# Outdoor wood boilers review



## pdboilermaker

My buddies and I have outside wood boilers, we have had them for a couple of years now.  Of course we meet at the fence row to cuss, fuss, and discuss which one is better.  The WoodMaster, the Central Boiler, or the Heatmor.  I dont know about you but my buddies and I had to buy different brands just so we could argue.

The one thing that we can all agree on is we wish that woodboilers were listed on epinions or a similar sight so that newbys as well as us could find out the pros/cons etc of each woodboiler such as expected issues, wood consumption etc. made by each of the now dozens of new manufactures.  Does anyone know of such a sight?  Shall we just start one here?

While it is fun for the 3 of us, that is a low sample of 1 piece of data per manufacturer.  To make a good descision, you would need much more data to identify any trends.


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## Eric Johnson

I'd like to get some honest answers on wood consumption for various brands/types of boilers. I think some people lie about how much wood they burn, just like some people lie about their gas mileage. I know there are important variables, but maybe discussing those would be useful as well.


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## JustWood

I don't own an OWB myself ( so my opinion is unbiased).  WOODCO provides  1-2000 customers a year their yearly wood supply, so I get to talk to alot of stove and OWB owners .  Over the years I have asked many OWB owners the pros and cons.  Central Boiler seems to have the best reviews and least complaints.  I recently advised my father to buy a  Central Boiler.    Just fired it up in the last week or so and he loves it.  I'm impressed with how well it works without a forced draft.like many models have.


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## pdboilermaker

OK then we will begin here with the comparisons I suppose:

1.  The home and conditions:

I live in North Central Indiana, in the country close to Kokomo

I am heating a 100 year old farm house that is 3300 square feet of a well insulated (R38 in celings / R19 in the walls) two story home using a forced air furnace for the upstairs and a forced air furnace for the downstairs

I have little to no windbreak (come on planted trees, grow), and the wind really whips around here, especially in fall, spring, and winter

My typical propane bills (prior to the boiler installed in March 2005) were about $2000/year with two 90+ furnaces and a tankless hot water heater

I have always used digital kickback thermostats with the following settings:  445am 70, 7am 50, 430pm 70, 930pm 60

2.  The boiler:

It is a Woodmaster 4400 made with mild steel, 125 gallons of water, fan induced draft

Woodmaster themselves said that the stainless steel is not a good value for the money and they sell stainless also.  My friend with a Central Boiler was told the same thing by their engineers as well.

It sets about 30 feet from the house

1" pex line buried about 34" in the ground

Smoke looks like when you first start a campfire for about 10 minutes then it goes away, while idle, smoke looks about like what comes off of a big fat cigar

I use it to run my upstairs furnace, my down stairs furnace, and heat my water

Boiler does NOT run year round, it is not worth the effort (to me)  to run it in the summer just to heat our domestic water

Boiler typically runs from mid October to mid May so like 7-8 months total per year

3.  The wood:

I burn any kind of wood from pine (in the cooler months) to hardwoods (in the midst of winter) and telephone poles ($1.00 each from our local utility) that are used for those sub-zero days and nights with the really low wind chills

My neighbor is a tree trimmer so I have an unlimited supply of fire wood

Many of my co-workers donate their fallen down trees if I will cut up and remove

In the town I work, there is a saw mill that makes pallets (from hard wood only) you can buy their scrap, typically 8" x 8" x 24" to 36" for $20.00.  That is two dumps onto your trailor, truck etc.  from their 5 cubic yard payloader.  When its all said and done, thats about a cord of hardwood for $20.00.  This is good to use if you are in a pinch because of snow or whatever.

4.  Filling the boiler:

This element is so dependat on the weather so it is nearly impossible to judge.  If the wind is blowing from the NW at 15-MPH but the outside temp is 32, I will burn much more wood then if the outside temp is 0 with no wind.  Wind is my nemisis.

I most generally fill the boiler 2 times per day.  At 6am then again at 5pm to get this type of times between fill ups, you must adjust what TYPE of wood that you use as seen above with the pine, hardwood, telephone poles example above.

I do go out often to stoke the fire.  Just because I like an excuse to go outside.  While I am out there, maybe I throw in a log or two each time.

5.  Total amout of wood used per heating season:

I have only had my boiler for two complete seasons (now entering the third) and I estimate that I burn between 9-12 cords per year again depending on the wind.

It is hard to really judge though since I am always picking up a little wood here or there.

