# Emergency Generator



## jensent (Sep 19, 2013)

Anyone having good luck with a portable generator over any period of time. We seem to be having more power outages than we used to. Outages seem to come with heavy storms and as a result our sump pumps don't function.  Looks like we need about 5000 running watts and 7000 starting watts. Lets hear what works for you.
Thanks
Tom


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## Backwoods Savage (Sep 19, 2013)

That is a pretty good sized generator Tom. One thing we have done is to not try to run everything at once. We'll hook up refrigerators and freezers for a while. Then water pump, etc. Most times our power is not out for a long time but we did have it out 3 days a year ago. We got along fine with a 3500.


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## thetooth (Sep 19, 2013)

I to have a 3500 watt . I bought it from Tractor Supply for $300 , I did not want to spend $700 on such a infrequent tool . 3500 watts should cover a fridge and sump pump plus some . Here is a link with some wattage requirements 

Top Generator Ratings | Generator Buying Guide – Consumer Reports


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## jensent (Sep 19, 2013)

Hi Dennis
Actually the size of the generator that I show is just a little less than needed to run  our 3 sump pumps. I have yet to need 3 at the same time but this spring ran 2 pumps for 16 hours continuously. We had 7in of rain that morning which is unusual. What generator are you using? Two smaller generators might be better than one larger one.
Hope everyone is well.
Tom


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## shawn6596 (Sep 19, 2013)

I have an old coleman 10 hp, 5000 watts I believe.  The trick is when you power up the house you have to bring it up slowly.  I shut off all the breakers in the house including the main, you don't want to back feed the power lines.  Then I fire up the generator and plug it into the 220 in the shop.  After its warmed up I go in the house and turn on the garage breaker(that powers the up panel).  then I turn on the well pump and let it cycle.  then I turn on the breakers one at a time in order to slowly load the generator.  once everything is on I can run the house like I am hooked to the pole.  it is just big enough.   If I remember right the last time the power was out It was summer and we ran the house for 7 days on 15 gallons of gas, AC and all.  The way I see it, it is better to have too much power than not enough.  Generators now a days seem to be way overrated.  3500 watts is not even big enough to run a compressor and a curricular saw at the same time.   One of the things I like to do to keep it fresh and running is use it in the yard.  I have an electric pole saw, so I throw the generator in the gator and go trim limbs.  last year I went to the neighbors and trimmed, she was ecstatic.  Sometimes I fire it up and leave it run for 1/2 hour or so just to let it run.  There's nothing worse than the powers out and trying to clean out a carb in the dark with a flashlight.  If you watch CL there are always generators on there for pretty cheap.  Here's one for $175


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## BrotherBart (Sep 19, 2013)

I have a whole house power monitor so I know that without the well pump or water heater running the joint uses .07 KWH, 700 watts continuous,  per hour with all of the comforts on. So the genny shack has two 3500/2500 generators in case one craps out or if I need an extra kick for something like cooking in the kitchen in the microwave or duel hot plate. Sitting next to them is the 5,000 watt puppy I have had for years. It is only fired to kick the well pump or water heater. 

We have done seven day outages three times in the last eight years. So the little ones save me a ton of money in gas for normal usage. That bigger one drinks gas like a hog. And in most of the extended outages we can't get out of our 900 foot snow buried driveway to drop into a gas station.

A 3500/2500 will get you through most outages with lights, fridge, computers and TV. And sip gas.

(And before the sine wave crowed steps in I ain't wrecked a TV, computer, fridge or server yet running them for seven days at a time.)


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## flhpi (Sep 19, 2013)

Lots of people I know bought the large generators that suck fuel, are heavy are loud.  I bought a small one that I can team with another one if needed and it sips gas.

Right now I just dont need more generator.  In summer it has run a small AC at night and I can keep the fridge chilled by running it every so often.

The portability of the small gen is great when its dark, raining and the gf is home alone.  Once again, I don't need a big genny but your needs may vary.

Best of luck with your search.


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## Retired Guy (Sep 20, 2013)

We has a 4000 watt portable unit that ran the refrigerator, well pump (1/2 hp), gas furnace, couple of lights and tv. It worked well. Keeping fuel fresh and in enough quantity was the problem. Installed a NG whole house unit a couple years ago.


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## Fi-Q (Sep 20, 2013)

I have a 3000/4000 watt champion generator. Thy are pretry cheap and have good review. I cannot run my well pump with it ( tht is anotehr project). It will run everyrhing in the house to keep us comfortable and is not too hard on gas. If you go around the webs there is hundreds of generator threads. Its all up too you, your need, ect..... But its true tht a big genny can be an issue with sucking hughe quantity of gas. Having 2 can be a good deal. Lot of people are also leaning towards  diesel, but it in a diffeent range budget.


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## jharkin (Sep 20, 2013)

I have a cheap 3250 (3750 starting)  generac that I bought at the blue box, wired to the house through a 240 inlet box and transfer panel.  

Its been more than enough to run the 1/3hp sump pump on one leg with house lights and even occasional use of the toaster or microwave on the other.


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## MrWhoopee (Sep 20, 2013)

shawn6596 said:


> I have an old coleman 10 hp, 5000 watts I believe.  The trick is when you power up the house you have to bring it up slowly.  I shut off all the breakers in the house including the main, you don't want to back feed the power lines.  Then I fire up the generator and plug it into the 220 in the shop.  After its warmed up I go in the house and turn on the garage breaker(that powers the up panel).  then I turn on the well pump and let it cycle.  then I turn on the breakers one at a time in order to slowly load the generator.  once everything is on I can run the house like I am hooked to the pole.  it is just big enough.   If I remember right the last time the power was out It was summer and we ran the house for 7 days on 15 gallons of gas, AC and all.  The way I see it, it is better to have too much power than not enough.  Generators now a days seem to be way overrated.  Sometimes I fire it up and leave it run for 1/2 hour or so just to let it run.  There's nothing worse than the powers out and trying to clean out a carb in the dark with a flashlight.  If you watch CL there are always generators on there for pretty cheap.  Here's one for $175


 
This is the basic process I use to power-up my house. I have a Honda EU3000is (2800 continuous watts), which provides very smooth, stable power for the electronics, is extremely quiet and economical to operate. Not a cheap generator by any means, but very high quality with easy, electric starting. It will run my refrigerator, freezer, TV, etc. Heidi's hair-dryer is another matter. It will not, however, run my well or my water heater. For that I have an old 5000 watt Generac. It is hard to start (10 hp B&S, pull start), noisy, thirsty and produces low quality power (the microwave and stove blowers sound like they're running at half speed). I exercise them every month or two and shut them down by turning off the fuel supply valve, allowing the carb to run dry. This eliminates the problems related to fuel evaporating in the carb.  I don't leave much gas in my generators, I put fresh gas in them when the power goes out. They do make portable propane generators that eliminate the problems associated with gas.

http://www.northerntool.com/shop/to...erator&mkwid=sfwm1UeKz&pcrid=18901096151&mt=b


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## Backwoods Savage (Sep 20, 2013)

jensent said:


> Hi Dennis
> Actually the size of the generator that I show is just a little less than needed to run  our 3 sump pumps. I have yet to need 3 at the same time but this spring ran 2 pumps for 16 hours continuously. We had 7in of rain that morning which is unusual. What generator are you using? Two smaller generators might be better than one larger one.
> Hope everyone is well.
> Tom



Tom, I can't tell you without going to the barn to see what it is.   But I can tell you I bought it at Home Depot. We've had it several years and got a great buy on it. We'd been in the market for a while and one day we walked into HD and they were putting out some new ones. I casually mentioned something about the price and the guy perked right up. Said they had one left of the previous year's model I could have for $150 less than the new ones. I grabbed it.

