# 2014 Green Conservation Plan



## starfoxACEFOX (Jan 3, 2014)

I would like to know what everyone plan for 2014 for saving more energy and also sharing new tech.

This year for my 2,000sq bi level home is goign to have a heat pump isntalled to my water heater from Nyle, their Geyser PRO line. Upgrade all my PSU in my server and desktop to 80 Plus Platinum or Titanium once they market 115v vers. Which I have about 10 system running 24/7 which could be nice saving of 200$ a year. Seeing most of my PSU already out of date. Also build 2kw solar system to help with peak usage.

Things I already did for 2013, installed quad ductless heating & cooling system with seer rating of 18 from LG, change all lighting to LED base and added more insulation to the attic. Also change all water fixture to meet EPA WaterSense program, 2.0gpm shower heads and 1.5gpm faucets from Delta and 1.1g per flush toilets from Kohler. Which we all did during our whole house remodel.

Here photo of before and after, I hope you like. I would love hear more about what you do to save more.


----------



## woodgeek (Jan 3, 2014)

After a lot of work over the last few years to drop HVAC BTU demand by 50%, cost by 75%, and carbon by 95%, I am going to try and chill out...

...until my home energy monitor, the Efegy e2, recc'ed by Highbeam, shows up.  Then I am gonna kill me some phantoms.

https://www.hearth.com/talk/threads/my-energy-audit-report.117919/


----------



## starfoxACEFOX (Jan 3, 2014)

woodgeek said:


> After a lot of work over the last few years to drop HVAC BTU demand by 50%, cost by 75%, and carbon by 95%, I am going to try and chill out...
> 
> ...until my home energy monitor, the Efegy e2, recc'ed by Highbeam, shows up.  Then I am gonna kill me some phantoms.



I never got idea on why people monitor usage, wont change efficiency just the usage? Maybe it's my data center mind, it's always on and never off.


----------



## woodgeek (Jan 3, 2014)

Yup we agree.  I decided to work on house envelope loads and efficiency first.  I have noticed, though, that my baseload usage is 2X what it should be....when we are on vacation, no HVAC or DHW, our house uses 10 kWh/day.  Adding up all the known loads I expect <5 kWh/day.  I got a monitor to track down the rest of it.  If they can be eliminated, it would be >1500 kWh and $200 in savings per year.

Did you airseal your attic before insulating??


----------



## midwestcoast (Jan 3, 2014)

Seal & insulate the rim joist after we finish a basement purge / reorganization that's well under way (mostly baby gear that has been taking over).
Also plan to greatly expand our veggie garden in spring since we have to take out a rotting tree & we'll then have enough sun.
MAybe backyard chickens.


----------



## starfoxACEFOX (Jan 3, 2014)

woodgeek said:


> Yup we agree.  I decided to work on house envelope loads and efficiency first.  I have noticed, though, that my baseload usage is 2X what it should be....when we are on vacation, no HVAC or DHW, our house uses 10 kWh/day.  Adding up all the known loads I expect <5 kWh/day.  I got a monitor to track down the rest of it.  If they can be eliminated, it would be >1500 kWh and $200 in savings per year.
> 
> Did you airseal your attic before insulating??



Nah, seeing there was already old insulation there. I didn't want to pull it all out to do that, then renting foam gun would have be fun. Almost killed myself with paint gun and shot myself with framing nail gun. Foam, what nightmare could I do with that.


----------



## semipro (Jan 3, 2014)

Welcome to the forum Fox.  
If you'll look around a bit you'll find many here have done a lot of work doing energy upgrades at their houses.  
Woodgeek mentioned phantom loads (I like the name "parasitic" better but...) and I'd like to address some more of those loads also.  
You mentioned computer power supplies.  Since you do IT work could you elaborate a little more on what could be done in that area.  We have numerous laptops and one tower sucking power constantly at our place. What's the deal with the power supplies you mentioned?


----------



## Highbeam (Jan 3, 2014)

starfoxACEFOX said:


> I never got idea on why people monitor usage, wont change efficiency just the usage? Maybe it's my data center mind, it's always on and never off.


 
Efficiency and usage are related. What are you trying to accomplish with efficiency improvements? Most would say that they wish to reduce their consumption of the resource for one of several reasons including cost, carbon footprint, resource conservation, off grid, etc. Through monitoring your usage you can evaluate your efficiency improvements. How do you know if your low flow shower heads are saving you energy? Can you quantify it?


----------



## Highbeam (Jan 3, 2014)

This year, I have already removed the pair of 8' t8 tube fixtures in my kitchen and replaced them with 6 ICAT can lights. The tube fixtures use 1 amp each and the LED flood lights in the cans use 60 watts combined. Less lumens but superior placement make for excellent lighting at a huge reduction in usage.

As the long life (LOL)CFL bulbs die I am swapping them to LED replacements. Each time I drop from 13 watts to 9 which is a big drop as a percentage.

I have a shop that I store freeze sensitive items. I insulated the walls last year to R-19 and this year will be installing an ceiling and insulating above it to R-30 to maybe R-50. Until then I've been forced to run a resistance heater at times and my meter really spins. With full insulation I expect that the building will need only minimal energy to avoid freezing.

I have well water and it has grit, light sulfur, and iron. I will be installing a grit filter, and a greensand filter to clean up my water. Until that happens I cannot risk replacement of water heating or dishwashing equipment. The water treatment will happen early 2014.

