# Energy king 385ek not heating whole house



## Benjamin5985 (Feb 1, 2021)

Hello everyone!

I am very new here and very limited on knowledge of wood furnaces so be easy on me lol. This is my last resort before ripping this unit out and sticking with propane.

alittle history We had the home built 4 years ago and put in a propane unit, and a wood furnance that would allow me to tie Them into the same ducting. Right now if the wood furnance is running it closes a auto dampener to let the heat upstairs not back into the propane ducting but if it doesn’t call for heat is dumped in the basement . If I am lazy I turn the propane on and it closes the Wood dampener and propane works. That’s the function of the unit butttttttt here’s the frustrating part.

the wood stove will heat the house but does not get to the far ends of the home at all and is not reliable steady warmth. The unit seems to not get enough pressure to push the heat to the far ends but I am not hvac tech I climb towers and build dispatch centers. We are having a baby girl soon and wanna keep her room warm. Looking for some input or help. Wood is pretty darn dry. Been on the ground for a few years and out in the open field split for maybe 8/9mths

last cold day measuring the room it was 71 in the hallway and middle of the house and her room it was 61/62


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## laynes69 (Feb 1, 2021)

Wood on the ground can contain more moisture than standing, 8 to 9 months is not enough to season. I'm a year or two ahead, that's split, covered and stacked. It sounds like you have a zone system, if the home temp is met and it dumps in the basement, the ductwork cools. Then opens back up and takes that time to reheat and distribute. To me it sounds partly a ducting issue. Putting the heat in the living space and letting it circulate will do more than dumping in the basement. Normally those who have a furnace load based on demand. How tall is your chimney? The furnace looks like it's been damn hot. Also flexible ducting is a no no with solid fuel.


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## Benjamin5985 (Feb 1, 2021)

I will have to check tonight but it is above the roof line. Thanks for the input on the wood I’ll get more split and open up for the next few seasons. Those are mostly returns I have one duct we had to add for the baby room so they used it for that.

Here is a pic of the chimney


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## GENECOP (Feb 1, 2021)

What is the BTU rating on both appliances? How much do you load into the wood furnace?
When burning wood only,  can you adjust dampers to divert more heat into the cold rooms?


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## Benjamin5985 (Feb 1, 2021)

GENECOP said:


> What is the BTU rating on both appliances? How much do you load into the wood furnace?
> When burning wood only,  can you adjust dampers to divert more heat into the cold rooms?


It is 125,000
I usually load it in the am and the evening but throughout the day my wife countiously puts 2/3 things of wood in, I cannot adjust it with  dampeners most of the ducts are fixed


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## andym (Feb 1, 2021)

I agree with laynes69 that it sounds like primarily a ducting issue. Any idea how many cfm the wood furnace blower is?


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## brenndatomu (Feb 1, 2021)

Sounds like you have a number of issues going on here...might have wet wood, and flex duct in the system...that stuff has awful flow characteristics...and is not approved for wood or coal heat. 
What speed is the blower wired to?
Have an air filter on it, if so, what # filter? Wood furnaces generally don't use high MERV filters...2-4...some maybe 6 at the very highest.
Your duct system is just not balanced well for running the lower CFM that wood furnaces tend to run...so you will need to install some dampers in the ducts, or put some adjustable register covers on...you need to restrict the closer ones so that there is enough pressure/flow to push some heat to the far end of the house...


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## Benjamin5985 (Feb 1, 2021)

I will look into the cfm for sure. I have tried adjusting the the restrictions on the vents and that didn’t help at all. The heat feels very weak coming out. I have only one flex duct that’s the only one the rest is solid duct insulated and sealed.


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## Benjamin5985 (Feb 1, 2021)

Low 1400 medium 1600 high 1850cfm


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## brenndatomu (Feb 1, 2021)

So that's a decent sized blower....what's in it for a filter?


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## Benjamin5985 (Feb 1, 2021)

Two merv 11 in the main hallways and nothing in the mothers


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## brenndatomu (Feb 1, 2021)

Huh?
Well, if the wood furnace is having to breath through a MERV 11 filter, that is WAY too high...that will kill your air flow right there!
Drop a cheapy blue MERV 2 fiberglass in it and see what happens...or a white fiberglass MERV 4...


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## Benjamin5985 (Feb 1, 2021)

brenndatomu said:


> Huh?
> Well, if the wood furnace is having to breath through a MERV 11 filter, that is WAY too high...that will kill your air flow right there!
> Drop a cheapy blue MERV 2 fiberglass in it and see what happens...or a white fiberglass MERV 4...


I can get merv 6 on Amazon will that work for a test? Also the propane that is connected to the same ducting and returns when it runs keeps the house warmer and warms that farm room within 1-2 degrees


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## brenndatomu (Feb 1, 2021)

Benjamin5985 said:


> I can get merv 6 on Amazon will that work for a test?


6 would be better than 11...but search for a 2-4 in your size...Amazon has them...or better yet, pick one up at the hardware for a couple bucks...I think you have to buy a case of 12 when you order them online (generally) What size is it?


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## brenndatomu (Feb 1, 2021)

Benjamin5985 said:


> Also the propane that is connected to the same ducting and returns when it runs keeps the house warmer and warms that farm room within 1-2 degrees


Its really hard to compare fossil fuel to wood fired...that LP furnace is running at 100%, and can do so for hours on end...hard to do that with wood fired...


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## Benjamin5985 (Feb 1, 2021)

brenndatomu said:


> 6 would be better than 11...but search for a 2-4 in your size...Amazon has them...or better yet, pick one up at the hardware for a couple bucks...I think you have to buy a case of 12 when you order them online (generally) What size is it?



12x24x1

very odd size

I’ve always thought of adding another return right on the wood furnance blower area for better flow also or cut the back out and do a slide in filter on the back


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## Benjamin5985 (Feb 1, 2021)

Would a draft motor help me produce more heat in the house?


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## brenndatomu (Feb 1, 2021)

Benjamin5985 said:


> 12x24x1
> 
> very odd size
> 
> I’ve always thought of adding another return right on the wood furnance blower area for better flow also or cut the back out and do a slide in filter on the back


Amazon product


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## brenndatomu (Feb 1, 2021)

Benjamin5985 said:


> Would a draft motor help me produce more heat in the house?