Right now, I have 10 cords cut and split since spring, and the boiler is going.  But, on nicer days (even in January) the boys and I will go cut a truck load on the weekends just for somethibng to do.

6.  The problems:

The little glass jelly jar light cover on the front of the boiler does not stay on very well 


Hope that this gets everyone started so that we can do some comparisons.  If we all follow this same format, it should be easy to decipher for people.


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## Nofossil

I don't have an OWB, but I do have an indoor boiler. I have really good data (no gas mileage stuff) on wood consumption, and I have a good baseline vs. previous experience with oil.

Summary - Oil was used for heating 3500 sq ft well-insulated house in Vermont. Oil also was used to heat domestic hot water and a large hot tub. Oil consumption was about 740 gallons per year. Of that 740 gallons, about 620 was heat / hot water / hot tub during the winter months.

First winter, we burned 3.2 cords of wood and about 12 gallons of oil for the winter months. That winter was warmer than average (2005-2006).

Next winter, we burned about 4.25 cords (+/- about .1 cords) and about 4 gallons of oil for the winter months.

My boiler is an Orlan / EKO 25, which is an 80,000 BTU/hr gasification boiler.


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## rsnider

hi yall love this forum lots of good info. glad to see some owb discussion in the boiler room. i currently dont have a heating source yet for this heating season but eager to buy one for next season. my brother-in-law has a empyre owb and it does about the same as just discussed. it works fine but im looking for something a little more efficient "less wood". his house is very warm and it is great but even he will say how much it uses the wood. he has radiant floor heat, forced air and heating dhw. the radiant works the best and his forced air hardly kicks on. his house is a ranch with basement 4000sft plus garages the same as me. both homes new well insulated and we installed all radiant. so far i have helped install 4 homes with radiant floor heat and they all work great no problems. obviusly my doesnt work yet no  boiler ha ha. right now im using my "backup" heat pump can u say cold heat.


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## ISeeDeadBTUs

Ok, ok, ok . . . back up the bus. . . . did you just say that you use 8 full cord (4' X 4' X 8') to heat (no DHW production) a 1,400 residence? Cause if you did/do . . . unless your house is made of cardboard, you have a problem!!

Jimbo


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## webbie

Wood poles may be poisoning you, your neighbors and the environment in general.....

pentachlorophenol, creosote, copper chromated arsenate and other wood preservatives are used in them...

From another forum:
"DO NOT BURN OLD POLES!! They are listed as Hazardous Material in the disposal department. Which ever type of preservative they used to make the pole, there are serious advisories against burning them.

I used to work for "the Phone Company" and we had to read the warning papers that came with the pole shipments. They also have sheets that go in the MSDS book for "Right To Know" reading by employees, treatments for reactions to chemicals used, for Dr. information. Papers warned of possible serious dangers to people breathing in the smoke, contaminated ashes causing problems also washing off into water systems. "

Sorry to say, but OWB's deserve a bad rap if folks are doing this kind of stuff.
 8-/


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## jdurant

i do not own an out door boiler but if I were to buy one I would by the sequioa paradise heat tranfer machine. It seems that it would burn hot with all the firebrick. It also has coal shaker grates. go to www.wdheat.com and check it out.


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## heaterman

I'm a licensed heating contractor in Michigan and let me say at the outset that I am 100% for renewable energy of any type be it purely heat or electrical generation or CHP.  I will also say that producing copious amounts of air pollution in the form of toxic gases and particulate emission, in the name of energy "savings" is a gross mistake. Any consumption of energy should be done in the most efficient manner possible regardless of how cheap the fuel source is. Using energy in non efficient ways is what got us into this mess in the first place and it matters not what form the energy comes in. Wood, coal, oil, natural gas, or whatever, one would think we would have learned our lesson, but no, consumers still demand "the cheapest" and manufacturers happily oblige due to the regulatory vacuum currently in place.  As usual our government is about 5 years behind the times, closing the barn door after the horse is already gone. 

  There is a lot of misinformation, poor information, lack of information and outright lies regarding OWB equipment. Most of which is "distributed" by salesmen who will say anything to make a sale and companies who, if they have ever tested for efficiency, somehow neglected to release the results. I recently heard a claim made by a company, which will remain nameless, that their unit was 90% efficient and you could tell that by the flame coming out of the exhaust. The truly sad thing is that the customer believed it. 

