# Saving money on electric bill



## Wisneaky (Nov 25, 2015)

I was able to cut my electric bill down to almost 1/3 of what it was last year. $58 vs $151 for the same time last year. It feels good to save money. Here are some things I did. Changed out all cfl bulbs to led bulbs. Unplugged all unnecessary appliances. This includes unplugging the laptop and printer when not in use. Turned off the breaker to the central air unit which made a big difference. Also changed electric water heater and electric stove to gas appliances. It just amazes me how much money can be saved by unplugging things.


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## jb6l6gc (Nov 25, 2015)

Why would shutting the breaker off to the central air unit do anything if my thermostat is off?


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## Where2 (Nov 25, 2015)

jb6l6gc said:


> Why would shutting the breaker off to the central air unit do anything if my thermostat is off?


Potentially because there is a 24v transformer running the automation electronics behind the thermostat whether the unit is set to "ON" or "OFF" possibly?

Some people find their door bell transformers draw more than they like... I just don't have a doorbell.


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## Husky (Nov 25, 2015)

jb6l6gc said:


> Why would shutting the breaker off to the central air unit do anything if my thermostat is off?


I'm wondering the same thing. Please let us know.


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## Wisneaky (Nov 25, 2015)

jb6l6gc said:


> Why would shutting the breaker off to the central air unit do anything if my thermostat is off?


I found out that some of them like mine have heaters in them to keep them warm. If I remember right I think someone said it heats an oil in them.


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## Wisneaky (Nov 25, 2015)

Turning it off was about 280 watts an hour.


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## jb6l6gc (Nov 25, 2015)

Really hmm. May have to shut that off and disconnect doorbell I'm all about saving hydro if I can. The rates here are absurd


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## BrotherBart (Nov 25, 2015)

Only comparative if you now add the gas and the electric bill together.


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## iamlucky13 (Nov 25, 2015)

BrotherBart said:


> Only comparative if you now add the gas and the electric bill together.



True, but assuming the gas costs $1.50 per therm, heat from natural gas costs the equivalent of $0.05/kWh, so probably about 1/3 what he was paying to heat his water electrically.


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## BrotherBart (Nov 25, 2015)

Only way to know is add'em together. And notice how mild November was compared to last year on that bill. A season's bills tell the true tale.


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## jb6l6gc (Nov 25, 2015)

I have no gas


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## jb6l6gc (Nov 25, 2015)

No water just electricity and wood


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## Wisneaky (Nov 25, 2015)

BrotherBart said:


> Only comparative if you now add the gas and the electric bill together.


Not even close when LP is only .98 a gallon.

Edited...I read you comment wrong. I thought you meant it was comparative. It's kind of hard for me to tell this month, so I'll track it next month. I know since I last had a fill on my LP tank I've used 1.5 gallons a day. For the last month or so though I've been running the LP furnace daily. With LP being so cheap I'm going to save my wood this season.


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## woodgeek (Nov 26, 2015)

Great job.  Nice catch on the AC heater.  

But the efficiency of ng and propane HWHs is much lower than electric.  The flue can also pull conditioned air 24/7.

What is the EF on the unit?


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## jb6l6gc (Nov 26, 2015)

just talked to master electrician at work. He also recommends shutting off ac circuit not only for the heater draw which he said is minimal but also because he says it attracts mice in the winter. One thing he did say was when you turn it back on leave the circuit on for at least 24hrs before first use


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## velvetfoot (Nov 26, 2015)

423 kw-hrs/month is good, I guess, but maybe nothing to brag about.


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## Wisneaky (Nov 26, 2015)

velvetfoot said:


> 423 kw-hrs/month is good, I guess, but maybe nothing to brag about.


Maybe I should mention I have a family of 6 people.


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## velvetfoot (Nov 26, 2015)

Well, there ya go!  
How are you cooking your turkey this year?


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## semipro (Nov 26, 2015)

Where2 said:


> Some people find their door bell transformers draw more than they like... I just don't have a doorbell.


This has always bothered me.  I found a reference online to the doorbell transformer and button lights using 4 watts.  A quick calculation shows that over my house's 30 year life-span about 1,000 kwh or $100 has been spent on a door bell that never gets used  (gravel driveways and dogs negate the need). 
Trouble is, I can't find the transformer for our door bell.  It must hidden somewhere between floors or such.


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## velvetfoot (Nov 26, 2015)

What bugs me is the money one has to pay just for the privilege of being hooked up to the grid.


