# Load it up, burn all night....



## Hogwildz (Dec 16, 2013)

You want an overnight burn and then some, load the puppy full as you can.
Start with some bigguns, then fill in the top.
The baffle is the stopping point LOL.
This is just after reloading after just over 12 hours ago, on a level coal bed at 200 degrees stove.
Even 8 seasons in, the honing still continues. Less wood and more heat come from not only newer stoves, but better practices
Fire it up!


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## vwmike (Dec 16, 2013)

Major stove envy! I can only get 2 of those big splits in my little guy


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## Woody Stover (Dec 16, 2013)

That one on the right looks like it was on the bottom of the stack; A little moistish on that one edge. 



vwmike said:


> Major stove envy! I can only get 2 of those big splits in my little guy


Maybe two of the big ones and one little one, if I packed it just right. Nice to have some Pignut and BL on hand so a smaller load will still go a long time.


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## JA600L (Dec 16, 2013)

I did the same thing and woke up to a 73 degree house. Right on the money!


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## cableman (Dec 16, 2013)

Do you pack it and keep the air closed right away?


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## Beer Belly (Dec 16, 2013)

someday I'll get the *alls to load it full....I'm afraid of a runaway with a full load....maybe 4 splits at most


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## Hogwildz (Dec 16, 2013)

cableman said:


> Do you pack it and keep the air closed right away?


Nada, full open air for about 15 to 20 mins to establish a nice char, and cook any moisture out(the one on the right), then cut air full low at about 450 degrees.
Those big boys need some time to get good and charred.
I usually cut the air to 1/2 for another 10 mins at around 300 degrees, but it was already up to 450ish, so cut it all the way back. Still lots in there, so will let it burn down while I am out on the road today.


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## jaychino415 (Dec 16, 2013)

Hogwildz said:


> You want an overnight burn and then some, load the puppy full as you can.
> Start with some bigguns, then fill in the top.
> The baffle is the stopping point LOL.
> This is just after reloading after just over 12 hours ago, on a level coal bed at 200 degrees stove.
> ...




Nice and packed like sardines. ;-)


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## AnalogKid (Dec 16, 2013)

Yep.  Been doing this twice a day for several weeks now.  It's great once you've got a system down.


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## cableman (Dec 16, 2013)

Thats what i figured. How hot ya think your stack temp gets? Mine will shoot to 800 easy which im not sure is a good thing. Yesterday i walked away too long and it went to 900 then shut it down and it dropped to 600 for a bit.


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## Saddle Mander (Dec 16, 2013)

I just got my NC135 weeks ago.  I've been getting burn times of about 90 minutes, but I'm 100% positive that's because I have no idea what I'm doing yet.

In my ignorance, my fear has been that packing it to the rafters would result in either:

1) a bright red glowing stove or 

2) nothing but smoldering smoke that would put a thick lining of creosote on the chimney

Feel free to chime in and set my thinking straight.

(Since I just got the stove, most of my wood is still in the 25%-30% MC range, so I've been adding a lot of pallet wood to help it along, or just burning pallet wood. Next year will be a different story.)


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## oldspark (Dec 16, 2013)

Hogwildz said:


> Nada, full open air for about 15 to 20 mins to establish a nice char, and cook any moisture out(the one on the right), then cut air full low at about 450 degrees.
> Those big boys need some time to get good and charred.
> I usually cut the air to 1/2 for another 10 mins at around 300 degrees, but it was already up to 450ish, so cut it all the way back. Still lots in there, so will let it burn down while I am out on the road today.


 
I have probably asked you this before but how tall is your chimney? My stove will not run like that.


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## BrianN (Dec 16, 2013)

Now that I am home all day (on the injured list) I load my stove 3 times a day. Needed or not. Usually not. I can only carry two or three splits at a time, so, I will put five or six splits in (two trips to the garage) let it char a bit then shut him down. That will get me well past the eight hour mark.
For the over night burn, I will stuff it a bit more and will still have a half load left in the morning.
Although, it is only -4 (25) overnight right now. But, later this week, we will be back to -16 (3) and hopefully will be able to stuff him with out too many trips to the garage.
When I do get back to work, hopefully next week, I will be back to loading it twice a day. Once before work and once when I get home.
That is when I stuff it full, with air wide open to get the char, also helps to clean the glass on the King.


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## Hogwildz (Dec 16, 2013)

oldspark said:


> I have probably asked you this before but how tall is your chimney? My stove will not run like that.


The liner is 27' tall. 22' of Rigid insulated double wall, with 5' of flex from the bottom tile to the insert.


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## Hogwildz (Dec 16, 2013)

cableman said:


> Thats what i figured. How hot ya think your stack temp gets? Mine will shoot to 800 easy which im not sure is a good thing. Yesterday i walked away too long and it went to 900 then shut it down and it dropped to 600 for a bit.


Not sure on stack temp. Being an insert, I have no access to the stack. I would say it gets up there prior to shutting the air down. With 27' of liner, all but the bottom 5' insulated, this thing has serious draft.


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## Hogwildz (Dec 16, 2013)

Saddle Mander said:


> I just got my NC135 weeks ago.  I've been getting burn times of about 90 minutes, but I'm 100% positive that's because I have no idea what I'm doing yet.
> 
> In my ignorance, my fear has been that packing it to the rafters would result in either:
> 
> ...


