# Stihl 064 AV vs. 056 AV Magnum II



## Ashful

My search for a 70 cc saw hasn't turned up much, but I have come across a few larger.  An 064 (reported 15 years old) with a 28" bar and some serious hours on it.  The shop had rebuilt it, and stands behind it with a guarantee for $500.  They also had an 056 AV Magnum II with a 36" bar and much less use on it, currently in their rebuild shop, for which they will also be looking to get somewhere near $500.

Not sure I'd ever have use for a 36" bar, although that can be changed out.  I've read the 056 AV Mag II is a mighty rare version of the 056, but not sure that's true.  Both saws are way beyond my needs, but I'm not sure I'd find a 70 cc saw locally for $500.  This is a reputable dealer with long history in this area, who will stand behind their saw if you have problems with it.

Opinions?  At 85cc and 94cc, these are more than a "little" bigger than my 50cc saw.  Then again, if I can get 90cc for less than 70cc, and I'm not carting this monster all over the woods, maybe it's a good deal?  Don't want to be into something where parts availability or pricing is a huge problem.


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## Thistle

Plus going from 50cc to 80+ is quite a shock if you've never run anything that big before.Would be a good deal for the money if its a strong runner & getting spare parts isnt a problem.Most older large saws still have them out there online & elsewhere,just might take some searching & patience.Certain models were more popular/sold for a longer period than others & its easier finding parts.

Once you're committed,be careful & hang on.


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## amateur cutter

Thistle gives good advice here imo. Personally, having run both saws, I'd do the 064 all things being equal. Less weight for the cc's, & slightly better anti vibe. I like my 064 very well, & it out runs an 056 for firewood cutting. If you're gonna mill much then the 056 is your saw. A C


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## Ashful

Thanks, guys. AC, are you sure we're talking the same 056? This is the 056 AV Magnum II, which is more powerful than the 064. Personally, I'd prefer the smaller displacement 064, but the 056 is much newer and less used.

Here's the spec's I've dug up on the two:

064 AV: 85 cc, 6.5 hp, 15.2 lb, 12k rpm max
056 AV Mag II: 94 cc, 6.7 hp, 18.3 lb.

I think the standard 056 was "only" 81 cc's.

I've read the Bosch ignitions are prone to failure, and damn expensive to replace.  Some later saws had an SEM ignition which apparently more reliable.


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## amateur cutter

Joful said:


> Thanks, guys. AC, are you sure we're talking the same 056? This is the 056 AV Magnum II, which is more powerful than the 064. Personally, I'd prefer the smaller displacement 064, but the 056 is much newer and less used.
> 
> Here's the spec's I've dug up on the two:
> 
> 064 AV: 85 cc, 6.5 hp, 15.2 lb, 12k rpm max
> 056 AV Mag II: 94 cc, 6.7 hp, 18.3 lb.
> 
> I think the standard 056 was "only" 81 cc's.
> 
> I've read the Bosch ignitions are prone to failure, and damn expensive to replace. Some later saws had an SEM ignition which apparently more reliable.


 
Yep, I'm sure. My meaning was for a firewood saw. The 3lb weight diff is huge in producing all day, my 064 with an 8 pin rim has far higher chain speed than the 056. The extra grunt in the 56 wouldn't come into play till you got into the monster wood or milling. @ 28" or less bar length, the 064 is gonna be faster unless that mag is tweaked to the max for RPM. See if the dealer might let you test drive both saws to compare. I'm not dissing the 056 @ all, they're great if you need massive torque, but if you're gonna sling it all day you better buy stock in wheaties & Ibuprofen. If you want a 90+cc saw with good production speed look to 066/660 saws. $ 500.00 may be a bit much if the 064 isn't pretty, but with a new slug & jug she'll run a long time. If they haven't completed the 64 yet, see if they'll throw an 066 jug on it. Just my thoughts. If it were me I'd buy both & really irritate the wife. A C


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## DexterDay

Joful, where abouts are you located? (Besides in front of your stove. LOL )

There are good deals out there. Here is an 660 for $450 about an hr away from me. These come up quite often. This one should be gone tomorrow, if it wasnt called on already.  

http://akroncanton.craigslist.org/tls/3117452832.html


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## Ashful

Eastern PA, Dexter. My attraction to buying from a dealer such as this is their willingness to stand behind it if I have a problem. I don't mind paying a fair price for that, assuming these prices are indeed fair for what I'm getting.

