# Conifer trees, Pitch or Sap?



## Lumber-Jack (Mar 18, 2009)

A couple of times I have read in this forum people stating as some kind of fact that pitch is something that comes exclusively from conifer trees and sap only comes from deciduous trees.   
I say hogwash.
I have never heard or read any evidence to back up this statement.
In fact I have never heard anybody make such a claim before except the couple times in this forum. 
I only protest because I think forums like this should be helping people with useful and factual imformation, not for speading some homegrown myths.
Conifers contain sap just like any other tree or plant.
Pitch, in reference to trees, simply refers to the highly viscous or resinous state of some tree SAP (particularly conifers).
If you disagree and can prove it somehow, I would like to see some sort of evidence. I'm quite willing to be edjumicated.    

Here is just a few government and educational references that refer to the SAP of conifer trees.

http://www.for.gov.bc.ca/hre/pubs/pubs/1015.htm 
Sap flow in old lodgepole pine trees.


http://www.fsl.orst.edu/oldtree/dougfir.htm
Photos of sap flow instrumentation, the top of a Douglas-fir tree.


http://efotg.nrcs.usda.gov/references/public/WY/Bio_No_228.pdf
"......Williams sapsuckers in Colarado fed exclusively on sap and phloem of live conifers."


There are plenty of other links that refer to the SAP of conifers.
http://www.google.ca/search?hl=en&q=conifer+sap&btnG=Google+Search&meta;=


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## LLigetfa (Mar 18, 2009)

Carbon_Liberator said:
			
		

> I say hogwash.


Don't be such a _sap_ %-P


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## Lumber-Jack (Mar 18, 2009)

LLigetfa said:
			
		

> Carbon_Liberator said:
> 
> 
> 
> ...



I don't like the pitch you are taking with me.  :lol:


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## Abhoth (Mar 18, 2009)

So, sap = http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sap

See also, resin = http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Resin

See also, pitch(resin) = http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pitch_(resin)

My pitch is this, then I'll stop being a sap ... sap is the life-blood of a tree, that which nourishes. And pitch is that which the tree secretes, trees secrete pitch to protect-itself when it's wounded, be it an open wound or insect attack. I would think that 'pitch' has some 'sap' within it, yet used for a different purpose other than nourishment. All trees have sap and secrete resins(pitch)... but not like pine and spruce and a number of others, ask anyone who's picked up a split and couldn't let go of it!


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## Bigg_Redd (Mar 18, 2009)

Carbon_Liberator said:
			
		

> A couple of times I have read in this forum people stating as some kind of fact that pitch is something that comes exclusively from conifer trees and sap only comes from deciduous trees.
> I say hogwash.
> I have never heard or read any evidence to back up this statement.
> In fact I have never heard anybody make such a claim before except the couple times in this forum.
> ...



Ummm. . . OK


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## savageactor7 (Mar 18, 2009)

What in TARnation is all this about.


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## Apprentice_GM (Mar 18, 2009)

Carbon_Liberator said:
			
		

> A couple of times I have read in this forum people stating as some kind of fact that pitch is something that comes exclusively from conifer trees and sap only comes from deciduous trees.
> I say hogwash.
> I have never heard or read any evidence to back up this statement.
> In fact I have never heard anybody make such a claim before except the couple times in this forum.
> ...



Well then, you should start by finding those posts and threads, and informing them. Starting a new thread and stating your opinion - well backed up and I don't disagree with you - is unlikely to educate those mis-informed posters who seem unlikely to stumble across your new thread imho.


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## Adios Pantalones (Mar 18, 2009)

How dare they call it sap... or pitch.. or whatever


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## Highbeam (Mar 18, 2009)

I may have caused you to go on this mission on education. There was once a guy who only cut hardwoods and only ran across sap under the fresh bark. That guy asked about cutting confiers and I thought it would be good to inform him about the pitch which he will be encountering sticking to his hands, feet, tools, hootus, etc. which he likely has never seen before since only being exposed to sap from a deciduous tree. The conifer will also have sap under the bark of course. These two seperate tree biproducts both start out as sap but the finished product of pitch is quite different than sap. 

You can call it whatever you want. It's okay, really. I'm sure there is a regional slang involved. 

If I holler out, "dang it, my hootus is covered in pitch" then everyone knows that I have a sticky mess. If I make the same outburst about sap then people might think I was cutting green wood.


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## Lumber-Jack (Mar 18, 2009)

Apprentice_GM said:
			
		

> Well then, you should start by finding those posts and threads, and informing them. Starting a new thread and stating your opinion - well backed up and I don't disagree with you - is unlikely to educate those mis-informed posters who seem unlikely to stumble across your new thread imho.


Actually Apprentice I don't think that is the right approach. Disrupting someone else's thread and using it to try and correct someone or argue some point that doesn't directly relate to the body of the thread is rude and inappropriate. Kind of what like some are doing in this thread.
 And don't worry, at least one of the mis-informed ones has found this thread already, but had nothing "informed" to say about the subject of the thread. That's ok, this thread here now and if I, if the subject comes up again it can be linked to in the future.
>
Hey Highbeam, thanks for the on topic reply, much appreciated.   
You are right, your post was what caused me to go on this "mission of education", but don't let it go to your head, or your hootus.  LOL

About, pitch coming from deciduous trees, I have encountered  actual pitch on deciduous trees before, some fruit trees can produce a lot pitch on them, cherry trees come to mind. I remember as a kid sticking bugs in the little blobs of pitch on the bark of cherry trees in an attempt to produce amber.


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## TreePapa (Mar 18, 2009)

I may be a sap, but here is my pitch:

All I know is that the gooey, resinious stuff in the PINE that I split a few weeks back, commonly refered to as "pitch" burns like oil. The pieces that are basically impregnated with this pitch light with one match, even tho' they are not fully seasoned (and smoke like an old man with a stinky cigar). If I try to do that with the green ash that oozed sap when I split it, it just sizzles and exinguishes the match (same w/ green pine from younger trees w/o as much, if any, pitch).

Also, pitch, usually from pine or other conifiers, used to be used to seal boat decks, etc. before the advent of petro-products that are easier to produce to do the job.

My understanding is that sap is mainly water and carbohydrates (sugars) ... as in sugar maple sap that gets made into maple syrup. Pitch contains the resins that highbeam refered to.

The sap that oozed from the big pine rounds when I split them w/ the (rental) hydraulic splitter wasn't terrible sticky. The pitch that was in the same pine was incredibly stick.

Peace,
- Sequoia


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## Lumber-Jack (Mar 18, 2009)

*Ok, here is some cherry wood. Is it pitch or sap?*


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## wendell (Mar 19, 2009)

Highbeam said:
			
		

> ... his hands, feet, tools, hootus, etc.



What the heck is a hootus? I thought I knew every slang term for every part of the body but that is a new one for me!


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## Highbeam (Mar 19, 2009)

Your hootus is exactly what you think it is..... google is your friend.

That cherry tree stuff might be pitch, would have to touch it. If it is jelly-like I would call it sap but if it sticks to you like contact cement and you can't rub it off of your fingers then I would call it pitch. I get that on my fruit trees too.


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## TreePapa (Mar 19, 2009)

Carbon_Liberator said:
			
		

> *Ok, here is some cherry wood. Is it pitch or sap?*



Take a blob off the tree
Light it with a match ... if it lights and burns, it's pitch. If it extinguishes the match, it's sap.

That's my opinion, FWIW.

Peace,
- Sequoia


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