# Just Another Small Shed... w/pics



## Battenkiller (Jun 9, 2010)

My old storage shed finally collapsed this winter.  I tore it down and cut it up into burnable pieces with a Sawzall.  Then I went to HD and Lowes to shop for a new shed.  What garbage!  Cheapest tool shed was an 8x10' metal piece of crapola for $400, and I was told it would take all day to put it together.  The wood ones were even worse, and were well over a grand.  I would expect 2-3 years tops out of one of those cheap wood ones, and the better wood sheds were over two grand, and even they had flimsy 2x4 trusses and 2x3 studs.  The only well made shed on the lot (i.e. had real trusses, 2x4 studs, and an actual header over the door) was $3400!  I decided I'd have to build my own if I wanted to have it last.   

I looked at several free plans on the Internet, but they were all too elaborate and the BOMs were $$$.  I never built a pole structure before, but living in farm country, they're all over the place. Then I saw PapaDave's mini pole barn and got inspired to do the same thing at my place, but with some easy to do mods that would give more rain coverage.  Seemed like a cheap and easy way to make a shed.  Turns out that nothing today is cheap, and having to hand dig those 42" deep holes ain't so easy.  

It took all afternoon for my son and I to lay out and dig nine holes, and our shoulders were aching at the end of the day.  At about 12" deep we hit rocks on every hole.  It was like the glaciers that deposited everything here had a thin schmear of rocks that got swept along as they passed.  I'd say, "I think we got a clean one, Curt", then that terrible scraping sound of metal on rock.  A couple of them took half an hour to pry out of the ground, but we weren't going to let a 30# boulder get in the way of two he-men.  We tossed a 30# bag of Quickrete in each hole, tamped it down and let it sit for a couple days to harden with ground water. This gave me a real solid footing below the frost line without having to pay for three times as much for concrete to completely fill the holes.  I would set the posts on the footings, then back fill with dirt to hold them in place.

The next week I started early in the AM one day and worked until almost dark.  I used bar clamps to hold the 2x4 girts to the posts.  Once they were plumb and square to each other, I used deck screws to hold everything in place.  Then I figure out the pitch and marked the bottoms of the header plate locations.  I used doubled 2x6s along the back (4' span between posts) and doubled 2x8s along the front (6' span).  I was working alone, so I put them up one at a time with deck screws.  After they were all in place and nailed together, I drill out the plates for four 6" galvanized spikes to go into each post.  Even with a pilot hole, I had to use a 2# sledge to drive then in.  Wouldn't want to have to do that all day.

When Lady BK got home from work, we ate a quick dinner and she came out and helped me put up the rafters.  We measured and cut the bird's mouths with a sliding bevel since I never did learn how to use a framing square, then I cut them out by hand with my Japanese ryoba saw.  It was faster than picking up the circ saw every time for these little cuts, and the fit was much better.  We used metal rafter ties to hold them in place instead of toe-nailing them.  Keeps them in place and prevents the roof from ever blowing off.

End of day 1... the framing on my 8' x 12' shed was done (minus one rafter and the side girts), and I was beat. More to come...


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## smokinj (Jun 9, 2010)

Great start!


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## mayhem (Jun 9, 2010)

Sweet!  Been looking at pole barn structures alot lately to help resolve my ever growing storage problems (not just for wood...yard tools, mower, snowblowers, plow, classic car undergoing restoration...too much sprawl).  

Following your build with interest.

I really like your footing idea.  I may have access to a mini-excavator when I build so my inevitable rocks will be alot easier to deal with then yours.


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## mainstation (Jun 9, 2010)

12" deep footings for a Wood Shed?  That's hardcore.


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## Battenkiller (Jun 9, 2010)

mainstation said:
			
		

> 12" deep footings for a Wood Shed?  That's hardcore.



Well, I shoulda done my math.  I could have used half a bag in each hole and it would have been more than enough and the posts would be 6" deeper in the ground then they are.  Plus, I bought all 10' posts instead of (much cheaper) 8 footers because I neglected to account for _any_ of the concrete, so I had to lop off 3' from the 4 rear posts.  Live and learn.


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## PapaDave (Jun 10, 2010)

Hey BK, nice start! What do you plan for the roof? Keep the pics coming, too.
Still working on mine. Life keeps getting in the way. :coolsmile: 
Did a little more today, then my brother showed up and we went to check on a new jobsite, came home, then went back out and got a bunch more boards put in the shop to mill up as siding. 
The rain started just as I was putting up the second board of the day, so...........I guess tomorrow's another day. Except, we need to go get some hay for the animals, and some more 3x5 landscape things so I can get the rest of my pallets made.


