# Which Pellet Stove? Harman Vs Quadrafire Vs Ecoteck



## CrowBean

Hi guys. I am a newbie and obviously thinking of buying a pellet stove.  Overview, I own a brand new Raised Ranch 2200sq ft, well insulated, finished basement in Cumberland Rhode Island. basement room is 28x20 with an opening up the stairs to the top floor. I am trying to figure out two options:

1. put a pellet stove approximately 2200 sq ft in the basement and let the heat come upstairs
        -the problem is it would be really warm downstairs and we do the majority of our living upstairs in a wide open floor plan
        -plus a little electric heater can take care of that no problem

2.put a pellet stove upstairs in the far corner so it heats the upstairs approx 1200 sq foot.
        - am also thinking of this as a 20 yr investment so if i expand (when i have children) i might need at least 1500 sq foot

So i am already looking for advice on the two above options plus im having a hard time deciding on brands. I have looked at the ecoteck monica 1500 sq ft for 3600 dollars msrp, harman accentra for a similar price, harman xxv, harman p68, quadrafire classic bay, etc.  i am trying to chose a model that will last the longest and be most efficient.  Ecoteck has some cool features and has a very pretty flame (for the girlfriend).

Thank you everyone for the advice in advance


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## jtakeman

There are many of us here that can say "heating from the basement is doable". But it will take some work to move the air. If your going with a stove, Go big!

Lots of pellet furnaces out there. The absolute sure way to heat the whole shack! Be it boiler or forced air. More money up front, But far less aggravation's in the long run.


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## CrowBean

Thank you Jakeman for the response. i actually just dealt with a Wittus Dealer and he might have me sold.  Similar to ecoteck but more btus for the buck. There is an EcoStar 35k btu, the dealer says the european ratings are probably a 10k btu difference (so should be 45k btu according to that measure). They also have ventable systems for alittle more money into my forced hot air system. any thoughts on this product?


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## DexterDay

Buy from a good dealer and get something "YOU" like... Everyone may be a little bias. I like Quadrafire's.. I own a Classic Bay. But after 3 years, I am ready to get a more "Adjustable" stove (Draft, Agitator, on/off-Hi/Low feature).. I learned what I needed to know out of my very 1st pellet stove and I am completely impressed with it. BUT... I am the type that is never satisfied.. I can Always go bigger or better... But I do like to learn too. Quad's are VERY easy to run... If you have zero experience. It does not get any easier. Harman's are very easy too. The Ecoteck line makes a heck of a stove, but with little experience, there may be a big learning curve. 

I am not steering you away from the Ecoteck, I wish I would have bought a stove that could be tinkered with more. So it depends on your personality. Do you like to "Set it and forget it"? OR "Mess with it, and Tinker"?... I like to tinker and fine tune..... Everyone has a different perspective... You need your own... Listen to what you want to do.. What do you like to LOOK at. It will be in your home for awhile..

Good luck and keep us updated... By the Way... The Enviro line of Stoves (j-takeman has one) is a VERY good model.. The Omega (if you can find one/dis-continued), Maxx-M, and the M55 (cast or steel) are all nice stoves.. I would take a look at them. If you have a dealer in the area.

Last but not least.. Like Jay said.. Heating from the basement.. Go BIG on BTU's.. Big BTU's (At least 50,000) and move the air.. Hard to do (Very) but can be done... Need all the logistic's right... If you were closer I would offer you my Fahrenheit, for a Song and a dance".... Graet stove, but got a Better deal on a Killer wood-stove. With Wood all around, It makes it much cheaper.


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## smwilliamson

I sell the Ecoteck line and have the Francesca in my kitchen. Great stove. It is the same as the Monica just has metal side instead of the Majolica. Very peppy little stove, more heat than the Harman for a stove the same size. I little less efficient. The Accentra is easier to clean and it hold more pellets. The Ecoteck doesn't hold a full bag, only 35 lbs.

Of all of the Ecotecks, the Veronica is the stove I like best. That's a 70,000 btu stove with air handling. It's really my favorite in the line but a bit too expensive. Wittus has some good stoves. Are you looking at the MCZ's? They are simular and work a bit better with the remote and thermostat etc...

I'm not a big fan of the Harman Accentra free standing or the Advance, though I think the XXV may be one of the best stoves ever made.

What Quad are you considering? I'm not a real big fan of the newer Quads, though for the money I think the Santa Fe is a great value in  small stove and may be one of the best stoves on the market for user tolerance when it comes to day in and day out operation....and it takes about 1/2 to perform a full service, another great feature and you can toss Harman into that category too.

Ecoteck, MCZ, EcoStar....much more complicated than you want to deal with if you are going to be doing the maintenance yourself. And you need a full set of metric tools!


