# on hold



## toonces (Jun 12, 2012)

i was asked by my landlord to tidy up my wood piles as my upstairs neighbor was complaining. i kept all the wood off to the the side of the backyard (even under a bunch of widowmakers from last fall!) but that wasn't enough. as of now, almost all of the wood is stacked on the edge of both of my neighbor's yards, both of whom don't mind. at worst, i let my last pile sit -- again, on the very edge of the lawn, under a death trap -- for a few weeks when i was racking up 60+ hours/wk at work. i guess that was enough.

i was really pissed at first, but now am just semi-pissed. literally, the backyard is where my kid plays, i stack wood, and the neighbor's dog drops big bombs. that's it, that's all. i have, in three years here, never seen her use the backyard for anything other than the dog's toilet and now??? c'mon

so now all my wood gathering is on hold since i have nowhere to process it. big-picture-wise, even though i have my landlord's blessing, i am holding off on the stove itself. even bigger-picture-wise, i'm soooo ready to buy my own house/property and put the wood right in the middle of my own damn yard. we're close but not quite there yet. this must be a message to go on hiatus until better things line up.


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## weatherguy (Jun 12, 2012)

If you can pull it off nows a good time to buy a house, no one tells you what to do or where to put your wood, oh, except for the wife


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## Ashful (Jun 12, 2012)

We got 3.375% on a 15 year fixed mortgage last year, and I hear them quoting 3.25% now.  Market is stalled, with more than a few people I know sitting on property they're trying desperately to unload.  Definitely the time to buy, if you can find a way to make it work.


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## bogydave (Jun 12, 2012)

If it works out that you can buy, interest rates have never been lower
Then go thank the guy for complaining 
Good luck


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## firebroad (Jun 12, 2012)

Widowmaker? Death Trap?  Not sure what you are referring to.  Maybe some tarps will soothe your neighbors ire until you find your own place?
Can you show a picture of this horrible scene?


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## chuckie5fingers (Jun 13, 2012)

Some banks enven have programs to help first time homebuyers
you can really negotiate a good price from the seller as well.
I bought my home for $74K in2001. It was listed at $99,000 and appraised out at $164,000
good luck toonces
chuck


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## 3fordasho (Jun 13, 2012)

Becoming a home owner does not guarantee you won't have neighbor(s) complaining about your wood piles.  I think it was in Minneapolis or a suburb close that the city decided that you could have no more than 1 cord on your property... this was in response to a neighbor complaining about someones wood stacks.  I have 20+ cords neatly stacked on my .44 acre. I am waiting for the day the city says something because I will then raise a stink about the dozens of propertys in the neighborhood that are not as well maintained or junky looking.




toonces said:


> i was asked by my landlord to tidy up my wood piles as my upstairs neighbor was complaining. i kept all the wood off to the the side of the backyard (even under a bunch of widowmakers from last fall!) but that wasn't enough. as of now, almost all of the wood is stacked on the edge of both of my neighbor's yards, both of whom don't mind. at worst, i let my last pile sit -- again, on the very edge of the lawn, under a death trap -- for a few weeks when i was racking up 60+ hours/wk at work. i guess that was enough.
> 
> i was really pissed at first, but now am just semi-pissed. literally, the backyard is where my kid plays, i stack wood, and the neighbor's dog drops big bombs. that's it, that's all. i have, in three years here, never seen her use the backyard for anything other than the dog's toilet and now??? c'mon
> 
> so now all my wood gathering is on hold since i have nowhere to process it. big-picture-wise, even though i have my landlord's blessing, i am holding off on the stove itself. even bigger-picture-wise, i'm soooo ready to buy my own house/property and put the wood right in the middle of my own damn yard. we're close but not quite there yet. this must be a message to go on hiatus until better things line up.


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## gzecc (Jun 13, 2012)

toonces said:


> i was asked by my landlord to tidy up my wood piles as my upstairs neighbor was complaining. i kept all the wood off to the the side of the backyard (even under a bunch of widowmakers from last fall!) but that wasn't enough. as of now, almost all of the wood is stacked on the edge of both of my neighbor's yards, both of whom don't mind. at worst, i let my last pile sit -- again, on the very edge of the lawn, under a death trap -- for a few weeks when i was racking up 60+ hours/wk at work. i guess that was enough.
> 
> i was really pissed at first, but now am just semi-pissed. literally, the backyard is where my kid plays, i stack wood, and the neighbor's dog drops big bombs. that's it, that's all. i have, in three years here, never seen her use the backyard for anything other than the dog's toilet and now??? c'mon
> 
> so now all my wood gathering is on hold since i have nowhere to process it. big-picture-wise, even though i have my landlord's blessing, i am holding off on the stove itself. even bigger-picture-wise, i'm soooo ready to buy my own house/property and put the wood right in the middle of my own damn yard. we're close but not quite there yet. this must be a message to go on hiatus until better things line up.


