# Piazzetta Sabrina questions



## kah68 (Mar 2, 2014)

OK I have just started on my 3 ton since I installed the stove. Q1, What is the normal feed rate for these stoves? I have been running it on level 3 mostly and been playing around with level 4 and now level two. When I look at other stoves their flames are short and intense, where my flame is usually tall and less intense. Not sure if that is normal for this stove or not. Q2 I'm pulling the baffles out behind the burn pot and cleaning in behind as well as the pot itself and flue pipe, are there any other areas I should be cleaning? There is a plate below the ash pan and I don't know what's under it. I've burned a ton of ambiance (good heat with lots of clinkers after one day heavy deposits), a ton of La Crete (good heat with less deposits and almost no clinkers but a fair bit of ash). As well as 10 bags of Satisfaction (not really impressed heat wise and left lots of ash and clinkers).


----------



## chken (Mar 2, 2014)

kah68 said:


> OK I have just started on my 3 ton since I installed the stove. Q1, What is the normal feed rate for these stoves? I have been running it on level 3 mostly and been playing around with level 4 and now level two. When I look at other stoves their flames are short and intense, where my flame is usually tall and less intense. Not sure if that is normal for this stove or not. Q2 I'm pulling the baffles out behind the burn pot and cleaning in behind as well as the pot itself and flue pipe, are there any other areas I should be cleaning? There is a plate below the ash pan and I don't know what's under it. I've burned a ton of ambiance (good heat with lots of clinkers after one day heavy deposits), a ton of La Crete (good heat with less deposits and almost no clinkers but a fair bit of ash). As well as 10 bags of Satisfaction (not really impressed heat wise and left lots of ash and clinkers).


Q1) Normal? There's no normal, you set it on the feed rate you think works best. A higher setting will raise your room temp faster. A setting too low may never reach your set temp.

I tend to set the feed rate setting as low as possible. For example, tonite it's 20 degrees out, and overnight I set my thermostat back to 61 degrees. For a 40 degree differential I know feed rate 2 can handle that, slowly, but surely. However, I know tomorrow it's going to start to get colder, and I'll have to up the feed rate to 3 and probably 4, and maybe even 5 when it gets below zero.

The flame can get very tall, feed rate 3 can easily be ⅔ to ¾ of the way up the fire box. feed rate 4 and 5 can go from ¾ to the top. If you find the flame not as intense as you'd like, try upping your air rate.

Q2) Daily, I scrape the burn pot, and wipe the glass, and since I have a PowerSmith ash vac, it only take a few secs to suck up what's in the tiny ash pan.

Weekly, pull the backplate and clean the gray/tan ash.

Monthly, clean the vent.

Yearly, clean the combustion fan box, which is covered by the plate below the ash pan.

I've been burning Crabbé from NB and LG from Quebec. LG have been good and clean, Crabbé is close, but I prefer the LG.

If you search this forum, you'll find a few threads on the Piazzetta Sabrina, and some of the settings that I and others are using. If you go into the Parameter Settings, by using Access Code E9, you can change all of your settings.

What's your firmware? You can see it by holding Button 1 and 6 at the same time for 5 secs.

I've adjusted my feed rate  and air settings to the following:
Feed rate/ air setting
3.3secs/2000rpm
4.5secs/2100
5.7secs/2300
6.9secs/2500
8.1secs/2650

Different pellets may require some adjustment to the air. I may be blowing a little more air than most, but I find that I don't get buildup in the fire pot, which leads to a lazy flame. I can easily go 48 hrs or more without scraping the fire pot, but usually I follow the manual.


----------



## kah68 (Mar 3, 2014)

Thanks for all the info chken...when you say monthly clean vent I assume  you mean exhaust vent (Chimney)? Hard to get firmware down (goes fast) but I got sp40-scmu1-1-15 if that makes sense. I think I would like to try more combustion air at a lower feed to see if efficiency improves.


----------



## chken (Mar 3, 2014)

kah68 said:


> Thanks for all the info chken...when you say monthly clean vent I assume  you mean exhaust vent (Chimney)? Hard to get firmware down (goes fast) but I got sp40-scmu1-1-15 if that makes sense. I think I would like to try more combustion air at a lower feed to see if efficiency improves.


Yes, monthly, clean outside vent. Basically, you follow the manual, and then adjust based upon your experience. 

For example, if I burn less than 2 bags in a day, I don't scrape the pot and wipe the glass, I wait for a 2nd day. Because my current burn settings are very good, I can easily go 48 hrs or more without shutting down and scraping/cleaning.

I think the manual itself states that you do the first outside vent cleaning after a month, about a ton, and then adjust based upon your experience. If your vent is 4" in diameter, you probably can clean less often, seeing as the pipe is almost 80% larger.

Your firmware is the same as mine: SP40 scmv 1.1.115. Interestingly others have different firmware.

I like to check my exhaust temp from time to time. You can access it by holding button 6 down for about 3 secs, and then click button 5 twice, which will take you to Stove Status. Click button 3, and it'll scroll the feed rate, the air fan rpm, and the stove exhaust temp. On feed rate 2, I typically get between 205 and 210 degrees, when it's on feed rates 4 and 5 I typically get 240 to 250 degrees. When the exhaust temps start to drop, it indicates to me that the stove can use an exhaust vent cleaning. Of course, different pellets will give you different results, so you have to determine your own baseline.


