# Need a new boiler EKO 25 died in fire.



## Rugar (Jan 20, 2017)

Have been running an EKO 25 for seven years and something happened. There was an explosion and shed was immediately on fire. Lost everything. Fire dept was quick and house was spared. 

I need a new boiler. Should I stay with EKO or is there a better option now.  Maybe something that doesn't need constant feeding. The EKO was fine but took some attention. Always planned water storage but haven't got it done. 
Thanks


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## Lcback (Jan 20, 2017)

From someone with an inside furnace. That's terrifying.


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## Vinced (Jan 20, 2017)

My main concern before doing anything would be finding out why it caught on fire!


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## velvetfoot (Jan 20, 2017)

Vinced said:


> My main concern before doing anything would be finding out why it caught on fire!


Terrorism?


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## dogwood (Jan 20, 2017)

Sorry for the loss of your boiler and outbuilding Rugar.  Glad nobody was hurt and your house was undamaged. Do you have any idea if the explosion was internal to the boiler or chimney, or was it possibly something stored in the shed that exploded?  Scary.

Mike


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## Rugar (Jan 20, 2017)

Really unsure what happened. I checked furnace an hour or so earlier. Wife was within 15 feet of shed doing chores 15 to 20 prior to explosion. She didn't notice smoke or anything unusual. At moment of explosion she and our 6 and 3 year old were leaving house going to shed and heard explosion and everything was on fire. I don't recognize any problem with integrity of boiler or any compromise of flue as in burnt up or holes. There was a benzomatic self igniting hand torch for soldering and starting fires. Could it have spontaneous combusted I don't know. Hard to believe something was smoldering and took off that fast. I had been carefully to make sure no embers escaped and was burning oak that doesn't throw sparks.  Had a double wall flue that attached to angle iron on one 2x4 and then poked through tin. 6 Inch stainless with a 13 inch outer shell. I'm at a loss of what happened. Fire dept and insurance didn't see anything to investigate


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## cumminstinkerer (Jan 20, 2017)

Rugar I wonder if you lost secondary flame for some reason and it built up a huge amount of gasses the lit off, my homemade "hybrid" does a small version of just that at times, I've had it blow fire out the peep hole in the door and flyash out the chimney when it does that, make one hell of a huff when it does it.


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## maple1 (Jan 20, 2017)

If I was buying a new boiler right now, I am pretty sure the Froling that Tarm is clearing out right now would be at the top of my list. Watch for the banner ad at the top of the page. It needs storage though - which one should have anyway if at all possible.


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## Rugar (Jan 20, 2017)

Cumminstinkerer you have the best theory I've heard so far. I've had the metal flapper by fan in front blow smoke out of itself at times. I'm guessing that is what your referring to. Always wondered if something could blow out at that moment but never seen evidence of anymore than smoke.


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## dogwood (Jan 20, 2017)

I'm so glad for you your wife and child weren't hurt.

Maybe the Benzomatic leaked some gas. Could have happened if it's valve was made in China, worn, or accidentally not completely closed. I read an article once warning about keeping any potential source of flammable fumes away from a room with gas, oil (or wood for that matter) fired appliances. That included oil based paints, solvents, or anything like that with potentially combustible fumes.

I'm digressing, but it's a concern when people put wood boilers in their garage where you have gasoline cans and other sources of flammable fumes.

I saw that ad on the Froling https://www.woodboilers.com/ at Tarm Biomass that Maple1 mentioned. Looked like a great deal.

Mike


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## goosegunner (Jan 20, 2017)

I sent you a Private message.


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## maple1 (Jan 20, 2017)

I have a Bernzo I keep beside my boiler too. Works great and love it. It's a push button one. I had one issue with it a couple weeks ago when I took it outside on a real cold morning to help thaw out some quick coupler fittings while hooking up the snow blade on our tractor. It sat on the ground for an hour or 2 before I went to use it (Had a breakage happen that required a weld job). Anyway when I went to use it the trigger froze in. It misfired & didn't light. So was spewing gas without control. Had to unscrew from cylinder & thaw it out under the tractor heater blower. Maybe the trigger stuck/froze slightly open on yours?


