# Prevent Baseboard Freeze



## Jlo83 (Jan 14, 2009)

Since I purchased my stove I realized I now have to worry about my baseboards freezing.  I have forced hot water and my boiler is broken and I'd rather not pay to fix it this year.   I was told that I should fix the boiler and put anti-freeze in the pipes but I went with draining the water out of the pipes instead.   This must be a common problem for people with wood and pellet stoves.   What are people doing to prevent baseboards from freezing.    Was it a bad idea that I drained the pipes?


----------



## chrisasst (Jan 14, 2009)

jlo83 said:
			
		

> Since I purchased my stove I realized I now have to worry about my baseboards freezing.  I have forced hot water and my boiler is broken and I'd rather not pay to fix it this year.   I was told that I should fix the boiler and put anti-freeze in the pipes but I went with draining the water out of the pipes instead.   This must be a common problem for people with wood and pellet stoves.   What are people doing to prevent baseboards from freezing.    Was it a bad idea that I drained the pipes?




Well I drained my pipes last year and they still busted in some spots.  So not sure what to tell ya.


----------



## kast (Jan 14, 2009)

Search the forum for ThermGuard or go here 

http://www.bearmountaindesign.com/

This assumes you have a working furnace though


----------



## Souzafone (Jan 14, 2009)

It's not just baseboards, but any water supply has the potential to freeze. In my case, I'll let the furnace run once in awhile during extreme cold so the water pipes in the basement won't freeze.


----------



## j00fek (Jan 14, 2009)

i have a programmed t-stat


----------



## SmokeyTheBear (Jan 14, 2009)

chrisasst said:
			
		

> jlo83 said:
> 
> 
> 
> ...



You have to make certain all of the water is out of the pipes by using compressed air and that all valves are open, and that there is no way for more water to enter the piping.   It is extremely rare for all of the piping to have the proper slope and a drain valve at the lowest point.  In addition just opening a drain valve doesn't allow all of the water to drain as it is common for well sealed runs to hold water because of this all pressure relief valves must be opened as well.


----------



## Barrett (Jan 14, 2009)

those of you who drain it or don't fix it or whatever and don't have a furnace- what do you do when you leave town for a few days?  we went home for christmas, and was nice to turn the stove off and run the furnace.  do you have somebody come and fill the hopper once or twice a day?  i'd be scared not to have a backup in case something happened, even during the day when we are at work, especially with these sub zero temps lately.


----------



## pellet0708 (Jan 14, 2009)

Barrett said:
			
		

> those of you who drain it or don't fix it or whatever and don't have a furnace- what do you do when you leave town for a few days?  we went home for christmas, and was nice to turn the stove off and run the furnace.  do you have somebody come and fill the hopper once or twice a day?  i'd be scared not to have a backup in case something happened, even during the day when we are at work, especially with these sub zero temps lately.




Exactly!   One big factor in purchasing a pellet stove was so that we would have two sources of heat.  If oil was scarce or the furnace quit in the middle of the night which has happened. 
We are heating almost totally with the pellet stove and are able to keep the house warmer than we did with oil but The furnace has to remain operational for those times when we might have to go away unexpectedly or if the pellet stove quit which is more likely.


----------



## bridgerman (Jan 15, 2009)

jlo83 said:
			
		

> Since I purchased my stove I realized I now have to worry about my baseboards freezing.  I have forced hot water and my boiler is broken and I'd rather not pay to fix it this year.   I was told that I should fix the boiler and put anti-freeze in the pipes but I went with draining the water out of the pipes instead.   This must be a common problem for people with wood and pellet stoves.   What are people doing to prevent baseboards from freezing.    Was it a bad idea that I drained the pipes?



My pipes burst twice while I was running my wood stove.  That is when I designed ThermGuard.  It was referenced above at www.bearmountaindesign.com

It has two wires that connect to your thermostat.  It doesn't matter which wires of ThermGuard connect to the red and white wires on your baseboard heat thermostat.  You can't hook it up wrong!  It is a programmable timer that you can configure based on your system.  It doesn't have the restrictions of a programmable thermostat with say a 35% on time, 65% off time.  You can set it up to just put 3 minutes of hot water every 2 hours, or 2 minutes of hot water every 3 hours or any variation of on time in one minute increments and any off time in 15 minute increments.

Once I installed my units, I NEVER worry about freezing pipes no matter how cold it gets outside.

There is also a 10% discount for hearth.com members (search the forum for the discount code).  At $63 bucks, you can't go wrong and it is MUCH less expensive than having a plumber visit on a Saturday (or any other time for that matter).

Check it out.

Cheers,
John


----------



## orangecrushcj7 (Jan 15, 2009)

My furnace is actually out of commision right now due flooding as a result of the ice storm back in december.  I took the wiring apart on the circulating pump, and wired on a plug.  I then plugged it into a simple household timer that has on/off increments of 15 mins.  I have it run for 15 minutes, then off for 45, run for 15 mins, off for 45. My circ pump is only .7 amps and the timer is rated at 15 amps.  So far so good, for the month it has been hooked up this way. Moving water won't freeze.  Plus, the water gets pumped thru the warm house too.


