# EnviroFire pellet stove technical question



## Pellet1 (Oct 3, 2008)

This is my first post and I want to say hello and thank all for a lot of great information. I recently got into pellet burning by buying a used(2001) Envirofire EF3 bayi. It was all sooted up and I got it for a pretty good price. I thoroughly cleaned it(took some doing to get the creosote off the heat exchanger), and then installed it. I then had it WETT certified.
I fired it up and it seemed to work very well, so I left it alone as it was in the spring.  About a week ago I started it up and found that it went out during the start cycle, so I put a small handful of pellets in the burning box and hit the start button again. The fire control knob(feed control) was set at midrange, as recommended. This time it burned, but just barely, so I turned up the feed rate to almost full, and the stove burned nicely.

I was concerned about the auger cycle as, at mid range, it was giving about 5 seconds green to green with the green being on for only one second(green on being when the auger is rotating) . So I e-mailed for some tech info and they returned with info on the feed times at various settings. They said that at mid range, the time is supposed to be 7 seconds, green to green, with green on for 3 seconds and off for 4 seconds. My stove is giving 5 seconds green to green--with green on for 1 second and off for 4 seconds. I traced the wires from the set control to the timer module and the module says 1 second and .3-10 seconds. I either have the wrong module or was given wrong info. If the auger is supposed to turn for 3 seconds each time, then that would affect the total feed for any given setting, and may explain all the creosote buildup, due to very low burns.

Can anyone out there shed some light please?  What are typical cycle times?  Anyone with the same stove who can verify?      Thanks, and sorry for the longish post.


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## nailed_nailer (Oct 3, 2008)

I have an Enviro EF-2 and anytime I have a problem with it or needed parts I got in touch with Climate Control Systems.

http://www.hearthtools.com/enviro_pellet.htm

They have a troubleshooting guide for all Enviro stoves and online manuals.

I also buy all my parts from them.  

Great service and helpful folks.

---Nailer---


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## Pellet1 (Oct 4, 2008)

Thanks nailer. What year is your EF2, and what is the time length of the green on cycle?   Apparently the newer stoves now have a 3 second timer, whereas my 2001 stove has a one second timer. I wonder if that difference was because of burning problems at lower settings in the older models?


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## nailed_nailer (Oct 4, 2008)

My EF2 FS (Freestanding)  Has a date code on the label of October 2000.

My stove is barely electronically controlled.  It is more Temp switch and feed rate controlled. 

I don't have a cycling green light to indicate auger feed cycles.  I have a "dial a fire" knob.

The knob does control the auger cycles.  But, there is no "light" associated with the cycles.

Follow this troubleshooting guide and you should be all set.

http://www.hearthtools.com/parts/2004enviroTrouble.pdf

---Nailer---


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## Pellet1 (Oct 4, 2008)

OK, I understand.  If you have no auger on cycle light, is it possible for you to hear when the auger is cycling and perhaps just take an estimate of whether it cycles on for one second or three seconds, just by sound alone?? When my dial a fire knob is set at mid range, my auger is off for 4 seconds and on for one second, for a total of 5 seconds per cycle. I am especially interested in how long the auger runs in each cycle---1 sec or 3 secs.


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## gutterboy2ca (Oct 10, 2008)

Hello there Firestarter, First time here, nice to see some relatively close people here too with my same questions, lol.Ok, i have just purchased my first pellet stove, its a EF3-Bay, also bought it from the local Dealer Used, was in there showroom for a number of years.They pulled it out a month ago and went Bigger for the Showroom.I got full 1 year warranty, and basically bought it as it was only stove i could find for $1200.Can
 It worked awsome the first afternoon and all nite set to about 9,Oclock position, just a hair above the Blue Zone.Later next day, went out, Dead, Have to keep relighting it no matter where i move the damper slide too.It just will not stay running Below 12,Oclock position.We're not Impressed, why did they even put a Blue Zone on there.After talking to the dealer,and seeing that Model still on there floor as a New Item, he said any we have ever sold all run the same way, will not stay running bleow 50% on Dial.WOW, thanks for letting me know that, stupid twits.
  For your question regarding Time intervals, heres mine with stopwatch.hope it helps.
  LOW=1.5 sec Green & 9 sec *OFF*
  Med=1.5 sec Green & 6 sec *OFF*
  High=1 sec Green & 1.5 *OFF* 
 Hope you can come to some conclusions with this, appears to me the time interval for Auger Movement needs to be bumped up to 2 sec ON.
 I'll take a short Vid tomorrow nite and upload it to Youtube for you or whoever else it may help..Feel Free to email with anymore questions, Brian.. :roll:


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## Pellet1 (Oct 10, 2008)

Hi Gutterboy(Brian)    Since my last post, I have continued to do some looking around and asking questions. The circa 2001 stoves came equipped with a one second auger timer module. I contacted the maker of that module(Syracuse, NY) and he told me that the one second interval module is what was ordered for that year stove. Sometime later??????? they switched to a 3 second module. I also spoke with a local Enviro dealer who said that the 3 second module would not be suitable for that year of stove--that my auger motor and gearbox may be getting tired and that they would be happy to come out to test it and determine what the stove needed. No thanks, I said. I did the live test on the motor, and when power is applied to it directly, it rotates the auger shaft at 1 RPM(right on specs). The bushings showed no sign of wear and everything looked good. So I put it all back together and started the stove. I then set the dial a fire to mid point and watched the auger shaft(set bolt). I counted 60 one second pulses of the auger, and guess what??  The auger shaft completed exactly one revolution. So, from that I concluded that there was absolutely nothing wrong with the auger and motor. The problem, IMO, is bad engineering of the feed. To feed successfuly, the auger pulse needs to be longer, and, you guessed it--that is exactly what they did. If you look at any Enviro parts supplier(there is one listed earlier in this thread), you will see only 3 second modules for sale.

