# Harman 52i Install; Let me Get This Right



## rob.mwpropane (Feb 27, 2014)

Hey gang; thanks to all those who have posted informative things here. I feel like I know some of you. At any rate, I was so happy with the outcome of "my hand me down" pellet stove (Old Earth Stove MP35/50) that I decided to spring for the new Accentra 52i. I have this thing ordered and feel I am fully capable of installing it myself. I have climbed up the roof, measured what I need, etc. etc. I know I want to run the liner to the cap, and am pretty sure I'm running 4" OAK to the cap as well (15' max), but I can't seem to find a place online that sells a chimney cap with a solid plate that I could put the holes in myself (13"x13" terracotta flu)? And what is the general consensus on insulating the liner for a pellet stove? Naturally insulation, Roxul or what not at the base above the damper, but what about the full length? I live in Maryland and have been told by the local dealer that intake and exhaust need to be 4' apart to follow code; I'm more keen on NFPA 54/58 in my line of work, so offsets for pellet stoves I'm not up on. Does anyone have pictures of their OAK out the top? I've attached a picture of another install on here that I'm shooting for. Advice, tips, and the cheaper websites that people use most welcome.

(P.S. - chimney is in the middle of the house, hence 4" OAK to top and not 3" out the back)

P.P.S. - These pictures are not mine, and I don't claim them to be
P.P.P.S. - Would of probably been easier and I would have been just as happy with the P68, however the Majolica Brown 52i was a MUCH easier sell to the wife

Thanks. advice much appreciated; and if anyone is local to Maryland and in need of owning their own propane tank, gas lines (shameless plug), or have questions regarding such a job, (as I'm happy to give back to a forum that has freely given to me) feel free to contact me. THANKS


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## Ctcarl (Feb 27, 2014)

Well good luck and congrats on your stove . If your confident in doing it your self power to you . I had mine installed and was very happy with the outcome.get some pics


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## rob.mwpropane (Feb 28, 2014)

Pictures are a definite. Where did you have them run the OAK, or is it pulling from the house? I still haven't figured if what I want to do with the intake and exhaust and if its legal per code. I feel mechanically capable, but I read threads on here and someone says "yes, insulation is a must", then someone says "no". "Oak is great", "no its bad"...it seems everyone has an opinion, and while I may not agree with all the codes, I'd like to try to stay as close to them as possible. I'm calling the county this morning to see what they say...


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## Mt Bob (Feb 28, 2014)

rob.mwpropane said:


> Pictures are a definite. Where did you have them run the OAK, or is it pulling from the house? I still haven't figured if what I want to do with the intake and exhaust and if its legal per code. I feel mechanically capable, but I read threads on here and someone says "yes, insulation is a must", then someone says "no". "Oak is great", "no its bad"...it seems everyone has an opinion, and while I may not agree with all the codes, I'd like to try to stay as close to them as possible. I'm calling the county this morning to see what they say...


 I have seen many service manual install guides and was a little confused,also.The 4' seperation from flue to intake air is for the intake air "of another appliance".Dealer/installer should know better.


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## rob.mwpropane (Feb 28, 2014)

So, would running intake/exhaust to chimney top be ok? Like in the picture I posted? I just got off the phone with my county inspector. He pretty much told me "whatever the manual stipulates", the problem is, the manual shows the intake terminating above the damper plate if using an outside air kit. Not one diagram shows the intake running to the top. 

The problem with that is harmans adapter that allows outside air to be drawn into the flu is 20"x20", when I only have 13"x13" to work with....which is why I just wanted to take it to the top and call it a day....


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## rob.mwpropane (Feb 28, 2014)

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 Ok, so I'm thinking I'm way over thinking this;  cut right from the manual. I'll install the way Harman has depicted, I'll just have to fabricate my own vent/grate/intake up top. The Harman adapter is (to expensive)& to big for my flue. This is probably how most installers do it anyway.....any thoughts?


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## CBL (Feb 28, 2014)

No you don't need insulation around the liner as it's a forced draft appliance. But does it hurt to have it? No not really. (My liner isn't insulated)

I have my OAK setup exactly as the manual says (it is the same for P35i and P52i). The top cap that seals the masonry flue has vents to let air in and the OAK pipe terminates about 12' below the top of the chimney. I think I like this method better than running it full length because if you have an issue or obstruction you can service it from the fire box rather than having to get up on the roof.

I also made my own venting at the top sealing plate. I used a terra cotta top plate and made a spacer out of 3/4" square tubing that I drilled holes into that went between the flue and the plate and sealed everything up with RTV to hold it down. The overhang from the terra cotta top plate provides weather protection for the vent holes and the terra cotta plate is oversized just enough gap to let air in. It's been working great for me this season.


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## rob.mwpropane (Feb 28, 2014)

Why did you opt to run it almost all the way to the top? Just curious, wouldn't it have been just as efficient, maybe a little less costly to terminate a few feet above appliance? (As pictured in the manual) My install is only 15' tops, so 4' of intake vs 10' really isn't going to make a difference...I don't think...


