# So who burns one year seasoned wood with no problems, including oak?



## MarkinNC (Aug 22, 2011)

This will be year 2 for me burning.  I went from zero years ahead to 4-5 years ahead wood wise.  Most of it is oak, red and white and it will be seasoned greater than one year.  A lot of the trees were dead or dying that I cut but they were still pretty wet last year.  The wood is much lighter feeling now.

Surely I won't have problems catching 1 year seasoned wood on fire like the garbage I bought from a firewood peddler last year.  I can see how it would be better after two years, but surely one will be adequate.  I am guessing I will have longer burns since I am not wasting energy evaporating water in the wood.  I do have a cord of maple and poplar as well.

Opinions?


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## EatenByLimestone (Aug 22, 2011)

Depending on how large the splits are and how much sun and wind you have hitting your stacks you may be ok.  There is a good chance the wood is still "wet" though.  White oak's water tightness is a prime reason why it is used for water containers.   

When it comes down to it, you have to burn what you have and stacked for a year is better than stacked for a week.  Mix your maple and poplar in with your oak as it will probably be dryer. 

Matt


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## smokinj (Aug 22, 2011)

Not oak but anything else is good to go for me!


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## Backwoods Savage (Aug 22, 2011)

Best I can say is good luck on the oak. When we cut oak, we usually don't even look at it for 3 years after it is split and stacked. However, I cut some dead pin oak last spring that surprised me. I may even try to burn a little bit of it in January just for kicks. 

Congratulations on getting 4-5 year ahead too. That is super!


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## Cascade Failure (Aug 22, 2011)

One year oak is better than no wood at all. That's the best I can say. I really hate watching water spit out of wood.


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## Wood Duck (Aug 22, 2011)

Who burns one year seasoned wood? Almost everyone around here burns wood that is not seasoned at all, so you are way ahead of average. I would expect it to burn just fine. You will probably be satisfied unless you know how well better seasoned oak burns.


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## joefrompa (Aug 22, 2011)

I've got pine that'll get ~4-5 months of seasoning before I burn it. And I expect it to do great. Ash, elm, and random other bits get maybe 6-9 months and will be great.

I'm gonna buy some 2-year seasoned pin-oak from a neighbor just for the experience of burning wood that, size for size, holds alot more BTUs than I'm used too


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## woodsmaster (Aug 22, 2011)

1 year oak may be hard to light and not burn the best ,but if you need to throw a piece or two on top of the dry wood.


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## n3pro (Aug 22, 2011)

Very rare for me to get oak, all of mine is one year seasoned, don't have the room for much else.


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## CTYank (Aug 22, 2011)

Lots of folks get hung up on this "seasoned x years" thing, but it's more meaningless than "ricks."

The process you're trying to manage is really "air-drying" and it's well-documented. Including the fact
that oak takes much longer than other hardwoods to air-dry down to a given MC.

Since your intended product is low-moisture-content wood, you can drop all the guesswork and guesstimating
with a moisture-content meter. Some go for $10 at Harbor Freight, and work fine.

For some yardsticks, when the moisture content (MC) inside the wood is
    below 20%, it's ready for a desperation-burn,
    below 15%,           "          decent           "   ,
    below 10%, it's pretty good for burning in an EPA stove.

If it's stored inside for a while (weeks+) near the stove, and the MC is well down in the single-digits, it's primo.

Please note also, that in the fall "shoulder" season, there's no need to burn the potentially best stuff. That's
the time to burn the less-desirables, while warming and finishing drying some of the really good stuff indoors.


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## PapaDave (Aug 22, 2011)

In my setup, I can burn Spruce, White Pine, Poplar, within a year. Maple takes a little longer, but burns pretty well in a year (soft maple). 
The oak can be burned, but what a pain! Last year was the best yet with almost 2 year dried oak, and some of it still sizzled a little. This year, the oak will have had *over* 2 years, so I'm thinking it will be better still.
This is oak from a log load I got. I will find out how well this stuff burns very shortly.......well, after I go through the Spruce and uglies.


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## lukem (Aug 22, 2011)

Nothing wrong with burning unseasoned wood, just not as efficient.  More heat is wasted converting the water to steam.

You also have the reduced "risk" of creosote.  Not a sure thing, but def more likely.  You just have to keep an eye on the flue and clean it accordingly.

Depending on your stove, it will prob be more finicky.

Is dry wood better?  ABSOLUTELY. Is bury wet wood disaster?  Not eeally, just takes more wood and effort.