Early this spring Warnock Hersey labs in Wisconsin tested 7 units from major OWB manufacturers and the results were stunning. Under tightly controlled lab conditions, burning 20% moisture content wood, in spotlessly clean equipment, these 7 units ran from a low of 28% to a high of 41% efficiency. This does not include heat loss from the unit sitting outside or the piping to the structure. As I understand it, agencies from several states were involved in this in order to gain insight as to what type of regulations should be applied to these. To my knowledge these test results have not been released as yet so I cannot divulge any information regarding brands.  I only know of it because of some correspondence with a person in the Michigan DEQ Air Quality division. Testing has also shown that one of these units emits the same amount of particulate matter as about 1,000 fuel oil fired furnaces. 


Few OWB's are actually boilers because a boiler has to be a closed system. Most are open to the atmosphere to preclude the possibility of explosion. Being open vessels they cannot be sealed from the ravages of oxygen corrosion, hence the importance of proper chemical treatment of the heating fluid. Many OWB's fail because of this fact. Many of the OWB companies were started by sheetmetal fabricating shops with virtually no knowledge of proper and clean combustion. They are as technically advanced as a pot of water over top of a camp fire.

I would not consider for myself or recommend to a customer ANY of the typical OWB equipment on the market currently.  Sealed system, gasification type boilers routinely hit in excess of 80% with some like EKO, Tarm and  Econoburn hitting 85-87%. Do they cost more? Only in terms of intial outlay. One doesn't have to turn over too many rocks to find that the average OWB has a relatively short life expectancy as far as heating equipment goes. Many times the initial investment including installation and cost of fuel is hardly recovered before failure occurs.


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## Eric Johnson

Excellent, informative post, heaterman. Welcome to the Boiler Room.


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## Nofossil

heaterman said:
			
		

> Early this spring Warnock Hersey labs in Wisconsin tested 7 units from major OWB manufacturers and the results were stunning. Under tightly controlled lab conditions, burning 20% moisture content wood, in spotlessly clean equipment, these 7 units ran from a low of 28% to a high of 41% efficiency.  Sealed system, gasification type boilers routinely hit in excess of 80% with some like EKO, Tarm and  Econoburn hitting 85-87%.



Hello, my name is nofossil, and I'm a data addict.

This post is my kind of crack. I bought the EKO for the clean burning. I didn't realize that the fuel savings were so dramatic. I've averaged about 4 cords per season for heat, hot water, and hot tub. Based on these numbers, I'd be using eight to fifteen cords per year with an OWB. This actually tallies with numbers that I've read here and elsewhere.

By my calculations, I'm getting about 18 million BTU/cord delivered into the house, hot tub, and hot water. My firewood is a mixture, about 2/3 assorted decent hardwood and 1/3 red cedar, punky hardwood, poplar, and other junk.

Amazingly, that works out to 80% - 85% overall efficiency depending on the assumptions that you make about the wood.


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## ISeeDeadBTUs

At 6', I don't need a soapbox to stand on.

Anyone that retreats to oil as being better for the environment based on the smoke they see from OWB (Throwing them all in one box) either is shortsighted (at best) or is protecting their position. Wanna compare 'pollution'? then

look at the whole picture

my wood fired hydronic requires

gas in my truck to go get the wood
gas/oil in my chain saw
recycling the steel in old saw chains
combustion products released into the air

How bout we look at ALL the pollution that has to happen to get th oil out of the ground, refined, delivered, then finally combusted in my boiler?


comparing the stack of an OWB to the the stack from an oil furnace is pure BS, sorry :-/ 

Having said that, anyone that believes what a salesman says (OWB, oil, gas, WHATEVER) at face value is scary.

Ya know what's sad? We still get advertising bombarded at us hourly about how we deserve 'nice things', nice cars', big 'nice houses'. A friend of mine recently install 3 oil boilers in a doctor's house built for two people. They are staged so as to provide the appropriate amount of heat and DHW for these two people. IMHO that's just sad and stupid. Now more and more people think the government should 'do something' about high gas prices.

Yada, yada, yada.


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## heaterman

Hmmmmm; where to start..........

1. To all who think that I was advocating traditional fuels such as oil, please re-read my opening statement.

2. The comparison of stack emissions between an OWB and 1,000 oil fired furnaces is to point out just how filthy a typical OWB really is. NOT how clean an oil burner is. Lord knows I've brushed and cleaned enough oil fired furnaces and boilers to flaty state that they can burn very dirty when things are not tuned correctly. This is not anecdotal look at the smoke evidence, those numbers were generated in a test by the New York DEQ. Goggle "Smoke gets in your eyes" and you should find the test results. Very interesting.

