# adding on a bedroom [updated 11/15, new pics]



## m0jumb0 (Oct 12, 2009)

[update 11/15] everything is painted, closet shelves are up.  all we lack is carpet and the ceiling fan.  new pics at the end

[update 11/8] closet is built, most of the trim is up.  need to put in a threshold and put up trim strips over the paneling joints.  pics are at the end

[update 11/3] paneling is mostly done, just have to finish up the wall on the old house.  new pics at end of thread

[update 10/18] got the framing mostly done, ready to put the metal up on the roof... pics at end of thread

Here's my fall project.  We have another kid on the way and our little house is getting cramped so it's time to add on a new bedroom for the wife and I.  Should take 3 or 4 good full weekends of work to get it all finished.


From what the old-timers say, our house was built around 1904.  It's built on rock piers with a narrow crawlspace, no original insulation.  We decided to build on piers as well, but we're insulating everywhere we can in the new room.  Here I've got the frame laid out and I'm checking it for square:







We stapled chicken wire underneath the joists to keep the critters out of the fiberglass, and hold it up in case a piece let loose.  I also stapled the faces to the joists, so I'm not worried about anything falling:






My wife was kind enough to help with the chicken wire:






Putting in the last piece of insulation:






Not bad for a day's work... I seldom get everything done that I set out to do, but this was one of those rare days.  That tongue and groove OSB is a major PITA to get together though.  I about threw my hands up over that, but then I went and got my maul and put an 8' 2x4 along the edge and pounded it right into place.  Just needed some brute force


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## rowerwet (Oct 12, 2009)

my kitchen is built like that only the sill sits on foundation on 3.5 of the sides, it is the coldest room in the house, it has the chicken wire and insulation under the floor and blown in insulation in the walls. When I bought the house it had 9' of baseboard, I changed it to 20' of (stacked) baseboard. I think you will find the floor is cold (good candidate for carpet) and the outer walls being exposed will need to be insulated extra, you might want to look into spray foam insulation for the floor and walls as it also stops almost all air entry. 
How are you going to heat that room?


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## m0jumb0 (Oct 12, 2009)

rowerwet said:
			
		

> my kitchen is built like that only the sill sits on foundation on 3.5 of the sides, it is the coldest room in the house, it has the chicken wire and insulation under the floor and blown in insulation in the walls. When I bought the house it had 9' of baseboard, I changed it to 20' of (stacked) baseboard. I think you will find the floor is cold (good candidate for carpet) and the outer walls being exposed will need to be insulated extra, you might want to look into spray foam insulation for the floor and walls as it also stops almost all air entry.
> How are you going to heat that room?



We're hoping to get a little heat in from the woodstove with some strategically placed fans and a ceiling fan to keep the air mixed.  We'll probably suppliment with an electric heater.  I'm expecting it to be downright cozy compared to the rest of the downstairs.  The loft upstairs is insulated pretty well and it stays relatively warm in the winter.  It only gets under freezing for a couple weeks out of the year, so we should be ok.


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## Jack Straw (Oct 12, 2009)

I don't want to be mean or disrespectful but I see several problems with those pictures. First off are you building to your local codes? Did you use joist hangers? I really think you need a double rim joist. Doesn't that whole thing need to be anchored down somehow? Is that treated lumber?


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## m0jumb0 (Oct 12, 2009)

Jack Straw said:
			
		

> I don't want to be mean or disrespectful but I see several problems with those pictures. First off are you building to your local codes? Did you use joist hangers? I really think you need a double rim joist. Doesn't that whole thing need to be anchored down somehow? Is that treated lumber?



No offense taken,  I don't mind constructive criticism.  Local codes: no, Joist hangers, no.  I do have a double rim joist all around, I added that after I nailed the joists up.  Should it be anchored down?  No idea.  Probably, but the rest of the house isn't.  The joists are treated.  I figured that would be a good idea to impede insect infiltration...


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## m0jumb0 (Oct 13, 2009)

Here's a pic of the double rim


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## woodsman23 (Oct 13, 2009)

Is that sitting just on cynder blocks??. I would have poured some footers with 6x6's pt to hold that puppy in place. Kinda looks like it may be able to be pushed.. =


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## Hogwildz (Oct 13, 2009)

Not being critical, but mice are going to have a field day with that insulation. I would have boxed the underside with  PT plywood myself.
Keep in mind that insulation does not stop air flow.