I hope to install a single 18000 btu mitsubishi hyper heat ductless mini split heat pump in my 1963 built home. It has no ducts currently. I hate the looks of the indoor units but the superior efficiency is very attractive. Also attractive will be removing a handful of those electric wall heaters.


----------



## starfoxACEFOX (Jan 3, 2014)

semipro said:


> You mentioned computer power supplies.  Since you do IT work could you elaborate a little more on what could be done in that area.  We have numerous laptops and one tower sucking power constantly at our place. What's the deal with the power supplies you mentioned?



Sure I can share a lot about high efficiency computers and electronics, all the way from audio amps to LED drivers. I think I would have to make other post just about that. There a lot out there, it can get confusing with how many option there are.



Highbeam said:


> Efficiency and usage are related. What are you trying to accomplish with efficiency improvements? Most would say that they wish to reduce their consumption of the resource for one of several reasons including cost, carbon footprint, resource conservation, off grid, etc. Through monitoring your usage you can evaluate your efficiency improvements. How do you know if your low flow shower heads are saving you energy? Can you quantify it?



Well I can see this being helpful when doing projects that don't have a set specification like home insulation lost or renewable energy production. Sometimes I've seen people get little to carried away with it. Most specification are accurate and got to compare spec with what you have from what your replacing and shop with well known companys seeing they take the time test it. Like shower head, I just got house in mid 2013. Which I didn't have any shower heads, so I went from full flow to 2.0gpm. If it was 2.2gpm to 2.0, more likely wouldn't have wasted the time replacing it. I must say Delta claim with there H2Okinetic system, as it dose only use 2.0gpm or 1.8gpm base on model. Dose feel like more water, seeing water droplets are larger I use little less hot water to get same temp. Now I don't think I need test if I'm saving hot water just base on H2Okinetic system, but I do know I'm saving cost of water use and heating of the saved water.


----------



## TradEddie (Jan 3, 2014)

I've started insulating my basement walls, foam will go in first, and eventually drywall will follow to meet code in case I ever need to sell. I've only put a few panels in yet, but now I can feel big drafts under my sill plate where I must have missed some sealing previously. Twofer!

Yesterday I found an untaped duct joint, worst of all I never noticed when I insulated that duct five years ago!

TE


----------



## starfoxACEFOX (Jan 3, 2014)

TradEddie said:


> I've started insulating my basement walls, foam will go in first, and eventually drywall will follow to meet code in case I ever need to sell. I've only put a few panels in yet, but now I can feel big drafts under my sill plate where I must have missed some sealing previously. Twofer!
> 
> Yesterday I found an untaped duct joint, worst of all I never noticed when I insulated that duct five years ago!
> 
> TE



Good plan, I want to do my garage this year, right now there no insulation. Just between the house, so I can heat and and cool it during the year. 

Dose anyone know good way to have good air tight garage door? I want to buy new one, but if I could reuse old one I have I would.


----------



## DawsonBuck18 (Jan 3, 2014)

Started backyard chicken in June with three chicks.   Now have three hens each laying an egg almost every day.  Free range for now. I moved into new construction in June.  Already replaced every contractor grade 60 watt incandescent with CFLs discounted by Georgia Power.  Installed two Venstar programmable WiFi thermostats.  $100 rebate for each one from Georgia Power. Already replaced 6 month old electric water heater with a new GE hybrid. Added 40 rolls of R30 Corning Eco Touch to attic but need 40 more to completely cover the sprayed in insulation that contractor installed.  Installed Delta water sense kinetic shower heads (1.8 gal per min). 

Tip: run the hot water tap at your kitchen sink until you feel HOT water before running your dish washer.   This is a big energy saver as your dish washer isn't having to raise the water temp itself at a rate of 1 degree per 3 minutes in order to start washing.  

Great thread.   Thanks for starting this one.


----------



## semipro (Jan 3, 2014)

DawsonBuck18 said:


> Now have three hens each laying an egg almost every day. Free* reign*...


Ruling the roost because there's no rooster I guess..
Sorry, couldn't help it.


----------



## jatoxico (Jan 3, 2014)

Replaced all the windows, new siding w/ tyvek and foam board. Have an energy audit scheduled for early Feb. Lemme guess, attic?


----------



## semipro (Jan 4, 2014)

2014 goals (some longer term realistically)

Finish basement air sealing and insulation 

PV array
Convert hybrid Highlander to plug-in
Run adult children who take long showers out of the house


----------



## jebatty (Jan 4, 2014)

Our PV array went active at the end of October, it is not sized to meet 100% of our prior usage, so our goal is to reduce usage to the kwh produced by the array over the course of an average year. This means we need to increase the efficiency of our electrical appliances, reduce usage or both: likely both. If we achieve this goal, and since we heat primarily with wood, we will be 100% carbon neutral, except for fuel usage for our vehicles. 

We already have done a lot to reduce usage and increase efficiency, and for Nov-Dec 2013 our average daily general electric usage has been 11 kwh/day and our electricity for supplemental heat and dhw has been an average of 35 kwh/day. Usually we use no supplemental heat from about April to December. Average solar production during Nov-Dec, two very low production months, has been 10 kwh/day. So total usage was 46 kwh/day offset by 10 kwh/day solar for a net of 36 kwh/day grid usage. Solar has been providing 22% of our total usage for these two months.