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## Cincinnati Kid

I would suggest putting the stove where you spend most of your time (upstairs on the first floor).  You can also purchase an additional stove for the basement.

I have a small P-38 Harman in my basement and the Harman Accentra insert on my first floor.  This scenario works very well.


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## rona

I have been burning pellets or corn for 7 years and started out trying to heat both finished basement and main floor of a ranch home like you are planning. I started with a Harman PC45 in the basement but it wasn't enough heat. The following year I bought one of the first Mt Vernam AE's which was over 60,000 btus. That didn't work either because the basement was way to hot and main floor was still uncomfortable.
  The next step was the idea of buying two stoves and install one downstairs and one upstairs.  At the time I could buy a new Bixby stove for 1700.00 but no warranty on E-Bay. I bought two figuring if something went wrong I could switch parts and keep one running. 
  The idea worked real well and we found out that with most of our time being spent upstairs we don't turn the basement stove on unless the temp gets in the minus 20 range.
  In my situation timing was the key as I was able to sell both my Harman and the AE for what I had in them because there was a shortage of the stoves and the dealers had "jacked up" their new stove prices even more thus making a used stove worth more.


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## smwilliamson

It is best when using a zone heating application that you instal the heater in the area where you actually want the heat most. I have plenty of customers that heat a raised ranch with a stove int he cellar/ finished area of the house and the heat makes its way throughout the house...but in most cases, the downstairs room is used as a primary hang-out. Get your stove upstairs if you live upstairs the most.


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## Vinelife

Quad classic bay is very nice indeed..


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## CrowBean

DexterDay said:
			
		

> Buy from a good dealer and get something "YOU" like... Everyone may be a little bias. I like Quadrafire's.. I own a Classic Bay. But after 3 years, I am ready to get a more "Adjustable" stove (Draft, Agitator, on/off-Hi/Low feature).. I learned what I needed to know out of my very 1st pellet stove and I am completely impressed with it. BUT... I am the type that is never satisfied.. I can Always go bigger or better... But I do like to learn too. Quad's are VERY easy to run... If you have zero experience. It does not get any easier. Harman's are very easy too. The Ecoteck line makes a heck of a stove, but with little experience, there may be a big learning curve.
> 
> I am not steering you away from the Ecoteck, I wish I would have bought a stove that could be tinkered with more. So it depends on your personality. Do you like to "Set it and forget it"? OR "Mess with it, and Tinker"?... I like to tinker and fine tune..... Everyone has a different perspective... You need your own... Listen to what you want to do.. What do you like to LOOK at. It will be in your home for awhile..
> 
> Good luck and keep us updated... By the Way... The Enviro line of Stoves (j-takeman has one) is a VERY good model.. The Omega (if you can find one/dis-continued), Maxx-M, and the M55 (cast or steel) are all nice stoves.. I would take a look at them. If you have a dealer in the area.
> 
> Last but not least.. Like Jay said.. Heating from the basement.. Go BIG on BTU's.. Big BTU's (At least 50,000) and move the air.. Hard to do (Very) but can be done... Need all the logistic's right... If you were closer I would offer you my Fahrenheit, for a Song and a dance".... Graet stove, but got a Better deal on a Killer wood-stove. With Wood all around, It makes it much cheaper.



Thank you for your reply. I am definitely a tinkering type of person. I think through all the posts that i am definitely gonna do the stove upstairs for now and when i go downstairs i can throw another stove in the future or a nice electric fireplace. How hard is it to clean a ecostar by wittus or francesa by ecoteck vs a harman accentra or xxv? also there are not alot of reviews on all these stoves. i research for hours to make the right decision.  Does anyone have any experience with hearth and patio in warwick for a dealer??? they are offering 0 percent for 1 year right now [plus a free vac and cleaning after one year. oh and the guy is giving me a free hearth pad.

Thank you everyone for your posts. they have all been outstanding.  so the bottom line is i need to hear upstairs which has the open floor plan with approximately 1200 sq ft. WHATS the best stove in everyone's opinion for that scenario? i have quadrafire, ecoteck, harman, wittus dealers around me. plus i think those are the best rated.

Thank you in advance


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## Countryboymo

Any of the above will serve you well.  I wouldn't forget the Englander stoves.  They have the best customer service around either by calling them or dropping the issue in here.  Mike from Englander frequents this site and is very helpful.  

I have a Quad Castile and wish it wasn't as picky on pellets as it is.  If I purchased tomorrow it would be a battle between Englander and Harman.