I wasn't thinking about the sump pumps when I originally posted. We don't have them here so it just didn't register with my feeble mind.


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## begreen (Sep 21, 2013)

jensent, do you have heavy loads that need a big genset like a well pump, sewer pump system? If not consider a smaller genset and manage the loads. We run our house on less than 2000 watts on the generator. The main reason for this is runtime per gallon of fuel. Our outages can last many days and there is a good chance that the gas stations will be out of power too. For that reason we have switched to a 2.4kw  propane generator. The fuel doesn't get stale and the generator is miserly.


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## stee6043 (Sep 21, 2013)

I tried and tried to convince myself to buy a Honda 5 or 6 years ago and just couldn't do it for a generator.  For something I use 3 or 4 times a year I couldn't justify it.

  So I ended up with a Coleman Powermate (I think?) with a Subaru motor.  5500 watts, I think 6500 peak.  I run a gen panel in the house that powers the well pump, sump pump, fridge, furnace, some lights, etc.  Plenty of juice in mine to handle the load.  The well pump being the biggest hit of anything in my house.

  For the $500 or so I paid I'm very pleased with the purchase and have had...knock on wood....zero problems in 5+ years.  I picked mine up at the Home Depot.


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## Seasoned Oak (Sep 21, 2013)

Problem with a generator is you have to run it on a regular basis to keep the fuel fresh or it will gum up the works and wont run.(unless its a propane model) Which is what happened to mine. So instead i bought a water powered sump pump. Darn thing pumps more water than the electric ones. 
Even when the power goes out the water remains on. Problem solved.


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## shawn6596 (Sep 21, 2013)

Water powered sump pump???????  I need details


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## Seasoned Oak (Sep 21, 2013)

Pump is powered by your municipal water supply. Got it from amazon ,about $160.


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## shawn6596 (Sep 21, 2013)

I found a this old house video of them explaining one.  It would be awesome if you lived in town.  I have never lived in town.  I feel for a lot of us it is no power no well.  That is why I sized my generator large enough to run the whole house.


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## jharkin (Sep 21, 2013)

But remember that the water powered one adds a lot of volume to the discharge water, make sure it has someplace to go.

Here we have town wells. In a short outage water stays on. In a long one effecting the entire town water could be effected.


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## jharkin (Sep 21, 2013)

Seasoned Oak said:


> Problem with a generator is you have to run it on a regular basis to keep the fuel fresh or it will gum up the works and wont run.(unless its a propane model) Which is what happened to mine. So instead i bought a water powered sump pump. Darn thing pumps more water than the electric ones.
> Even when the power goes out the water remains on. Problem solved.



Run it every 3 months for 30min, close the fuel shutoff, let it run dry and drain the tank into the mower. Problem solved.


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## Seasoned Oak (Sep 21, 2013)

jharkin said:


> Run it every 3 months for 30min, close the fuel shutoff, let it run dry and drain the tank into the mower. Problem solved.


I dont have to do any kind of maintainence with the Water pump at all. Its a simple no-hassle solution for me. ITs my backup sump pump. My back up heat is the wood stove.


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## Seasoned Oak (Sep 21, 2013)

jharkin said:


> But remember that the water powered one adds a lot of volume to the discharge water, make sure it has someplace to go.
> Here we have town wells. In a short outage water stays on. In a long one effecting the entire town water could be effected.


It pump 3-4 gallons of water out for every gallon it uses. A fair trade off.


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## stee6043 (Sep 21, 2013)

Seasoned Oak said:


> Problem with a generator is you have to run it on a regular basis to keep the fuel fresh or it will gum up the works and wont run.(unless its a propane model) Which is what happened to mine. So instead i bought a water powered sump pump. Darn thing pumps more water than the electric ones.
> Even when the power goes out the water remains on. Problem solved.



5+  years and mine gets run every 3-6 months, max.  In the summer it may run more frequently depending on the storms.  I've never added fuel treatment, never drained the tank.  Haven't had any problems yet...knock on wood.


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## simple.serf (Sep 21, 2013)

If you just want to run a pump, the water powered units are great...unless you are dependent on a well.

I have an MEP-002a military diesel that will run the whole house without any problems, and I don't have to worry about the fuel going bad. I think I paid $3500 for it. That was load tested on a M116a2 trailer. Yes, it's loud, and you need some knowledge of both diesel engines and generators to keep it going, but it's fairly cheap for what it will do. The other option is one of the Yanmar converted mil surplus units.

We loose power quite a bit here, so it makes sense for me to use this type of generator. You may not need something so large/heavy duty if you only need a genset once a year or so. In the last year, I put 30 hrs on mine, most of which was in use time, not testing.


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## velvetfoot (Sep 21, 2013)

simple.serf said:


> I don't have to worry about the fuel going bad.


Diesel can get stuff growing in it as well, I believe.  I put some biocide additive in my fuel oil tank just in case, since we don't use that much anymore.


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## Seasoned Oak (Sep 21, 2013)

A lot depends on how often you lose power. Iv lived in the same house for 25 years and never been out for more than a few hours. And even that is rarely. Even in the dead of winter a few hours is no problem. So no need for me to spend thousands on a large generator. Worst case scenario for me is no power in a flooding situation so hence the water powered sump pump.


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## KaptJaq (Sep 21, 2013)

In 2011 we had Hurricane Irene and were out for 7 days.  In 2012 Sandy followed by a Northeaster knocked the lights out for 11 days.  Other than those we get one or two short outages a year, a couple of days or less.

I have a Honda 6500em.  I don't touch it the first day the lights are out. Enough hot water in the insulated tank & the stove provides heat.  Candle light is fun the first day. If by the second day there is no light at the end of the tunnel I roll it out, fuel it up, plug it into the house, and start it.  Runs everything except the AC and has a pretty good fuel management & response to load program.

When the lights come back on I drain the tank, run it dry, mist it, change the oil, and put it away.  It has never failed to start and run smooth.

I have 2 full five gallon gas cans in the shed.  Between the outboard on the runabout and other "toys" I usually refill at least one a month. If I haven't used them recently I dump them in the pick-up and refill them.  Fresh gas is important...

KaptJaq


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## simple.serf (Sep 22, 2013)

velvetfoot said:


> Diesel can get stuff growing in it as well, I believe.  I put some biocide additive in my fuel oil tank just in case, since we don't use that much anymore.



That's true, although I haven't had many issues with this in the past. I usually dump a can of anti-gel/biocide in my tank right before I have It filled. If you don't treat your tank, the trick is to watch for moisture contamination. The bacteria likes to grow right at the line between the water and the diesel. I have an untreated farm tank right now with moisture in it that I am trying to deal with. Lots of Diesel 911 and biocide in that tank right now, with none of it going into any diesel engine.