3. I agree 100% that total life cycle costs should be evaluated on any and all products that we purchase. The cheapest is seldom the best when looking at something from that perspective.

4. We installed a heating system in a 8,200 sq ft house up on Michigan's "Gold Coast" a couple years ago. The job required 5 boilers that totaled over 1MMbtu's. We heated almost 6,200 sq ft of outside cement in the driveway and approach. It had to be heated because of the extreme slope on the drive. You'd never get up the thing if there was a 1/2" of snow on it. Talk about a waste of resources........it's a sin....nothing less. No one deserves that kind of excess, not when it effectively robs someone else of that energy.

5. All forms of energy need to be utilized in the most efficient manner possible, even wood. That's the problem I have with the typical OWB's.  Running a wood boiler at 80+% is easily done so why bother with something that produces half that. The only reason is low first cost, not low life cycle cost.

6. I think that there is going to be a HUGE switch to alternate fuels in very short order. Do some research on world crude oil production since 2005. It is scary to contemplate but world production has been flat to slightly declining for the last 2 1/2 years. The vast majority of the easy to get oil has been found and from here on out it gets exponentially more costly to produce a barrel of crude. Soooooo.......why not get our wood burning ducks in a row and use the best possible equipment instead of units that give wood burning a bad name. 

I get the feeling I'm preaching to the choir here but I think a new paradigm is out in front of us and we better get it right this time.


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## ISeeDeadBTUs

Can't speak for 'All", but I got the distinct impression you prefer oil to 'traditional OWB'.  I'm from NY, castigate me for the roneous - assuming it was, in fact - impression, not the rest of the fine gents here :coolsmirk: 

Two things I would ask for your input on.

1)How do you define Emmisions? For example, if it's what you see coming out of the stack, then I think you've missed entirly the point of the emissions created while refining oil. As far as a 'traditional OWB' what do you actually SEE coming out the stack? I will leave the talk of the chemicals coming out to those here that understand chemistry way better than I. But if it's "particulate matter" aka unburned wood and ash . . . if the particulate matter settles out of the air and lands on the owners ground, what harm has it done?

2)If you read the entire "Smoke Gets in Your eyes" (please tell me you realize the political source of that document) you know that it took umberage with the statement that low stack temperature indicates high efficiency. Since a few of the apparently more knowledgable gentleman here also believe that low stack temp indicates a cleaner burn, where do you stand on this statement? Is the science wrong? The politician? The end user?

Jimbo


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## georgeinct

In my research in looking for a woodburning stove, I have come to the conclusion that I may be better off with a wood boiler instead.  I have never had either so it is  a new thing for sure.  I agree with the contractor from MI who said that the environment should be taken into consideration and anything purchased should be hopefully as clean burning as possible.  Our political system which failed to make energy independence a national priority like JFK did with getting to the moon has all of us behind an eightball unfortunately, and being held hostage by the fossil fuel powers that be until the next techno breakthrough comes along.  Let's not complain too much about high prices, there is a silver lining, hopefully they will hasten the development of the new technologies that will deliver us from the geopolitical and economic energy mess that we are in.  I am looking into Geothermal also, and may make a go of it but still would like to burn wood as I get it for free. 

I have narrowed down the woodstove possibilities to Vermont Castings Defiant, the largest model, which is the cleanest burning stove made per the EPA or the Mansfield or the new Equinox by Hearthstone.  Does anyone have any experience with any of these stoves?

If I go with a wood boiler, I have narrowed it down to HS Tarm, Econoburn, Greenwood, or EKO...HS Tarm seems to be the established name, EKO does not have much of a warranty or track record yet, Econoburn seems pricey, Greenwood looks good but weighs 3000 lbs.  Obviously, there are many factors more than these.  The problem is no one does unbiased independent testing of these boilers and all claims made by manufacturers are just that, claims.  It is difficilt to know who makes the best.

does anyone have any experience with any of these?  Surely, gasification is the way to go, I have to heat a house which is about 5200 s.f.

I would welcome and be thankful for any information.


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## Eric Johnson

I've got the EKO 60 and I'm very happy with it. Other people on this board have the other boilers you mentioned, plus a few that you didn't.

Welcome to Hearth.com and the Boiler Room. Hopefully we can help you make an informed decision. Gasification is the way to go, and there are a number of very good options.