Our solar has been below estimated production of 15 kwh/day. November and December appear to have been much cloudier and snowier than normal. Hopefully other months will make up the difference.

Besides supplemental electric heat, our big energy hog is the electric clothes dryer. It will be difficult for my wife to alter her behavior to do dry some clothes outside. We do have a HE clothes washer, so drying time takes much less time and electricity than before. We also replaced our failed dishwasher with a more energy efficient model. We already do an excellent job of turning off lights and other electric devices when not being used, but still can do better and are working on that. I just bought 20 LED A19 bulbs from Earth LED, half 40 watt and half 60 watt incandescent equivalent, and I am switching out CFL to LED based on usage levels.

And we will monitor our level of goal achievement, and look for ways to do even better.


----------



## jebatty (Jan 5, 2014)

One more energy hog is the dehumidifier in the basement, about 1000 kwh usage during the summer, and I don't know of any way to not use it.


----------



## woodgeek (Jan 5, 2014)

jebatty said:


> One more energy hog is the dehumidifier in the basement, about 1000 kwh usage during the summer, and I don't know of any way to not use it.



An airsealed basement in a AC'ed house will need less.  A Central AC could take the humidity in the house out for a similar or lower usage, and make you more comfortable in the process.


----------



## jebatty (Jan 5, 2014)

Fortunately we do not need AC. Our summer days of high 80's to low 90's are typically only about 1 week long, and uncomfortable humidity then and other times is quite uncommon, at least not enough to consider AC. And ceiling fans do a good job of handling the few days when AC might be useful. We have neighbors who "must" live in a conditioned house all the time for reasons unknown to me other than that they can.


----------



## semipro (Jan 5, 2014)

jebatty said:


> Fortunately we do not need AC. Our summer days of high 80's to low 90's are typically only about 1 week long, and uncomfortable humidity then and other times is quite uncommon, at least not enough to consider AC. And ceiling fans do a good job of handling the few days when AC might be useful. We have neighbors who "must" live in a conditioned house all the time for reasons unknown to me other than that they can.


Our situation is similar.  We rarely use AC. 
And like yours (per another thread), basement dehumidification is a challenge.  
I'm currently doing a lot of water/air sealing and insulation in the basement in hopes of getting away from the dehumidifier.  
We have two hot water heaters (WHs), one of them a heat pump WH in the basement, the other is an electrical resistance unit near our master bath.   Each WH feeds a completely different circuit. The HP WH (Geospring) does dehumidify the basement. 
I'm considering combining our hot water circuits into one to put as much water heating load on the Geospring as possible.  I could put the ER WH in series and after the HP WH to maintain capacity.


----------



## DawsonBuck18 (Jan 5, 2014)

jebatty said:


> Fortunately we do not need AC. Our summer days of high 80's to low 90's are typically only about 1 week long, and uncomfortable humidity then and other times is quite uncommon, at least not enough to consider AC. And ceiling fans do a good job of handling the few days when AC might be useful. We have neighbors who "must" live in a conditioned house all the time for reasons unknown to me other than that they can.


Jebatty, I don't recall which type of hot water heater you have but if you install a GE Geospring heat pump water heater in your basement, it will heat your water and dehumidify your basement at the same time.   As long as your basement temp stays above 45 deg F, the heat pump will do its job and remove moisture from the air at the same time. Just a suggestion.  I installed a Geospring two weeks ago in my 2nd floor and it has really dried the house out, almost too much.   Avg humidity level went from about 45-50% to 25-30% in a 2,500 sq ft 2nd floor.


----------



## jebatty (Jan 5, 2014)

I've thought about a heat pump water heater, but we use very little hot water, only about 100 kwh/mo at $0.05/kwh or $5.00/month, that the investment in a heat pump water heater may not be worth it. A heat pump hot water heater would result in about $1.75/month electric cost perhaps, or a savings of about $3.25/month. We would get some dehumidification for sure, but I'm tending to think that because the heat pump would not be active very much we still would need dehumidification. What do you think?


----------



## TradEddie (Jan 5, 2014)

When we moved in, our basement was very humid, with obvious signs of damp an many places. One of the first things I did was to install an exterior door at the the bottom of the  stairwell of the Bilco door. That made an immediate and huge difference in the humidity, later work sealing the rim joists improved it a little more and I'm hoping that insulating the walls will bring up the temperature and consequently reduce the RH again. One remaining problem area is due to exterior drainage problems which needs to be addressed before I foam over that corner.
I still keep a humidifier down there, but I put a kill-a-watt on it for a week in the summer and it used less than 10 kWh in the week.

TE


----------



## Wear More Layers (Jan 5, 2014)

So far in 2014 I have:
a. put a 2nd blanket on my bed
b. worn a new fleece jacket I found on clearance.

You guys amaze me with all the things you've done.  Thank you for posting many of your ideas for the rest of us to learn from.


----------



## woodgeek (Jan 5, 2014)

jebatty said:


> Fortunately we do not need AC. Our summer days of high 80's to low 90's are typically only about 1 week long, and uncomfortable humidity then and other times is quite uncommon, at least not enough to consider AC. And ceiling fans do a good job of handling the few days when AC might be useful. We have neighbors who "must" live in a conditioned house all the time for reasons unknown to me other than that they can.



Cool.  For the record I have a 1960s house in a warmer and more humid climate, and my central AC for the whole summer keeping the place at 72°F and below 50% RH is ~1500 kWh, about 50% more than you are using for dehumidifiers.  Granted my lot is very shady.