I think they did a new cylinder and piston on the 064, but will check. We discussed several saws while I was in the shop, and I have the various repairs mixed in my head now. But based on your recommendation, I might wait until he's done the 056, and then see what price he puts on it. If he's going to ask the same for that newer and more powerful saw (with a MUCH larger bar, too!), then maybe I can talk him down some on the 064.

What would you be looking for on an old 064, if you were considering buying it? I have absolutely zero experience with Stihl saws.

edit:  forgot to mention, the 064 has a brand new 28" bar and chain.  the 056 was apart, but they showed me a used 36" bar with it.


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## MasterMech

Running that 056 Mag II for firewood duty would be like driving a '69 Boss 429 Mustang to work every day.

Just too rare/collectable to run it for utility purposes. IMO that is.  Parts availability _will_ be an issue with that saw.

I'd be checking out that 064, preferrably with the 066 top end as mentioned previously.


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## DexterDay

MasterMech said:


> Running that 056 Mag II for firewood duty would be like driving a '69 Boss 429 Mustang to work every day.
> 
> Just too rare/collectable to run it for utility purposes. IMO that is.  Parts availability _will_ be an issue with that saw.
> 
> I'd be checking out that 064, preferrably with the 066 top end as mentioned previously.




Old saws are nice.... But they are heavy. 

The 064 would be my choice for a Big Wood Saw! If its been rebuilt, then thats even better.

There are so many options when looking for a BIG saw. The best deal I seen recently, was in Bailey's catalog. A Makita 6421 (new 6401) Its 64 cc for $599. Or upgrade to 79cc for $719. Or go to 84cc for $679.

Almost 90cc and that cheap.... And new..?? 

There are many different avenues to take. Whether its a Husq, Stihl, Solo, Echo, Makita.... The dealer may play big in your purchase, if your not a DIY? But just throwin out different ideas.


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## Ashful

Actually, I did drive a 429 Mustang to work everyday for several years!  It was a 1984 LX (originally 302cid) body, and I did the motor / trans / rear build and transplant myself.  Too long ago, and when I had infinitely more time on my hands.  I only get what amounts to a few hours per month to process wood now, and tinkering with a project saw will cut dearly into that time.

I'll see what I can do on the 064 on Thursday.  Please let me know what to look for.


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## Ashful

So, I picked up the Stihl 064 AV tonight, along with a new 28" bar (Tsumura Total sprocket tip) and two RSC3 chains to go with it.  Hopefully I'll get back out in the woods soon to give it a try!  Seems to start easy and run nice, even if not the prettiest saw in the shed.

Definitely heavier with that 28" bar than the monster 056 was without a bar, which is a surprise, since the 056 Mag II body is spec'd as 6 lb. heavier than the 064.  Bailey's puts the shipping weight of their sprocket tip bar and chain combos this size at only 3.75 lb., so something doesn't add up.


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## DexterDay

Joful said:


> So, I picked up the Stihl 064 AV tonight, along with a new 28" bar (Tsumura Total sprocket tip) and two RSC3 chains to go with it.  Hopefully I'll get back out in the woods soon to give it a try!  Seems to start easy and run nice, even if not the prettiest saw in the shed.
> 
> Definitely heavier with that 28" bar than the monster 056 was without a bar, which is a surprise, since the 056 Mag II body is spec'd as 6 lb. heavier than the 064.  Bailey's puts the shipping weight of their sprocket tip bar and chain combos this size at only 3.75 lb., so something doesn't add up.




Ummmmmm... Pics??? Never happened. You know the rules! 

As for the weight. I would buy a 20" or 25" bar for it... 20" is the best for most average wood... 25" if you want to reduce a little weight.

I would go 20" though. You wanna talk about a Light Saber through wood!!

Congrats. But we still want pics 
Here is my 460 (wimpy compared to the beast you got today ) w/ dual port muffler (look close on the right side) and Big Dogs!!


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## ScotO

I'd be leaning towards the 064 too (and I am an old skool, Stihl magnesium-bodied saw freak-a-zoid, ask around) so the 056 is a dream saw for my barn someday.  The 064 has a lot of 066-660 cross-compatible parts, and doing like AC said (066-660 piston/cylinder) on that 064 would make it an animal, good enough for cutting or milling almost anything.  Just my two cents.  But I surely do loves me the 056, just not a feasible saw to cut all day, everyday....that saw belongs on a shrine....