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## georgeinct

Eric, thanks for the message.  How long have you had it?  How long of a burn time will it do?  How much wood are you burning per season?  
 How did you decide on the EKO vs. Tarm, etc.?  Does anyone have a Tarm, Greenwood or Econoburn?

thanks, george


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## Eric Johnson

I'm just getting started with it and still have a lot of work to do on the system to get it about where I want it. It's heating the house (big one) and greenhouse (old, ineffient one) with no problem. It really kicked into gear during a recent cold snap, so I'm pretty confident that it will do the job and then some. Because my tank isn't operational yet, I haven't had the opportunity to fill it completely with wood, but I suspect that on a typical winter day, with the tank, it would need to be loaded about once a day. I like to fool with it, so when I'm around, I know I'll be poking around at whenever I feel like it. Compared to my old, conventional wood-fired boiler (Royall) it produces a lot of heat for the amount of wood burned.

I went with the EKO for a few reasons: 1.) It was about $1,000 cheaper than the Tarm 60. 2.) It takes 24+" wood, which is all I have, while the Tarm maxes out at 20 inches and, 3.) The dealer and importer were very helpful before, during and after the installation with all my questions and concerns. Since I did the work myself, that was an important consideration.

The Tarm is a fine boiler with a much better warranty and a long track record in the U.S. market. I don't think you can go wrong there, but I'm impressed with the EKO so far. I especially like the mechanical heat exchanger cleaner, which I don't think is an option on the Tarm.


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## georgeinct

The Tarm does definitely have a good rep. and track record, but I agree I wish they made at least one size larger, my house is 5300 s.f.  How many square feet are you heating, is house insulated, how warm do you keep the house?  do you have radiators, baseboard, or hot air?

There is also like I mentioned the Greenwood, and the Econoburn, among others.  The EKO has a short warranty which I do not like, they claim it is made from "boiler steel" and to ASME standards, is it really well constructed compared to the Tarm?  Unfortunately, can't see any of these things physically side by side or get any data beased on independent testing to compare apples to apples.  I mean there is no way to know which one is more efficient, puts out more BTU, is better constructed and so on, because you are relying on mostly manufacturers claims and any user information that you can gather.

I will have to just make a decision and pick one.


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## Eric Johnson

I've got about 3,000 square feet of old farmhouse with a couple of additions. Overall, I'd rate the insulation as fair. I also have a 12x24-foot single pane glass greenhouse. My wife likes to keep the house between 75 and 80. Domestic hot water is also heated with the EKO. All our heat is provided by cast iron radiators. Pic attached. My boiler is in an insulated, concrete block room in my barn. I pipe hot water to a gas boiler in my basement and from there it is distributed into the house zones. A separate 3/4-inch line goes directly from the EKO into the greenhouse radiant. A 1,000 gallon tank and copper hx waits in the wings.

I can't really comment on the EKO's build quality compared to the Tarm. It pales in comparison to the Wood Gun, but for twice the price, what do you expect? Looks to be made of good boiler plate, nice looking welds and it works as advertised. Plenty of refractory cast into the doors and gasification chamber. To me it looks like a typical steel plate boiler; you don't know how long they're going to last until they fail. My understanding is that Orlan is a well-known and respected boiler manufacturer in Europe. I know that Poland has a good reputation for manufacturing, i.e., shipbuilding, etc.

The EKO claims 91 percent overall efficiency while the Tarm claims something like 85%, I believe. The rated output of the EKO 60 is 205K btu/hour, compared to something just shy of 200 K for the Tarm Solo 60. Presumably they're both 60KW units. Do the math on 60KW and you come up with 205K btu.

I shut the gas boiler and electric water heater off when I'm running the EKO, so we're pretty much 24/7/365 except for when everyone is out of town.


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## ISeeDeadBTUs

georgeinct said:
			
		

> Does anyone have a Tarm, Greenwood or Econoburn?
> 
> thanks, george



I have a GW100 here. IMHO most of the models you -and others- have been considering are good. I think each one has it's own strengths and weaknesses.

Unless it stays 40 degrees outside for a couple of months yet (Farmers' Almanac is not THAT pessimistic :coolsmirk: ) my thought would be to not rush anything for this year. That will give you time to make a list of important features, so that you can shop around and see what fits best. 



Jimbo


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## georgeinct

Thanks for the info Eric, I had not even heard of the Wood Gun until you mentioned it, but just went to their website and did my homework.  They claim that their is no heat storage tank needed, that is a good thing, from what you said I suppose they are pricey, I will have to call them and find out.  It is a long term investment and I want to do it once and do it right.