----------



## gusto (Mar 12, 2014)

Installed a Sabrina as well ,noticed the flame up end down more noticeable at the lower settings maybe just the way the auger dumps the pellets I guess . At factory settings level 3 flame reaches top flame deflector by reading other posts seems a bit high ,all draft readings at the test port seem on line with the programming manual .Selkirk PL vent pipe up 6' and out 24"

Firm Load SP40 SC MV 1.1

Well ready for more testing (and tasting) hope the picture loads

Piazzetta Sabrina Bordeaux  with Amarone overtones


----------



## chken (Mar 12, 2014)

gusto said:


> Installed a Sabrina as well ,noticed the flame up end down more noticeable at the lower settings maybe just the way the auger dumps the pellets I guess . At factory settings level 3 flame reaches top flame deflector by reading other posts seems a bit high ,all draft readings at the test port seem on line with the programming manual .Selkirk PL vent pipe up 6' and out 24"
> 
> Firm Load SP40 SC MV 1.1
> 
> ...


I think it all depends upon the pellet. My FSUs on feed rate 3 can send a flame all the way up to the top baffle. Others, not so high.

Are your pellets supporting your wine stash?


----------



## gusto (Mar 12, 2014)

Well same here at level 1 at times hits the top then down to burning pot levels not very even by no means . I will try tonight to lower the drop rate to 3 and leave the smoke fan alone .
As for the pellets supporting the wine stash ,we at gusto's are committed to a long and extensive testing program as you can see we are prepared for the task 

Thanks Chken 
I'll try dropping the rate by 10%


----------



## chken (Mar 12, 2014)

Haha, that's awesome!


----------



## Ktm300 (Mar 12, 2014)

kah68 said:


> OK I have just started on my 3 ton since I installed the stove. Q1, What is the normal feed rate for these stoves? I have been running it on level 3 mostly and been playing around with level 4 and now level two. When I look at other stoves their flames are short and intense, where my flame is usually tall and less intense. Not sure if that is normal for this stove or not. Q2 I'm pulling the baffles out behind the burn pot and cleaning in behind as well as the pot itself and flue pipe, are there any other areas I should be cleaning? There is a plate below the ash pan and I don't know what's under it. I've burned a ton of ambiance (good heat with lots of clinkers after one day heavy deposits), a ton of La Crete (good heat with less deposits and almost no clinkers but a fair bit of ash). As well as 10 bags of Satisfaction (not really impressed heat wise and left lots of ash and clinkers).


Nice avatar


----------



## Grizzly_G (Apr 24, 2014)

Hi All,

I got the Sabrina before winter and had issues from the beginnings where my dealer can't seem to resolve or lack of knowledge. I also sent messages to Piazzetta and got no response.

1. When setting the temperature example 23 degrees Celsius, the machine surpasses the temp like 29 degrees and continues to climb, should it not remain close to set temp? This is resulting in using more fuel which is not efficient. This also makes it very hard to control a comfortable environment. Is there a problem with the machine? Dealer is telling me it is a water thermostat so it can't be controlled. They suggested to use the energy saving mode but my concern is the grate needs to be clean if not I had an issue where it kept feeding pellets and over filled the pot and never ignited.

2. Cleaning Grate, should this not clear all traces of pellets for the next start up if using a weekly program?

3. The clean out tee pipe does not have enough clearance for me to take off the cap. I need to lean the machine forward which raises the pipe clearance off the floor.  This is because they installed it on the floor protector losing clearance. This will become very difficult to perform maintenance clean-ups which they suggest removing the pipe from the machine, defeats the purpose of the clean out tee which is tedious. They blame the design of the machine.

Any help would be appreciated.

Thanks,
Johnny


----------



## chken (Apr 24, 2014)

Grizzly_G said:


> Hi All,
> 
> I got the Sabrina before winter and had issues from the beginnings where my dealer can't seem to resolve or lack of knowledge. I also sent messages to Piazzetta and got no response.
> 
> ...


Johnny, you should search a few of these recent Piazzetta threads, because there is a dealer near you who can help. I think his name is Pierre, and he's about an hour north of Montreal, and he seems really eager to help.

As for your questions, here are my thoughts:
1) The stove should never exceed the temp setting by more than a degree, in practice. Clearly, this is not normal behavior.

When you say 29 degrees, you mean on the stove's thermostat or the room thermostat? Because there is a possibility for the stove's thermostat to think it's only 23 degrees when the room thermostat shows 29 degrees. You need to put the stove's thermostat wire in a place where it reads very closely to what your room thermostat reads. If it's too close to the wall, it could be reading very cold drafts, which would allow the stove to keep running as it thinks the room is colder than it is.

Not sure what your dealer means by a "water thermostat", unless he's referring to your room thermostat.

In Energy Saving mode, when the stove shuts down, it basically goes into grate cleaning mode for 10 minutes, blowing hot air thru the grate in order to burn off any embers. Thus, when it restarts, it should not have an ignition failure. If you are having ignition failures, and weren't getting error messages, then something is not working right. An ignition failure should trigger a code and some beeping.

