# Burn ratio with Englander pellet stove



## coffeedogz3 (Oct 23, 2008)

I've tried to find some info on the burn settings on our Englander pellet stove (1500sq ft model) that we just installed last weekend, but not really finding much for feed settings with fan speeds.  Seems that setting the feed on 4 and fan on 2 works fine for mild temp day and/or overnight.  I'm curious to know what setting works best for a colder temp day (below 40F or lower at night, to keep a 2 story house warm).  How's this all play out for a good burn to conserve the pellets.  I don't want to have to get up in the middle of the night to feed the fire monster because we have the seetings wrong.  I realize the higher the feed # = hotter heat, but the fan blowing faster/slower seems to make the difference too.  How fast/slow a feed vs. fast/slow fan - too much feed & too slow a fan?   I can't find a good break down.  More importantly - what settings should NOT be used together!


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## Wet1 (Oct 23, 2008)

Call Englander (if Mike doesn't answer here)... they can give you the details for your stove.


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## Panhandler (Oct 23, 2008)

coffee said:
			
		

> I've tried to find some info on the burn settings on our Englander pellet stove (1500sq ft model) that we just installed last weekend, but not really finding much for feed settings with fan speeds.  Seems that setting the feed on 4 and fan on 2 works fine for mild temp day and/or overnight.  I'm curious to know what setting works best for a colder temp day (below 40F or lower at night, to keep a 2 story house warm).  How's this all play out for a good burn to conserve the pellets.  I don't want to have to get up in the middle of the night to feed the fire monster because we have the seetings wrong.  I realize the higher the feed # = hotter heat, but the fan blowing faster/slower seems to make the difference too.  How fast/slow a feed vs. fast/slow fan - too much feed & too slow a fan?   I can't find a good break down.  More importantly - what settings should NOT be used together!



The first thing anyone should tell you is never set your fan speed lower than your feed rate. This can cause overheating, please see manual or website. As for ideal settings, this has many variables such as low temp, high temp, wind, size of house and configuration, tightness, insulation, etc. You can use a certain kind of thermostat with this stove. I have the PDVC model but haven't got the thermo yet. I'm sure you can do a search and find the info on this board. I believe you want the kind with two settings as this stove may not restart if it shuts down completely.


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## Smudge88 (Oct 23, 2008)

I also have a 25PDV...always run it with feed and blower at the same settings...Check with Englander on your lower setings 1 and 2...I checked mine last night after doing some research from some of Mikes posts...I'm running on low 1 and 1 right now...But found my settings to be at 5-4-1..I adjusted them to 4-6-1 as Mike had stated and when I checked this morning I didn't burn quite as much as the other settings. No clinkers and plenty of heat on low. Call them...Each stove varies on settings and they'll wall you through it.


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## geek (Oct 23, 2008)

Smudge88 said:
			
		

> I also have a 25PDV...always run it with feed and blower at the same settings...Check with Englander on your lower setings 1 and 2...I checked mine last night after doing some research from some of Mikes posts...I'm running on low 1 and 1 right now...But found my settings to be at 5-4-1..I adjusted them to 4-6-1 as Mike had stated and when I checked this morning I didn't burn quite as much as the other settings. No clinkers and plenty of heat on low. Call them...Each stove varies on settings and they'll wall you through it.



you're referring to the little 3 buttons on the bottom, right?
Mine were 5-7-1, I changed to 4-6-1 and will see how it burns because mine is creating lots of clinkers .....


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## Smudge88 (Oct 23, 2008)

One thing I did notice tonight when I started it up at those settings...I had a E2 failure...so I turned the stove up to 3-3 on Start up...Maybe I ahd a jam in the top feeder...Don't know...1st time I've played with the settings...Just turned it down to 1-1....I'll keep you informeded..Maybe Mike couls step in if he's reading our posts....


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## staplebox (Oct 23, 2008)

You can run the fan at a higher setting then the fuel feed, but not the other way around.  I regularly run mine at 1-6 or 3-9.  If it gets really cold I go to 5-9 but have never needed to go higher than that.  The bottom buttons could be different for everyone.  If you search here you will find a lot of info about them buttons.  Or, as suggested, you could contact Englander .  I currently have it set at 5-7-1 but occasionally change it with different pellets.  If you do change them on your own, do it in small increments and carefully watch for changes in the burn.


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## coffeedogz3 (Oct 24, 2008)

Looks like I've only got the 2 button control settings on the bottom right of our new new little burner. I take it that I need the fan speed a bit higher than the feed? Sounds like I'm doing it backwards (as usual). Is there a wrong way to set it (as in 2 feed w/ 6 fan - or a big variable or would that be the other way around)? What does that do vs something else? I'm one for testing things out, but don't want to go too far with the new burner. I was also wondering what the "don't do's" are. 