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## DexterDay

CrowBean said:
			
		

> DexterDay said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Buy from a good dealer and get something "YOU" like... Everyone may be a little bias. I like Quadrafire.. I own a Classic Bay. But after 3 years, I am ready to get a more "Adjustable" stove (Draft, Agitator, on/off-Hi/Low feature).. I learned what I needed to know out of my very 1st pellet stove and I am completely impressed with it. BUT... I am the type that is never satisfied.. I can Always go bigger or better... But I do like to learn too. Quad's are VERY easy to run... If you have zero experience. It does not get any easier. Harman's are very easy too. The Ecoteck line makes a heck of a stove, but with little experience, there may be a big learning curve.
> 
> I am not steering you away from the Ecoteck, I wish I would have bought a stove that could be tinkered with more. So it depends on your personality. Do you like to "Set it and forget it"? OR "Mess with it, and Tinker"?... I like to tinker and fine tune..... Everyone has a different perspective... You need your own... Listen to what you want to do.. What do you like to LOOK at. It will be in your home for awhile..
> 
> Good luck and keep us updated... By the Way... The Enviro line of Stoves (j-takeman has one) is a VERY good model.. The Omega (if you can find one/dis-continued), Maxx-M, and the M55 (cast or steel) are all nice stoves.. I would take a look at them. If you have a dealer in the area.
> 
> Last but not least.. Like Jay said.. Heating from the basement.. Go BIG on BTU's.. Big BTU's (At least 50,000) and move the air.. Hard to do (Very) but can be done... Need all the logistic's right... If you were closer I would offer you my Fahrenheit, for a Song and a dance".... Graet stove, but got a Better deal on a Killer wood-stove. With Wood all around, It makes it much cheaper.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Thank you for your reply. I am definitely a tinkering type of person. I think through all the posts that i am definitely gonna do the stove upstairs for now and when i go downstairs i can throw another stove in the future or a nice electric fireplace. How hard is it to clean a ecostar by wittus or francesa by ecoteck vs a harman accentra or xxv? also there are not alot of reviews on all these stoves. i research for hours to make the right decision. Does anyone have any experience with hearth and patio in warwick for a dealer??? they are offering 0 percent for 1 year right now [plus a free vac and cleaning after one year. oh and the guy is giving me a free hearth pad.
> 
> Thank you everyone for your posts. they have all been outstanding. so the bottom line is i need to hear upstairs which has the open floor plan with approximately 1200 sq ft. WHATS the best stove in everyone's opinion for that scenario? i have quadrafire, ecoteck, harman, wittus dealers around me. plus i think those are the best rated.
> 
> Thank you in advance
Click to expand...


If heating from your upstairs. You wont need as many BTU's, as heating from downstairs... .. Go with a 30,000-50,000 BTU unit... Many are Bias on here.. If you want the "Easiest" stove to operate, that will function on a thermostat. Then go with a Quadrafire. Harman's have a "Built In" Thermostat in there system.. Its all in what you want and how the dealer treats you.. I still love my CB 1200 But...In the 3 yrs of operating it, I have learned a lot and want a stove that has more adjust-ability. The Quad heats my 2,200 sq ft Ranch on its Lowest setting (Unless its below 0 outside). So I could not be happier with it. 

Buy what you want.. Ecoteck makes a GREAT stove as does Harman..

Good luck and cheers.. Hppy 4th.


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## CrowBean

Thank you for your reply dexterday.

Also thanks for the information on the new englander stove. I believe the new englander is sold at our local lowes for like 1k (1500 sq ft model). Is it better to grab a new englander at that price vs a harman/quad/wittus at 3k? obviously the payback would be much quicker but i am also waying the aesthetics portion as well. i have a transitional/contemporary look inside my house and just want to match that up as well.  Can you hook the new englander to a programmable thermostat?


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## DexterDay

CrowBean said:
			
		

> Thank you for your reply dexterday.
> 
> Also thanks for the information on the new englander stove. I believe the new englander is sold at our local lowes for like 1k (1500 sq ft model). Is it better to grab a new englander at that price vs a harman/quad/wittus at 3k? obviously the payback would be much quicker but i am also waying the aesthetics portion as well. i have a transitional/contemporary look inside my house and just want to match that up as well. Can you hook the new englander to a programmable thermostat?



Yes... An Englander can be hooked to a Thermostat. There are 2 "New" Models of Englander now. The old design used a double auger system and was a Bottom Feed System (kinda like a Harman). But these 2 new ones incoperate a top feed system like most stoves. Where the pellets are feed up a chute and dropped down into the firepot.

Here is the Englander 10-CPM Nice Multi-Fuel Stove http://www.englanderstoves.com/10-cpm.html

Here is the New 25-Evolution Pellet Looks like a Quad CB 1200 http://www.englanderstoves.com/25-ep_i.html

These new stoves they made, kept people from being stuck with just a "Black Box". The Black boxes work well. I have an old beast myself. But for people with a certain look in there home. These 2 new stoves will fit the bill. There is a Forum member who is installing the new 25-EP into his home. Here is that Thread https://www.hearth.com/econtent/index.php/forums/viewthread/76121/

Like Countryboymo said, Englander Customer Service is 2nd to none.. I am currently looking into buying the Multi-Fuel 10-CPM.. Hope some of this helps..