Hopefully, I can find some more real world users like yourself and make a decision.


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## leaddog

georgeinct said:
			
		

> Thanks for the info Eric, I had not even heard of the Wood Gun until you mentioned it, but just went to their website and did my homework.  They claim that their is no heat storage tank needed, that is a good thing, from what you said I suppose they are pricey, I will have to call them and find out.  It is a long term investment and I want to do it once and do it right.
> 
> Hopefully, I can find some more real world users like yourself and make a decision.



I looked at the wood gun before I bought the eko and they are a very nice unit. One of the selling points for me was that they had a oil gun tube installed for alternate heat that is seperate from the wood side. That was attractive to me as I had a good gun, tank, and I burn fuel oil in my tractor. I went and saw a unit that was in operation and was impressed. I do believe that they would run more efficient with storage as any time you idle You will smoke at start and that is wasted heat. The deciding factor was between the time of reserching and buying the price went up past my set limit. They are a very nice unit. That said I'm very happy now with the eko80.
The selling point for me over the Tarm was the size of wood. I cut my own wood and I cut a lot of wolf trees. That means alot of small dia limbs and I like to cut them 3ft long to make it easier to handle and less time. The 80 will take 42in long and with the storage the over capasity isn't a problem.
If you can go see a unit in operation but I do believe that most any of the units are way better that a traditional owb. Been there done that.
leaddog


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## brad068

Does anyone out there have a Wood Doctor Converter wood boiler. They are suppose to be a gasifying boiler. Would like to here the operation and maintenance of it.


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## chubs

I too was looking at the wood doctor


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## Eric Johnson

I see wood doctors OWBs parked all over the place, but never one that wasn't smoking. I haven't heard about a gasification version, though that would be interesting to see in action. There's a place nearby that sells them, but they're all the traditional OWBs. This place has a big pile of green logs parked next to the unit they're actually using. Looks like when it needs filling, somebody goes out with a chainsaw and lopps of a couple of rounds.

The Wood Gun is at the high end, from what I've seen. The deal with storage is this: you can get by without it, but it's the key to seeing the kind of efficiency and clean-burn claims made for the gasifier (any gasifier). It's just that when they're trying to sell you a boiler for, say, $8,000 or $10,000, it's probably the wrong time to start talking about spending another 5 grand on a tank and hx. As a practical matter, I think the Wood Gun is probably pretty similar in operation to a Tarm or EKO or Econoburn or BioMax or other water-jacketed downdraft gasifier. But it is built like a Sherman tank.


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## Eric Johnson

Garnification said:
			
		

> Does anyone out there have a Wood Doctor Converter wood boiler. They are suppose to be a gasifying boiler. Would like to here the operation and maintenance of it.



There's a place at the intersection of Hwys 21 and 22 in Wautoma that used to sell Wood Doctors. Don't know if that's still the case, but it was back in September when I went through there.


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## myleakywooddoctor

Hey there,

I'm new to this forum, but got lots to say regarding OWB in general and in particular my corroding stainless steel Wood Doctor furnace.  First off I would like you all to know about a site I found devoted to this very subject . . .

http://outdoorwoodfurnaceinfo.com/forum/index.php 

I have had two SS Wood Doctors corrode threw on me so far and I had only been up and running for  5 heating seasons, so I have lots of things to say about warranty wording, grounding, anodes, water treatment, circulation, piping, heat exchangers and so on!

I hope I will be able to add some insights to this site as well.

I just have to upload a picture now as we all know, a picture is worth a thousand words!

Later,

Leaky 

I decided to add a picture of the holes in my Heavy Gauge Stainless Steel Wood Doctor Boiler that I'm trying to keep sealed with some high Temperature Epoxy Putty!


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## Eric Johnson

greeninsulation said:
			
		

> Our Wood Doctor Gasification Converters are being redesigned to be more energy efficient and will be the industry leader!  We ship factory direct so contact us at www.WoodDoctorConverters.com for more info.



Or maybe the "industry leaker!"


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## Jim K in PA

Eric Johnson said:
			
		

> greeninsulation said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Our Wood Doctor Gasification Converters are being redesigned to be more energy efficient and will be the industry leader!  We ship factory direct so contact us at www.WoodDoctorConverters.com for more info.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Or maybe the "industry leaker!"
Click to expand...


Eric - ROFL - perfect. :lol:  :lol: 

MLWD - welcome to the Boiler Room.  Nasty pic.  I hope you get resolution (perhaps restitution?) with the unit.  Cruise around here for a few hours and you'll never go back to an OWB again.


