# My new neighbour is smokily burning green wood



## dougstove (Oct 14, 2011)

I know people on here are upset about local restrictions on burning, but my new neighbour is running prolonged, smokey burns
Walking by yesterday I saw them stacking green, round wood in the vapour-barrier lined enclosed garage.
I rather nosily asked 'Are you sure you should stack round wood in there' (in hindsight, rude).
They answered 'Oh yes, it is from father's woodlot.'

Now there is a prolonged pall of smoke all over the neighbourhood and they are giving wood burners a bad name.

My wife is on the provincial lung association, and poorly managed wood combustion is a health concern.


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## Danno77 (Oct 14, 2011)

dougstove said:
			
		

> I know people on here are upset about local restrictions on burning, but my new neighbour is running prolonged, smokey burns
> Walking by yesterday I saw them stacking green, round wood in the vapour-barrier lined enclosed garage.
> I rather noisily asked 'Are you sure you should stake round wood in there' (in hindsight, rude).
> They answered 'Oh yes, it is from father's woodlot.'
> ...


You hit it right on. People who don't do it right give those who do a bad name.


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## jatoxico (Oct 14, 2011)

Same here. I had to push my new neighbor to have a leaner locust tree taken down that fell during Irene from his yard into mine. If you don't want the wood I'll take it "No no, I'm gonna use it." OK cool, didn't know he meant 2 weeks later. Now the heavy smoke is hanging in the whole neighborhood. Clueless.


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## loon (Oct 14, 2011)

i'd have a chat with him if it's possibly? sounds like Dumbass will just keep it going if not  ;-) 

loon


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## cptoneleg (Oct 14, 2011)

Nearly all homes around where I live burn wood and they start c/s/stacking like now for this winter lots of smoke but it doesn't bother me, the few I have said something to about drying wood think I am crazy.
When I built my new shed I left about 3" gap between the boards for circulation and one of my neighbors a wood-burner said it was too bad I couldn't aford enough boards to make it solid.


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## Wood Duck (Oct 14, 2011)

Maybe you can engage in a friendly discussion about woodburning (people love to talk about it), and invite the new neighbors in to see your setup. When they come inside they'll be amazed to see a fire despite noticing no smoke just minutes earlier when you were outside and you discussed your chimney. Perhaps you'll add a log and they can watch it immediately catch fire or something similarly demonstrative of the benefits of dry firewood. it is a lot easier to show people good woodburning than to get them to listen to criticism of their poor burning technique.


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## fossil (Oct 14, 2011)

cptoneleg said:
			
		

> ...When I built my new shed I left about 3" gap between the boards for circulation and one of my neighbors a wood-burner said it was too bad I couldn't aford enough boards to make it solid.



 :lol:   :lol:   :lol:


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## Danno77 (Oct 14, 2011)

cptoneleg said:
			
		

> Nearly all homes around where I live burn wood and they start c/s/stacking like now for this winter lots of smoke but it doesn't bother me, the few I have said something to about drying wood think I am crazy.
> When I built my new shed I left about 3" gap between the boards for circulation and one of my neighbors a wood-burner said it was too bad I couldn't aford enough boards to make it solid.


He prob saw you usin' that 170 and just figured you were poor, the gapped siding was just the last thing to solidify it in his mind. Did ya tell him that po folks just stack their wood outside, and only fancy people have woodsheds?


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## MICHAEL H (Oct 14, 2011)

Sounds all to familar. My brother in-law turns the whole county into a certified fog zone every year. I swear he only burns green wood that has been rained on that day.


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## 3fordasho (Oct 14, 2011)

An idiot neighbor about half a block away burns green wood and yard waste in his firepit all summer long -  completely fogs the neighborhood at times.  The prevailing winds blow it away from me    Another one, (a true idiot who signs his name with "xx") ran an home improvement business years ago, mostly roofing and vinyl siding jobs. One very calm evening he decides to throw a bunch of siding scraps in his barrel stove. Soon the whole neighborhood is smoked out with acrid thick smoke and all the neighbors are out wondering whose house is on fire... soon the firetrucks show up.  My next door neighbor who was quite the hot head figures out where the smoke is coming from and goes over to the vinyl siding burner and clocks him in the face... never had a problem with that again ;-)


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## thewoodlands (Oct 14, 2011)

loon said:
			
		

> i'd have a chat with him if it's possibly? sounds like Dumbass will just keep it going if not  ;-)
> 
> loon




What do they say Loon, you can't fix dumb.


zap


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## weatherguy (Oct 14, 2011)

> Maybe you can engage in a friendly discussion about woodburning (people love to talk about it), and invite the new neighbors in to see your setup. When they come inside theyâ€™ll be amazed to see a fire despite noticing no smoke just minutes earlier when you were outside and you discussed your chimney. Perhaps youâ€™ll add a log and they can watch it immediately catch fire or something similarly demonstrative of the benefits of dry firewood. it is a lot easier to show people good woodburning than to get them to listen to criticism of their poor burning technique.