Make sure your stove and its vent are clean, and that you burn good pellets and see if you still have this ignition problem.

2) The Cleaning Grate process is not that precise. It will just turn the combustion fan on its highest setting, for about 45 seconds, which helps to burn off any excess pellets. Pierre recommends shortening the interval between grate cleanings and increasing the time of the cleaning. I have done similarly. Those are settings your dealer can adjust, or you can do it yourself easily by going into the parameter settings using code E9. There's a list of parameters you can change in some of these Piazzetta threads.

3) Are you saying you can't remove the cap on the bottom of the T? There should be a few inches from the floor protector. A picture of the situation would help.


----------



## Grizzly_G (Apr 24, 2014)

Hi Chken,

Thanks for the quick response,

1. Yes the stove thermostat goes up, my electrical thermostats in the rooms go even beyond 35 to 39 degrees which is unbearable and need to shutdown the stove. So yes the stove thermometer does not remain within the 1 degree. I did notice if I unplug the power chord on the unit when cleaning it, the next startup it seems to stay more stable but after the next consecutive startups it goes out of whack. I also noticed the flame is always high and pellets are always feeding which uses up a bag within 8 hours, I use P5 setting according to dealer they claim it will run more stable but I also tried it on P1. I also find it leaves a lot of ash and I am using Lauzon hard wood which should be around .03 ash.

They claim the Piazzetta thermostat is like a water thermostat which is not as precise as the electronic base board Aube thermostats.

After 24 hours the pot becomes pretty full and causes issues for next startup. I need to scrape everything out and it is pretty black and packed.

3. Yes. Picture provided. They tell me to use a Shopvac from the outside. Also I had a lot of ash come out of the tee after about 15 bags. The black dust was everywhere.


----------



## chken (Apr 24, 2014)

Grizzly_G said:


> Hi Chken,
> 
> Thanks for the quick response,
> 
> ...



1) I'd try two things, first, I'd try moving the stove thermostat wire around so that it reads the room temp correctly. If it's reading too low, I'd more the wire so that it's right next to the metal jacket of the stove. The stove jacket should be warmer than the back wall, where the wire normally is getting a cold draft.

If that doesn't work, then an external thermostat is required. Other threads here have recommended different external thermostats to use with a pellet stove.

Anyhow, fixing the temperature should be an easy fix, with moving the existing thermo probe around, or using an external thermostat.

As for power setting, if you run on P5, and it never reaches your set temp, as you describe, it should eat up a 40lb bag in 7 to 8 hrs. Clearly, it's working as described, since your stove never cycles to P1 because it never reaches your set temp. As answered earlier, you need to move the temp wire. I'd tuck the wire into the decorative slices in the metal on the right side of the stove, and have the probe just an inch from the metal. That should keep it warmer.

Will P5 run more "stable"? No. Not sure what they mean. I typically run my stove on its lowest setting that allows it to heat the house in a reasonable amount of time. If the temp is about 0 celsius, I'll use P3, and even P2, if I'm using a particularly hot pellet. If it's colder, P4, and if it's really cold, then P5.

If a setting is leaving more ash, then the air for that setting needs adjusting. An efficient stove can operate just fine on all its settings, but your dealer should use a manometer to adjust the air correctly. You can do it to, but when the dealer installed it, he should have used a manometer to adjust it.

My Piazzetta thermostat works just fine, it seems to be electronic, so I'm not sure what that means.

If your pot is becoming full of ash, your air needs adjusting. I base my scraping on bags of pellets burned. I can easily go 3 to 5 bags between scrapings, and I don't expect anything in the pot. Maybe a thin biscuit with holes, but usually just accumulation up around the rim. Of course, it's recommended to scrape once a day, but once you get to know your stove, and IF your stove is adjusted for optimal efficiency, you can easily go 3 to 5 bags between scrapes. Right now, with the temps pretty moderate around Maine, I may burn 5 bags in a week, and so I haven't scraped in a week.

3) The duravent T seems just a little lower than my Excel T on my stove. I know there's not a lot of room under my T, but I can get my fingers under there and undo the screw and drop the plug. Cleaning the T by opening it is crucial because a lot of ash accumulates right at the 90degree bend. No amount of sucking with a shopvac will clean it.

I'd consider one of two things: one, think about switching to a vent pipe with a T that gives you more room, like the Excel. Or two, I'd raise the stove up a couple inches, something to give you the room to open the bottom of the T, so you can remove the ash cake that accumulates.

Lastly, I'd do the leaf blower trick to suck out any ash. Do a search on leaf blower trick on this forum or youtube and you'll see what I mean.

As for the failed ignition, I've never had one so I can't say whether yours is typical or not. It could be a side effect of your inefficient combustion leading to a lot of ash accumulation in the pot, so that the fresh pellets don't ignite. If that's the case, then you need to get your dealer to optimize combustion with a manometer. You can do it too, but I think your dealer should be given the chance to do his job, first.


----------



## chken (Apr 24, 2014)

Contact Pascal_Maertens who's in Mont-Laurier.