 Look into a rural development purchase, if your a first time home buyer. Its a gov't incentive program for certain areas. 0 money down and other incentives.


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## toonces (Jun 17, 2012)

i think i'm gonna have to tell the landlord to month-to-month us come renewal time. a lot to think about here. i wonder if my wife would think i'm crazy if i only look for places that have good stove installation prereqs.


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## firebroad (Jun 18, 2012)

You know you're a real wood burner if...


toonces said:


> i think i'm gonna have to tell the landlord to month-to-month us come renewal time. a lot to think about here. i wonder if my wife would think i'm crazy if i only look for places that have good stove installation prereqs.


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## toonces (Feb 22, 2013)

welp, we got prequalified by the USDA this week so we are one step closer to my master plan of having a massive awesome wood stack in my (own) backyard. there's a lack of credit history on my spouse's side, so we're going to work on that and apply within the next few months. wish me luck!


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## firebroad (Feb 22, 2013)

toonces said:


> welp, we got prequalified by the USDA this week so we are one step closer to my master plan of having a massive awesome wood stack in my (own) backyard. there's a lack of credit history on my spouse's side, so we're going to work on that and apply within the next few months. wish me luck!


You have it!!
Hope you find a nice place.  However, excuse my ignorance, but what does the Department of Agriculture have to do with you buying a home?


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## swagler85 (Feb 22, 2013)

firebroad said:


> You have it!!
> Hope you find a nice place.  However, excuse my ignorance, but what does the Department of Agriculture have to do with you buying a home?


They have a program where they provide loans on houses in rural areas. Can't be in a city, pretty cool program. Better than an FHA loan for many reasons. They are a little picky on condition of the house but a good program to support those buyers wanting to be out of congested areas.


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## fabsroman (Feb 22, 2013)

weatherguy said:


> If you can pull it off nows a good time to buy a house, no one tells you what to do or where to put your wood, oh, except for the wife


 
That isn't necessarily true. Some local governments have ordinances against wood stacking. I know my sister's town/city does. Of course, I NEVER would have bought something there. Too expensive, not enough land, too crowded, and too many restrictions. You have to get the town/city's permission to even cut down your own trees and they usually only grant permission if the tree is dying.

To the OP, sell the wood and put the proceeds toward the house purchase fund. Getting a house right now is probably the most important thing on your list. Continue processing firewood and selling it as soon as you get enough to cause an issue there. House prices and interest rates will not be this low forever unless we experience another recession rather soon. Trust me, it is so nice to have a place where you can almost do whatever you want. Prior to this house, we lived in a townhouse and there was a million rules with the HOA. I could hardly even work on my cars. They could not be in disrepair for more than a day unless they were in the garage. Been here two years and my Taurus waited from April to September of this year for a brake line replacement and it sat in the driveway during that time. Nobody said a thing. Yeah, I cannot stand to live where there are too many rules, regulations, and nosey neighbors.


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## muncybob (Feb 22, 2013)

Sounds like you are referring to the Rural Housing program? I agree with fabsroman, getting your own place in an area that you can do what you like is so rewarding!! We are so fortunate in that the neighbors we have are nice and 1/4 mile away...I have plenty of land to do what I want and when I want to do it, never a fear of disturbing anybody...priceless! As long as you can take the responsibilities that come along with owning your on place. The Mrs and I will hopefuly never have to move back into town again...we are spoiled!

Funny how getting pissed(as you put it) was the catalyst to getting serious about your own place. Us getting pissed at the oil delivery company 4 years ago was the main catalyst to us now heating with wood!


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## Lumber-Jack (Feb 22, 2013)

toonces said:


> i was asked by my landlord to tidy up my wood piles as* my upstairs neighbor was complaining. *
> i was really pissed at first, but now am just semi-pissed. literally, the *backyard is where my kid plays*, i stack wood, and *the neighbor's dog drops big bombs.* that's it, that's all. i have, in three years here, never seen her use the backyard for anything other than the dog's toilet and now??? c'mon


So your kids have to play in your neighbor's dog crap, and she is the one complaining?

We just renewed our house mortgage at 2.99%, and now our mortgage payment is lower than what most renters we know are paying for rent,,, even the ones living in apartments. Now is the time to buy.
Knowing what a pain neighbors can be, make sure you buy something far enough away, or with a big enough fence that you have plenty of privacy.