What if your neighbor's AC only used 1000 kWh all summer, and they didn't have to run a dehum....is their choice worse than yours?


----------



## semipro (Jan 5, 2014)

We've got so many blankets on our bed right now I feel I'm suffocating. 
It may be time to install the heated mattress pad on the bed.


----------



## DawsonBuck18 (Jan 5, 2014)

jebatty said:


> I've thought about a heat pump water heater, but we use very little hot water, only about 100 kwh/mo at $0.05/kwh or $5.00/month, that the investment in a heat pump water heater may not be worth it. A heat pump hot water heater would result in about $1.75/month electric cost perhaps, or a savings of about $3.25/month. We would get some dehumidification for sure, but I'm tending to think that because the heat pump would not be active very much we still would need dehumidification. What do you think?



When I had my electric water heater, I never knew when it was in operation because I could not hear it like you can hear a gas water heater.   Since the hybrid is relatively louder than other heaters, I am much more aware of how often it actually runs, whether to meet demand or restore water temp after hours of gradual heat dissipation.  Perhaps a hybrid would run enough in your basement, even with your low demand, to contribute to dehumidification. I hope this helps. And thanks for keeping us posted on your other energy efficiency initiatives.


----------



## Highbeam (Jan 5, 2014)

semipro said:


> We've got so many blankets on our bed right now I feel I'm suffocating.
> It may be time to install the heated mattress pad on the bed.


 
Oooh, heated beds. I am a believer. We have ours installed all year and when heating season arrives we use it every night to at least pre-heat the bed at full throttle and if its really cold out we leave the element on low for all night comfort. Having bed heaters can save money by not having to heat the whole house.

I don't know what it consumes, maybe 50 watts on high? and they cycle. We even had the heaters when I was a kid at my parents' house.


----------



## begreen (Jan 5, 2014)

Wife's side of the bed is heaped with blankets & quilts that I have folded over on her side. I can't usually sleep with more than a sheet and maybe a single blanket in winter. In the summer it is only the sheet.


----------



## velvetfoot (Jan 6, 2014)

Love the granite!  Thermal storage, right?


----------



## DBoon (Jan 6, 2014)

Probably the last of the upgrades I can make for energy-efficiency would be to replace the 15+ year old dishwasher.   I think it uses about 12 gallons per wash cycle, and probably draws a lot to power the motor and run the internal heater coil as well.  I'm going to wait for it to break, however, which could be any day now.  It is well past its expected lifetime.


----------



## Seasoned Oak (Jan 7, 2014)

I need wall insulation. Some of my 100yr old homes wall are completely uninsulated. I should be ashamed.


----------



## jebatty (Jan 7, 2014)

Yesterday I completed part of our conservation plan by installing 40 and 60 watt equivalent LED's throughout our house, leaving only a few CFL's in little used fixtures, CFL pin tubes in the kitchen ceiling fixtures, 40 watt florescent fixtures in the basement, and incandescent bulbs in the fridge, oven, microwave, garage and exterior lights with minimal usage. I also ordered LED strip lighting to replace the under cabinet halogen lighting in the kitchen.


----------



## Circus (Jan 7, 2014)

starfoxACEFOX said:


> I never got idea on why people monitor usage, wont change efficiency just the usage?


 
You can't improve what you don't know. Five years ago I bought a kill a watt monitor causing the purchase of a new fridge. They've long since paid for themselves, if you don't figure the old fridge's waste heat helping in the winter.
I dismantled the old fridge to see why it suck so much electricity. All the fiberglass insulation was soaking wet within plastic bags.


----------



## jebatty (Jan 7, 2014)

What's the thinking on this: should incandescent and/or CFL's be replaced with LEDs at today's prices immediately or only as they wear out? And should avoidance of the social and environmental costs of electricity waste associated with high usage bulbs be taken into consideration in making this decision? And how are the other benefits of LEDs over CFL's to be taken into account: usable in cold weather, instant on, dimmable, and also a variety of colors available? Other considerations?

The 10 - 40 watt equivalent LEDs and 10 - 60 watt equivalent LEDs cost me $120.00 total. Our current electric rate is $0.12 kwh. A savings of 1000 kwh recoups the price paid for the LEDs at the current electric rate.


----------



## Ashful (Jan 7, 2014)

We're adding on 1460 sq.ft. of heated and air-conditioned space.  Gonna finally break the 300 million BTU usage mark.  

Thank you for your conservation.


----------



## BrotherBart (Jan 7, 2014)

Joful said:


> We're adding on 1460 sq.ft. of heated and air-conditioned space.  Gonna finally break the 300 million BTU usage mark.
> 
> Thank you for your conservation.


----------



## Ashful (Jan 7, 2014)

Mostly joking there, BroBart.  We spent an almost insane amount of time and money rebuilding old windows this summer, and building/installing traditional wooden storm windows, a project that will continue the next 4 - 5 years.  We also added temporary weather stripping to two of the doors in the 1770's portion of the house, until I can get around to rebuilding them properly, which made an enormous difference.  I mortared in all holes around the sill of our 1894 addition, installed a new roof on that addition, and installed a new mini-split in the room above our attached garage.  The 1200 sq.ft. shop addition will also be high efficiency Mitsubishi mini-splits.  I'm greener than I like to admit.