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## Battenkiller (Jun 10, 2010)

PapaDave said:
			
		

> Hey BK, nice start! What do you plan for the roof? Keep the pics coming, too.



Well, actually, most of the work is already done.  I started shortly after I saw your shed on the forum here.  Didn't have time to post about it until today.  Like you said, life gets in the way.  Just got all the pics together, so I'll post a few more and describe the methods I used.  First outbuilding project for me (not counting decks), so my methods may be unorthodox, but they got a good shed built.


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## golfandwoodnut (Jun 10, 2010)

Looks good, you probably could have gotten away with fewer posts. We have to go down 3 feet, atleast for code around here.  I feel pretty good at 30 inches.  On a deck you usually only put posts every 8 to ten feet.  One thing I have found with concrete is that you can just put it dry in the hole like you did, then tamp it down with the post to get a flat surface then fill it up.  No need for water, or waiting, believe me it will harden up.  A builder showed me that trick, I used to always put the post in and pour wet concrete in the hole.  Keep the pictures coming.


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## wood spliter (Jun 10, 2010)

Great start! can't wait to see the finished product.


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## savageactor7 (Jun 10, 2010)

Holy cow 42" down for each post...that is severely hard core. Good job so for Bk no way the frost line will affect that shed. You're absolutely correct about those prefab sheds being unworthy...what junk. Looking forward to any progress.


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## LLigetfa (Jun 10, 2010)

The frost doesn't have to get under the posts to jack them.  It can jack them them by grabbing the sides.  Wrapping layers of 6 mil poly around them can help reduce frost jacking from the side.

My posts have jacked up a foot.  Too bad I didn't know about the poly trick when I built it.


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## Cowboy Billy (Jun 10, 2010)

Lookin Good!

We just had a pole barn put up. What they did to tie the trusses to the header (and you could do the same for the rafter) Was to put one header on the inside of the pole and the other on the outside. Then they measured out where the trusses went and marked it and put short 2x4 sticking upright between the header and nailed it in. When they put the truss on they butted it to the 2x4 and side nailed it.

Hopefully by the end of the year I will catch up with you and have a wood shed up too!

Billy


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## Battenkiller (Jun 10, 2010)

savageactor7 said:
			
		

> Holy cow 42" down for each post...that is severely hard core. Good job so for Bk no way the frost line will affect that shed. You're absolutely correct about those prefab sheds being unworthy...what junk. Looking forward to any progress.



Sorry, a little inaccuracy in my reporting.  We dug the holes over a month ago, and my memory was faulty.  Now that I think about it, we didn't go down that far.  That was the _recommended_ depth in my area.  At 36" I joked about global warming making it unlikely that this shed will ever see a 42" frost depth, so we stopped there.  The posts are sitting on 12" thick footings set 24" below the surface.  How this will play out over time is anyone's guess.  Seems less depth on top of a secure footing will lessen the "side grab" that LL refers to. Thankfully, we won't be living in it.  Well, at least Lady BK won't, but she may ask me to stay in it from time to time.  It's better than the doghouse.  I think I'll call it "Man Cave #5".


I don't know what you call this type of roof, but it is seen on Adirondack lean-tos, and it is real nice to get some extra coverage from the elements.  It extends about 40" from the front header, making the shed about 11' deep instead of the 8' it would have without it.  It is a short span, so I used 2x4s for the bottom chords and rafters.  I set the outer bottom chords with a framing square and a line level, then held them up with hurricane ties in front and a single deck screw in the back.  I ran a string across the outer chords and attached all the inner ones to just touch the string.  A glued and nailed 1/2" plywood gusset will go on each chord/rafter junction to strengthen and triangulate it.  The 2x4 rafters are held to the main rafters and bottom chords with 3/8" carriage bolts.   I used string to set them as well.  Small bars clamps held them in place, then I drilled the holes for the carriage bolts and installed the bolts while the clamps were still attached.  Then I cut off the surplus wood from the main rafters with a Sawzall.

You can now see my choice of roofing material - .029" galvanized metal over wood purlins.  This stuff ain't fancy, but it doesn't hold a snow load for long before it slides right off.  This was important to me since the old shed roof gave way this winter under that first heavy snow we had.  I only have a 3 pitch on this roof, so I wanted to make sure nothing ever happens to it.  I was going to go with brick red, but the galvalume was $80 less, so I cheaped out.  It was $225 as it was, the most expensive part of the shed.  The ridge cap was over $20 for a 10' length, and I needed a little extra so I had to buy two.  I used cheap 8' 2x3s for purlins, staggering the lengths between the two center rafters.  I used 10d hot dipped ring nails to attach the purlins to the rafters.  Then I struck a chalk line on the bottoms of the purlins and cut them to the line with a Sawzall.




