The house is about 1300 sq ft, 1920's thing with full basement. Not well insulated - but some walls have new and there are all new windows & roof. 

Clinkers make me think of log crackles, as I pretend to be outside in the woods where the deer & the antelope play (crap that's a skunk! just my luck) LOL. Burn baby burn! Ha Ha natural gas company you aint getting my money!!


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## coffeedogz3 (Oct 28, 2008)

Well I thought we had our settings correct however.... last night was the real test being about 30F outside. I put the Heat Range (7), with Blower Speed (9) - the living room temp came up to 64F. I woke up in the middle of the night and it was freezing upstairs around 58F. I went to check the unit and it was working and temp in the living room only got up to 66F. I might as well had slept on top of the thing! Living room is a rectangle roughly 36'L x 18'W x 10'H. Need more heat!! The one portable kerosene heater we used last winter did a bit better. If this is all the heat this unit will produce then we shouldn't have invested so much money into this in this economy. What more can this do for heat?  Is there something wrong with the unit?  Blower & augers work.


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## rap69ri (Oct 28, 2008)

Where is the stove located in your house? Did you connect the Outside Air Kit? What brand of pellets are you burning?

Sorry for all of the questions, but we need to know details to be of any real help. I have the same stove and it keeps my house of about the same size nice and warm. My stove is on the first floor in my kitchen about 25' feet from my living room. In the dead of winter my living room temp hovers between 70 -74, but the 2nd floor is only about 65. The cooler temp in the bedrooms make sleeping nice.


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## coffeedogz3 (Oct 28, 2008)

Got it installed into the fire place w/the air kit - it's on the south side of the house (under one of the most used of the 3 bed rooms). However it's kind of blocked from the stairs, so we've used the ceiling fan to move the air around, but that's not really doing much good. (I'm wondering now if that flue is letting too much warm air up?? can that be insulated or boxed in better?) 

Currently using the Somerset brand pellets from Tractor Supply which burn nice (better than the Lowes Pennington brand). Not much selection in this area.

We have thought about moving the unit into the dining room area on the north side of the house, which might give it chance to move air up the stairs. This room is small - about 10x10 and has many windows making it a bit difficult to hook up, along with windows on the 2nd fl just above. We initially went for this area - but just can't seem to get it to work. 

One thing I noticed this morning was standing directly in front of the unit - it was nice and warm. So I slowly backed away to see where the drop off was for warmth - that was about at 3 1/2' to 4' and then started to really drop off about 6' out (end of the couch). If we did happen to move the unit into the dining room the 6' drop off would be at about the 3rd step up the stairs. So, I'm not seeing warm air radiating out any better than in the living room. (At least I can sleep on the couch if need be & not the dining room table - LOL


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## rap69ri (Oct 28, 2008)

Pellet stoves are after all just expensive space heaters, but they do a good job ;-)

So the outside air kit is pulling air from the chimney? Did you install a blocking plate in your fireplace to prevent your heat from going up your chimney?


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## coffeedogz3 (Oct 28, 2008)

yupers - got all the pieces/parts in the right spots.

After not finding much info for the control settings I've played with the buttons - the 3 bottom ones (guess I'm not really supposed to, but couldn't help myself).
Low Fuel Feed (3), Low Burn Air (4), Air on Temp (1); with the Top 2 set Heat Range (6), Blower Speed (6). Also with the bottom 3 the same #'s, I tried Heat Range (4) and Blower Speed (6).

I'm not exactly sure on the changes for low burn air vs. blower speed differences. A lot of variables.  Any suggestions on best settings is helpful (or is it a secret) combo.


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## rap69ri (Oct 28, 2008)

The bottom LFF and LBA buttons only have an effect on setttings 1 and 2. The default settings are 6-4-1, and I was told by Englander never to touch the 3rd button so I haven't even though my curiosity is killing me. I have changed my LFF and LBA settings many times to burn different brands of pellets more thoroughly on the low settings. 

The LFF changes the amount of pellets that are fed into the burn pot when in settings 1 or 2, and the LBA changes the amount of combustion air being fed into the burn chamber when on settings 1 or 2. There are no secret settings, it just depends on what you're burning for pellets as to what settings work best. 

Now one more question for you, do you feel cool air going towards the stove at floor level?


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## coffeedogz3 (Oct 28, 2008)

Got home to find 'er still on and hadn't used much pellet, so guess the feed is good. Temp about 64, so holding steady in the area. Same upstairs around 57. (I pulled out the electric blanket for tonight).

Yes, I can feel cool air (lightly) across the floor. While there is nice warm air just about waist high. I noticed the dog picked out a spot about 3' out, so I stood near there - nice.