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## Husky (Nov 26, 2015)

semipro said:


> This has always bothered me.  I found a reference online to the doorbell transformer and button lights using 4 watts.  A quick calculation shows that over my house's 30 year life-span about 1,000 kwh or $100 has been spent on a door bell that never gets used  (gravel driveways and dogs negate the need).
> Trouble is, I can't find the transformer for our door bell.  It must hidden somewhere between floors or such.


Check right behind door bell. Sometimes they put it where you wouldn't expect.


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## Wisneaky (Nov 26, 2015)

velvetfoot said:


> What bugs me is the money one has to pay just for the privilege of being hooked up to the grid.


Yes I agree. I pay $8 a month plus 8.5% in taxes and fees on top of what I use. They are trying to raise the $8 connection fee to $18 which sounds like it is going to be approved. They want people to save electricity, but when it cuts into their profits they start tacking on other fees.


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## velvetfoot (Nov 26, 2015)

I just looked at an old bill.  We pay $15.11.


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## Wisneaky (Nov 26, 2015)

woodgeek said:


> Great job.  Nice catch on the AC heater.
> 
> But the efficiency of ng and propane HWHs is much lower than electric.  The flue can also pull conditioned air 24/7.
> 
> What is the EF on the unit?


I'm out of town for the week, but I'll check when I get back home. I know when I first hooked up the gas water heater and stove I was using about 1 gallons a day between them and the gas dryer without the LP furnace running. I know it's a power vent water heater and it can completely heat a cold tank to 140 degrees in 20 minutes.


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## Husky (Nov 26, 2015)

Wisneaky said:


> Yes I agree. I pay $8 a month plus 8.5% in taxes and fees on top of what I use. They are trying to raise the $8 connection fee to $18 which sounds like it is going to be approved. They want people to save electricity, but when it cuts into their profits they start tacking on other fees.


If your not ahead of the curve on making efficiency savings then you end up paying as others jump on the band wagon before you. This is a double edge sword though. If you start early then the things you do always end up costing more then if you wait for the technology to be developed and become cheaper. If you wait to long then other have taken advantage and cause the electric companies to begin to lose revenue and the fee start in to make up for that revenue. You really need to think long term and get ahead of that curve. I am just as guilty as the next person and wait to long.


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## laynes69 (Nov 26, 2015)

Lp is cheap now, but with supply and demand can skyrocket. We bought a new tank this year and paid $.99 a gallon, but 3 years ago we paid $2.99 a gallon. Eventually I want to replace our water heater with a hybrid. Our electric bill is high with all the energy hogs in the home. Old appliances, pool, old well pump and security lights are a few of our problems. Eventually I will phase things out, bit it's going to cost some money.


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## velvetfoot (Nov 26, 2015)

I have no idea of the latest in well pump technology.  I've heard in the past about soft start motors to cut inrush current.

My current pet peeve is outside lights left on in the middle of the day.  I'm not sure why people leave their porch lights on constantly, even when they're home.


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## Wisneaky (Nov 26, 2015)

velvetfoot said:


> I have no idea of the latest in well pump technology.  I've heard in the past about soft start motors to cut inrush current.
> 
> My current pet peeve is outside lights left on in the middle of the day.  I'm not sure why people leave their porch lights on constantly, even when they're home.


We actually keep ours on. We just have a bad habit of forgetting to turn it off. It's an led bulb also, but any little savings would help. I keep saying I'm going to hook it up to one of those timers. Next time I'm at menards I'll get one.


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## laynes69 (Nov 26, 2015)

We have a 20 year old deep well jet pump. It takes some time to build pressure so it runs quite a bit. I believe it's either a 3/4 or 1hp motor. The plan is to replace with a submersible pump and do away with the well pit. Our security lights aren't on our meter, but they charge a flat 9 dollar fee for each a month. Currently we are consuming around 1200 kwh a month. What I don't understand however, our elderly neighbors are paying more for 2 people than we are for a family of 5.


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## Wisneaky (Nov 26, 2015)

laynes69 said:


> Lp is cheap now, but with supply and demand can skyrocket. We bought a new tank this year and paid $.99 a gallon, but 3 years ago we paid $2.99 a gallon. Eventually I want to replace our water heater with a hybrid. Our electric bill is high with all the energy hogs in the home. Old appliances, pool, old well pump and security lights are a few of our problems. Eventually I will phase things out, bit it's going to cost some money.


The next thing I'd like to get in a new fridge. Ours is older. But fridges cost so much money. I often wonder if the savings would justify the expense.


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## velvetfoot (Nov 26, 2015)

Wisneaky said:


> I'm going to hook it up to one of those timers.