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## DuckDog (Sep 22, 2013)

Back in 98 (I was still living with mom and dad) we were nailed hard by the ice storm.  We were out of power for 17 days. 
Just months before I'd bought a generator for a hunt camp I was a part of.  Honda EZ5000.  The 5000 would have provided everything we needed but since we were not set up with a backfeed panel we were only able to run what ran on a standard extension cord. No deep well pump, no hot water.  That was the only thing we missed.

The 5000 has more than enough to run everything but not all at once.  They now have the correct panel that allows them to feed the main panel by the generator.  The only things they are careful of would be the deep well pump and hot water. They flip the breaker on one when running the other.  They always use stabilized gas in it and every 6 months run the system for a full tank.  24-48 hour power outages are not uncommon.


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## rowerwet (Sep 22, 2013)

if you have a Prius, and most likely most other hybrid cars also, you have a great power source for average small house hold demands. Toyota dealers can sell and install an inverter that will give you a good supply of 110v electricity. You turn the car on, and plug in the extension cord. the charging system will start the engine and recharg the battery banks as needed. I don't know if Ford or Chevy offer this also, but anybody with a good knowledge of the car and electricity could use a multimeter to find the best place to hook up an inverter that would do the same thing on any hybrid car.
I have a Homlite with the Subaru engine, from what I know the Subaru engines are more reliable and quieter than B&S or any china made stuff. I wouldn't spring for a honda powered unit unless I planned on weekly or daily use. 
The homelite powered us for about a week during the big ice storm a few years ago, when I lived in Maine I used the generator almost monthly for power failures. since then I've moved and haven't touched the generator since.


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## Halligan (Sep 22, 2013)

I've been using a 2000 watt Honda for the last 4 years and it sips fuel. However, I recently moved into a new house with a well pump and the Honda will not run it. Also, my job dictates that during severe weather events I may be gone for a day or two. Therefore I just installed a 20kw propane powered standby generator with automatic transfer switch. Now I don't have to worry about the wife and kids if I'm not home. If I'm home though the Honda will be used during the day to power the fridge. In the evening I'll use the big one for shower needs and to run the AC before bed.


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## seige101 (Sep 22, 2013)

Halligan said:


> I've been using a 2000 watt Honda for the last 4 years and it sips fuel. However, I recently moved into a new house with a well pump and the Honda will not run it. Also, my job dictates that during severe weather events I may be gone for a day or two. Therefore I just installed a 20kw propane powered standby generator with automatic transfer switch. Now I don't have to worry about the wife and kids if I'm not home. If I'm home though the Honda will be used during the day to power the fridge. In the evening I'll use the big one for shower needs and to run the AC before bed.


You might want to test that plan out. The propane generators usually have a block/carb heater that runs on utility power until an outtage occurs. If you shut the generator off for several hours in the cold you might now be able to restart it.


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## Jaugust124 (Sep 22, 2013)

I bought the Troy-Bilt from Lowes about a year and a half ago.  7000 running watts and 10,500 starting watts.  Consumer Reports rates it #1 if that means anything. Only had to use it once since I purchased it for about an hour.  Wired it into the breaker box with a transfer switch and bought one of those plastic deck boxes to keep it out of the weather.  Probably have about $1500 invested.  Still way cheaper than one of the standby generators.


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## woodgeek (Sep 22, 2013)

I'll vote for the Harbor Freight, rated at 800W after run in.  I think it actually doesn't trip until 1000W  Ran all my loads for 5+ days after Sandy, on 7 gals of fuel.  Ran Fridge, sump, insert blower, wifi router, handheld electronics, laptops, and numerous cfl lights, with 'load management'.  Have 2 propane camp stoves for cooking.  $100 delivered.


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## simple.serf (Sep 23, 2013)

woodgeek said:


> I'll vote for the Harbor Freight, rated at 800W after run in.  I think it actually doesn't trip until 1000W  Ran all my loads for 5+ days after Sandy, on 7 gals of fuel.  Ran Fridge, sump, insert blower, wifi router, handheld electronics, laptops, and numerous cfl lights, with 'load management'.  Have 2 propane camp stoves for cooking.  $100 delivered.



Those little things are awesome! I had one that saw use when I didn't need the big boy or the 2500W medium boy.  I ran all of the lights at our wedding with one, and it ran for 3 days straight stopping only for gas for setup, during the wedding, and teardown. It was easy to throw in the truck for lighting when working in parking lots and when using small tools. Mine did throw a rod, however, but this was after at least 500 hrs of runtime, which isn't too bad for something made out of Chinesium. BTW, use 40:1, not 50:1.


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## Halligan (Sep 23, 2013)

seige101 said:


> You might want to test that plan out. The propane generators usually have a block/carb heater that runs on utility power until an outtage occurs. If you shut the generator off for several hours in the cold you might now be able to restart it.


 
Good point. It does have a carb heater as you described. The heater has a regular plug on it that plugs into an outlet within the generator housing. I suppose I could run an extension cord from the Honda and plug it in.


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## shawn6596 (Sep 23, 2013)

Not that I would ever own a prius, but thats an awesome fact.  Now they need to make a hybrid silverado.


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## rowerwet (Sep 23, 2013)

shawn6596 said:


> Not that I would ever own a prius, but thats an awesome fact.  Now they need to make a hybrid silverado.


I believe GM is working on it or already sells a full size SUV with the hybrid tech, it actually gives a better return on the mileage for a big heavy truck than a smaller car. 
Hybrid doesn't intrest me, computers and anything I want to rely on for years = a bad idea. I work on airplanes for a living, we take care of the big passenger jets for the whole airport, 95% of the calls for maintenance are a computer error... shut it down, reload, and everything is good.. until next time...


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## G6 at Snook TX (Sep 25, 2013)

If you like to weld, double up and get a Miller Bobcat or Lincoln Ranger. Or if you can find a Lincoln Weldanpower from the 1980s (get the Briggs motor, not the Onan--parts availability) you ca get them for not much more than a smaller generator, and you have more power. About $750. For a standalone generator, I am satisfied with my HF knockoff that I keep treated gas in and run dry to store. It is 3500 size and has treated me right. When buying from Harbor Freight, always look for the coupons.


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## Seasoned Oak (Sep 25, 2013)

shawn6596 said:


> Not that I would ever own a prius, but thats an awesome fact.  Now they need to make a hybrid silverado.


They already do,but it dont sell well is very expensive and has that annoying stop -start feature. That would just drive me crazy that the engine shuts off at every stop sign. Ill pass.
GIve me an electric truck with a small diesel generator range extender and ill be happy. Yea i know, they dont exist.


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## mass_burner (Sep 25, 2013)

I got the Prius 2004 generator. I have a hidden plug behind the tail light that plugs into an inverter I keep under the rear deck. I have a dedicated cord going from my garage door up to behind my fridge. I pull out the fridge, swap plugs, plug in the inverter at the car, turn on the car. I get 1500 quiet watts which enough for fridge, DVD player, stove fan. I am also getting an APC or battery pack for that I can plug in and move around the house as needed for lights etc (it can also be recharged by the Prius).

There is an additional way to tie into the 3000W HV battery, but I haven't tried that yet.