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## ScotO

Joful said:


> So, I picked up the Stihl 064 AV tonight, along with a new 28" bar (Tsumura Total sprocket tip) and two RSC3 chains to go with it. Hopefully I'll get back out in the woods soon to give it a try! _*Seems to start easy and run nice, even if not the prettiest saw in the shed.*_
> 
> Definitely heavier with that 28" bar than the monster 056 was without a bar, which is a surprise, since the 056 Mag II body is spec'd as 6 lb. heavier than the 064. Bailey's puts the shipping weight of their sprocket tip bar and chain combos this size at only 3.75 lb., so something doesn't add up.


Looks don't make it cut any better.....heck I dated some uglies back in da day, they may have not been the prettiest girls in the shed but man oh man could they ever.................(sweet talk ya, you dirty minded SOB's.....)


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## DexterDay

Scotty Overkill said:


> I dated some uglies back in da day, they may have not been the prettiest girls in the shed.........



It takes a Big Man to admit that..... So I'm gonna join you. I'm not real proud of it either. But made me who I am


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## Ashful

Scotty Overkill said:


> Looks don't make it cut any better.....heck I dated some uglies back in da day, they may have not been the prettiest girls in the shed but man oh man could they ever...


 
... leave a wet spot every place you set them? This saw does!

Had two other old saws that did the same, and both were easy fixes. Hoping this one's similar.



DexterDay said:


> Ummmmmm... Pics??? Never happened. You know the rules!


 
I'll try to get some tomorrow.  Too late to head out to the shed tonight!



DexterDay said:


> As for the weight. I would buy a 20" or 25" bar for it... 20" is the best for most average wood... 25" if you want to reduce a little weight.


 
Yeah, I'll have to rethink my bar lengths.  Right now I have 14" on 35cc, 20" on 50cc, and 28" on 84cc.  Seeing as I'll be using the 84cc saw least of the three, it might not be a bad setup as-is.  Would sure be fun to run a 20" bar on that monster, but I'm guessing it's not the same pattern as my 50cc 510EVL.


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## ScotO

Joful said:


> ... leave a wet spot every place you set them? This saw does!
> 
> Had two other old saws that did the same, and both were easy fixes. Hoping this one's similar.


leaky oilers.......on the saws, that is! Most likely an o-ring, usually an easy fix.....


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## Ashful

Scotty Overkill said:


> leaky oilers.......on the saws, that is! Most likely an o-ring, usually an easy fix.....


 
Will have to dig into it, since that's something that really bothers me.  Never owned a Stihl, so any suggestions on where to start?  Should have probably addressed it with the saw shop where I bought it, before purchase, but suspected the answer would be "that's what these old Stihls do."


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## ScotO

Some leak with temperature change if the vent to the oil tank (which I believe is in the cap on that saw) is compromised or plugged, but to check the oiler seal would mean to pull the oiler out.  I'd take it back to the shop and tell them to look at it before you go tearing it apart.


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## Thistle

Joful said:


> Yeah, I'll have to rethink my bar lengths. Right now I have 14" on 35cc, 20" on 50cc, and 28" on 84cc. Seeing as I'll be using the 84cc saw least of the three, it might not be a bad setup as-is. Would sure be fun to run a 20" bar on that monster, but I'm guessing it's not the same pattern as my 50cc 510EVL.


 
That sounds just about perfect to me. I run 28cc/12" bar,62cc/20" bar,88cc/28" bar exclusively.Have other bars/chains hanging in the shed,they dont get much use anymore though.


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## Thistle

DexterDay said:


> Old saws are nice.... But they are heavy.
> 
> The 064 would be my choice for a Big Wood Saw! If its been rebuilt, then thats even better.
> 
> There are so many options when looking for a BIG saw. The best deal I seen recently, was in Bailey's catalog. A Makita 6421 (new 6401) Its 64 cc for $599. Or upgrade to 79cc for $719. Or go to 84cc for $679.
> 
> Almost 90cc and that cheap.... And new..??
> 
> There are many different avenues to take. Whether its a Husq, Stihl, Solo, Echo, Makita.... The dealer may play big in your purchase, if your not a DIY? But just throwin out different ideas.