Might be worth a try, I tried to talk to my neighbor in a diplomatic non confrontational way about burning seasoned wood, didnt register, he gets his wood in October/November, immediately puts it into his basement and burns it like that, hes been doing it that way his whole life and thinks its a waste of time to buy wood early and stack it outside. In fact, almost everyone I know in the real world (not here in the cyber world) burns green. 
My BIL just cut and split his wood and also puts it into his basement, I tried talking to him at dinner one night when we went out and he got hostile. Hes been burning for 30+ years and his business has been selling firewood for all that time so hes an expert. He says Im falling for all these money grubbing regulations by installing correctly and getting a permit. He said I would get a much better draft without my liner connected to my insert, says my 6" liner is restricting my draft. I dont waste my time talking to anyone any more. If they burn their house down thats their problem.


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## Danno77 (Oct 14, 2011)

People who burn green wood aren't necessarily stupid. If they blatently disregard evidence that is respectfully and appropriately presented, then they might be! 

Come here and complain about people doing it, that's what makes this forum so great, but let's all assume that they just haven't been given the proper tools (information included) to do it right.

Now, if you come here and complain about your uncle's neighbor, who you've talked to and given a full PowerPoint presentation made by Battenkiller and then demonstrated effective burning techniques using Backwoods Savage's 15 year old Ash, then let the name calling ensue


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## red oak (Oct 14, 2011)

That's a good point - everyone I know in the real world does burn green wood.  Before I came to this site I thought I was way ahead because my wood would be cut for 6 months before burning.  It's hard for me to keep quiet because most of the people I know who burn wood are friends or family so I actually care what happens to them.  Hard to decide what to do or how much to say sometimes.


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## cptoneleg (Oct 14, 2011)

There are lots of folks up here in these Mtns. believe the wood is good to burn if cut after the sap is down (leaves fall off)  they get them stoves burning hot they don't put out much smoke.  I kept my house warm that way for over 20 yrs, 90% oak  till I found this site while shopping for a new stove.  Them old stoves don't have windows that get dirty, yes I have burnt Oak that has seasoned the time it takes to c/s/ and haul to the Stove.  And most have the theory that you mix green with dry for best and long burn times. :zip:


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## Nater (Oct 14, 2011)

There is a house down the street that just finished cutting and splitting the load of logs they received this summer.  It is just sitting in a few piles in their driveway.  I see no other wood on their property so I know they are planning on burning it this winter.  I've thought of stopping to talk to them about it but I don't want to be the "wierd guy down the street".  

I think there should be a hearth.com pamphlet, something that you could leave underneath the wipers on their car, or maybe their mailbox.  It could touch on the key points of woodburning and give them the address to the site so they could come here to learn the correct way.


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## gzecc (Oct 14, 2011)

jatoxico said:
			
		

> Same here. I had to push my new neighbor to have a leaner locust tree taken down that fell during Irene from his yard into mine. If you don't want the wood I'll take it "No no, I'm gonna use it." OK cool, didn't know he meant 2 weeks later. Now the heavy smoke is hanging in the whole neighborhood. Clueless.


Locust smells like cat pee when burned and its seasoned, whats it like unseasoned? Is it worse?


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## krex1010 (Oct 14, 2011)

It is almost impossible to get people to change the way they do things.  My brother in law called me yesterday asking if I could get him so wood from one of my tree service connections. He wants it for this year. He is one of these guys shrouds his whole neighborhood in smoke, has a chimney fire most years, and always makes a mad scramble every October to find wood. I simply cannot get through to him, good guy but clueless about woodburning and has no interest in changing his ways.


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## pen (Oct 14, 2011)

Dealing with this is about like going up to a 400#er and telling him that second Whopper he's munching on is a bad idea.  

As a general rule, people don't like having their habits questioned.  It's as though being a free citizen of the US entitles folks to do as they please, right or wrong.

What's funny is that it is the same people who complain about overregulation.  Reg's generally don't appear out of thin air, but rather as a reaction to people repeatedily making poor decisions.  