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## slindo (Sep 25, 2013)

I've got  a 3500 watt Champion from TSC. If you stack a sale with a coupon you can get them as low as $250. Typical Chinese genset, but a better quality one (Champion supposedly has their own factory in China but it is hard to know what that means) and full parts and reachable technical support. Motor is a really sweet Honda GX clone that so far has been excellent Starts so easy it often fires when I am just pulling out the rope slowly to get the gas moving so I have never regretted not having electric start.  I greatly prefer a good quality GX clone to the old flattie Briggs a lot of low end American made generators come with, it starts much easier and burns less gas.

Nice  thing about cheap import gens is you an afford  to keep some spares. Probably the most likely thing to give trouble is the voltage regulator. A new one for our Champion costs about $25. We had a friend who has to replace the VR on his Generac, it has a two board regulator, and the boards are about $200 each! If I was less fanatical about gas issues I'd probably keep a spare carb on hand too  for another $25 or so.


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## maple1 (Sep 26, 2013)

I think I've gone full circle in my generator thinking.

I had (still have it) a cheap Chinese 3500 watt one from Walmart (needed one in a hurry, ugggh). It was OK, does my well pump but kinda barely - but I didn't want to have to string extension cords when the power went out. So I got a 6500 Craftsman that could do the whole house. But I soon found out it is very thirsty (and noisy) with the B&S that runs full honk all the time, and gas comsumption in a power outage can be a problem when you live in the middle of nowhere. Plus its a bear to move around & takes up space. And, I now don't feel comfortable plugging computer & electronic stuff into either one - I don't want to have to go big-screen shopping again for a long time. So now I think I will sell the big one & get an inverter gen in the 2000 range to go with the 3500 one I still have. After thinking more, I don't have anything that needs 240 when the power is out, and could get by with no issues with both once in a while & likely just the 2000 most of the time - and the power has not gone out much the last 2-3 years (knock on wood).

So, I think another Honda is in my future....


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## velvetfoot (Sep 26, 2013)

I might lean towards keeping the larger one;  don't have to run the well pump that much, nice to have some extra capacity, maybe lose more money trying to sell.


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## btuser (Sep 26, 2013)

I've got a 6500w  portable generator with a transfer switch.  One thing to think about is whether or not a generator has a bonded neutral, and a lot of other little things if you're going to do it right.    This size is enough for my boiler and well pump to work simultaneously.  We use it about 8-12hrs/day when the power is out and it comes to about 5-6 gal, more than some but micromanaging my women with the lights out is a calculated risk I'm not willing to make.

My generator does not have permanent magnets. Most portables don't.   It needs to be under UNDER LOAD to charge the dew-hickies, or so I've read.


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## rowerwet (Sep 26, 2013)

look for a large gas tank on any portable generator, the kind that act as a cover for the motor and generator, little lawn mower type tanks will leave you in the dark every few hours, my generator will run 10+ hrs on a ta_nk_


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## shawn6596 (Sep 26, 2013)

rowerwet said:


> look for a large gas tank on any portable generator, the kind that act as a cover for the motor and generator, little lawn mower type tanks will leave you in the dark every few hours, my generator will run 10+ hrs on a tank



Just my opinion Mine runs for 2-3 hours on 1 tank.  Then I shut it down and let it cool off.  I like it that way.  It keeps me from running it to death.  If it was liquid cooled I would agree with you.


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## OutdoorGuy (Sep 27, 2013)

A generator of that size is going to be fairly expensive. I agree to look into running things separately to reduce the amount of power required. I would recommend looking into a mid-sized portable generator for your needs.


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## BrotherBart (Sep 27, 2013)

It doesn't take many $35 half days of running to get ya looking at one that will run 10 hours on half the gas. And appreciate electric rates.


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## rowerwet (Sep 27, 2013)

shawn6596 said:


> Just my opinion Mine runs for 2-3 hours on 1 tank.  Then I shut it down and let it cool off.  I like it that way.  It keeps me from running it to death.  If it was liquid cooled I would agree with you.


I've heard the cheaper engines in the cheaper generators need a cool down, the subaru engine in mine ran for about a week, it was only shut off during refueling due to fire danger. of course this was in december in Maine, August down south could be a different issue.


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## rowerwet (Sep 27, 2013)

BrotherBart said:


> It doesn't take many $35 half days of running to get ya looking at one that will run 10 hours on half the gas. And appreciate electric rates.


my gas is free, I kept 5 5 gallon jugs of 100 low lead from work on standby. If I had to buy it the price would hurt today...


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## BrotherBart (Sep 27, 2013)

Hope it isn't too far over a year old. When I worked for an oil company I asked the lab guys about shelf life of gasoline in containers. They said a little over a year for 100 octane and then it heads down the degrading curve.

The octane lab guys said that winter blend 100 , jacked up with butane, will have a shorter life because the butane evaporates. Three months with Ethanol blends. And that after two years any of it is gonna give ya trouble.


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## shawn6596 (Sep 27, 2013)

I found this one on CL if any is looking for something small just to run a few things


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## BrotherBart (Sep 27, 2013)

Those show up on CL here too and sometimes I am tempted.


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## chazcarr (Sep 27, 2013)

For what it is worth I have a Generac Ultrasource 8000W generator and it has gotten me through both freak October Storms and a blown transformer (10 days there).

Runs about 12-15 hours on 8 gallons of gas.  It has some type of load regulator that drops it into idle unless there is a direct load on it.  

It has unfortunately become necessary in my area over the last few years as CL+P cannot do much right.


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## BrotherBart (Sep 27, 2013)

Those idle regulators are interesting. Most don't drop down until the load is under 12 watts. No house is using less than 12 watts. Might be good at a construction site where the tools are turned off but I don't see any value in it for powering a house.

Neighbor just bought the 8,000 watt Generac that has it so we shall see.


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## rowerwet (Sep 29, 2013)

BrotherBart said:


> Hope it isn't too far over a year old. When I worked for an oil company I asked the lab guys about shelf life of gasoline in containers. They said a little over a year for 100 octane and then it heads down the degrading curve.
> 
> The octane lab guys said that winter blend 100 , jacked up with butane, will have a shorter life because the butane evaporates. Three months with Ethanol blends. And that after two years any of it is gonna give ya trouble.


100ll has no ethanol, I keep it rotated by burning it in the lawn mowers and snowblower. since it comes for free, I will dump any that sits a whole season and refill it with fresh. the suppliers say it is very stable and can sit in barrels for a few years before it is unusable. guys still have stockpiles of it in 55 gallon drums that get bought and sold up in Alaska. the question comes up often, and the experts say out of the sun and filtered through a shamie it is fine.


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## BrotherBart (Sep 29, 2013)

rowerwet said:


> 100ll has no ethanol



Look at the pump. A lot of it has since 2007.

I will stick with the opinion of the guys in the Exxon refinery octane lab where I was told about this stuff.


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## MrWhoopee (Sep 29, 2013)

shawn6596 said:


> I found this one on CL if any is looking for something small just to run a few things


 Pull start?


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## rowerwet (Sep 30, 2013)

BrotherBart said:


> Look at the pump. A lot of it has since 2007.
> 
> I will stick with the opinion of the guys in the Exxon refinery octane lab where I was told about this stuff.