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## cptoneleg (Aug 22, 2011)

My first year with EPA stove I burned about 3 cords of 6 and 7 month oak  with about 1 1/2 cord of 14 month oak , stayed warm furnace never kicked on and cleaned chimney 3 times and cleaned the glass alot.  Not to say its the ideal thing to do but yes you can.  I split everything real small.  


     And the 25 yrs before that I burned wood seasoned 1 day sometimes.   You heard me cut live tree split and right to the fire same day, it had no glass to clean, and back then I only cleaned chimney once a year.


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## oldspark (Aug 23, 2011)

CTYank said:
			
		

> Lots of folks get hung up on this "seasoned x years" thing, but it's more meaningless than "ricks."
> 
> The process you're trying to manage is really "air-drying" and it's well-documented. Including the fact
> that oak takes much longer than other hardwoods to air-dry down to a given MC.
> ...


HUH? below 20% desperation-burn, on what planet?


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## dafattkidd (Aug 23, 2011)

oldspark said:
			
		

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That's what I'm thinking.  Those numbers seem a bit wacky.  Are you splitting those suckers in and taking a reading from the middle?  I can't get a 10% reading on kiln dried hardwood flooring.


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## pants on fire (Aug 23, 2011)

I think wood stored outdoors here reaches equilibrium in the mid to upper teens.  You'd have to use artificial means to get it below that.  I have read (might be a controversial point) that, at a moisture content below 15%, fuel in an EPA stove doesn't give off an adequate amount of gases for secondary combustion.

From enerysavers.gov (regarding wood for EPA stoves)

"It should have a moisture content of just over 20%â€“25% by weight. Some well-seasoned wood can in fact be too dry for today's airtight modern stoves. If you place wood that is too dry on a bed of coals, it will instantly give up its gases as smoke, wasting unburned smoke and producing creosote buildup."


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## cptoneleg (Aug 23, 2011)

I told you before the Woodpecker is nuts he said that in several posts furniture isn't that dry


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## woodsmaster (Aug 23, 2011)

CTYank said:
			
		

> Lots of folks get hung up on this "seasoned x years" thing, but it's more meaningless than "ricks."
> 
> The process you're trying to manage is really "air-drying" and it's well-documented. Including the fact
> that oak takes much longer than other hardwoods to air-dry down to a given MC.
> ...



Where did you get that info. ? Not on hearth.


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## Dix (Aug 23, 2011)

Posted on wrong thread.


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## cptoneleg (Aug 23, 2011)

woodsmaster said:
			
		

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My wife just bought an antique rocking chair should be about 150 yrs old, probably the only thing we have in that ( pretty good for burning ) range. :lol:


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## oldspark (Aug 23, 2011)

cptoneleg said:
			
		

> I told you before the Woodpecker is nuts he said that in several posts furniture isn't that dry


   :lol:


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## Woody Stover (Aug 23, 2011)

woodsmaster said:
			
		

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Dennis has said that wood dried for many years burns the best for him. If I'm not mistaken, he's mentioned that a time of two.  :smirk: 
Wood that old has got to be in the low double digits MC, I'd think. As I've said before, wood that's at 18% hisses in our stove so I'm shooting for 15% max.


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## mayhem (Aug 23, 2011)

The longer your wood has seasoned and dried out, the better off you are.  It'll burn hotter and, your emissions will be lower and your chimney will stay cleaner.

That said, I seem to be unable to break out of the split in the summer/fall to burn that winter cycle.  Last winter I burned about a quarter cord of oak that I cut from trunks during the summer and didn't split until about a month before I burned it.  It sizzled a fair bit but it burned and was great overnight wood.  

Put a fan on your wood if you can and let it run for a few weeks...the constant airflow will wick away a surprising amount of moisture and speed the initial seasoning.


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## oldspark (Aug 23, 2011)

Woody Stover said:
			
		

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No way in hell 18% wood should hiss, normaly wood that has moisture comeing out the ends is in the high 20's.


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## albertj03 (Aug 23, 2011)

In my neck of the woods, where red oak is the most abundant hardwood, most people consider 1 year to be perfectly seasoned. Of course most people still use pre-EPA stoves and let the wood sit tree length and cut it in the fall.

Personally I've had good luck burning year old oak in my EPA stove. The key is to split it small and stack it in the most windy and sunny spot you can find. If you can, only cover the stacks when it rains and leave them uncovered when it's not raining. I prefer to split it a little larger and give it 18+ months before it hits the stove.


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## Jags (Aug 23, 2011)

Virtually every MFG recommends the use of wood in the 20% range.  Kiln dried lumber is NOT recommended because the moisture content is TOO low.  You get 10% wood and load up a stove, ya better hang on and be diligent in your operation or your gonna create your own volcano.