Nah...natural draft works just fine...and I've had and hate forced draft!
Besides, as someone mentioned earlier, by the looks of the front of the furnace, it has been plenty hot!


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## Benjamin5985 (Feb 1, 2021)

brenndatomu said:


> Nah...natural draft works just fine...and I've had and hate forced draft!
> Besides, as someone mentioned earlier, by the looks of the front of the furnace, it has been plenty hot!



Yeaaaaaaa wellllll lol may have accidentally left the dampener open once of twice.  Still hear about it from the wife Lolol 

Found 12 pack of merv 4 on eBay for $30 and merv 6 on Amazon $35 i got both 

I will def try that but any other suggestion? Should I add another return right on top of the circulator fan for the wood furnace?

i am out of ideas


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## brenndatomu (Feb 1, 2021)

What's your chimney draft like? Ever put a manometer on it?
If you have high draft that can suck the heat right up the chimney...


Benjamin5985 said:


> Should I add another return right on top of the circulator fan for the wood furnace?


I'd wait and make one change at a time....


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## Benjamin5985 (Feb 1, 2021)

brenndatomu said:


> What's your chimney draft like? Ever put a manometer on it?
> If you have high draft that can suck the heat right up the chimney...
> 
> I'd wait and make one change at a time....



I have no done that and I am going to be 100% honest not even sure how to do it. Open to suggestions and I understand I’ll take it one step at a time. My returns are so loud it’s annoying when we added a return on the propane side it made it so much more tolerable.


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## brenndatomu (Feb 1, 2021)

Benjamin5985 said:


> My returns are so loud it’s annoying when we added a return on the propane side it made it so much more tolerable.


Hmm...that's weird...noise means turbulence and restriction...not good...sounds like a visit from a good HVAC tech would be warranted...but those guys can be hard to find.


Benjamin5985 said:


> not even sure how to do it.


You could have it tested, but honestly I'd save my money and just buy a Dwyer Mark II model 25 manometer, and then just leave it hooked up...many of us do. Its easy to set up.
You can buy them pretty cheap on ebay/etc. Just make sure it comes with the accessories and gauge oil...its a little pricey to buy separately.


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## brenndatomu (Feb 1, 2021)

Example








						Dwyer MARK II 25 Plastic Manometer 0-3" WC, Stand/Vertical Mount for sale online | eBay
					

Find many great new & used options and get the best deals for Dwyer MARK II 25 Plastic Manometer 0-3" WC, Stand/Vertical Mount at the best online prices at eBay! Free shipping for many products!



					www.ebay.com


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## Benjamin5985 (Feb 1, 2021)

brenndatomu said:


> Hmm...that's weird...noise means turbulence and restriction...not good...sounds like a visit from a good HVAC tech would be warranted...but those guys can be hard to find.
> 
> You could have it tested, but honestly I'd save my money and just buy a Dwyer Mark II model 25 manometer, and then just leave it hooked up...many of us do. Its easy to set up.
> You can buy them pretty cheap on ebay/etc. Just make sure it comes with the accessories and gauge oil...its a little pricey to buy separately.



I’ll def do that I’ll look online for it tomorrow. Any tips of tricks on install or the instructions pretty solid??

Also 3 hvac techs later two first ones sucked

last one just installed two more returns in the house and another vent for littlesoon baby room for more air flow. Each time these guys visit it’s $1k out the door I am hoping to be getting close to a solution I am at about 4K so far lol.


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## brenndatomu (Feb 1, 2021)

Easy to set up.
Just need to mount to wall or something, needs to be flat/level...put in oil, hook up hose, zero gauge, drill small hole in stovepipe, insert a small metal tube (1/4 copper, or brake line) in stovepipe, hook rubber tube to the metal tube, bam, done.


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## Benjamin5985 (Feb 1, 2021)

brenndatomu said:


> Example
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Ordered that exact one u sent me 

thank you Any chance in the future you can show me a pic of how yours is mounted? Any location better then others? So I’m looking for heat loss in the chimney?

what numbers are good and what’s bad


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## andym (Feb 1, 2021)

Benjamin5985 said:


> We are having a baby girl soon and wanna keep her room warm. Looking for some input or help.


Congrats, by the way! 61° is a little chilly, but I wouldn't freak out about it. Babies are usually wrapped up pretty warmly and actually handle cool temps pretty well. At least our 3 have! 
I can't resist.....were you asking for input  on the furnace or the baby? LOL!
I don't blame ya for wanting to improve the air distribution, I did some extensive revamping of our HVAC ducting a year ago with great results.


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## brenndatomu (Feb 1, 2021)

Benjamin5985 said:


> Ordered that exact one u sent me
> 
> thank you Any chance in the future you can show me a pic of how yours is mounted? Any location better then others? So I’m looking for heat loss in the chimney?
> 
> what numbers are good and what’s bad


I just have mine mounted on a piece of plywood and then that's mounted on the wall.
You are measuring chimney draft...not sure what the specs are on your furnace, but -0.04 to -0.06" are pretty common specs.
If its much more than that, the draft speed is too high, and that pull lots of extra heat up the chimney...not good for warming the house.


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## Benjamin5985 (Feb 1, 2021)

andym said:


> Congrats, by the way! 61° is a little chilly, but I wouldn't freak out about it. Babies are usually wrapped up pretty warmly and actually handle cool temps pretty well. At least our 3 have!
> I can't resist.....were you asking for input  on the furnace or the baby? LOL!
> I don't blame ya for wanting to improve the air distribution, I did some extensive revamping of our HVAC ducting a year ago with great results.



What things did you do for better result? Sad the house is only 4 years old but I want it to work great and lol I needed a doctor to make the baby so I may need help hahahah


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## brenndatomu (Feb 1, 2021)

Page 19 of the manual says draft of -0.06" WC is not to be exceeded.
Edit: page 22 says -0.04 to -0.06", as I suspected...


			https://www.energyking.com/manual/energyking-furnace-user-manual.pdf


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## Benjamin5985 (Feb 1, 2021)

brenndatomu said:


> I just have mine mounted on a piece of plywood and then that's mounted on the wall.
> You are measuring chimney draft...not sure what the specs are on your furnace, but -0.04 to -0.06" are pretty common specs.
> If its much more than that, the draft speed is too high, and that pull lots of extra heat up the chimney...not good for warming the house.



