# New property means new saw.



## tlhfirelion (Jul 7, 2018)

Buying some land, will be processing a lot of trees, both standing dead, Feld and cutting some down.  In my area it’s almost all red oak.  I have been using a little a Stihl the past few years and it’s fine, but obviously underpowered for the task.  I’m not brand loyal, I just want speed and reliability.  

What brand, model and bar length would you folks suggest I look at?  

Thank you.


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## Jazzberry (Jul 7, 2018)

tlhfirelion said:


> Buying some land, will be processing a lot of trees, both standing dead, Feld and cutting some down.  In my area it’s almost all red oak.  I have been using a little a Stihl the past few years and it’s fine, but obviously underpowered for the task.  I’m not brand loyal, I just want speed and reliability.
> 
> What brand, model and bar length would you folks suggest I look at?
> 
> ...


Need to know how big are the trees you are gonna be cutting.


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## tlhfirelion (Jul 7, 2018)

Jazzberry said:


> Need to know how big are the trees you are gonna be cutting.


It’ll be all sizes, but there are some 24”plus oaks. I could use my smaller Stihl for limbs and the like bit wonder about a 20” bar for rounds.  Thank you for your reply.


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## Jazzberry (Jul 7, 2018)

Since you have a smaller saw already, I would go with a 70 to 75cc Stihl, Husky or Dolmar 7300. Sounds like a 20" bar would work but you could run up to a 28" if  there was many trees in the 24" range. Me personally I would prolly get a 24" bar for what you sound like you'll be cutting.  Still 044/440, Husky 372xp, or maybe a Dolmar 7300 in good used condition in the $500 range.


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## tlhfirelion (Jul 7, 2018)

I’ll dig into this models and see what I can find,  I’ll go new most likely.  Thank you for the reply.


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## Bad LP (Jul 8, 2018)

The 372XP would be on the top of my list because I have one. Nice saw. With the 24" bar you don't have to bend over as much.


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## tlhfirelion (Jul 8, 2018)

Bad LP said:


> The 372XP would be on the top of my list because I have one. Nice saw. With the 24" bar you don't have to bend over as much.


 whoooo....nice saw and a hefty price tag from what Im seeing online.  Most places are over $900 with taxes and all that.  Maybe more than I care to spend.


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## Prof (Jul 8, 2018)

I have a Stihl 261 and 362. I can't complain about either one, but if I'm honest, I rarely grab the 362 over the 261. I happen to have a couple good Stihl dealers not far from me, so this helped to inform what brand I bought--though I haven't had any problems that a search on this site or https://www.arboristsite.com/community/ hasn't resolved. I did own a couple of other Stihl saws before this, one a homeowner grade and the other a farm/ranch grade. I won't ever own a non-pro saw at this point. There is a marked difference in quality and performance. So whatever brand you go with, I'd highly consider a pro saw--in my experience the extra cost is worth it (and I'm basically a cheap guy by nature).


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## tlhfirelion (Jul 8, 2018)

Prof said:


> I have a Stihl 261 and 362. I can't complain about either one, but if I'm honest, I rarely grab the 362 over the 261. I happen to have a couple good Stihl dealers not far from me, so this helped to inform what brand I bought--though I haven't had any problems that a search on this site or https://www.arboristsite.com/community/ hasn't resolved. I did own a couple of other Stihl saws before this, one a homeowner grade and the other a farm/ranch grade. I won't ever own a non-pro saw at this point. There is a marked difference in quality and performance. So whatever brand you go with, I'd highly consider a pro saw--in my experience the extra cost is worth it (and I'm basically a cheap guy by nature).



I do tend to go a little bigger than I need because overkill is good in my book.  IF I can afford it, I'll go bigger than I need but there's a big price difference that may not make it affordable.  Until a year or so ago I had no idea that Husqvarna made a pro saw.  I assumed it was just lowes stuff for little tree limbs and the like.  Apparently they make a good saw.  If only Honda made chainsaws then I could have an entire line up of Honda.  lol  I need to stay at around $500 and if that won't get me a decent saw I guess I'll need to deal with that.  So far my little $200 Still has done ok but it's wasn't used as often as this will be so I know i need to go bigger.  Thank you for the reply.


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## Jazzberry (Jul 8, 2018)

tlhfirelion said:


> I do tend to go a little bigger than I need because overkill is good in my book.  IF I can afford it, I'll go bigger than I need but there's a big price difference that may not make it affordable.  Until a year or so ago I had no idea that Husqvarna made a pro saw.  I assumed it was just lowes stuff for little tree limbs and the like.  Apparently they make a good saw.  If only Honda made chainsaws then I could have an entire line up of Honda.  lol  I need to stay at around $500 and if that won't get me a decent saw I guess I'll need to deal with that.  So far my little $200 Still has done ok but it's wasn't used as often as this will be so I know i need to go bigger.  Thank you for the reply.




Your not gonna get a new saw that you need for $500.00. I wouldn't go new unless I was a pro using it every day anyways. Good used pro saws will last a non pro forever and the saws I reccomended above are some of the best of the best pro saws made. You won't be able to get anything close new for $500.00


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## tlhfirelion (Jul 8, 2018)

Jazzberry said:


> Your not gonna get a new saw that you need for $500.00. I wouldn't go new unless I was a pro using it every day anyways. Good used pro saws will last a non pro forever and the saws I reccomended above are some of the best of the best pro saws made. You won't be able to get anything close new for $500.00



I have been asking around and had 2 small engine shops with good reputations recommended. So I emailed them to see if they had anything that might fit the bill.  Hopefully I can get a good used pro saw.  Might have to step away from Stihl but I'm not dead set on that brand.


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## heavy hammer (Jul 9, 2018)

This is my new 660, for what you are talking about I would look into this saw.  I'm not saying you need to buy brand new.  There are plenty of good used ones out there, and you can always find replacement parts.  My father who is 62 uses this saw all the time.  Since you have a smaller saw for limbing a big saw will come in handy.  I just sold my used one a couple of months ago, so they are available.


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## bholler (Jul 9, 2018)

tlhfirelion said:


> I do tend to go a little bigger than I need because overkill is good in my book.  IF I can afford it, I'll go bigger than I need but there's a big price difference that may not make it affordable.  Until a year or so ago I had no idea that Husqvarna made a pro saw.  I assumed it was just lowes stuff for little tree limbs and the like.  Apparently they make a good saw.  If only Honda made chainsaws then I could have an entire line up of Honda.  lol  I need to stay at around $500 and if that won't get me a decent saw I guess I'll need to deal with that.  So far my little $200 Still has done ok but it's wasn't used as often as this will be so I know i need to go bigger.  Thank you for the reply.


Husqvarna makes tons of pro stuff.  They have been around a long time and until relatively recently they only made pro stuff.


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## tadmaz (Jul 9, 2018)

I am biased, but I can tell you that an MS261CM is awesome.  I have an 18" bar but it can take a 20.


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## DodgyNomad (Jul 9, 2018)

Another vote for Stihl, Husky, or Dolmar in the 70cc neigborhood.  Bar length is up to you, but 24" should work good for almost everything.  Just keep in mind, bigger bar = more expense including chains, slower cut speeds, more sharpening time, etc.  

I'd do a quick assessment of your average tree sizes, and count how many of the large trees you have to help you figure out what bar size you need.  

Long bars are great so you don't have to reach as much and rotate/change sides/or roll large logs, but they'll really slow down your saw, and too long and they feel nose heavy and unbalanced.  

Might want to pick up and feel a few new ones at the store to see what length and balance feels best for you.   Then watch CL, FB marketplace for a decent used one.  I'm still not a fan of the new electronic saws, haven't had great results with them, but that's the way they're going.  

Keep us posted.


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## Jazzberry (Jul 9, 2018)

Tadmaz I am a huge fan of the 026 series Stihl but it won't run a 20" blade in 24" pine let alone oak. I know I have a few of them.