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## Superglyde (Feb 28, 2014)

our 52i manual shows an option of the OAK termininating in the chimney providing you have a way to get air into the chimney, thus the recommendation for their top. I didn't use their top for the same reason you mention above. My terracotta is 13x13 also. I modified...er...jury rigged...my setup and I think I will work on chaning it out in the spring but haven't been able to find the right top you asked about. I also have wind/downdraft problems as well from the second story roof as my chimeny is on the first floor addition and is only 15 feet.
The only downside so far to having the OAK terminate in the chimney is the damn stinkbugs nest in the chimney and are probably getting fed into the stove....but I bet they are..incinerated! don't smell them cause its a closed system....air to exhaust.


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## Superglyde (Feb 28, 2014)

i don't like that setup in your first post. saw that before myself. Its too close only because it will suck down flyash. If Harman made a top plate for our size, then we wouldn't have that problem


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## rob.mwpropane (Feb 28, 2014)

Ok, I'm still not sure the benefit of running up to the top with intake? Wouldnt that cause more of a restriction as opposed to terminating directly above the unit? Of course, still have the same vented top plate/cap.  On the plus side I have an idea for the top plate/cover based off of your post. Will take plenty of pictures upon install, ....


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## CBL (Feb 28, 2014)

Superglyde said:


> If Harman made a top plate for our size, then we wouldn't have that problem



You can actually trim it down to size if need be. I just didn't use it because it looks weird and it costs a lot of money. 



rob.mwpropane said:


> Why did you opt to run it almost all the way to the top? Just curious, wouldn't it have been just as efficient, maybe a little less costly to terminate a few feet above appliance? (As pictured in the manual) My install is only 15' tops, so 4' of intake vs 10' really isn't going to make a difference...I don't think...



That's what I did. you still have to keep the intake a minimum below the exhaust termination (I think its 4')


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## rob.mwpropane (Feb 28, 2014)

As far as the 4', I don't think that's code. Still looking into that, I think it depends on the situation, for instance, how can they manufacturer the exhaust where the intake is on the outside of the exhaust pipe? The inspector I spoke with was really heavy on following the manufacturers specs....

Now onto my next small hurtle, what about the electric? Do most people run electric through the wall or cleanoyt to hide the plug? As it stands, my best thinking is running a new line from the basement through the cleanout, or at least the top of the wall above the cleanout....any suggestions? Anyone know what the code is for electric box in fireplace? Naturally surge protector for sure...


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## rob.mwpropane (Feb 28, 2014)

Found this thread; suits my needs for electrical...

https://www.hearth.com/talk/threads...dea-to-install-a-plug-in-the-fireplace.81715/


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## deercamp (Mar 1, 2014)

It's pretty funny how you never see the electrical cord running across the hearth in any stove brochures.  They must be using that new invisible cord.  A dealer told me that it's not a good
idea ruinning an extension cord down to the basement because you might have to high or low voltage.  I am going to be mounting a plug in the back of my fireplace when I go to install
my insert.  I am not worried at all about doing this I have talked to many of my electrician friends and they said that it would be fine.  On the same note I am going to go overboard on safety
using the proper fire rated materials just in case.


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## rob.mwpropane (Mar 1, 2014)

The only issue I have with "mounting" anything means I'd have holes in a perfectly good fireplace should I ever move.  (Because I'm not leaving the stove behind). I would like to have a receptacle, just haven't 100% thought that all the way through... anybody have any ideas that don't involve mounting to the floor/wall? Could it be mounted to the frame?

So I started taking the damper apart and made a block off plate. I attached photos. One thing that scares me a little is how close the appliance will be to the carpet, and how the inspector will interpret the manual. It says --"6 inches from glass", I might have 7" from glass if I'm lucky, but not from the base of the unit...


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## deercamp (Mar 1, 2014)

Do you plan on coming up through the clean out?  If so what I plan on doing is just mounting the receptacle box with one or two screws using a shield in a grout joint.  Then when you remove it
you just have to patch one or two 1/4" small holes and rub a little black soot and ash on it and you'll never notice it.  The pan looks nice did you do that yourself?  What did you
attach the pan with?


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## rob.mwpropane (Mar 1, 2014)

Yes, coming through the cleanout with 12 or 14 gauge romex. I was thinking possibly a shut off in the basement, and maybe the outlet attached to the frame? I'm not sure how much room I have as the unit is not here yet. 

Thank you for the compliment. I bought a 2'x3' sheet of sheet metal from HD for $9. I used the cardboard method (put a piece in place, trim, repeat until happy with the fit) to get the right shape to trace on the sheet. I then added 2" to the sides and cut it out. I used a razor blade to score it with a straight edge, just bent it back and forth until it breaks. Perfect cut. I used snips for the corners. As of now I just kept the sides bent out more than needed so when I pushed it into place it would stay. I'll take it back down when I get the unit. (I'm really surprised harman doesn't include the measurements in the install manual, I could have the holes cut if I had the exact placement.) I'm really happy with the way it turned out, although I really took my time, so between taking the damper apart and cutting/bending the sheet (and letting the kids feel like they were apart of the project) I spent the better part of 2.5 hours to do it...