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## brenndatomu (Jan 20, 2017)

maple1 said:


> I have a Bernzo I keep beside my boiler too. Works great and love it. It's a push button one. I had one issue with it a couple weeks ago when I took it outside on a real cold morning to help thaw out some quick coupler fittings while hooking up the snow blade on our tractor. It sat on the ground for an hour or 2 before I went to use it (Had a breakage happen that required a weld job). Anyway when I went to use it the trigger froze in. It misfired & didn't light. So was spewing gas without control. Had to unscrew from cylinder & thaw it out under the tractor heater blower. Maybe the trigger stuck/froze slightly open on yours?


I was just going to say the same thing. I have used my torch out in the cold and then it "freezes up" and won't shut off completely until it gets warm...if the flame went out but the gas was still flowing...well, you know, BOOM!


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## Rugar (Jan 20, 2017)

The Froling looks interesting. I've seen some about econoburn. Looking for pros and cons. Haven't kept up with newer products well. The EKO was fine but wish it had a larger firebox and had some trouble with controllers. I have a small two story drafty farmhouse that's around 1000 sq ft. The EKO  25 did keep up with all the heat our baseboards could handle but cold windy days were just adequate for warmth. Probably need more baseboard and insulation. So 85-100,000 BTU boiler is probably adequate


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## Fred61 (Jan 21, 2017)

If the amount of "tending" is an issue for you, your first inclination would be to buy a larger boiler. That could backfire on you because after filling the firebox on a larger boiler you could get creosote build-up from excessive idling and your only fix would be to make smaller fires then you're back to where you started, The best way to minimize "tending" is to incorporate storage. Then you will be able to tend the boiler on your schedule.
With the 25 you were burning at the maximum capacity if the boiler making creosote problems less of an issue.
If I were in your shoes I would make an effort to tighten up the house. It's money well spent.


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## hondaracer2oo4 (Jan 21, 2017)

Heatmaster g100?


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## BoiledOver (Jan 21, 2017)

Is the Eko a total loss? I would think not. UNLESS, the explosion happened within the boiler. The blower, controller, rockwool, and wiring is all replaceable. As long as the inner and outer skins of the water jacket are sound, you have a good unit. You might have a good again boiler for just $600. If you get a settlement maybe consider storage and home insulation.

You experienced troubles with your controller? I have not had any issues with that. From day one it was removed from the pyramid and placed above a piece of polyiso and several inches of airspace, NOT enclosed in any box that would hold heat. From the factory, it is in a prone to over heat location.

Best of luck.


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## BoiledOver (Jan 21, 2017)

Here is what I did with the controller. Just that little 1/2" of polyiso stops the heat in its tracks.


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## Woodfarmer1 (Jan 21, 2017)

My Garn is in my shop with Diesel atv, car and truck. I would think as long as the fan is running there would be no buildup of gasses.


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## NateB (Jan 22, 2017)

Sorry for your loss. Glad everyone is OK.

I know the last thing you need right now is more to do, but any change we could get some closer pictures of the EKO? I have the 40 and would like to know more.


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## salecker (Jan 22, 2017)

Rugar said:


> Have been running an EKO 25 for seven years and something happened. There was an explosion and shed was immediately on fire. Lost everything. Fire dept was quick and house was spared.
> 
> I need a new boiler. Should I stay with EKO or is there a better option now.  Maybe something that doesn't need constant feeding. The EKO was fine but took some attention. Always planned water storage but haven't got it done.
> Thanks


Wow that sucks.Can you save the lines to hook back up top them?
If so you could get an Outdoor Econoburn to hook up quick and get back heating.Then build a shed around it next summer and add heat storage at that time.
 I started my system with the outdoor version of the Econoburn,which ended up in a shed hooked to storage.I didn't know if i was going to have my shed fully functional by winter,and i got a good deal on the outdoor model.My systyem has been running for 6 yrs,and am impressed with the Econoburn.I had an issue with a controller and was able to continue running it with an extension cord feeding the fan,using the high limit aguastat to shut off the power when it reached the set point.
 I live in the middle of nowhere so having a basic tough boiler is great.
 Your experience shows one of the main reasons to have a separate boiler building.Catastrophic boiler fail,and you still have a house to live in.


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## Fred61 (Jan 22, 2017)

I don't believe the boiler exploded. In fact I'm willing to bet my brother in law's paycheck on it. In order to get  BOOM you need to confine the area of ignition tighter than the EKO is capable of doing in order to create that much pressure. You have a large 8 inch flue plus an air intake plus the doors would quickly relieve any pressure with the slightest outward bend. You'll get a "PPPFFFFFFTTTT larger and louder than you want to hear in the worst case. That is not to say that you won't get some smoke or maybe some flame into the room.
I had some wicked explosions with my Wood Gun and was darn glad I had my flue pipe screwed together well. It was just the task of running around to pick up the blown off pieces and re-attaching to the boiler. Intake pipe, etc.