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## Zack R (Jul 9, 2018)

There's a guy on ebay who sells rebuilt 372XP's for $500 (he's from Michigan). You really can't go wrong with this saw. I have a 365 Special which is the same thing but slightly smaller engine (65cc) and its handled everything I've thrown at it.

The build quality on a pro saw is much better as is the serviceability.

For most of your needs a 20" bar will be enough. For the bigger stuff you might need something larger, but not likely. 

The little Stihl you have will come in handy for limbing.


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## blades (Jul 9, 2018)

Keep an eye on Home Depot every so often they sell off their rental units Mikita/ Dolmar- 64xx series that will pull a 20-24" bar full comp. Typical price range around $250 but you might have to put a couple bucks into it likely still come out less than $500- pro saw.  64xx series can be  rebuilt to 7xxx size as the lower end is the same ( or at least they were). 
Advice -  find a reputable dealer that you like in your area- get what they service


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## My_3_Girls (Jul 11, 2018)

A few years ago, I picked up a brand new Husky 357xp at the Booneville, NY show - huge discount, definitely sub $500, and plenty of saw for me.  I have an 18" bar on it, and only cut a few cords a year, but should last forever until I either put it out of the way, under the loader tire, or forget to put mixed gas in it.

Just checked my sig - it was more than a few years ago, I guess!  Time flies when you're cutting wood.


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## Ashful (Jul 12, 2018)

heavy hammer said:


> View attachment 227759
> 
> 
> 
> ...



You can’t beat the 660, but you also can’t buy one at the OP’s price point.  Even its predecessor, the old 064’s and 066’s bring $500 in good condition, and they’re 25+ years old.

I’ve been thinking about trading my venerable old 064 in on a 660, recently.


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## walhondingnashua (Jul 12, 2018)

Not sure what a Husky 562xp costs right now but I love mine.  I only have a 20" bar but I am more than sure it could handle more.  I mostly cut hardwoods (oaks, hickories, walnut, cherry, ash) and it eats them up.  For power to weight, everyone that picks it up loves it.


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## heavy hammer (Jul 14, 2018)

Ashful, in my opinion you will not be disappointed if you get a 660.  Look around every now and then you can find one for a good price.  If you are willing to spend a little more you can still find them new, just going to cost more.  Everyone's situation is different I wanted a new saw, it took awhile but I was able to find one.


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## Jazzberry (Jul 14, 2018)

I traded my 064 for an 084 and it was a great upgrade for the mill but I man miss the 30+ year old 064. Its a special saw.


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## sportbikerider78 (Jul 14, 2018)

If you have some 24" oak, you might want to have a forester take a look and see if there is any value.  Some (you may not be one of them) rush to cutting and lose quite a bit of money and cause unneeded labor.


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## Ashful (Jul 14, 2018)

heavy hammer said:


> Ashful, in my opinion you will not be disappointed if you get a 660.  Look around every now and then you can find one for a good price.  If you are willing to spend a little more you can still find them new, just going to cost more.  Everyone's situation is different I wanted a new saw, it took awhile but I was able to find one.


I’d probably buy from my local dealer, who could take my 064 in trade.  That gives me less leverage on price, but helps me avoid the hassle of selling the old saw to someone who could break it or hurt themselves with it.



Jazzberry said:


> I traded my 064 for an 084 and it was a great upgrade for the mill but I man miss the 30+ year old 064. Its a special saw.


The 084 is a beast, but not as fun to run.  Slower chain speed for just chewing and chewing, without ever slowing up a bit, but the 064 is miles faster with a 30” or less bar.  I had an 084 very briefly, try before you buy situation.


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## timmyd (Jul 14, 2018)

Look at the Echo cs590. The stihl saw suggestions are good but the 261 may be to small and the 660 is overkill. The Echo is a magnesium cased 60cc saw that will handle a 24 inch bar. They sell for around $399.00


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## Jazzberry (Jul 14, 2018)

Ashful said:


> I’d probably buy from my local dealer, who could take my 064 in trade.  That gives me less leverage on price, but helps me avoid the hassle of selling the old saw to someone who could break it or hurt themselves with it.
> 
> 
> The 084 is a beast, but not as fun to run.  Slower chain speed for just chewing and chewing, without ever slowing up a bit, but the 064 is miles faster with a 30” or less bar.  I had an 084 very briefly, try before you buy situation.




084s should come standard with a wheelbarrow. Super awesome saw for a mill but I don't even like to carry it to my pickup and back let alone go troopsing in the woods with it. I would take a look at a Dolmar 7900 if I was in the market for a big saw and you had a dealer around. Pretty impressed with the 7300 i got on a trade for my ms 360.


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## Jazzberry (Jul 14, 2018)

timmyd said:


> Look at the Echo cs590. The stihl saw suggestions are good but the 261 may be to small and the 660 is overkill. The Echo is a magnesium cased 60cc saw that will handle a 24 inch bar. They sell for around $399.00




Thats definitely not an upgrade for a 064 and running a 24" bar in oak????  I don't think so.


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## Prof (Jul 14, 2018)

You may also want to consider how many of the trees will the 24+ inches. I have some beech trees that are real whoppers around my place, but most of my cutting is medium-sized trees. I have a 25 inch bar for my 362 in the event that I need to cut up a huge beech. If I had to do it every day, I'd certainly want a bigger saw, but since an 18 inch bar will get through 90+ percent of what I have around me, I tend to err on the side of smaller saws since I find them easier to handle for long stretches.


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## Ashful (Jul 15, 2018)

Jazzberry said:


> Thats definitely not an upgrade for a 064 and running a 24" bar in oak????  I don't think so.



We’re getting threads crossed, here.  He is talking to the OP, looking to upgrade from his $200 big box store saw.  Then I make an off hand comment about replacing an 064 with a 660, and get you all excited... [emoji12]


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## Jazzberry (Jul 15, 2018)

Re read it without the exited part. It applies to your post and the op. But ya a little thread jacking. The cutting 24" oak part was for the op and the 064 was in case he was referring to your post. Sorta confusing but no excitement on my end.


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## Cast Iron (Jul 19, 2018)

*MS261*


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## Jazzberry (Jul 19, 2018)

He already has a small saw. He needs something for up to 24" oak. Sorry but a 261 aint in that league.


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## Cast Iron (Jul 20, 2018)

Jazzberry said:


> He already has a small saw. He needs something for up to 24" oak. Sorry but a 261 aint in that league.



This MS 261 is a Major league pro saw for 99% of most non career work. The right mix of speed, weight, power for what most of us do. Easy 8 cords of hardwood firewood harvested from the woodlot each year, intensive trails maintenance for regional environmental groups, and of course the constant softwood blowdowns to clear and buck for shoulder firewood. The MS261 with 16" and 20" bars has done it all. 
The 16" bar with the skills of knowing how to plunge/bore cut, target falls, and wedge use WILL and HAS safely dropped trees to 36" trunk ( DBH for you). And, just as fast and accurately as a 440 with a 28" bar.
Sure it's mach to want the big boy saws such as the MS660 with a 36" bar for the part time suburban cuts. Fine. Most of the tree surgeons, loggers, and contractors prefer the smaller tools ( such as the 261) for worker safety, efficiency, and fatigue here. My older saws when I was that strapping Ranger ( sic ) were the Stihl 440, 028, etc with those silly long bars in the +28" range. Silly. I want a tool that I can use all day safely without that "movement" partner holding my hand.
The smaller pro saws of Hisky and Stihl can also be carried for trail work in a backpack with wedges, hammer, aid kit, 2in1 with stump vise.
That's the experience in these Northeastern mountain valleys with diverse trees. Bore cuts are fun if you know how.