 
I seen that Dolkita deal in past 3 Bailey's catalogues & flyers.Sounds great,but if it was me I'd get the 84cc BB kit included but not have installed until after factory warranty expired just to CMA.  And I'd spend the extra coin on high performance air filter setup & full wrap handlebar for it too.Those really add to the capabilities of a big saw.Maybe even go 'West Coast" & add foam filter/aluminum velocity stack.Havent added dual port muffler to my 288XPW yet,but will when finances allow it.


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## amateur cutter

Congrats. But we still want pics 
Here is my 460 (wimpy compared to the beast you got today ) w/ dual port muffler (look close on the right side) and Big Dogs!!


Hey dex, why don't you go that dirty instead of just posting pics to make mine look bad. 

That saw there's a beauty. A C


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## DexterDay

amateur cutter said:


> Congrats. But we still want pics
> Here is my 460 (wimpy compared to the beast you got today ) w/ dual port muffler (look close on the right side) and Big Dogs!!
> 
> 
> Hey dex, why don't you go that dirty instead of just posting pics to make mine look bad.
> 
> That saw there's a beauty. A C



That was the 1st time I had it out with the Dual Port.. Its a little dirtier now that I cut all these rounds... Got a lot of it split and stacked now (about half of it?)

I still try to routinely clean them and shoot my saws with compressed air (at the least), after a day of cutting. Along with bringing them in and giving the chains a good sharpening .... 

I have washed (and waxed) my mower more than my Wifes car.... Which one looks cleaner? LOL

I will try my best, to get my equipment dirty.  I promise... !! LOL


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## amateur cutter

That whole place looks just excellent! Yea I blow my saws clean after every use too, makes em last longer by keeping the cooling fins clean. I know what you mean with the lawnmower too, in my case it's my tools & box. A C


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## Ashful

Sorry guys, I forgot.  Good thing I left it in the garage after playing with it tonight, instead of taking it back out to the barn!  Here's a few shots I just went out and snapped.

Like I said, she's not pretty...





For kicks, I threw the T435 in for comparison:




I was offered any size bar I wanted on the 064 (they had to mount a new bar anyway), so I chose a 28" sprocket tip bar, as a good compliment to the 20" bar I run on my other saw.  Seems this saw can sling a lot more than 28" without any trouble, but I don't think I'll have too many occasions to need more than that.


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## Jesco

Interesting thread for me, as I own two 056 Mag IIs, and only just this week picked up an 064.

A bit late to weigh in with advice, but I think you made the right choice with the 064... even though I absolutely love my 056s.

The main problem with the 056 (as already mentioned) is parts availability, both of mine really need new mufflers and I've been having to patch the old ones up, or even fabricate one. The other is the weight - I used my 064 yesterday and it's certianly a lot lighter!
Another thing with the 056 is lots of vibration... make sure everything is done up tight!


On the other hand... after using my 064 yesterday, I can say without doubt the 056 has way more torque, way more power.
Having said that, the 064 still has enough power for my needs.

I was thinking of selling my 056 Mag 2s (including an incomplete 3rd one for parts), or possibly even part them out - but I suspect I would regret that in the future. I might just hang onto them I think.


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## ScotO

Jesco said:


> Interesting thread for me, as I own two 056 Mag IIs, and only just this week picked up an 064.
> 
> A bit late to weigh in with advice, but I think you made the right choice with the 064... even though I absolutely love my 056s.
> 
> The main problem with the 056 (as already mentioned) is parts availability, both of mine really need new mufflers and I've been having to patch the old ones up, or even fabricate one. The other is the weight - I used my 064 yesterday and it's certianly a lot lighter!
> Another thing with the 056 is lots of vibration... make sure everything is done up tight!
> 
> 
> On the other hand... after using my 064 yesterday, I can say without doubt the 056 has way more torque, way more power.
> Having said that, the 064 still has enough power for my needs.
> 
> I was thinking of selling my 056 Mag 2s (including an incomplete 3rd one for parts), or possibly even part them out - but I suspect I would regret that in the future. I might just hang onto them I think.


 If you ever sell them Jesco, I'm your buyer!  Welcome to the forum!