100LL is airplane gas, ethanol is garbage being foisted on the tax payers to get algore to win the Iowa caucuses (he admited it recently) ethanol in an airplane engine will detonate (pre ignite) and destroy the engine rapidly. I worked at a flight school that had aircraft that could run the autogas STC (an FAA aproved modification to the operation of the airplane) the STC is VERY  clear that no ethanol is allowed. The flight school being cheap didn't listen. Until the second engine failed after detonation burned away the top of the aluminum piston and the piston ring came loose. the first piston had a hole burned right through it
The FAA took away their STC aproval after that, today thanks to the corn growers subsidy, (ethanol) no aircraft can run the autogas STC. It was only an issue during the winter back then ('95)


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## BrotherBart (Sep 30, 2013)

Yeah I didn't pick up on the LL in your other post.


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## rowerwet (Sep 30, 2013)

MrWhoopee said:


> Pull start?


that would run the whole neigborhood... and drain the wallet...


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## Hearth Mistress (Sep 30, 2013)

I'm a little late to party, work keeps interrupting my forum time 

Anyway, after the freak October winter storm in 2011, that knocked out our power for 9 days a friend of my dad sold us a 7500 watt gas gene he used a few times, wife hated it so he installed a big ol automatic generac propane back up system. Best $250 I ever spent (We also bought our wood stove after this storm too)

We were out electric 19 days with Sandy.  We ran it a few hours a day for the chest freezer, fridge and using a REALLY long cord to the neighbors pump to keep his basement from flooding.  When we finally found out the house was safe to go back into, we also ran it at night for a few lights and my hubby's breathing machine.  We eventually had to siphon our cars for gas as even if you could get out to a station, they were out or didn't have power either.

It saved us, not even an ice cube melted in our freezer, others lost all their food.

I just had an electrician out last week to get a price to have it hooked to the breaker box and plan on doing that, especially so we have water, that was the only struggle during Sandy, well water, no electric, no water. 

Worth every penny if you ask me


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## Bad Wolf (Sep 30, 2013)

I got a 7550/13500 watt Troy-Bilt about 7yrs ago, wired it up as a whole house with an interlock on the panel.  Never needed it until Irene in 2011 (6 days) then Sandy in 2012 (5 days) Would run everything in the house including the well pump (3/4 hp). I'd run it for a few hours in the morning for showers and breakfast then for another 4-5 hours in the evening for dinner, showers, watching TV and annoying the neighbors. Consumed about 3 quarts/hr.  For the rest of the time I have a 2000 watt Champion inverter. That ran the fridge, freezer, TV and the computers. Would have also run the furnace (Tarm) but didn't need it in September/October. The Champion would run for 9-10 hours on a gallon. Took a little bit of work to switch things around but I think I got the best of both worlds.  I had power 24/7 for 7 gallons a day. I keep 40-50 gallons on hand and rotate through it. Still beat the hell out of losing all my food and going to a motel.

I put up a sign at my desk at work that said: "No I don't have power, Yes I have a generator, No you can't come over."

As a back up to my back up I have a 1800 amp/hr battery bank and an automatic transfer switch for the furnace and pumps, with a solar panel to keep it charged and recharge during the day it should be good for 4-5 days all by itself.

After all that I'll probably never lose power again.  What you have to remember is you're not planning for the end of the world, just a few days with out power.  While a whole house gen set with auto transfer and an infinite gas supply is nice, you can get by with a smaller manual system for a fraction of the cost.


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## rowerwet (Oct 2, 2013)

my current house is all set for no power, city water, natural gas, the only stupid part.. an electric stove/oven  who puts that in in a house with natural gas!? so any cooking will be on the woodstove/ gas grill. I've got enough gas for a few days on the generator.
In a pinch for gas? check with your local airport, they keep a couple thousand gallons of leaded gas in tanks/trucks, while it will ruin your car's emisions controls, it will burn just fine in generators, pumps, chainsaws, etc. Most even have JetA which is super clean kerosene, it will run in your oil furnace just fine, and will run ok in a diesel engine. the JetA will be in a truck and can be pumped or drained with no power.


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## simple.serf (Oct 2, 2013)

rowerwet said:


> my current house is all set for no power, city water, natural gas, the only stupid part.. an electric stove/oven  who puts that in in a house with natural gas!? .



Me.

Seen what gas can do. 

BTW, be sure to check your diesel engine specs before running JetA. While my Genset can run on it, It is limited to 400 hrs of continuous use (non WEP... If under fire, you have bigger problems... use whatever the hell you can dump in it) due to the lack of lubricity. Last I checked, Onan "J" series IPs are around $800.


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## Ram 1500 with an axe... (Oct 12, 2013)

I love this thread, I am learning a lot but now I need to make a decision, on what size I should buy...3200 vs. 5500
These are the items that I want to run....
Tv.240w,       Cable box 500w, insert fan.  Not sure how many watts, can't be more than 300 right? It is a 150cfm,    Refrigerator 900w, portable heater 1500w each, I have 2 of them, lights 400-600w? Possible computer for Internet.....I am near 2500 without the portable heaters. As well as make coffee etc when need be, I'd prefer one that sips gas....harbor freight has these two models for $300 vs $470.....6.5 horsepower vs. 13 horsepower...I appreciate any and all feedback...thanks....


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## woodgeek (Oct 12, 2013)

500W cable box?  (2) 1500W heaters?  600W of lights?  on a genny?   My 150 cfm insert fan is <100W

so, are you planning on doing load mgmt, or do you want to run all this stuff at the same time?

Seems to me like a little load mgmt is a lot less hassle than stocking/handling enough gas to run all that stuff.

Of course, I'm a weirdo and was content with 900W for 5 days.


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## jharkin (Oct 12, 2013)

That cable box is prob 50w not 500. And better put it on a power conditioner or ups to protect from load spikes if you don't buy an inverter gen.

Why do you want to use elec. space heaters if you have a wood stove?? Worse possible use of a Genny.

And to the 100LL users. We have been through this sooooooooo many times. Small engines are not meant to run on airplane gas! Better be checking your spark plugs for lead fouling and try not to breath the nasty exhaust.


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## Ram 1500 with an axe... (Oct 12, 2013)

Cable box said 500 watts on back.....
My insert is in the family room, I have a whole other section and upstairs that it will not heat....
I have 3 kids and a wife, during sandy last year we suffered without all of this, suffered is not the right word but if I have that list covered then we are good to go, that is why I am asking for your opinions to help me choose.... I'd really not want a gas hog


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## Ram 1500 with an axe... (Oct 12, 2013)

It's 6 things that I want to run...


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## jharkin (Oct 12, 2013)

Check the box on a killawatt, can't be 500. My HD DVR box draws about 70.

For the other loads, you can rotate. Fridge can be run a couple hours a day only and stay cold. 600 watts of lighting is just insane. Get some CFLs or light a few candles. Coffee pot uses 800 but it only takes 10min to brew, turn the heater off while using it.

Tell the kids its a camping trip. Read books, play board games. They will adapt to less.


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## Ram 1500 with an axe... (Oct 12, 2013)

I just googled cable boxes, there is a report that says they consume more energy in a year then refrigerators, I took the number off the back of my box and put it on my list. To try and make the right decision for my current needs....thanks


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## jharkin (Oct 12, 2013)

Totally understand, trying to help so you don't overspend on a gen.

I highly reccomend spending $30 on a kill-a-watt and measuring everything. Nameplates are sometimes max ratings and waaaaay off. The cable box may use more over a year than fridge because the fridge is intermittent.