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## Ashful (Jul 20, 2018)

Cast Iron said:


> This MS 261 is a Major league pro saw for 99% of most non career work. The right mix of speed, weight, power for what most of us do. Easy 8 cords of hardwood firewood harvested from the woodlot each year, intensive trails maintenance for regional environmental groups, and of course the constant softwood blowdowns to clear and buck for shoulder firewood. The MS261 with 16" and 20" bars has done it all.
> The 16" bar with the skills of knowing how to plunge/bore cut, target falls, and wedge use WILL and HAS safely dropped trees to 36" trunk ( DBH for you). And, just as fast and accurately as a 440 with a 28" bar.
> Sure it's mach to want the big boy saws such as the MS660 with a 36" bar for the part time suburban cuts. Fine. Most of the tree surgeons, loggers, and contractors prefer the smaller tools ( such as the 261) for worker safety, efficiency, and fatigue here. My older saws when I was that strapping Ranger ( sic ) were the Stihl 440, 028, etc with those silly long bars in the +28" range. Silly. I want a tool that I can use all day safely without that "movement" partner holding my hand.
> The smaller pro saws of Hisky and Stihl can also be carried for trail work in a backpack with wedges, hammer, aid kit, 2in1 with stump vise.
> That's the experience in these Northeastern mountain valleys with diverse trees. Bore cuts are fun if you know how.


All true, minus your usual unnecessary insults.  But if you’re not carrying the saw long distances, there’s no reason for all that extra work.  I put my saws in the bucket of my front-end loader, drive into the woods, make a few cuts, and then drag the logs out in 15 foot lengths (or 7.5 feet, if they’re over 36” diameter).  The extra two or four pounds of a larger saw really aren’t enough to deter me from the frustration of working with an under-powered saw, or the extra time and thought required to take a 36” tree with a 16” bar.

Since I cut with an older guy, I leave most of the easier to handle stuff for him, and much of what I’m cutting for myself is big enough that I have to work it from both sides with the 28 inch bar (call that “part time suburban”, if you like).  When I switch from the 064 with 28 inch bar to the 036 with 20 inch bar, I have to slow up considerably, and I don’t see any benefit in that.

If I were trekking all over God’s creation with my saw, as you claim to do, then I’d be probably right there with your ideas of carrying the smallest saw that’d do the job.  But I like using the smallest tool that will do the job quickly, not just the smallest tool that can get it done.

You like to talk like you’re a pro logger, and the rest of us are just hacks, but how many cords of wood are you felling and putting up every year?  It’s really amazing (and charitable of you), that you even want to waste your time talking to the rest of us, when your experience is so vastly superior to every other person on this forum.


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## Cast Iron (Jul 20, 2018)

All correct Ash except for the "pro"assumptions. The woods roads in our woodlots get overgrown and steep so that we can't use a tractor.
Besides, tractors with logging rigs easily run $50 k and up....way up. Rather travel or play with the boat on Champlain.
For us part timers (said above), harvesting 8+ cords each year ( as posted above ), along with trail work, blowdowns , and environmental sanctuary
clearing, the smallest, most powerful saw that does the job is used. For longer hikes in, the top handles tree saw makes an hour's hike in less fatiguing.
BTW: getting into trunks of blowdowns through the crown and branches is the dangerous part; don't want anyone near.
Long ago I took the pro logger training as the only landowner civilian in the class, then later went through the 4 levels of the GOL at the university for competition ( look up GOL well worth the time).
Both programs stress efficiency for the pros , maintenance, safety, and planning each fall. Doing a first time plunge or bore cut was frankly wet pants
fightening. The instructor was right on my butt ready to tap me on the shoulder with his yardstick if the technique was wrong or dangerous.
No bragging, just facts about how this person uses saws and harvests.
No insults meant.....both directions. Thx. Take care.


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## Cast Iron (Jul 20, 2018)

For the main saw in the quiver, it is now the MS261. The top handle always is the partner.
We all went through a micro brew case discussing the 261 vs the 346Xp. It is a Ford vs Chevy thing; tho most have Subarus .
Why the 261?
Low emissions
High Power to weight
Fixed nuts (when tensioning, sharpening, transfering the bar up side ). Ever dropped bar nuts in the woods ?
Low vibration.
Side screw tensioning.
Easy air filter.
Electronic carb control.
Takes up to 20" bar with little loss of power/speed.
Fuel efficiency.
Used as THE one saw for limbing, bucking, felling by many pros.
Less fatigue with a reliable 50cc saw than heavier saws..
Color.


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## Jazzberry (Jul 20, 2018)

Out here in the west the main saw pros carry is the 460. Most of the pros have a ported 460 for their personal saw also. The 26 series is a fantastic saw but it is not the saw for bigger wood. A 26 with a 20" bar is barely adequate in softwood with a skip tooth. Great saw for most non pro firewood cutters but definitely not the saw of choice when you get into bigger wood. Also not a saw I would pick if I already had a small saw such as the op stated. For a single saw for most non pros getting firewood I also recommend it. But I would tell them go with an 18" bar.


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## Cast Iron (Jul 21, 2018)

Jazz is right for WESTERN timber professionals with trunks well over 3' DBH.
However for us Northeastern part timers only doing clearing, trail work, and mostly firewood from our woodlots, a 50cc pro saw is adequate for 90% of the cutting. Less fatigue, faster sharpening with shorter bars under 20", the right training to do bigger trees with shorter bars along with using wedges,
makes for enjoyable time in the woods. Besides, as you get older, the body does not crave heavy tools. We need more time to enjoy buddies, drinking, and our partners.
BTW Jazz, where'd you get the tat ?


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## DodgyNomad (Jul 21, 2018)

Cast Iron said:


> Jazz is right for WESTERN timber professionals with trunks well over 3' DBH.
> However for us Northeastern part timers only doing clearing, trail work, and mostly firewood from our woodlots, a 50cc pro saw is adequate for 90% of the cutting. Less fatigue, faster sharpening with shorter bars under 20", the right training to do bigger trees with shorter bars along with using wedges,
> makes for enjoyable time in the woods. Besides, as you get older, the body does not crave heavy tools. We need more time to enjoy buddies, drinking, and our partners.
> BTW Jazz, where'd you get the tat ?



Can't argue with this at all.  I was all about big saws and heavy lifting until a year ago.  Then a bad knee, and torn shoulder labrum make me appreciate my lighter saws now.  

I'm in the process of taking my lighter saws and going well beyond wood's porting and making them big bore screamers.  

I already use premium ethanol free fuel, so adding a little race fuel to my mix is no big deal.  I want the power, but don't want the extra weight of a 660 with me on larger logs anymore.  The weight of a 361/362 is about as heavy as I want in my hands anymore if I'm working for hours on end.  And if my saws need more attention and rebuilding more often, that seems a lot cheaper than surgery and visits to the chiropractor.


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## Alpine1 (Jul 21, 2018)

I agree with Cast Iron. My oleomac gs650 is overkill for my wood cutting. When time will come for me to buy a new chainsaw, I’ll go for a 50 cc with 18” bar. A good rule of thumb for choosing a chainsaw: if it seems adequate, it’s probably too big.


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## Cast Iron (Jul 22, 2018)

Once I too had the idea that a big saw ( 440, 660) with a 28" bar or longer was needed to cut a 36" trunk. Stupid then and now. There was big dead standing oak on the lot at least 3' dia. Had to call my friendly logger with his 36" 880 since I assumed that my 20" 028 coudn't do it.
Those training programs, one for pros then GOL for civilian part timers, cured me. Learning the technique*s *(plural ) for plunge and bore cuts with a short bar, use of wedges to safely direct falls, and fully planning the cuts and escape paths was all it took. Full PPE of course, always.
Those bore cuts demand attention to directing the saw, and having a seriously sharp and tensioned chain. Too easy to have the beast come out at you.......fast if not done right. Kind of like a firearm or ordinance ( maybe fireworks if no 'ordinance' available ). Humbling.
Try it ; get someone with plunging experience to show you.
And, climbing and sport injuries, older bodies demand the correct but efficient tools. You'll find out.
A MS261 0r a 346XP will do most work for us part time cutters. Both high power to weight tools.


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## Medic21 (Jul 25, 2018)

I have a 261, 362, and 461, and a Dolmar PS510 that is ported along with some cheap and lightweight box store saws.  A CS310 echo and a 171 stihl for liming and cleanup and a Husky top handle.  