Less than 25% - Burnable.
~20% - acceptable.
17-18% - (about the bottom you will see in air dried - and yes it can go lower, but not by much) - Premo stuff.

If you have nothing to compare it to, you won't be disappointed in your 12 mo. Oak.  That is, till you have burned 2 or 3 year old stuff, and realize its full potential.

And yes, if you compile the data, the numbers above are not made up - they are a generalization (compiled average) of the real world of EPA stoves.

10% firewood - good grief. :blank:


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## 70marlin (Aug 23, 2011)

Been there done that. 1st year only had four months to get wood. Mostly ash, poplar and oak. Finished the season scrounging pallets.


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## joefrompa (Aug 23, 2011)

I like to just go by feel. When I pick it up, does it feel ready to burn? Let the wood speak to you 

Seriously though, I know when I first take my wheelbarrow to the wood pile to start bringing it into (or close to) the house, I'll go by feel. If a split feels dry/light/etc. I'll put it in the barrow. If I pick up a similar sized piece of the same species, and it feels heavy, I put it back for later. 

It's not like you are going to have a uniform MC, even in a single piece. Just burn the best stuff you have - it's still better than no fire at all.

Also, the difference between 18% MC and 20% MC is 2% water. In a 5 pound log, that'd be the difference between 409 grams of water and 454 grams. We're talking about 1/20th a liter of water per split difference.

I get that it adds up, but when you consider the difference between 25% MC and 20% MC, both of which burn fine, you start to realize that we're arguing pretty minor differences. Which, I know we are experts on


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## gpcollen1 (Aug 23, 2011)

CTYank said:
			
		

> Lots of folks get hung up on this "seasoned x years" thing, but it's more meaningless than "ricks."
> 
> The process you're trying to manage is really "air-drying" and it's well-documented. Including the fact
> that oak takes much longer than other hardwoods to air-dry down to a given MC.
> ...



20% = desperation??

10% = ready??

I cannot get on board with this at all.  Somewhere around 20% burns just fine in both of my EPA stoves.


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## rdust (Aug 23, 2011)

Woody Stover said:
			
		

> Dennis has said that wood dried for many years burns the best for him. If I'm not mistaken, he's mentioned that a time of two.  :smirk:
> Wood that old has got to be in the low double digits MC, I'd think. As I've said before, wood that's at 18% hisses in our stove so I'm shooting for 15% max.




Wood is only going to get as low as the local environment lets it.  Dennis saved me my first year of burning and hooked me up with a cord + of the "good stuff".  Just for kicks I split a piece or two and put the moisture meter on it and fresh faces of the splits were around 18%.  I find this to be about as low as my area will let it go when sitting stacked outside.  A while back I grabbed some rounds of elm from my dad that he couldn't split from 22 years ago, he had them sitting outside under his wood rack which is off the ground.  I split them open and they read 12-14%.  Here is a link to that post https://www.hearth.com/econtent/index.php/forums/viewthread/53463/

I've also burned oak at 20% on my meter and had some water boil out of it so I think wood type plays a role in it.  Even at 20% it still has moisture that has to go somewhere, no reason it can't come out of the ends.  I've burned ash near 30% my first year and didn't even get moisture on the ends.


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## bogydave (Aug 23, 2011)

Wish I had the problem of Oak taking longer to dry.
I burn spruce 1 year seasoned & birch if i have too.
Birch, 2yrs seasoned,  a big difference in the way it burns in the new stove, soooooo much better.


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## oldspark (Aug 23, 2011)

I burn Oak all the time and it never sizzles, not sure what is going on with what some of you are seeing.


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## cptoneleg (Aug 23, 2011)

CTYank said:
			
		

> Lots of folks get hung up on this "seasoned x years" thing, but it's more meaningless than "ricks."
> 
> The process you're trying to manage is really "air-drying" and it's well-documented. Including the fact
> that oak takes much longer than other hardwoods to air-dry down to a given MC.
> ...







  Post some pictures of your wood piles you know show off like we all do.


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## Woody Stover (Aug 23, 2011)

oldspark said:
			
		

> I burn Oak all the time and it never sizzles, not sure what is going on with what some of you are seeing.


At 18%, moisture wasn't bubbling out the ends. There was just an audible hiss.


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## cptoneleg (Aug 23, 2011)

Your just too pickey wood don't get better than 18%, I don't know if its good for your stove to get lower than that .  I burned Oak in the 30s stayed warm, all I had.  Keep her Hot , shut the door no hiss.

  Good Luck


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## MarkinNC (Aug 24, 2011)

Jag's  post shares my perspective.  i was doing a mental inventory today.  I arguably have enough non-oak wood to make it through the winter.  I have some beech that burned super (standing dead that was dry) and I have access to more.  I am really hoping the oak will be adequate, meaning, it will catch on fire, and burn decent, not stellar but decent.  All of the wood will actually be over 1 year seasoned.