Well I am def going to give this a try for sure I will say this when the circulator fan is on I can feel air coming out of the furnace in the front. I personally don’t think that would be normal but again I am a a mature at this. I called energy king today with very little help to none sadly


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## brenndatomu (Feb 1, 2021)

They are still in business? Many/most of the companies that made those older wood furnaces were gone soon after spring of 2020.


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## Benjamin5985 (Feb 1, 2021)

brenndatomu said:


> They are still in business? Many/most of the companies that made those older wood furnaces were gone soon after spring of 2020.



they are part of royal now I believe

so after looking at that page it ask for a dampener in the chimney pipe I def don’t see one of those on mine


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## brenndatomu (Feb 1, 2021)

I noticed that...that's what made me question the draft.
Get yours tested first, and then the damper can be installed if needed...


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## brenndatomu (Feb 1, 2021)

You may want to read through the manual, see if your setup conforms to requirements...lots of info on ductwork, etc...


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## andym (Feb 1, 2021)

Benjamin5985 said:


> What things did you do for better result?


My ductwork was not original. The supply and return ducting for the (partial) 2nd floor were routed through the attic with flex duct. You couldn't tell if the AC was on or not, virtually no air flow. I ran new ducting inside the main floor walls and ceiling. It worked out beautifully. This past summer we did not use our 2nd floor window unit at all. The temps do stay warmer in summer and cooler in winter up there, but you won't get away from that without installing a separate zone. I may add a multi head minisplit up there someday when the children are older. 

Does the baby's room have a return register? Is the door left open? Return air can make a big difference.


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## Benjamin5985 (Feb 1, 2021)

brenndatomu said:


> You may want to read through the manual, see if your setup conforms to requirements...lots of info on ductwork, etc...



Def trying to do that. I asked the chimney guy that when he came he didn’t say anything except installing a clean out. I’ll test it and keep in touch. That def could be a issue for sure


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## Benjamin5985 (Feb 1, 2021)

andym said:


> My ductwork was not original. The supply and return ducting for the (partial) 2nd floor were routed through the attic with flex duct. You couldn't tell if the AC was on or not, virtually no air flow. I ran new ducting inside the main floor walls and ceiling. It worked out beautifully. This past summer we did not use our 2nd floor window unit at all. The temps do stay warmer in summer and cooler in winter up there, but you won't get away from that without installing a separate zone. I may add a multi head minisplit up there someday when the children are older.
> 
> Does the baby's room have a return register? Is the door left open? Return air can make a big difference.



we out three vents in her room one high two low, and the new return ia in the room Right next to it


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## brenndatomu (Feb 1, 2021)

Benjamin5985 said:


> we out three vents in her room one high two low, and the new return ia in the room Right next to it


Return right next to the supply vent?
If so, that isn't good...it will just short circuit...should be as far away from each other as possible...


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## Benjamin5985 (Feb 1, 2021)

brenndatomu said:


> Return right next to the supply vent?
> If so, that isn't good...it will just short circuit...should be as far away from each other as possible...


The room
Right next to her sorry. Total super are room the return is in

I have a return in my master bedroom, spare bedroom and two mains in the hallway


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## maple1 (Feb 2, 2021)

Seems to me some accurate temperature measuring would be in order here? Of several things. Flue temps, plenum temps, register temps...


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## sloeffle (Feb 2, 2021)

brenndatomu said:


> Huh?
> Well, if the wood furnace is having to breath through a MERV 11 filter, that is WAY too high...that will kill your air flow right there!
> Drop a cheapy blue MERV 2 fiberglass in it and see what happens...or a white fiberglass MERV 4...


I started running MERV 11 filters in my wood burning furnace this year because I noticed the house was always very dusty when I was burning wood. The new filters have definitely cut down on the dust in my house.  I ran the junky blue air filters from Menards earlier this year, and for years before that and I haven't noticed much of a difference on how the house heats since switching over to the MERV 11 filters.

For the OP's issue I definitely don't think it wouldn't hurt to use a lower MERV filter as test to see if it helps.


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## brenndatomu (Feb 2, 2021)

sloeffle said:


> I started running MERV 11 filters in my wood burning furnace this year because I noticed the house was always very dusty when I was burning wood. The new filters have definitely cut down on the dust in my house.  I ran the junky blue air filters from Menards earlier this year, and for years before that and I haven't noticed much of a difference on how the house heats since switching over to the MERV 11 filters.
> 
> For the OP's issue I definitely don't think it wouldn't hurt to use a lower MERV filter as test to see if it helps.


You aren't having issues pushing heat to the far end of the house though either...and probably have a larger filter than OP's...if its working for you fine, but I would watch things like a hawk...not gonna take long to get dirty enough to plug up enough to restrict the air and get things hot...that just happened on my sisters Tundra the other night, she called saying it smelled hot...she gave me all the relevant numbers and I told her to pull the air filter out...plenum temp dropped like a rock...filter was dirty...didn't look that bad though. She is running a MERV 6...gonna switch to a 4 though.


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## brenndatomu (Feb 2, 2021)

maple1 said:


> Seems to me some accurate temperature measuring would be in order here? Of several things. Flue temps, plenum temps, register temps...


Yes...that needs to happen too.


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## sloeffle (Feb 2, 2021)

brenndatomu said:


> You aren't having issues pushing heat to the far end of the house though either...and probably have a larger filter than OP's...if its working for you fine, but I would watch things like a hawk...not gonna take long to get dirty enough to plug up enough to restrict the air and get things hot


Correct, I'm actually having the opposite issue, I need to slow the air down going through my furnace. I figured the higher MERV filters would help with that too. I have the same MERV number filter on my geo furnace, and I agree that you need to watch them like a hawk or they will get plugged up pretty fast. My particular version of Caddy has two 12x12 filters. 

Being a frugal person , I usually take them to barn every month or so and blow them out with my air compressor.


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## Benjamin5985 (Feb 2, 2021)

maple1 said:


> Seems to me some accurate temperature measuring would be in order here? Of several things. Flue temps, plenum temps, register temps...


I will look into on how to do this thank u for the input


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## Benjamin5985 (Feb 2, 2021)

maple1 said:


> Seems to me some accurate temperature measuring would be in order here? Of several things. Flue temps, plenum temps, register temps...