----------



## gusto (Apr 24, 2014)

Hi Grizz
Does the temperature display on the stove climb to high readings as well??
If the stove does not revert to P1 or turn off in econo mode 
I would try a factory reset first (check all the parameters and record them before reset)
Like Chken said not too cold now I run the stove on econo mode 72F     +2    - 2     on P3 and set the pellet drop rate on P1 to 2.7 (With this P1 setting still get 225-230 F fumes temp) so the cycles are long .
Same problem with the cleaning T 
One ignition failure so far 

Regards 

PS
You should be able to grab the temp sensor between your fingers and make the stove cycle and watch the temp climb on the stove display
I have the covers off the stove most of the time so if you need any info or readings go for it

Later


----------



## Grizzly_G (Apr 24, 2014)

Hi Guys,

Thanks for the info. I am willing to try anything but running out of time due to warmer weather. I want to settle this with my dealer that has been giving me the run around for the last 4 months.

Gusto, yes the temperature on the stove keeps climbing and does not regulate itself to stop at set temp. I think you may be right where the stove does not cycle itself and stays on P5, flame is always high, pellets keep feeding and temp rises uncontrollably. I am sure when it was first installed I used to see the flame go down and also the fan slows down and was able to sit there and watch TV. Now, I have to turn it off before it gets to hot. My thermostat wire is sitting on the floor where they left it. When it was installed it was two young guys and they never did any setup/configuration or explanation; they just added the pellets and turned it on and off they went. Dealer also claims they don't know it to well since it is relatively new product and is currently experimenting with the one they have setup at the store. They claim their rep is from Pacific Energy in Vancouver but did not get much assistance. Is there a number to call for Piazzetta Canada? I filled out their forms on the web site but still no response.

***I think a reset may do the trick but just wondering since they never configured anything I have nothing to lose or settings to write down? It is factory default already!

They installed a 4" Duravent pipe and considering maybe to put a higher base but not esthetically nice in order to access the T Plug; kind of like it on the floor though. I am able to loosen the T Plug but can't remove it since not enough of a clearance to slide it out. I need to lodge myself between wall and machine to tilt it so the pipe goes up and at the same time try to remove the plug. It is very difficult task by yourself to put it back and align it without crushing the plug. My wife says she would never be able to do this herself, it should be easy and says the dealer should be responsible for this install.

I never tried econo mode because afraid that the pot is full and won't re-ignite and will continue to feed the pellets. I read in the manual that it should detect no ignition or heat and should abort. I am afraid of using any programs for that matter. I clean it out completely before each new startup. I manually turned on and off the machine all winter. So much for this sophisticated advanced technology.


----------



## Owen1508 (Apr 24, 2014)

Grizzly_G said:


> 3. The clean out tee pipe does not have enough clearance for me to take off the cap. I need to lean the machine forward which raises the pipe clearance off the floor.  This is because they installed it on the floor protector losing clearance. This will become very difficult to perform maintenance clean-ups which they suggest removing the pipe from the machine, defeats the purpose of the clean out tee which is tedious. They blame the design of the machine.


The dealer installed it like that?  If so how could he blame the design of the stove?  He should have known that could be an issue and planned for that, he's the dealer he never encountered that before?.  The floor protector didn't lower the clearance of the tee, if it was installed onto the floor directly the clearance would be the same.  It just doesn't seem like his "answers" jive all around.  I'm not one to knock anyone generally, IMHO I would contact the gentleman chken suggusted for another opinion from a local dealer.  Seems to be you are getting better advice/answers in here.  Sorry to anyone  if this post seems negitive.


----------



## chken (Apr 24, 2014)

Grizzly_G said:


> My thermostat wire is sitting on the floor where they left it. ...
> 
> They installed a 4" Duravent pipe



Well, even if the dealer screwed up, which he did, you should at least try moving the thermostat wire. Leaving it on the floor means it is measuring the temp of the room at floor level, which is colder than off the floor, unless you have in-floor radiant heat. As I noted earlier, try tucking the wire in the slots cut into the side panels. That should raise the temp of the stove thermostat so that the differential between stove and room thermostat is minimal. Leaving it on the floor was a mistake.

A 4" vent is going to bring the bottom of the T closer to the floor. I thought it looked like a 4", but wasn't sure. I would ask the dealer to replace with a 3", which should give you a little more room underneath to pull the plug out. Then use an adapter above the T to go from 3" to 4".


----------



## Grizzly_G (Apr 25, 2014)

Hi Chken,

I understand your point which I will try your suggestion but even at that, the thermostat on the stove reads the actual temp as 29 degrees but I set it to 21 with the wire probe being on the floor. The machine or thermostat is not doing the job to cycle or maintain the temp. I will try to do the factory reset. Are the instructions in the manual to do this?

As far as the pipe size, I had argued with the vendor that the manual recommends 3" pipe but they insisted to use the 4" and is easier to maintain/clean. I also have an issue where my pipe on the outside of the house goes out a foot and turns towards the ground but my insurance companies insist the pipe to go up another 4 feet outside to prevent negative back draft to prevent the smoke from backing up back into the house and causing interior damages and possible claim. The unit is installed in the basement so the pipe from the back of the machine already goes up and straight outside which the dealer says is only required. I also notice when we get a lot of snow, I run the risk of the pipe being blocked since it is only a foot off the ground and we get more snow than that.

Thanks again.