Here's Lady BK doing her tomboy thing, drilling the pilot holes for the roof fasteners.  I made a makeshift sled out of scrap so she could be comfortable scooting around up there.  I let her use one of my favorite tools, my offset Sioux corded drill, the perfect tool for something like this.  By pre-drilling instead of pushing self-tapping screws into the metal, she was able to do the whole thing in about an hour with my help at the bottom.  Her real name is Rose, so she's earned the nickname "Rosie the Riveter".

















Here's the finished roof.  Don't look too bad IMO.  A shot inside shows the gap left for ventilation, over which the ridge cap will eventually get screwed.














I was going to take the cheap and easy route and cover it with T-111, but 5/8" T-111 was $30 a sheet.  I needed 7 sheets, so that was $210.  The 3/8" stuff that was on my old shed was like tissue paper when we sawed it off, so I didn't want to go that route.  I always wanted to do a traditional board and batten siding, so that's what I went with.  Two mills in my area sell rough sawn pine for 50 cents a board foot.  I used 1 x 10" boards with 1 x 2 3/4" battens that I ripped on my band saw.  Boards were nailed to the girt on one edge only, two hot dipped 8d spiral nails to a each girt.  We drilled pilot holes through the battens and used two 16d spiral nails at each girt to hold down both the batten and the other side on the board.  This method allows one side of each board to "float" under the batten, shrinking and swelling with the seasons without cracking or buckling.  We'll see.  All told, I used 3# of 8d nails and 5# of 16d nails.  That's a lot more pounding than the T-111 would have been, but the result is way better.


Here's a shot of the shed as it sits now.  Haven't figured out how to do the trim yet.  There will be a fascia board across the front, and I will continue the board and batten treatment below the peak.  I should have nailed a fascia along the sides of the purlins before I attached the roofing, so now I will have to saw off about a inch from the end of each one so the board can sit under the roofing. Those header ends sticking out well past the side are going to complicate things. I'll probably just cut them off flush with the rafters.  I won't be putting soffits on because I want all the through ventilation I can get.  One of the things this shed will be used for is to contain my blacksmithing forge.  I need the smoke to get up and out of there.


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## smokinj (Jun 10, 2010)

Battenkiller said:
			
		

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Nice Work!


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## daveswoodhauler (Jun 10, 2010)

Nice Shed. Exactly what I have been meaning to build. Thanks for the post


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## prairiefire (Jun 11, 2010)

very nice work, i like the overhang on the front so much i may add one to my shed. thanks for the pics!


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## golfandwoodnut (Jun 11, 2010)

nice helper.


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## Battenkiller (Jun 11, 2010)

GolfandWoodNut said:
			
		

> nice helper.



 :lol: 

Yeah, and she knows it, too!

She showed up at my door 31 years ago with a "Will Work For Food" sign in her hands.  I never could turn down a stray.  It's worked out pretty good.  She does most of the work, I cook the food.


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## LLigetfa (Jun 11, 2010)

Battenkiller said:
			
		

> She showed up at my door *31 years ago*...


Either you're a cradle robber or she ages really well.  Must be nice to get help like that.  My wife helped me build our house but she retired after that.  She comes out of retirement for house reno projects only.


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## Battenkiller (Jun 11, 2010)

LLigetfa said:
			
		

> Either you're a cradle robber or she ages really well.



Maybe a little of both.   ;-) 


Ever hear the old 30s Western swing tune, "Mama's Getting Younger, Papa's Getting Older Each Day"?  Her dad was still looking good when he died in his 80s and his sister Irma was a looker (considering) when she died at 94, so I guess it's all in her jeans.  Er... I mean _genes_. :coolsmile: 

She'll be 50 in August, but you'd never know.  That's her natural hair color, looks good even in the sunlight.  I did catch a few gray hairs peaking out yesterday, though.  When I told her, she says, "Well, pull 'em _out_!"  I told her if she keeps doing that she'll be both bald _and_ gray... just like me.

Yeah, she's a keeper.  Helps with just about anything I ask, 'cept she has to do it her way... which is usually better than my way, so I don't complain.



Anyway, back to the shed....