As well, I was in contact with Enviro, and was told by their chief tech that it would be quite OK to put a 3 second module into my stove. I may do that if/when absolutely necessary. It appears to me that they corrected an engineering error with the 3 second module in later years.

As a side note--I set the dial at the mid point feed position and dumped a 40 lb bag in the stove and started the clock. That bag lasted 40 hours, and the stove threw only minimal heat(I would say equivilent to a setting in the blue zone. But, with very little increase beyond the 12 o'clock position, the stove will heat up considerably, and will really throw the heat at just near the red zone.  I plan to simply adjust accordingly until I need to do something else.

Amazing what a little research will uncover.


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## gutterboy2ca (Oct 10, 2008)

Great research, and much appreciated.I've only had mine a week and already i'm having to start research.I have 1 year full warranty on the used stove i purchased.Its Year of manufacturing is Nov 2000, and he said its been run as an only source of heat in the showroom forapprox 7 years.Only part they replaced was the convection fan just this spring.Think i'll tell them to get me a 3sec switch for free and i won,t return the stove.Never hurts to see what they'll say at least.Will post if i get it and if it makes a diff.Thanks for the quick response, Brian.


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## Pellet1 (Oct 10, 2008)

Well, if you do get a free 3 second module, get them to throw one in for me too. I may just go to Enviro and request one if your pans out. Personally, I think that is all the stove needs to be a very good working heater. And that is apparently what they did for later models.  It is one of the nicest looking stoves that I have seen. I bagged mine just this last spring from a family in Moncton for a grand, including the pipe and hearth.

Please keep me posted.


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## gutterboy2ca (Oct 11, 2008)

Hey Pellet1, 3 sec timer is on order, hopefully before next weekend i will test it out against performance of the factory 1 sec timer in it now.I also went to canadian tire tonite there BBQ stuff is on clearance, got a nice little Digital Meat Probe that goes to 500F for $11.99 with a 3 ft Braided steel cord and 6 inch stainless Probe, stuck the probe in the Heat exchanger tube and tried a Heat test on my only source of Pellets ATM, they are the Quebec Brand called, LG brand.. *www.granuleslg.com* Around here in Woodstock area they are the Prefered Pellet , over the Shaw brand and the Cozy Comfort by the Local pellet stove companies (Sunpoke Energy and Woodchuck heating). I haven,t got any other pellets to test the heat range as of today but will post soon to see diff. Here are couple pics #1 is on Med(12' o,clock-Fan on 50%) #2 is High, Fan on 50%)


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## Pellet1 (Oct 11, 2008)

Did you order it on you own or did the dealer order it. Please let me know the price too. PM or e-mail me if you prefer.  Thanks


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## hearthtools (Oct 11, 2008)

All the Replacement auger timers now are 3 second timers 
Enviro EF 2/3/4/Solas 3 sec auger timer EF-036
the problem with 1 second timers was that if Pellets were LONG the feet time was not enough to keep a fire going on low because as you know Longer pellets are less dense and less amount of fuel would feed that if the pellets were short.


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## hearthtools (Oct 11, 2008)

Just to clear up how the Older NON control board Enviro and Older NON control board TRAVIS stoves work.
This kind of stoves use Timers, potentiometer and switches.

The feed rate of the pellets is determined by the ON/OFF cycling of auger motor.
 Remember the auger motor turns at a constant speed of 1 RPM (some 4 RPM). Therefore, to vary the pellet feed, the on and off time of the auger motor is varied.

The auger timer Control the FEED time. How long the power is sent to the AUGER motor. This never changes regardless of Feed rate setting.

The Dial O fire or Feed rate switch. (potentiometer) 
a potentiometer Regulates the the ohms 800 to 1,200 ohms on lower rates down to 1 -10 ohms on higher rates. 
controlling the time BETWEEN feeds.


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## gutterboy2ca (Oct 11, 2008)

Awsome Tutorial there Rod, much appreciated explaination, so if the 3 sec is the now regular replacement part for this stove, is this going to solve my problem of stove not staying running below 11 o'clock position?sometimes as we watch the cycle, it will blink 5 times(1 sec each) without a single pellet dropping to the pot.5 sec of auger turning along with 9 sec each x 5 in the off cycle is over 60 sec on inactivity in the burn pot, thats when it goes out.Fingers crossed that replacing this timer is going to give us peace of mind that the stove is still running thru the nite.
  Right now with nite temps in the mid 40's and daytime in the 60's we really don,t want to have it set above 12. o'clock just so it will stay running. Sound reasonable to you Rod? thanks in advance, brian, BTW, Love the site, great feedback and a wealth of hands on knowledge..Brian


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## hearthtools (Oct 11, 2008)

gutterboy2ca said:
			
		