25% ain't the worst.
If you load it tight, with large & medium splits  it won't go nuclear. Especially with the moisture content of the wood you have.
You prolly will get a shatload of coals though.
It is when you load a bunch or real dry small stuff with lots of air space between, that things get bright.
90 minutes burn times? Unless we are thinking differently, you should be getting a hell of a lot longer burn times than that. Are you getting it up to temp good then shutting the air back or down all the way?
If you leave it wide open, it will either overfire, some never get to a good temp, and the load will not last long. That will make things glow if I ever attempted that.


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## Saddle Mander (Dec 16, 2013)

Hogwildz said:


> 90 minutes burn times? Unless we are thinking differently, you should be getting a hell of a lot longer burn times than that. Are you getting it up to temp good then shutting the air back or down all the way?



Like I said, I'm sure the problem is me, not the stove.

With the stove top at 400-500, it's giving us good heat in the house.  I'll put 2 or 3 splits in to get a fire going and heat up the box, then I might add one or two splits at a time just to keep it going.  Once that gets roaring, I'll close the vent most of the way.

Should I be really packing it instead?


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## Hogwildz (Dec 16, 2013)

Saddle Mander said:


> Like I said, I'm sure the problem is me, not the stove.
> 
> With the stove top at 400-500, it's giving us good heat in the house.  I'll put 2 or 3 splits in to get a fire going and heat up the box, then I might add one or two splits at a time just to keep it going.  Once that gets roaring, I'll close the vent most of the way.
> 
> Should I be really packing it instead?


Do what your comfortable with. In time, you will feel more comfortable and also knowing your stove better, you will prolly end up loading it up. It gets tedious constantly filling a split at a time. And the babysitting involved.
I pack mine, get it going, up to temp, cut the air back. and walk away for 12 hours or so. I had many hesitations as everyone else does/did when they first got their stove. In time that will pass as you feel more at ease.
If you pack it, pack it with large, dry stuff, and see how it works for you.


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## Saddle Mander (Dec 16, 2013)

Hogwildz said:


> Do what your comfortable with



Well, you're giving me the confidence to go ahead and pack it to the top of the firebricks and watch what happens.


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## Kevin Dolan (Dec 16, 2013)

Hogwildz said:


> You want an overnight burn and then some, load the puppy full as you can.
> Start with some bigguns, then fill in the top.
> The baffle is the stopping point LOL.
> This is just after reloading after just over 12 hours ago, on a level coal bed at 200 degrees stove.
> ...


Sure looks stacked like cordwood, I too am jealous with the huge load you can put into that wood eating monster
Great pics, thanks


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## MofoG23 (Dec 16, 2013)

Your posted motivated me to get a picture of my load tonight...mostly medium splits....almost packed full.

Loaded up around 9:15pm, should be good till I load it up again around 6am with plenty of large coals left.


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## Hogwildz (Dec 16, 2013)

MofoG23 said:


> Your posted motivated me to get a picture of my load tonight...mostly medium splits....almost packed full.
> 
> Loaded up around 9:15pm, should be good till I load it up again around 6am with plenty of large coals left.
> 
> View attachment 120833


That is the way to do it.  Enjoy


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## AnalogKid (Dec 16, 2013)

Me too....  Just loaded up at 10:00pm.  Pulled the leftover coals forward from the load I put in at 8:30 this morning and packed it full with a bunch of odd-sized splits.  Good to go till late-morning tomorrow.


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## Huntindog1 (Dec 16, 2013)

Looks like Hog is using the technology we call *Big Chunk Technology* and he has the stove to to do just that.

For newbies gotta make sure they are good and seasoned.


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## cableman (Dec 16, 2013)

I stuck 6 splits in mine 2 were big and i couldnt load n/s. It Started lighting at 930, Airs been all the way down since 10! 450+ stove top


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## BrotherBart (Dec 16, 2013)

Well, if we are doing loaded pics...


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## AnalogKid (Dec 16, 2013)

10:45, 650 on the stove top, air all the way down, and we are cruisin'.....


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## Jotul118 (Dec 16, 2013)

BrotherBart said:


> Well, if we are doing loaded pics...
> 
> 
> View attachment 120845


 
A little sweat equity burns through many a night...

Looks like you've got'er right where you want'er!


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## Saddle Mander (Dec 16, 2013)

I'm giving it a go, but I can only stack E/W.

Left side is burning well.  Waiting for the right side to catch....


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## Jotul118 (Dec 16, 2013)

AnalogKid said:


> 10:45, 650 on the stove top, air all the way down, and we are cruisin'.....


 
Would love to have a glass door on the front of my 118!

Love to watch it on start up, but when everything is dialed down for an overnight burn, can't keep it open for too long.


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## Hogwildz (Dec 17, 2013)

Looking good gentlemen, enjoy


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## Hogwildz (Dec 17, 2013)

Saddle, put your stove make & model in your signature, so others know what your working with.


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## Beer Belly (Dec 17, 2013)

Ok, I put in a good load last night, most I ever put in, and the stove got very touchy with the adjustments......was good and hot, adjusted the air a little at a time.....got good secondary's....tried to bring it down a hair more (BIG secondary's)...BAM.....shut down....touchy, touchy, touchy


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## Saddle Mander (Dec 17, 2013)

Hogwildz said:


> Saddle, put your stove make & model in your signature, so others know what your working with.