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## m0jumb0 (Oct 13, 2009)

woodsman23 said:
			
		

> Is that sitting just on cynder blocks??. I would have poured some footers with 6x6's pt to hold that puppy in place. Kinda looks like it may be able to be pushed.. =



I dug holes and poured pads under each of the piers.  Hadn't really thought about using posts like that, but what I did is more than the rest of the house.  Once the weight of the the walls is on there, I don't think you could push it anywhere.


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## LLigetfa (Oct 13, 2009)

That would never pass code around here.  My house is held down with hurricane ties.


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## m0jumb0 (Oct 13, 2009)

Hogwildz said:
			
		

> Not being critical, but mice are going to have a field day with that insulation. I would have boxed the underside with  PT plywood myself.
> Keep in mind that insulation does not stop air flow.



I thought about doing that, but I thought that might be overdoing it.  You have a point about the mice.  Hopefully our cats will get them before they can do any damage  I'll be adding underpinning around the outside, so that should stop the breezes from blowing underneath


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## m0jumb0 (Oct 13, 2009)

LLigetfa said:
			
		

> That would never pass code around here.  My house is held down with hurricane ties.



Probably wouldn't pass codes here either, but this room is still going to be built better than the rest of the house.

What kind of hurricane ties do you have?  Here are some I found, but I can't think of a way they'd work to secure the bottom.  They do look useful for the rafters though
http://www.idealtruevalue.com/servlet/the-134326/Detail

I'm imagining some kind of straps like are used on mobile homes.


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## LLigetfa (Oct 13, 2009)

My foundation walls go down 4 feet.  The first floor rim joists are tied to the foundation every 4 feet with 2 foot long galvanized steel straps.


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## m0jumb0 (Oct 13, 2009)

LLigetfa said:
			
		

> My foundation walls go down 4 feet.  The first floor rim joists are tied to the foundation every 4 feet with 2 foot long galvanized steel straps.



4 FEET wow!  I guess in Ontario you have frost heave to worry about.  How far down does it usually freeze?

I know the correct way would have been to pour a footer and lay block, but that would probably have doubled both the budget and the schedule.  The house is a 100 year old farmhouse/shack that I remodeled inside last year to be fairly nice.  Laying a block foundation would have been like putting lipstick on a pig.  I really do appreciate all the comments and criticisms though.  I have a 1970s carpentry textbook that my dad gave me to guide me along, so hopefully I don't bungle this thing too much.


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## LLigetfa (Oct 13, 2009)

My crawlspace is insulated and heated so 4 feet is adequate to keep the frost from getting under the footings.  If it wasn't heated, I'd have to go deeper.

I notice you didn't use joist hangers either.  I think a few things have changed since the 70's.


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## m0jumb0 (Oct 13, 2009)

LLigetfa said:
			
		

> My crawlspace is insulated and heated so 4 feet is adequate to keep the frost from getting under the footings.  If it wasn't heated, I'd have to go deeper.
> 
> I notice you didn't use joist hangers either.  I think a few things have changed since the 70's.



Lack of joist hangers has been noted.  I was advised by someone that I trust that they weren't necessary as I put 4 nails through my header into the ends of the joists.  At any rate, I'm not going to tear it up to add them at this point, though I would use them in a future project.


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## kenny chaos (Oct 13, 2009)

Great job man.  I'd love to know if you do indeed get it all done in three weekends.  I remember when I could work like that.  I miss it.  Thanks for sharing.  As far as joist hangars, you didn't need them for that application.  My house is 178 years old and it ain't because it's got joist hangars.  The code is for dummies that don't know how things work.
Again, great job.


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## ohio woodburner (Oct 19, 2009)

I think we're missing the obvious.... nice stacks of wood


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## m0jumb0 (Oct 19, 2009)

Got a lot done this weekend... about what I wanted to.  I'm ready to put the metal on the roof next weekend.


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## kenny chaos (Oct 19, 2009)

Great job man.  You're quite the hustler.
Stand-by for the critics.


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## m0jumb0 (Oct 19, 2009)

kenny chaos said:
			
		

> Great job man.  You're quite the hustler.
> Stand-by for the critics.



Thanks.  I got crackin' at sunrise both days this weekend.  I told the wife I'd probably have it done (well, livable) around the first weekend of November, so there are "expectations"


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## crazy_dan (Oct 19, 2009)

OH CRAP EXPECTATIONS bad very bad

lookin good to me but I am just a country boy.


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## rowerwet (Oct 19, 2009)

I've got to say, with the walls and roof framed it looks huge, when it was just the deck it didn't look that big! way to go!


