# Burning frozen wood...bad idea!



## Swedishchef (Jan 18, 2013)

Hey guys

Well it is cold as ......  -35C with the wind this evening. I noticed the wood that is in my basement (about 1 week's worth) was low on hardwood. So I went outside to my greenhouse (stash of wood) and brought in some maple.

Long story short is that I ended up putting the frozen stuff in the stove and not the thawed maple.

So for the first 15 minutes all I heard was HHHHHHHHHHHHHHIIIIIIIISSSSSSSSSSSSS.

Note to self: burning frozen wood is a PITA.

Andrew


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## mattjm1017 (Jan 18, 2013)

Holy frozen smoke -34c and im fussing about +34f!! I cant imagine how cold that is!!


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## bobabuoy (Jan 18, 2013)

Back in the days before I knew better, I would put wood that had snow on it into my stove! Doh!


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## ArsenalDon (Jan 19, 2013)

Burning previously snow covered wood I brought in tonight...but it is only 20 out...coldest it has been so far is -2...cannot imagine your cold....that is real cold.


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## Swedishchef (Jan 19, 2013)

lol. Lots of places in the US get the same cold as we are having where I currently live. It's a cold snap. It is not normal, on Sunday they are calling for +1C lol


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## Backwoods Savage (Jan 19, 2013)

Well that is the wind chill factor but what was the actual temperature.

We do not bring wood in the house to warm up before putting it into the stove no matter what the temperature outside is. The coldest we've had was -34 F and we had no problem. If the wood is dry there should be no problems.


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## Swedishchef (Jan 19, 2013)

Hey Dennis,

It was -25C without the wind. Still darn cold.

Unfortunately I don't understand something.... No matter how dry your wood is there will be some moisture right? From my understanding of thermodynamics, the temperature of the fire/wood will remain the same as water is changing phases. In this case there are 2 phase changes that must occur and not just one: from solid to liquid and then liquid to gas. However, this transition goes quickly. That is why I think I heard hissing. My wood is 3.5 years old. There is no way there was moisture in it. Some pieces that I had put near the stove to warm up did not hiss 4 hours later whatsoever. And some of these splits were the "other  half" of some splits that hissed...


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## Corey (Jan 20, 2013)

You are correct on the phase changes...you put energy in to warm ice to 0C, then you have to put energy into ice at 0C to get water at 0C, then you heat the water, then you put energy into the water at 100C to get steam at 100C.  'Latent heat of fusion' for the ice/water transition and latent heat of vaporization for the water>steam transition.  Though the end result is the same either way...if you have 16% MC, it is the same amount of steam if you start at -100C or 0C. 

I wonder if the hissing you heard might have been due to the air in the log expanding?  Going from -30ish to firebox temps is going to be quite a bit of expansion in just the air alone!


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## Swedishchef (Jan 20, 2013)

I think it may have been just that: gas expansion pushing out faster. It was weird!


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## colin.p (Jan 20, 2013)

mattjm1017 said:


> Holy frozen smoke -34c and im fussing about +34f!! I cant imagine how cold that is!!


 
Just think of a brass monkey, running down the street with a welding torch in his hand.
Yup going to be cold this week:

Tonight
A few clouds. Wind northwest 40 km/h gusting to 60 becoming light early this evening. Low minus 19.

Monday
Increasing cloudiness. High minus 14.

Monday night
Mainly cloudy. 40 percent chance of flurries overnight. Low minus 21.

Tuesday
A mix of sun and cloud. High minus 17.

Wednesday
Sunny. Low minus 25. High minus 17.

Thursday
Sunny. Low minus 22. High minus 15.

Friday
Periods of snow. Low minus 17. High minus 9.

Saturday
A mix of sun and cloud. Low minus 15. High minus 11.


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## mattjm1017 (Jan 20, 2013)

Colinp thats to cold for me! I don't know how ya'll deal with that. Im looking at a low of +17 this week and worried about that and my pipes I cant imagine negative temps for a high.


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## jrendfrey (Jan 20, 2013)

It's negative Celsius correct? Probably above zero in Fahrenheit. So far oldest we've had was -22 and this next weeks supposed to be negative lows every night well be putting the wood right to her. Can you convert you lows in Canada to Fahrenheit?


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## Swedishchef (Jan 20, 2013)

It's about 0 to -5 F without the wind.....


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## mattjm1017 (Jan 20, 2013)

Yeah I didn't think about Canada being on Celsius. Thats still way to cold for me.


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## colin.p (Jan 20, 2013)

mattjm1017 said:


> Yeah I didn't think about Canada being on Celsius. Thats still way to cold for me.