----------



## chken (Apr 25, 2014)

Grizzly_G said:


> I understand your point which I will try your suggestion but even at that, the thermostat on the stove reads the actual temp as 29 degrees but I set it to 21 with the wire probe being on the floor. The machine or thermostat is not doing the job to cycle or maintain the temp. I will try to do the factory reset. Are the instructions in the manual to do this?



Okay, now I'm confused, I thought the room thermostat was showing 29 and the stove was showing 21, but you're saying the stove is saying 29, while your set point is 21, which means the stove should turn off. If that's not the case, then something is wrong that the dealer needs to see and have addressed.

As for the settings reset, that's what Gusto recommended. You can access your settings thru the programming menu, section 6.4 in your manual. Go to Menu Paramaters>Settings Factory, the access code is E9. You can then scroll thru all of your settings. Write them down, they're 28 of them. If you post them, I can tell you if they are factory, or have been adjusted. In this thread and others, you can see some of the changes, usually to the air, that I and others have used. At the top of this thread, I've posted my settings on air and pellet rate. They are quite a bit higher than what the factory sets, and I have a feeling that your stove needs higher air settings, based upon your comments.



Grizzly_G said:


> As far as the pipe size, I had argued with the vendor that the manual recommends 3" pipe but they insisted to use the 4" and is easier to maintain/clean. I also have an issue where my pipe on the outside of the house goes out a foot and turns towards the ground but my insurance companies insist the pipe to go up another 4 feet outside to prevent negative back draft to prevent the smoke from backing up back into the house and causing interior damages and possible claim. The unit is installed in the basement so the pipe from the back of the machine already goes up and straight outside which the dealer says is only required. I also notice when we get a lot of snow, I run the risk of the pipe being blocked since it is only a foot off the ground and we get more snow than that.
> 
> Thanks again.


Actually, the dealer is right, the 3" recommended pipe is the minimum. A 4" pipe will require less cleaning, since it's 65% larger. Where installations are tricky, making cleaning harder, then a 4" pipe makes sense. However, as I noted above, I would have used a 3" T, to make it easier for you to access the plug at the bottom of the T, and then right above the T put in an adapter going to 4". That'll give you both the easier to access plug, but also the benefits of a 4" pipe.

As for backdrafting, the 4' vertical rise can be either inside or outside. In fact, inside works better, since the pipe is warm, it will naturally draft better. So, your dealer is correct.

Basement installs are trickier for some reason. It sounds like your install looks like Page 15 in the manual. There, the requirement is 1 foot off the ground. Obviously, in snow country you have to be careful not to have the vent blocked. If you can, you may want to add a vertical to get it above your snow level. With a 4" diameter pipe, you should not have any issues with the pipe being too long.

As for snow, I lived in Ste-Agathe-des-Monts as a child and recall getting something like 72" over 3 days in 1971!


----------



## Pascal_Maertens (Aug 17, 2014)

chken said:


> 1) I'd try two things, first, I'd try moving the stove thermostat wire around so that it reads the room temp correctly. If it's reading too low, I'd more the wire so that it's right next to the metal jacket of the stove. The stove jacket should be warmer than the back wall, where the wire normally is getting a cold draft.
> 
> If that doesn't work, then an external thermostat is required. Other threads here have recommended different external thermostats to use with a pellet stove.
> 
> ...





chken said:


> Okay, now I'm confused, I thought the room thermostat was showing 29 and the stove was showing 21, but you're saying the stove is saying 29, while your set point is 21, which means the stove should turn off. If that's not the case, then something is wrong that the dealer needs to see and have addressed.
> 
> As for the settings reset, that's what Gusto recommended. You can access your settings thru the programming menu, section 6.4 in your manual. Go to Menu Paramaters>Settings Factory, the access code is E9. You can then scroll thru all of your settings. Write them down, they're 28 of them. If you post them, I can tell you if they are factory, or have been adjusted. In this thread and others, you can see some of the changes, usually to the air, that I and others have used. At the top of this thread, I've posted my settings on air and pellet rate. They are quite a bit higher than what the factory sets, and I have a feeling that your stove needs higher air settings, based upon your comments.
> 
> ...


by the way there is also a code to adjust the thermostat of the stove to the same temperature off the room and a good trick is also to put an audio extension cord to your stove I have my thermostat cable on the 2nd floor I put 25 feet off extention and calibrate the thermostat off my stove to the temperature off the 2nd floor. if you put an external thermostat the energy saver will not work. a 25 feet audio extension will also cost you less. I don't have my book on hand for now but I'll be back to give you that code you need for calibrating you stove temperature. reguards Pascal.


----------



## Pascal_Maertens (Aug 17, 2014)

Hi again,  you can see what I was talking about that little black wire coming out off the wall, next to my wall thermostat is the stove original thermostat sensor wire. I know I'ved said it was an Audio extension I used sorry I was wrong, it is not. But if you go to an electronic store they can make you one. just bring your sensor wire. (( I also know that if you splice it and just twist it together it will work but do it write )). ok, then comes the fun part once it's install properly on the second floor or just were ever you want it then go in set up menu - settings factory - set - enter scroll to the code F7 adjust to the temperature you have next to the sensor in my case the second floor. and now the reading on my stove is the one from the second floor that's it, hope you enjoy. Pascal  for those who have a remote control that the temperature also is not reading correct then the code for setting the remote controle is F8 only for series P5XX and P6XX

(( I've learned that from fishing experiment to find thermocline whit a basic thermostat wire and an 90 foot added wire to it, 90 foot and still it's giving you the temperature )).