----------



## old4x4 (Jan 15, 2009)

Souzafone said:
			
		

> In my case, I'll let the furnace run once in awhile during extreme cold so the water pipes in the basement won't freeze.


I run my boiler a couple times a day for a minute or 2.


----------



## Jlo83 (Jan 15, 2009)

I hooked the air compressor to the pipes and blew out the water so I am hoping its good.  I just purchased the house the hot water tank went first and thank God we switched it to Electric.  Then the boiler went.  So can't afford to fix it right now especially since I just purchased the pellet stove on top of that.   The basement seems to be staying above freezing except for the garage which is colder.   Now that the pipes are drained and to fix the boiler is going to cost a ton of money not really sure what my options are... Pray they don't break?!

As far as my regular water pipes they are all well insulated up and I put the electric plug where the water comes into the house.  We figured the worst case would be if it broke before the shut off valve so we sealed it up good!  Plus I let the sinks drip when its this cold.   Hopefully that works.  I worry about this all the time.  Last night me and my fiance could hear noises in the baseboard.   When we blew air through the pipes we left the air in it and closed it up not sure what I am hearing!

I guess next year I will fix the boiler and either put a circulator or antifreeze???  Everyone has a different opionion what to do.  I don't even want the boiler I just want to use my stove!!  I grew up with only a wood stove I dont even know anything about this boiler!


----------



## Wet1 (Jan 15, 2009)

jlo83 said:
			
		

> I hooked the air compressor to the pipes and blew out the water so I am hoping its good.  I just purchased the house the hot water tank went first and thank God we switched it to Electric.  Then the boiler went.  So can't afford to fix it right now especially since I just purchased the pellet stove on top of that.   The basement seems to be staying above freezing except for the garage which is colder.   Now that the pipes are drained and to fix the boiler is going to cost a ton of money not really sure what my options are... Pray they don't break?!
> 
> As far as my regular water pipes they are all well insulated up and I put the electric plug where the water comes into the house.  We figured the worst case would be if it broke before the shut off valve so we sealed it up good!  Plus I let the sinks drip when its this cold.   Hopefully that works.  I worry about this all the time.  Last night me and my fiance could hear noises in the baseboard.   When we blew air through the pipes we left the air in it and closed it up not sure what I am hearing!
> 
> I guess next year I will fix the boiler and either put a circulator or antifreeze???  Everyone has a different opionion what to do.  I don't even want the boiler I just want to use my stove!!  I grew up with only a wood stove I dont even know anything about this boiler!


Does the boiler need to be repaired or replaced?  I just converted over from oil to NG and I have two oil boilers sitting here.  I was going to sell the newer one because it's only a few years old, but the older one still works fine and has some life left in it.  Let me know if you need to replace yours.


----------



## treehackers (Jan 15, 2009)

bridgerman said:
			
		

> jlo83 said:
> 
> 
> 
> ...




I take it that you need one of these for each zone? My oil furnace has 4 zones.


----------



## bridgerman (Jan 15, 2009)

treehackers said:
			
		

> I take it that you need one of these for each zone? My oil furnace has 4 zones.



That is correct...it can't connect to all the zones simultaneously.  The point is to have ThermGuard work in conjunction with the existing thermostats.  Each zone will work as though ThermGuard was not attached if you turn ThermGuard off (as most people do in the warmer months).

Another nice feature is that ThermGuard will not come on if the zone has recently called for heat through the thermostat.  That way, it will only come on (for instance) two hours after the thermostat has last called for heat.  No need to run extra water through the pipes.

Cheers,
John


----------



## Nicholas440 (Jan 15, 2009)

After reading about feezing pipes here, I got to thinking that I better let a few faucets drip constantly because my furnace has not been running and I never gave the water pipes a thought since they are under the house and the house has a crawl space below ground level but its still very cold under it.

I would say let some of your faucets drip until the severe cold snap is over and temps get back to more seasonal.


----------



## treehackers (Jan 15, 2009)

bridgerman said:
			
		

> treehackers said:
> 
> 
> 
> ...



John,

Just bought one and paid thru Paypal - thanks for the "Hearth" discount


----------



## sinnian (Jan 15, 2009)

Nicholas440 said:
			
		

> After reading about feezing pipes here, I got to thinking that I better let a few faucets drip constantly because my furnace has not been running and I never gave the water pipes a thought since they are under the house and the house has a crawl space below ground level but its still very cold under it.
> 
> I would say let some of your faucets drip until the severe cold snap is over and temps get back to more seasonal.



Letting your faucets drip does nothing for the water (gray) in your heating pipes.  Sounds like you should turn on your furnace and let it run once in a while, or purchase a ThermoGuard.