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## Ratman (Oct 19, 2009)

I built the same size add-on almost the exact same way blocks.
Mine sags badly in one corner from settling and block erosion.
Consider adding two more blocks to the corners and maybe a jack also on the far corners.
Mine is a sun style porch rather than a nicer add-on like yours so it has all windows.
I wish I could resolve my issue without ripping up the floor and applying the solution from the inside.
Too late now.


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## m0jumb0 (Oct 19, 2009)

rowerwet said:
			
		

> I've got to say, with the walls and roof framed it looks huge, when it was just the deck it didn't look that big! way to go!



Yeah, it's pretty tall.  I wanted to follow the existing roof so I didn't have to fool with a gable roof and flashing.




			
				Ratman said:
			
		

> I built the same size add-on almost the exact same way blocks.
> Mine sags badly in one corner from settling and block erosion.
> Consider adding two more blocks to the corners and maybe a jack also on the far corners.
> Mine is a sun style porch rather than a nicer add-on like yours so it has all windows.
> ...



I'm hoping that the concrete pads I poured will limit settling, but if it doesn't the underpinning will be in 8' removable panels so I'll have access to jack up and re-level if I need to. *fingers-crossed*


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## tutu_sue (Oct 19, 2009)

your room is looking great!  Something you might consider doing that's not expensive but makes a huge difference in efficiency and comfort is caulking.  Fiberglass will stop cold from radiating but the air can still get in.  Run a bead of caulk along the subfloor and bottom plate.  You can also do the seams on the subfloor and when the sheathing goes on, caulk along the top plate and sheathing in each stud cavity.  Also where the new room attaches to the house.  You can do the whole stud cavity to eliminate air movement in the walls.  The contractor box of ALEX caulk is not expensive and will keep cold out in winter and humidity out in summer.

Yesterday we found a 14/ gap between the sheathing and top plate in our corner bedroom.  That corner was always cold and we had an ice dam in that corner roof a couple of winters ago.  As soon as I caulked it warmed right up.  Hubby is going to caulk each gable end like that from the attic.


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## m0jumb0 (Oct 19, 2009)

tutu_sue said:
			
		

> your room is looking great!  Something you might consider doing that's not expensive but makes a huge difference in efficiency and comfort is caulking.  Fiberglass will stop cold from radiating but the air can still get in.  Run a bead of caulk along the subfloor and bottom plate.  You can also do the seams on the subfloor and when the sheathing goes on, caulk along the top plate and sheathing in each stud cavity.  Also where the new room attaches to the house.  You can do the whole stud cavity to eliminate air movement in the walls.  The contractor box of ALEX caulk is not expensive and will keep cold out in winter and humidity out in summer.
> 
> Yesterday we found a 14/ gap between the sheathing and top plate in our corner bedroom.  That corner was always cold and we had an ice dam in that corner roof a couple of winters ago.  As soon as I caulked it warmed right up.  Hubby is going to caulk each gable end like that from the attic.



Hey that's a great idea!  I'll definetly do that since I have a whole case of caulk left from when we remodeled the inside of the house.


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## Hogwildz (Oct 20, 2009)

I use silicone caulk on all stud bays, top plate, bottom rim, everywhere, it makes a huge difference. Not a breeze to be felt.
I was up in the attic Sunday till midnight crawling around stuffing all wire holes with steel wool and siliconing. Have a mouse up there, and want him gone, I think I caught him in the trap, will release him today at the wetlands.
My attic is all trusses and I can't stand up in it, and most of the wire runs were along the outside walls, not the most pleasant time, but its near do near now.
Also found the misr chewed at the wood sheathing n both sides of the chimney. I stuffed one side with coarse steel wool, and left a spot on the other for the mouse to get out before I completely seal it up.
Might take some mortar up there and lay it over top the steel wool to full the gap. 
A couple words of caution to anyone working in a low attic or near the eaves. Don't bang your head into the roofing nails coming through the roof sheathing, it tend to hurt. And if siliconing, it is kind of strong up there, and may may ya gag a lil.


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## gzecc (Oct 21, 2009)

Hog, Thats funny about the mouse. Think you only have one? They do look the same.