----------



## gusto (Oct 24, 2014)

Pascal_Maertens said:


> View attachment 136709
> View attachment 136710
> 
> Hi again,  you can see what I was talking about that little black wire coming out off the wall, next to my wall thermostat is the stove original thermostat sensor wire. I know I'ved said it was an Audio extension I used sorry I was wrong, it is not. But if you go to an electronic store they can make you one. just bring your sensor wire. (( I also know that if you splice it and just twist it together it will work but do it write )). ok, then comes the fun part once it's install properly on the second floor or just were ever you want it then go in set up menu - settings factory - set - enter scroll to the code F7 adjust to the temperature you have next to the sensor in my case the second floor. and now the reading on my stove is the one from the second floor that's it, hope you enjoy. Pascal  for those who have a remote control that the temperature also is not reading correct then the code for setting the remote controle is F8 only for series P5XX and P6XX
> ...


Bonjour Pascal

By any chance do you have the code for the Sabrina (Temp probe calibration F7 does not work) . I used about 25ft of telephone inside wire and spliced a 10K NTC from flea Bay 
The stove display shows a bit colder about 2 F not a big deal but if it can be fixed why not.
At first the display was bouncing plus or minus 1F (interference I think ,a .1 uf capacitor across the thermistor fixed the problem) stable now

Regards
gusto


----------



## Pascal_Maertens (Oct 30, 2014)

sorry for the delay F7 is the correct code you need to enter it in settings factory.


----------



## gusto (Oct 30, 2014)

Pascal_Maertens said:


> sorry for the delay F7 is the correct code you need to enter it in settings factory.


Merci 

Tried again in Factory Settings but I get code error (E9 works fine for all the 28 parameters) maybe different firmware load I am at SP40 SC MV 

Regards
gusto


----------



## Pascal_Maertens (Oct 31, 2014)

hum... maybe, I have SP40_B_V_1_1_115 this is a new Firmware. Piazzetta expect to have a newer firmware soon, this will allow to have auto cleaning in P1 and P2. but I will check wen I receive other stove if the firmware is the solution or not.

regards


----------



## Grizzly_G (Nov 3, 2014)

Hi all, been a while.

Well I am still working with dealer. They set it up to Econo mode at the end of winter last year but did not have a chance to test due to warmer weather. So I ran it this weekend since it is getting cold and it works by reaching a specified temp 26 C and then shuts off to cool off to set temp 24 C then turns back on. Now I am having an issue where the house fills up with smoke between the cycles. What is causing this? My stove is in the basement and the pipe goes up and straight out. Wondering if the pipe outside needs to go up another 4 feet? I feel a backdraft of cold air coming back in through the inside clean out tee at the back of the stove.

Also, someone mentioned to provide my stove settings for some adjustments.



28’ P1


05’ P2


45’ P3


3.2” P4


3.8’ P5


3.3” P6


4.3” P7


5.4” P8


6.5” P9


7.6” P10


60” P11


25” P12


43 C P13


174 C P14


80 C P15


2000 P16


205 P17


1820 P18


1950 P19


2100 P20


2250 P21


2470 P22


34 P23


35 P24


36 P25


37 P26


38 P27


190 C P28


Thanks for the help.


----------



## chken (Nov 4, 2014)

Grizzly_G said:


> Hi all, been a while.
> 
> Well I am still working with dealer. They set it up to Econo mode at the end of winter last year but did not have a chance to test due to warmer weather. So I ran it this weekend since it is getting cold and it works by reaching a specified temp 26 C and then shuts off to cool off to set temp 24 C then turns back on. Now I am having an issue where the house fills up with smoke between the cycles. What is causing this? My stove is in the basement and the pipe goes up and straight out. Wondering if the pipe outside needs to go up another 4 feet? I feel a backdraft of cold air coming back in through the inside clean out tee at the back of the stove.
> 
> ...


Basement installs are tricky. You may have a low pressure zone where your pipe terminates. Increasing the height may help, but make sure you don't exceed your limit.

As for your settings, they look to be factory settings, unchanged, that match how mine came, except yours are in Centigrade.

I've upped the frequency of grate cleaning as Pascal recommended, and I've tweaked my feed, air and blower settings. My differences are:
1) 20' from 28'
2) 3' from 5'
3) 30' from 45'
...
7) 4.5secs from 4.3
8) 5.7secs from 5.4
9) 6.9secs from 6.5
10) 8.1secs from 7.6
...
16) 2050rpm from 2000
...
18) 2100rpm from 1800
19) 2200rpm from 1950
20) 2350rpm from 2100
21) 2500rpm from 2250
22) 2650rpm from 2470
23) 36 from 34
24) 37 from 35
25) 38 from 36
26) 38 from 37
...
Basically, I upped the feed rate to span the full rated range from 11k btus to 47k btus, by doing some testing on how fast the pellets were being burned on different power settings. To get any where near the 5.7lbs/hr consumption on P5, I had to max the feed rate to 8.1secs on setting 10.