Why not a photocell instead?


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## BrotherBart (Nov 26, 2015)

Wisneaky said:


> The next thing I'd like to get in a new fridge. Ours is older. But fridges cost so much money. I often wonder if the savings would justify the expense.



Mine sure did. I don't remember what I measured the current consumption on the old one at but the new one dropped it to 118 watts and half the watts in the defrost cycle of the old one.


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## Wisneaky (Nov 26, 2015)

velvetfoot said:


> Why not a photocell instead?


The light is a covered porch so I'm not sure if it would work. It might stay on all the time.


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## brenndatomu (Nov 26, 2015)

Wisneaky said:


> The next thing I'd like to get in a new fridge. Ours is older. But fridges cost so much money. I often wonder if the savings would justify the expense.


A few years back I switched from a 1961 Frigidaire to a new Whirlpool, relatively the same fridge (size and style) there was actually very little difference in electric usage. (as monitored by a Kill-A-Watt)
But I don't buy brand new appliances anymore, there are too many deals to be had on CL. Not hard to find 1-2 YO stuff like new condition for 1/4 (or less) of new. We recently snagged a 2 YO 22(ish) CF french door fridge with bottom freezer drawer for $265...like new condition, works great


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## velvetfoot (Nov 26, 2015)

Wisneaky said:


> The light is a covered porch so I'm not sure if it would work. It might stay on all the time.


I think some of the timers that replace a light switch can also compensate for the shortening and lengthening days.


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## Wisneaky (Nov 26, 2015)

velvetfoot said:


> I think some of the timers that replace a light switch can also compensate for the shortening and lengthening days.


I had one installed on outside garage lights in a place I rented a few years back. I should of pulled it when I moved because I paid for it and I didn't even think about it at the time. I think it was a pretty spendy switch.


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## jb6l6gc (Nov 26, 2015)

semipro said:


> This has always bothered me.  I found a reference online to the doorbell transformer and button lights using 4 watts.  A quick calculation shows that over my house's 30 year life-span about 1,000 kwh or $100 has been spent on a door bell that never gets used  (gravel driveways and dogs negate the need).
> Trouble is, I can't find the transformer for our door bell.  It must hidden somewhere between floors or such.


lol mines in the basment wired on top of a light gonna disconnect that crap


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## Former Farmer (Nov 26, 2015)

velvetfoot said:


> Why not a photocell instead?



I have our soffit recessed lights on a timer and a photocell.  They turn on at dusk, off at 10:00pm, on at 5:00am, and off at dawn.  Saves having the lights on an extra 7 hours per day.


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## semipro (Nov 26, 2015)

Wisneaky said:


> The next thing I'd like to get in a new fridge. Ours is older. But fridges cost so much money. I often wonder if the savings would justify the expense.


Check here: https://www.energystar.gov/index.cfm?fuseaction=refrig.calculator 
The answer might surprise you.


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## BrotherBart (Nov 26, 2015)

For sure. The difference in the electric bill after buying the cheapest same size fridge after my 1985 one crapped out was amazing.


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## williaty (Nov 27, 2015)

Man, I'd love to get our usage down to what you guys are seeing. Just 2 of us in a 1400sqf house, all electric, yet we're always 1,100-1,500 kWh/month  That's all electric appliances, with only LEDs, etc, etc.


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## DBoon (Nov 27, 2015)

williaty said:


> Just 2 of us in a 1400sqf house, all electric, yet we're always 1,100-1,500 kWh/month  That's all electric appliances, with only LEDs, etc, etc.


Hi Williaty, a goal of 500-600 kWh is possible for you.  We are also just a two person household, all electric (except for space heating, which is oil), and we manage 400-550 kWh/month, depending on the season (more in the winter).  We have a HPWH, low flow everything, front loading washer, new refrigerator, chest freezer, LEDs/CFLs, radon mitigation fan, and optimized pumps for the hydronic heating system, but no air-conditioning.  My wife cooks and bakes a lot, so no relief there.  We are very diligent at eliminating phantom loads, but otherwise not nutty about consumption reduction and don't feel that we deprive ourselves.


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## FXRrider (Nov 29, 2015)

Been trying to get mine down for awhile now. We had our lowest bill since the spring, 880KHW, $171.00 and that is with the HVAC system running very little. Our winter time bill is usually as high or higher than the summer and we have a LP furnace.  Our minimum bill is $56, for just electric. I have got our average KWH usage down from 1700 to 1400 over the last 4 years.