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## m0jumb0 (Oct 22, 2009)

yeah, about those "expectations".... just got in from screwing down metal roofing in the dark with 1000 watts of halogen shining up on the roof.  as the sun was going down, and we had 3 pieces screwed down the wife says "if you get a spotlight you could get the rest done in about 30 minutes"

thanks honey!

anyway, we got 5 of 6 pieces up, just have to rip the last one to about 1.5' or so and the metal is knocked out

obviously no pics since it's been dark about an hour


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## firefighterjake (Oct 22, 2009)

m0jumb0 said:
			
		

> yeah, about those "expectations".... just got in from screwing down metal roofing in the dark with 1000 watts of halogen shining up on the roof.  as the sun was going down, and we had 3 pieces screwed down the wife says "if you get a spotlight you could get the rest done in about 30 minutes"
> 
> thanks honey!
> 
> ...



It's tough to get work done in the evenings this time of year . . . it gets dark so soon . . . it seemed like only two or three weeks ago I could at least work until 7 p.m. or so before it got too dark to see . . . now I have to pack it up by 6:15 p.m.


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## m0jumb0 (Oct 22, 2009)

firefighterjake said:
			
		

> It's tough to get work done in the evenings this time of year . . . it gets dark so soon . . . it seemed like only two or three weeks ago I could at least work until 7 p.m. or so before it got too dark to see . . . now I have to pack it up by 6:15 p.m.



Yeah, and we have the time change coming up too... so it'll be dark before most folks even get home.   I wish they kept it DST year round.


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## Flatbedford (Oct 22, 2009)

m0jumb0 said:
			
		

> I wish they kept it DST year round.



That would make for some very dark mornings. The sun wouldn't be up until well after 8 in December!


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## m0jumb0 (Oct 22, 2009)

Flatbedford said:
			
		

> m0jumb0 said:
> 
> 
> 
> ...




that's ok... I'd rather be going to work in the dark than coming home.  obviously that wouldn't work for everyone, but I can dream can't I?


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## Flatbedford (Oct 22, 2009)

In the winter I drive to and from work in the dark.


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## firefighterjake (Oct 23, 2009)

Flatbedford said:
			
		

> In the winter I drive to and from work in the dark.



Same here . . . a bit depressing . . . and it makes it hard to get any outdoor work done around the house.


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## m0jumb0 (Nov 1, 2009)

a little update, got the sheeting and electrical done last weekend.. went ahead and installed some floodlights for the back of the house too.  we were seriously lacking in lighting for the back of the house.  this weekend so far we've caulked everything and insulated.  and we have paneling up on the back wall and ceiling.  I think we'll be trimming stuff out and ready to paint next weekend... *fingers crossed*


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## westkywood (Nov 1, 2009)

10 years ago I was able to add onto my house and not have to follow codes. A few ago they made it where the entire county now has to follow building codes. I'd love to be able to add onto my house "My way" again.. Good luck and looking forward to seeing more photos.


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## m0jumb0 (Nov 3, 2009)

got most of the paneling up and the opening cut to the rest of the house.  this week i'm working on putting up some furring strips on the wall of the old house and getting the door in.  all that's left is to frame the closet in and put up trim and paint.


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## meathead (Nov 3, 2009)

Cool old planks on the origional part of the house. Don't paint those bad boys they look too good as is.


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## m0jumb0 (Nov 4, 2009)

this evening I finished the paneling on the last wall and tacked up the door.  will get started on the closets thursday and hopefully trim and paint this weekend


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## m0jumb0 (Nov 9, 2009)

finished up the closet, put up bifolds, installed crown, and trimmed in most other stuff.  next are the strips over the paneling joints, then prime, caulk, paint

got the other side of the door casing up... have some oak glued and clamped up ready to go in for a threshold





window trim and crown molding





baseboard too





his and hers closets... probably mostly hers





and a storage area above the closets


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## m0jumb0 (Nov 16, 2009)

ok, got all the painting done this weekend and shelves in the closets

trim's done





ceiling painted










all the paint's done, view from my office















can you spot the mistake?


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## geardoc (Nov 16, 2009)

Light switch on the wrong side of the door? Looks good to me.


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## m0jumb0 (Nov 16, 2009)

geardoc said:
			
		

> Light switch on the wrong side of the door? Looks good to me.



you win the prize!  I can't believe I did that... I'm going to re-hang the door to open the other way some time later after I'm sufficiently annoyed with having to reach behind the door the turn the lights on


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## billb3 (Nov 16, 2009)

No occupancy permit for you.  


Looking good.


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## smokinj (Nov 16, 2009)

yes nice job!


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## wingsfan (Nov 18, 2009)

You did a nice job on the addition I am surprised no one has said anything about the block supports laying on thier sides. I think you will be sorry in a couple of years for laying the blocks on the side. They are alot stronger if you stand them up the way they were meant to be laid.


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