Once I did that, I then had to adjust the air on my stove, using a manometer. I found for my setup I needed far more air than the factory setting. Lastly, I wanted more of that heat to come into the room, so I upped the room blower as noted in Settings 23 to 26.


----------



## bogieb (Nov 4, 2014)

This is a timely post as I just ran across a Used Sabrina last night and am considering buying. However, one of my concerns is that the exhaust outlet is ~7" on center to the floor. that does not leave much room for the T w/cleanout (as shown in an earlier picture). I am not sure about placing it on a "pedestal" as it is already tall - plus the placement would be in my living room, so it might just look weird (and my place already has enough weirdness - LOL)


----------



## chken (Nov 4, 2014)

bogieb said:


> This is a timely post as I just ran across a Used Sabrina last night and am considering buying. However, one of my concerns is that the exhaust outlet is ~7" on center to the floor. that does not leave much room for the T w/cleanout (as shown in an earlier picture). I am not sure about placing it on a "pedestal" as it is already tall - plus the placement would be in my living room, so it might just look weird (and my place already has enough weirdness - LOL)


My Sabrina vents straight out to a T, before going up. Outside, the T height isn't an issue.


----------



## Griff726 (Nov 4, 2014)

chken said:


> My Sabrina vents straight out to a T, before going up. Outside, the T height isn't an issue.



Mine only sits on a stove board that's less than 2" tall. I it goes to a T and then up. There's not much room for cleaning, but it clears the ground just fine. I'm just going to clean mine from the outside.


----------



## bogieb (Nov 5, 2014)

Thanks for the replies about the height!


----------



## Grizzly_G (Nov 5, 2014)

chken said:


> Basement installs are tricky. You may have a low pressure zone where your pipe terminates. Increasing the height may help, but make sure you don't exceed your limit.
> 
> As for your settings, they look to be factory settings, unchanged, that match how mine came, except yours are in Centigrade.
> 
> ...



OK. So I will try to make the changes, I am sure there are some procedures somewhere? Do I need a manometer after making these changes or these change will suffice?

As far as the smoke coming back in, the vendor is not sure about extending the pipe up 4 feet outside would resolve it. They are going to redo my connections inside and put the T clean out on a 45 degree angle so the cap will be accessible to be removed; not sure if it is a good idea. They also mentioned we may need to install another pipe to get the air intake from outside due to negative pressure. He claims my air exchange exit is in the same room which is causing the issue; do I need to turn it off?

Thanks again.


----------



## chken (Nov 6, 2014)

Grizzly_G said:


> OK. So I will try to make the changes, I am sure there are some procedures somewhere? Do I need a manometer after making these changes or these change will suffice?
> 
> As far as the smoke coming back in, the vendor is not sure about extending the pipe up 4 feet outside would resolve it. They are going to redo my connections inside and put the T clean out on a 45 degree angle so the cap will be accessible to be removed; not sure if it is a good idea. They also mentioned we may need to install another pipe to get the air intake from outside due to negative pressure. He claims my air exchange exit is in the same room which is causing the issue; do I need to turn it off?
> 
> Thanks again.


I recently posted the manual on how to change the settings, but I forgot in which thread. I'll post it below:

https://www.dropbox.com/s/ogznqraei...023_E02_USA [MONIA_SABRINA].2012_max.pdf?dl=0

Hope that works, I put the manual in my Dropbox account.

As far as my settings, you can make all the changes, from 1 to 10 and 23 to 26, but the combustion air, settings 18 to 22 need to be your own settings, not mine. Mine are specific for my conditions which are determined by my house and vent location. A manometer can be bought for about $60, online. The above linked manual has the pressure readings you should see, and the procedure to test. 

However, even without a manometer, you can try adjusting your combustion air settings. Many threads talk about combustion air and what you should see visually when the air is good. Pellets shouldn't be flying out of the pot, though they can jump when pellets drop into the grate. The flame should be pointy, and active, not lazy.

https://www.dropbox.com/s/sy93k6amkwjomhq/2014-11-02 09.27.23.mov?dl=0

That's my flame, looks lazier than in real life. It's as if the camera picks up the infrared much better than my eyes. I only see the sharp pointy part that's white hot in that video.

The temps of the exhaust gas, which the stove will tell you under "Stove Status" should be in the 200F to 250F range, whatever that is in Celsius. Too low and too hot is not good.

As far as your smoke, that's concerning, but I have no experience with basement installs, other than that others here have commented that they are tricky to get vented correctly.

I'm guessing they mean they'll tilt the T on a 45. That seems totally fine by me.

As for the air intake, by all means, you should definitely consider an OAK, Outside Air Kit, as a first possible solution. The air intake is the slightly diagonal pipe out the back of your stove, you should be able to feel a little suction when the stove is on. I'm not sure what you mean about turning off your air exchanger, do you mean you have an ERV or HRV? If so, then it's possible that they could be exacerbating the negative pressure problem, but it shouldn't if installed correctly. I mean it's an EXCHANGER, air is coming in and the same amount is going out, right? Anyhow, I've seen where people recommend turning down your ERVs and HRVs in the Winter. Not off, but a lower fan setting.

Anyhow, good luck.

If you continue to have difficulty, I would start a new thread with the problem as the title of the thread, because your issue isn't specific to the Piazzetta, but a common problem for basement installs, and then people with experience with tricky basement installations can give you some of their insight.