 I did burn some of the dead oaks I cut last year. I would judge the weight by feel.  Some of the splits would stain my glass a little but it was that a hot fire could not fix.  The softer woods I have like maple, poplar, beech are all nicely dry.  I also have access to gobs of very dry kindling.  I brought home a truck load already.

Last year went better than I thought.  This year will surely be better.

Thanks for all the replies.  I think my next post will be about volatile gas loss from over seasoning of oak firewood


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## fabsroman (Aug 24, 2011)

oldspark said:
			
		

> I burn Oak all the time and it never sizzles, not sure what is going on with what some of you are seeing.



I burn steaks all the time and they sizzle like crazy. However, if I get it just right they taste oh so good. Now, I am hungry.

You guys have me way too worried about all this stuff. This will be my first year burning and I have about 5 cords of wood scrounged already. My parents and wife think I am nuts. Might be because I just broke the 8' x 16' wood shed news to them. We shall see how this goes. I have about 2.0 cords of well seasoned stuff, some that will be about 4 to 5 months on the rack before it will be burned, and if needed the rest will be about 2 to 3 months on the rack before it gets burned. Next year should be awesome. Now, as soon as I can start figuring out what these tree species are I will be in great shape. Without seeing the leaves, I can hardly tell oak apart from anything else.


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## firefighterjake (Aug 24, 2011)

fabsroman said:
			
		

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I think it's pretty normal to come here when you get a new woodstove -- then discover that the wood you cut three months ago may not be all that great for burning in the woodstove. The good news is that you should not worry too much . . . I mean definitely see if you cannot get some pallets for use in helping to start the fires and for "drying" out any excess moisture in the splits in the stove . . . and you will want to frequently inspect and clean the chimney . . . and be aware that you may find the stove's "glass" gets dirty relatively quickly . . . but you will survive and stay warm and not burn your house down in the process.

The even better news is that if you learn how important well seasoned wood is and work right now to get next year's wood put up when you go to burn in Year 2 you will suddenly discover just how well your woodstove really works in terms of heat, secondary burns (if it is a secondary burner), clean burns, etc. . . . I know I thought I did pretty well in my first year of burning with semi-seasoned wood . . . we stayed warm and the chimney was never excessively dirty. However, in Year 2 I re-discovered my woodstove with easier to light fires, more intense secondaries and glass that would stay cleaner long . . . it was a whole new experience.


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## fabsroman (Aug 24, 2011)

firefighterjake said:
			
		

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Trust me, I am getting ahead of the curve as we speak. I already have all of this year's wood cut and split with half of it stacked and I have half of next year's cut and split too. This is assuming that I only need 3 cords. My dad thinks 3 cords will be plenty, but who really knows.

By the time next winter gets here, I should be in pretty good shape. After today, I will have around 5 cords of wood and I still have a bunch of additional trees to cut up and split. Probably another 4 or 5 cords of wood available. I am hoping to have 10 cords c/s/s by the time it gets really cold and then I am hoping to have one heck of a wood shed built next spring once tax season is over. I can tell you one thing though, I am getting sick and tired of moving firewood around. I want to get to the point where I stack it and leave it until it is ready to come in the house to be burned.

As far as the glass on the stove is concerned, I don't have to worry about that. I have a furnace with absolutely no glass on it. As far as starting the fire is concerned, don't really have to worry about that either. The natural gas backup fires in the chamber where the wood is, so that lights the fire. Just need to fill it up and turn on the thermostat for the natural gas. The furnace will light the wood. I guess the furnace would dry it out too if it really is that wet.


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## firefighterjake (Aug 24, 2011)

fabsroman said:
			
		

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You're smart to get more wood than you think you need . . . properly stored it it will not spoil, go rancid or curdle on you.  Besides, I have seen far too many folks under-estimate their burning needs and resign themselves to switching over to oil/gas sometime in March or April . . . I have yet to hear of anyone complain that they have too much wood left over when their heating season ends -- most just view any overage as the start of next year's wood supply.


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## oldspark (Aug 24, 2011)

fabsroman, my guess is your furnace will not be as persnickety as some of the EPA stoves so it will be all good.


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## fabsroman (Aug 24, 2011)

firefighterjake said:
			
		

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We hardly need any heat in April. Don't know if I will even be burning in April. That is when bike riding is great. April and September is when the weather is awesome around here. We have the windows open today with the AC shut off. March isn't too bad of a month either, but we will probably burn some wood in March.


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