I'm guessing you had a propane leak.


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## NateB (Jan 22, 2017)

Do you think a small propane bottle with a leak could get the fuel to air ratio close enough to get a boom? With a boiler sucking fresh air into the room.  I am not saying you are wrong. I just don't know?

I did hear of a guy blowing up his garage when he set a can of spray paint on top of his wood stove.


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## Fred61 (Jan 22, 2017)

NateB said:


> Do you think a small propane bottle with a leak could get the fuel to air ratio close enough to get a boom? With a boiler sucking fresh air into the room.  I am not saying you are wrong. I just don't know?
> 
> I did hear of a guy blowing up his garage when he set a can of spray paint on top of his wood stove.



Yes. Looks like a pretty small building. My EKO 25 moves very little air. It would take a lot of time for the EKO to purge the air in that space.


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## Rugar (Jan 22, 2017)

Sorry I haven't been available much this weekend. I will get some closer pictures. I don't think the boiler is compromised other than controller, fan, paint, sheet metal, insulation and wiring. Fortunately I have replacement cost insurance and boiler was listed so I guess I have to buy a new boiler. But I think I will keep the old one to use again somewhere.


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## maple1 (Jan 22, 2017)

salecker said:


> Wow that sucks.Can you save the lines to hook back up top them?
> If so you could get an Outdoor Econoburn to hook up quick and get back heating.Then build a shed around it next summer and add heat storage at that time.
> I started my system with the outdoor version of the Econoburn,which ended up in a shed hooked to storage.I didn't know if i was going to have my shed fully functional by winter,and i got a good deal on the outdoor model.My systyem has been running for 6 yrs,and am impressed with the Econoburn.I had an issue with a controller and was able to continue running it with an extension cord feeding the fan,using the high limit aguastat to shut off the power when it reached the set point.
> I live in the middle of nowhere so having a basic tough boiler is great.
> Your experience shows one of the main reasons to have a separate boiler building.Catastrophic boiler fail,and you still have a house to live in.



What catastrophic boiler fail?


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## Rugar (Jan 22, 2017)

As for why the explosion I'm still baffled. The building had windows on one side that were missing pains of glass. What I mean is it had plenty of air movement inside. Was an old wash house from long ago. All rough cut hardwood. Concrete floor and tin on top that was very steep. Always hit my head on doorway going in. I'll always miss that


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## Fred61 (Jan 22, 2017)

Propane, like other gasses such as co hangs around the floor and doesn't necessarily mix. That's why they mount the detectors low. It could have a higher concentration than you might think. 

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## Bill in IL (Jan 22, 2017)

I just switched this year to a Garn.  It's a very simple furnace to operate and the water storage that was on your someday list is already built in. 

Glad that everyone was ok after that ordeal.


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## maple1 (Jan 22, 2017)

I will have to admit this thread has me rethinking where I usually keep my Bernzo parked.


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## maple1 (Jan 22, 2017)

Kinda hard to tell in the pic with the debris around, but is the boiler sitting right on the floor, or is it up on a stand or blocks or something?


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## Rugar (Jan 22, 2017)

The boiler is on top of the metal pallet it came with. I would say it's five inches tall at least. Without measuring I would say the lower chamber door is about 12 inches above floor


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## mustash29 (Jan 23, 2017)

How big was the shed?

Propane is flammable in air between about 2% to 10%.


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## dogwood (Jan 23, 2017)

I initiated a very small "explosion" relighting the burner on our old propane fired water heater once. I used one of those long wooden matches to light the the pilot. It didn't relight on the first try.  Only a few seconds later enough propane had build up for it to ignite on the second try with a loud pop, and a flame shooting out long enough to burn the hairs off the back of my hand and singe my eyebrows as I was looking into the orifice. So I'm figuring it doesn't take much time or gas to set off an explosion judging by that experience. And like Fred said, propane is heavier than air and does sink to the floor, so maybe wouldn't dissipate very quickly out the windows.


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## velvetfoot (Jan 24, 2017)

When I unscrewed a tank from my torch, I noticed it was leaking a little.  I took it outside.  I now keep all the bottles outside in a plastic bag.  Actually, I do believe the instructions on the bottle tell you to not store it inside.