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## rap69ri (Oct 28, 2008)

coffee said:
			
		

> Got home to find 'er still on and hadn't used much pellet, so guess the feed is good. Temp about 64, so holding steady in the area. Same upstairs around 57. (I pulled out the electric blanket for tonight).
> 
> Yes, I can feel cool air (lightly) across the floor. While there is nice warm air just about waist high. I noticed the dog picked out a spot about 3' out, so I stood near there - nice.



If you're feeling a draft near the floor then it sounds like your stove is pulling air from the house, not the outside. This will definitely make a difference in how warm your house can get.

Check out post number 8 from Mike of Englander in this thread: https://www.hearth.com/econtent/index.php/forums/viewthread/26673/


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## pegdot (Oct 29, 2008)

Coffee, on the top of your "Don't" list put... Never run the stove with the heat range set at a higher number than the blower speed. 3-3 is good. 1-3 is good. 3-1 is BAD.

I heat my whole house with the stove but I've discovered that while it does a great job of keeping a warm house warm it struggles to heat the house if I let the inside temperature fall below 60 to 65 degrees. My suggestion to you would be to get the house warm some other way and then play with the stove to see what settings it takes to keep it warm. 

The secret to getting the most heat out of your stove is to move cold air towards the stove at floor level. That will push the warm air from the stove room into the rest of the house. Trying to move the warm air is futile! lol What I've found is that my ceiling fans are pretty much useless. They seem to actually block warm air from entering the room. What I do is set one small fan on the floor in the doorway leading to the stove room with the fan pointed at the stove. This pulls cold air from the adjoining room towards the stove to be heated and forces warm air out of the stove room. It takes a little trial and error since every floor plan is different but basically moving cold air towards the stove is what you want to do. I've found that once I use the fan to get the circulation started I can cut it off and the air continues to move around the house but this may not be true in every house. One easy way to check on how the air is moving through out your house is with a candle. If you hold the candle down next to the floor you want to see the flame drawn towards the stove. If you hold it just below the top of the doorway you want to see the flame drawn away from the stove. When you get those reactions at every door way in your house you've got maximum heat movement.  :coolsmile:


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## coffeedogz3 (Oct 29, 2008)

Looks like we're moving it to the dining room this weekend.  The challenge is the windows, along with the old slate board wall.  Not easy!


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## pegdot (Oct 29, 2008)

I feel for ya! lol Cutting the hole in the interior wall was the hardest part of our install. The old horsehair plaster was a breeze but the wooden lath behind it was a nightmare! You can't saw through something that won't hold still.  :grrr:  Good luck!


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## rap69ri (Oct 29, 2008)

I think you'l notice a big difference if you install the OAK correctly, and the time and aggrevation will be well worth it.


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## coffeedogz3 (Oct 29, 2008)

I'm hoping so.  Nothing's ever easy that's worthwhile!  Just hate putting a hole in and .... ?  As long as we keep from pulling our hair out or kill each other.


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## pegdot (Oct 29, 2008)

ROFL! If it's a husband and wife project there are no guarantees about the not killing each other part! My hubby is a real risk taker.....he insists on ticking me off while I have a hammer in my hand. Talk about living on the edge. ;-)


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## rap69ri (Oct 30, 2008)

If you don't want to make another hole in the house you could always put a hole in the wall thimble to snake the OAK through. I know a user on here called pelletizer did it this way, and he hasn't had any complaints yet. 

Remember, no risk no reward.


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## coffeedogz3 (Oct 30, 2008)

Kicking around a thought - can you put the OAK thru the floor to pull air from a basement?


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## rap69ri (Oct 30, 2008)

I know I've read it on this site somewhere, but I didn't search this time, that you don't want to do that. To test you could run it to a window and then block off the rest of the opening to see if the OAK helps.


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## cdodge04 (Oct 30, 2008)

^I actually tried that before I installed the OAK.  I didn't like the results of running it through the window as it was harder to make sure that thre was no other cold air leaking in around the pipe.  I stuffed some towels in the window just as a temporary try out for the OAK.  After a day of doing it that way I just gave up and cut a hole in the wall haha.


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## rap69ri (Oct 30, 2008)

CDodge04 said:
			
		

> ^I actually tried that before I installed the OAK.  I didn't like the results of running it through the window as it was harder to make sure that thre was no other cold air leaking in around the pipe.  I stuffed some towels in the window just as a temporary try out for the OAK.  After a day of doing it that way I just gave up and cut a hole in the wall haha.



To avoid cutting another hole in the house you could run through the thimble. Unfortunately I didn't think of that first, and have two holes in my house :-(


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## cdodge04 (Oct 31, 2008)

Not sure if it's been asked of before, but could you pull air from the attic or would that be the same as the basement?  Attic's typically have the vents up there that exchange air anyway...For my exhaust I converted my 3" inch exhaust to go up through my 6" metal bestos flu...Why not just widen out the hole a little bit where my chimney goes up through to the attic and stick the pipe up there? I have one of those suspended ceilings, just some sheetrock above the suspended ceiling, it'd be more than easy to stick the OAK up through that.  I've already got the OAK out through the wall, but the info might be useful for those that haven't...