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## fmsm (Mar 1, 2014)

https://www.hearth.com/talk/attachments/pvp_prairiecap-and-increaser_w-pdf.122948/

This is what I used. Works great!


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## rob.mwpropane (Mar 2, 2014)

Fmsm- how much was that? Where did you get it?



Here's a DIY blockoff plate with better pictures. This is the same how I did it.

https://www.hearth.com/talk/threads/my-diy-block-off-plate-installation.61183/


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## CBL (Mar 2, 2014)

CBL said:


> ake a minimum below the exhaust termination (I think its 4')





rob.mwpropane said:


> As far as the 4', I don't think that's code. Still looking into that, I think it depends on the situation, for instance, how can they manufacturer the exhaust where the intake is on the outside of the exhaust pipe? The inspector I spoke with was really heavy on following the manufacturers specs....



Have you carefully read the manual yet for the P52i? It explicitly says the minimum is 4' below the exhaust. 

If you speak to any city or town building inspector they will always rely on the manufactures instructions when it comes to a solid fuel appliance. And in your example, if the air intake is in the flue chase and you have a chimney cap that's designed with intake slots below the exhaust vent there's really very little chance of it sucking in exhaust. Even in the very unlikely chance it does that combustion air will simply vent out through the exhaust anyway.


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## fmsm (Mar 2, 2014)

rob.mwpropane said:


> Fmsm- how much was that? Where did you get it?
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Linwood Stove & Fireplace
Website · (781) 829-4419


Sunday Closed
I can't remember exactly what they sell it for. Around 250 I think


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## rob.mwpropane (Mar 2, 2014)

CBL said:


> Have you carefully read the manual yet for the P52i? It explicitly says the minimum is 4' below the exhaust.



I think I said, "I don't think that's code", and I really don't. I believe the first picture I posted is ok, however I think I would of put a baffle in between the intake/exhaust. That's kind of why I started this thread, to see what other people had done. As of now I plan to do it the way it is in the book as per the second picture I posted in post 6 of this thread. I have a plan for a vent to go under the top plate sort of what harman has,.....just cheaper. And I don't see any point wasting material to go all the way up the chimney with the intake line.

Just a rant, and really not trying to be ignorant (so no offense is intended), but I run into so many problems when people take opinion for code. The 4' rule posted in Harmans 52i install manual is there suggestion, and good in most instances. (See picture) If I had the Selkirk direct vent system, or similar, I would have no problem having the intake/exhaust in close proximity, which is way less than 4'. If the design is right, you can throw that 4' rule out the window because it's NOT code. 

I'm only saying all this because I've had multiple people mention this 4 foot rule, (consider the guy at my local dealer, who sells direct vent pipe). Its not code, and it's misinformation to label it as such. There are instances where this can be bypassed, considering the right design.


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## NHcpa (Mar 2, 2014)

rob.mwpropane said:


> I think I said, "I don't think that's code", and I really don't. I believe the first picture I posted is ok, however I think I would of put a baffle in between the intake/exhaust. That's kind of why I started this thread, to see what other people had done. As of now I plan to do it the way it is in the book as per the second picture I posted in post 6 of this thread. I have a plan for a vent to go under the top plate sort of what harman has,.....just cheaper. And I don't see any point wasting material to go all the way up the chimney with the intake line.
> 
> Just a rant, and really not trying to be ignorant (so no offense is intended), but I run into so many problems when people take opinion for code. The 4' rule posted in Harmans 52i install manual is there suggestion, and good in most instances. (See picture) If I had the Selkirk direct vent system, or similar, I would have no problem having the intake/exhaust in close proximity, which is way less than 4'. If the design is right, you can throw that 4' rule out the window because it's NOT code.
> 
> I'm only saying all this because I've had multiple people mention this 4 foot rule, (consider the guy at my local dealer, who sells direct vent pipe). Its not code, and it's misinformation to label it as such. There are instances where this can be bypassed, considering the right design.


I hate to over think this...  My middle of the room non exterior chimney is too far for OAK to an outside wall...say, run a pipe from the clean out to the basement and then, outside wall.  If the the chimney is sealed from the damper to the crown to provide warmth for exhaust draft, how does opening the crown cap to feed an OAK pipe mounted in the chimney help the draft?


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## rob.mwpropane (Mar 2, 2014)

NHcpa said:


> I hate to over think this...  My middle of the room non exterior chimney is too far for OAK to an outside wall...say, run a pipe from the clean out to the basement and then, outside wall.  If the the chimney is sealed from the damper to the crown to provide warmth for exhaust draft, how does opening the crown cap to feed an OAK pipe mounted in the chimney help the draft?



I have the same issue you do and
I'll be really honest here; I'm installing my first pellet stove in a chimney, so your terminology is evading me. I know the damper is the metal door I have pictured above, and I would assume the crown is the top? At any rate, I don't think it would help the natural draft. In a wood stove, this would probably be horrible/illegal, but with a pellet stove it's power vented. So natural draft is only relevant in the event of a power outage, in which case I'll have an $80 APC (American Power Conversion) model #BE750G (on Amazon) to run the exhaust while the unit slowly powers down.