 
Ya, it's too bloody cold for me too, but I'm stuck here.


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## jdp1152 (Jan 20, 2013)

mattjm1017 said:


> Holy frozen smoke -34c and im fussing about +34f!! I cant imagine how cold that is!!


 
but it's a dry cold!


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## Swedishchef (Jan 20, 2013)

It depends where you live...I am on the coast of the Gulf of St Lawrence and it is not frozen. Therefore the humidity hovers between 50-80%. Damp cold = not fun. THe Prairies in Western Canada is a dry cold.


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## rideau (Jan 20, 2013)

Not in Ottawa, not a dry cold.  Prairies a dry cold, yes.  Ottawa, no.  A cold cold.  - 25 C = 9/5 x 25= 225/5=45.  So subtract 45 from 32 (freezing in F) = -13 F.  Pretty cold.  Gets worse...to about -30F.  The days with the 30 MPH winds on top of that are the killers.


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## jdp1152 (Jan 20, 2013)

I was only kidding.  It gets insanely hot in Arizona, but everyone always says it's not so bad because it's a dry heat.


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## TheBaron (Jan 21, 2013)

Here is Ottawa in Deg F for our American friends


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## jdp1152 (Jan 21, 2013)

Makes the 29 degrees I'm sitting in seem balmy.


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## mattjm1017 (Jan 21, 2013)

I know one place ill not be visiting in the winter.


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## Swedishchef (Jan 21, 2013)

mattjm1017 said:


> I know one place ill not be visiting in the winter.


 lol. It is rarely that cold (I know, it's hard to believe!!) But you could always go to Quebec City and see the Ice Hotel http://www.hoteldeglace-canada.com/


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## Backwoods Savage (Jan 21, 2013)

Swedishchef said:


> Hey Dennis,
> 
> It was -25C without the wind. Still darn cold.
> 
> Unfortunately I don't understand something.... No matter how dry your wood is there will be some moisture right? From my understanding of thermodynamics, the temperature of the fire/wood will remain the same as water is changing phases. In this case there are 2 phase changes that must occur and not just one: from solid to liquid and then liquid to gas. However, this transition goes quickly. That is why I think I heard hissing. My wood is 3.5 years old. There is no way there was moisture in it. Some pieces that I had put near the stove to warm up did not hiss 4 hours later whatsoever. And some of these splits were the "other half" of some splits that hissed...


 
Swede, do you think it might also have something to do with the humidity levels you have there? No doubt you probably will even get frost on the wood and for sure that can cause some hissing. Here, we've just never noticed it. Should be around zero tonight when I load up and I'll check it a few minutes after it gets going but doubt there will be any hissing.


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## mattjm1017 (Jan 21, 2013)

Swedish chef that place looks pretty cool I would like to visit my northern neighbors one of these days but I think ill have to make my first visit in th late spring or summer and work my way up to the cold.


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## eclecticcottage (Jan 21, 2013)

mattjm1017 said:


> Yeah I didn't think about Canada being on Celsius. Thats still way to cold for me.


 
Lol, we live by the border so we watch Toronto TV, listen to radio from Canada...we forget sometimes we are watching/listening to a Canadian station and the temps forecasts can be hair raising for a moment until you realize it's C not F.


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## katwillny (Jan 21, 2013)

That weather must literally hurt the skin on contact. Good grief thats cold. I would think frozen anything wont burn properly and would hiss for a while. does that constitute as 0 moisture content being that all moisture is rock solid frozen?


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## Swedishchef (Jan 21, 2013)

Dennis: there may be some moisture in a couple of pieces but I don't know if it is frost or moisture in the wood. 1 out of 4 pieces hisses and it is all the same wood from the same batch! Hmmmm.. let me know how you make out!

Matt: it must get cold in North Carolina from time to time? Here it gets warm from time to time in the winter   All jokes aside, Quebec City (located in the province of QUebec) has an old part to it. They call it Old Quebec. It is a UNESCO heritage site and it likely one of the nicest places in North America. It's the closest thing you'll get to Europe while on this contitent. It's a nice place to visit! 

Andrew


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## Swedishchef (Jan 21, 2013)

katwillny said:


> That weather must literally hurt the skin on contact. Good grief thats cold. I would think frozen anything wont burn properly and would hiss for a while. does that constitute as 0 moisture content being that all moisture is rock solid frozen?


 LOL. It is not that cold. You put on a hat, jacket and gloves and you're fine. -40 is cold. Tonight it is supposed to be -35C with the wind here. That is certainly getting chilly.


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## Machria (Jan 21, 2013)

-34?  Forget the wood, MOVE!