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## FyreBug

The models you mention are all decent especially the Harman. Based on your comments you are looking for a pellet appliance that 1) looks nice 2) Can distribute the heat throughout the house 3) some serious BTU.

The Enerzone Euromax may fit the bill... http://enerzone-intl.com/product.aspx?CategoId=5&Id=549

Its 70,000 BTU, it's a bottom feeder similar to Harman and the nice thing with this unit is there is a kit for a small distribution system where you can duct your heat around your house. It retails for about $3,800


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## CrowBean

DexterDay said:
			
		

> CrowBean said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Thank you for your reply dexterday.
> 
> Also thanks for the information on the new englander stove. I believe the new englander is sold at our local lowes for like 1k (1500 sq ft model). Is it better to grab a new englander at that price vs a harman/quad/wittus at 3k? obviously the payback would be much quicker but i am also waying the aesthetics portion as well. i have a transitional/contemporary look inside my house and just want to match that up as well. Can you hook the new englander to a programmable thermostat?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Yes... An Englander can be hooked to a Thermostat. There are 2 "New" Models of Englander now. The old design used a double auger system and was a Bottom Feed System (kinda like a Harman). But these 2 new ones incoperate a top feed system like most stoves. Where the pellets are feed up a chute and dropped down into the firepot.
> 
> Here is the Englander 10-CPM Nice Multi-Fuel Stove http://www.englanderstoves.com/10-cpm.html
> 
> Here is the New 25-Evolution Pellet Looks like a Quad CB 1200 http://www.englanderstoves.com/25-ep_i.html
> 
> These new stoves they made, kept people from being stuck with just a "Black Box". The Black boxes work well. I have an old beast myself. But for people with a certain look in there home. These 2 new stoves will fit the bill. There is a Forum member who is installing the new 25-EP into his home. Here is that Thread https://www.hearth.com/econtent/index.php/forums/viewthread/76121/
> 
> Like Countryboymo said, Englander Customer Service is 2nd to none.. I am currently looking into buying the Multi-Fuel 10-CPM.. Hope some of this helps..
Click to expand...



Thank you I am gonna look into those models.


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## CrowBean

FyreBug said:
			
		

> The models you mention are all decent especially the Harman. Based on your comments you are looking for a pellet appliance that 1) looks nice 2) Can distribute the heat throughout the house 3) some serious BTU.
> 
> The Enerzone Euromax may fit the bill... http://enerzone-intl.com/product.aspx?CategoId=5&Id=549
> 
> Its 70,000 BTU, it's a bottom feeder similar to Harman and the nice thing with this unit is there is a kit for a small distribution system (about $150) where you can duct your heat around your house. It retails for about $3,800




That was a nice looking stove.  It was only 77% efficient though. The wittus is 91% efficient.


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## FyreBug

CrowBean said:
			
		

> FyreBug said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The models you mention are all decent especially the Harman. Based on your comments you are looking for a pellet appliance that 1) looks nice 2) Can distribute the heat throughout the house 3) some serious BTU.
> 
> The Enerzone Euromax may fit the bill... http://enerzone-intl.com/product.aspx?CategoId=5&Id=549
> 
> Its 70,000 BTU, it's a bottom feeder similar to Harman and the nice thing with this unit is there is a kit for a small distribution system (about $150) where you can duct your heat around your house. It retails for about $3,800
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> That was a nice looking stove.  It was only 77% efficient though. The wittus is 91% efficient.
Click to expand...


This is where I really hate to do this kind of posting.... Burn time, coverage, cu ft and many other specs have to be taken with a grain of salt... It would be fantastic if the 'baseline' was really hard coded so everyone is talking about the same thing but, unfortunately that is not always the case.

I'll try to explain. North American Manufacturers for the most part have to follow the EPA protocol to establish efficiencies. It takes into consideration Fuel/air ratio. NA standards also requires a minimal flue temp in order to avoid condensation (creosote). In Europe, standards to determine efficiencies follow a different protocol. In Europe it is possible to buy a pellet appliance which is almost 100% efficient, they also have condensation recuperators and are typically more expensive. There's also other efficiency measurement you can state (LHV vs HHV) but you get the point...

 A BTU is a BTU not sure what your dealer is saying regarding European BTU. The BTU stated by all manufacturers are 'input' BTU. If the unit is truly 91% efficient (NA Protocol) (to confuse you further this is an average based on the different burn rates) your output will be around 31,850 (35,000 X .91). The Enerzone will be around 55,000. 