I'll admit that there will probably be more creosote build up in the liner because of the cooler temperatures I'll be introducing to the chimney/liner. If it wasn't ridiculously expensive I might wrap it in insulation, but I plan to just have to clean it more often. (What, once a year? Shouldn't I be doing that anyway?)

I hope I answered your question, but please realize that this is based on my opinions from stuff I've read,....so take it with a grain of salt.....or maybe not at all....


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## rob.mwpropane (Mar 2, 2014)

P.S. - Just ordered my liner from FiresideChimneySupply, price was good, free shipping and I saw a 10% off coupon on the web....we'll see.


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## NHcpa (Mar 2, 2014)

rob.mwpropane said:


> I have the same issue you do and
> I'll be really honest here; I'm installing my first pellet stove in a chimney, so your terminology is evading me. I know the damper is the metal door I have pictured above, and I would assume the crown is the top? At any rate, I don't think it would help the natural draft. In a wood stove, this would probably be horrible/illegal, but with a pellet stove it's power vented. So natural draft is only relevant in the event of a power outage, in which case I'll have an $80 APC (American Power Conversion) model #BE750G (on Amazon) to run the exhaust while the unit slowly powers down.
> 
> I'll admit that there will probably be more creosote build up in the liner because of the cooler temperatures I'll be introducing to the chimney/liner. If it wasn't ridiculously expensive I might wrap it in insulation, but I plan to just have to clean it more often. (What, once a year? Shouldn't I be doing that anyway?)
> ...


Perhaps not clear from prior posts, the chimney will have a 4" exhaust tube from the stove to the crown (top/exit of the chimney). The exhaust tube is non insulated and the chimney (with clay tile) is closed/sealed at the crown and damper.  The Harman manual states that an OAK tube can be run up the chimney to within 4' of the crown. This confuses me because if I am sealed at both ends, there is no fresh air...  so the answer is or assumption, there is fresh air to draw - presumably from the crown cap.  Again, presumably, the thought process to seal both ends is to "heat" the chimney pathway for the exhaust tube to better draw.  I would think if the exhaust tube was insulted, then perhaps you could have the top crown plate vented as I have seen on various threads to give air to the OAK intake.  Regardless, my stove installer is sealing both ends, using a non insulated exhaust tube, and I will not have outside air.


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## rob.mwpropane (Mar 2, 2014)

NHcpa said:


> Perhaps not clear from prior posts, the chimney will have a 4" exhaust tube from the stove to the crown (top/exit of the chimney). The exhaust tube is non insulated and the chimney (with clay tile) is closed/sealed at the crown and damper.  The Harman manual states that an OAK tube can be run up the chimney to within 4' of the crown. This confuses me because if I am sealed at both ends, there is no fresh air...  so the answer is or assumption, there is fresh air to draw - presumably from the crown cap.  Again, presumably, the thought process to seal both ends is to "heat" the chimney pathway for the exhaust tube to better draw.  I would think if the exhaust tube was insulted, then perhaps you could have the top crown plate vented as I have seen on various threads to give air to the OAK intake.  Regardless, my stove installer is sealing both ends, using a non insulated exhaust tube, and I will not have outside air.



If you don't have some sort of vent up top, there's no way to terminate the intake inside the chimney. I guess you could run up and out the side of the chimney, however many inches code says to be above the snow fall....this will keep your chimney space warm, and the oak still short. My only issue with that would be the effect of the prevailing winds on that side of the chimney. Its either going to be + or -, to what effect this would have I don't know.

If I didn't do mine up into chimney space with intake, I would of had to run 40' all said and done down through cleanout, over, and to the back of the house. I can't imagine how big my line would have been by the end to still be efficient?


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## rob.mwpropane (Mar 22, 2014)

Pictures as promised. Installed last week before the snow...


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## rob.mwpropane (Mar 22, 2014)




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## rob.mwpropane (Mar 22, 2014)




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## rob.mwpropane (Mar 22, 2014)

While I was on the roof I didn't remember to take pictures of the vent part. I have 1/2 screen bent over the flu (it's been there to keep animals out was there before I moved in). I cut a hole big enough for the liner to fit through and laid two pieces of steel channel on either side of the liner, flat side down (in the shape of a "U"). I used a small amount of liquid nail to adhere the channel to the screen/flu. My fly measures 13"x13" outside. My cap measures 14.5"x14.5" inside. This gives me 1.5" intake all the way around the base of the cap. My channel is only 1.25" off the flu, so this allowed there to be a nice size gap for intake air all around the cap, just like in the Harman manual. Hope all that makes sense; I'm only posting all this stuff trying to help others as I have been helped on this site.


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## dradam1 (Mar 22, 2014)

rob.mwpropane said:


> View attachment 130236
> View attachment 130237
> View attachment 130238
> View attachment 130239
> ...


Great pics!!


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## rob.mwpropane (Mar 22, 2014)

MANY THANKS TO     lbcynya, without his thread here;
https://www.hearth.com/talk/threads/how-your-harman-works-what-your-manual-doesnt-tell-you.91030/
without it, it would have taken me a lot longer to figure out how this thing works. I had the unit up and running in 5 minutes, and set in 10 (I might of played for a couple days, lol) 

In conclusion.......