> Awsome Tutorial there Rod, much appreciated explaination, so if the 3 sec is the now regular replacement part for this stove, is this going to solve my problem of stove not staying running below 11 o'clock position?sometimes as we watch the cycle, it will blink 5 times(1 sec each) without a single pellet dropping to the pot.5 sec of auger turning along with 9 sec each x 5 in the off cycle is over 60 sec on inactivity in the burn pot, thats when it goes out.Fingers crossed that replacing this timer is going to give us peace of mind that the stove is still running thru the nite.
> Right now with nite temps in the mid 40's and daytime in the 60's we really don,t want to have it set above 12. o'clock just so it will stay running. Sound reasonable to you Rod? thanks in advance, brian, BTW, Love the site, great feedback and a wealth of hands on knowledge..Brian



Yes a 3 second timer will help your problem. on second on is just not enough to feed pellets.
 All pellet stoves have a hard time with the Lower setting if the pellets you are using are over 1 1/4" long.
because with longer pellets the auger will dump a few pellets at a time then every so often pellets will build up in the top of the drop shoot and it will dump a bunch at a time then ither smothering the LOW fire out or not giving it enough pellets to keep a fire going.

the only solution is to turn up the feet rate. and this is what you will be doing when you change the timer to a 3 seconds on timer.


BTW the EF3 is one on the simplest stoves to use and maintain.
Just make sure you scrape the Heat exchange scraper as often as possible other wise it become so crusted up you will not be able to scrap it any longer.


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## hearthtools (Oct 11, 2008)

OH
this type of stove does NOT control the Combustion blower speed (lack of Control board or phase controller) so sometimes it is necessary to Lower the Air draft on Lower settings so you dont have to much air burn or popping pellets out of the pot. 
So you will have to match the air to fuel Manualy. More fuel more air.
Less fuel Less air.
Newer stoves do this with the Electronic control boards by dropping the voltage to the Combustion blower when you run it on lower settings.
the EF4 has a Phase controller that drops the voltage when you turn up or down the feed rate.


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## gutterboy2ca (Oct 11, 2008)

so if i will still need to turn up the feed rate even with a 3 sec timer, really whats the point, i might as well just turn up the feedrate with the 1 sec timer, is this correct? i was under the assumption the 3 sec timer on low was going to dump more pellets in the burn pot then the 1 sec timer. If theres no advantage to the 3 sec, meaning we are still going to have to run it on 50% capacity, i might as well run it on 50% with the factory 1 sec timer..Unless i missed something there....


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## Pellet1 (Oct 12, 2008)

My guess is that putting in a 3 second timer will greatly alter the feed rate at all settings, when compared with the 1 second timer. The fire control POT will have the same values of resistance, so therefore the OFF times between cycles will vary the same as with the 1 sec module. This will make the feed rate much better at the lower settings, but will probably make the higher settings way too hot for the stove. One big advantage though, will be far less auger motor cycles. If I can find a 3 second module for a reasonable price, I will try one.
There are better prices out there, if I could only be sure of the numbers for the module. For example, the 1 sec. module is TRS51A11s2----my guess for the 3 second module( I used the available charts) is TRS51A13s2 but would like some verification if possible.

And thanks Hearthtools, for confirming my conclusions about this stove.


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## hearthtools (Oct 12, 2008)

the 3 second timer is what enviro updated the stove to. For they found out the 1 second was a mistake.
the stove will work much better on low with the 3 second timer

the Factory 3 second timer is listed on my site and I have them in stock http://www.hearthtools.com/enviro_pellet.htm
PRODUCT: Enviro EF 2/3/4/Solas 3 sec auger timer
EF-036 -- $78.00


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## gutterboy2ca (Oct 12, 2008)

Great, thanks Rod, i'll prob order one as soon as my dealer says (Frig you") yours still works, don,t mess with it, lol.Or at least thats what i feel they will say, we'll see, shipping shouldn,t be that bad to maine.Prefer to my mailbox then stuck in canada customs for 3 weeks as usual.. Will let you know soon i hope,Thanks again..


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## ShaneR34 (Oct 13, 2008)

Great thread to read.

I have an EF3 that came existing with our new home. So, this is our first year with it or any other pellet stove.

My production date on the label is listed as October 2006, so I would assume I have the 3 second motor (which would make sense based on memory of the last few test burns).  I've noticed, however, that it doesn't burn very well on the 12 O'clock setting.  The flame will go from Photo 1 above to photo 2 (80% of the time looking like photo 1). So, assuming I have the 3 second motor, Rob has me thinking that it's my pellets-- The auger will turn once or twice (maybe 3) with no pellets dropping and then a bunch will come down on the next turn.  If I then move the dial-a-fire to the next setting up (2'o'clock) it's fine...anything above that and it roars.  I guess it's not a big deal, but I would LOVE to know what a properly functioning EF3's flame SHOULD look like at the 12 O'clock setting....


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## Pellet1 (Oct 13, 2008)

Well Shane, nice to hear from another EF3er. All you need to do to know is to time how long the green light stays on per cycle. 1 second or 3 seconds. The time between green lights will vary according to the dial a  fire setting.  Let us know.


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## gutterboy2ca (Oct 13, 2008)

Well i've personally not seen enough to know if my own is functioning properly on Med ShaneR34, but its definately not a consistant flame on Med or anything below that, very little difference between 10 o'clock and 12 o'clock, but at least on 12 o'clock it won,t go out in the middle of the nite,although at recent temps outside at nite its Hotter then we like here in the office of my house where its centraly located, and runs approx 80F to 82F, Hopefully your not burning those cozy comfy pellets from Kent Bld Ctr.they are known to Have Extremely long inconsistant pellet lenth,causing auger clogging,some pellets over 3 inch in lenth.Longest one i have found in these LG Granules has been 1 -1/8th, which is prob bout long enough..