Done!


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## cableman (Dec 17, 2013)

I got up at 3am and the stove was glowing big coals and was 250* stovetop. I threw in 2 splits and opened it a hair, came down at 630 and it was all coals again. I think i could definitely get a better run if i pack shorter splits n/s. House was still 69


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## mass_burner (Dec 17, 2013)

I would love to burn for 12+ hours. But for me this would be wasteful. Not that I could do it anyway with the horizontal stoves I have. At night we shut the one door separating the bedrooms from the common area (where the stoves are). This area usually makes it until 7:20 when I wake up without the furnace coming on set to 64.


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## Archer39 (Dec 17, 2013)

My little blaze king stuffed full. I would show a picture of it after it starts to burn but that would be boring.


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## Ansky (Dec 17, 2013)

Hogwildz, what's the depth of your stove?  Just curious what size you cut your splits.  Mine stove's firebox is 24" E-W and maybe 13" or so N-S.  But most of my splits are 18".  I'm wondering if I should start cutting up my logs to 12" so I can load the stove that way.  It would be a lot more sawing, but probably easier splitting and more efficient burning. 
Any advice is welcome.  Just my 2nd season, so I'm still learning.


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## Saddle Mander (Dec 17, 2013)

cableman said:


> I think i could definitely get a better run if i pack shorter splits n/s



That's the next thing I'm gonna try.  I put a lot more splits in last night than I have been, but it seems like I got about the same burn time with slightly lower temps.  But I can't REALLY fill it E/W unless a lot is resting on the glass, which I don't want to do.  So short N/S splits is my next experiment.

That will make my wife happy. She says that I don't spend enough time or thought on the stove.  (sarcasm face)


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## oldspark (Dec 17, 2013)

Now that its back up into the 20's at night I let the fire go out, just a couple of days ago could not get enough heat out of it.
I have never had any trouble getting overnight burns with my Summit, Mulberry works well for overnight burns.


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## Treemoss (Dec 17, 2013)

Just loaded up with 6 splits of mulberry an hour ago and now cruzing with the air all the way down.


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## Hogwildz (Dec 17, 2013)

Ansky said:


> Hogwildz, what's the depth of your stove?  Just curious what size you cut your splits.  Mine stove's firebox is 24" E-W and maybe 13" or so N-S.  But most of my splits are 18".  I'm wondering if I should start cutting up my logs to 12" so I can load the stove that way.  It would be a lot more sawing, but probably easier splitting and more efficient burning.
> Any advice is welcome.  Just my 2nd season, so I'm still learning.


I want to say 20" x 20" or somewhere around that.
I can fit a 20" in if I remember correctly, but cut everything to about 18" to keep the splits away from the glass enough to keep them from offgassing on the glass and fogging it up.
I tried E-W and did not like it. It left splits in the back unburnt and just charred at best.
N-S makes it easier to load full, without the fear of anything rolling forward, and I feel makes for a tighter packed stove. I believe it burns hotter and faster N-S due to the air cavities being fed from the primary in front. More free flow of the air straight back, then smacking up against the side of the splits, it cruises between them.
At the burn times I am getting, I really can't complain about it burning down any faster.
These were made for N-S burning. Your appears made for E-W, but you may want to experiment and cut a few splits down to be able to load N-S and see how it performs. If it is doing the job fine as is, then I say go with what works,


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## Hogwildz (Dec 17, 2013)

oldspark said:


> Now that its back up into the 20's at night I let the fire go out, just a couple of days ago could not get enough heat out of it.
> I have never had any trouble getting overnight burns with my Summit, Mulberry works well for overnight burns.


Let the stove go out? What size place are you heating and how tight is it that you can let the stove go out in the 20s?


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## Hogwildz (Dec 17, 2013)

BrotherBart said:


> Well, if we are doing loaded pics...
> 
> 
> View attachment 120845


That right thar is optimal loading, tight & full! Nice


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## Hogwildz (Dec 17, 2013)

Archer39 said:


> My little blaze king stuffed full. I would show a picture of it after it starts to burn but that would be boring.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Look at all that wasted space, load that biach up tight & full man! LOL Its a BK, it will last for days!
Whats with the lumber?

What kind of real world burns you getting out of her?


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## Archer39 (Dec 17, 2013)

Hogwildz said:


> Look at all that wasted space, load that biach up tight & full man! LOL Its a BK, it will last for days!
> Whats with the lumber?
> 
> What kind of real world burns you getting out of her?




It is!!... Kinda hard to see but it is packed tight the bottom row the pieces are solid all the way across then the next layer is up the shield below the cat. There are no gaps just looks that way. That's as high as you can go because of the cat. 

The lumber is from my work. It's the blocking that comes on our bundles of metal for spacing. Around 12% MC burns great.

With these temps to keep the house warm (70's) I have to load every 8 hrs. I have some heat loss issues I have to addresses and vents to put in to circulate the heat better. I think after that I would be able to go 12-14 hrs. I am also burning some not so ideal wood right now. The good crap is behind the wet crap.


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## weatherguy (Dec 17, 2013)

I do 3 loads a day too Archer in this frigid weather, sometimes I can get away with 2 depending on the wood.