 Any recommendations on kits for this so I can measure each one


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## Benjamin5985 (Feb 2, 2021)

Condar stovepipe probe thermometers
					

stovepipe probe thermometers



					www.condar.com
				




This work for the stove pipe? Or is a digital unit better suited


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## woodey (Feb 2, 2021)

brenndatomu said:


> Amazon product



I have been buying my filters from purolatorairfilters.com,  the same filter that came with the wood furnace-- P312 - 14x24x1/ MERV 4.   
Nice filters, a case of 12 delivered   for  $53.73 .


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## brenndatomu (Feb 2, 2021)

Benjamin5985 said:


> Condar stovepipe probe thermometers
> 
> 
> stovepipe probe thermometers
> ...



The Condar would be fine for flue temps...you can use a household meat thermometer to measure duct/register temps....


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## Benjamin5985 (Feb 2, 2021)

brenndatomu said:


> The Condar would be fine for flue temps...you can use a household meat thermometer to measure duct/register temps....



What about a temp laser gun for the duct and register or does it have to be inside the unit?

sorry for all the question I am doing all this all under your input which I am very thankful but learning for sure


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## brenndatomu (Feb 2, 2021)

Inside is more accurate for plenum, duct temps...but IR gun would work ok for register temps if you try to shoot "back in" the register...


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## Benjamin5985 (Feb 2, 2021)

My pipe is black any way to figure out if it’s double wall or single without drilling it? Not sure what one to order magnetic or probe without knowing double or single  wall


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## brenndatomu (Feb 2, 2021)

Benjamin5985 said:


> any way to figure out if it’s double wall or single without drilling it


Some better pics of it might tell the story...


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## Benjamin5985 (Feb 2, 2021)

brenndatomu said:


> Some better pics of it might tell the story...



I will do that tonight! I seriously appreciate all the help! I really hope to find a solution to all this because I cheat I have a decent wood processor so I use that to cut and split wood and some big  machinery to help that a lot so in the end I save a bunch


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## trx250r87 (Feb 2, 2021)

Benjamin5985 said:


> What about a temp laser gun for the duct and register or does it have to be inside the unit?
> 
> sorry for all the question I am doing all this all under your input which I am very thankful but learning for sure


The IR thermo heat guns with laser don't work well on shiny smooth surfaces such as metal furnace duct. At least mine doesn't...

Eric


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## brenndatomu (Feb 2, 2021)

Benjamin5985 said:


> I am doing all this all under your input


Gulp...  
Don't go just by what I say...there are a bunch of knowledgeable folks following this thread now...between everybody hopefully we can get you on the right track here...


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## brenndatomu (Feb 2, 2021)

Benjamin5985 said:


> 12x24x1
> 
> very odd size
> 
> I’ve always thought of adding another return right on the wood furnance blower area for better flow also or cut the back out and do a slide in filter on the back


Manual shows it should have a 20 x 20 filter...that sounds more like it, with a blower the size of this one...that would be over a third again bigger...


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## Benjamin5985 (Feb 2, 2021)

brenndatomu said:


> Manual shows it should have a 20 x 20 filter...that sounds more like it, with a blower the size of this one...



i agree but there are two 12x24x1 stack on top of each other. Not sure if that creates more flow or not. I can easy take it off the return system and do it’s own filter box setup in the basement but not sure if that’s better or worse






I can take it off the house return system and use this


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## brenndatomu (Feb 2, 2021)

Benjamin5985 said:


> i agree but there are two 12x24x1 stack on top of each other.


Never mind...I didn't know there were 2...


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## Benjamin5985 (Feb 2, 2021)

Piping not sure if it’s double wall or not. I guess I can take it apart and check but any other ways to see


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## Benjamin5985 (Feb 2, 2021)

This is with a laser thermometer but thought I’d share until some stuff comes in


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## Benjamin5985 (Feb 2, 2021)

More


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## Benjamin5985 (Feb 2, 2021)

Stove pipe


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## brenndatomu (Feb 2, 2021)

Benjamin5985 said:


> This is with a laser thermometer but thought I’d share until some stuff comes in


These registers are in the basement? Are those normally open at all?


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## brenndatomu (Feb 2, 2021)

Benjamin5985 said:


> Piping not sure if it’s double wall or not. I guess I can take it apart and check but any other ways to see


Looks like singlewall to me...anybody else?


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## Benjamin5985 (Feb 2, 2021)

brenndatomu said:


> These registers are in the basement? Are those normally open at all?



They open and close

right now it’s 70 in the house (middle lol) and when it hits temp it dumps in the basement so that register opens the main one closes and when it calls for heat upstairs it dumps it back upstairs


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## Benjamin5985 (Feb 2, 2021)

brenndatomu said:


> Looks like singlewall to me...anybody else?


If it is single wall do I get a magnetic thermiometer for the stove pipe or is the prob style still ok


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## brenndatomu (Feb 2, 2021)

Benjamin5985 said:


> If it is single wall do I get a magnetic thermiometer for the stove pipe or is the prob style still ok


Probe style


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## brenndatomu (Feb 2, 2021)

Benjamin5985 said:


> They open and close
> 
> right now it’s 70 in the house (middle lol) and when it hits temp it dumps in the basement so that register opens the main one closes and when it calls for heat upstairs it dumps it back upstairs


Oh, ok...slick...that's just for the EK, or LP too?


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## Benjamin5985 (Feb 2, 2021)

brenndatomu said:


> Oh, ok...slick...that's just for the EK, or LP too?



It is for both. So right now the main register to the house for the lp is closed while the basement for the lp is open

the main register on the wood is closed since it’s not calling for heat and the basement register is open. Now if I wanna hook up one more thermostat in the basement I can make it auto between the two like I had it before the first hvac jerk came


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## Benjamin5985 (Feb 2, 2021)

brenndatomu said:


> Probe style


Ok cool I’ll do it the same then and mount it like it’s a double wall


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## brenndatomu (Feb 2, 2021)

Benjamin5985 said:


> It is for both. So right now the main register to the house for the lp is closed while the basement for the lp is open
> 
> the main register on the wood is closed since it’s not calling for heat and the basement register is open. Now if I wanna hook up one more thermostat in the basement I can make it auto between the two like I had it before the first hvac jerk came


I get this arrangement for the EK...but why on the LP too? Does the same Tstat turn the LP furnace on/off too?