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## maple1 (Jan 24, 2017)

velvetfoot said:


> When I unscrewed a tank from my torch, I noticed it was leaking a little.  I took it outside.  I now keep all the bottles outside in a plastic bag.  Actually, I do believe the instructions on the bottle tell you to not store it inside.



Yes, that was another aspect of my stuck trigger incident I mentioned earlier. After I got the torch unscrewed from the bottle, the bottle was still leaking a little bit of gas. For a few moments at least. Think it stopped as soon as I got it under the heater fan. The torch took longer to come around.


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## velvetfoot (Jan 24, 2017)

maple1 said:


> Yes, that was another aspect of my stuck trigger incident I mentioned earlier. After I got the torch unscrewed from the bottle, the bottle was still leaking a little bit of gas. For a few moments at least. Think it stopped as soon as I got it under the heater fan. The torch took longer to come around.


My incident was this past summer.


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## huffdawg (Jan 24, 2017)

I have an Eko 40 for sale.. 2 grand US .comes with draft booster,spare controller and a spare fan capacitor.  Been used roughly 5 seasons.


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## Rugar (Jan 25, 2017)

Shed was close to 12x16. I'm about convinced it had to be the burnzo leaking. I had a couple empty bottles that I found but I can't find the partially full bottle or nozzle and I know exactly where it should have been.


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## Rugar (Jan 25, 2017)

Thanks for everyone's insite, it really helps make sense of it all. Appreciate offers on good used boilers. I have replacement cost insurance so probably looking for new but still unsure of what I should be looking for. Seems like many boilers went up in cost however EKO has stayed steady or gotten cheeper. Has other boilers passed it in technology.


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## E Yoder (Jan 27, 2017)

Sorry to hear about your incident. Wow.

I would look into some of the outdoor gassers- they've  come a long way just in the last couple of years.
They are designed to run without storage (cycling, rather than batch burning) and save some installation cost . They're not your old school "smoke dragons".

Just another option to consider.


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## Fred61 (Jan 27, 2017)

E Yoder said:


> Sorry to hear about your incident. Wow.
> 
> I would look into some of the outdoor gassers- they've  come a long way just in the last couple of years.
> They are designed to run without storage (cycling, rather than batch burning) and save a lot of installation cost . They're not your old school "smoke dragons".
> In my experience outdoor installation is much safer and cheaper. And no tinder dry shed to catch fire when cleaning ashes out....  We see that happen way too often.



Unless boiler engineering has progressed drastically since I went to bed last night I would like to dispute your assessment of what is available out there for wood boilers.

Cycling wood boilers (gassers) have been around for some time now. In fact the OP has one. The EKO 25 you see standing there in it's underwear. If a wood boiler idles (shuts down the air) it will make a mess of the internal surfaces of the fire chamber. Starving a fire of air is not a good way of shutting off a fire. The only clean way to shut down a fire is to remove the fuel like an oil boiler, gas boiler, pellet boiler, etc. Imagine if your oil boiler was built to shut down by shutting off the air and leaving the oil flowing.

Unless the heat load equals the output of the boiler it will idle and gum up the inside. Shoulder seasons become a nightmare for the operator since the heat load varies within the heating season.

I could be wrong but in my opinion anyone running a cycling boiler without storage is going to continually be fighting creosote.


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## E Yoder (Jan 27, 2017)

I agree that storage is a great and time tested way to eliminate creosote problems. What I've seen in my G1 is that it has creosote but the air passageways are designed to stay hot enough to burn off the creosote during the next burn. Firebox is stainless so moisture isn't a problem. And it burns very very clean. 
But I am in no way saying that the batch burning boilers are wrong. Just giving another option. 

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## Fred61 (Jan 27, 2017)

Are these "air passages" surrounded by water?


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## E Yoder (Jan 27, 2017)

No. They're stainless channels on the inside of the water jacket. The actual water jacket can get pretty messy in the spring and fall (like you were describing). Air coming directly from that would be a real headache. With the separate air channels I haven't had issues. 
The reason I mentioned a cycling boiler was because he had said (I think) that he didn't have storage. 

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## Fred61 (Jan 27, 2017)

His Eko is a cycling boiler.  You could have any boiler with storage or any boiler without storage. The fact that he doesn't have storage is no indicator of what he has for a boiler. 