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## fabsroman (Feb 22, 2013)

toonces said:


> i think i'm gonna have to tell the landlord to month-to-month us come renewal time. a lot to think about here. i wonder if my wife would think i'm crazy if i only look for places that have good stove installation prereqs.


 
lol - I was looking at wood burning stoves/furnaces while we were looking for homes. My wife knew full well that was the route I wanted to go while we spent 3 years trying to find the house we wanted to buy. Took all of 1 heating oil bill and 4 months later the wood burning furnace was purchased. The chainsaws and firewood came shortly thereafter.


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## fabsroman (Feb 22, 2013)

Lumber-Jack said:


> So your kids have to play in your neighbor's dog crap, and she is the one complaining?
> 
> We just renewed our house mortgage at 2.99%, and now our mortgage payment is lower than what most renters we know are paying for rent,,, even the ones living in apartments. Now is the time to buy.
> Knowing what a pain neighbors can be, make sure you buy something far enough away, or with a big enough fence that you have plenty of privacy.


 
The problem most people have with buying is the down payment. I see it so many times in my line of work. They are struggling to make ends meet and just cannot come up with the down payment. Back in the days of zero down, they could hardly come up with the closing costs but that could sometimes be rolled into the loan too back then. Not so much now. Most lenders want 20% + closing costs from the buyer before they will lend 80% of the purchase price.

We refinanced last summer to 4.375% and we are going to do it again at the end of this tax season. Hoping to get something around 3.5%. When we refinanced last summer, one of my clients said "If interest rates get any lower the economy is really going to be in the crapper and all that will matter is guns and bullets." Really hoping he is wrong.


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## gzecc (Feb 22, 2013)

fabsroman said:


> The problem most people have with buying is the down payment. I see it so many times in my line of work. They are struggling to make ends meet and just cannot come up with the down payment. Back in the days of zero down, they could hardly come up with the closing costs but that could sometimes be rolled into the loan too back then. Not so much now. Most lenders want 20% + closing costs from the buyer before they will lend 80% of the purchase price.
> 
> We refinanced last summer to 4.375% and we are going to do it again at the end of this tax season. Hoping to get something around 3.5%. When we refinanced last summer, one of my clients said "If interest rates get any lower the economy is really going to be in the crapper and all that will matter is guns and bullets." Really hoping he is wrong.


 One of the benifits of the Rural Developement loan. No down payment. They will even give you more than the mortgage payment for "improvment money".


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## fabsroman (Feb 22, 2013)

gzecc said:


> One of the benifits of the Rural Developement loan. No down payment. They will even give you more than the mortgage payment for "improvment money".


 
The OP is in Connecticut. Depends on whether "rural development" is something that is being done there. I know we do not have it here in Maryland. Probably would not go that route myself because the schools would not be the best. If we did not have to deal with our kids being in school, we would be living on a huge farm in the middle of nowhere. Whether we stay in this area after the kids are done with grade school depends on where they go to college and whether they stay around this area after college. Regardless, I am going to buy a farm or three on the eastern shore at some point just for piece of mind. Maybe something in the backwoods of Virginia too.


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## ScotO (Feb 22, 2013)

Lumber-Jack said:


> So your kids have to play in your neighbor's dog crap, and she is the one complaining?


I agree, Lumber Jack.  I'd be pizzing to the landlord about all that dog chit in the yard, if that don't work, maybe put it in a bag and set it on her porch for the tenant that complains about the wood....
Then, you could legitimately tell them "I've had enough of your chit, too!"


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## fabsroman (Feb 22, 2013)

Yeah, another thought that came to mind is whether the addition of a stove would make the stove part of the property and not subject to removal upon quitting the lease. If you do go forward on the stove at this rental, I would get it in writing that the stove will belong to you and that it will leave with you once the lease is over.


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## ohlongarm (Feb 22, 2013)

toonces said:


> i was asked by my landlord to tidy up my wood piles as my upstairs neighbor was complaining. i kept all the wood off to the the side of the backyard (even under a bunch of widowmakers from last fall!) but that wasn't enough. as of now, almost all of the wood is stacked on the edge of both of my neighbor's yards, both of whom don't mind. at worst, i let my last pile sit -- again, on the very edge of the lawn, under a death trap -- for a few weeks when i was racking up 60+ hours/wk at work. i guess that was enough.
> 
> i was really pissed at first, but now am just semi-pissed. literally, the backyard is where my kid plays, i stack wood, and the neighbor's dog drops big bombs. that's it, that's all. i have, in three years here, never seen her use the backyard for anything other than the dog's toilet and now??? c'mon
> 
> so now all my wood gathering is on hold since i have nowhere to process it. big-picture-wise, even though i have my landlord's blessing, i am holding off on the stove itself. even bigger-picture-wise, i'm soooo ready to buy my own house/property and put the wood right in the middle of my own damn yard. we're close but not quite there yet. this must be a message to go on hiatus until better things line up.