Of all those I will grab the 362, hands down, every time I go to the woods.  I carry it in the log truck also for when I have to cut when loading.  If I need to fell more than one larger tree like I will do this Saturday I will take the 461 and 362.  I run a 25” bar on the 461 and 20” on the 362.  I do have a 32” bar with skip tooth chain for a pinch and In all honesty if you want to run a bar larger than a 24” a 660 is what you need for the power to run a 32” bar efficiently.  I plan on a 660 this year before winter.  Nice thing is the 362, 461, and 660 are all the same bar mount so they are interchangeable.  A 390xp from husqvarna will run a 36” ok and it’s cheaper than a 461 but a lot more powerful.  There are some that will say their 271 farm boss will run a 20 and 25 bar a fine all day long.  It will, with more fuel and more sweat.  There is a reason manufacturers recommend bar sizes.  60cc in a pro saw or 70cc in a farm and ranch saw are close to equal on power.  The max is 24/25 inches for bars.  

When I bought the 362 I demo’d It and a Husky 562xp.  The 562 probably out performed the stihl but, I felt the engine was more durable with double piston rings on the stihl vs the husky.  I bought that as my everyday pro saw that I will have till I quit burning wood.  The differences on power to weight of the 261 and 362 along with the price difference being only a 100bucks makes the 261 a non issue to me.  That and a .325 vs 3/8 chain makes it something To cut brush with.  I buy chain bulk and make my chains so I stay with 3/8 for everything I use everyday.  The 261 was way under powered for a 3/8 chain when I tried it.

What I suggest is talking to shops and regional reps and demo something.  Nothing will tell you how much you like it like running it for a day.  If you buy new plan on close to a thousand bucks for a 362 or 562 Husky with extra chains.


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## DodgyNomad (Jul 25, 2018)

Medic21 said:


> I have a 261, 362, and 461, and a Dolmar PS510 that is ported along with some cheap and lightweight box store saws.  A CS310 echo and a 171 stihl for liming and cleanup and a Husky top handle.
> 
> Of all those I will grab the 362, hands down, every time I go to the woods.  I carry it in the log truck also for when I have to cut when loading.  If I need to fell more than one larger tree like I will do this Saturday I will take the 461 and 362.  I run a 25” bar on the 461 and 20” on the 362.  I do have a 32” bar with skip tooth chain for a pinch and In all honesty if you want to run a bar larger than a 24” a 660 is what you need for the power to run a 32” bar efficiently.  I plan on a 660 this year before winter.  Nice thing is the 362, 461, and 660 are all the same bar mount so they are interchangeable.  A 390xp from husqvarna will run a 36” ok and it’s cheaper than a 461 but a lot more powerful.  There are some that will say their 271 farm boss will run a 20 and 25 bar a fine all day long.  It will, with more fuel and more sweat.  There is a reason manufacturers recommend bar sizes.  60cc in a pro saw or 70cc in a farm and ranch saw are close to equal on power.  The max is 24/25 inches for bars.
> 
> ...




How I sum up the 361/362 too.  I've had 2-362's.  One was a CM.  It's the saw I end up using most of the time.  Right balance and power.


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## Medic21 (Jul 25, 2018)

DodgyNomad said:


> How I sum up the 361/362 too.  I've had 2-362's.  One was a CM.  It's the saw I end up using most of the time.  Right balance and power.



Put a 20” bar on it and it’s a workhorse put an 18” bar and speed sprocket it down right fun.


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## Medic21 (Jul 25, 2018)

Cast Iron said:


> Used as THE one saw for limbing, bucking, felling by many pros.



I work for a logging company on my days I’m off the ambulance.  Not ONE cutter ever goes to the woods with less than an 80cc saw and the majority use a MS 660 which is 91cc with a 36” bar.  The MS 880 is on every site for trees over 36” and gets used frequently.  The smallest saw I have ever seen on site is a MS461.  Those guys usually only plunge cut leaners, it takes too long to set that up.

I would never recommend a saw less than 60cc pro model or 70cc non pro.  I work on a lot of them in my shop at home and the majority of engine problems are on 50cc and smaller.  People lean them out to get the bigger saw performance and that burns them up.


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## Cast Iron (Jul 25, 2018)

Very big qualitative diff between those cutting part time even if it is up to 10 real cords/year, trail work for environmental groups and on our woodlots, and the PITA blowdowns to clear. There is no macho gestalt with saws or ordinance or firearms. That's how we see chainsaws.
There are full time pro users like Mr. Medic then those of us who cut and harvest for ourselves and some volunteer felling for vet groups and trails.
We are older, have had our share of sports and other injuries, and NEED tools ( *NEED*)  that reflect our physical and skill abilities. We ain't pros even IF we have had similar training to pros. And few of the weekend cutters (sic) need anything like professional saws like Stihl 880, 660, 0r 440. The 362's are still too much for most of us (me at least) for cutting in a short day of recreation. Not work.
I use plunge/bore cuts with my 50cc tool cause my saws have short bars, I take care with felling, and have other recreations to waste my body year-round.
No comparison.


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## Medic21 (Jul 25, 2018)

Cast Iron said:


> Very big qualitative diff between those cutting part time even if it is up to 10 real cords/year, trail work for environmental groups and on our woodlots, and the PITA blowdowns to clear. There is no macho gestalt with saws or ordinance or firearms. That's how we see chainsaws.
> There are full time pro users like Mr. Medic then those of us who cut and harvest for ourselves and some volunteer felling for vet groups and trails.
> We are older, have had our share of sports and other injuries, and NEED tools ( *NEED*)  that reflect our physical and skill abilities. We ain't pros even IF we have had similar training to pros. And few of the weekend cutters (sic) need anything like professional saws like Stihl 880, 660, 0r 440. The 362's are still too much for most of us (me at least) for cutting in a short day of recreation. Not work.
> I use plunge/bore cuts with my 50cc tool cause my saws have short bars, I take care with felling, and have other recreations to waste my body year-round.
> No comparison.




I’m not a cutter.  I’ve spent time learning from them and may someday, I end up bucking a lot to load it on the semi.  I was replying to your statement that a MS 261 was the choice of saw for the pros.  I have never seen anything less than a 461 used by the pros.  

For what the OP was asking the 261 is like buying the cub cadet at tsc to mow your yard and the 362 is an exmark.  The two more pounds are nothing and the production of a 3/8 pitch chain over a .325 is night and day.  You will work harder to make a saw do something a bigger saw is designed to do.  I used to cut firewood with a 029 then 290 then bought the 261.  It’s a great saw but the 362 wears me out less because the saw does more work in less time. 

It’s the same principle with our fire rescue saw.  A 461 with a 14” bar and .404 pitch chain.  I can take a ms170 on the roof and cut a hole.  I’ll take the 461r and cut a hole in less than half the time.  But, back when we used small saws, 20+ years ago, we learned to use an axe for ventilation because it was quick and efficient.  It’s all about how hard you want to work and how long you want it to take to get a job done.

I don’t cut tops with the 461.  That is a heavy saw to run all day cutting 18” and smaller wood.  The 362 with a more aggressive chain weighing about 2 pounds more will do the job quite a bit faster.  That is why I use it all the time.


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## Renovationman (Jul 26, 2018)

A lot of great posts. I can’t believe no one asked how much land and how many trees. Is it 5 acres or 500 and is it 100 trees or a 1000? Will this be a 3 week cleanup and your done other than yearly cleanup. Buy the biggest saw you need and what you can afford based on all you have read here. Unlike you I am brand specific with Stihl. I have a 026 and it does what I need it to do.


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## Medic21 (Jul 26, 2018)

Renovationman said:


> A lot of great posts. I can’t believe no one asked how much land and how many trees. Is it 5 acres or 500 and is it 100 trees or a 1000? Will this be a 3 week cleanup and your done other than yearly cleanup. Buy the biggest saw you need and what you can afford based on all you have read here. Unlike you I am brand specific with Stihl. I have a 026 and it does what I need it to do.