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## laynes69 (Feb 2, 2021)

200's or even 300's seems awfully low for the face of a furnace like that unless insulated. If your temps are there and the chimney is producing smoke, it should be hotter. That furnace has provisions for secondary air, even if not working fully it should be burning cleaner.


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## Benjamin5985 (Feb 2, 2021)

brenndatomu said:


> I get this arrangement for the EK...but why on the LP too? Does the same Tstat turn the LP furnace on/off too?


Nope but they both use the same piping fle the house ducting. So it stops it from back feeding in the lp or vise versa so the lp doesn’t back feed into the wood


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## Benjamin5985 (Feb 2, 2021)

laynes69 said:


> 200's or even 300's seems awfully low for the face of a furnace like that unless insulated. If your temps are there and the chimney is producing smoke, it should be hotter. That furnace has provisions for secondary air, even if not working fully it should be burning cleaner.


Hey laynes

What recommendations do you have? I have a auto dampener on the side when it calls doe heat upstairs it opens be when it’s not it’s closes. I also have a damper on the front then dial I can open up.


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## laynes69 (Feb 2, 2021)

Not sure, for I don't know the furnace. As i said before I wouldn't dump the heat into the basement but put it into the living space. Especially with a ceiling that's insulated in the basement. We have tall ceilings and the longer the blower operates the better the heat distribution. I know our old furnace would hit 500 to 600 on the face before burning clean, but was a different furnace. Monitor the chimney and when it's burning cleanly that should give you an idea on the operation. More details should allow for a better idea.


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## brenndatomu (Feb 2, 2021)

laynes69 said:


> That furnace has provisions for secondary air,


It does?
I briefly considered one of these years ago...their advertising kinda eluded to secondary air, but when I grilled the dealer they fessed up that it probably didn't have secondary air over the fire like I wanted (more like the SBI furnaces) but then the lady didn't fill me with confidence that she really knew the product either...I moved on.


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## Benjamin5985 (Feb 3, 2021)

So after reading I see I should actually keep the return duct tied into the wood stove and not it’s own  feed


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## Benjamin5985 (Feb 3, 2021)

Also saw this but have no clue what it really means to be honest 

tried to read it 12 times but bit putting it together


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## laynes69 (Feb 3, 2021)

brenndatomu said:


> It does?
> I briefly considered one of these years ago...their advertising kinda eluded to secondary air, but when I grilled the dealer they fessed up that it probably didn't have secondary air over the fire like I wanted (more like the SBI furnaces) but then the lady didn't fill me with confidence that she really knew the product either...I moved on.


Yep. It's nothing like modern furnaces or stoves but better than nothing. It's square steel tube up top circled in the pic.


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## Benjamin5985 (Feb 3, 2021)

laynes69 said:


> Yep. It's nothing like modern furnaces or stoves but better than nothing. It's square steel tube up top circled in the pic.



Is there anything I have to do to get this setup or is this like a gasification system that will burn more effient?


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## laynes69 (Feb 3, 2021)

Benjamin5985 said:


> Is there anything I have to do to get this setup or is this like a gasification system that will burn more effient?


The idea of secondary air is to burn gasses. The 385ek had a secondary tube in the top between the baffles. Ideally one would get the fire hot, char the load and close down the primary air. The secondary air would then burn off the gasses and make alot of heat. From the looks of it theres heat exchange tubes in the top and that's where a majority of the heat would come from. Is there a way to clean those?


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## Benjamin5985 (Feb 3, 2021)

I will look when the fire calms down this weekend and see if that is possible. I did a full clean but didn’t do the fire blocks

maybe I’ll do all new blocks after the season, clean inside there andsee if that helps


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## brenndatomu (Feb 3, 2021)

Benjamin5985 said:


> Also saw this but have no clue what it really means to be honest
> 
> tried to read it 12 times but bit putting it together
> 
> ...


Basically its saying that your setup needs to be such that you don't end up with too much duct backpressure for the furnace(s) to be able to cool themselves...on the other hand, if the duct pressure is too low, that can mean poor heating performance too...0.2" WC is what they tell you to shoot for...but that can be a hard number to hit on many duct systems (with a wood furnace)...IME as long as you are getting good temp rise across the furnace, and enough air flow to get the heat where you want it, good enough.


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## Benjamin5985 (Feb 3, 2021)

brenndatomu said:


> Basically its saying that your setup needs to be such that you don't end up with too much duct backpressure for the furnace(s) to be able to cool themselves...on the other hand, if the duct pressure is too low, that can mean poor heating performance too...0.2" WC is what they tell you to shoot for...but that can be a hard number to hit on many duct systems (with a wood furnace)...IME as long as you are getting good temp rise across the furnace, and enough air flow to get the heat where you want it, good enough.



Perfect!

-air filters will be here this week or next
-I got the probe and the magnetic stove pipe thermometer 
-I’ll install the Dwyer mark 2 but I am curious I’m gonna take the pipe out get some 1/4 brake line with compression fitting with a threaded end I can put on the inside for a solid seal. Do I stick the stick in towards the middle of the pipe or just has to be a hole that’s it?


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## brenndatomu (Feb 3, 2021)

Just so its in the stovepipe for a draft sample. I just bent my 1/4" tubing into a large S shape then stuck one end of the S into the 1/4" hole in the pipe and let it hang there...not fancy, but it works.


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## Benjamin5985 (Feb 3, 2021)

I’m gonna go get some 1/4 copper pipe today. One question is if you take the piping out for a none  per many install do u plug the hole and how, I like a permante mount but that means every time I do a chimjney clean out I gotta take it all apart. Any pic would be great too I see a lot of people doing both


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## brenndatomu (Feb 3, 2021)

Not sure, but I think you are asking how to plug the hole?
Just find a large screw or a small bolt of the appropriate size to screw in there...doesn't have to be water tight...