In the meantime, those who do the right thing have to suffer the consequences.

pen


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## Manitoulin Maples (Oct 14, 2011)

I was telling someone the other day how I was so happy i had seasoned wood this year and he told me all his buddies pretty much PREFER green wood....same old nonsense about long fires and mixing green with dry.  and they all probably have big old stoves with no windows!  

sounds like more education is needed.  here's a program Environment Canada put on around Ottawa years ago called Burn it Smart - nice to see two stoves going side by side - everyone who burns woods needs to understand this.  it's the first video at the top of the page called Advanced Wood Stove Technology:  http://www.woodheat.org/wood-heat-videos.html


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## cptoneleg (Oct 14, 2011)

gzecc said:
			
		

> jatoxico said:
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My Black Locust doesn't smell bad it actually smells good maybe you need to kill some cats.


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## laynes69 (Oct 14, 2011)

I've burned a ton of locust, and it can smell horrible. It's not as noticeable with a clean burning stove.


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## willworkforwood (Oct 14, 2011)

Nater said:
			
		

> .... but I don't want to be the "wierd guy down the street".....


Good thing too, because I already have that position, and I'm not about to give it up.  When asked about all the stacked wood in my yard, I politely give the brief spiel that we all do - 20%, split and stacked for a year or more - yada, yada, yada.  Then comes the empty look in reply (the lights are on but nobody's home).  One of these days someone is going to say, "really, tell me more about that", but then I'll realize it's only a dream and wake up.


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## Shari (Oct 14, 2011)

Manitoulin Maples said:
			
		

> I was telling someone the other day how I was so happy i had seasoned wood this year and he told me all his buddies pretty much PREFER green wood....same old nonsense about long fires and mixing green with dry.  and they all probably have big old stoves with no windows!
> 
> sounds like more education is needed.  here's a program Environment Canada put on around Ottawa years ago called Burn it Smart - nice to see two stoves going side by side - everyone who burns woods needs to understand this.  it's the first video at the top of the page called Advanced Wood Stove Technology:  http://www.woodheat.org/wood-heat-videos.html



Great video - thanks for sharing!


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## mhrischuk (Oct 14, 2011)

Give him a link to this site.


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## cptoneleg (Oct 14, 2011)

mhrischuk said:
			
		

> Give him a link to this site.





Its like telling someone to quit smoking, I don't do it except just a hint at the right moment.


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## stejus (Oct 14, 2011)

I hear ya.  I have a neighboor to the right that has an old smoke dragon and he burns unseasoned wood in his basement.   He has this thing puffing from Nov through March.  The other day it was in the low 50's and he had his clay lined chimney smoking heavily then it got real lazy where it was almost going backwards just laying on his roof and spreading horizontally.

Then I have another neighboor across the street with a fireplace.  Starts off with white steam and then turns to a blue smoke.

Then there's me, 24x7 from late Nov to early Mar with a little white smoke upon reload, then nothing.  Most people would guess that I don't burn wood, but its obvious from the weekly wood supply on the front porch.  

Lets see, dry wood and an EPA stove should do it!


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## Danno77 (Oct 14, 2011)

stejus said:
			
		

> Lets see, dry wood and an EPA stove should do it!


Even with my non-epa Englander 12, I would only get very minimal smoke when cruising at lower temps and essentially no visible smoke when it was really cranking. Dry wood can make a huge difference. I expect this new stove to do even better.


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## oldspark (Oct 14, 2011)

Danno77 said:
			
		

> stejus said:
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 Yep me too, the old Nashua burnt clean due to nice dry wood.


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## BrotherBart (Oct 14, 2011)

One of my neighbors will have his wood for this year ready soon. Tree service cut down some big oaks in his yard a few days ago and now that it has stopped raining he is splitting it.


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## Got Wood (Oct 14, 2011)

Guess I shouldnt get too stressed about only being 1/2 done with my 2014/15 wood... gotta be done by spring though!


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## Wood Duck (Oct 14, 2011)

If anyone asks why I have so much firewood in the back yard I tell them that burning dry wood is a whole lot nicer than burning wet, unseasoned wood, and they should try it. I also mention that I get an extra 30% more heat because I am not evaporating a lot of extra water. I doubt I have changed anyone's mind, but maybe a few are thinking it.


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## Backwoods Savage (Oct 14, 2011)

What really disturbs me is all the OWB's that are being sold and installed. One of the first things the sales people tell folks is that you can burn green wood in them. Of course you can and this is about as far as it goes. If folks would realize how much better the wood will burn and how much less would be required if they burned dry wood this area would have a lot cleaner air. However, lazy usually takes over and we see many who just cut as needed and throw it into the stove. They seem to be very proud of it too.