That said, our BTU usage is way higher using wood than the 264 million I had previously calculated using oil.  With oil, the thermostats sit at 62F all the time, excepting weekends and about 6 hours each week day.  With wood, we're kinda forced to keep the house at 70F, so it's not frozen when we wake up or get home from work.  That extra 8 degrees means an extra 21% BTU usage for the month of January, alone.  Looking at just 2011 and 2012, we went from using 1400 gal. oil with no wood, to 5-1/2 cords of wood plus 1000 gal. oil.


----------



## Highbeam (Jan 7, 2014)

jebatty said:


> What's the thinking on this: should incandescent and/or CFL's be replaced with LEDs at today's prices immediately or only as they wear out? And should avoidance of the social and environmental costs of electricity waste associated with high usage bulbs be taken into consideration in making this decision? And how are the other benefits of LEDs over CFL's to be taken into account: usable in cold weather, instant on, dimmable, and also a variety of colors available? Other considerations?
> 
> The 10 - 40 watt equivalent LEDs and 10 - 60 watt equivalent LEDs cost me $120.00 total. Our current electric rate is $0.12 kwh. A savings of 1000 kwh recoups the price paid for the LEDs at the current electric rate.


 
The CFLs you removed were likely only costing you 2-3 watts each extra over the LED. I do not believe that destroying good CFL bulbs for LED is cost effective based on consumption only. The other factors have value, sometimes great value such as cold weather performance, that may make the upgrade worth it but I would save that functional CFL to use as a replacement for other CFLs that die on their own.


----------



## TradEddie (Jan 7, 2014)

Highbeam said:


> jebatty said: ↑ What's the thinking on this: should incandescent and/or CFL's be replaced with LEDs at today's prices immediately or only as they wear out? And should avoidance of the social and environmental costs of electricity waste associated with high usage bulbs be taken into consideration in making this decision? And how are the other benefits of LEDs over CFL's to be taken into account: usable in cold weather, instant on, dimmable, and also a variety of colors available? Other considerations? The 10 - 40 watt equivalent LEDs and 10 - 60 watt equivalent LEDs cost me $120.00 total. Our current electric rate is $0.12 kwh. A savings of 1000 kwh recoups the price paid for the LEDs at the current electric rate. The CFLs you removed were likely only costing you 2-3 watts each extra over the LED. I do not believe that destroying good CFL bulbs for LED is cost effective based on consumption only. The other factors have value, sometimes great value such as cold weather performance, that may make the upgrade worth it but I would save that functional CFL to use as a replacement for other CFLs that die on their own.



There's a mathematics PhD in there for someone. I have replaced all incandescent bulbs unless I can't  find a good aesthetic or functional replacement (e.g. Halogen PAR20s in dining room, candelabra bulb sconces in the bedroom). I've replaced several CFLs with Cree LEDs where I value the instant on and cold weather performance. I'll keep on using my CFL's but I won't buy only more. As they die (usually much sooner than advertised), I hope that the variety, price and color of LEDs will have improved even more. 

TE


----------



## Ashful (Jan 7, 2014)

Just happened to look and notice milestone:


----------



## woodgeek (Jan 7, 2014)

jebatty said:


> What's the thinking on this: should incandescent and/or CFL's be replaced with LEDs at today's prices immediately or only as they wear out? And should avoidance of the social and environmental costs of electricity waste associated with high usage bulbs be taken into consideration in making this decision? And how are the other benefits of LEDs over CFL's to be taken into account: usable in cold weather, instant on, dimmable, and also a variety of colors available? Other considerations?
> 
> The 10 - 40 watt equivalent LEDs and 10 - 60 watt equivalent LEDs cost me $120.00 total. Our current electric rate is $0.12 kwh. A savings of 1000 kwh recoups the price paid for the LEDs at the current electric rate.



The modest energy difference makes it not clear cut. In my case, I replaced all the locations I wanted an LED for fast warmup, low temp, high hour usage, dimmability, etc, maybe half of my bulbs total.  I am keeping those surplus cfls in a closet, and will use them to replace the other cfls as they burn out.  Best of both worlds.  I'll never buy another cfl, but it will prob take me 5-10 years to finish them all off


----------



## jebatty (Jan 7, 2014)

I thought about replacing only some CFLs, for the reasons stated by woodgeek as well as to eliminate high usage CFL's, and then keeping spare LEDs to replace other CFLs as they wear out. But after thinking about it, that doesn't make much sense. I already invested in the LEDs, and I think I should use them LEDs now to get the energy savings + the other benefits, keep the CFLs as spares, because LEDs likely only will get better and less expensive. Why save them for a future use?

Saving for a future use is what I did when halogen bulbs first came on the market, but then came the CFLs and I never used the saved halogens. I still have those, and I have plenty of spare CFLs for a future that likely will never arrive.


----------



## peakbagger (Jan 7, 2014)

Hate to say, I have been there and done that, solar hot water, solar electric , wood boiler and storage and a mini split to cut back on wood usage. The payback on what few  energy improvements are left is so long that I cant justify sending time or money on them. The big thing I need to do is spend time to get two years ahead on wood.


----------



## Highbeam (Jan 7, 2014)

jebatty said:


> I already invested in the LEDs,  Why save them for a future use?


 
You created your own problem by buying so many LEDs at this time vs. waiting until you need them which would coincide with the price falling.