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## ShaneR34 (Oct 13, 2008)

As I said, I'm pretty sure I have the 3 second motor   I'll double check the next time I have it on, but I payed close attention to the Auger the times I did have it going, and 1 second doesn't seem right...I could be wrong. lol

As for the pellets, I went with Easter Embers premium.  The Tech I had out to inspect and clean basically told me to get my pellets anywhere I like, but to stay away from Kent.  He's part of the reason why I don't want to burn it too low: the previous owner burned it too low and caused creosite to really build up. The Tech said the heat exchange tubes actually had caught fire...but no harm done. All is well after he was through with it.  He advised no to burn it below the 10 O'clock setting for any more than a short period of time every now and then.

So, if I don't see a good flame, I get nervous 

I'll let you know how my testing goes the next time I have it going (which won't be too long. It's starting to get cold here in the Maritimes...)


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## Pellet1 (Oct 13, 2008)

If you look at the  Eastern Ember and the Cozy Comfort pellets--the Cozy Comfort actually have slightly better specs. Makes one wonder how they come up with them. That being said, I have 3.5 tons of Eastern Ember in my basement.


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## x96mnn (Oct 13, 2008)

Have an EF3 as well, bought it last September and it works great. I run it 75% of the time with the dial a fire in the 9:00 position and have never had an issue with it going out. I have an Enviro MAX down stairs which has no issues on low going out but the burn pot over flows at times causing smoke in the house (Enviro is working with me on this)

I am using Eastern Ember pellets as well; they seem to be the only ones I kind find in this


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## gutterboy2ca (Oct 13, 2008)

Thanks for the post on this x96mnn, if i can keep mine running all nite in 9'o,clock with the 3 sec timer i'll be happy as a clam..


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## gutterboy2ca (Oct 17, 2008)

Ok, still more testing, WOW ! i would not have believed the difference in pellets as far as heat range.I was finally able to get my hands on another brand of pellets,over the LG-Granules Brand suggested by both of our pellet stove dealers.Well, so much for the frowned upon KENT BLDG pellets,i Like em', i agree they are consitently longer, with prob 10% of the pellets being approx 1.5 inches in lenth, but for the proven heat output from them as you'll see in the attatched pic,thats gotta make a diff come mid winter.All test results were done on a warmed stove with min 45 mins burn time,auger speed set to max, fan speed to 50% , damper 1/2 way open .Flame appearance seems to be similar, just heat output diff of 100 degree's with the (Cozy Comfy) being superior. Any input Ken?? loL


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## DiggerJim (Oct 17, 2008)

gutterboy2ca said:
			
		

> Ok, still more testing, WOW ! i would not have believed the difference in pellets as far as heat range.I was finally able to get my hands on another brand of pellets,over the LG-Granules Brand suggested by both of our pellet stove dealers.Well, so much for the frowned upon KENT BLDG pellets,i Like em', i agree they are consitently longer, with prob 10% of the pellets being approx 1.5 inches in lenth, but for the proven heat output from them as you'll see in the attatched pic,thats gotta make a diff come mid winter.


I think you'll find that you'll also consume more pellets. Since the pellet delivery is not really by weight but by how many get augured in during a feed cycle, longer pellets likely feed more total pellet mass for a given auger setting. Consider that your auger allows say 5 seconds of pellet drop on a feeding turn. So both pellet brands will drop about the same number of pellets (perhaps a few more of the smaller ones due to compaction density), but if the longer ones are consistently say 20% longer, you'll actually be feeding 20% more wood into the burn pot. That being the case, you'd get more heat (you're burning more wood) but you'll also run through a bag quicker. A proper test would involve weighing the pellets fed over a test timeframe.

TANSTAAFL


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## Pellet1 (Oct 17, 2008)

I agree. The true test is having a house thermometer set in a constant position and monitoring it while you feed two 40 lb bags thru the stove on exactly the same settings. Then, measure the time it takes to empty the stove on each pellet brand. I strongly doubt there will be any measurable difference. Around these parts, Eastern Ember gets the nod from most, although the Cozy Comfort spec out better on the bag.


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## gutterboy2ca (Oct 17, 2008)

Ohh, yeah, DiggerJim, go complicate things now, lol.Just when i thought i was getting somewheres.Naw, your prob right,think i'll wait till it gets colder though to do a full 40lb bag burn time test,as its too hot in here at these temps to leave it running on 1/2 way(only place it stays running) so i'll wait till temp drops to 30F constant to do those tests.Hopefully i'll have my 3 sec timer in by Mon and see if it makes a diff on Low settings for reliability...


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## Pellet1 (Oct 17, 2008)

Keep us posted on that 3 second timer. ;-)


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## samandlillie (Oct 18, 2008)

Nova Scotia pellet burners. I noticed that eastern embers pellets jumped up in price this year, from 4.69 to 5.99 per bag. . Has this happened in your area this year?
Wayne in Windsor,NS.