I used to be brand specific.  I am pro line specific now.  These new “homeowner” and “farm and ranch” saws are junk compared to pro saws.  Take apart an work on an older 029 then compare it to the 291 and you will see what I mean.  The 291 belongs in the trash can to keep the wind from blowing it over.


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## Renovationman (Jul 26, 2018)

Medic21 said:


> I used to be brand specific.  I am pro line specific now.  These new “homeowner” and “farm and ranch” saws are junk compared to pro saws.  Take apart an work on an older 029 then compare it to the 291 and you will see what I mean.  The 291 belongs in the trash can to keep the wind from blowing it over.



From what I have read the 026 is one of the better non-pro saws. I have never had an issue with it in all the years I’ve had it. Run non ethanol fuel always and never store it with fuel in it for long periods.


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## Jazzberry (Jul 26, 2018)

026s are pro saws.


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## Renovationman (Jul 26, 2018)

Jazzberry said:


> 026s are pro saws.



I did not know that! You learn something new everyday!! I was not aware of that at time of purchase years ago. 
Thanks


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## Jazzberry (Jul 26, 2018)

Stihls smallest pro saw.


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## Chas0218 (Jul 26, 2018)

I just bought a husky 550xp and love the thing. I've been doing 24"+ logs with the 18" bar no problems. I cut myself ash, sugar maple, hickory, and red maple.  I have an older Stihl 041 60cc saw with 24" bar that i barely pick up since getting the 550. If you blow up the attached photo you can see the size of the logs im bucking. I bucked that all in 6 hours with the 550. I will say it likes a sharp chain like most saws. If you buy from a dealer and buy 4 cans of the husky synthetic fuel it will extend your warranty to 4 years. I think it was $22 for the cans. Well worth the money with as much use as mine gets. 
	

		
			
		

		
	







Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk


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## Medic21 (Jul 26, 2018)

Wouldn’t mind to come cut this as firewood.  Someone might say something to me about that.


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## Medic21 (Jul 26, 2018)

Any of the 0xx saws are built like the professional models today.  That is why the homeowner stuff is junk.  It is built modular and cheap to keep cost down.  In my opinion all the manufacturers did themselves a disservice when they did this.


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## bholler (Jul 26, 2018)

Medic21 said:


> Any of the 0xx saws are built like the professional models today.  That is why the homeowner stuff is junk.  It is built modular and cheap to keep cost down.  In my opinion all the manufacturers did themselves a disservice when they did this.


The problem is that many people dont need pro saws.  Or cant afford one i know i couldnt when i started.  The homeowner and ranch saws are just fine for what they are.  And for most people just cutting firewood and downed trees they will work just fine.  I cut many cords with a cheap poulan pro saw.  I have since upgraded to a ms241c and it does everything i need it to do.  I have no need or want for a big saw


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## Medic21 (Jul 26, 2018)

bholler said:


> The problem is that many people dont need pro saws.  Or cant afford one i know i couldnt when i started.  The homeowner and ranch saws are just fine for what they are.  And for most people just cutting firewood and downed trees they will work just fine.  I cut many cords with a cheap poulan pro saw.  I have since upgraded to a ms241c and it does everything i need it to do.  I have no need or want for a big saw



I know exactly what your saying.  Finding the used 029 or 026 for around $250 will be a better saw all day long than a new MS271 or smaller.  The way I explain it for firewood cutters is spending the money for a 241c or 261 is buying a saw like dad or grandpa had.  Quality built.  My dad still brings out the Homelight XL when he comes out with me.  That heavy bastard give me flash backs of my childhood when I pick it up.    I will guarantee that a brand new ms250 will wear out before that 30+ y/o saw will die. I am 41 and I have know nothing other than wood heat my entire life.  I have spent the money over the years getting saws I want to make my life easier.  The only one bought new was the 362cm last year and I love it.  It will be my sons saw in 25 years when I’m too old to do this chit.  Husky and Stihl both make a great product but, only in the pro line.  They are built like those 30 year old saws still running.  I wore out a ms250 in two years. The cost to rebuild was 70% of new.  Last homeowner saw I will ever buy.  

For the OP I just gave my .02 if he wants to cut efficiently with a 24” bar I would go no less than the 362 but recommend the 461.  Those will still be running in 15-20 years with proper maintenance working them that hard.  Would probably be the last saw he ever bought.


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## bholler (Jul 26, 2018)

Medic21 said:


> I know exactly what your saying.  Finding the used 029 or 026 for around $250 will be a better saw all day long than a new MS271 or smaller.  The way I explain it for firewood cutters is spending the money for a 241c or 261 is buying a saw like dad or grandpa had.  Quality built.  My dad still brings out the Homelight XL when he comes out with me.  That heavy bastard give me flash backs of my childhood when I pick it up.    I will guarantee that a brand new ms250 will wear out before that 30+ y/o saw will die. I am 41 and I have know nothing other than wood heat my entire life.  I have spent the money over the years getting saws I want to make my life easier.  The only one bought new was the 362cm last year and I love it.  It will be my sons saw in 25 years when I’m too old to do this chit.  Husky and Stihl both make a great product but, only in the pro line.  They are built like those 30 year old saws still running.  I wore out a ms250 in two years. The cost to rebuild was 70% of new.  Last homeowner saw I will ever buy.
> 
> For the OP I just gave my .02 if he wants to cut efficiently with a 24” bar I would go no less than the 362 but recommend the 461.  Those will still be running in 15-20 years with proper maintenance working them that hard.  Would probably be the last saw he ever bought.


Around here you dont find used saws in good condition.  They just dont exist.  Any used saw i have looked at is worn out.  Yes without question the pro stuff is much better.  But the cheaper stuff will work for many people


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## Jazzberry (Jul 26, 2018)

Looks can be awful deceiving. I just got rid of my 064 that was made in 1984 and it still ran like new. Looked like sh-it though. Spent a ton of hours on a mill which is the most abusive way to run a saw. Traded it to a pro tree cutter that didn't want to lug around his 084. Hmm pro tree cutter wants a 34 year old Stihl pro saw. Go figure. In fact around this area a lot of pros want the 066 instead of the 661, the 044 not the 441, 046 vs the 461 etc. Not all of them but a lot don't want the new electronics. I know because I repair and sell old saws for pocket money. Find an old ms 200 or 020T and sell it for $550 quick around here


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## Medic21 (Jul 26, 2018)

Jazzberry said:


> Looks can be awful deceiving. I just got rid of my 064 that was made in 1984 and it still ran like new. Looked like sh-it though. Spent a ton of hours on a mill which is the most abusive way to run a saw. Traded it to a pro tree cutter that didn't want to lug around his 084. Hmm pro tree cutter wants a 34 year old Stihl pro saw. Go figure. In fact around this area a lot of pros want the 066 instead of the 661, the 044 not the 441, 046 vs the 461 etc. Not all of them but a lot don't want the new electronics. I know because I repair and sell old saws for pocket money. Find an old ms 200 or 020T and sell it for $550 quick around here



I’ve gotten a grand out of a 020t I bought at a pawn shop and rebuilt.  Had $250 total in it.  I do work in the evenings for most of the tree companies around here and they all run the older saws and no one will buy electronic.  I waited till last year.  I like it, don’t have to keep tuning for every season.  I stock parts for the 046, 036, and 029.  Those three are what most tree companies use for ground saws around here.  I see a few 066 and 660 magnums.  That and rebuilding the top ends is so easy.  

 No one is using a 661 that I have seen outside of the loggers.  There is a group of Amish that use all dolmars too.  I bought one 5 years ago.  It’s heavy but cuts like a beast after porting and removing the catalytic muffler.  I richened it up and the damn muffler would glow red before I changed it out lol.