Hogz, is the Summit insert box a 3cf like the free stander? I thought my Princess was 2.8 but turns out the insert's a bit smaller at 2.54.


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## oldspark (Dec 17, 2013)

Hogwildz said:


> Let the stove go out? What size place are you heating and how tight is it that you can let the stove go out in the 20s?


2500 sq feet, berm house (walk in basement) with insulation on the outside of the block walls, big heat sink, below zero temps with a south wind are no fun though.
It was 61n the house this morning but both the wife and I like that temp for sleeping.


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## Hogwildz (Dec 17, 2013)

weatherguy said:


> I do 3 loads a day too Archer in this frigid weather, sometimes I can get away with 2 depending on the wood.
> 
> Hogz, is the Summit insert box a 3cf like the free stander? I thought my Princess was 2.8 but turns out the insert's a bit smaller at 2.54.


Yes 3cf, but that includes the baffle space too, so not true 3 for loading wood into.
So I guess in this weather, you ain't squeezing 24 hours out of a load? LOL
I guess you'll see some long burns in the shoulder seasons.


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## Hogwildz (Dec 17, 2013)

So is it a true berm, or just a walkout basement?
I can see the insulating value of being a good portion under ground, with the insulation around it.
Kudos to you. 20's round here with this place calls for burning.


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## oldspark (Dec 17, 2013)

Hogwildz said:


> So is it a true berm, or just a walkout basement?
> I can see the insulating value of being a good portion under ground, with the insulation around it.
> Kudos to you. 20's round here with this place calls for burning.


Well I guess its a true berm, we built the dirt up around it.
All the south glass makes it hard to heat when its real cold but working on getting some insulated curtains.


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## Archer39 (Dec 17, 2013)

Hogwildz said:


> Yes 3cf, but that includes the baffle space too, so not true 3 for loading wood into.
> So I guess in this weather, you ain't squeezing 24 hours out of a load? LOL
> I guess you'll see some long burns in the shoulder seasons.



Anyone who claims 24hr burns in a princess in these temps are either full of crap, have well insulated house that is  smaller  than 2000sq ft or likes their house cold. That just my opinion though.


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## Dix (Dec 17, 2013)

Saddle Mander said:


> That's the next thing I'm gonna try.  I put a lot more splits in last night than I have been, but it seems like I got about the same burn time with slightly lower temps.  But I can't REALLY fill it E/W unless a lot is resting on the glass, which I don't want to do.  So short N/S splits is my next experiment.
> 
> That will make my wife happy. She says that I don't spend enough time or thought on the stove.  (sarcasm face)



Smaller splits loaded N/S in the 13 burn really well.. And loading that stove E / W .......

As I sort through my firewood while stacking, I always toss the shorter splits into a "13" pile., and take the "too longs for either stove" and cut them in half, and burn them in both stoves, works for me. 

If you're getting 90 minutes out of that puppy something is wrong. 4 - 6 Hours is normal burn time, with an hour or two of residual heat..


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## dyerkutn (Dec 17, 2013)

Hogwildz said:


> If you load it tight, with large & medium splits it won't go nuclear. Especially with the moisture content of the wood you have. You prolly will get a shatload of coals though. It is when you load a bunch or real dry small stuff with lots of air space between, that things get bright.



HogWildz--I am with BeerBelly and Cableman--seems like if I put more than 3-4 splits (5 inches-ish) on a lowish bed of still hot coals my pipe temp (single wall) flies up----a couple of times to 700 but makes me nervous because I hear crackling noises and that new stove cure smell (I assume is the top part of the pipe).  But my splits usually have a lot of air plus a couple of small pieces underneath just to get flames restarted. I load N/S usually on a flat bed of coals. So are you saying that if I put in more splits but just pack them tight next to and top of each other it would be less likely to overfire than putting fewer that have more space between them?  My T5 can definitely fit way more than I am putting in and with this cold spell I could probably use it.


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## oldspark (Dec 17, 2013)

My flue temp goes up no matter how I run the stove, big loads, small loads it don't matter, if I want a hot fire I am going to have a hot flue.


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## dyerkutn (Dec 17, 2013)

oldspark said:


> My flue temp goes up no matter how I run the stove, big loads, small loads it don't matter, if I want a hot fire I am going to have a hot flue.


OldSpark. Thanks for responding. I remember you posted that before somewhere and I meant to ask you about it.Your temps sound crazy. And I think you also have single wall?   And is that internal or external temp? Do you think this is typical of PE's (I think my firebox is similar to yours). Do you get all that crackling and smell? How tall is your chimney?

I am thinking maybe I should get a stove top thermometer


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## Dairyman (Dec 17, 2013)

oldspark said:


> My flue temp goes up no matter how I run the stove, big loads, small loads it don't matter, if I want a hot fire I am going to have a hot flue.



Same here oldspark. But on the bright side the flue stays clean.


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## BrotherBart (Dec 17, 2013)

oldspark said:


> My flue temp goes up no matter how I run the stove, big loads, small loads it don't matter, if I want a hot fire I am going to have a hot flue.



Every time I see one of your posts I am so happy that I don't have a flue thermometer. Never have.  And the liners on the upstairs and the downstairs stoves have been there for for seven years. And they and the house have survived.