Now you're in a pickle. Do you use the LEDs and waste the remaining value in the CFL? or do you save the LEDs and wring every bit of value from the CFLs? It would be great if you could sell the used CFLs.

Like woodgeek, I will not be buying more CFLs. That tech has expired.


----------



## TradEddie (Jan 7, 2014)

I use CFLs in my portable shoplights, much more robust than heavy duty incandescents, and much less burnt hair when I get too close! Just need to remember to hold my breath if I drop one.
I think that's a good retirement use for my remaining CFL's. 

TE


----------



## DBoon (Jan 7, 2014)

I'm only buying LEDs from here on out.  I've put the new Cree LEDs in my most often-used fixtures, and the CFLs are in lesser-used locations.  I expect that it will take 5-10 years to use up the CFLs though.  

I did find the new Cree LEDs used 2-3 watts less than rated, and they run not quite twice as efficient as the CFLs.


----------



## jebatty (Jan 8, 2014)

> You created your own problem by buying so many LEDs at this time ....


So true, but that's my nature, and I think my label may be "early adopter." I installed the first wood gasification boiler in our area (Tarm), this summer installed the first residential grid-tied microinverter solar array in our area that I am aware of, jumped on halogens as energy savers when they became available, similarly CFLs, and now LEDs. When we redid our kitchen in 1996 I installed pin tube CFL fixtures in the ceiling, quite uncommon then, and all but one of the can fixtures still use the original CFL. No regrets, though. I can't change others but I can change my own behavior, and hope that my behavior impacts others to act similarly with regard to all aspects of conservation.


----------



## Laszlo (Jan 11, 2014)

semipro said:


> You mentioned computer power supplies.  Since you do IT work could you elaborate a little more on what could be done in that area.  We have numerous laptops and one tower sucking power constantly at our place. What's the deal with the power supplies you mentioned?


Computers run on direct current, not the alternating current that comes from your wall. In order to deliver steady, low-voltage DC power, a power supply (PSU) is needed to do the conversion. In laptops this will usually be an external "power brick" (the AC adapter) as part of the cord. In a desktop PC, it's a boxy internal component. 

Unfortunately, it's not a sexy spec to tout, so many manufacturers just slap cheap and inefficient PSUs in PCs. A study in 2005 showed most PSUs were only 70-80% efficient, meaning a quarter of the AC draw at the wall was turned directly into heat. Besides the huge waste of electricity, this is bad because the excess heat can damage or shorten the life of other parts of your PC, and your fans will have to work harder (and create more noise) getting rid of all the heat. Additionally, a failing PSU can destroy more expensive components (like the CPU or GPU) by delivering unstable power, so it's not something to skimp on.

The significance of the PSUs starfox mentioned is their efficiency rating. 80 PLUS is a certification for PSUs that are at least 80% efficient, with several higher tiers of efficiency called Bronze, Silver, Gold, and Platinum (with Titanium coming soon). An 80 PLUS Platinum-rated PSU is 90% efficient, so would be 3x less wasteful than a cheapo 70% efficient PSU! The initial cost of a quality power supply will be higher, but could pay for itself over time, especially in 24/7 applications like running servers or distributed computing projects.


----------



## pdf27 (Jan 13, 2014)

Done so far since 2010 when we bought the house (~1,000 sq ft mid-terrace):

New condensing natural gas boiler fitted to replace 1970s one (~90% efficient versus ~60%), separate upstairs and downstairs zones. 
Underfloor insulation fitted downstairs.
Draught lobby fitted by back door.
New kitchen with A++ rated fridge/freezer and A+ rated oven.
New hot water cylinder.
LED or CFL lights everywhere.
5kW (1700 BTU/hr) wood stove fitted, capable of heating the whole house down to about -5 deg C.
Water saving plumbing in the bathroom.
Dishwasher plumbed in to hot water supply so it uses water heated by gas not electricity.
Reasonably high-efficiency washing machine.
Couple of solid walls insulated internally.
Growing some of our own food.
Still to do (this year, maybe - first baby due in June!):

Solar PV - 4kW system facing ESE.
Solar Hot Water.
New windows - currently 25 year old UPVC double glazing, bit draughty and has condensation in places.
Expand vegetable garden to ~3x current size. That was to be this winter but I broke my collarbone falling off my bike and it's only just been fixed (back to work for the first time this morning).
Current usage for the past rolling year is ~2,500 kWh of electricity and ~9,000 kWh of gas. Once all the improvements are done anticipated values are roughly net-zero on electricity and ~5,000 kWh of gas, plus a few cubic metres of wood per year.


----------



## woodgeek (Jan 13, 2014)

pdf27 said:


> Still to do (this year, maybe - first baby due in June!):
> 
> Solar PV - 4kW system facing ESE.
> Solar Hot Water.
> Current usage for the past rolling year is ~2,500 kWh of electricity and ~9,000 kWh of gas. Once all the improvements are done anticipated values are roughly net-zero on electricity and ~5,000 kWh of gas, plus a few cubic metres of wood per year.



5kW = 17000 BTU/h.

I assume you have read the bit that suggests adding more PV + a HP water tank.  IIRC, you worry about the grid battery.  Like to hear your logic.


----------



## Ashful (Jan 13, 2014)

pdf27 said:


> Still to do (this year, maybe - first baby due in June!):


Congratulations.  Your available time for further improvements is about to get cut by about 80%.  When kid #2 comes, expect that to get cut in half again, to 10% of pre-kid levels.