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## mike1234

through - from side to side, all the way through, viewing the holes through the other holes, so you can see the rust.
thru - not really a word, but used as in I'm going to drive thru the fast food place
threw - what you want to do with your owb.  I threw it over the cliff.
Just thought you'd like to know.


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## 603doug

I started up a wood doctor converter(old style) in Oct. and have been very pleased on performance. Burn alot of free pine along with hardwoods, no creosote issues or other problems and get 12 hr all the time no matter how chilly. My problems are the learning curve but slowly I learn what size pieces for what temp demand. Using it on 2 buildings with radiant floors plus dhw and hot tub and so far so good. Have had no warranty issues but asked wood doc before I purchased it what if and "assured" me they stand behind their product, guess should asked how far. Talked to a couple of locals who have wd and they were very happy.


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## rowerwet

from another thread I read that the wood doctor gassifier works ok but they have problems with the welds, the person who said this had a drawing of the insides of the stove, lots of welds and corners, and the smoke path in the back is very hard to clean. (just what I read)


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## 603doug

I weld every day and looking at the welds on my stove they look well done but that is on the outside, time will tell. As far as cleaning there are clean out doors that you use a long handle shovel to clean out the powdered ash, not really an issue. Takes about 5 mins. to do the whole stove once aweek


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## greeninsulation

Eric as moderator was disappointed in your reply  "the industy leaker"  .  First of all the person who wrote and took the pictures was a disgruntled customer trying to claim it was a Wood Doctor.   Anyone in the INDUSTRY knows Wood Doctors are not Green in color on the Exterior so it must be a Global Hydronic unit and not a Wood Doctor..  I do understand the customers obvious being upset but we must have all the facts before blame is being thrown around.  I really find the forum informative for the most part and hope it will not become anything but that.


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## Eric Johnson

Well, I was torn between making a small joke at your expense or calling you out for posting a blatant sales pitch in what's supposed to be a neutral forum and website. Please. Everybody thinks their product is the greatest thing on the market, destined to to become "the industry leader." If you want to promote your product here, you can advertise like everyone else, or at least start a thread containing some useful information that the rest of us can digest and debate. How about some photos and a schematic, along with a simple description of how it works and an invitation for comment?

Announcing that you sell direct and posting a link to your website in the same post is unacceptable, in other words.


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## myleakywooddoctor

OK, thought I would show all how I am managing to keep the water in my Wood Doctor.  Not sure if I mentioned yet, but besides perforations along the weld lines I also have some welding that has given way as there is water seeping out from right under the weld bead!  This is happening along the top and bottom of my furnace door. >:-( 

So I wanted to put some pictures up showing how I use this five-minute high temperature Epoxy putty to seal off the leaks.  I spent another 3 hours this weekend stripping off the panels and insulation to get at the leaks!  This is the third time this winter so far! :red: 

I have numbered these pics 1 threw 9 and I hope you will fine them very informative!

Please refer to the next few posts for the rest of the pictures.

FYI,

Leaky ;-)


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## myleakywooddoctor

Ok, next pictures.

Leaky :roll:


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## myleakywooddoctor

And, the last four pics,

Leaky :down:


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## myleakywooddoctor

Ha!  :lol: 

I see someone thinks my furnace is actually not a Wood Doctor!

Well my first Stainless Steel Wood Doctor was the right color and had the Wood Doctor logo all over it, but this furnace was replace under warranty at no cost to me cause it developed perforation through it's belly in only it's second heating season!  :red: 

Funny thing is, when Wood Doctor delivered my replacement furnace, it was all green with Global Hydronics logos all over it!  I just figured Wood Doctor was to busy to bother repackaging it with their Wood Doctor colors and logos before they delivered it!  :-/ 

So, where does that leave me now that this replacement they brought me has corroded through along it's weld lines right in the middle of only it's third heating season?  :sick: 

Well, Wood Doctor sold my original furnace to me and I have still have my original Wood Doctor Warranty for all the good it's doing me!   

FYI,

Leaky  :down:


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## myleakywooddoctor

OK . . . I searched and searched and this is the only picture I could find showing something of my original Wood Doctor furnace!

At least it shows it had light grey panels, which should satisfy some people, I hope! My relatives are busy searching their photos around my property to see it they can find me something better. Who knew, I would find myself trying to prove I actually did originally buy a boldly logo-ed Wood Doctor furnace!