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## Deezl Smoke (Nov 29, 2015)

This is a great thread. Very eye opening for me. I probably should resist participating as I am new here and have no history for you to know what direction I come from. However I will try to state up front that I am only a family of one, and in a very small, 915 sq/ft old run down shack. So I am in no way trying to point fingers or any sort of negativity toward anyone elses situation. Please note that.

 After reading the replies so far, I decided to go look at my highest month electricity usage so far. Again, only myself and the dog reside here so.... But it was 32 days of service at 255 kw/hr. This is what really amazed me after viewing some of your usages. Again, sorry to beat that horse, but I do understand many here are larger families etc. Not comparing for any other reason than my own curiosity. I really did not know how much it might take for a larger dwelling and to support a family. I feel quite lucky to be getting by on what I do.

 I have no door bells, but I did not know that they might draw power when on standby. So thanks for that info. Learned something new today.

 I do have a "kill a watt" meter, but so far have not used it but on the coffee pot and a couple out door items. I think I best use it to see how much my desk top draws when not in use.

 My pellet stoves are rated at about 450 watts start up and about 70 watt usage when running. I should confirm that with the meter and see how close they are. 

 I have all led light bulbs, including the motion flood at the entry door. Perhaps I can replace that setup with a lower draw system of some kind? I had the chance to go with an on demand water heater about 6-7 months ago and I should have done so, but chickened out and just replaced it with a high efficiency electric. But I did lower the gallon size since it is only myself here. Still, may have to see if I can sell it and go with the on demand. I can adjust my usage of hot water timing with simple daily life style changes if I can save some energy.

 Does solar fit in this thread anywhere? Or should that be a thread on it's own?

 Thanks.
 Don.


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## williaty (Nov 29, 2015)

Solar (or any alt-e) should be the last thing you look at. You save more dollars per dollar spent by conservation. Generation is very expensive in comparison. Plus, if you conserve first, then the size/cost of the solar system you need is MUCH smaller.


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## Where2 (Nov 29, 2015)

williaty said:


> Solar (or any alt-e) should be the last thing you look at. You save more dollars per dollar spent by conservation. Generation is very expensive in comparison. Plus, if you conserve first, then the size/cost of the solar system you need is MUCH smaller.


^^^^ Exactly! (and I've got a 4.4kW solar array on my roof). I'm in the midst of putting my TED 5003 (and it's little brother the TED 1001) back in service today. It's like a whole house Kill-A-Watt which installs in the breaker panel.


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## maple1 (Nov 30, 2015)

Deezl Smoke said:


> This is a great thread. Very eye opening for me. I probably should resist participating as I am new here and have no history for you to know what direction I come from. However I will try to state up front that I am only a family of one, and in a very small, 915 sq/ft old run down shack. So I am in no way trying to point fingers or any sort of negativity toward anyone elses situation. Please note that.
> 
> After reading the replies so far, I decided to go look at my highest month electricity usage so far. Again, only myself and the dog reside here so.... But it was 32 days of service at 255 kw/hr. This is what really amazed me after viewing some of your usages. Again, sorry to beat that horse, but I do understand many here are larger families etc. Not comparing for any other reason than my own curiosity. I really did not know how much it might take for a larger dwelling and to support a family. I feel quite lucky to be getting by on what I do.
> 
> ...


 
I'm not so sure an on-demand is the way to go. We have an 80 gallon conventional electric water heater, it only costs around $20/mo (@ 0.18/kwh) to run for our family (which varies between 3 & 5 now). Just make sure your tank is well insulated & you have heat traps plumbed in. Ours supposedly came with traps built in to the inlets, but I plumbed others in anyway, and it also now has 4" of fiberglass around it.

Did you price how much an on-demand costs? Installed? They usually require very big breakers & wiring, for starters. Unless you meant gas.


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## mass_burner (Nov 30, 2015)

BrotherBart said:


> Only comparative if you now add the gas and the electric bill together.



And all other costs/break even period included.


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## mass_burner (Nov 30, 2015)

semipro said:


> This has always bothered me.  I found a reference online to the doorbell transformer and button lights using 4 watts.  A quick calculation shows that over my house's 30 year life-span about 1,000 kwh or $100 has been spent on a door bell that never gets used  (gravel driveways and dogs negate the need).
> Trouble is, I can't find the transformer for our door bell.  It must hidden somewhere between floors or such.


Ha, I found my transformer by accident while doing my basement re wire project. It was in the joist bay in the same area where most of the outdoor wiring leaves the house.

Do they make an updated efficient model?