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## oldspark (Dec 17, 2013)

dyerkutn said:


> OldSpark. Thanks for responding. I remember you posted that before somewhere and I meant to ask you about it.Your temps sound crazy. And I think you also have single wall?   Do you think this is typical of PE's (I think my firebox is similar to yours). Do you get all that crackling and smell? How tall is your chimney?


BG's PE seems to run with cooler flue temps if I remember correctly but many report high flue temps, its not just PE's either.
I have asked this question many times, how can you have low flue temps when the secondaries are firing and the flames are wrapping around the baffle only a short distance from the flue exit?


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## dyerkutn (Dec 17, 2013)

oldspark said:


> how can you have low flue temps when the secondaries are firing and the flames are wrapping around the baffle only a short distance from the flue exit?


hmmm good point--


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## Dairyman (Dec 17, 2013)

From a few nights ago the big rock is ready to roll.


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## oldspark (Dec 17, 2013)

BrotherBart said:


> Every time I see one of your posts I am so happy that I don't have a flue thermometer. Never have.  And the liners on the upstairs and the downstairs stoves have been there for for seven years. And they and the house have survived.


I pretty much let the stove do its thing but at about 650 (surface single wall I like to idle it down and then the stove plays catch up.
It may be just this type of stove but it would be nice to know if it is normal.


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## dyerkutn (Dec 17, 2013)

dyerkutn said:


> hmmm good point--


posting on my post--one more thing--I seem to be getting big whitle splotches, sort of discoloring, at the bottom 6 inches of the flue--what does this mean and is it connected with heat in the flue.


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## oldspark (Dec 17, 2013)

dyerkutn said:


> posting on my post--one more thing--I seem to be getting big whitle splotches, sort of discoloring, at the bottom 6 inches of the flue--what does this mean and is it connected with heat in the flue.


What brand of stove pipe, might be the paint, I do not have that.


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## oldspark (Dec 17, 2013)

Something I have noticed from some people's posts, I get secondaries very early in the burn cycle even with a cold stove, right around 300 or so and I am sure that is contributing to the high flue temps. Damn dry wood.


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## dyerkutn (Dec 17, 2013)

oldspark said:


> What brand of stove pipe, might be the paint, I do not have that.


not sure--will have to look into that. 



oldspark said:


> might be the paint,


you  might be right--I just swiped it with my finger and got grey stuff on my finger--like powdery dry paint.


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## BrotherBart (Dec 17, 2013)

Dairyman said:


> From a few nights ago the big rock is ready to roll.



I have lusted to burn in a Manny for ten years. Damnit! That has to be one incredible wood stove.


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## dyerkutn (Dec 17, 2013)

oldspark said:


> Damn dry wood


yes--my wood is extremely dry too and flames up really quickly--even bigger splits if there are coals below


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## Dairyman (Dec 17, 2013)

BrotherBart said:


> I have lusted to burn in a Manny for ten years. Damnit! That has to be one incredible wood stove.



I'm impressed with the heat. The last 2 weeks were the coldest we've had with it. Ad it would keep the stove room hot with 2 full loads and a small one.


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## BrotherBart (Dec 17, 2013)

I would have one in my fireplace but with what that sucker weighs I would probably have it sitting demolished in the basement some night filled with burning wood. When the burn started on the floor above.


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## Paulywalnut (Dec 17, 2013)

Envy. Sometimes I wish I could load North -South like that.


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## oldspark (Dec 17, 2013)

Dairyman said:


> I'm impressed with the heat. The last 2 weeks were the coldest we've had with it. Ad it would keep the stove room hot with 2 full loads and a small one.


What size flue does that have?


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## velvetfoot (Dec 17, 2013)

I just split some little guys earlier to burn down coals.  Seems to work.


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## Dairyman (Dec 17, 2013)

oldspark said:


> What size flue does that have?



6"


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## Elusive (Dec 17, 2013)

oldspark said:


> BG's PE seems to run with cooler flue temps if I remember correctly but many report high flue temps, its not just PE's either.
> I have asked this question many times, how can you have low flue temps when the secondaries are firing and the flames are wrapping around the baffle only a short distance from the flue exit?



I posted about this the other day, but I peeked through the vent in my fireplace above my insert and saw my flexliner glowing a little red after a re-load.  Stove was just under 500 degrees at the time.   When i cut the air half way down the liner quits glowing within minutes.  I've since kept an eye on it and learned it will glow pretty much anytime i reload while building the stove temp back up.  I suspect it is pretty easy to make a flex liner glow, and it probably happens to others here, but they have no way to see it. .  I've tried cutting back the air sooner, but it caused problems reaching a good burn temp.  I have a ton of draft, not sure if that could be part of the problem.


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## lopiliberty (Dec 17, 2013)

I loaded 5 large (believe it or not probably 10 year old locust) into a 550 degree stove last night.  Got it going good closed the air to where I usually run it with a load of locust, got up this morning and the glass was solid black.  Don't know what in the hell happened.  Yeah mine burned all night but it was a smoldering mess


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## oldspark (Dec 17, 2013)

Elusive said:


> I've tried cutting back the air sooner, but it caused problems reaching a good burn temp. .


That's what happens to mine if I lower the air too soon.