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## Benjamin5985 (Feb 3, 2021)

brenndatomu said:


> Not sure, but I think you are asking how to plug the hole?
> Just find a large screw or a small bolt of the appropriate size to screw in there...doesn't have to be water tight...


did some more searching since I’m so picking with crap and making things hard mounted I got some goodies today

I’m gonna drill the stove pipe out the compression fitting in and nut the other side. Then I have a lot of tuning I’ll run it close to the Dwyer and then I have another end with compression fitting to a barn connector for the rubber hose.
Do I crimo the end and drill mini pilot holes on the side of the tubing or do I leave it open and point the tube down the pipe  facing the furnace or just straigh in and that’s it


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## Benjamin5985 (Feb 3, 2021)

Pipe and connector goin in the stove pipe  I’m thinking of cutting it 3”


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## brenndatomu (Feb 3, 2021)

Benjamin5985 said:


> do I leave it open and point the tube down the pipe facing the furnace or just straigh in and that’s it


Leave it open...I have played around with pointing the tube up/down/sideways...didn't seem to make much difference for checking chimney draft...just as long as its in the pipe, you good. 
This is one of the few things with properly setting up a forced air furnace that is actually pretty simple...(testing the draft that is)


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## Benjamin5985 (Feb 4, 2021)

brenndatomu said:


> Leave it open...I have played around with pointing the tube up/down/sideways...didn't seem to make much difference for checking chimney draft...just as long as its in the pipe, you good.
> This is one of the few things with properly setting up a forced air furnace that is actually pretty simple...(testing the draft that is)



Lol I will get the hang of it MAYBE.
I was thinking of just mounting it to the return duct or run it all the way to the wall


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## Benjamin5985 (Feb 6, 2021)




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## Benjamin5985 (Feb 6, 2021)

Installed 

with no fire and all doors closed this is what it reads


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## Benjamin5985 (Feb 6, 2021)

Now with fire started and going pretty well with auto dampener open


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## maple1 (Feb 6, 2021)

That's way way way too much draft.


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## Benjamin5985 (Feb 6, 2021)

Getting worse


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## maple1 (Feb 6, 2021)

Make sure it's calibrated right. As in, if you disconnect it from the flu pipe does it go to zero?


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## Benjamin5985 (Feb 6, 2021)

maple1 said:


> Make sure it's calibrated right. As in, if you disconnect it from the flu pipe does it go to zero?



it goes right back to 0


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## maple1 (Feb 6, 2021)

Looks like you need a good baro damper. For starters. I'm really surprised to see it that high though - your chimney didn't look outrageously high? I would be aiming for .06, .08 max. For a starting point. You're almost .2, or 3x what I'm thinking it should be. The other guys should be along soon for more input.


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## Benjamin5985 (Feb 6, 2021)

So if I install a barometric dampener my issue is my stove pipe is on a angle how to I install it like that? I read if has to be completely vertical to work properly


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## salecker (Feb 6, 2021)

After you install the baro housing the baro can be turned in the housing to make it level
So if you install the baro housing on the side of the angled pipe,then you can install the baro in the housing level.
On the angled side like the side where you made your hole for the gauge.


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## Benjamin5985 (Feb 6, 2021)

salecker said:


> After you install the baro housing the baro can be turned in the housing to make it level
> So if you install the baro housing on the side of the angled pipe,then you can install the baro in the housing level.
> On the angled side like the side where you made your hole for the gauge.


Perfect! Thank you!!


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## Benjamin5985 (Feb 6, 2021)

6-RCBT - Field Controls 6-RCBT - 6" Draft Regulator for Wood, Oil, or Coal
					

Field Controls 6-RCBT - 6" Draft Regulator for Wood, Oil, or Coal - RCBT is recommended for wood and coal burning applications or anytime black pipe is preferred. <br><br> RCBT draft controls are calibrated to allow for easy adjustment to the furnace or boiler manufacturer's specifications...




					www.supplyhouse.com
				




How does this one look??


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## brenndatomu (Feb 6, 2021)

That's perfect, as long as that tee will fit your pipe.
You can also buy the baro with a saddle tee, then you just cut a hole in you pipe and clamp tee on.


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## brenndatomu (Feb 6, 2021)

6-RC - Field Controls 6-RC - 6" Draft Regulator for Wood, Oil, or Coal
					

Field Controls 6-RC - 6" Draft Regulator for Wood, Oil, or Coal - The Field RC is furnished as standard equipment on many leading brands of oil or coal-fired heating equipment. It is calibrated to allow for easy adjustment to the furnace or boiler manufacturer?s specifications. Designed for...




					www.supplyhouse.com


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## Benjamin5985 (Feb 6, 2021)

Could this excessive draft be a lot of my issues? If I get it fix what are some benefits


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## brenndatomu (Feb 6, 2021)

It certainly is NOT helping...all your heat is being sucked up the chimney.


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## brenndatomu (Feb 6, 2021)

High draft makes it easy to overfire the furnace and can damage it...some signs of such would be fried paint on the front...I know you said that was your fault, but it would not have happened so fast if high draft wasn't in play.


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## Benjamin5985 (Feb 6, 2021)

brenndatomu said:


> High draft makes it easy to overfire the furnace and can damage it...some signs of such would be fried paint on the front...I know you said that was your fault, but it would not have happened so fast if high draft wasn't in play.



awesome info!! Looks like the baro dampener will be hereTuesday def can’t wait to see how it helps


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## brenndatomu (Feb 6, 2021)

Keep in mind there very well may still be other things will need to be addressed as far as getting the heat down to the baby's bedroom...but first things first...proper draft is basic wood furnace setup 101.


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## Benjamin5985 (Feb 6, 2021)

brenndatomu said:


> Keep in mind there very well may still be other things will need to be addressed as far as getting the heat down to the baby's bedroom...but first things first...proper draft is basic wood furnace setup 101.



I will def take care of that my goal is .06

what other suggestion is next after this


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## brenndatomu (Feb 6, 2021)

Benjamin5985 said:


> I will def take care of that my goal is .06
> 
> what other suggestion is next after this


-0.06" is OK...but if you can get down to -0.04" and it still makes good heat for you, then that is even better.
Once you get the draft in spec then you need to run it for a few days to see what's what.
Might need to get some plenum/duct temps and pressures...which you can use your new manometer to measure...


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## Benjamin5985 (Feb 6, 2021)

Just to be sure too I’m suppose to be hooked up to the low side of the manometer?

and that’s a question for y’all if the pressure is low and so is the temps what’s that solution?


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## brenndatomu (Feb 6, 2021)

Benjamin5985 said:


> Just to be sure too I’m suppose to be hooked up to the low side of the manometer?


The way you have it is right.


Benjamin5985 said:


> if the pressure is low and so is the temps what’s that solution?