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## Cast Iron (Jul 26, 2018)

Stihl 026,028. and other "0" saws are defunct, not made anymore. 
The MS261 IS a pro model as is my climbing/limbing/long trail saw the older Stihl 009 top handle.
Look at how much you cut, your physical shape, and how you want to enjoy cutting, felling. clearing safely as a landowner....not a pro logger or tree surgeon. Harvesting less than 10 firewood cords ( the real cords ) per year, clearing long distance trails, moving blowdowns, and cutting for friends and elderly neighbors has got to be fun....and safe. I have the time.
We don't want or need the big boy heavy saws. No need. 
Analogy: why most mil and law sidearms are in the 9mm range NOT 45.


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## JimBear (Jul 27, 2018)

Wow, lots of input on this thread. I bought a new MS 271 with 18” bar last fall to replace a 029 that someone 5 fingered. I cut up 23 cord with it & have not had any issues. I am not sure what the difference is between a cord & a real cord is but I am an amateur. $399 for saw, case, gallon bar oil & a six pack of 50:1. It’s not a power house but I got along really well with it. I didn’t run up against any trees over 36” so it wasn’t a problem. Maybe after a few years at that pace it will crap out & realize now that there is a difference in Pro saws & Farm/Ranch saw.  I guess the point is everyone has their favorites but what gets one fella by may not get another fella by. My 271 wouldn’t work well for Ashful but has worked well for me thru a variety of wood & conditions.


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## Jazzberry (Jul 27, 2018)

Only works if you don’t know any better. Good used pro saws (certain ones)  are cheaper and better in every way.  Not all pro saws are the same. 026,036,044,046,064, 066 are classics. Oh ya the 020 200 is maybe the coolest saw Stihl made even though its not a pro saw.


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## bholler (Jul 27, 2018)

Jazzberry said:


> Only works if you don’t know any better. Good used pro saws (certain ones)  are cheaper and better in every way.  Not all pro saws are the same. 026,036,044,046,064, 066 are classics. Oh ya the 020 200 is maybe the coolest saw Stihl made even though its not a pro saw.


No it works if you are able to cut what you need to cut with it.  The same goes for anything.  The higher quality stuff will work better but that doesnt mean the cheaper stuff wont work.


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## Medic21 (Jul 27, 2018)

JimBear said:


> Wow, lots of input on this thread. I bought a new MS 271 with 18” bar last fall to replace a 029 that someone 5 fingered. I cut up 23 cord with it & have not had any issues. I am not sure what the difference is between a cord & a real cord is but I am an amateur. $399 for saw, case, gallon bar oil & a six pack of 50:1. It’s not a power house but I got along really well with it. I didn’t run up against any trees over 36” so it wasn’t a problem. Maybe after a few years at that pace it will crap out & realize now that there is a difference in Pro saws & Farm/Ranch saw.  I guess the point is everyone has their favorites but what gets one fella by may not get another fella by. My 271 wouldn’t work well for Ashful but has worked well for me thru a variety of wood & conditions.



A huge difference is weight.  The 271 and 362 weigh the same with a ton of difference in power.  The 261 is 2 pounds lighter and more powerful than the 271.  That’s the difference in cases of the motor and how the pro saws are built.  

The crank bearings and seals are also different between the 271 and pro saws.  The oilers are steel vs plastic also.  Quite a few differences in comfort and durability.


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## bholler (Jul 27, 2018)

Medic21 said:


> A huge difference is weight.  The 271 and 362 weigh the same with a ton of difference in power.  The 261 is 2 pounds lighter and more powerful than the 271.  That’s the difference in cases of the motor and how the pro saws are built.
> 
> The crank bearings and seals are also different between the 271 and pro saws.  The oilers are steel vs plastic also.  Quite a few differences in comfort and durability.


You are absolutly right on all of that which is why i got a pro saw.  But the farm and ranch saw can still give many years of good service.


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## JimBear (Jul 27, 2018)

Medic21 said:


> A huge difference is weight.  The 271 and 362 weigh the same with a ton of difference in power.  The 261 is 2 pounds lighter and more powerful than the 271.  That’s the difference in cases of the motor and how the pro saws are built.
> 
> The crank bearings and seals are also different between the 271 and pro saws.  The oilers are steel vs plastic also.  Quite a few differences in comfort and durability.


I must of had a misprint, I now realize the difference the differences between Pro & Farm/ranch after purchasing the 271 & then joining this site & being educated by several of the entertaining threads. This thread is eerily similar to the new ATV/UTV thread, lots of thoughts/opinions on what works for each individual. I agree with bholler if it does what it’s supposed to & what you want & stayed within your budget then it’s all good. Now I did buy a used 260 online & have spent a lot of time & effort trying to get it to run as advertised, to no success, but do recognize the difference in weight,oiler, cases ,etc. The 260 is off to the Doctor today & should be able recognize all differences in the 2 saws this fall/winter.


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## Ashful (Jul 27, 2018)

Jazzberry said:


> Looks can be awful deceiving. I just got rid of my 064 that was made in 1984 and it still ran like new. Looked like sh-it though. Spent a ton of hours on a mill which is the most abusive way to run a saw. Traded it to a pro tree cutter that didn't want to lug around his 084. Hmm pro tree cutter wants a 34 year old Stihl pro saw. Go figure.



That pro cutter apparently wasn’t aware of some of the ignition module issues with the 064.  I think there were three different versions used over the product life cycle of the 064, one of which is showing serious reliability problems today, and another of which is NLA.  If his ignition module dies, he may have a very heavy (but sexy) paperweight, door stop, or science project. 

I’ll be trading my old 064 for a 660, when the timing becomes convenient.  I love that saw, but nothing lasts forever.


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## Ashful (Jul 27, 2018)

bholler said:


> You are absolutly right on all of that which is why i got a pro saw.  But the farm and ranch saw can still give many years of good service.



Exactly.  At the pace of any amateur firewood cutter, even the most ambitious, our yearly usage is probably close to the weekly usage of a pro cutter.  So, pro saws are great, buy them if you can afford them, but there’s nothing wrong with a farm saw, either.

The saw failures reported here are always more about age (cracked fuel lines, gummed carbs) than wear.  Your farm saw will die from old age, or replacement parts availability (see my 064 ignition module, above), before you wear it out.


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## Jazzberry (Jul 27, 2018)

I wasn't meaning the saw wouldn't work. I was referring to the thought process of paying the price for a new homeowner saw vs less money for a good used pro saw being a good deal. Of course a cheaper less powerful new saw will work. But not a good deal if you know better.


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## bholler (Jul 27, 2018)

Jazzberry said:


> I wasn't meaning the saw wouldn't work. I was referring to the thought process of paying the price for a new homeowner saw vs less money for a good used pro saw being a good deal. Of course a cheaper less powerful new saw will work. But not a good deal if you know better.


Only if good used pro saws are available.  Around here you can find used homeowner saws in good condition but the pro saws are beat.  I looked at many.  And yes most can be fixed but not everyone knows how to work on their saws.  So by the time you pay for parts and labor did you still get a good deal?   Again i agree the pro stuff is absolutly superior.  But most people will do just fine with a good homeowner or farm/ranch saw. 

And buying used is great if there are good saws available and you know what you are looking for.


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## Jazzberry (Jul 27, 2018)

Ashful said:


> That pro cutter apparently wasn’t aware of some of the ignition module issues with the 064.  I think there were three different versions used over the product life cycle of the 064, one of which is showing serious reliability problems today, and another of which is NLA.  If his ignition module dies, he may have a very heavy (but sexy) paperweight, door stop, or science project.
> 
> I’ll be trading my old 064 for a 660, when the timing becomes convenient.  I love that saw, but nothing lasts forever.




You make it sound like all 064 saws are ticking time bombs destined to be paperweights and I happened to find the dumbest pro cutter in the world who wanted my paperweight. Lots of desire for the 064 around my parts. They bring close to the same money as a 660 in my area. Any saw that lasts 34 years cant be all bad.


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## Ashful (Jul 27, 2018)

Jazzberry said:


> You make it sound like all 064 saws are ticking time bombs destined to be paperweights and I happened to find the dumbest pro cutter in the world who wanted my paperweight. Lots of desire for the 064 around my parts. They bring close to the same money as a 660 in my area. Any saw that lasts 34 years cant be all bad.



