# Lil House Outside wood furnace Anybody know about this?



## elkimmeg (Jan 1, 2006)

Cheaper than many wood stoves a furnace that can heat an entire house? What do you think? anybody have any experience using one or know of them in use?

http://page.auctions.yahoo.com/auction/94778134


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## BrotherBart (Jan 1, 2006)

elkimmeg said:
			
		

> Cheaper than many wood stoves a furnace that can heat an entire house? What do you think? anybody have any experience using one or know of them in use?
> 
> http://page.auctions.yahoo.com/auction/94778134



Don't have one or know anybody that does Elk but here are a lot of pictures of it:

http://www.outsidewoodheater.com/page5.html


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## wg_bent (Jan 1, 2006)

Looks like it could be much more efficient and less polluting than an outside wood boiler.   half a chance to get firebox temps up to what an epa wood stove could do.

Is that a barrel in there??

Looks like a similar concept to the Englander indoor furnace that HomeDepot sells.


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## begreen (Jan 1, 2006)

Looks like a small drum heater with an insulated surround and a grainger squirrel cage blower.  AFAICS, no safety systems at all. I wouldn't want this blowing into my home. 

http://www.backwoodshome.com/articles2/lee90.html


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## webbie (Jan 1, 2006)

BeGreen said:
			
		

> Looks like a small drum heater with an insulated surround and a grainger squirrel cage blower.  AFAICS, no safety systems at all. I wouldn't want this blowing into my home.
> 
> http://www.backwoodshome.com/articles2/lee90.html



I like the ad that showed up at the bottom of that article...

It was like a windoz error box, but said something like:

Error - Buy Rural Land

Your life has become corrupted by pavement, pollution and irritating urban personalities.



Ha Ha.......

If nothing else that article shows that freedom still rings in the heartland!


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## BrotherBart (Jan 1, 2006)

What it looks like to me is the ideal garage or shop heater.


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## begreen (Jan 1, 2006)

LOL. Yes, you have to admire the spirit of the fellow. Funny how these OWBs show up around folks trying to get away from urban pollution and irritated downwind neighbors.


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## wg_bent (Jan 1, 2006)

BrotherBart said:
			
		

> What it looks like to me is the ideal garage or shop heater.



For a workshop heater, I like the looks of one of these:

http://mha-net.org/docs/v8n2/wildac04a.htm

It just looks simple and I'll bet it runs pretty clean.  You could even get creative in building an insulated shroud around it so that it could be outside the shop and channel head into the shop just like the subject heater does.

I do wonder where they got clay tiles that big though.


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## Rob From Wisconsin (Jan 2, 2006)

I've seen info on these before.
Heat transfer via an "Air Plenum".
Better be a very short run to the house,
otherwise the heat loss must be huge!!
This is one area where the boilers would have
the definite advantage - water retains heat better.

Rob


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## Michael6268 (Jan 3, 2006)

I might still be under the influence of New Years eve beverages but call me crazy, this looks to me like it might work!   Depending on how well insulated the inside is and I would think that more insulation on the heated air duct into the house would definetely help, but after watching the video on his site, it seems to work!    He is located in misouri though, not sure how it would work in colder climates.....


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## Eric Johnson (Jan 3, 2006)

It doesn't look particularly well designed or constructed to me. Notice the Dayton blower connection--no gaskets or even a flat surface for a secure mount. The guy's got photos of just about everything except what I would like to know about, such as grates, bypass dampers, etc. Probably cause there ain't none. Nice photos of the $5 air vents and the $1 steel junction box, though.  And, to second what Rob pointed out, it should probably be in or attached to the building you're trying to heat, which would sort of defeat the main selling point.


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## SeanD (Jan 3, 2006)

As Warren observed, this is very similar to the Englander 28-3500 I bought from Home Depot.  The big difference being the Englander stove is in the basement while the Lil'house is outside.
No matter how well insulated the duct is from the stove into the house, this stove has to be very inefficient in that it is heating outside air to be blown into the house.  The blower takes outside air and pushes it into the plenum and from there into the house.  On a 20F day the Lil'house would have to raise airtemp by 50F to do any good.  The Englander (or any inside furnace) only has to warm 60F basement air 10 degrees.
Final point - the Englander recirculates air in the house.  Lil'house forces air into the house with no cold air return.  I guess you have to leave a window open to equalize the pressure.


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## wg_bent (Jan 3, 2006)

SeanD said:
			
		

> As Warren observed, this is very similar to the Englander 28-3500 I bought from Home Depot.  The big difference being the Englander stove is in the basement while the Lil'house is outside.
> No matter how well insulated the duct is from the stove into the house, this stove has to be very inefficient in that it is heating outside air to be blown into the house.  The blower takes outside air and pushes it into the plenum and from there into the house.  On a 20F day the Lil'house would have to raise airtemp by 50F to do any good.  The Englander (or any inside furnace) only has to warm 60F basement air 10 degrees.
> Final point - the Englander recirculates air in the house.  Lil'house forces air into the house with no cold air return.  I guess you have to leave a window open to equalize the pressure.



The final picture shown in the second post, shows the return, so no, it's not trying to heat outside air as the first picture seems to show.  Still, it would seem that large amounts of insulation would be prudent.


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## farmerscotty (Mar 10, 2007)

Hi all!

