice. Works on most anything. If it doesn't start, you can always re-apply the choke, no harm, no foul.


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## TreePointer (Sep 19, 2017)

That's very similar to the procedure I use on a Stilh MS-361.  On full choke, the initial pop is sometimes difficult to detect, so I learned never to pull more than 3 times on full choke.  After I move the switch to "fast idle," if it doesn't start after a couple of pulls, I move it to RUN and pull to prevent flooding.

When I first started using it, I flooded it a lot before I learned what it liked.  I never did have to pull the plug after flooding, though.  I moved the control switch to RUN and the flood would clear within 10 pulls.


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## max384 (Oct 24, 2017)

Sorry for the long time between updates, but I don't log in here regularly. Anyhow, I adjusted my starting procedure just a tad, and everything seems to be working just fine. A little finicky to start up... Not nearly as easy as my Husqvarna... But something I can live with.


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