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## gutterboy2ca (Oct 18, 2008)

on that same note, anyone know what brand Canadian Tire sells? i see there on sale this week for $4.99/bag, when i called to see if they were in, she said no but any day, come get a Rain check.Like to know what company they use first though.
 Curries  hardware-Woodstock NB =LG-Granules--($4.99/Bag/Pallet)--$5.25/bag individual
 Kent Bld Cnter = Cozy Comfy-----------($5.50/Bag) by pallet.. $5.99/Bag individual
 All Home hardware Franchises-- Eastern Embers---------(5.99/Bag)
 Canadian Tire Corp--Type Unknown----($4.99/Bag)


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## 56 chevtruck (Oct 20, 2008)

canadian tire sells eastern embers here in nova scotia they did last year. i tried all three brands eastern embers , comfy cozy, and lg, eastern embers burn the hottest in my ef 3 using same exact setting wife said is stove on with comfy cozy ? i said yeah. she said those pelletS suck. LG heat output simular to  cozy. my vote is for eastern embers. only advantage i seen to other 2 brands is glass didnt get as dirty. gutter boy unless comfy cozy changed their pellets in the last couple weeks heat is more with eastern .gotta get me on of those probes though


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## gutterboy2ca (Oct 20, 2008)

Wow, 56, wondering if the diff may be in the 3 sec module as opposed to the 1 sec garbage i have in.My test results after last nite were totally opposite.Very dissapointed in Eastern Embers, (well not totally)Managed to Grab 2 bags to test with at Home hardware,ran them on Med from 12 yesterday, till it Ran dry at 2PM this afternoon,yeilding 26hrs burntime and a temp of only 200F from the digital thermo, Ash was considerably more then LG Granules, but Less then Cozy Comfy. Not sure if i wanna cry or laugh, as i just ran to Canadiantire and ordered a Pallet on there sat sale for $4.99/Bag, with a 20% Manditory deposit, well, if there Eastern Embers, and i so far don,t like em, it shouldn,t be hard to sell the pallet at $4.99/Bag. But i'm def Leaning towards a pallet of Cozy Comfy for my best heat Value, next step is to test Runtime on a bag tonite of the C.C and see how they compare that way...Before i change the timer..


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## Pellet1 (Oct 20, 2008)

As far as I know, Eastern Ember have only one pellet mill--in Milford, NS. However, I guess it is entirely possible for any batch run to vary from any other. I have only burned EE pellets, but those around here who have been burning for years, say that EE are the best available. Apparently, only NS spruce saw dust and no bark or any other filler. But who knows??

Is this timer day????


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## gutterboy2ca (Oct 20, 2008)

They are def the Darkest of all 3 for some reason,pellet size is more consistant then the other 2 with average longest being only 1 inch,maybe 10%, rest only 1/2 inch consistantly.We noticed a slight Odor with E.E,kinda like when you saw melamine or particle board,and a few total Black Pellets,like a saw burn on wood,not sure whats with them,prob nothing..


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## ShaneR34 (Oct 21, 2008)

Kinda hi-jacking the thread a little...

but, for the EF3 owners in here (with a 3 second timer...sorry gutterboy,lol). What does your flame look like with feed rate at medium? Mine seems to be (most of the time) close to picture 2 above, while burning "lower" for the other times.  As I'm getting to the point where we will be leaving on 24/7 (we did last night and all day today) I'm still unsure if it's burning as it should: although I'm fairly sure it is.

Last night I turned it down to the 11 o'clock position and the flame was nearly non existent, which I wasn't comfortable leaving it at, so I left it on medium....

Thanks!


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## hearthtools (Oct 21, 2008)

ShaneR34 said:
			
		

> Kinda hi-jacking the thread a little...
> 
> but, for the EF3 owners in here (with a 3 second timer...sorry gutterboy,lol). What does your flame look like with feed rate at medium? Mine seems to be (most of the time) close to picture 2 above, while burning "lower" for the other times.  As I'm getting to the point where we will be leaving on 24/7 (we did last night and all day today) I'm still unsure if it's burning as it should: although I'm fairly sure it is.
> 
> ...



you will need to adjust the air when you turn the feed up and down to get the right air to fuel mix


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## Pellet1 (Oct 21, 2008)

While we are talking apples and apples here, the apples are Macintosh and Gravenstein. That is to say, that what determins the flame is the pellet feed and the air to the flame. We can all achieve a burn consumption of a bag per day(more or less). The difference between the two auger timers will determine the dial a fire knob position to achieve that burn. For me, presently with the 1 second timer module(3 second one on order), I need to set my dial to about the two o'clock position; while you. with the 3 second timer, may burn up a bag with the knob set at 12 o'clock, or mid range.
I think the makers of the Enviro recognized that problem some time ago and switched to the 3 second timer. Later, I believe they went with a total control board. I feel that they should have offered a free upgrade to owners of the older stoves, since it was their engineering problem.


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## gutterboy2ca (Oct 21, 2008)

Here,Here, I'll second that Motion... :coolsmile:


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## 56 chevtruck (Oct 21, 2008)

hi gutter i couldnt log on from home last night. if your enviro is working right it should burn at min  280 to 300 F max with pellet feed turned all way up and damper rod about half way out using eastern ember pellets. my enviro is about 3 years old in the winter i run 24/7 except shutting down for cleaning every couple days. if you bought you pellets at canadain tire that are on sale this week you are in luck the brand they have is lignetics and i tested them last night.we have a clear winner here over all brands available in eastern canada! i burned the lignetics for about 4 hours last night with feed on high fan on hi and damper rod out about half and temp was 370/380 F. i was gonna do the deal pierceys building supplies had on spreading the payments over 5 months on 2 pallets full of eastern embers but 70/80F difference and fact they are on sale i will be heading to canadian tire.thing i found with burning eastern embers on high is burn pot would build up not so with lignetics.