 Neighbors for the most part are a PITA,that's why I've lived my whole life without them,now I have one 600 feet across a ravine and through the woods,not a problem though,I told them when they bought the 15 acres surrounded by park that if they don't like roosters crowing at daybreak,dogs barking and gunshots occasionally they'd better look elsewhere nary a problem.Most neighbors who are a PITA usually don't have a busy enough life so they need to meddle in someone elses,good luck.


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## Scols (Feb 22, 2013)

toonces said:


> i think i'm gonna have to tell the landlord to month-to-month us come renewal time. a lot to think about here. i wonder if my wife would think i'm crazy if i only look for places that have good stove installation prereqs.


 When we bought our house in August one of the main selling points was that the fireplace would accomodate our stove. If you can buy now, our rate was 3.5


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## weatherguy (Feb 23, 2013)

> That isn't necessarily true. Some local governments have ordinances against wood stacking. I know my sister's town/city does. Of course, I NEVER would have bought something there. Too expensive, not enough land, too crowded, and too many restrictions. You have to get the town/city's permission to even cut down your own trees and they usually only grant permission if the tree is dying.


 
well, yeah, and you could buy a house in a developmemnt with an HOA that wouldnt permit you to burn wood or stack wood in the open for your fireplace but I wouldnt and I dont think the OP would buy a house under those conditions. My nearest neighborhor is about 500 feet and thats too close, we're looking for a larger parcel now to build in the future, would like to have a minimum of 10 acres, ideally larger.


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## fabsroman (Feb 23, 2013)

weatherguy said:


> well, yeah, and you could buy a house in a developmemnt with an HOA that wouldnt permit you to burn wood or stack wood in the open for your fireplace but I wouldnt and I dont think the OP would buy a house under those conditions. My nearest neighborhor is about 500 feet and thats too close, we're looking for a larger parcel now to build in the future, would like to have a minimum of 10 acres, ideally larger.


 
Yep, an HOA would screw you over too. That was one of the prerequisites of our last house purchase. No HOA and at least 2 acres. If I go bigger than 2 acres though, I think it has to be 100+. Anything in between is just a hassle to mow grass. Bad enough spending 0.9 on the mower every time I have to mow these 2 acres. We looked at houses with 6 acres and to be honest, that would have been a crapload of mowing. Now, 6 acres with 4 acres wooded would be a different thing. I've been looking at places SW of Richmond, VA and we can easily get 10 acres and a really nice house down there. It is really pulling at my gut. Only thing keeping me here is my parents, siblings, and the fact that my wife might kill me if I wanted to move after getting this place.


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## Wildo (Feb 23, 2013)

If you can qualify a rural development loan is a great deal we got 33yrs @ 3.125% last year. Once you begin they lock your rate so it can't go higher but it can go lower. Ours dropped .125 from signing to closing and saved us like 6k in the long run.


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## Thistle (Feb 23, 2013)

Scotty Overkill said:


> I agree, Lumber Jack. I'd be pizzing to the landlord about all that dog chit in the yard, if that don't work, maybe put it in a bag and set it on her porch for the tenant that complains about the wood....
> Then, you could legitimately tell them "I've had enough of your chit, too!"


 
 That's sounds like what Dad did many years ago to a neighbor down his street who had a huge red lab that squatted on Mom's prized rose bushes several mornings in a row...Dad scooped it up,walked down the sidewalk,rang the doorbell & dumped it on front steps when the guy opened the door... "Here you go,your elephant left this in my yard,I'm returning it."

Myself,I prefer setting the paper bag on fire,then ringing the door & waiting for their response....but that's just me.


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## toonces (Feb 23, 2013)

got the application package in the mail yesterday -- that's a lot of stuff to fill out!

at my age, with my historic temper, i am being over-the-top civil with my neighbor. the dog crap is just one of a list of things that i could complain about. my across-the-street neighbor sides with me b/c he has to mow the lawn and dodge those bombs. not to mention avoid frozen newspapers when he's clearing the snow. like i said, it's all just motivation to get the heck out and stay out (of rentals).

the beauty of the USDA Rural Development loan is that you can look for houses in sparsely-populated areas. now, i still have to get to work, my wife still goes to school and work, and my kid gets shuffled to school way across town, so even though i wish i could live waaay out in the sticks, i'll just be looking in the semi-sticks. and as much as i am meh about Connecticut, it has good public schools and part of my wife's family is close by. i was partially joking about the prerequisite of having accommodations but with what i just payed on my last tank of oil and how that damn furnace is going to be serviced for the third time in about as many weeks, i may bump it up on my list of wants. i'll look out for the HOAs, though.

fabrosman: my landlord and i came to an agreement last year that a stove could be installed if it was inspected and signed-off on by whoever does that sort of thing in my town. he stipulated that he would keep the liner, but the stove was mine and i was fully responsible for the costs of everything. that's when the woodstacks went up, and the meowing started shortly thereafter. i stopped collecting wood for myself after that. i'm bartering away the wood right now and hope i get some working lawn equipment or something else useful now that Neighbor Dave won't be around. gonna miss him and his splitter hehe.