     The Harman instructions are really bad. I pride myself on being able to mechanically take stuff apart/put stuff together. Because I've never done a pellet stove insert/liner/cap, etc I wanted to make sure I did it right. I don't think I've ever come across a set of instructions so azz backwards. The connectors supplied on the unit did NOT plug right into the room air sensor. I had to cut, and splice these with the appropriate ones. And there were two side rails that allow the hopper to slide into the cage; both of which were put on backwards, and neither ever mentioned in the manual. The only thing I can figure; guy at the Harman factory's first day?....no big deal, we've all had those.

     I'm not sure if I would go with the Mojolica Brown option if I had to do it again. It's gorgeous, but I didn't realize how easy it would chip. I chipped one small spot when removing the door to move the unit inside. It was like +7 degrees that day and super windy, so I'm hoping that chip happened because it was relatively fresh paint, and because it was so cold outside. Since then, no chips, but only time will tell. I have four boys, so I'm paranoid all the time that they'll throw, kick, bite, smack....a chip off at any minute. Harman included a little container of matching paint which did fill in the gap really well, can't even see it, but I don't want to be painting it every other week either...

     I'm not really satisfied with the intake on top of the cage (actual intake goes 4' into flu and terminates). I used what was left of my liner to tie onto the intake, but needed a 3"-4" reducer to move up to the liner size of 4". I think when I pull it after the season I'll change that a bit. Get something that's a better fit.

     I did find a slightly used APC #BE750G for $30, so in case the power goes out it can power down without getting smoke in the house. (although I wonder if the natural draft would have taken care of that??, oh well, better safe than sorry...)

     I just did my first clean yesterday. I will say the holes in the burn pot were a little pain to get to, but for my first clean I expected some obstacles to overcome. I can only get more efficient cleaning with time. 

Final Thoughts;

     I love it. Warms the house using half the amount of pellets as my 15 year old Earth Stove. And when I say it burns every last part of every single pellet I mean it. I've burned quite a bit so far (almost non stop for the past week; feed rate 4.25, room temp set to 76 or so), and still have yet to empty the ash pan. (Just for reference - Energex pellets from http://kingdombiofuel.com/)

     The fire itself is stunning. We've (family) spent a couple nights just sitting in front of the fire. It really brings life to the living room. My house was built in 1964, and I'm updating the inefficiencies all the time, but the boys room was always slightly chilly before....not at all now. The house itself is 1500sq' with an unfinished basement. This thing warms the whole house, and it seems with little to no effort at all. As you can see in the pictures, it sits directly next to the TV with no trouble. I'll admit that I have a fairly nice surround sound, and I do turn the blower down to the fans if were watching the TV, but completely bearable.  All in all, only time will tell if this was a good purchase. Anything new always has it's appeal, so I don't know where I'll stand a year from now. I could have spent the money on a new boiler or something, but as of now, pellets are cheaper than oil/gas, and that's even with the price that I can get oil/gas at, so that's says a lot.


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## rob.mwpropane (Mar 22, 2014)

dradam1 said:


> Great pics!!


Thanks!


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## deercamp (Mar 22, 2014)

This is what I am going to use to terminate both the exhaust and fresh
air intake.  On the bottom of the chimney cap there is a 3" and 4" 
stub to connect each pipe. 
The stove looks great. I finally ordered 
mine last week so I'll be picking your
brain for some install pointers. What type if liner did you end up using?


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## rob.mwpropane (Mar 22, 2014)

deercamp - I looked at that setup. A little too expensive for me. I got mine from FiresideChimneySupply. For 20' of smooth wall liner, cap, and connector it was like $380 shipped. I didn't see the point running the intake all the way to the top. 

I'm no pro, so just a heads up, take my advice with a grain of salt.


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## CBL (Mar 22, 2014)

Nice install... Makes me wish I held out for the P52i.

Front hearth protection looks a little anemic though, I think you need at least 6" from the glass to the edge of the hearth pad (maybe it's ok, just judging from the scale of the pictures) . Would suck to burn holes on the carpet if embers find their way out while you're scraping the pot or popping out the ash pan...


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## deercamp (Mar 22, 2014)

Your no pro look at my first picture that I posted.  I am surprised that it didn't have my phone number on it.  Yes that chimney cap is not that cheap it's in the $200 plus range. 
I was told from Harman that if I only ran the fresh air pipe up past the block off plate and not all the way to the top that people have been having a noise problem with a loud rumbling noise from
the stove sucking in the fresh air down the lenght of the chimney.  Have you noticed any such noise and how far did you run your fresh air liner up past the block off plate? 
With all the money that I saved from not getting the Majolica brown I can now afford that chimney cap LOL.


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## rob.mwpropane (Mar 22, 2014)

Funny you mention rumbling. I myself hear a very minor rumbling, almost like a train or small earthquake very far away. My intake goes about 4' into space above block off plate. It is extremely subtle. No one in the family has mentioned it. I just figured it was the funky adapter I used for 3"-4". I want to climb up on the roof while its running to investigate. The rumbling is not constant, and to be honest, I haven't heard it since Monday or Tuesday. Part of me figured it was just breaking in.