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## ShaneR34 (Oct 21, 2008)

hearthtools said:
			
		

> you will need to adjust the air when you turn the feed up and down to get the right air to fuel mix



Yep...well aware of adusting the air 

Anything under the 12'oclock position and I get a poor burn, regardless of what I do to the air...


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## hearthtools (Oct 21, 2008)

Pellet1 said:
			
		

> While we are talking apples and apples here, the apples are Macintosh and Gravenstein. That is to say, that what determins the flame is the pellet feed and the air to the flame. We can all achieve a burn consumption of a bag per day(more or less). The difference between the two auger timers will determine the dial a fire knob position to achieve that burn. For me, presently with the 1 second timer module(3 second one on order), I need to set my dial to about the two o'clock position; while you. with the 3 second timer, may burn up a bag with the knob set at 12 o'clock, or mid range.
> I think the makers of the Enviro recognized that problem some time ago and switched to the 3 second timer. Later, I believe they went with a total control board. I feel that they should have offered a free upgrade to owners of the older stoves, since it was their engineering problem.



They still make the EF3 stove with the same switches. they just changed to 3 second timers to improve the performance with longer pellets. Just like any thing mechanical after timer you find a better way. 
If you have SHORT pellets the 1 second timer works great.

the only reason they use a control board in the OTHER NEW models is PEOPLE want thermostat options (THAT WORK)
The Timer and switch system like the EF 2, 3 and 4 and the older Travis stoves are the best type(IMO)of controls because they are solid state and you only need to change out one timer or switch if something goes bad. A control board system will have to replace the whole control board.


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## Pellet1 (Oct 21, 2008)

That is enlightening stuff, Hearthtools. So all we need to do is find some real short pellets and things will be OK. I was told by a dealer that the new stoves went to a control board. I was surprised by that and that is why I said that I only thought the new stoves had a control board. Now I know they do not.. If you are following this thread, which it appears you are, you see that some are experiencing burn difficulties with the 1 second timer. Shorter pellets huh.

Our local CTC just got in a whack of Lignetics(may explain the shortage in NE) and are selling them for $250 per ton($5 per bag) I decided to grab 25 bags, just to try out these so called hardwood pellets. Boy, the plastic of the bags sure is thin--even a bad grasp will open them up. The pellets look dark and are quite longish. Can't wait to burn a bag

Thanks again Hearthtools.


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## hearthtools (Oct 21, 2008)

Pellet1 said:
			
		

> That is enlightening stuff, Hearthtools. So all we need to do is find some real short pellets and things will be OK. I was told by a dealer that the new stoves went to a control board. I was surprised by that and that is why I said that I only thought the new stoves had a control board. Now I know they do not.. If you are following this thread, which it appears you are, you see that some are experiencing burn difficulties with the 1 second timer. Shorter pellets huh.
> 
> Our local CTC just got in a whack of Lignetics(may explain the shortage in NE) and are selling them for $250 per ton($5 per bag) I decided to grab 25 bags, just to try out these so called hardwood pellets. Boy, the plastic of the bags sure is thin--even a bad grasp will open them up. The pellets look dark and are quite longish. Can't wait to burn a bag
> 
> Thanks again Hearthtools.



They changed to a 3 second timer about 3 years ago.
I am thinking if some people got New EF3 stoves This year it was OLD STOCK from distributors because a lot of dealers (my self included) stopped selling the EF3 when the Meridian came out because it had thermostat option and more BTU.
 Enviro Kepted making the EF3 and EF4 for the New Zealand and European market.
The sales in North America has been resurrected when the EAST COAST had a feeding Frenzy for wood and pellet stove because of the cost of oil.


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## gutterboy2ca (Oct 21, 2008)

Lignetics pellets are made only from the finest premium quality western conifer sawdust (West Coast Plant) and premium quality hardwood sawdust (East Coast Plant).

Lignetics high quality control standards assure you of the highest BTU’s, lowest moisture and least amount of ash residual of any pellet on the market. Lignetics pellets burn hotter and more consistently which provides you more heat per pound. 
 Hmm, Hardwood in Eastern canada plant huh, well i got a whole pallet of them on raincheck so hope they are ok.
  As for there statement of Highest BTU,s, well, guess i'll be digging out the ole Digi Thermo yet another time.


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## 56 chevtruck (Oct 22, 2008)

hey gutter unless your stove doesnt burn as hot as mine. you should  get at least a min 350 F on high fire will go to 370/380F as  i stated no BS! i tried 2 different thermometers with same reading. i bought my winter supply yesterday at canadian tire based on higher heat output than eastern embers and other 2 brands.( supply at canadian tire went fast i would have missed out if wasnt for your post here). let us know your temperature findings.


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## gutterboy2ca (Oct 22, 2008)

sure will chevtruck, if i ever get any, lol. Can Tire here is saying no supply of Pellets to them till 2nd week of Nov, and i was first in line for Raincheck for a pallet of the hardwood pellets.
 Where did you place the thermometer on yours,i'm not saying i can,t get a higher Heat reading in a diff spot maybe, but as you can see in the pics, my probe is in the heat exchanger,as it reaches the room.
 BTW just installed the new 3 sec timer at 11:AM today,set it to approx 8 O'clock position and left for the day, just got in at 4PM and was soo relieved to see it still plunking away with a nice burn gowing and a comfortable 125 F Reading with probe.So far i'm glad i got the 3 sec timer(Pellet1).It will be a relief to go to bed tonite with auger set to 9 o,clock and hopefully still see it running in the morning.Fingers crossed..