----------



## bridgerman (Jan 16, 2009)

treehackers said:
			
		

> John,
> 
> Just bought one and paid thru Paypal - thanks for the "Hearth" discount



Thanks!  It will ship tomorrow.

Cheers,
John


----------



## xbillyx (Jan 26, 2009)

I've found a lot of helpful information on this site.  I've found myself in the same situation (pipes froze last week in baseboards because I was running pellet stove).

I just purchased two ThermGuards.


----------



## bridgerman (Dec 9, 2009)

Hey all,

Don't forget about the baseboard freezing problem with this cold weather coming in. I am still offering a 10% discount for Hearth.com members on ThermGuard. ThermGuard is a programmable timer that attaches to your thermostat that you can use to circulate a little water through your pipes periodically to keep them from freezing. It is about $63 bucks which is a small price compared to repairing your pipes in an emergency. Just enter 101657512 in the voucher/discount code field to receive your discount. There is FREE shipping to within the USA.

ThermGuard also won a prestigious Vesta award for being the most innovative hearth accessory of the year at the Hearth, Patio and Barbeque show in Reno.

ThermGuard can be viewed at the web site: www.bearmountaindesign.com

Cheers,
John


----------



## imacman (Dec 9, 2009)

Yep, I brought this subject up a while ago as I figured there were some "newbies" on the forum that might need the Thermguard.

Great product...LOVE mine!


----------



## treehackers (Dec 9, 2009)

I bought one also - works as it should

FYI - if you have more than one zone you will need one for EACH zone/thermostat


----------



## treehackers (Dec 9, 2009)

jlo83 said:
			
		

> I hooked the air compressor to the pipes and blew out the water so I am hoping its good. I just purchased the house the hot water tank went first and thank God we switched it to Electric. Then the boiler went. So can't afford to fix it right now especially since I just purchased the pellet stove on top of that. The basement seems to be staying above freezing except for the garage which is colder. Now that the pipes are drained and to fix the boiler is going to cost a ton of money not really sure what my options are... Pray they don't break?!
> 
> As far as my regular water pipes they are all well insulated up and I put the electric plug where the water comes into the house. We figured the worst case would be if it broke before the shut off valve so we sealed it up good! Plus I let the sinks drip when its this cold. Hopefully that works. I worry about this all the time. Last night me and my fiance could hear noises in the baseboard. When we blew air through the pipes we left the air in it and closed it up not sure what I am hearing!
> 
> I guess next year I will fix the boiler and either put a circulator or antifreeze??? Everyone has a different opionion what to do. I don't even want the boiler I just want to use my stove!! I grew up with only a wood stove I dont even know anything about this boiler!



Go here - http://www.masssave.com/

In MA there is a program ending ??? to give homeowners a no interest loan for an energy efficient heating system replacement.

There are other free, low cost, or rebate progams on the site also


----------



## Gweeper64 (Dec 9, 2009)

Thanks for bumping this, macman. I didn't see it first time around ( I was just getting my stove around then). I'm going to order a ThermaGuard soon. I have been manually turning my thermostat up when it gets extremely cold out to circulate the baseboard pipes for a few minutes. This will save me from having to do it manually and protect me if I forget! Great idea.


----------



## jj1949 (Dec 10, 2009)

I also have hot water baseboard heat and last month I had my plumber drain my system and refill it with an anti freeze solution. I did have a water line partially freeze last winter, it was on the zone line for my upstairs which never sees heat other than my pellet stove. I'm more cautious this year and yes, I think the therm guard was one of the best ideas anyone could've ever come up with. The last thing any one of us wants is to have water lines burst and have the expense of replacing them.


----------



## imacman (Dec 10, 2009)

Gweeper64 said:
			
		

> .....This will save me from having to do it manually and protect me if I forget! Great idea.



Yep, the ThermGuard is really the perfect thing for people that heat w/ alternatives to HHO or Gas.


JJ1949, sorry to hear you went to the expense of filling with anti-freeze....hope you never have a leak in the house with that stuff.


----------



## jj1949 (Dec 10, 2009)

Me too Macman but it was before I knew anything about the ThermGuard. Would've saved me money for sure but can't look back now.


----------



## imacman (Dec 10, 2009)

jj1949 said:
			
		

> Me too Macman but it was before I knew anything about the ThermGuard. Would've saved me money for sure but can't look back now.



Yep, I understand.


----------



## EJW1 (Dec 10, 2009)

Nicholas440 said:
			
		

> After reading about feezing pipes here, I got to thinking that I better let a few faucets drip constantly because my furnace has not been running and I never gave the water pipes a thought since they are under the house and the house has a crawl space below ground level but its still very cold under it.
> 
> I would say let some of your faucets drip until the severe cold snap is over and temps get back to more seasonal.




Letting your faucets drip during extreme cold can help keep the water lines from freezing but it can freeze your sewer line shut. Little tiny amounts of water 
will never make it all the way out of a sewer line before they freeze.


----------