If I had it to do all over again, I would have made it 16' wide.  Because of the way the metal roofing comes (39" wide with a 3" overlap), I could have had a whole other 4' of roof for $20.  Could have spaced out the posts a bit, went with doubled 2x10 headers and gotten an extra 33% space for the cost of the roofing and three 10' rough sawn planks cut in half for the back.  Wasn't planning on metal roofing in the beginning, so 20/20 hindsight is all I have.

Next on the list is a small potting shed (4' x 8') for Lady BK's gardening needs.  That'll reclaim those lost 32 sq. ft and get all her dang forks, shovels, trowels, pots and fertilizers out on my "Man Toy" shed.  With rough sawn hemlock posts set on concrete blocks, some of the recycled lumber from the old shed, one of the roofing cut-offs and the leftover fasteners from the new one, it should be doable for under $100.  The big shed cost me $700.


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## begreen (Jun 11, 2010)

Very nice job, both of you deserve a pat on the back. We are a lucky men Bk. My wife has never been up on the roof, but she sure can cook!


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## Battenkiller (Jun 11, 2010)

BeGreen said:
			
		

> We are a lucky men Bk. My wife has never been up on the roof, but she sure can cook!



My gal can really cook as well...

... but she has no talent in the kitchen. :cheese:


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## savageactor7 (Jun 12, 2010)

Nice trim!


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## Battenkiller (Jun 12, 2010)

savageactor7 said:
			
		

> Nice trim!



H-mmmm...

I started it with the "Hot Babes with Power Tools" shots, but let's not go beyond "trim", guys.  I _really_ don't want to sleep in that damn shed. :roll: 

Funny comment, though. :lol:


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## oldspark (Jun 12, 2010)

Battenkiller said:
			
		

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 All righty then!


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## begreen (Jun 12, 2010)

Battenkiller said:
			
		

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LOL :lol:


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## habsfan70 (Jun 15, 2010)

If my wife climbed up on that roof the whole thing would come crashing down!


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## treehackers (Jun 15, 2010)

habsfan70 said:
			
		

> If my wife climbed up on that roof the whole thing would come crashing down!



 :lol:


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## Battenkiller (Jul 13, 2010)

OK, everybody's cool wood shed postings got me out there with the camera for an update...


Finally, everything done but the trim work and staining.  As you can see, no room for wood in this shed.  But by tearing down the other dilapidated sheds I had, I now have room for about 20 cord of very well-spaced stacks outside in a prime windy area.  I'll never get close to that amount, but the wood that I do store won't be sticking out like a sore thumb anymore, so I'll be more inclined to keep collecting it.



Check out my home-built coal forge on the right.  Finally I have a home under cover for all the blacksmithing and metalworking stuff.  I'm gonna run a 100A electrical sub-feed to the shed.  That'll allow me to use both my stick and GMAC welders, as well as my oxy-acetylene torches, a small metal-cutting band saw and an extra compressor I had in storage in the basement.  I already have a collapsible cutting and welding bench stored outside the right side of the shed.  I'll be in pig heaven once I finally get through this very hectic week (oldest son's getting married on Saturday).










Here's a side view showing the roof extension and the board and batten siding.  I haven't quite figured out how to trim out the gable area and the purlins.  I was gonna leave them all exposed for extra ventilation, but the ridge cap should allow enough ventilation for the forge fumes, so now I want to go for a more finished look on the outside.  The truck box is gonna get raised up higher and attached to the side, then the saws and other valuable stuff are getting stored in the locked box.  If I get another full-size truck, I can just unbolt it and build a strong box in its place.









This closeup shows the glued and nailed gussets I finally put in.  I laid out the nailing pattern on the gusset to the far left, then drilled through several ones under it to get all the spacings right and even looking.  Made nailing them all in (best part of a 5 pound box of 2" common nails) a lot easier as well.

I have a tendency to do 95% of a job like this and forget to do the most important part.  Without these gussets, the whole roof extension is at risk for collapse during a heavy, wet snow like we had all last year.  I decided to put a big fan on myself in the 95º heat and get the damn things installed before I beat myself up once again and put them off until after the damage has occurred.









This is a shot of the small workbench I put in on the left side.  All my outside tools and boatbuilding tools are gonna be stored here.  The hand saws are from my deceased FILs tool shed.  I got a saw set, and I'm gonna learn to sharpen them while I'm learning to sharpen saw chains.  The bench will make working on saws and other outdoor equipment a pleasure.


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## LLigetfa (Jul 13, 2010)

Battenkiller said:
			
		

> This closeup shows the glued and nailed gussets I finally put in.


The nailing pattern is too consistent to have been done freehand.  You must have made a template.

Nice shed!


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