----------



## Pascal_Maertens (Nov 9, 2014)

bogieb said:


> This is a timely post as I just ran across a Used Sabrina last night and am considering buying. However, one of my concerns is that the exhaust outlet is ~7" on center to the floor. that does not leave much room for the T w/cleanout (as shown in an earlier picture). I am not sure about placing it on a "pedestal" as it is already tall - plus the placement would be in my living room, so it might just look weird (and my place already has enough weirdness - LOL)


two answer for you first use a 90 degree cheaper I take mine out for cleaning in the bath tube my wife well any wife will freak out so clean it when you wife is out lol... or 2nd option there is some t that clean out by the side ( ICC chimney ) http://www.icc-rsf.com/main.php?t=chem_produits&i=68&d=


----------



## Pascal_Maertens (Nov 9, 2014)

Grizzly_G said:


> Hi all, been a while.
> 
> Well I am still working with dealer. They set it up to Econo mode at the end of winter last year but did not have a chance to test due to warmer weather. So I ran it this weekend since it is getting cold and it works by reaching a specified temp 26 C and then shuts off to cool off to set temp 24 C then turns back on. Now I am having an issue where the house fills up with smoke between the cycles. What is causing this? My stove is in the basement and the pipe goes up and straight out. Wondering if the pipe outside needs to go up another 4 feet? I feel a backdraft of cold air coming back in through the inside clean out tee at the back of the stove.
> 
> ...


first it is not possible for program 20,21 and 22 to be higher than the program 16
if you are using a tool to adjust your stove like a magnehelic mine is scale in Kpascal
at program 16 you should reach 110 Kp this is the higher point of setting
p20 should be 75 Kp, p21 should be 85 Kp, p22 should be 95 Kp
the rpm to reach the Kp depends on the air tight of the house older house will have lower rpm output
newer houses will have higher rpm output
but one ting is for Shure 20,21,22 settings are wrong compared to prog 16
but although 16  seem to be low I looked at all of my customer records none are under 2300rpm  top one is 2700rpm
only two have very old houses are around 1900rpm
and it is very hard to adjust without a proper tool.


----------



## afreeace (Oct 2, 2015)

Hi sorry if these questions when is the hundred times or I just don't understand how to get into the programs settings. I am trying to turn up my room fan so it is always higher than the factory settings. Can somebody explain to me how?


----------



## gdphishman817 (Oct 3, 2015)

Hold Down + all the way to the right, Scroll and select "Menu Parameters" with the "Set Button", Select "Factory Settings".

From there scroll with the + button all the way to the left until you get to E9 (if you hold down the + it goes faster), One there use the + and - all the way to the right to scroll through the different options


----------



## afreeace (Oct 3, 2015)

gdphishman817 said:


> Hold Down + all the way to the right, Scroll and select "Menu Parameters" with the "Set Button", Select "Factory Settings".
> 
> From there scroll with the + button all the way to the left until you get to E9 (if you hold down the + it goes faster), One there use the + and - all the way to the right to scroll through the different options



Thank you for the help but now its asking for code access?


----------



## gdphishman817 (Oct 3, 2015)

afreeace said:


> Thank you for the help but now its asking for code access?



Once you get to E9, pressing "Set" should get you into the different parameters


----------



## Pascal_Maertens (Oct 4, 2015)

buy the way if you ever do any renovation be aware that the blower are very sensitive to dust


----------



## HotTamale (Jan 19, 2016)

Will any custom settings default to factory if there is a 2 second power outage? My Monia tripped during a very fast power outage and read "energy saving OK" before continuing to burn.


----------



## 709GADE (Jan 19, 2016)

HotTamale said:


> Will any custom settings default to factory if there is a 2 second power outage? My Monia tripped during a very fast power outage and read "energy saving OK" before continuing to burn.


I've had power outages while Monia was running and the settings stayed the way I had it set up.  My stove also displayed "energy saving OK"


----------



## afreeace (Jan 19, 2016)

gdphishman817 said:


> Once you get to E9, pressing "Set" should get you into the different parameters


All I still get is code error. I get to number 23 I push set and it says code error


----------



## Pascal_Maertens (Jan 20, 2016)

HotTamale said:


> Will any custom settings default to factory if there is a 2 second power outage? My Monia tripped during a very fast power outage and read "energy saving OK" before continuing to burn.


it will continu on power level P2 no matter the level you had set it to it's a safety feature


----------



## HotTamale (Jan 20, 2016)

Ok this is strange. After tripping I had to restart it hot, and indicated, "NO LIGHTING".
*
From Manual: "If the readout NO LIGHTING appears on the display during the startup stage (and the buzzer activates, if set), it means that the sensor installed on the ue gas outlet detects no temperature rise (sign that the combustion process has not been triggered) or the pellet hopper is empty. The stove goes into the alarm status." *

Was the stove too hot to ignite and start up again? 

It successfully started after fully shutting down, thus bypassing the error.


----------



## Pascal_Maertens (Jan 20, 2016)

If you shut your stove off, and immediately try to turn it back on manually, it will not and you will get an error message it as to cool down to 40°C before it can start back. after a power outage it will go back on by it self you must not try to interfere.


----------