We'll cross that bridge if we come to it...but it might involve changing those filters around, changing fan speeds, changing duct damper/register settings...etc...


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## Benjamin5985 (Feb 6, 2021)

brenndatomu said:


> The way you have it is right.
> 
> We'll cross that bridge if we come to it...but it might involve changing those filters around, changing fan speeds, changing duct damper/register settings...etc...



sounds great! After the baro dampener gets installed I’m gonna put in the merv  4

right now it’s  merv 6 they came in first


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## Benjamin5985 (Feb 9, 2021)

So I got everything installed but ocd about safety so I wanna make sure I did it right

can I cut pipe to make it for better? That’s firstbecause I cut it but if I gotta go get sections I def will.
I cut the bottom to go into the t for the clean out and that goes into the stove
I cut the section coming off the top sweep

here is a load of pictures please tell me what ya think

I prob should have went and grab the angle grinder kinda was lazy after today’s work load


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## brenndatomu (Feb 9, 2021)

So what's the question then?


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## Benjamin5985 (Feb 9, 2021)

Here are more


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## Benjamin5985 (Feb 9, 2021)

is it ok to cut pipe like I did?

And does it look somewhat right?

the bottom pipe had a knurle on it but I cut it out that went into the bottom t so I can make it fit


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## brenndatomu (Feb 9, 2021)

Looks good!


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## JRHAWK9 (Feb 9, 2021)

Looks good, but your BD NEEDS to be level both horizontally and vertically.  Hard to tell from the photo, but the tee doesn't look like it is...???


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## Benjamin5985 (Feb 9, 2021)

JRHAWK9 said:


> Looks good, but your BD NEEDS to be level both horizontally and vertically.  Hard to tell from the photo, but the tee doesn't look like it is...???


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## brenndatomu (Feb 9, 2021)

Fire in the hole!


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## Benjamin5985 (Feb 9, 2021)

Starting the fire now


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## JRHAWK9 (Feb 9, 2021)

I normally put the level on the vertical face to level it vertically.  Assuming what you did is fine though..?


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## JRHAWK9 (Feb 9, 2021)

With that high of draft, you may have to add weight to the weight on the flap.  I had to add a thick washer or two to mine to get it to pull the draft down enough.


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## Benjamin5985 (Feb 9, 2021)

JRHAWK9 said:


> I normally put the level on the vertical face to level it vertically.  Assuming what you did is fine though..?


Oooo got you! I would try and fix it right now but that pipe is hot ahhahaha I’ll do that tomorrow thank you! Should be ok though?


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## Benjamin5985 (Feb 9, 2021)

Your browser is not able to display this video.


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## brenndatomu (Feb 9, 2021)

To me level side to side (pivot pin exactly at 3 and 9 o'clock)  is more important than the vertical of the tee being dead nuts vertical


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## Benjamin5985 (Feb 9, 2021)

brenndatomu said:


> To me level side to side (pivot pin exactly at 3 and 9 o'clock)  is more important than the vertical of the tee being dead nuts vertical



I can fix it tomroorw def off a bit


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## Benjamin5985 (Feb 9, 2021)

Read three articles and all different options any suggestions on my limit switch settings 

right now 115/150/200


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## brenndatomu (Feb 9, 2021)

Benjamin5985 said:


> Read three articles and all different options any suggestions on my limit switch settings
> 
> right now 115/150/200


That 200 is fine...the other 2 maybe 110 off/140 on? Dunno...probably just need to play around with it and see what works well...


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## Benjamin5985 (Feb 9, 2021)

brenndatomu said:


> That 200 is fine...the other 2 maybe 110 off/140 on? Dunno...probably just need to play around with it and see what works well...



moved it to that settings

the whole wood stove is acting different now

-stove is actually getting hot outside is about 500 degrees with laser thermometer
-Stove pipe isn’t bad should be alittle hotter temp wise with magnetic temp guage

hot air is actually blowing thru the vents

only concern right now is stove getting close to 500 degree may be fine but haven’t seen it actually get that hot

also nanometer is almost perfect


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## brenndatomu (Feb 9, 2021)

Benjamin5985 said:


> Stove pipe isn’t bad should be alittle hotter temp wise with magnetic temp guage


What's it read?


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## Benjamin5985 (Feb 9, 2021)

brenndatomu said:


> What's it read?


Just under 250


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## Benjamin5985 (Feb 9, 2021)

This is where I think I should adjust the dampener to allow the pipe to get hotter? Maybe bring it up to .05?


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## brenndatomu (Feb 9, 2021)

Benjamin5985 said:


> Just under 250


Perfect...250* (242) externally means almost 500* internally...and that's plenty!
Oh...wait, that's a probe type themometer? If so then yeah...a little low.
You could try to bump up to -.05"...or is there some sort of damper adjustment on the furnace?


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## Benjamin5985 (Feb 9, 2021)

brenndatomu said:


> Perfect...250* (242) externally means almost 500* internally...and that's plenty!
> Oh...wait, that's a probe type themometer? If so then yeah...a little low.
> You could try to bump up to -.05"...or is there some sort of damper adjustment on the furnace?



it’s a single wall pipe so I am using the condae magnetic pipe thermometer


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## Benjamin5985 (Feb 9, 2021)

Benjamin5985 said:


> it’s a single wall pipe so I am using the condae magnetic pipe thermometer


I also have a prob style but it says only for double wall pipes


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## brenndatomu (Feb 9, 2021)

Benjamin5985 said:


> it’s a single wall pipe so I am using the condae magnetic pipe thermometer


Those temps are good then.


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## brenndatomu (Feb 9, 2021)

You might go around the pipe and find out which side shows the hottest, then use that spot...I would guess more toward the furnace side of the pipe, and maybe a little toward the high side (left when you are looking at the back of the furnace) will be the hotspot.


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## maple1 (Feb 10, 2021)

Benjamin5985 said:


> moved it to that settings
> 
> the whole wood stove is acting different now
> 
> ...



I'm not a furnace guy but I wouldn't have expected the furnace to get much hotter by getting draft under control? Might have to check out static pressures etc in your duct system? Almost sounds like you need more air moving through it now. I'll duck out again now.


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## Benjamin5985 (Feb 10, 2021)

maple1 said:


> I'm not a furnace guy but I wouldn't have expected the furnace to get much hotter by getting draft under control? Might have to check out static pressures etc in your duct system? Almost sounds like you need more air moving through it now. I'll duck out again now.