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## bag of hammers (Jan 21, 2013)

I lived in Ottawa for a few years.  For some reason when it did get cold it felt reeeaaaally cold.  World's longest skating rink (Rideau Canal).  And the old world beauty of Quebec "next door".  Not so bad putting up with the winter weather.  

Just remember when the mercury hits -40 wer're talking the same language either side of the border (C & F converge).   Freaking cold!


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## Swedishchef (Jan 21, 2013)

Machria said:


> -34? Forget the wood, MOVE!


 LOL. remember that is with the wind!


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## mattjm1017 (Jan 22, 2013)

Yeah we have a little bit of cold weather got a cold snap this week going to be in the 30s last week it was 60s and 70s.


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## bag of hammers (Jan 22, 2013)

This is probably beach weather for you Alaska guys, but it's getting a bit chilly here this week....
(@ -18 F).  Forecast for tomorrow a.m. is -30C.


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## MishMouse (Jan 22, 2013)

We got to -28 this morning, thankfully the wind died down only 5-10, Sat we had gusts > 60, if we had that today things would not go well.


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## bag of hammers (Jan 22, 2013)

MishMouse said:


> We got to -28 this morning, thankfully the wind died down only 5-10, Sat we had gusts > 60, if we had that today things would not go well.


 
-28 plus 60 MPH wind chill?  Lock the door and hunker down inside. 

They are calling for windchill temps tomorrow <  -40.  Sounds awful, but it seems like you folks in Minnesota, Michigan, Wisconsin, etc. get the cold "Canadian" winters even worse than we do here.   Old man winter knows no borders.  Things are supposed to warm up a bit towards the end of this weekend, meanwhile stay warm and safe...


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## Backwoods Savage (Jan 22, 2013)

Swedishchef said:


> Dennis: there may be some moisture in a couple of pieces but I don't know if it is frost or moisture in the wood. 1 out of 4 pieces hisses and it is all the same wood from the same batch! Hmmmm.. let me know how you make out!
> 
> Matt: it must get cold in North Carolina from time to time? Here it gets warm from time to time in the winter  All jokes aside, Quebec City (located in the province of QUebec) has an old part to it. They call it Old Quebec. It is a UNESCO heritage site and it likely one of the nicest places in North America. It's the closest thing you'll get to Europe while on this contitent. It's a nice place to visit!
> 
> Andrew


 

Andrew, last night I filled the stove with black locust. Typical, it did not want to burn good at the start and this wood should have been dried a bit longer (given to me by a friend). I checked a couple times and there was no hissing. The temperature when I got the wood from the porch was 1 degree F. The wood went right into the stove. Tonight I'll be burning all oak and we'll watch it close again.


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## Swedishchef (Jan 22, 2013)

Dennis: then I gotta say that you were likely right. Either my wood got wet before it froze of those pieces that were hissing simply were not dry (how???). Thanks for getting back to me!

Hammers: crap it is nice outside! -22 C right now and I was sheltered from the wind. I was just outside for 1 hour and loved it! Quiet, super clear, lots of stars and no noise!

Andrew


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## bag of hammers (Jan 23, 2013)

Swedishchef said:


> I was just outside for 1 hour and loved it! Quiet, super clear, lots of stars and no noise!


 
+1 Andrew.  I think there was another thread here a couple months ago talking about the upside of the winters (being outdoors) with lots of comments like yours.  Yep, I wander down to the frozen shoreline on those quiet still winter nights and the deafening silence, and the visuals are hard to describe.


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## Swedishchef (Jan 23, 2013)

Last night was scary quiet. No a whistle of wind, nothing. Just the crunching of snow under my feet.

Saturday is the full moon here. Quite the light in the sky on those cold nights. I love it. As long as there's no wind. Wind = enemy. Unfortunately I live near the coast and it blows 3 days out of 4!!


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## Backwoods Savage (Jan 23, 2013)

Last night was an all oak load. Everything worked out just fine.


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## Swedishchef (Jan 23, 2013)

Well Dennis, I am guessing some of my wood was wet before it froze. We had a rain storm around Christmas time and the roof of my greenhouse (where I store wood) has a couple of leaks. I am guessing it has to be that..the maple is over 3 years old C/S/S....

Once again, I erred in my above statement.

Thanks for updating!


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## Backwoods Savage (Jan 23, 2013)

Maybe some coons got in and are peeing on the wood too?!


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## Swedishchef (Jan 23, 2013)

Ha ha. perhaps. Or someone came with buckets of water and tossed it on my wood (could you imagine someone doing that....that would be terrible! especially before the frost sets in..)

A


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