The bottom line will be your bottom line... What you can afford & what will serve your needs and which unit will give you years of service with minimal maintenance.

Edit: I checked Wittus web site and spoke to some dealers. What I said about European appliances above is not likely to apply to Wittus. They are made in the US and their efficiencies are likely what they are... excellent!


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## DexterDay

FyreBug said:
			
		

> The models you mention are all decent especially the Harman. Based on your comments you are looking for a pellet appliance that 1) looks nice 2) Can distribute the heat throughout the house 3) some serious BTU.
> 
> The Enerzone Euromax may fit the bill... http://enerzone-intl.com/product.aspx?CategoId=5&Id=549
> 
> Its 70,000 BTU, it's a bottom feeder similar to Harman and the nice thing with this unit is there is a kit for a small distribution system (about $150) where you can duct your heat around your house. It retails for about $3,800



I just read the entire owners manual. I never seen anything on-line or in the manual about a kit turning it into a "Furnace"?? Interested, becuase I too am looking to get another stove, and we have an Enerzone dealer really close....Where do you get this kit??


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## FyreBug

DexterDay said:
			
		

> FyreBug said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The models you mention are all decent especially the Harman. Based on your comments you are looking for a pellet appliance that 1) looks nice 2) Can distribute the heat throughout the house 3) some serious BTU.
> 
> The Enerzone Euromax may fit the bill... http://enerzone-intl.com/product.aspx?CategoId=5&Id=549
> 
> Its 70,000 BTU, it's a bottom feeder similar to Harman and the nice thing with this unit is there is a kit for a small distribution system (about $150) where you can duct your heat around your house. It retails for about $3,800
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I just read the entire owners manual. I never seen anything on-line or in the manual about a kit turning it into a "Furnace"?? Interested, becuase I too am looking to get another stove, and we have an Enerzone dealer really close....Where do you get this kit??
Click to expand...


You're right. It will be added to the web site shortly. Since the Euromax is not certified as a 'furnace add-on' you cannot connect this appliance to your existing duct work. However, this kit is perfect for houses who may not have existing duct work such as electrically heated homes, mobile & or trailer homes etc...

Basically, since the Blower is about 500 CFM the kit allow the unit to still send about 20% of its heat from the front and the rest is re-directed to the removable grille where the distribution kit is installed. You can then extend 2 duct up to 20 ft away to bring heat to registers. 

Shoot me a PM if you want and I'll send you the installation manual.

Hope this helps


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## DexterDay

FyreBug said:
			
		

> DexterDay said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> FyreBug said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The models you mention are all decent especially the Harman. Based on your comments you are looking for a pellet appliance that 1) looks nice 2) Can distribute the heat throughout the house 3) some serious BTU.
> 
> The Enerzone Euromax may fit the bill... http://enerzone-intl.com/product.aspx?CategoId=5&Id=549
> 
> Its 70,000 BTU, it's a bottom feeder similar to Harman and the nice thing with this unit is there is a kit for a small distribution system (about $150) where you can duct your heat around your house. It retails for about $3,800
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I just read the entire owners manual. I never seen anything on-line or in the manual about a kit turning it into a "Furnace"?? Interested, becuase I too am looking to get another stove, and we have an Enerzone dealer really close....Where do you get this kit??
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> You're right. It will be added to the web site shortly. Since the Euromax is not certified as a 'furnace add-on' you cannot connect this appliance to your existing duct work. However, this kit is perfect for houses who may not have existing duct work such as electrically heated homes, mobile & or trailer homes etc...
> 
> Basically, since the Blower is about 500 CFM the kit allow the unit to still send about 20% of its heat from the front and the rest is re-directed to the removable grille where the distribution kit is installed. You can then extend 2 duct up to 20 ft away to bring heat to registers.
> 
> Shoot me a PM if you want and I'll send you the installation manual.
> 
> Hope this helps
Click to expand...

Very Nice... That big blower would be enough to move some air too..

In the owners manual, it also said it had 2 auger motors??  Does it incorperate a system like Englander? Looks from the manual that they are one on top of the other? (Like Englander)?

Also says it has 3 blower motors.. Convection Blower, Comustion Blower and an Exhaust Blower??? An Exhaust Blower and a Combustion Blower? (One and the same)?? I dont know if I follow that one?? Page 38 Figure 31 in the owners manual.. 

Overall, It reminds me of a Maxx-M by Enviro. 70,000 BTU's, with a 465 CFM Blower (Big Blower), Only difference is the no agitator for the Enerzone. Although bottom feed Harmans can run for weeks without shutting down.. The burn pot looks to be almost the same..(Or as much as you can see from a picture), as a Harman (Not an Englander) with the upsweeping ramp and a widening pot at the top..


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## FyreBug

_[/quote]
Very Nice... That big blower would be enough to move some air too..