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## Pellet1 (Oct 22, 2008)

Congratulations, gutterboy. Looks like it will do the trick. Sure beats cutting all those pellets into 1/4" lengths. :cheese:


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## hearthtools (Oct 23, 2008)

gutterboy2ca said:
			
		

> sure will chevtruck, if i ever get any, lol. Can Tire here is saying no supply of Pellets to them till 2nd week of Nov, and i was first in line for Raincheck for a pallet of the hardwood pellets.
> Where did you place the thermometer on yours,i'm not saying i can,t get a higher Heat reading in a diff spot maybe, but as you can see in the pics, my probe is in the heat exchanger,as it reaches the room.
> BTW just installed the new 3 sec timer at 11:AM today,set it to approx 8 O'clock position and left for the day, just got in at 4PM and was soo relieved to see it still plunking away with a nice burn gowing and a comfortable 125 F Reading with probe.So far i'm glad i got the 3 sec timer(Pellet1).It will be a relief to go to bed tonite with auger set to 9 o,clock and hopefully still see it running in the morning.Fingers crossed..



did you get the timer from your dealer?


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## gutterboy2ca (Oct 23, 2008)

Yes, reluctantly i did Hearthtools, he gave me a price of his cost, then when i got there to pick it up he jacked the price another $28, i wasn,t impressed to be honest.If i did buizz like that in my line of work, i wouldn,t be in buizz very long.When i give someone a price for Rain Gutters, thats what it will be when i'm done the job, don,t matter if cost did go up between estimate time and Install time, thats life...Am i wrong on that?? Hmm...
 Ohh well, enough Ranting, i'ts in and so far it was a good move, i am now very satisfied with the performance of the EF3. If i could just get some stinkin Pellets now, lol....


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## 56 chevtruck (Oct 23, 2008)

hi gutter all  canadian tire must have different rules they told me no rainchecks.? i gots  a little over 2 tons. 111bags. they went quick at dartmouth store.i had my thermometer right on top of stove where grate comes off the top.this surface is right on top of exchanger tube where you.


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## pete324rocket (Oct 23, 2008)

Just wanted to say hello to my fellow Maritimers.I've only grazed the content of your posts but seems you are comparing pellet quality. This is my second year of the pellet stove deal. Not sure if pellet quality changes from year to year but regardless of bag specs,the shaw brand is superior to the cozys by far as heat output goes.I just snagged 2 ton of Lignetics from Crappy Tire at that 4.99 price and waiting for buddy to deliver them but am very pleased if they are as good as other reports from the users here say.Saw on tv last nite on CBC about the pellet shortage.Shaw is saying maybe xmas for some people since there is no sawdust or shavings to make them-no mills producing the waste.Next year should be a different game since some new big mills should then be producing.Anyways,I'm running a drolet eco-45 which seems ok though they have had some issues with electronics.I just got a new auger motor on warranty though it took forever-I think the blame may lie with the dealer more than the manufacturer since they are new at this too.Heating someones house is important business-not quite like selling toasters.


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## cdurost (Nov 5, 2009)

i bought a house with ef2i  the stove worked great  and the auger moter quit part #ef-001 replace from dealer. it still has 1 sec timer  might be looking to update. we put new auger motor in and know i have it in the red zone and can't keep it going its not putting the qty of pelllets in the stove that it did last year. stove date is april of 1994. i by passed the dial as it said in the book and still qty of pellets in stove burns it self out the auger is spining sre the gears diffrant . i have cleaned and serviced stove as book said  need  help please


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## hearthtools (Nov 5, 2009)

cdurost said:
			
		

> i bought a house with ef2i  the stove worked great  and the auger moter quit part #ef-001 replace from dealer. it still has 1 sec timer  might be looking to update. we put new auger motor in and know i have it in the red zone and can't keep it going its not putting the qty of pelllets in the stove that it did last year. stove date is april of 1994. i by passed the dial as it said in the book and still qty of pellets in stove burns it self out the auger is spining sre the gears diffrant . i have cleaned and serviced stove as book said  need  help please



have you times the feed times
On and off is so what are they?

and are you sure the auger motor is turning? it might be just trying to turn if you have a jam up in the auger.
I pulled a nail out of auger last week. the motor was coming on but only turning a 1/8" then the thermo protection would kick in and shut off. over and over again


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## Pellet1 (Nov 5, 2009)

The 3 second timer is what solved the feed problems on my EFI 3 stove. If yours is on for only 1 second, and the auger is actually turning, as was indicated by Stove Doc, then I would suggest getting the newer controller. I think there were some sources quoted earlier in the thread. I got mine thru a Canadian supplier, but it actually came from somewhere in NY state, I do believe.