I took this picture while I was attempting to plug the holes perforating the belly of this first (original) furnace. It's not much fun trying to keep the water inside these Wood Doctor furnaces once they have started leaking all over the place. 

I may as well throw in some pictures of those simple pine plugs that got me threw only my second heating season with this first furnace!

Leaky :roll:


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## Birdman

Not to change the subject... but I saw on this thread.. a guy named George in Ct?. George... I was much like you. I started last year investigating a chnage in the way i heated my house. I was first drawn to the OWB. I checked em all out.. I was ready to get a CB but then i stumbled upon this site. I read on this site for easily 40 hours. After... i decided the OWB was not the way to go. I was a little scared at first about this " woodgas " thing and the " gasifier" stuff. But I am one of those kinds of people who if i am going to invest my money... I am going to know everyting about the product i am going to buy. ANyways... I learned a ton about the Tarm on this site. I got over my fear of buying it.. (the biggest fear was I had never seen one.. and i don't know anyone who has one). I called Tarm( great business ... can't say enough good about them) . I went to there business in Lyme NH. I asked every question i could. I finally asked myself this question. " If tons of eurpean people have used this idea for decades... isn't it a tried and true thing? " I mean.... its really not a huge complicated thing... and it is way more efficient than the american idea of OWB. And way more tried and true... and warrantied. It became an easy decision. So... I bought one. Tarm Plus 40. Had good plumber install it. BEST decision i have ever made. I have used 4 cord of maple and 1 cord of pine this eason to heat a 2000 sq ft drafty log cabin with big cathedral cieling area... and all hot water.. .for 5! ... I have used about 30 gallons of fuel. house at 65-70 all year. It is in basement. I fill it up shile in my skivies! no OWB for me! Best decision. Saving about 2000 dollars a year in oil. Total cost?... it will pay for itself in 5 years. Hope this helps


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## rowerwet

myleakywooddoctor said:
			
		

> Ha!  :lol:
> 
> I see someone thinks my furnace is actually not a Wood Doctor!
> 
> Well my first Stainless Steel Wood Doctor was the right color and had the Wood Doctor logo all over it, but this furnace was replace under warranty at no cost to me cause it developed perforation through it's belly in only it's second heating season!  :red:
> 
> Funny thing is, when Wood Doctor delivered my replacement furnace, it was all green with Global Hydronics logos all over it!  I just figured Wood Doctor was to busy to bother repackaging it with their Wood Doctor colors and logos before they delivered it!  :-/
> 
> So, where does that leave me now that this replacement they brought me has corroded through along it's weld lines right in the middle of only it's third heating season?  :sick:
> 
> Well, Wood Doctor sold my original furnace to me and I have still have my original Wood Doctor Warranty for all the good it's doing me!
> 
> FYI,
> 
> Leaky  :down:


there is a wood doctor dealer near me, last time I went by he had three stoves that were all black and didn't have the wood doctor logo on them, it may have been the global hydronics logo.


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## myleakywooddoctor

*Welding that Leaky Wood doctor of mine!*

Hey Folks,

I haven't been on this site for a while now cause I received news that Wood Doctor decided to fix my boiler leaks after all.  
I must say that perhaps there may have been some initial confusion on Wood Doctor's part as to what I was expecting them to do for me. When I finally made it clear that I was not prepared to pay out any additional cash for a replacement furnace, Wood Doctor ceased their efforts on this tact and sent me a welder.

So, all seems water tight again an good to go for another heating season.  Of course, I volunteered my time to strip down and put everything back together again, not wanting the welder they sent me to be distracted by anything that wasn't strictly welding and all in all I am quiet pleased with the result.  

I must also state that *Wood Doctor has graciously instructed me to call this welder directly should any further leaks develop!*

Leaky   :cheese:

I can seem to control the order of the pics, so . . .

1) Temp Patching
2) Perferations
3) Welder
4) Back Plate
5) Belly Plate


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## deerefanatic

Was that welder using a stick welder? I hope so..... The welds look kinda rough.... If they were done with a MIG welder I'd be wondering on that guys abilities.... 

But hey, if it holds water, that's good enough!


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## heaterman

I hope for our sake that the problem that caused all the corrosion has been identified and corrected. With all those spots showing up something is definitely amiss with your boiler and/or system.


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## sgschwend

I second that point.  If you don't find and fix your problem it will come back even faster this time.

You issue is that this stove is not compatible with you system which include the water, piping and everything else.


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