Hah... didn’t mean to imply that.  But they don’t even fetch half the price of a new 660/1, around here!   I paid $400 for mine, which was in very good condition, more wear on the outside of the chain cover from rolling around in a tool box on the former owner’s truck, than anything else.

NOS 660’s are $1000, 661’s run $1200, around here.  Are you talking used 660’s?  We don’t see them, period.


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## Jazzberry (Jul 27, 2018)

Ya I meant used value vs used value. Here 660s have a huge range from maybe 600.00 to 750.00 in decent shape. 064s around 550.00 to 675.00  neighborhood.


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## Renovationman (Jul 27, 2018)

So I wonder if the OP is as confused even more about what saw to get as I am lol. A lot of great info on this thread. If/when I need a new saw, I know “kinda” what to get. I still think my 026 is the best, for me anyways lol.


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## Jazzberry (Jul 27, 2018)

Renovationman said:


> So I wonder if the OP is as confused even more about what saw to get as I am lol. A lot of great info on this thread. If/when I need a new saw, I know “kinda” what to get. I still think my 026 is the best, for me anyways lol.



026s were one of the all time best saws Stihl made. Arguments here was that it was too small for cutting 24" oak not that it wasn't a great saw. One of the best for smaller stuff.


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## Ashful (Jul 27, 2018)

Jazzberry said:


> 026s were one of the all time best saws Stihl made. Arguments here was that it was too small for cutting 24" oak not that it wasn't a great saw. One of the best for smaller stuff.


'sactly.

Because I'm a nerd that likes to research stuff, and try things, I spent a year or three arriving at my current saw plan:

1.  Small top-handle with 12" bar (30'ish cc)
2.  Mid-size with 18" - 20" bar (60'ish cc)
3.  Biggun' with 28" bar (90'ish cc)

I thought I'd use the mi-size the most, but it's actually the one I use least.  I grab the little top handle saw for limbing and marking, and the biggun for almost everything else.  The mid-size saw is just like a smaller, slower, more frustrating backup to the big one.

If I were buying brandy-new saws, and wanted to just carry two:

1.  Small top-handle with 12" - 14" bar (30-36 cc)
2.  Stihl 44x series with 24" bar (75cc)

Since I was buying used (read... cheap), and never have to carry my saws far from the tractor or trailer, I prefer the 3-saw plan.  It gives me a backup, if one of the larger saws has a failure, or gets stuck.

Here, we see a lot of folks who own a 40cc saw, and come here asking about adding a 50cc.  Or they have a 50cc, and ask about adding a 60cc.  This just makes zero sense, if adding to (not replacing) an existing saw.  Your saws should not be similar in size, unless the reason is purely backup.  Space them out a good 50% in their displacement, to give yourself a range of capability, suit the tool to the job... yadda, yadda...


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## salecker (Jul 28, 2018)

Jazzberry said:


> Stihls smallest pro saw.


Not any more there is the MS150 out now,and don't forget the MS201


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## salecker (Jul 28, 2018)

Medic21 said:


> I know exactly what your saying.  Finding the used 029 or 026 for around $250 will be a better saw all day long than a new MS271 or smaller.  The way I explain it for firewood cutters is spending the money for a 241c or 261 is buying a saw like dad or grandpa had.  Quality built.  My dad still brings out the Homelight XL when he comes out with me.  That heavy bastard give me flash backs of my childhood when I pick it up.    I will guarantee that a brand new ms250 will wear out before that 30+ y/o saw will die. I am 41 and I have know nothing other than wood heat my entire life.  I have spent the money over the years getting saws I want to make my life easier.  The only one bought new was the 362cm last year and I love it.  It will be my sons saw in 25 years when I’m too old to do this chit.  Husky and Stihl both make a great product but, only in the pro line.  They are built like those 30 year old saws still running.  I wore out a ms250 in two years. The cost to rebuild was 70% of new.  Last homeowner saw I will ever buy.
> 
> For the OP I just gave my .02 if he wants to cut efficiently with a 24” bar I would go no less than the 362 but recommend the 461.  Those will still be running in 15-20 years with proper maintenance working them that hard.  Would probably be the last saw he ever bought.



Just for info the 029 isn't a pro saw.It is a clam shell saw. Along with it's brothers 027 039 025 021 017.For a while Stihl pro saws had a white rear handle.
Rule of thumb Clamshell saws are the homeowner saws.Cheaper to build ,harder to fix.


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## salecker (Jul 28, 2018)

Jazzberry said:


> Only works if you don’t know any better. Good used pro saws (certain ones)  are cheaper and better in every way.  Not all pro saws are the same. 026,036,044,046,064, 066 are classics. Oh ya the 020 200 is maybe the coolest saw Stihl made even though its not a pro saw.


Actually the 020 and 200 are pro saws,you can pull the cylinder without messing with the crank. Clamshell saws are the homeowner saws like the 193,clamshell and will never pull any coin like the 020/200 pro saws.


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## salecker (Jul 28, 2018)

Jazzberry said:


> You make it sound like all 064 saws are ticking time bombs destined to be paperweights and I happened to find the dumbest pro cutter in the world who wanted my paperweight. Lots of desire for the 064 around my parts. They bring close to the same money as a 660 in my area. Any saw that lasts 34 years cant be all bad.


There are other coils from other Stihls that work on the 064 right now i have 4 they all have spark.One is a play saw that has a ported 066 jug on it.The biggest appeal of the 064 is that it weighs less than the 066,it's like an 046 with the power of an 066


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## Jazzberry (Jul 28, 2018)

salecker said:


> Not any more there is the MS150 out now,and don't forget the MS201



You missed the Pro part. Smallest pro saw


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## Ashful (Jul 28, 2018)

salecker said:


> The biggest appeal of the 064 is that it weighs less than the 066,it's like an 046 with the power of an 066



That’s exactly why I bought one.  But 66x owners disagree, maybe to avoid remorse.


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## Tar12 (Jul 28, 2018)

Ashful said:


> You can’t beat the 660, but you also can’t buy one at the OP’s price point.  Even its predecessor, the old 064’s and 066’s bring $500 in good condition, and they’re 25+ years old.
> 
> I’ve been thinking about trading my venerable old 064 in on a 660, recently.


You will not be disappointed...


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## salecker (Jul 29, 2018)

Jazzberry said:


> You missed the Pro part. Smallest pro saw


Those are Pro saws .On both models you can remove the cylinder without splitting the crank out.
Clamshell saws are homeowner saws.
Saws with a crankcase are Pro saws.


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## Medic21 (Jul 29, 2018)

Ashful said:


> 'sactly.
> 
> Because I'm a nerd that likes to research stuff, and try things, I spent a year or three arriving at my current saw plan:
> 
> ...



So yesterday I dropped a bunch of dead ash.  Took three saws with me.  362, 461, and t545.  Dropped all the trees 18”-20” with the 362.  I grabbed the top handle saw to start limbing.  

Cuts way to slow with a new chain.  Tossed it in the back of the truck and did everything with the 362.  I’m too impatient for how slow a picco chain cuts vs full chisel 3/8 anymore.

Once you find what you like it’s hard to do anything different.  And, I added a 441 to the list yesterday for $350, in great shape and ready to run.


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## Jazzberry (Jul 29, 2018)

salecker said:


> Those are Pro saws .On both models you can remove the cylinder without splitting the crank out.
> Clamshell saws are homeowner saws.
> Saws with a crankcase are Pro saws.



I know they are not clamshells but Stihl puts them in the homeowner class in their advertising. At least thats what the did for the 200 so I assumed the rest were rated that way also. Figured there was a reason why they didn't rate them as pro saws.


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## Ashful (Jul 29, 2018)

Medic21 said:


> ...,I grabbed the top handle saw to start limbing.  Cuts way to slow with a new chain.  Tossed it in the back of the truck and did everything with the 362.  I’m too impatient for how slow a picco chain cuts vs full chisel 3/8 anymore.