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## rob.mwpropane (Mar 22, 2014)

CBM - Thanks for the compliment.

Your right. I went back and forth about this for a while. Its not something that I like, but its 6" from glass believe it or not. Whenever I open the door, I crack it and wait for combustion blower to stop (takes about .5 seconds). The carpet is pretty old, and there's hardwood floors under that, but I really don't want to have the kids destroy hardwood. If I have any issues, I'll add a bigger hearth.


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## canuck_22 (Mar 22, 2014)

Very Nice


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## Ctcarl (Mar 22, 2014)

Beautiful looking stove


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## rob.mwpropane (Mar 22, 2014)

Thanks guys. I figured if I was going to spend all that money, might as well shoot for the moon. I'm not by any means wealthy, and still sort of nervous about the long term investment, but for today, I feel good about it.


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## rob.mwpropane (Apr 16, 2014)

So... loving the stove, however, I get this subtle rumbling noise (distant train?) when it's rolling full blast. A friend of mine works at the local dealer, he said they are replacing a piece on the back of the units before they are even installed to fix this. Does anyone know what that might be?


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## NHcpa (Apr 16, 2014)

rob.mwpropane said:


> So... loving the stove, however, I get this subtle rumbling noise (distant train?) when it's rolling full blast. A friend of mine works at the local dealer, he said they are replacing a piece on the back of the units before they are even installed to fix this. Does anyone know what that might be?


I too have commented of a low rumble since my 52I install last March.  I think It is the exhaust blower as I can still hear it when the blower fan shuts off. Your insert looks great also!


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## rob.mwpropane (Apr 16, 2014)

Thanks for the compliment. My friend said it had something to do with the air intake, so if by exhaust blower/combustion blower than yes. I'm not sure, I text him earlier about details or part number, but haven't heard back...


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## Big papa (May 4, 2014)

Hey all I'm new also had a question concerning how the floor tile meeting up with the bricks of fire place floor there's a1/4 difference the bricks are higher than floor tile will there be a problem installing a new harman accentra 52i or is this ok


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## rob.mwpropane (Apr 4, 2016)

OK guys, stoves been running for 2 seasons now. Works great! So far I've had to replace the combustion blower (under warranty) bad bearings, but other than that lots of heat.

I've tried searching but I have a rumble, flutter, vibration noise when running (intermittent, like 35-40% of the time). The best thing I can relate it to would be a car with only 1 window down driving down the highway. That flutter in your ears. It is intermittent, but when it happens the flame moves to the sound....looks like a flutter.

Anyone have any insight?


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## Peterfield (Apr 4, 2016)

That's the famous Harman freight train.  Don't know why it happens but several posts from users who experience it.  I also had to replace the combustion blower under warranty.


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## rob.mwpropane (Apr 4, 2016)

It stops 100% if I even slightly open the door or the hopper. I'm assuming no one's found a fix? It's annoying when it happens.


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## BrotherBart (Apr 4, 2016)

Don't have a Harman, but you could have gotten the rumble for two grand less.  Happens with my Englander 25-PDVC too.


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## pelleteer (Apr 4, 2016)

To me that sounds like a choked engine. Like a poorly tuned carb.  I don't know why it would be reverberating so much with an insulated flue.  Another telling part is when you open the door it goes away immediately.  

I don't have an outside air kit on mine.  Initially I had vibration issues from something behind the combustion blower and it seems from the cradle frame against the hearth.  

Have you tried running the unit without OAK connected?  If that does works you may need to adjust your OAK somehow to get more air.

Sorry to hear about the combustion fans dying early how long is the warranty?  What symptoms were there?


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## rob.mwpropane (Apr 5, 2016)

Here are my thoughts; 

1.) When I installed mine I used leftover 4" intake for the oak as opposed to the 3" the manual calls for. I need to replace with 3", and have been told to run it at least 6' up into the chimney. 

2.) I've read that the draft needs to be set with a gauge to I believe between -25 and -35 (page 27 in the manual. I have not been able to find this port, but haven't made it a big priority yet. My "rumble" problem is more persistent at idle, or low draft. 

...So I think I have enough air, maybe too much. 

I don't know how long the warranty is. It started making a "hum" whenever it was on. I knew it had to be the combustion motor after listening to it for a while because that was the only thing running. It had bad bearings, and besides the noise the stove worked fine when in use, right up to the day I replaced it.


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## rob.mwpropane (Apr 5, 2016)

Ok, so I can't find the draft meter bolt hole location. Seems there's 2 different install manuals for the 52i???

It states "The head of the Draft bolt can be accessed from inside the firebox
on the left hand side."

...anyone have a picture of where that is?


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## pelleteer (Apr 5, 2016)

rob.mwpropane said:


> Here are my thoughts;
> 
> 1.) When I installed mine I used leftover 4" intake for the oak as opposed to the 3" the manual calls for. I need to replace with 3", and have been told to run it at least 6' up into the chimney.
> 
> ...




I am no expert it was just a thought.  Perhaps it is the other end is there any obstruction?  That points to the back draft door opening and closing. 