I just read thru the posts.......


The heat duct is insulated just like the heater.......IT will HAVE snow on it in the winter with a fire in it.......very well insulated.  

Not the most complicated heater made for sure, but it is simple, cheap, and it works.

The cold air you are heating up for the house is from the house itself.

Not cold air from outside the house.

You need cold air returns located as far away from the heater as possible to "draw" the heat thru the house.

Yes it is a 55 gal. 16 gauge drum,  since the firebox is round it heats evenly and won't burn out.

Yes it will eventually rust out......life expectancy is anywhere from 3 or 4 years to 10 years....it depends solely on the owners maintence of the unit.

Been manufactured in a "real business" for over 20 years.

You need to look over the website and read it to understand how it works.  

It is different from many heaters and people get confused about how it works.

Is it for everyone????? NO

Is it something that works and insurable?   YES

I just wanted to give the straight facts so people know what it is.

Scott Bradley
www.outsidewoodheater.com

if you have questions about the Lil'house heater just go to the website and contact me direct.


Thanks.....have a great day!


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## elkimmeg (Mar 10, 2007)

Is it Epa approved can it burn green wood?  what is the average grams per hour emittances?

 I looked at the installation pictures  some show the owners using common r4.2 flex duct outside?
 others have zero insulation on exposed outside ducts?.

Tell me how can one install an appliance that is not labled or listed I think there are codes that govern this all appliances must be tested labled and listed.

so how can one be installed? ARe you advising all to void their insurance policies and  not pull permits. How does one inspect an unlisted appliance?

  How can one  issue a permit for an unlisted appliance?


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## ernie (Mar 10, 2007)

Our business also sells this unit. Yes it is economically made. Sells for $1395.00. You would kind of consider this unit like the "window air conditioner" of out side wood furnaces. We sell a lot of them in Missouri. We have had very good feedback on the unit. It can be rebuilt by the customer at a later date if needed. They dont hook into the hot air duct work like other units on the market but blow the heat dirctly in. It actually works better than putting the heat into a long duct run. It uses the return air to help draw the air thru the house rather than blowing it thru. 
You can see our store at 
www.hechlers.com

ernie


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## restorer (Mar 10, 2007)

Welcome Scott and Ernie to the hearth. I read the info on Ernie's site and was impressed to say the least. This is not the typical OWB we discuss on this forum. The greenwood boilers are smoking dragons, where this seems to more like a remote placed wood stove. It obviously is not for all applications, but does seem to have a place. 

Hope we can have an educating discussion.


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## Michael6268 (Mar 10, 2007)

Wouldnt these fall into the catagory of "furnaces" and therefore be EPA exempt?


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## farmerscotty (Mar 10, 2007)

Thanks for letting us educate about the Lil house heater.

Any furnace, heater , stove that burns green wood is wasting someones time and money since it is full of water and takes much more heat to burn and that heat is wasted.

We recommend DRY WOOD..............less smoke,  and more heat in the house.

Scott

www.outsidewoodheater.com


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## WarmGuy (Mar 11, 2007)

What are the advantages over an interior wood stove?  Installation and space issues?

I'd think the disadvantages of having to go outside in the rain/snow/cold to add wood, and not being able to see the fire from the couch would outweigh those.


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## farmerscotty (Mar 11, 2007)

house is cleaner, less carrying of wood, more space in the house..........you are mainly loading it 2x a day so going outside is no big deal to me.  I like the idea of not handling the wood as much.  Seeing the fire is just that........seeing.........remember in one of my posts........not for everyone.   Many people go with this if they have a bad chimney since it will cost more to replace chimney than the unit does.  No smoke, no mess in the house too.

Scott


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## elkimmeg (Mar 11, 2007)

farmer how do you you avoid the permitting issues How do you avoid labeling and listings  Have you read the international mechanical codes?
 Do you know all states have adopted them? Is not you boiler/furnace not part of the heating system and part of the mechanical system?

 How do you avoid the solid fuel affdavit required with all solid fuel burning appliances?

 you know I have read the codes many many times and never seen you appliance listed as an exemption?


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## farmerscotty (Mar 11, 2007)

That is something that would need to be asked of the factory.  Remember this is not a boiler, lots of permits and codes are directed at the boiler units.  Very few companies build units that are just forced air heat.  I will check into this, but I am sure after over 20 years of manufacturing and insurance companies insuring if it was not I would have heard about it by now.  Remember I am just a dealer not the manufacturer.   I know that I have heard the manufacturer talk of us being exempt, from what I don't know.  I have not concerned myself with that end of the business.

thanks

Scott

www.outsidewoodheater.com


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## Gooserider (Mar 13, 2007)

I scanned the site, and was kind of amused by the description of their air inlet system - it sounds JUST LIKE the air inlets on BOTH my smoke dragons....  It works, but it isn't anything the EPA would love.

 Gooserider


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## Michael6268 (Mar 14, 2007)

As I stated earlier, im pretty sure this is considered a wood furnace, and it epa exempt.


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## Jimbob (Mar 13, 2008)

Insurance companies might like it better than an un-certified wood stove installed INSIDE the house. He does mention combustion air being pre-heated, so it might not burn as dirty as some people think.
I'll give him credit, at least he doesn't claim it will burn green wood.


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