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## woodgeek (Oct 12, 2013)

sorry to sound scornful....not at all.

Just that a too big generator is at least as bad as a too small one....doesn't get broken out and tested, large standby loss running through you gas, etc.  A little too small....you just manage some loads.


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## jharkin (Oct 12, 2013)

And I just checked, we got a new upgraded DVR box from vz, new one only uses 40w


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## MrWhoopee (Oct 12, 2013)

Ram 1500 with an axe... said:


> My insert is in the family room, I have a whole other section and upstairs that it will not heat....


 
I'd be looking into improving the heat distribution from the family room. Money spent there will save you plenty, aside from reducing the size of the generator.


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## BrotherBart (Oct 12, 2013)

My generator load just got a lot lighter. My new refrigerator has now run 48 hours. On just 2 KWH, defrost cycles and all.  The thing is using one third of the juice of the old one and one cubic foot larger capacity. 117 watts running and 700 defrost.


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## woodgeek (Oct 12, 2013)

jharkin said:


> Check the box on a killawatt, can't be 500. My HD DVR box draws about 70.
> 
> For the other loads, you can rotate. Fridge can be run a couple hours a day only and stay cold. 600 watts of lighting is just insane. Get some CFLs or light a few candles. Coffee pot uses 800 but it only takes 10min to brew, turn the heater off while using it.
> 
> Tell the kids its a camping trip. Read books, play board games. They will adapt to less.



I broke out a propane camp stove and made tea (and hot cocoa for the littles) and did w/o the coffeepot and microwave. Didn't miss the TV at all, games on the phones and iPad got a workout, though.


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## Ram 1500 with an axe... (Oct 12, 2013)

Thanks guys, I could have overstated the watts on the lights and the box could be the total maximum, are you seeing that I should be ok with the 3200?
How much more gas does a 13 Horsepower engine eat over  compared to a 6.5 and please don't say 6.5....


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## MrWhoopee (Oct 12, 2013)

Ram 1500 with an axe... said:


> Thanks guys, I could have overstated the watts on the lights and the box could be the total maximum, are you seeing that I should be ok with the 3200?


 
3200 should be plenty, without the electric heaters. Burning gasoline to make electricity to then convert to heat is EXTREMELY inefficient, a gas motor is (IIRC) only 10% efficient, and that's not counting the losses converting to electricity. You'd be MUCH better off with a couple of kerosene heaters like this:
http://www.northerntool.com/shop/to..._sku=173410&gclid=CNDsxrbwkboCFQnhQgodQxsACQx


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## Ram 1500 with an axe... (Oct 12, 2013)

MrWhoopee said:


> 3200 should be plenty, without the electric heaters. Burning gasoline to make electricity to then convert to heat is EXTREMELY inefficient, a gas motor is (IIRC) only 10% efficient, and that's not counting the losses converting to electricity. You'd be MUCH better off with a couple of kerosene heaters like this:
> http://www.northerntool.com/shop/tools/product_200442151_200442151?cm_mmc=Google-pla-_-Heaters, Stoves + Fireplaces-_-Kerosene Heaters-_-173410&ci_src=17588969&ci_sku=173410&gclid=CNDsxrbwkboCFQnhQgodQxsACQx


Inefficient? If I have no power,  but i do have a proper size generator and 2 portable electric heaters that will heat the area that I want, how is that inefficient?  That's the whole purpose of having a generator....I have the heaters, I use them as necessary, ie.basement both units heat my entire basement nicely in 30-50 minutes in the middle of winter, or kids room when I'm not turning on oil till the house really needs it...
I'm just trying to figure out if I should buy the 3200 or the 5500.....


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## BrotherBart (Oct 12, 2013)

Ram 1500 with an axe... said:


> Thanks guys, I could have overstated the watts on the lights and the box could be the total maximum, are you seeing that I should be ok with the 3200?
> How much more gas does a 13 Horsepower engine eat over  compared to a 6.5 and please don't say 6.5....



My nine horse genny eats almost exactly twice as much gas as my 6.5 horse one. Powering the same loads.


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## jharkin (Oct 12, 2013)

Ram 1500 with an axe... said:


> Inefficient? If I have no power,  but i do have a proper size generator and 2 portable electric heaters that will heat the area that I want, how is that inefficient?  That's the whole purpose of having a generator....I have the heaters, I use them as necessary, ie.basement both units heat my entire basement nicely in 30-50 minutes in the middle of winter, or kids room when I'm not turning on oil till the house really needs it...
> I'm just trying to figure out if I should buy the 3200 or the 5500.....



Its inneficient because a gas engine turns less than 20% of the energy in the fuel ( maybe as little as 10% for you small engine in a gen) into power to drive the crank, and then there are losses in the generator and wires as well.  Vs. Just burning that fuel in a heater inside the space which will turn all the energy to heat.

Put another way: It could take you 4 or 5 gallons of generator gas to put as many BTU into your living room as a wick style kerosene heater will make burning one gallon of K1 directly.


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## Ram 1500 with an axe... (Oct 12, 2013)

What your saying I'm sure is absolutely true, but that does not pertain to my situation is.  Kerosene heaters are banned in my state, I want to use what I have, I just want to purchase the right size unit..... Thanks for answering the question BB.


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## MrWhoopee (Oct 12, 2013)

Ram 1500 with an axe... said:


> What your saying I'm sure is absolutely true, but that does not pertain to my situation is.  Kerosene heaters are banned in my state, I want to use what I have, I just want to purchase the right size unit..... Thanks for answering the question BB.


 In that case, you will have to buy the big generator and suffer the fuel expense. You're talking 3000 watts of heaters alone.

Unless your particular municipality has banned kerosene heaters, they are not banned for use in single-family dwellings in N.J.

"In New Jersey, kerosene heaters are banned by law from
use in commercial establishments and multiple-family
dwellings. In addition, some municipalities have
ordinances that further restrict your use of kerosene
heaters and some types of electric heaters. You should check
with your local fire inspector to find out if your
municipality has any ordinances about space heaters."

http://www.state.nj.us/oag/ca/brief/heaters.pdf


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## BrotherBart (Oct 12, 2013)

If they are oil filled radiator heaters you could run them on low or medium using around six hundred or nine hundreds watts each.


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## Redbarn (Oct 12, 2013)

Ram 1500 with an axe... said:


> Thanks guys, I could have overstated the watts on the lights and the box could be the total maximum, are you seeing that I should be ok with the 3200?
> How much more gas does a 13 Horsepower engine eat over  compared to a 6.5 and please don't say 6.5....



Fuel use will depend on your loads.
In my case when powering the same loads, my 5500 watt old B&S genny uses 2 galls of gas every 3 hours and my 2000 watt Yamaha uses 0.5 gall every 3 hours.
As the small Honda/Yamahas are very fuel efficient, I agree with BB that a 9 hp genny would use double that of a 6.5. So a 13.5 genny will use at least 3x a 6.5.


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## Ram 1500 with an axe... (Oct 12, 2013)

Redbarn said:


> Fuel use will depend on your loads.
> In my case when powering the same loads, my 5500 watt old B&S genny uses 2 galls of gas every 3 hours and my 2000 watt Yamaha uses 0.5 gall every 3 hours.
> As the small Honda/Yamahas are very fuel efficient, I agree with BB that a 9 hp genny would use double that of a 6.5. So a 13.5 genny will use at least 3x a 6.5.