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## Elusive (Dec 17, 2013)

lopiliberty said:


> I loaded 5 large (believe it or not probably 10 year old locust) into a 550 degree stove last night.  Got it going good closed the air to where I usually run it with a load of locust, got up this morning and the glass was solid black.  Don't know what in the hell happened.  Yeah mine burned all night but it was a smoldering mess




If that happened to me i'd probably have to do a liner sweep, because I would be completely paranoid.


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## Dix (Dec 17, 2013)

Tonight's load in the PE





Burning down the coal bed.





20 minutes later.

Upside down stove, again. Looks kinda cool )


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## Seasoned Oak (Dec 17, 2013)

Saddle Mander said:


> I'm giving it a go, but I can only stack E/W.
> 
> Left side is burning well.  Waiting for the right side to catch....


I know what yur sayin, for my 2CU ft stove and id have to cut wood about 10" long to stack N/S


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## lopiliberty (Dec 17, 2013)

Elusive said:


> If that happened to me i'd probably have to do a liner sweep, because I would be completely paranoid.


 I made sure I ran my flue up to 450 degrees for a couple minutes  just in case


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## Seasoned Oak (Dec 17, 2013)

Archer39 said:


> My little blaze king stuffed full. I would show a picture of it after it starts to burn but that would be boring.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


That looks like a piece of treated wood railing in there. Not a good idea to burn treated, may kill yur cat. :Edit Nevermind i just read yur post about it being spacing wood. looks just like treated railing though.


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## Quentin2 (Dec 18, 2013)

Your thread inspired me to stuff it full, well that and the fact it's 19 below outside!  This is white spruce with one split of cottonwood, there's 9 inches below the door so pics look a little deceptive.
Stay warm


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## weatherguy (Dec 18, 2013)

Archer39 said:


> Anyone who claims 24hr burns in a princess in these temps are either full of crap, have well insulated house that is  smaller  than 2000sq ft or likes their house cold. That just my opinion though.


 Who's making that claim? I haven't read that anywhere, some guys with the Kings are even burning two loads a day in these frigid temps.


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## tlingit (Dec 18, 2013)

So, do you think this type of loading is ok with soapstone?  We have a big equinox, and it's doing a nice job of heating the house, but I'm hesitant to pack it that full.  (and by heating the house, I mean 62 degrees in the unheated upstairs).  It's -25 here tonight in beautiful Wasilla AK.


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## oldspark (Dec 18, 2013)

tlingit said:


> So, do you think this type of loading is ok with soapstone?  We have a big equinox, and it's doing a nice job of heating the house, but I'm hesitant to pack it that full.  (and by heating the house, I mean 62 degrees in the unheated upstairs).  It's -25 here tonight in beautiful Wasilla AK.


 
Not sure why people have the idea its not safe to load your stove full, where is this fear coming from?


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## Dairyman (Dec 18, 2013)

tlingit said:


> So, do you think this type of loading is ok with soapstone?  We have a big equinox, and it's doing a nice job of heating the house, but I'm hesitant to pack it that full.  (and by heating the house, I mean 62 degrees in the unheated upstairs).  It's -25 here tonight in beautiful Wasilla AK.



It'll be fine, just remember that 600° is max on a hearthstone. I personally think it's a good idea to know how my stove will behave in different situations. So when I leave I'm not fretting over it. That said if what your doing is working for you keep doing it.


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## oldspark (Dec 18, 2013)

Dairyman said:


> It'll be fine, just remember that 600° is max on a hearthstone


 
So thats the limits of soapstone?
Yes knowing your stove wll make you feel good about loaking it full, make sure you have the time to spend with the stove a few times so you can trust it.


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## Saddle Mander (Dec 18, 2013)

oldspark said:


> Not sure why people have the idea its not safe to load your stove full, where is this fear coming from?



My NC13 manual says not to load it higher than the fire bricks.


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## Saddle Mander (Dec 18, 2013)

Doing The Dixie Eyed Hustle said:


> If you're getting 90 minutes out of that puppy something is wrong. 4 - 6 Hours is normal burn time, with an hour or two of residual heat..



I am wondering if something is wrong (assuming operator error).  I don't have the outside air intake installed.  The port is wide open in back.  Should that be closed up?  I had a plug in it, but the installer said that plug was for the hole in the firebox going to the ash drawer.


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## BrotherBart (Dec 18, 2013)

oldspark said:


> Not sure why people have the idea its not safe to load your stove full, where is this fear coming from?



Depends on what ya call full. Stuff it up to the baffle and not leave any combustion air space between the wood and the baffle and most of what comes off the wood get blown up the flue before it gets a chance to burn. Combustion needs fuel, air, heat, residence time and turbulence. Stuffed to the roof severely limits the residence time.  I have run the 30 stuffed and also I have run it loaded just to the top of the fire bricks a bunch of times and get better heat and the same burn times just loading to the top of the bricks and letting it burn the way it was designed to burn.


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## oldspark (Dec 18, 2013)

BrotherBart said:


> Depends on what ya call full. Stuff it up to the baffle and not leave any combustion air space between the wood and the baffle and most of what comes off the wood get blown up the flue before it gets a chance to burn. Combustion needs fuel, air, heat, residence time and turbulence. Stuffed to the roof severely limits the residence time.  I have run the 30 stuffed and also I have run it loaded just to the top of the fire bricks a bunch of times and get better heat and the same burn times just loading to the top of the bricks and letting it burn the way it was designed to burn.