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## gzecc (Feb 23, 2013)

toonces said:


> got the application package in the mail yesterday -- that's a lot of stuff to fill out!
> 
> at my age, with my historic temper, i am being over-the-top civil with my neighbor. the dog crap is just one of a list of things that i could complain about. my across-the-street neighbor sides with me b/c he has to mow the lawn and dodge those bombs. not to mention avoid frozen newspapers when he's clearing the snow. like i said, it's all just motivation to get the heck out and stay out (of rentals).
> 
> ...


 Toonces, Be sure you know the specific locations of the Rural Dev areas. In some areas they are limited. They used to be identified by zipcodes. I'm not sure now.


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## BrotherBart (Feb 23, 2013)

28 years ago we bought this place about two hundred feet farther out than where we would end up with an HOA. Ten years later they developed the five acre properties next to us and they have an HOA. Guy next to us came over to tell me that something violated the HOA agreement one day 15 years ago. I told him my HOA said I could kick his ass all the way the 900 feet back through the woods to his property line.


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## toonces (Feb 23, 2013)

gzecc said:


> Toonces, Be sure you know the specific locations of the Rural Dev areas. In some areas they are limited. They used to be identified by zipcodes. I'm not sure now.


we got lucky. the map and their literature have our current town listed as well as some of the surrounding towns which all interest us. one of which i work in.


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## fabsroman (Feb 23, 2013)

BrotherBart said:


> 28 years ago we bought this place about two hundred feet farther out than where we would end up with an HOA. Ten years later they developed the five acre properties next to us and they have an HOA. Guy next to us came over to tell me that something violated the HOA agreement one day 15 years ago. I told him my HOA said I could kick his ass all the way the 900 feet back through the woods to his property line.


 
Living in Northern Virginia, that is surprising to hear that you do not have an HOA. Granted, they weren't all that prevalent in the 80's and such. I didn't want an HOA so bad that we were looking at buying a lot and building a house if need be.


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## fabsroman (Feb 23, 2013)

toonces said:


> got the application package in the mail yesterday -- that's a lot of stuff to fill out!
> 
> at my age, with my historic temper, i am being over-the-top civil with my neighbor. the dog crap is just one of a list of things that i could complain about. my across-the-street neighbor sides with me b/c he has to mow the lawn and dodge those bombs. not to mention avoid frozen newspapers when he's clearing the snow. like i said, it's all just motivation to get the heck out and stay out (of rentals).
> 
> ...


 
Most of that is really good news.

Regarding the accommodations for a wood stove, etc., do not joke around about that stuff. We are probably saving $2k to $3k a year in heating costs. Defintiely $3k if we still had the oil furnace, and around $2k with the new natural gas furnace (i.e., only used natural gas once so far this heating season). That adds up. If you stay in a house for 20 years, that is $40k to $60k in savings, and that is after tax savings.

Selling and moving also costs a good amount of money. So, choose your area and house wisely and try to stay put as long as possible. We chose our area first. My wife changed jobs to be in this area with better schools. After she changed jobs, we knew we had 4.5 years until our oldest at that point would start public school, so the house search was on. We spent almost 3 years looking at houses. We laugh about it now. I wanted to stay in the $500k range, but we started to get a little ansy and put offers on homes in the $575k to $650k range. I could not sleep at night. Then, everything came together. We found a foreclosure listed at $395k just on the edge of our dividing line of as close to her work as possible but not too close that I felt claustrophobic. On top of that, it was in a neighborhood that we had looked at two other houses we were interested in and almost put offers on. We were a day late putting an offer on a POS at the top of the street that sold for $425k. My wife had really wanted that house. I told her everything would work out. In hindsight, we did much, much better. There were 7 contracts on the house we bought and we actually had to all bid on it. We were the second highest and then the highest one backed out of the house after their inspection (guessing they noticed the water problem and the age of the furnace and A/C). I already knew about all the problems with the house. So, we ended up getting it for $435k. It needs some work, but the possibilities that are here are pretty awesome. First thing that is getting done is the infrastructure. Heating, cooling, plumbing (e.g., all grey polybutylene piping replaced), and water treatment. After that, probably a stand alone garage and/or a french drain with some dry wells to cure the water problem on the front wall. When we were looking at houses, I was always looking to build a stand alone garage/workshop and to complete the basement the way I want it. This house gave me those possibilities better than most and certainly cheaper than most that we looked at. I have 10+ years worth of projects here.