Great thanks... So now I need to see if I can get away with the 3200 because I want to save on the gas....


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## Ram 1500 with an axe... (Oct 12, 2013)

BrotherBart said:


> If they are oil filled radiator heaters you could run them on low or medium using around six hundred or nine hundreds watts each.


Yes you are right, thanks again....


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## Ram 1500 with an axe... (Oct 12, 2013)

MrWhoopee said:


> In that case, you will have to buy the big generator and suffer the fuel expense. You're talking 3000 watts of heaters alone.
> 
> Unless your particular municipality has banned kerosene heaters, they are not banned for use in single-family dwellings in N.J.
> 
> ...


Thank you for taking the time and effort to search about the kerosene, I had a heater in the house when I was young but I would just prefer to stay away from that route.... Those electric heaters wouldn't need to be running full blast all the time simultaneously, so  I may be able to get away with the 3200. But they are on the list of something I may want to use if need be...


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## shawn6596 (Oct 12, 2013)

with all the electronics you want to invest in something that makes clean power like a honda.  I doubt HF has anything that will not be harmful to all the components listed.  The Irony of a cable box is that a power outage is most likely caused by a downed line, probably from a tree.  most of the time when the power goes out the cable and phone are out also.


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## Ram 1500 with an axe... (Oct 12, 2013)

shawn6596 said:


> with all the electronics you want to invest in something that makes clean power like a honda.  I doubt HF has anything that will not be harmful to all the components listed.  The Irony of a cable box is that a power outage is most likely caused by a downed line, probably from a tree.  most of the time when the power goes out the cable and phone are out also.


Can you further explain clean power? So if I go cheap, I could be hurting my tv?


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## jharkin (Oct 12, 2013)

I wrote this on another generator thread recently re: clean power...

_Electronics like computers and TV's all convert the as power from you wall to DC internally to power the circuit, this conversion filters much of the noise and they are actually a lot less sensitive to the shape of the ac wave then we think. Problem is that cheap contractor generators use an rpm governor to maintain 3600 rpm to make 60 hz and 120v and as the load changes the lag in the governor reaction causes spikes and sags in both voltage and frequency. That does cause electronic damage.

The solution if you are willing to spend is to buy an inverter generator from Honda, Yamaha, Champion, etc. Inverters have other benefits as well - better fuel economy and typically much quieter.

Alternately a cheaper option is to hook up sensitive electronics to your generator via a good quality UPS or line conditioner. This is what I do. The UPS has to be a 'true sine wave' model ( I use APC SmarUPS). You will probably have to turn down the UPS voltage sensitivity or it may just go on battery even connected to the gen._


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## Ehouse (Oct 13, 2013)

BrotherBart said:


> My generator load just got a lot lighter. My new refrigerator has now run 48 hours. On just 2 KWH, defrost cycles and all.  The thing is using one third of the juice of the old one and one cubic foot larger capacity. 117 watts running and 700 defrost.




What brand and model?  I'm lookin' for one.


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## Bad Wolf (Oct 13, 2013)

Just  a point of interest.  My 7550 watt Troy-Bilt ran everything just fine except the washing machine. It would cycle but when it came to spin it would just click.  It is a newer one with electronic controls. Which is funny because the TV, computers, and all other electronics had no problem. I haven't tried it on the inverter generator but I assume that would work.

As for the heat, how about a propane heater like the "Big Buddy"? It will run on 16 oz. bottles or has an adaptor for a 20 lb bottle. It has 4,9, & 18K btu settings, and a battery powered fan. Even has a low O2 sensor so you can run it inside.  They claim you can run it on low for 220 hours with two 20lb bottles, but if you run it at medium and only get half that run time you are still looking at 2-3 days worth. Get an extra bottle and you're good for a week. I always have an extra bottle for the grill anyway. It goes for about $120 which is less than the difference between a small and a large generator, you can use it for camping and you would save a lot of gasoline.

I picked one up after Irene for $75, it had only been run 8 hours before his power came back on.  I got it to use at my mothers if it came to it.  I would bring her back to my place and leave the heater on low to keep pipes from freezing. She has a small, one level home in an over 55 community.

That's my worst case scenario, an ice storm followed by a cold snap. Power out for days in below freezing weather.  All of these hurricanes have been during mild weather, uncomfortable but not life threatening.


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## Treacherous (Oct 13, 2013)

I was just going to mention the Big Buddy as well.  I have a couple of them.  They also have a built in fan that you can run off AC or (4) D batteries.

http://www.mrheater.com/product.aspx?catid=41&id=116







Note: Different models required for California and Canada due to local regulations.
Designed and approved for emergency indoor & outdoor use
Automatic low oxygen shutoff system
Accidental tip-over safety shutoff
Heats up to 400 sq. ft.
Connects directly to two 1 lb. disposable cylinders or to a 20 lb. cylinder w/optional hose
CSA certified


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## Treacherous (Oct 13, 2013)

jharkin said:


> I wrote this on another generator thread recently re: clean power...
> 
> _Electronics like computers and TV's all convert the as power from you wall to DC internally to power the circuit, this conversion filters much of the noise and they are actually a lot less sensitive to the shape of the ac wave then we think. Problem is that cheap contractor generators use an rpm governor to maintain 3600 rpm to make 60 hz and 120v and as the load changes the lag in the governor reaction causes spikes and sags in both voltage and frequency. That does cause electronic damage.
> 
> ...



Since a lot of clocks are tied to the 60hz you will see the time on clocks off as well.  I've never played with a computer on anything but an Inverter generator so not sure what other affects there would be.

Robin Subaru made some decent models as well.  Costco has 2000 watt inverter model for about 599.  It is red and kinda looks like an EU2000i.  I thought they had it branded as Snap On but could be wrong.

I can run refrig, freezer, plasma tv, lights etc off of one of my Eu2000i's.  I've only plugged the two gens together as a test.


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## Retired Guy (Oct 13, 2013)

Sounds to me that the 500W might refer to te switched load that the box and control.


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## Ram 1500 with an axe... (Oct 13, 2013)

Ok, I pulled the trigger... I went with the 4000/3200 unit for $280
I figure why spend the extra money for something I may not have to use.
All I really need is the fridge, lights and insert fan to live comfortable, those things we missed during sandy....
When I get it, I will break it in and test it out and let you know what I think. I am capable of sending it back for free of need be....
ThAnk you all for your help and comments....


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## BrotherBart (Oct 13, 2013)

Ehouse said:


> What brand and model?  I'm lookin' for one.



Just a simple 18 cubic foot GE from Home Depot. All we need or can fit in the space.