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## amateur cutter

Scotty Overkill said:


> If you ever sell them Jesco, I'm your buyer! Welcome to the forum!


 
Easy there trigger, I'd hate to get in a bidding war with a hearth.com friend.......... but. We might have to flip for those 056's. A C


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## amateur cutter

Crap, sorry jesco, got so involved doggin scotty, I forgot to say welcome. A C


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## MasterMech

Jesco said:


> Interesting thread for me, as I own two 056 Mag IIs, and only just this week picked up an 064.
> 
> A bit late to weigh in with advice, but I think you made the right choice with the 064... even though I absolutely love my 056s.
> 
> The main problem with the 056 (as already mentioned) is parts availability, both of mine really need new mufflers and I've been having to patch the old ones up, or even fabricate one. The other is the weight - I used my 064 yesterday and it's certianly a lot lighter!
> Another thing with the 056 is lots of vibration... make sure everything is done up tight!
> 
> 
> On the other hand... after using my 064 yesterday, I can say without doubt the 056 has way more torque, way more power.
> Having said that, the 064 still has enough power for my needs.
> 
> I was thinking of selling my 056 Mag 2s (including an incomplete 3rd one for parts), or possibly even part them out - but I suspect I would regret that in the future. I might just hang onto them I think.


 
Welcome Jesco!  And about those 056's, we want pictures of course!


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## Jesco

Scotty Overkill said:


> If you ever sell them Jesco, I'm your buyer! Welcome to the forum!


 
Thanks for the welcome Scotty, I'll let you know if I decide to sell - only catch is I'm in Australia... so the shipping costs would be brutal!


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## Jesco

amateur cutter said:


> Crap, sorry jesco, got so involved doggin scotty, I forgot to say welcome. A C


 
No problems and thanks for the welcome


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## Jesco

Than


MasterMech said:


> Welcome Jesco! And about those 056's, we want pictures of course!


 
Thanks MasterMech, I'll see what I can do about some pics, be warned they're not pretty to look at... plenty of scratches, worn out mufflers, etc. These beasties have done a lot of work


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## Jesco

MasterMech said:


> Welcome Jesco! And about those 056's, we want pictures of course!


 
Here we go:






There's an 038 somewhere in the shed, and a little MS170 kept in the car as well.


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## DexterDay

Jesco said:


> Than
> 
> 
> Thanks MasterMech, I'll see what I can do about some pics, be warned they're not pretty to look at... plenty of scratches, worn out mufflers, etc. These beasties have done a lot of work



Wow....... Maybe they look bad to you.. Them some fine lookin saws  

Beauty is in the eye of the beholder. Thats a dandy of a pic.

Welcome to the Forums and thanks for sharing.


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## MasterMech

DexterDay said:


> Wow....... Maybe they look bad to you.. Them some fine lookin saws
> 
> Beauty is in the eye of the beholder. Thats a dandy of a pic.
> 
> Welcome to the Forums and thanks for sharing.


 
'Round these parts we like our saws to show a little evidence of work getting done.  A fine herd indeed.


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## Jesco

Thanks everyone for the kind words. I get the impression the 056 Mag 2 is a lot rarer way over where you all are compared to Australia?
They're not exactly common here, but usually you can find one if you're reasonably patient. Getting certain parts such as ignition and mufflers is another story though!


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## Ashful

Jesco said:


> Thanks everyone for the kind words. I get the impression the 056 Mag 2 is a lot rarer way over where you all are compared to Australia?
> They're not exactly common here, but usually you can find one if you're reasonably patient. Getting certain parts such as ignition and mufflers is another story though!


 
While researching the two saws, and trying to decide which to buy, I read somewhere Stihl had made only 70 of the 056 AV Magnum II's.  I found it very hard to believe Stihl had made only 70 of any one model.


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## Jesco

Joful said:


> While researching the two saws, and trying to decide which to buy, I read somewhere Stihl had made only 70 of the 056 AV Magnum II's. I found it very hard to believe Stihl had made only 70 of any one model.





Joful said:


> While researching the two saws, and trying to decide which to buy, I read somewhere Stihl had made only 70 of the 056 AV Magnum II's. I found it very hard to believe Stihl had made only 70 of any one model.


 
Either I've been incredibly lucky find two complete and one incomplete,...or there were quite a bit more than 70 made!


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