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## rap69ri (Oct 31, 2008)

I think the objective here is to have a short run for the OAK. Somewhere on this forum someone explains why, but I can't remember for the life of me. Think I'm developing CRS...


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## cdodge04 (Oct 31, 2008)

Hmmm...never thought of that...I suppose it would be rather long...8-10 feet.


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## pegdot (Oct 31, 2008)

I sent Pelletizer a PM and asked him to drop in here and see if he can give you some advice on installing your OAK through the same hole that you cut for the vent. I'm not sure how he did it but I think that might be the easiest solution for you.

Installing the OAK into the basement isn't a good idea unless you happen to have a really open basement with tons of fresh air down there. Basically, installing the OAK anywhere inside your house could create the same negative pressure issues as running the stove without an OAK.


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## Chinkowski (Oct 31, 2008)

Simpson sells a wall thimble with an OAK built into it. check it out on their website. i bought and installed one. kind of pricey, just like everything else they sell. but it works nice and i didn't have to put another hole in the house.


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## sydney1963 (Oct 31, 2008)

Coffee,

That piglet is just cute as a button.


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## pelletizer (Nov 1, 2008)

I do have my OAK installed through the thimble here is a pic I found I will take more pics later.
I did get the idea from the custom Thimble Simpson sells like Chinkoski says.
It is a little work but I like the results 

You will need a 2" hole saw and need to pop out the screen from the OAK kit. 
All you do is make sure there is enough room for the hose by cutting out a liitle extra sheet rock and outside siding.
Cut the 2" hole in the outside thimble, put a bead of silicone on the little round screen and place it from the outside in the 2" drilled hole, Put some silicone on the back side of the screen (not the screen itself) that is now inserted in the thimble.
Put the hose with hose clamp and tighten up but not to tight as the screen pc is only aluminum (let the silicone set up)

Place outside thimble in wall with OAK hose poking into house place inside thimble (with a 2" hole drilled in the same area as the outside thimble) in the wall with hose poking out.

At this point I had the outside thimble mounted to the siding so it was solid, but inside thimble was not screwed to wall.

Then line up stove pipes/stove through the wall and mount ouside pipe to wall.

When all is lined up mount inside thimble to wall hook up OAK to stove, silicone were OAK and stove pipe goes through thimble.

Just don't pull on the OAK to hard you don't want to pull the hose off that is now hose clamped in the wall.

Sounds like a pain but it is pretty easy. I will post a pic in a bit


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## pelletizer (Nov 1, 2008)

Happy Halloween here are 2 pics, Note I cut and attached the metal weather guard to fit over the mesh screen on the outside thimble.


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## coffeedogz3 (Nov 3, 2008)

I'm working my way up from pellet piglet (yearling 1 ton) - doing my share of "grunt" work. Mascot?  

Well, we got the stove moved on Sunday (I've got some pics that I'm working on adding).  I must say that my hubby did a fine job and we didn't kill each other!! The wall thimble covers up the area well as the holes weren't perfect since he found the studs, along with the old wood siding and old aluminum siding on top of that.  I think it took about 6 hours and the time change screwed us up.

We wanted to do our test burn to make sure it was going to be better. The house was warm to begin with since we had an absolutely beautiful weekend. Start temp was 71 downstairs & 64 up. This morning it was 86 down & 72 up and we could feel the warm air going up the stairs. Maybe this local will work.  I guess our real test will be later in the week when it gets cold again.


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## coffeedogz3 (Nov 3, 2008)

Now that we had to move this thing - flooring under the stove is the next phase. One guy told me he's got acres of stone that I can go thru (now that's work!). Someone else suggested welding some sheet metal together and paint it (free from work).  And a couple other people had suggestions.  Right now it needs to be very inexpensive, plain & simple and don't care what it looks like.


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## pegdot (Nov 3, 2008)

Glad to hear that no one was killed in the stove move. ;-)  It sounds like the new location is going to work much better for you. About the floor.....do you have any kind of hearth pad under it now? What kind of flooring is it on? There have been tons of discussions on here about building hearth pads so if you do a search you'll likely come up with all kinds of ideas.


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## coffeedogz3 (Nov 4, 2008)

I've seen some great looking pads on here (nice work) - which are giving us some good ideas.  Ours is sitting on a temp tile pad so that we can work on getting a nice looking one made later on.


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## coffeedogz3 (Nov 5, 2008)

here's what we were able to do with a not-so-ideal location for placement.


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## coffeedogz3 (Nov 7, 2008)

Was just itching to know just how much better this new location was going to be - fired the stove up last night (temp outside was low 50's). Got up this morning and upstairs temp was 71. Hot diggity dog!!   :coolsmile:   This just might work.


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