Is that what they are referring to, I will have to go back and see if any one mentioned whether loading it to the baffle was a good idea or not.
I will make it a point to only load up to the fire brick and see if any difference, done it both ways and so far I cant tell any difference, but I will try and pay more attention this time.


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## Saddle Mander (Dec 18, 2013)

oldspark said:


> I will have to go back and see if any one mentioned whether loading it to the baffle was a good idea or not.



From the original post:



Hogwildz said:


> You want an overnight burn and then some, load the puppy full as you can. Start with some bigguns, then fill in the top. The baffle is the stopping point LOL.


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## oldspark (Dec 18, 2013)

Using the fire brick as a guide my Summit has a 1.7 cubic foot fire box, sweet.


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## oldspark (Dec 18, 2013)

Saddle Mander said:


> From the original post:


I know he said that but no one objected at that time.


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## oldspark (Dec 18, 2013)

I was waiting for some one to chime in about loading it to the baffle but it took 4 pages to get there.


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## Saddle Mander (Dec 18, 2013)

oldspark said:


> I was waiting for some one to chime in about loading it to the baffle but it took 4 pages to get there.



OK. I admit I spent 4 pages thinking, "Um, aren't you not supposed to do that?"  But I'm only 6 weeks into this whole stove thing so I was deferring to the knowledge, wisdom, and experience of others who--unlike me--actually HAVE a clue.


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## oldspark (Dec 18, 2013)

Saddle Mander said:


> OK. I admit I spent 4 pages thinking, "Um, aren't you not supposed to do that?"


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## cableman (Dec 19, 2013)

Had a nice bed of coals this morn after 10hrs! Relight was easy, thermastat room did drop to 63 so it wasnt really putting much heat out.


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## vwmike (Dec 19, 2013)

The PE manuals say you can stuff them full to the baffles. I still get secondaries no problem even stuffed right tight to the baffle, there is still plenty of air space.


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## velvetfoot (Dec 19, 2013)

No mention in my manual, far as I can see.


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## Saddle Mander (Dec 19, 2013)

I am having a totally different experience.  After 3 hours, my coals aren't even glowing any more.


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## cableman (Dec 19, 2013)

Saddle Mander said:


> I am having a totally different experience.  After 3 hours, my coals aren't even glowing any more.



Thats crazy! I moved the bottom ash around and mine was glowing after 10hrs! It was a good burn!


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## oldspark (Dec 19, 2013)

vwmike said:


> The PE manuals say you can stuff them full to the baffles. I still get secondaries no problem even stuffed right tight to the baffle, there is still plenty of air space.


 
Cool, I had not looked into my manual yet.


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## Dairyman (Dec 19, 2013)

BrotherBart said:


> Depends on what ya call full. Stuff it up to the baffle and not leave any combustion air space between the wood and the baffle and most of what comes off the wood get blown up the flue before it gets a chance to burn. Combustion needs fuel, air, heat, residence time and turbulence. Stuffed to the roof severely limits the residence time.  I have run the 30 stuffed and also I have run it loaded just to the top of the fire bricks a bunch of times and get better heat and the same burn times just loading to the top of the bricks and letting it burn the way it was designed to burn.



So how much space is needed?


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## oldspark (Dec 19, 2013)

vwmike said:


> The PE manuals say you can stuff them full to the baffles. I still get secondaries no problem even stuffed right tight to the baffle, there is still plenty of air space.


I do too but thought the suggestion about not loading it to the baffle was for our stove also, never noticed a problem with the secondaries with a small load of wood or a big one.


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## Hogwildz (Dec 20, 2013)

I stuff mine to the bottom of the baffle, and have no problems with the burn or secondaries.
When the load gets going, the wood both shrinks and for whatever reason, what was at the bottom of the baffle, by the time comes to cut the air back, the load is not about a 1/2" to an inch away from the baffle at that point. Those jets of the secondaries will burn the wood whether tight against, or below. Matter of fact, the secondaries will blast though all the top splits practically blasting all the way through at each line of ports.
For me, the space is there, I am using it.


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## Hogwildz (Dec 20, 2013)

Elusive said:


> I posted about this the other day, but I peeked through the vent in my fireplace above my insert and saw my flexliner glowing a little red after a re-load.  Stove was just under 500 degrees at the time.   When i cut the air half way down the liner quits glowing within minutes.  I've since kept an eye on it and learned it will glow pretty much anytime i reload while building the stove temp back up.  I suspect it is pretty easy to make a flex liner glow, and it probably happens to others here, but they have no way to see it. .  I've tried cutting back the air sooner, but it caused problems reaching a good burn temp.  I have a ton of draft, not sure if that could be part of the problem.