Does smoke come in your house(more than you think would) when you open the door?

Either way it looks like you are on the right track with the heliometrics stuff.  I am not sure where the opening is.


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## Rock Crusher (Apr 5, 2016)

The bolt in question is located in the front left corner looking at the stove.  It is under the ash pan, believe it is a 3/8" coarse bolt-9/16" head.


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## rob.mwpropane (Apr 6, 2016)

pelleteer said:


> I am no expert it was just a thought.  Perhaps it is the other end is there any obstruction?  That points to the back draft door opening and closing.
> 
> Does smoke come in your house(more than you think would) when you open the door?



No obstruction, cleaned regularly flu and all. No smoke has ever backed into the room, door or hopper open. I've even accidentally left the hopper open one night and had no issues. I read when cleaning to put in "test" to draw up any soot. Works great.



Rock Crusher said:


> The bolt in question is located in the front left corner looking at the stove.  It is under the ash pan, believe it is a 3/8" coarse bolt-9/16" head.



Is this on the inside of the stove, like open the door to get to it, or behind the bottom "molding?" that you have to remove to pull the stove out? Any chance you have a picture, cause I'm feeling stupid/blind at the moment....


Thanks guys!


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## corkman (Apr 6, 2016)

rob.mwpropane said:


> No obstruction, cleaned regularly flu and all. No smoke has ever backed into the room, door or hopper open. I've even accidentally left the hopper open one night and had no issues. I read when cleaning to put in "test" to draw up any soot. Works great.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Open the door and remove the ash pan. See bolt in stove floor


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## rob.mwpropane (Apr 7, 2016)

corkman said:


> Open the door and remove the ash pan. See bolt in stove floor



Do you run the test with the door open?

Edit: I just re-read the instructions, I see the door needs to be closed. What am I supposed to do, look at the gauge through the glass? That seems like a bad design. All the appliances I've ever worked on (gas) had the port on the outside.


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## corkman (Apr 7, 2016)

Remove cast trim at bottom of stove and somehow get the adapter at the end of the hose into the test port. Door closed while running in test mode. I've never done it myself. I just picked up a used accentra insert and saw where it was while pulling stove apart. I'd love to see a pic or 2 of what people use as an adapter to do this. I may be at my dealer today snd if so I will ask


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## rob.mwpropane (Apr 7, 2016)

corkman said:


> Remove cast trim at bottom of stove and somehow get the adapter at the end of the hose into the test port. Door closed while running in test mode. I've never done it myself. I just picked up a used accentra insert and saw where it was while pulling stove apart. I'd love to see a pic or 2 of what people use as an adapter to do this. I may be at my dealer today snd if so I will ask



I pulled the trim, it's currently running so I didn't remove the ash pan. I don't see why removing trim would have anything to do with it? I see nothing. I'm thinking once I remove the pan I might, but I'm still not understanding the procedure for this test.


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## corkman (Apr 7, 2016)

rob.mwpropane said:


> I pulled the trim, it's currently running so I didn't remove the ash pan. I don't see why removing trim would have anything to do with it? I see nothing. I'm thinking once I remove the pan I might, but I'm still not understanding the procedure for this test.


Yes it's under the pan


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## rob.mwpropane (Nov 7, 2016)

Sorry to bring up my old thread, wanted to post some things after having the stove for 2 or so years.

1.) It seems the rumble that I had before is gone. I've had the stove running for a week or so now, haven't heard it once. I did two things so I'm not sure what the fix was. I cleaned the flu for the first time (and it needed it more than I thought it would), and I changed out the leftover 4" SS flu that I used for the outside air intake for a 3" piece of white PVC that just goes 4' or so past the stove and into the chimney above the insulation / top plate. No more rumble. I f it comes back, I'll know it's from cleaning the flu.

2.) Last year I replaced the combustion blower under warranty, and go figure, when I start the stove up this year the combustion blower is pretty loud again. I'm A.) hoping it's still under warranty, and B.) getting them to come replace it this time. It didn't take that long to replace last year, but now it's just the principal. I JUST changed it, I bet this one's not even a year old.

Edit: 3.) I connected it to the thermostat that used to go to the oil boiler. Hopefully save some pellets and it's really nice being able to hit the thermostat for more heat, instead of bending down to play with the knob to find the sweet spot. I don't think I've opened the side panel on the stove unless to turn it off. Plus, no more forgetting to turn the stove down at night, and it's warm when I get up in the morning.


Has anyone else had there combustion motor's bearings go out that fast? I mean, I don't even think I've got a full year out of this one ~ 3-4 months of run time last season?


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## Peterfield (Nov 7, 2016)

I had the combustion blower bearings squeal within two months of installation.  Dealer came out and swapped out the blower and problem solved.


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## rob.mwpropane (Nov 8, 2016)

Peterfield said:


> I had the combustion blower bearings squeal within two months of installation.  Dealer came out and swapped out the blower and problem solved.



     Thanks, at least I know I'm not crazy. I wonder if they just use crap bearings, or maybe the heat gets to them? I looked it up, I installed this blower in Jan of this year. I could of waited for the warranty guy, but he was 3 weeks out. If I can't get it replaced, I'm going to change the bearings with something heavy duty.