In the owners manual, it also said it had 2 auger motors??  Does it incorperate a system like Englander? Looks from the manual that they are one on top of the other? (Like Englander)?

Also says it has 3 blower motors.. Convection Blower, Comustion Blower and an Exhaust Blower??? An Exhaust Blower and a Combustion Blower? (One and the same)?? I dont know if I follow that one?? Page 38 Figure 31 in the owners manual.. 

Overall, It reminds me of a Maxx-M by Enviro. 70,000 BTU's, with a 465 CFM Blower (Big Blower), Only difference is the no agitator for the Enerzone. Although bottom feed Harmans can run for weeks without shutting down.. The burn pot looks to be almost the same..(Or as much as you can see from a picture), as a Harman (Not an Englander) with the upsweeping ramp and a widening pot at the top..[/quote]_

The 2 auger system works as follows: The top auger regulates the feed rate from the hopper and drops the pellets to the bottom auger. The bottom augurs always turns at the same speed. Not sure how Englander works. 

Yes it has 3 separate blowers. The convection is the big 500CFM. Since the combustion air has to be regulated separately than the exhaust it needs it's own blower. You might be thinking of a 'sealed' system (less expensive) in which the hopper, ash pan, door etc... must be tightly sealed since the system works with only one exhaust blower. I think Englander works that way. As soon as you open a door the whole system decompresses and you might lose combustion. With separate combustion/exhaust blower you can open the front door, hopper etc.. and it does not affect combustion. 

We dont need an agitator, much like the Harman the pellets burn, turn to ashes and fall down into the large ash pan below. You mention you have a dealer nearby, you may want to go visit him if he has one on his show room & play with it a little. The touchpad screen makes it really easy to set up. Let me know if you have other questions.


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## DexterDay

FyreBug said:
			
		

> The 2 auger system works as follows: The top auger regulates the feed rate from the hopper and drops the pellets to the bottom auger. The bottom augurs always turns at the same speed. Not sure how Englander works.
> 
> Yes it has 3 separate blowers. The convection is the big 500CFM. Since the combustion air has to be regulated separately than the exhaust it needs it's own blower. You might be thinking of a 'sealed' system (less expensive) in which the hopper, ash pan, door etc... must be tightly sealed since the system works with only one exhaust blower. I think Englander works that way. As soon as you open a door the whole system decompresses and you might lose combustion. With separate combustion/exhaust blower you can open the front door, hopper etc.. and it does not affect combustion.
> 
> We dont need an agitator, much like the Harman the pellets burn, turn to ashes and fall down into the large ash pan below. You mention you have a dealer nearby, you may want to go visit him if he has one on his show room & play with it a little. The touchpad screen makes it really easy to set up. Let me know if you have other questions.



Englander works the same way, Top turns intermittently and bottom is constant... 2 blowers for combustion is a Great idea, but with a "Pressurized" Burn chamber, the Glass must not have a "Standard" Air-Wash.. The way a normal air wash would work, would not fit this application.. Unless the Exhaust blower is still pulling "Just a Few More CFM's than the Blower set-up for combustion... I want to go look at one now.. Got me very intrigued.


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## briansol

I would also suggest putting it up stairs.
use a space heater/etc on the lower level that you use less.


Look for
- big hooper (can hold a full bag, some don't)
- settings/dials.  I hate my 1/2/3/4/5 option only.  Independent feed & fan dials would be a must for my next stove.
- ability to use a thermostat.  look for a cat-5 like plug on the control board
-


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## FyreBug

DexterDay said:
			
		

> FyreBug said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The 2 auger system works as follows: The top auger regulates the feed rate from the hopper and drops the pellets to the bottom auger. The bottom augurs always turns at the same speed. Not sure how Englander works.
> 
> Yes it has 3 separate blowers. The convection is the big 500CFM. Since the combustion air has to be regulated separately than the exhaust it needs it's own blower. You might be thinking of a 'sealed' system (less expensive) in which the hopper, ash pan, door etc... must be tightly sealed since the system works with only one exhaust blower. I think Englander works that way. As soon as you open a door the whole system decompresses and you might lose combustion. With separate combustion/exhaust blower you can open the front door, hopper etc.. and it does not affect combustion.
> 
> We dont need an agitator, much like the Harman the pellets burn, turn to ashes and fall down into the large ash pan below. You mention you have a dealer nearby, you may want to go visit him if he has one on his show room & play with it a little. The touchpad screen makes it really easy to set up. Let me know if you have other questions.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Englander works the same way, Top turns intermittently and bottom is constant... 2 blowers for combustion is a Great idea, but with a "Pressurized" Burn chamber, the Glass must not have a "Standard" Air-Wash.. The way a normal air wash would work, would not fit this application.. Unless the Exhaust blower is still pulling "Just a Few More CFM's than the Blower set-up for combustion... I want to go look at one now.. Got me very intrigued.
Click to expand...