That’s funny, as this is the reason I rarely use my 036 (eff. 362).  It just cuts way too slow, when there’s an 064 sitting right next to it on the tailgate.

I run a 20” bar on the 036, and it does okay until you bury the nose in hardwood, then its noticeably under-powered with a full chisel chain.  I put big felling dogs on it, just to shorten the exposed bar area another inch, and that helped a little.  If I were buying bar and chains all over again, I’d go 18” on that saw.


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## Cast Iron (Jul 30, 2018)

For the +/- 10 cords we cut each year a single pro saw plan works. I go through a bar and maybe 2-3 chains each year on the wondrous MS261 with a now downsized 16" bar from 20" .Why ? Dirt, rounds, barbed wire, dead mammals in the trunks.  It has done up to a 36" DBH oak a few times without timely delays. An older 028 and loaned 440 are too much to handle for heavy cutting. BTW:  a pro Stihl 009 does the tree climbing, long trail walk ins, and blowdown limbing. It has gotten me out of user jams with the 261 ( truth sets you free ).
It's beyond me other than the testosterone demand why any non pro cutting less than a few cords each year even thinks a 440, 660, 880 will speed anything up. But your choice. Hubris.
Never will use a chisel tooth chain again. Dulls quickly. Harder to sharpen correctly, chatters. Gave me hemhoroids (sp. )


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## DodgyNomad (Jul 30, 2018)

Are dead mammals especially hard on the chains?


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## vtwoodheater (Jul 30, 2018)

Just get a 372xp and be done with it.  
Can't imagine owning three chainsaws.  Seems like a lot of work.  What homeowner or non pro owns three different lawnmowers? One saw,one bar, one chain. I don't have all day to plan out what saw I am going to use for what cut.
Besides, who in their right mind would own a Stihl anyway.


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## bholler (Jul 30, 2018)

vtwoodheater said:


> Just get a 372xp and be done with it.
> Can't imagine owning three chainsaws.  Seems like a lot of work.  What homeowner or non pro owns three different lawnmowers? One saw,one bar, one chain. I don't have all day to plan out what saw I am going to use for what cut.
> Besides, who in their right mind would own a Stihl anyway.


I own 3 but really only use the stihl.  But i always take a spare with.


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## bholler (Jul 30, 2018)

Oh and anyone who goes through 2 to 3 chains and a bar a year as a non pro needs to go back to their paul bunyan university.  Because they have allot to learn.


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## vtwoodheater (Jul 30, 2018)

Seems to be a lot of testosterone flying around when it comes to splitters..........
Lot of folks split by hand, not too many felling trees or cutting logs to 18" length with an ax.


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## Ashful (Jul 31, 2018)

vtwoodheater said:


> Seems to be a lot of testosterone flying around when it comes to splitters..........
> Lot of folks split by hand, not too many felling trees or cutting logs to 18" length with an ax.


You got it backwards.  Splitting axes are for those with too much testosterone, splitters are for the rest of us.


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## Cast Iron (Jul 31, 2018)

DodgyNomad said:


> Are dead mammals especially hard on the chains?



Dear Doggy:
Some live IN trees.
Bones. Bones. 
Then again with those 7 ( seven ! ) saws you have my permission to ignore dead bodies in trees.


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## vtwoodheater (Jul 31, 2018)

I hear you. Splitting takes the most time.


Ashful said:


> You got it backwards.  Splitting axes are for those with too much testosterone, splitters are for the rest of us.


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## Renovationman (Jul 31, 2018)

No manual splitting here!!


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## Medic21 (Jul 31, 2018)

bholler said:


> Oh and anyone who goes through 2 to 3 chains and a bar a year as a non pro needs to go back to their paul bunyan university.  Because they have allot to learn.



How did I miss this???

THE post of the entire thread.


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## Medic21 (Jul 31, 2018)

Cast Iron said:


> For the +/- 10 cords we cut each year a single pro saw plan works. I go through a bar and maybe 2-3 chains each year on the wondrous MS261 with a now downsized 16" bar from 20" .Why ? Dirt, rounds, barbed wire, dead mammals in the trunks.  It has done up to a 36" DBH oak a few times without timely delays. An older 028 and loaned 440 are too much to handle for heavy cutting. BTW:  a pro Stihl 009 does the tree climbing, long trail walk ins, and blowdown limbing. It has gotten me out of user jams with the 261 ( truth sets you free ).
> It's beyond me other than the testosterone demand why any non pro cutting less than a few cords each year even thinks a 440, 660, 880 will speed anything up. But your choice. Hubris.
> Never will use a chisel tooth chain again. Dulls quickly. Harder to sharpen correctly, chatters. Gave me hemhoroids (sp. )



Your record player is broken.  Won’t sing a new song and is stuck on 10 Cords a year, blow downs, and trail walking.  Sounds like a bad Florida Georgia Line song. 

You fail to see a point different to yours and I fail to see how a grown man can’t handle 14 pounds all day.  Do you change your own tires?  Man bun or beard?


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## Tar12 (Jul 31, 2018)

Cast Iron said:


> For the +/- 10 cords we cut each year a single pro saw plan works. I go through a bar and maybe 2-3 chains each year on the wondrous MS261 with a now downsized 16" bar from 20" .Why ? Dirt, rounds, barbed wire, dead mammals in the trunks.  It has done up to a 36" DBH oak a few times without timely delays. An older 028 and loaned 440 are too much to handle for heavy cutting. BTW:  a pro Stihl 009 does the tree climbing, long trail walk ins, and blowdown limbing. It has gotten me out of user jams with the 261 ( truth sets you free ).
> It's beyond me other than the testosterone demand why any non pro cutting less than a few cords each year even thinks a 440, 660, 880 will speed anything up. But your choice. Hubris.
> Never will use a chisel tooth chain again. Dulls quickly. Harder to sharpen correctly, chatters. Gave me hemhoroids (sp. )


I will soon be 55...I run everything from 260 Pros up to a 660...all with full chisel chain...I choose the saw for the task at hand...I want my cutting done as fast as possible...this is due to the lack of testosterone..while you are attempting to cut one round of 36" oak that 660 is on its 3rd round...thats a fact. Keep your bars out of the ground and they will last a lot longer..


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## Cast Iron (Jul 31, 2018)

No need for "14 lb all day". Maybe with all this testosterone flow you'd like to try a multi pitch 5.10 climb with night packs ?
Maybe take that oh so big 660 and walk in a couple of hours to open a trail. Fine. Not what we do or need.
I see I see I see the 'need' for big boy saws for part timers. Take it. It's my and those we cut with and have cut for decades approach.
Use the appropriate gear for the job and user. We don't sleep with our tools.
Hey, record players are long defunct.


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## Cast Iron (Jul 31, 2018)

Jazzberry: how are conditions with the Ferguson Fire ? Hope you're safe .


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## Medic21 (Jul 31, 2018)

Cast Iron said:


> No need for "14 lb all day". Maybe with all this testosterone flow you'd like to try a multi pitch 5.10 climb with night packs ?
> Maybe take that oh so big 660 and walk in a couple of hours to open a trail. Fine. Not what we do or need.
> I see I see I see the 'need' for big boy saws for part timers. Take it. It's my and those we cut with and have cut for decades approach.
> Use the appropriate gear for the job and user. We don't sleep with our tools.
> Hey, record players are long defunct.



Son,

I humped far more than you can dream of during my days in the 101st.  I have carried 80lb packs for miles, for days.  I’ve done chit that would leave you a quivering fool in the heat of the desert. 

Frankly, some of us have tried to offer opinions based on our own experience and lessons learned from our years on this earth and the years of those that thought is.  All I have seen you do is bash and talk chit on opinions that don’t agree with yours but, you yet have anything else to offer.   Personally I won’t really give you the suggestion I have in mind but, I’m done with anything your highness has to puke out of your (expletive deleted - BB).


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## Prof (Jul 31, 2018)

Seems to me that this thread has run its course.


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