My dad bugged me for the entire 3 years, telling me that we needed a house with a yard so the kids could play, etc. Now, I have the cheapest house out of all my siblings with the most land and almost as much square footage in the 3rd richest county in the nation and with some of the best schools in the nation. Now, I am brilliant and my dad is bugging me about other stuff. lol You would think my dad would understand by now I am in everything for the long haul.

Our total vehicle mileage has dropped from 40,000 a year to 15,000 a year. Just that there is a huge savings in gas, car repairs/maintenance, and car replacement.

Gist of the story, take your time making a decision on a house purchase while saving every dime possible to put use as a down payment.


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## ScotO (Feb 24, 2013)

An HOA is just another form of government that can kiss my ass......never belonged to one, and NEVER plan on it, either....


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## toonces (Feb 24, 2013)

fabsroman said:


> We were a day late putting an offer on a POS at the top of the street that sold for $425k.


 
me and you are in different leagues, fabsroman. that is is waay past the limits of the RD program and waaaay past what we could afford. i'm a man of modest needs hehe. your patience and planning is admirable, however. i kind of feel like i've been working up to this for several years also, but not actively, so i have a decent idea of where i want to move and what i want to move in to. and again, the wood stove is clawing it's way up the list as tonight, after breaking our furnace Thursday, the oil company refused to come out until Monday. at least we can manually fire it up. i wonder if i can burn wood in that thing...


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## fabsroman (Feb 24, 2013)

toonces said:


> me and you are in different leagues, fabsroman. that is is waay past the limits of the RD program and waaaay past what we could afford. i'm a man of modest needs hehe. your patience and planning is admirable, however. i kind of feel like i've been working up to this for several years also, but not actively, so i have a decent idea of where i want to move and what i want to move in to. and again, the wood stove is clawing it's way up the list as tonight, after breaking our furnace Thursday, the oil company refused to come out until Monday. at least we can manually fire it up. i wonder if i can burn wood in that thing...


 
Where I live is like living in New York City. The cost of living is pretty high. Forget the numbers. The median house price in this area is around $975k. We live in a shack compared to most people here, but went with the "Buy the crappiest house in the best neighborhood possible" motto. Granted, the house up the street that we initially wanted to put an offer on is the crappiest in the neighborhood IMO, but we are in the running for 2nd, 3rd, or 4th place I think. I'll be working on moving us up the list.

Just work on getting to where you need to be. It takes time and dedication. We looked at single family homes in 2004 right when we got engaged, and they were around $600k. Told my now wife that we would be eating beans and rice if we spent that much on a house, so we started looking at townhouses. Bought a townhouse for $333k. We could easily afford the townhouse and put an extra $1k toward the mortgage monthly. Ended up selling it at a loss to buy this place, but we still had enough equity in it to put a 20% down payment on this place. Took us 7 years in the townhouse to get this place. 7 years of dealing with cramped quarters, neighbors all over the place, a crackhead getting arrested the next door over the day after our wedding night, gang symbols on the condo complex right next to us, having to do car repairs at my parents, a two car garage I could barely move through much less get a car in, etc. The list of misery was long, but we had a plan and a time frame and we were able to get it done a year early. The goal was to be out of the townhouse in 8 years or less. 

I kept telling my wife, no way a pharmacist and attorney/CPA cannot easily afford a single family house. There is something wrong with this picture. I told her that at some point everything was going to come to a standstill, or prices would reverse themselves. Had no idea the reversal would be this big and last for this long. This foreclosure we bought was sold for $625k in 2005. As I mentioned, we paid $435k for it. The bank lost almost $190k on it and sent investigators out here because the mortgage insurance company denied the bank's claim since the bank did not do due diligence on the loan. Not to mention the bank had already gone into receivorship and the FDIC was running it.

In summary, come up with a plan for the short term and long term, and try to stick to it. Don't expect anything good to come quick or easy, but if it does realize life is not always like that. That mentality is what got a lot of people in trouble in 2008.


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## toonces (Aug 24, 2013)

welp, after applying, some waiting, some verifying, we finally have our certificate from the USDA. i'm not as excited as i thought i'd be probably b/c of what lies ahead in house hunting. my brother had a lot of advice for me, though, and one piece was to have fun with the house search. i guess i will figure that out soon but the past few months of online searching has been entertaining at times i guess.

i think the areas we are zoned in on (west/northwest Hartford county) all will meet our public school needs. we have our list of wants and priorities. we have a budget. i will be looking for that stack of bricks coming out of the roof. here goes!

btw, anyone know how long this process takes after you find a house? i've heard some states are backed up for several months but not sure what reality is in CT vs the internets.


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## Pallet Pete (Aug 24, 2013)

Our loan was Department of Agriculture and it took about 7 months from approval to move in.