     On another note, I added something else to my post up top that I did to the stove as well. Connected it to the the thermostat. So far, I really like it. This way if I forget to turn the stove down at night, I'm not out of pellets in the morning. My hopes are that it will save some pellets this year.


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## Peterfield (Nov 8, 2016)

rob.mwpropane said:


> Thanks, at least I know I'm not crazy. I wonder if they just use crap bearings, or maybe the heat gets to them? I looked it up, I installed this blower in Jan of this year. I could of waited for the warranty guy, but he was 3 weeks out. If I can't get it replaced, I'm going to change the bearings with something heavy duty.
> 
> On another note, I added something else to my post up top that I did to the stove as well. Connected it to the the thermostat. So far, I really like it. This way if I forget to turn the stove down at night, I'm not out of pellets in the morning. My hopes are that it will save some pellets this year.



FWIW, the replacement combustion blower has been running fine for two years.  It's an easy install so if you're comfortable doing that, remove the blower and bring it to the dealer for replacement.


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## rob.mwpropane (Nov 8, 2016)

Peterfield said:


> FWIW, the replacement combustion blower has been running fine for two years.  It's an easy install so if you're comfortable doing that, remove the blower and bring it to the dealer for replacement.



Well...as per the post above, I did replace the blower already. I bought this stove the beginning of 2014, and the first combustion blower went out Dec of last year (2015). I contacted the dealer, and they were 3 weeks out for repairs, so I removed the blower, exchanged it with them and replaced it myself (no cost, under warranty). Now this combustion blower bearings are going again. The blower itself works fine.


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## Mt Bob (Nov 8, 2016)

Well sorry about your problem,but,in my opinion,is rare.Even with harman suppliers of the motor,I really cannot say anything bad,mostly very high quality,from what I have seen,but problems of this sort seem to rear there head mostly in fireplace installs.Depending on design/airflow,basement-foundation,you may have a moisture thing happening,affecting the brgs/and seals.Have never put brgs in a harman combustion motor,but have at least one in parts box,if you want me to take it apart and measure brgs,let me know.


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## rob.mwpropane (Nov 8, 2016)

bob bare said:


> Well sorry about your problem,but,in my opinion,is rare.Even with harman suppliers of the motor,I really cannot say anything bad,mostly very high quality,from what I have seen,but problems of this sort seem to rear there head mostly in fireplace installs.Depending on design/airflow,basement-foundation,you may have a moisture thing happening,affecting the brgs/and seals.Have never put brgs in a harman combustion motor,but have at least one in parts box,if you want me to take it apart and measure brgs,let me know.



     I appreciate your offer, may take you up on it depending on what the dealer does. I agree about everything being top notch, nothing else with the stove has been an issue. Flawless. I also thought maybe a moisture problem, but I have the top plate sealed with heavy roxul insulation over top. And the combustion blower is the only thing to go, both distribution fans are perfect. No surface rust on anything, not damp at all.

     I'm really hoping I'm just unlucky and it's a fluke. I shouldn't have to change the bearings, but at some point the dealer isn't going to cover it anymore (she was pretty skeptical on the phone today). I'm not even 100% they'll stand behind this.

     Except for the higher than acceptable hum, the stove runs perfect.


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## Mt Bob (Nov 8, 2016)

rob.mwpropane said:


> I appreciate your offer, may take you up on it depending on what the dealer does. I agree about everything being top notch, nothing else with the stove has been an issue. Flawless. I also thought maybe a moisture problem, but I have the top plate sealed with heavy roxul insulation over top. And the combustion blower is the only thing to go, both distribution fans are perfect. No surface rust on anything, not damp at all.
> 
> I'm really hoping I'm just unlucky and it's a fluke. I shouldn't have to change the bearings, but at some point the dealer isn't going to cover it anymore (she was pretty skeptical on the phone today). I'm not even 100% they'll stand behind this.
> 
> Except for the higher than acceptable hum, the stove runs perfect.


Do not want to go there,my accentra is very quiet,BUT my austroflamm is extremely quiet,but much older!LOL


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## rob.mwpropane (Nov 9, 2016)

bob bare said:


> Do not want to go there,my accentra is very quiet,BUT my austroflamm is extremely quiet,but much older!LOL



Well, my insert used to be quiet The pictures that I posted in the install are of it directly next to the TV, and we don't have any issues at all. Sometimes I turn the distribution blower down some, but other than the stray pellet getting crunched everything is (was) very quiet.


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## rob.mwpropane (Nov 10, 2016)

Well....no such dice. They won't stand behind the stove, won't stand behind the combustion blower So now I'm in for either a replacement motor, or replacing the bearings. 

Funny, Amazon sells the same combustion blower with a 1 year warranty. 

I thought there was a thread somewhere on here about replacing the bearings?


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## rob.mwpropane (Nov 10, 2016)

I got a new oem replacement blower from ebay for $78.00 shipped. Will still replace the bearings from the other motor, that way I can swap when needed. 

bob bare - any idea on the size of those bearings? Or anyone?, I swear I saw a thread when I was going through this last year....


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