Elusive, you should in no way have anything glowing, on the stove, or the liner. With the exception of the baffle and sometimes the baffle rail(s).
If that flex liner is glowing, you got way too much heat going up the flue. Which leads me to believe your cutting the air back way to late. If you have to cut it back any later than 400-500 degrees, your wood is wet, or you have a weak draft, and your keeping it flaming longer to keep it from smouldering when you cut the air back. Which is an indicator the wood ain't ready.
I have 27' of liner and have a serious draft, and never seen the liner glow.
Based on what I have read, I am banking that your wood is not close to ready.
Throw some real dry stuff in there and you should be able to cut the air back around 400 and she will do the rest.
I load, run 15-20 mins, cut air back to 50% at 300 degrees, run another 10 mins, cut the air back all the way.
The time frame maybe be extended if I am loading a cold stove or say the insert temp has dropped to 100-150.
After 400 she is basically on autopilot with air shut back.

With a strong draft you would be cutting the air back sooner, not later.


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## Elusive (Dec 21, 2013)

Hogwildz said:


> Elusive, you should in no way have anything glowing, on the stove, or the liner. With the exception of the baffle and sometimes the baffle rail(s).
> If that flex liner is glowing, you got way too much heat going up the flue. Which leads me to believe your cutting the air back way to late. If you have to cut it back any later than 400-500 degrees, your wood is wet, or you have a weak draft, and your keeping it flaming longer to keep it from smouldering when you cut the air back. Which is an indicator the wood ain't ready.
> I have 27' of liner and have a serious draft, and never seen the liner glow.
> Based on what I have read, I am banking that your wood is not close to ready.
> ...



Thanks for the reply.  I've been having success with cutting the air back around 350 degrees the last couple days.  I burn almost exclusively black locust that has been c/s/s for exactly one year, but some of my bigger splits aren't quite ready yet, so i've been more selective when loading.


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## Huntindog1 (Dec 22, 2013)

I remember one thing is loading east west and stacking it high in the front of the stove traps the heat in the stove and the stove can over heat more easily. Many of us east west loaders have done that and learned our lesson.

Stacking it high in the stove is a concept we talk about alot as these stoves work best from full load cycles. Plus the top down technique of fire starting. Your basically creating a real small burn chamber up at the top of the stove that being small is more easily heated up and the heat is more easily maintained in a smaller space which creates a condition to fire off secondaries. So you get a fire up in the top of the stove while your main wood load sits underneath as the  stove burns down from top to bottom. There is just a little bit of dog house air down at the coal level to energize the coals at a slow burn level while most of your heat is made up top burning smoke gases.

I believe some maybe able to get a longer burn by block off the doghouse air inlet, on my stove its a 3/8" in hole on the bottom of the stove front center. I put a piece of aluminum foil tape over the hole. This now allows  the draw of the flue to pull in more air in the top of the stove thru the secondary holes in the tubes or manifold. So the load at the bottom burns slower while the flames at the top burn more with more air coming in. More of a balancing act of air flow thru the stove.


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## begreen (Dec 22, 2013)

Hogwildz said:


> I stuff mine to the bottom of the baffle, and have no problems with the burn or secondaries.
> When the load gets going, the wood both shrinks and for whatever reason, what was at the bottom of the baffle, by the time comes to cut the air back, the load is not about a 1/2" to an inch away from the baffle at that point. Those jets of the secondaries will burn the wood whether tight against, or below. Matter of fact, the secondaries will blast though all the top splits practically blasting all the way through at each line of ports.
> For me, the space is there, I am using it.


This is possible with the unique, flat-metal-bottom baffle in the PE stoves. The box baffle is not going to get damaged if you bang a split up against it. I would leave a bit more room under the tubes in a stove that has an insulation board baffle.


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## Hogwildz (Dec 22, 2013)

begreen said:


> This is possible with the unique, flat-metal-bottom baffle in the PE stoves. The box baffle is not going to get damaged if you bang a split up against it. I would leave a bit more room under the tubes in a stove that has an insulation board baffle.


Agreed. And I will be hopefully doing just that once I ever get the 30 Hooked up.


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## privatejoker75 (Dec 22, 2013)

We have a BK Chinook 20 and I stuff it every night around 11pm and put it on a lower thermomostat setting.  At 7am it's still like 25% full and going strong


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## Machria (Dec 22, 2013)

BrotherBart said:


> Well, if we are doing loaded pics...
> 
> 
> View attachment 120845




That's an awesome shot


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## jzinckgra (Dec 22, 2013)

I pulled this quote from the csia site " In the case of wood stoves, overloading the firebox with wood in an attempt to get a longer burn time also contributes to creosote buildup" I thought this was interesting given all the talk about stuffing boxes full. Maybe they are thinking everyone fills the box and let's it smolder all nite otherwise not sure I understand their warning.


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## Huntindog1 (Dec 22, 2013)

My experience has been that smaller areas up in the top of the stove are easier to build the heat up in the top of the stove. Free open space in a stove is harder to build heat up in. Even if the wood is stacked to the bottom of the baffle tubes there is still air coming in thru those air holes. Its the heat build up thats going to fire off those secondaries burning the smoke gases. If your wood is good and dry and you load on a good bed of hot coals your going to get some secondary action pretty quick with a full load of dry wood mainly because smaller areas build up heat much quicker than big open areas in a firebox. As a matter of fact like I mentioned before if you load wood high in the front of the stove with a east west load you can get a too hot of stove that can be hard to get shut down and cooled down. 

If you think in terms of its all about the heat, things make much more sense. The old way of thinking is its all about flames but flames dont always build you heat.. So when your operating your stove think of ways to build heat in the firebox as when you do that better your stove will burn better.


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