Pete


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## swagler85 (Aug 25, 2013)

toonces said:


> btw, anyone know how long this process takes after you find a house? i've heard some states are backed up for several months but not sure what reality is in CT vs the internets.


I sell real estate and the normal USDA process is 60 days from acceptance to closing. Its not uncommon to miss the closing date by a week or so, every once in a while we run into the houses that just take forever. Ive had a few I worked with that were like Pete said and took many months, that often happens when the house doesn't meet all the requirements for USDA. They are picky on the condition of the house.


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## Ashful (Aug 25, 2013)

swagler85 said:


> Ive had a few I worked with that were like Pete said and took many months, that often happens when the house doesn't meet all the requirements for USDA. They are picky on the condition of the house.


 
"What structural failure?  Oh, I can just throw a pallet over that hole."


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## Pallet Pete (Aug 25, 2013)

Joful said:


> "What structural failure?  Oh, I can just throw a pallet over that hole."



Did I hear the word pallet ?


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## NortheastAl (Aug 25, 2013)

Pallet Pete said:


> Did I hear the word pallet ?


Pallets, ya know, kinda like duct tape...


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## teutonicking (Aug 25, 2013)

toonces said:


> welp, after applying, some waiting, some verifying, we finally have our certificate from the USDA. i'm not as excited as i thought i'd be probably b/c of what lies ahead in house hunting. my brother had a lot of advice for me, though, and one piece was to have fun with the house search. i guess i will figure that out soon but the past few months of online searching has been entertaining at times i guess.
> 
> i think the areas we are zoned in on (west/northwest Hartford county) all will meet our public school needs. we have our list of wants and priorities. we have a budget. i will be looking for that stack of bricks coming out of the roof. here goes!
> 
> btw, anyone know how long this process takes after you find a house? i've heard some states are backed up for several months but not sure what reality is in CT vs the internets.


 
Congratulations!  Owning a home is the most significant purchase an American will ever make, with the obvious exception of buying a wood stove.


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## Pallet Pete (Aug 25, 2013)

NortheastAl said:


> Pallets, ya know, kinda like duct tape...


 
I love Red Green too !


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## teutonicking (Aug 25, 2013)

Pallet Pete said:


> I love Red Green too !


 
When I was little, I used to think it was called "duck" tape.


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## Bster13 (Aug 25, 2013)

If u have an agent, ask them to get you a login to Listingbook.com, it is the online MLS and actually what is up for sale, not zillow.com.  GL!


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## pyroholic (Aug 26, 2013)

Thistle said:


> That's sounds like what Dad did many years ago to a neighbor down his street who had a huge red lab that squatted on Mom's prized rose bushes several mornings in a row...Dad scooped it up,walked down the sidewalk,rang the doorbell & dumped it on front steps when the guy opened the door... "Here you go,your elephant left this in my yard,I'm returning it."
> 
> Myself,I prefer setting the paper bag on fire,then ringing the door & waiting for their response....but that's just me.


 
Flinging well deserved poop on a neighbor's porch can be quite rewarding.

Last place I had this opportunity, the neighbor's deck was close enough to fling the bombs with a shovel all the way from yard to the deck easily.  They never said anything, and it never totally fixed the problem.  They prob thought the dog got lazy and just started chitting on the deck.

Hmmmm, neighbors....glad that problem's a thing of the past.


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## Mitch Newton (Aug 26, 2013)

swagler85 said:


> They have a program where they provide loans on houses in rural areas. Can't be in a city, pretty cool program. Better than an FHA loan for many reasons. They are a little picky on condition of the house but a good program to support those buyers wanting to be out of congested areas.


 
As far as condition, they follow the same standards as FHA.


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## swagler85 (Aug 26, 2013)

Mitch Newton said:


> As far as condition, they follow the same standards as FHA.


They add a few rules of their own, FHA is a little less regulated. USDA won't allow any type of manufactured home only stick built. Also with USDA the house must be liveable as it sits, with FHA there is options to buy a house and fix it up with the loan.


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## Ashful (Aug 26, 2013)

pyroholic said:


> Flinging well deserved poop on a neighbor's porch can be quite rewarding.
> 
> Last place I had this opportunity, the neighbor's deck was close enough to fling the bombs with a shovel all the way from yard to the deck easily.  They never said anything, and it never totally fixed the problem.  They prob thought the dog got lazy and just started chitting on the deck.
> 
> Hmmmm, neighbors....glad that problem's a thing of the past.


Ditto, on all of that... always fun to watch them have to clean it off their shoe, when my aim was good enough to land the turds on their stoop!