----------



## pdf27 (Jan 13, 2014)

Joful said:


> Congratulations.  Your available time for further improvements is about to get cut by about 80%.  When kid #2 comes, expect that to get cut in half again, to 10% of pre-kid levels.


Which is why all the stuff I need to do apart from the gardening is already done - everything else I've got to pay someone to do (and the money is going too, but none of it is urgent!).


----------



## pdf27 (Jan 13, 2014)

woodgeek said:


> I assume you have read the bit that suggests adding more PV + a HP water tank.  IIRC, you worry about the grid battery.  Like to hear your logic.


UK law is the obstacle there - we don't have net metering due to a wrinkle of the tax system. That means you can displace your own normal consumption (saving 16p/kWh in my case), export it at 4.4p/kWh or use it to heat hot water saving the 3.5p/kWh I currently pay for natural gas. Currently they assume you export 50% of your consumption no matter what, but net meters are coming in by 2015 and so exporting to the grid will be better than replacing natural gas.

As far as HP Water Heaters go, they don't make sense if you ever run them on grid electricity and have gas anyway in the UK. Even with a COP of 3 they cost about 5p/kWh of useful heat, when I can heat the water with gas at 4p/kWh. There's a bit of a saving if you're using PV, but if I can fit solar thermal at about the same cost as a HPWH (and keep the gas boiler as a winter backup more easily) that works out better.

This doesn't apply to the US case - your electricity prices are lower, and most of you don't have natural gas so heat with much more expensive oil. Most of all, you have net metering so can use the grid as a giant battery so far as finance is concerned. I can't over here.


----------



## velvetfoot (Jan 13, 2014)

pdf27,
I saw that your collectors are facing ESE.  That is approx. where my roof is facing, but I was under the assumption that S is ideal.  True?  Thanks.  VF


----------



## pdf27 (Jan 13, 2014)

velvetfoot said:


> pdf27,
> I saw that your collectors are facing ESE.  That is approx. where my roof is facing, but I was under the assumption that S is ideal.  True?  Thanks.  VF


South is ideal, losing a bit as you go further East or West. They aren't installed yet, but the calculation suggests that it should provide about 70-80% of the generation of a straight south setup.
Minor correction - It's actually WSW, I was having a brain fart. It's a mid-terrace house with roofs facing WSW and ENE, so I don't have much choice. I'm also a long way north - roughly level with southern Alaska or Newfoundland. The main effect (apart from reduced total generation) is that in summer the sun is above the horizon for a very, very long time so it'll keep generating until relatively late in the evening. If you want to look at it, SMA Sunny Design is pretty good for a free almost professional tool, and PVWatts is pretty good for a quick look. Both of those let you put in location and roof angle, which should let you compare your orientation to due south.

One thing to remember - we both work during the day, and probably will continue to do so after the baby arrives. That means the majority of our electricity consumption is when we're at home in the evening - and since we don't have net metering that actually makes a WSW orientation quite good since it matches generation and consumption to each other relatively well. If you have net metering (as most US states do) then this advantage doesn't apply.


----------



## velvetfoot (Jan 13, 2014)

Thanks.  We have trees too, (that we don't want to cut down!)


----------



## pdf27 (Jan 13, 2014)

velvetfoot said:


> Thanks.  We have trees too, (that we don't want to cut down!)


That's a potentially big problem - PV panels really, really don't like partial shade. If the bit of the roof you want the panels on is shaded for part of the day, assume you'll get very little generation during that time.


----------



## velvetfoot (Jan 13, 2014)

Well, the actual story is that a solar company came out and gave us an estimate on pylon mounted collectors in the backyard, which my wife didn't like.  I didn't like the collectors mounted on our metal roof, so, never got an analysis on that.  I might change my mind-the tree situation might not be as bad as I think.
Thanks again.


----------



## begreen (Jan 13, 2014)

pdf27 said:


> That's a potentially big problem - PV panels really, really don't like partial shade. If the bit of the roof you want the panels on is shaded for part of the day, assume you'll get very little generation during that time.


That can be mitigated by using inverters like the Enphase on each panel instead of serially connecting the entire array.


----------



## jebatty (Jan 22, 2014)

The LED strip under cabinet lighting is installed and my wife loves it. Maximum power is 20 watts vs 65 watts for the replaced halogen puck lights. The LED strip also can be dimmed down, and I suspect once we find the "turn it on and leave it alone" setting, power usage will be around 12-15 watts.

Just got back from a 10 day trip, and the electric meter showed 5kwh/day of background usage, not including dhw and supplemental electric heat. That's a little higher than I expected, so time to track down the users: freezer, refrig, and DSL phone are the expected major users, but then there is the background use by the control circuits of the electric stove, microwave, and other things I will have to ID that still are always on. Our normal general use when we are home has dropped to right around 10kwh/day, down from close to 20kwh/day prior to our renewed passion to find and eliminate wasted electric use. Since we just made the conversion to nearly all LED lights, I will be interested to see how much the 10kwh/day average use drops.


----------



## Highbeam (Jan 22, 2014)

jebatty said:


> Just got back from a 10 day trip, and the electric meter showed 5kwh/day of background usage, not including dhw and supplemental electric heat. That's a little higher than I expected, so time to track down the users: freezer, refrig, and DSL phone are the expected major users, but then there is the background use by the control circuits of the electric stove, microwave, and other things I will have to ID that still are always on. Our normal general use when we are home has dropped to right around 10kwh/day, down from close to 20kwh/day prior to our renewed passion to find and eliminate wasted electric use. Since we just made the conversion to nearly all LED lights, I will be interested to see how much the 10kwh/day average use drops.