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## krex1010 (Oct 14, 2011)

BrotherBart said:
			
		

> One of my neighbors will have his wood for this year ready soon. Tree service cut down some big oaks in his yard a few days ago and now that it has stopped raining he is splitting it.


My next door neighbor loves his firewood guy because he gives him " good fresh oak" every year. Thankfully he only burns about a cord a year.  But he has actually offered me some of his to burn because my firewood looks "old and grey"


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## oldspark (Oct 14, 2011)

Whats so hard to understand about water dont burn?


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## willworkforwood (Oct 14, 2011)

BrotherBart said:
			
		

> One of my neighbors will have his wood for this year ready soon. Tree service cut down some big oaks in his yard a few days ago and now that it has stopped raining he is splitting it.


Have some fun with it BB.  Tell him that it shouldn't be split or even bucked - just drag a log into the living room, pour some gas on it, and light it up.


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## Flatbedford (Oct 14, 2011)

There is a weird old guy about 1/2 mile from me that burns 24/7 fall winter. he gets logs from one of the local tree guys. He got some beautiful Black Locust two weeks ago. It is now all split and stacked outside his front door. The house and barn chimney are smoking away! Sometimes driving by his place is like driving through fog. I won't talk to him. A local old timer advised against trying to be friendly with the guy. When one kinda crusty local old timer tells the new, young guy that I should stay away, I do as he says.


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## adrpga498 (Oct 15, 2011)

oldspark said:
			
		

> Whats so hard to understand about water dont burn?




Now thats funny, best I've heard so far today.


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## Dix (Oct 15, 2011)

oldspark said:
			
		

> Whats so hard to understand about water dont burn?



OS, I have thought about this. Because 5-10 years ago when I was burning my fireplace to supplement the heat (old style heatalator, it did heat, when it was running), I never thought about dry/wet wood. I'd just order a cord or two, save the dead fall over the year, and fire away. I bought alot of ire starters, fat wood, etc. Never gave it a thought. 

Even when I started with the PE, I figured..naah, those guys are lying, I'll be OK with wood split in April (if I was lucky). Clogged my chimney by January the first year.(OK, ok, I worked on getting more seasoned wood, it didn't take long !)

The wake up call was when we had an oak tree cut down 3 years ago, and were left with a 10 foot upright trunk left. 8 months later, we cut it down, and the water poured out of it for a good 1/2 hour. Major "whooaaa" moment. I had had no idea. 

Most peeps don't realize how wet the wood is when a tree is cut down.

Says she who is as of this weekend or shortly after sitting on 10 +  cords, and with 6 + cords ready to go for this winter


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## wannabegreener (Oct 15, 2011)

fossil said:
			
		

> cptoneleg said:
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I was thinking the same thing.  That is hilarious


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## blacktail (Oct 15, 2011)

Entertaining thread. I bought my house less than 2 months ago. Everyone around here has a wood stove but I don't know about their burning habits yet. I'm sure most people have had at least a couple of fires going since I've been here and I haven't noticed any smoke, so that's a good sign. 
There used to be a guy around the corner from my parents' house who would cover the neighborhood in smoke every day during winter. The wood he used must have been wet, but my dad said the guy stuffed his stove and then shut the throttle down so it would just smolder all day. 
I always peek at my chimney to get a feel for how I'm doing. Burning dirty contributes to burn bans, gives burners a bad name, and smoking the neighborhood is simply rude.


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## Wood Duck (Oct 15, 2011)

JamiePNW78 said:
			
		

> Entertaining thread. I bought my house less than 2 months ago. Everyone around here has a wood stove but I don't know about their burning habits yet.



You can get a good idea of their burning habits by looking at their wood piles. If the wood is still in log lengths, and if there aren't a bunch of stacks of grey firewood around, it is a good bet they aren't going to burn seasoned wood. Around here I am impressed by the number of people who seem to have be a year ahead or so on their wood piles. A few are many years ahead.


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## blacktail (Oct 16, 2011)

I've only seen the wood supply of two neighbors. One has it all in a large wood shed that prevents much of a view. The other neighbor has wood stacked in every place that's under cover. It's an impressive supply so I doubt he has to burn wet stuff. As for other people around here, with the trees and distance, I can't see what they've got for wood.