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## E Yoder (Jan 27, 2017)

Right. I'm jumbling terms. 
I was meaning the perhaps most common or "recommended" installation. But I'm not as familiar with all the brands of indoor boilers. 

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## mike van (Jan 28, 2017)

E Yoder said:


> Sorry to hear about your incident. Wow.
> 
> I would look into some of the outdoor gassers- they've  come a long way just in the last couple of years.
> They are designed to run without storage (cycling, rather than batch burning) and save a lot of installation cost . They're not your old school "smoke dragons".
> In my experience outdoor installation is much safer and cheaper. And no tinder dry shed to catch fire when cleaning ashes out....  We see that happen way too often.


                                                                                                Some friends of ours have one of these 'cycling gassers'   in a word, it stinks when idling. which is alot in the kind of weather we've had of late.  And I wouldn't trade my 'tinder dry shed' for all the wood in china. Just my 2 cents.


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## E Yoder (Jan 28, 2017)

I edited my earlier post and apologize as I did not intend to criticize anyone's setup. 

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## Tennman (Jan 29, 2017)

Agree with Fred. There are just too many big holes in a boiler pressure vessel between flue and blowers etc for adequate pressure for a firebox explosion and subsequent fire. I'll bet you replace the controller and your boiler will run again. Boiler still holding water? You keep mower gas cans in there? Glad all are safe. Don't see how an EKO can create pressure for what you describe. Steam maybe, firebox... hummm.


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## slowzuki (Feb 9, 2017)

Its hard to have a steam explosion in a little boiler, you have relief valves etc and if it had happened the water jacket would have been blown to smithereens.

Looks exactly like a gas explosion.  Butane, propane, wood gas hard to tell.  A 1 lb propane cylinder contents can level a family home if it leaks out and has time to mix a bit.


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## stee6043 (Feb 9, 2017)

I'd like the record to show that the evidence here seems to suggest your EKO was MURDERED.

That's a hell of a way to go for such a fine boiler.  Only that EKO knows the real truth.  She probably smelled the gas and couldn't do anything about it.  Like watching your car fill with water after ditching in the lake knowing you can't get your seatbelt off.

That crime scene photo gives me the willies.  No boiler deserves to go out like that.  Particularly at the hands of a fossil fuel.  Jealous #(*^*&^##)@.

Never underestimate the power of a jealous bottle of LP, friends...


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## Fred61 (Feb 9, 2017)

Tragic death. I hope it was quick and she didn't suffer. 

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## dogwood (Feb 9, 2017)

Well Rugar, the silver lining is that your family is safe, you'll be getting a new boiler, Maple and others may be moving their torches to safer locations, and not to mention your thread brought Slowzuki out of hibernation. I've always liked his posts. Let us know what you end up doing, and best of luck on your new boiler.

Mike


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## Rugar (Feb 15, 2017)

I'm quite convinced my bernzo or tank it was attached to was the culprit. Starting cleaning the mess up and found an exploded propane tank on opposite side of building from its original position. The bernzo was closer to original location but either partly melted or at least missing some parts. 
For a new boiler I'm considering the discontinued Froling on special. I'm considering placing new boiler in detached garage that is only used for tools and such. My question is I really should have storage and have a low profile but very long 500 gallon propane tank that hasn't been built for storage yet. To use it it would set in garage or outside. Other options would be small basement under house but couldn't get a propane tank into it so would have to build something from scratch or spend a bunch. 
Any thoughts or spend more cash for a garn or something else.


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## dogwood (Feb 16, 2017)

Rugar, I'm thinking the Froling is a great choice for it's Lambda device alone, especially if you get it at the sale price.  

I've got our insulated propane-type storage tank partitioned off in the back of our unheated garage. In hindsight it may have been wiser to have set it on blocks and framed it in outside on the same wall. Would have saved valuable garage space and cost not much more. The Garn Jr. is a top quality boiler too, but you'd pay a lot more for it because it comes with it's own storage, which you already have.

Mike


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## maple1 (Feb 16, 2017)

Could do open American Solartechnics tanks, with HX coils. Those can be assembled most anywhere - even a small basement. Efficient use of space, and you bring it into the space in pieces & put it together. Definitely would want storage with that boiler.

Or put your 500 against a wall in the garage - can still use the space above it for storage. Of 'stuff'.


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## goosegunner (Feb 16, 2017)

Pretty sure the sale was over on the 10th of February.

If you have a gable end on your garage you could very easily build a small bump out of less than 6' x 6' and go vertical with the 500 gallon tank.