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## toonces (Aug 27, 2013)

we've hit a bit of snag. they're asking for a fairly sizeable (for us) downpayment. i entered this process b/c i thought a downpayment wasn't nec., but they are zeroing in on my wife's 401(k) which, to me, is no touchy. i know you can normally take out a loan on the 401(k), but she is no longer employed with the original company and the plan administrator doesn't do loans. so, we're stuck here. this was in the eligibility cert. but i assumed 'no down payment' so it was something they rolled into the final loan (oops). well, we're not purchasing a house if her 401(k) has to be withdrawn -- that's stupid in my opinion. the lady at the USDA didn't really give us other options except to come up with the money. so, i'm a bit confused, a bit perturbed. they have all of our financial info down to about the penny and know we don't have that money sitting in the bank. and on top of that, every single thing i've read says, 'no down payment'. there is a rule stating you must use excess of $15k in 'non-retirement assets' toward the purchase and the _Underwriting and Loan Closing Documentation Matrix_ (whatever that is) states under 'Verification of Income: Household Assets' the following:

"Section 1980.347(d)(3)(iii) requires net family assets with a cumulative total of $5,000 or greater to be considered in the annual income calculation. The greater of the actual income derived from all net family assets or a percentage of the value of such assets based on the current passbook savings rate must be considered when calculating annual income. Verification documents must coincide with the type of asset identified for income purposes. Section 1980.302(a) defines net family assets as the value of equity in real property, savings, IRA’s, demand deposits, the market value of stocks, bonds, other forms of capital investments and business or household assets disposed of for less than fair market value for two years preceding the date of loan application (disposition of a trust considered but not inclusion in a foreclosure or bankruptcy). * 401k’s are not considered in net family assets*."

maybe i'm richer in $$$ than i thought  or they want me to sell my cars, cats, furniture, and clothes? i'm confused.


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## teutonicking (Aug 27, 2013)

toonces said:


> we've hit a bit of snag. they're asking for a fairly sizeable (for us) downpayment. i entered this process b/c i thought a downpayment wasn't nec., but they are zeroing in on my wife's 401(k) which, to me, is no touchy. i know you can normally take out a loan on the 401(k), but she is no longer employed with the original company and the plan administrator doesn't do loans. so, we're stuck here. this was in the eligibility cert. but i assumed 'no down payment' so it was something they rolled into the final loan (oops). well, we're not purchasing a house if her 401(k) has to be withdrawn -- that's stupid in my opinion. the lady at the USDA didn't really give us other options except to come up with the money. so, i'm a bit confused, a bit perturbed. they have all of our financial info down to about the penny and know we don't have that money sitting in the bank. and on top of that, every single thing i've read says, 'no down payment'. there is a rule stating you must use excess of $15k in 'non-retirement assets' toward the purchase and the _Underwriting and Loan Closing Documentation Matrix_ (whatever that is) states under 'Verification of Income: Household Assets' the following:
> 
> "Section 1980.347(d)(3)(iii) requires net family assets with a cumulative total of $5,000 or greater to be considered in the annual income calculation. The greater of the actual income derived from all net family assets or a percentage of the value of such assets based on the current passbook savings rate must be considered when calculating annual income. Verification documents must coincide with the type of asset identified for income purposes. Section 1980.302(a) defines net family assets as the value of equity in real property, savings, IRA’s, demand deposits, the market value of stocks, bonds, other forms of capital investments and business or household assets disposed of for less than fair market value for two years preceding the date of loan application (disposition of a trust considered but not inclusion in a foreclosure or bankruptcy). * 401k’s are not considered in net family assets*."
> 
> maybe i'm richer in $$$ than i thought  or they want me to sell my cars, cats, furniture, and clothes? i'm confused.


 
Maybe an inquiry from your local Congressman to the agency involved pointing out that 401k assets are not to be considered net family assets might do the trick.

Are you 100% sure this has nothing to do with your driving record???


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## Ashful (Aug 27, 2013)

Bummer!  Did you print out the text in bold and share this with the lady at the USDA?


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## toonces (Aug 28, 2013)

ha! all those dings on my driving record must have done it!

no, haven't pointed it out b/c i just found that tonight. that's a great idea, though!


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## toonces (Aug 30, 2013)

ok, so ends this route to home ownership! they do indeed want us to cash in my wife's 401k and that's the down payment they calculated for us (with penalties, taxes, ect). still, no one can point out where it states that this enters into the decision. when i pointed out that there is zero documentation regarding 401k's, i was ignored. not gonna push it any more as i take this as a sign; we live in this state b/c we have to (wife has to finish her MA), so the fewer anchors we have, the better when it comes time to take off. crappy way to see things, but we try and try to live reasonably in this grossly expensive state and continue to find ourselves in that gray zone that makes no progress. gonna sign another lease and start looking for wood stoves. neighbor can go f**k herself.


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