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## Got Wood (Oct 16, 2011)

We were out to dinner Friday night with a few friends, one of which is a wood burner who also happens to have 30+ acres of land with a good percentage wooded. This guy has been burning wood for over 30 years. I know from prior conversations that his plan for wood is to find standing dead, cut and split it there, load onto his tractor and drive it up to the porch and pull the wood off it to put in the stove. He knows I think he is crazy but he thinks I'm more crazy with all the wood stacks and being ahead. I got a laugh when he said normally burns 5-6 cords a year but got into trouble last year when he had issues getting to the wood (standing dead) because we had so much snow on the ground.

Side note - we got into a discussion about how effective his stove is at heating the house. He said the rooms farther away were always really cold. I suggested the idea of blowing cold air at the stove to improve circulation and get the heat to those rooms. I think I convinced him to atleast try it.


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## nate379 (Oct 16, 2011)

How does a person even get that crap to light?


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## oldspark (Oct 16, 2011)

NATE379 said:
			
		

> How does a person even get that crap to light?


 About 34 years ago when I first started burning I tried some grean elm and boxelder and decided it was too much of a pain, not sure why or how some people never learn how much easier it is too burn dry wood (never mind the extra heat).


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## wannabegreener (Oct 16, 2011)

NATE379 said:
			
		

> How does a person even get that crap to light?



I've been thinking the same thing.  Last year was my first and the end of my wood supply was cut and stacked in oct.  It is ash, so I was hoping I could burn it in march.  I could not light it.  Used up all of my kindling but could not get the fire to light. When/if if did light, the stove was only at 300 degree.  I had to clean the glass constantly.  After a coulpe of days of fighting with the wood, I turned on the oil heat.  Killed me to do it, but the wood was not usable.

I now have all of that ash from last oct, plus the rest that I split in march of this year.  I hope to not run out of dry wood again.


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## mainemaul (Oct 17, 2011)

Backwoods Savage said:
			
		

> What really disturbs me is all the OWB's that are being sold and installed. One of the first things the sales people tell folks is that you can burn green wood in them. Of course you can and this is about as far as it goes. If folks would realize how much better the wood will burn and how much less would be required if they burned dry wood this area would have a lot cleaner air. However, lazy usually takes over and we see many who just cut as needed and throw it into the stove. They seem to be very proud of it too.


I have a buddy who has an OWB and swears by the green wood theory.
There is no talking to him about dry wood and not burning off moisture, I just gave up!!


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## 3fordasho (Oct 17, 2011)

mainemaul said:
			
		

> Backwoods Savage said:
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A co-worker has an OWB on his farm.  I was always amazed at how late in the year he would start cutting wood for the upcoming heating season.  He couldn't believe it when I told him I let my wood dry at least two years and mentioned all the benefits of dry wood.  His experience when burning dry wood in the OWB was it burned up way too fast and didn't put out anymore heat then the green stuff.  Also less loading with green.


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## pen (Oct 17, 2011)

3fordasho said:
			
		

> mainemaul said:
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One guy I cut wood with has the same experience.  The OWB is so damn inefficient that it can't make use of the dry wood by burning it in a controlled fashion.

Putting dry wood in an OWB is about like putting 110 ocatane VP racing fuel in my f-150.  It won't make 1 hp more because it's not designed to take advantage of the good fuel.  

pen


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## MasterMech (Oct 17, 2011)

I think we're going to have a mess on our hands when the old fire-in-a-box type OWB's are banned and folks try to burn 12"x36" logs they cut yesterday in their new, expensive, gassifier OWB's.


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## richg (Oct 17, 2011)

For the original poster, here's my recommendation: there are special logs you can buy that are supposed to extinguish a chimney fire. When a chimney fire erupts, you thrown them in your stove or fireplace and they put the fire out. Buy one for your neighbor and tell him that when he gets a chimney fire, throw this log in there and he might have enough house left to salvage some pots and pans.


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## Danno77 (Oct 17, 2011)

richg said:
			
		

> For the original poster, here's my recommendation: there are special logs you can buy that are supposed to extinguish a chimney fire. When a chimney fire erupts, you thrown them in your stove or fireplace and they put the fire out. Buy one for your neighbor and tell him that when he gets a chimney fire, throw this log in there and he might have enough house left to salvage some pots and pans.


Ok, smarty, but how is one to keep the chimbley clean without a good weekly chimbley fire? Duh.

(Jake, if your are reading this, thanks for "chimbley," that still cracks me up)


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## pen (Oct 17, 2011)

I think this has played out.  Good luck w/ the neighbor.  

pen


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