Air wash on any pellet stove is a tricky proposition as it affects your efficiencies if not done correctly. The Enerzone Airwash is very good for a 70K BTU. And good call!You are right, the exhaust blower is pulling more than the combustion blower is 'pushing'.


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## DexterDay

FyreBug said:
			
		

> DexterDay said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> FyreBug said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The 2 auger system works as follows: The top auger regulates the feed rate from the hopper and drops the pellets to the bottom auger. The bottom augurs always turns at the same speed. Not sure how Englander works.
> 
> Yes it has 3 separate blowers. The convection is the big 500CFM. Since the combustion air has to be regulated separately than the exhaust it needs it's own blower. You might be thinking of a 'sealed' system (less expensive) in which the hopper, ash pan, door etc... must be tightly sealed since the system works with only one exhaust blower. I think Englander works that way. As soon as you open a door the whole system decompresses and you might lose combustion. With separate combustion/exhaust blower you can open the front door, hopper etc.. and it does not affect combustion.
> 
> We dont need an agitator, much like the Harman the pellets burn, turn to ashes and fall down into the large ash pan below. You mention you have a dealer nearby, you may want to go visit him if he has one on his show room & play with it a little. The touchpad screen makes it really easy to set up. Let me know if you have other questions.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Englander works the same way, Top turns intermittently and bottom is constant... 2 blowers for combustion is a Great idea, but with a "Pressurized" Burn chamber, the Glass must not have a "Standard" Air-Wash.. The way a normal air wash would work, would not fit this application.. Unless the Exhaust blower is still pulling "Just a Few More CFM's than the Blower set-up for combustion... I want to go look at one now.. Got me very intrigued.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Air wash on any pellet stove is a tricky proposition as it affects your efficiencies if not done correctly. The Enerzone Airwash is very good for a 70K BTU. And good call!You are right, the exhaust blower is pulling more than the combustion blower is 'pushing'.
Click to expand...


I figured for an air-wash to work properly. It would have to... Thats just physics. Unless it was some kind of new system.. Everyday, new technology comes out.. Got to keep up with the times.. (Disclosure- Or try to anyways) LOL... Thanks again....  and thanks for the PM


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## smwilliamson

FyreBug said:
			
		

> The models you mention are all decent especially the Harman. Based on your comments you are looking for a pellet appliance that 1) looks nice 2) Can distribute the heat throughout the house 3) some serious BTU.
> 
> The Enerzone Euromax may fit the bill... http://enerzone-intl.com/product.aspx?CategoId=5&Id=549
> 
> Its 70,000 BTU, it's a bottom feeder similar to Harman and the nice thing with this unit is there is a kit for a small distribution system where you can duct your heat around your house. It retails for about $3,800



Fyrebug...you work for SBI. If you are going to push their product on the boards you need to identify yourself publicly. I am not a mod and cannot do anything about it...just a heads up. We need more manufacturer participation and perhaps you would have more to offer by being their spokesperson on the boards, like Mike Holton from Englander...but do not run around in incognito. ;-P


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## FyreBug

smwilliamson said:
			
		

> FyreBug said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The models you mention are all decent especially the Harman. Based on your comments you are looking for a pellet appliance that 1) looks nice 2) Can distribute the heat throughout the house 3) some serious BTU.
> 
> The Enerzone Euromax may fit the bill... http://enerzone-intl.com/product.aspx?CategoId=5&Id=549
> 
> Its 70,000 BTU, it's a bottom feeder similar to Harman and the nice thing with this unit is there is a kit for a small distribution system where you can duct your heat around your house. It retails for about $3,800
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Fyrebug...you work for SBI. If you are going to push their product on the boards you need to identify yourself publicly. I am not a mod and cannot do anything about it...just a heads up. We need more manufacturer participation and perhaps you would have more to offer by being their spokesperson on the boards, like Mike Holton from Englander...but do not run around in incognito. ;-P
Click to expand...


Thanks for the heads up. I've been slapped on the knuckles before... Most posts I identify myself as who I work for and my profile clearly indicates who I am. I try very hard not to blatantly advertise. If you check my posts, I also try to be balanced since I firmly believe most manufacturers make excellent products (as you well know) and as I commented.

In this instance, I provided generic advice as well as providing an alternative since the customer was specifically asking for choices. This is an additional choice, no more no less. If additional disclosure is required every time I post regarding our products I will gladly do so. However, I have read the rules regarding this and I did not think this fitted in the blatant advertising category. But again thanks for pointing it out...