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## rowerwet (Oct 13, 2013)

jharkin said:


> And to the 100LL users. We have been through this sooooooooo many times. Small engines are not meant to run on airplane gas! Better be checking your spark plugs for lead fouling and try not to breath the nasty exhaust.


so how many years more can I get out of my lawn mowers, snowblower, chainsaws, and generator? I have two so far on the lawnmowers, and more than that on the chainsaws. I clean and check the spark plugs on every airplane I work on every 100 hrs or 1 year. I know what a normal spark plug looks like, my lawnmowers and chainsaws get seasonal checks, the plugs look like a normal lead burner.
engines designed before unleaded gas have spark plugs made to operate at the correct temp to burn off lead at a normal mixture setting.
B&S and the rest haven't done much to change their engines, except to run them leaner (good for lead burn off) and Champion hasn't changed enough on their plugs to make a difference.
the only problem you could run into is running a full synthetic oil in 4 stroke motors with leaded gas. Synthetic oil doesn't keep the lead suspended and will cause sludge deposits. Any mineral oil naturaly will keep the oil suspended, multi-weight oils have a blend of mineral and synthetic and work just fine.
if you were born before unleaded gas was all gas statons sold, you remember how good gas smelled. Avgas stll smells that way, the exhaust smells great ! In 20+ years as an airplane mechanic I haven't met anyone the exhaust hurt.


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## 2biker (Oct 13, 2013)

Why is everyone in this forum trying to save 10 cents more then the other guy. You don' t realize the luxury of electricity until you have none. I use a 7k  Briggs & Stratton to run a 4000 sq ft house. Spending $35-40 a day on gas is a lot better then $200 a night for a hotel. So, my advice is " more is better". Don't be cheap and get a generator 1 watt more then your load, get something that won' t flicker your lights when you flush your toilet.


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## simple.serf (Oct 13, 2013)

There is a reason I have 3 generators. The Mil surp Diesel runs the whole place if needed. It also runs any 3 phase stuff that I need to run. The middle genset (2850 w, I think) is great when I need to run the compressor for the nail gun, or the house in a pinch. The 900 watt gets the most use in my work truck for charging batteries and running tools while working in parking lots.

Get more than what you need.

As to 100LL, it won't hurt the motor to run higher octane, and some of us still have stuff that needs leaded fuel (why pull the heads until it actually has to be done?)


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## velvetfoot (Oct 13, 2013)

Because you might not be able to get the gas when the gas stations don't have power, or aren't getting deliveries, like in Sandy.
For my well pump, I had to get a 7.5 kw (constant) generator to run it, cause the 5 kw generator already had wouldn't .  I also have a smaller one.


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## BrotherBart (Oct 13, 2013)

Yep. After several five to seven day outages with 900 feet of snow packed driveway between me and the road the quantity of gas needed became a huge issue. If around 2,500 watts will run this place, and it does nicely, for 22 hours of the day at half the consumption of my big genny then it is the one that runs. The big one only fired when the kick is needed.


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## 2biker (Oct 13, 2013)

Sandy was, "a hundred year storm", we may not have another one like Sandy in my lifetime. Using common sense, if we get another 36" blizzard, I' m going to have at least 60 gal of gas ready. That will give me 6 days to dig out before I need more.


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## Ram 1500 with an axe... (Oct 13, 2013)

2biker said:


> Why is everyone in this forum trying to save 10 cents more then the other guy. You don' t realize the luxury of electricity until you have none. I use a 7k  Briggs & Stratton to run a 4000 sq ft house. Spending $35-40 a day on gas is a lot better then $200 a night for a hotel. So, my advice is " more is better". Don't be cheap and get a generator 1 watt more then your load, get something that won' t flicker your lights when you flush your toilet.


I understand your point completely, I had no power or 8 days last year, my family missed heat, lights at night and tv of course.... But  having those things will make things much easier..... My family wouldn't  mind going camping a week, or two or three if We had them all...


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## Ram 1500 with an axe... (Oct 13, 2013)

2biker said:


> Sandy was, "a hundred year storm", we may not have another one like Sandy in my lifetime. Using common sense, if we get another 36" blizzard, I' m going to have at least 60 gal of gas ready. That will give me 6 days to dig out before I need more.


How exactly do you store 60 gal of gas?    Thanks...


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## Bad Wolf (Oct 13, 2013)

I have 11 jerry cans: 8 NATO and 3 regular red ones. Stop and Shop has a deal where you build up points and I can get up to $2.20 a gallon off up to 35 gallons.  Since the car only takes 15, I put the other 20 in cans and fill the cars as needed using the oldest gas first, so I fluctuate between 25 and 50 gallons on hand. I usually get enough points to max it out once a month. I figure the extra 20 gallons x $2.20 off is $44.00 per month. I guess I'm just cheap.
Anyway with this program the gas in never month than 2 months old so I don't have to add a stabilizer. If I see a storm coming I make sure everything is topped off.


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## 2biker (Oct 13, 2013)

How do I store 60 gallons?  Easy, one pickup truck holds 24 galls, the other holds 18,  (2) 5 gallon cans, and 8 gallons in the generator. I' ll siphon the trucks' gas tanks if needed.


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## woodgeek (Oct 14, 2013)

Different strokes guys.

Some folks will spend a **bundle** on a whole house backup that switches in automatically, with self testing, etc.   Others will roll out a big genny, and hook it into a manual transfer switch, and run most/all their 120V circuits.  Other (like me) will have a rather small genny, and snake a bunch of heavy duty extension cords around the house to run lights, fridge, insert, sump, and small electronics/wifi.

In the end my family was comfortable for 5 days using 6 gallons of gas and ~$250 worth of HF genny + associated gear.  Kids got a hot breakfast, and went to school on time, we cooked about half of our dinners at home, and got the rest takeout.  For me, the small genny is about ease of setup/replacement/testing (I have a bad back), and avoiding either storing/rotating a ton of gas on site or siphoning from vehicles.  Not saving money in a rare event.  I figure 3-5-day outages will happen about every 10 years in my area.

Which genny you chose depends on a lot of factors....wood heat vs none, well pump vs city water, need for AC during outage.  In the end, I have a well shaded house that needs little AC, city water, a wood stove, a big tank water heater and a family that likes to read books and play handheld electronic games.


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## shawn6596 (Oct 14, 2013)

I will say its nice to reconnect with the family when there is an outage, and everything is down.


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## chazcarr (Oct 14, 2013)

Just adding this as a side note:

I checked my electric bill a few months back and it had a $20 energy audit inspection offer.  I took them up on it.  
It was great, they changed all the lightbulbs to HE, left some tap filters, new shower heads, new barriers on the exterior doors, etc...   Best of all, they gave me two Kil-A-Watt devices included.  A good deal for $20.

I used those things to see how much energy stuff draws.  You will be surprised.  In the end though I had to go large (8000W)  because my water pump is insane.  Guess I have a really deep well.


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## KB007 (Oct 14, 2013)

For those of you using a large generator thru a xfr switch and a second smaller one, do you also run the smaller one thru the xfr switch and just not use the heavier demand circuits?

I have an 8000W B&S that runs into an L14-30 inlet on the side of the house.  Got bigger, mainly for the 30A and ability to run the well pump.

If you go to a smaller, do you simply make up a L14-20 to L14-30 cable or what do you do to run the smaller genny thru the xfr switch so you don't have to run extension cords?


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## velvetfoot (Oct 14, 2013)

yes, i made up a cord


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## kopeck (Oct 15, 2013)

Do you have a tractor?  If you do check out the PTO driven generators.

That's what I'm looking at.  Northern has a 7200 watt unit that would get most folks through a tough spot for a grand.  One less engine to maintain and quite a bit out output not to mention the engine that you are using is meant to run under load for a long time...

K


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