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## cdurost (Nov 11, 2009)

I have a ef2i does anyone have the auger timer part # from the maker not the
evrio #ef-036 I have the 1sec timer # I talk to infrtec here in Syracuse
and get it for
49.95 from them instead of paying 105 .95 from the dealer can
anyone help thanks


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## Pellet1 (Nov 11, 2009)

If you look at the 1 sec timer that you presently have, and its part number is TRS51A11s2--------then the part that you would want is TRS51A13s2A The number following the first A is the time length.  ie 3 vs 1  I took thos e numbers right off the box for the timer for my EF3i stove.  Not sure about the EF2i

I got my timer from infitec in Syracuse


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## gutterboy2ca (Nov 11, 2009)

Yeah Pellet1 and I went thru all this crap last year, believe me its worth paying to get the 3 sec timer, i still feel it should have been changed undewr warranty by the dealer, but he said the 1 sec timer was not broke and Enviro wouldn,t cover it.Oh well, water under the Bridge.


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## Caper (Nov 7, 2010)

Help needed.
I have an Envirofire II that I bought used a number of years ago. I have always had problems with pellet feed rates. The fire would never burn very high. I have not used it much over the past few years. I now have continual auger jams.
I have replaced the auger motor. Still no luck. With no pellets, the auger will take 90 secs for 1 revolution. I have read that most auger motors are rated for 1 rpm. It appears I may have a 1 sec timer as well. Any suggestions/help is appreciated.


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## gutterboy2ca (Nov 7, 2010)

pull that puppy out and order a 3 sec timer and be done with it.I felt it should have been a factory recall/update,my dealer said hey, its not broken, so not covered.I ended up buying the timer from him at his cost(so he said) think was $80, take the part# off the above pictured 3 sec timer and take it to your local Enviro dealer to get one ordered.Can buy it direct from Infetec, but think was a min of 3 had to be purchased..


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## Caper (Nov 7, 2010)

Definitely a 1 sec. timer. I will replace. Thanks for the advice.


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## gutterboy2ca (Nov 7, 2010)

Anytime, feel free to PM with any questions or concerns.


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## tomasulo (Nov 9, 2010)

Nice to see some other Enviro EF3 owners!!  I have one, manufacture date 2006.  I just set mine at 12 o'clock and timed the auger.  It is running for 3 seconds, then off for 7 seconds.  

Since last winter, I ran into a similar issue of the fire going out, and it just did it again this morning.  Last winter, I was using carry over pellets from the year before, now this year, I still am using some pellets that are two seasons old.  I had a service tech here last week to check on it, and he said the old pellets could be causing a less than great burn.  In the years prior, I could set the level to the lowest setting and it would never go out, with fresh pellets, now I am sure it would go out if I set it below 12 o'clock.  Does anyone know if using old pellets would be a culperit?  They have been stored in my basement on pallets, but I am afraid in the summer when the basement is damp that this may degrade the quality too??

I have also been having issues with my auger squeeling.  I emptied out the hopped and vacuumed the auger really good, which helped a bit.  The service techs said that this can be due to leaving pellets in the hopper for extended periods when not in use and the fines jamming up the auger.  Seems to be very loud upon starting then goes away when it warms up.

Andrew in PEI, Canada


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## gutterboy2ca (Nov 9, 2010)

Hey Amdrew, this model stove is pretty picky on settings,have you disassembled it in the firebox,removed the 3 rear panels and give it a good vacumn out?this should be done once a year at least,sounds like its not getting enough air.Make sure the Gasket is good where the ash pan seals against the stove, my wife has a habit of shoving the drawer in, and not turning the knob to lock it,giving an air leak, and lazy flame, stove will not stay going.Have you ever popped the Exhaust fan off,and give it a good cleaning in there.Don,t be affraid to strip her down for a good overall cleaning,then when your done with wifey, you can tackle the stove,lol.Sorry, that slipped out,haha.Holler if you have any questions


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## tomasulo (Nov 9, 2010)

Thanks for the reply, I do the regular clean every week, and just had the service tech here last week for a full cleaning.


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## turbotech (Feb 9, 2011)

hearthtools said:
			
		

> gutterboy2ca said:
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Ya think they would have just used a timer with both the ON delay and OFF delay to be programmable and installed an external resistor for the ON delay.
Has anyone taken apart their old timer and opened it up to change the resistor so that it does 3 sec instead of 1 sec?

Too bad they used a "one shot" for the power control. If it wasn't for the power control timer needing a loss of power to restart then a simple Tstat  could do on/off stove operation.
I know it is an old thread, but good info just the same.


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## controlsource (Feb 28, 2011)

We have the Infitec TRS51A11S2 and TRS51A13S2A in-stock by the way. We are an Infitec distributor.

Dwayne Ray
Control Source International


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## enviro pyro (Feb 16, 2013)

i have an e3 pellet stove for about 16 years have replaced both fans several times and auger motor once. now my problem is the stove will start and run but shut off after 10 mins no matter how hot and well burning it is.my question is which temp sensor controls this shut down--the one on the exhaust or in the burn area?


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## SmokeyTheBear (Feb 16, 2013)

The POF it is against the exhaust blower housing on a lot of units and frequently if it is a ceramic unit it just needs to be cleaned. It could be bad but a simple wipe with a damp cloth can work wonders if it was dirty.


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## enviro pyro (Feb 18, 2013)

SmokeyTheBear said:


> The POF it is against the exhaust blower housing on a lot of units and frequently if it is a ceramic unit it just needs to be cleaned. It could be bad but a simple wipe with a damp cloth can work wonders if it was dirty.


thanks smokey! cleaned it off and its running fine again-appreciate the advice and quick response


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