 
This is why energy monitors are so great. I will be curious to see how low you can go.


----------



## WiscWoody (Jan 26, 2014)

semipro said:


> We've got so many blankets on our bed right now I feel I'm suffocating.
> It may be time to install the heated mattress pad on the bed.


All the beds in my home have heated mattress pads. The King size on uses 110 watts over side but I rarely have it hotter than the 2 setting, cycling on and off. It works well having a wood stove for heat as the bedrooms are cool. I sleep better in a cool room anyways.


----------



## WiscWoody (Jan 26, 2014)

My home is well insulated and blower door tested tight. Since I can't have a drain field septic system I have a 3000 gallon holding tank and water conservation has been a goal since moving into the house full time instead of just the weekends before. I just installed the second dual flush commode to replace a 1.6 gallon flusher. The toilets don't get flushed on every use but it's just myself grossing out. Lol

I use 260-320 KWh of power a month so that's under control IMO.


----------



## jebatty (Feb 5, 2014)

We have a gravity drainfield, but our goal too has been to reduce water usage. One toilet gets used most of the time, and dual flush is on that one (if it's yellow let it mellow, if it's brown flush it down); other toilet is the 1.6 gallon variety. We never let the faucets run, and we have to remind guests to not let the faucets run.

Since the solar install our goal is less than 300 kwh/mo general use plus 100 kwh/mo for the electric hot water heater, or about 13 kwh/day average. Since Oct 28 when the solar went active, our average daily use for these is a little over 12 kwh/day, and usage should be dropping as in Jan we converted to nearly all LED lighting. 

We have supplemental electric heat to keep the basement at 50F and to heat the house when we are gone for more than a day. This winter that has been a killer: 2810 kwh for heat and electric hot water Oct 28 - Feb 4 (about 735 kwh ave/mo for heat +100 kwh ave/mo for hot water ). Our goal is for the solar over the year to meet 100% of our electric usage, including heat. Time will tell. I'm looking for an inexpensive way to get additional heat into the basement. Our wood stove does not have the capacity to do this and also keep the main level of the house comfortable.

On the other hand this heating electric translates to about 14 lbs/wood/day if wood heat was used for that heat, and about 2 lbs/wood/day if wood heat was used for hot water, or about 1-1/2 cords of aspen stove wood over a season.


----------



## Ashful (Feb 5, 2014)

Not criticizing, but just curious... in the case of a properly functioning septic system, why such interest in reducing water usage?  Sure, a few pennies are spent on pumping it to the surface, and a some portion is lost to evaporation when put into your drain field, but it seems like a mostly closed-loop system to me.  It comes out of my yard, and goes back into my yard.  You haven't discussed reducing the waste it carries (don't stop pooping!), just the amount of water that waste is conveyed by or into which it may be dissolved.


----------



## jebatty (Feb 5, 2014)

From what I have read, excess water is not good for septic systems with drain fields. It's pretty hard to get too little water in a septic tank but easy to get too much. Excess water can push solids into the drain field which ultimately will clog it. Also, excess water can slow down the decomposition of the waste in the septic tank and not allow it to decompose as much as it should before entering the drain field.

Edit: Also, IMO wasting any resource rarely if every is a benefit. Potable water is a precious resource.


----------



## Highbeam (Feb 5, 2014)

jebatty said:


> From what I have read, excess water is not good for septic systems with drain fields. It's pretty hard to get too little water in a septic tank but easy to get too much. Excess water can push solids into the drain field which ultimately will clog it. Also, excess water can slow down the decomposition of the waste in the septic tank and not allow it to decompose as much as it should before entering the drain field.
> 
> Edit: Also, IMO wasting any resource rarely if every is a benefit. Potable water is a precious resource.


 
It's not so much a green-conservation thing but it is good for your drainfield to underutilize it. Gravity drainfields are progressive failure systems and minimizing flows will maximize life. They are doomed to clog eventually from the non-degradable lints, and hairs that will make it out and form a matt on the interface between soil and gravel.


----------



## Where2 (Feb 8, 2014)

begreen said:


> That can be mitigated by using inverters like the Enphase on each panel instead of serially connecting the entire array.


I've got a large royal palm tree in the neighbor's yard that partially shades my PV system in the early morning (until 11AM today), and a large oak tree in the other neighbor's yard that partially shades my PV system in the late afternoon. My enphase inverters handle the minor shading issues very well. My system faces ~16° west of due south, yet I'm still averaging 119% of estimated output over the last 6 months.

Toward my 2014 goals, I continue to look at HP water heaters and am searching for a residential ground mount system that can withstand a 3-second gust of 160mph while holding 16-20 panels.


----------



## jebatty (Feb 10, 2014)

The 2014 Plan now also includes a 2.5' x 24' downspout hot air solar collector, facing SW under some windows, to supply hot air into our basement supplanting some of the electric heat we need to keep the basement at about 50F. I'm going to try to get it built and installed by March/April so we get some use out of it yet this winter season.


----------



## maple1 (Feb 13, 2014)

Keep your camera close - interested in seeing that one.


----------