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## rona

One last suggestion is talk to a person who owns one that you are interested in and find out what they like or dislike about that model. 
  When you are a first time buyer you should list your needs and what you expect the stove to do for you. Sometimes we get so caught up on certain advantages of one stove versus another that we miss a disadvantage that may be a real problem. 
 You can buy a beautiful stove that can be programmed to run itself and it looks like a ideal choice but once you get it home you find out it has a very small hopper and you have to fill it several times a day. Maybe that doesn't bother someone who is home all day but for a couple who is gone all day it would make a bad choice.
 Another point is how much noise does it make?  Usually the more air being moved the louder it is. Of course we all get used to a new noise but if you can't hear the TV or visit it will be annoying. 
 You will also be advised to pick a dealer that is close to you because he will be able to make service calls. This brings up another can of worms.  If you are willing to tinker and do maintenance work in the house you will do fine but if you don't like to get your hands dirty or can't read the manual then don't buy it.
  The best scenario would be if you had a friend that has a stove like you are interested in as you could talk to him and see what he likes and dislikes about it. 
  There is lots of different brands of stoves and some use generic parts while others have special motors that will be costly to replace. 
  One last bit of advice would be to stay away from a new model for a couple years until the bugs are worked out.


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## CrowBean

Thank you rona. Most people here are making me look into the Englanders alittle more. Im on vacation in cancun for 2 weeks but when i return i want to make a decision. thank you all for your help and i will update.


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## FyreBug

CrowBean said:
			
		

> Thank you rona. Most people here are making me look into the Englanders alittle more. Im on vacation in cancun for 2 weeks but when i return i want to make a decision. thank you all for your help and i will update.



You may want to ask smwilliamson's advice since he's fixed just about every brand out there. So he would know the ins & outs of many of the ones you are considering. 

All the best!


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## titikiki

Stay away from Quadafire brand - poor customer service once you buy the unit.  The company basically refers you back to the dealer.  Easy to use but once off warranty expensive repairs.  If could redo would go with the Englander.


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## DexterDay

Cold in NY said:
			
		

> Stay away from Quadafire brand - poor customer service once you buy the unit.  The company basically refers you back to the dealer.  Easy to use but once off warranty expensive repairs.  If could redo would go with the Englander.



Any stove out of warranty will be expensive to fix. Going into the Pellet stove market. One must assume that a $2,000-$4,000 will need to be worked on. Any and all mechanical parts will fail. Being mechanical. They cannot last forever.  I am a handy person and would rather fix my own problems anyways. 

For Example.  You will spend about $100 on a Combustion blower for any model.  (Just a reference part, because all stoves use the same parts, they may differ in design. But the overall function and price is the same.) As per warranty, my Chainsaws are the same way. I have to take them to the dealer I bought them at. Not just any Husqvarna dealer. 

The OP already stated that the part replacement cost for the Ego was very similar to the Harman XXV. 

Just my 2 cents............


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## rona

Cold in NY said:
			
		

> Stay away from Quadafire brand - poor customer service once you buy the unit.  The company basically refers you back to the dealer.  Easy to use but once off warranty expensive repairs.  If could redo would go with the Englander.


   You can say that with many name brands.  Some force you to go through your dealer for parts. The factory won't sell parts direct to the consumers.  That should be a important consideration when choosing a brand to buy.  
  There are other sources that sell fans, igniters etc that will fit as replacement parts and are more reasonable priced for many stoves. Some stoves have weak points such as igniters and once the warranty goes off they are still weak points and you will be stuck paying for them.
  Actually this brings up a good point in that when people find a good reasonable source for replacement parts they should post where they buy these parts so other people can save some money. Think of it this way. A factory buys its ignitors from someplace and sells them as a profit to a dealer who in turn sells them to a customer at another markup.  It  is easy to save 40% for a lot of items if you can find the source.


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## summit

can't go wrong w/ a P68 for whole house heating. especially from a basement


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## tonyd

Im not sure which is better but I have owned the Quad Castile and now own an Accentra. Much happier with the Harmon.


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## BurnBabyBurn

What kind of thermostat do these stove come with is it programmable or manual thermostat? If its manual would it be possible to upgrade to a programmable thermostat. My wife and I leave at very different time of the day and neither of like to get up to a cold house. We would really like a programmable thermostat they will keep us both warm.


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## CrowBean

Hi guys. Just to let everyone know I decided on a wittus ego which should be installed anytime now


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## simplicityfarmgirl

DexterDay said:
			
		

> Last but not least.. Like Jay said.. Heating from the basement.. Go BIG on BTU's.. Big BTU's (At least 50,000) and move the air.. Hard to do (Very) but can be done... Need all the logistic's right....


So how do I move the air?  You say it's hard but can be done.  How?  What logisitcs?  Sorry I haven't a clue and I really need to know this.  Thanks!


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