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## Sparky (Feb 16, 2017)

Pressurized is the way to go these days, but if you can't You could build your own. I did it and it works great. Tarm used to sell unpressurized units but it doesn't appear they do anymore. I know building your own and using EPDM for a liner isn't top shelf but it does work when you are limited to space. 8' x 8' x 4' You can get enough water in there for about 1200 gallons. Mine is in my basement and my boiler is in my attached garage it's 100 feet in pipe length away. Good luck and enjoy figuring out all the kinks it's a lot of fun (if you enjoy that kind of thing)?


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## Hydronics (Feb 17, 2017)

If you have the money (from insurance), I really like the Garn for it's simplicity. Downsides are: open system requires HX and water chemistry monitoring and adjustment. Larger blower = higher electricity use.


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## dogwood (Feb 17, 2017)

Could you post a picture of that tank of yours?


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## Sparky (Feb 18, 2017)

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## Sparky (Feb 18, 2017)

Woops sorry didn't add explanation this was my first design
I bought the liner custom made I had moisture escaping from the cover from not being properly sealed. I decided to make it bigger and when I opened it up the liner above the water was brittle that's why I used EPDM the second time 
Same design just double the size w a extra coil and better reinforcement 
I don't have pics of that being built


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## dogwood (Feb 18, 2017)

Rugar, how about a picture of your "very long 500 gallon propane tank" too?


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## Rugar (Feb 21, 2017)

I'll try to get a picture of tank today.  Someone also makes a garn like boiler that has pressurized storage around it. Don't remember the name. These type of boilers may be pushing the amount of dollars I can spend. I hope the Froling sale isn't gone, will make things tougher if so. My biggest concern is I needed 180 plus temp water to heat my baseboards and be comfortable. When temps dropped to 77 or lower it was noticable.


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## E Yoder (Feb 21, 2017)

Switzer is pressurized.


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## maple1 (Feb 21, 2017)

I think I would add more radiation, of some kind. No matter what you do on the boiler side, it will help it immensely - keeping supply at 180 all the time is an efficiency hit and without storage you will be bouncing between a lot of idling, and supply water not hot enough. Cast iron rads work very well, usually lots of used ones around.

And add more insulation & air sealing.

^See above - Switzer is the Garn like one you were thinking about. Likely.


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## Rugar (Feb 21, 2017)

This is my propane tank. Touch longer than 13 ft and 2.66 ft wide. 500 gallon. Wish I had two. Gotta be great for stratification when placed on end.


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## salecker (Feb 21, 2017)

I love my cast iron rads.Like having a wood stove in every room without the mess or danger.
Even when my storage gets down to 120F they are still putting out heat.120 is where my oil boiler kicks in for backup or when we go somewhere.


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## Rugar (Mar 2, 2017)

Maybe it's time to start a new thread but I've done a lot of calling and reading on different systems. I've looked at Froling, Portage and Main, Woodmaster g series, hardy kb125 and Econoburn. All of those sound like great units with great people. On a whim I called on a Switzer and I'm having trouble figuring out why I shouldn't obviously choose it. All these boilers aren't cheep but the Switzer isn't that much more and has pressurized storage. Is there something I'm missing.


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## E Yoder (Mar 2, 2017)

You're comparing among units that would potentially different installation costs. The Heatmaster G series, Hardy KB125, and Portage and Main would commonly be installed without storage. Not saying they couldn't be, but the manufacturers expect them to not be. 
I'm not telling you to go one way or another. Just an observation.


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## Rugar (Mar 2, 2017)

Your certainly right about the heatmaster, hardy, and P&M. There is still a fit for flexability that these units give that I had to consider. Then looked at good storage capable brands and had an epiphany, they all cost about the same. Then  checked out the Switzer and it isn't that much more really.  Unless I'm on boiler overload( which I am) the choice looks clear unless my mind is fogged.


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## TCaldwell (Mar 3, 2017)

I know Gary Switzer and his son in law install, test and tune their boilers. This could save you a lot of aggravation and time.


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## Rugar (Mar 3, 2017)

I'm well over a thousand miles away. I'm guessing that would place me on my own for install. Sounds like Gary has re designed part of the system in the last couple years to where it's much easier. Sounds like a little electrical and some outer plumbing is most of it.


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## Dutchie84 (Mar 3, 2017)

Any one know of any switzer's in Canada??


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