I can do that with going down to merv 4  filters


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## usernametaken (Feb 10, 2021)

I was unhappy with my 1" filter setup that came with my Max Caddy so I removed the filter and sealed the OE filter housing. I then added a GeneralAir 20X25X5 housing in my return and run MERV 11 filters in it. It's a much better setup and doesn't get dirty so quickly.  Just an option if you find your 1" filters are being replaced too often...


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## brenndatomu (Feb 10, 2021)

Benjamin5985 said:


> I can do that with going down to merv 4  filters


You already dropped from 11 to what, 6?

So what's your findings after running a load or 2 through 'er?


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## Benjamin5985 (Feb 10, 2021)

brenndatomu said:


> You already dropped from 11 to what, 6?
> 
> So what's your findings after running a load or 2 through 'er?


Seems way better!! The soon to be baby’s room  was 67 while the house was 70 that’s the best it’s been yet So maybe 4 will get it 1 degree more 

we are gonna get blackouts curtains for that room it has a lot of windows


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## Benjamin5985 (Feb 10, 2021)

Not sure why that face was in there lol sorry


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## sloeffle (Feb 10, 2021)

Those are some nice racks in your basement.


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## brenndatomu (Feb 10, 2021)

Benjamin5985 said:


> Not sure why that face was in there lol sorry


3 exclamation points in a row makes it happen, like this


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## Benjamin5985 (Feb 10, 2021)

sloeffle said:


> Those are some nice racks in your basement.



Lol thank you! A lot are dads actually mine are upstairs where I can show them off hahaha 

we go to Canada it’s a blast and hard hunting but it’s time with my father


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## Benjamin5985 (Feb 10, 2021)

brenndatomu said:


> 3 exclamation points in a row makes it happen, like this


Ahhaha thanks 

checked the temps on the pipe again it says 220degrees single wall pipe magnetic guage and lasher matches it


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## Benjamin5985 (Feb 25, 2021)

So I lost! The wife and the neighbor (mother and father) hated the wood stove and complained so much I had it taken out!! Sad but if it makes them that much happier I’ll pay the propane bill. Guess it’s time to sell this furnace


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## brenndatomu (Feb 25, 2021)

Benjamin5985 said:


> So I lost! The wife and the neighbor (mother and father) hated the wood stove and complained so much I had it taken out!! Sad but if it makes them that much happier I’ll pay the propane bill. Guess it’s time to sell this furnace


What?!


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## Benjamin5985 (Feb 25, 2021)

brenndatomu said:


> What?!



Yea I tried I heard about it everyday because we built a bad ass family compound and my wife and mother both hated the smell so I lost this battle! Sad lol

but all kidding aside they are my biggest supporters so if I gotta pay the propane bill and it makes them happy then I will dig deep and do it


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## Benjamin5985 (Feb 25, 2021)

Your browser is not able to display this video.


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## brenndatomu (Feb 25, 2021)

Benjamin5985 said:


> my wife and mother both hated the smell


Well, I don't love the smell of the smoke on the older firebox designs, its kind of sickening creosote smell...however, the smell coming from the chimney on modern clean burn units (like the Kuuma, or a cat stove) is addictive...has a lightly roasted wood smell (too me) I'll actually stop and take an extra sniff when I catch a wiff outside.


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## Benjamin5985 (Feb 25, 2021)

brenndatomu said:


> Well, I don't love the smell of the smoke on the older firebox designs, its kind of sickening creosote smell...however, the smell coming from the chimney on modern clean burn units (like the Kuuma, or a cat stove) is addictive...has a lightly roasted wood smell (too me) I'll actually stop and take an extra sniff when I catch a wiff outside.


I enjoy the smell also It was a nice unit and worked well. It was a energy kind 385ek so it was pretty new. I enjoy a nice bonfire or fire pit so it was great to me but they always thought it smelt like fuel. My wife was always worried. I am not sure where the words it smells like fuel started but once it did I was already loosing that battle


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## woodey (Feb 25, 2021)

brenndatomu said:


> Well, I don't love the smell of the smoke on the older firebox designs, its kind of sickening creosote smell...however, the smell coming from the chimney on modern clean burn units (like the Kuuma, or a cat stove) is addictive...has a lightly roasted wood smell (too me) I'll actually stop and take an extra sniff when I catch a wiff outside.


I can’t say I ever remember smelling anything from outside with the Kuuma, as you can see the chimney is high enough where I guess I miss out that lightly roasted smell. This photo was taken from the river bank a few years ago after a thaw. Some pieces were 14”  thick and 20’ long. Six weeks later I was mowing the grass there!


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## Benjamin5985 (Feb 25, 2021)

woodey said:


> I can’t say I ever remember smelling anything from outside with the Kuuma, as you can see the chimney is high enough where I guess I miss out that lightly roasted smell. This photo was taken from the river bank a few years ago after a thaw. Some pieces were 14”  thick and 20’ long. Six weeks later I was mowing the grass there!
> 
> 
> 
> ...


That’s a cool picture


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## brenndatomu (Feb 25, 2021)

Benjamin5985 said:


> smells like fuel


It is fuel...wood gas...and that's what modern fireboxes are good at burning up (for low emissions...which I would not consider the EK to be low emmissions...if it was it would still be in production (phase 2)...I don't think they even made it past the phase 1 testing?)
Does your wife/MIL spend a lot of time outside in the winter where they are smelling this often? If the smell is getting into the house, then that is another matter...


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## Benjamin5985 (Feb 25, 2021)

brenndatomu said:


> It is fuel...wood gas...and that's what modern fireboxes are good at burning up (for low emissions...which I would not consider the EK to be low emmissions...if it was it would still be in production (phase 2)...I don't think they even made it past the phase 1 testing?)
> Does your wife/MIL spend a lot of time outside in the winter where they are smelling this often? If the smell is getting into the house, then that is another matter...



They only go outside sometimes but that’s when I hear about it lol


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## woodey (Feb 25, 2021)

Benjamin5985 said:


> That’s a cool picture


Thanks, I wasn't trying to highjack the thread but it looks it's nearing the end.


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## RockyMtnGriz (Mar 15, 2021)

He'll be back when propane hits $5 a gallon....  

Nice of y'all to spend that time helping him tune it!


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