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## semipro (Nov 30, 2015)

mass_burner said:


> Ha, I found my transformer by accident while doing my basement re wire project. It was in the joist bay in the same area where most of the outdoor wiring leaves the house.
> Do they make an updated efficient model?


I'm sure they do but since I don't need one I really haven't looked into it.  
This guy apparently replaced the standard transformer with some sort of switching supply.  http://www.johnsavesenergy.com/PhantomPower2.html#.VlxNq7-Vm62 
BTW, the site referenced above would probably interest most of you on this thread.


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## EatenByLimestone (Dec 6, 2015)

Wisneaky said:


> The next thing I'd like to get in a new fridge. Ours is older. But fridges cost so much money. I often wonder if the savings would justify the expense.


Swapping my Montgomery Wards branded fridge to a new Frigidaire cut me from 90 kWh a month to between 30 and 40.  I can't remember exactly, but I think upper 30s.  I really think the savings is the improvement in life that it brings.  There is a LED light on each side which brightens it up so much more than the old fridge.  I also like the large shelves on the door.  It paying for itself quickly was just a bonus.


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## English BoB (Dec 7, 2015)

mass_burner said:


> Ha, I found my transformer by accident while doing my basement re wire project. It was in the joist bay in the same area where most of the outdoor wiring leaves the house.
> 
> Do they make an updated efficient model?



Its called a door knocker.

bob


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## blades (Dec 8, 2015)

I will have try the disconnect on the ac unit to see if that helps some, I am  at around 194 kw for this time of year. just me and 2 dogs in a 60's 2k sq ft  house.  Note on Power vent units. My particular hw unit did not have a back draft damper on the exhaust- that let a lot of cold air constantly blowing into the basement and down the central flue of gas hw unit. I installed a back draft damper and it made a see able difference on the gas bill which is also very miminal. Refridge and Oven are electric everything else is ng. Seldom use oven- so main draws are likly ref. and old school tube TV.  I have a LCD unit but not hooked up or plugged in at present. read that some of these new flat screens can add a fair size load?


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## English BoB (Dec 8, 2015)

Biggest item that dropped my bill was the clothes dryer. Have only used it for emergencies in the last 2.5 years. Dry outside in the summer or when weather permits and during the winter in front of the wood stove. Ran a clothes line on the porch to help out.
Next was the washing machine - set to cold wash and rinse.
Then change all the light bulbs to curly style.
My average budget payment is $56 - currently running $10 less.

PS....why is that light on behind you ?????

bob


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## mass_burner (Dec 9, 2015)

English BoB said:


> Its called a door knocker.
> 
> bob


Right, huh. I have 3 entry doors with push buttons I just replaced, wiring is still in place.


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## EatenByLimestone (Dec 9, 2015)

The fridge was pretty big for me also.  I replaced that and the stove (gas now) and I'm 100 kwh lighter/month.


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## seige101 (Dec 9, 2015)

blades said:


> I have a LCD unit but not hooked up or plugged in at present. read that some of these new flat screens can add a fair size load?




It is much more efficient than running an older tube tv


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## brenndatomu (Dec 9, 2015)

I jut saw on the news that the new "smart" TVs are hogs though...


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## blades (Dec 10, 2015)

brenndatomu said:


> I jut saw on the news that the new "smart" TVs are hogs though...


What I have  sony lcd unit from a few years back-  Heard/read about some other, irritating to me, habits of those units.


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## begreen (Dec 14, 2015)

brenndatomu said:


> I jut saw on the news that the new "smart" TVs are hogs though...


Some are. It depends on the features and how they're implemented. Our Panasonic is pretty miserly in standby mode.


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## peakbagger (Dec 14, 2015)

My 2 year old Sony 40" LED is quite good at standby load. I have an energy setting enabled so it powers down the processor. When I first turn it on, its defaults to the last channel and then takes about 30 seconds for the volume and channel selector to work.

My remaining energy hogs are actually water related. I have deep well pump that draws a lot of power and a 20 year old standard flow toilet. I expect I could cut my power use down further by putting in a water miser toilet and a variable speed drive on my pump but its  hard to justify spending money to save power when I generate more than I use.


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## maverick06 (Dec 15, 2015)

One I found was my FIOS internet connection, if you open up the box, and unplug the lead acid battery you save something like 12watts. I guess it is always trickle charging. The battery is for "emergency" use of a telephone over fios. I am not paying for a landline, so could never use it anyways.

I will also concur to the load of the AC unit. Mine pulls a lot of power when not in use. But since it is a heat pump in the winter, I can never just shut the breaker.


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