# Generator for Pellet Stove



## MainePellethead (Jan 7, 2008)

Hi everyone....just curious on the "size" etc of a generator that will actually run a pellet stove in times of power outages. We very rarely have one in my area but just in case.  I am having a Quadra Fire Castille installed Wednesday. The dealer said the battery back ups on these are so very expensive it would probably be cheaper to get a small generator from Honda etc. But a small one is 800 bucks! lol....Just wanted some input from Rod or others that could direct me in a good choice. 

Thanks!


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## Xena (Jan 7, 2008)

800 bucks?  Where you shoppin?   
I have a portable Coleman Proforce
3750 that powers my stove, computer,
and more.   Paid 313.00 shipped on sale
from northern tool.
Price might be a little higher now but my
point being you can get a good one for
short money. 
http://www.northerntool.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/product_6970_449_449.


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## MainePellethead (Jan 7, 2008)

zeta said:
			
		

> 800 bucks?  Where you shoppin?
> I have a portable Coleman Proforce
> 3750 that powers my stove, computer,
> and more.   Paid 313.00 shipped on sale
> ...



I didnt shop....I looked  lol  But one of the dealers locally was saying some of the cheaper models of generators will not work on some pellet stoves for some reason. But was telling me that Hondas will work on all. Just curious. Used alot of generators but just not on pellet stoves....so didnt really know any info on it.

lol  actually there on sale for less than what you paid lol....thanks for the info.


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## Xena (Jan 7, 2008)

AwsumSS said:
			
		

> I didnt shop....I looked  lol  But one of the dealers locally was saying some of the
> cheaper models of generators will not work on some pellet stoves for some reason.
> But was telling me that Hondas will work on all. Just curious.



If it has enough power then I don't see why
any brand wouldn't work for a pellet stove.
Mine works great with my stove.



			
				AwsumSS said:
			
		

> lol  actually there on sale for less than what you paid lol....thanks for the info.



Nope it's still not less.  I paid 313.00 shipped.  NT now wants 340.00+ shipped to me
279 plus 63 and some change for shipping..  ;-) 

Good luck shopping for one.  The reviews at NT are right on.   Can't say a bad thing about mine.


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## blanc12 (Jan 7, 2008)

Try the old wally world. save on shipping.

$297 plus Baldacci's cut.
http://www.walmart.com/catalog/product.do?product_id=6487122

honda's electricity isn't special in any way shape or form. Perhaps the people telling you to get one will get a cut of the sale.


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## MainePellethead (Jan 7, 2008)

Thanks!

Its funny....I had another stove shop maybe 2 months ago on the other side of town said he had someone come in that said his stove wouldnt run off a Honda generator...lol......and they wonder why some consumers get confused....nothings ever easy and to the point I guess.  I'm not even sure I will buy one right away....in the 14 years  we have been in this house we probably lost power maybe 4 times and not for very long at all....

thanks again...


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## begreen (Jan 7, 2008)

A small 1KW generator will easily handle an average pellet stove. Honda is a good choice. It costs a lot more, but worth it. Their super quiet units are better built than the average unit, offering cleaner power for the electronics and much quieter. Subaru also makes some nice units.


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## Highbeam (Jan 7, 2008)

The small hondas you were likely being shown were the EUi series of inverter generators. They are almost entirely red plastic box that can be carried like a lunchbox in 1000 and 2000 watt sizes. The larger ones are not easily carried and double the price. If you were at a dealership then I feel pretty confident that you were being quoted on a Honda Eu1000i which is sufficient for your pellet stove, quiet, and has a good track record. These small hondas do not need to run at 3600 rpm to produce 60HZ power so they idle down which makes them much quieter and efficient. They are very nice and suitable, really ideal, for campgrounds. I would suggest the 2000 watt model if you choose to go with the honda since the additional cost is very small and the extra power will allow you to run your fridge with minimal additional fuel cost.

For home backup power I need 220 volts to backfeed my panel (the legal way). The proper Honda is extremely expensive. So I chose the 3500/4000 watt Champion Power Equipment brand generator from the local schucks for 299$. This is the yellow one that weighs 112 lbs so I can lift it into my pickup if needed. This thing is very quiet relative to the typical portable generator from HD. I was preparing to pull wire just last night to mount the outside male plug. The cheap generators are disposable. I can buy 6 of them for the price of the equivalent Honda and the track record from the RV crowd for these champions has shown 500+ of hours of life without trouble. In other words, look out Honda.

This is the right time to decide on whether you want to just power the stove or you want to keep more items powered up.


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## deadeye316 (Jan 7, 2008)

I have been looking into this and it seems the only place to buy a small one is online.  Lowes, homedepot even walmart only carry $400 dollar ones


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## deadeye316 (Jan 7, 2008)

What about this with a marine battery

http://www.target.com/Xpower-400-Wa...t&field;-browse=1038576&rh=k:generator&page=1


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## moralleper (Jan 7, 2008)

anybody have any idea how long the xpower 400watt powerpack would run an average pellet stove?


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## webbie (Jan 7, 2008)

I would look at a UPS setup, and then maybe an car attached inverter for plugging that into after a couple hours.
A UPS setup will turn on instantly when the power goes out, and since most power interruptions are short this may do the job. Another nice thing about a UPS is that it conditions the power.

Also, a short break in power will usually reset your pellet stove (turn it off). If you are not home to do some switcheroo, then you are out of luck. The UPS instantly changes over and then instantly changes back. Length of service will depend on pellet stove and on storage rating, but I think from 30 minutes to 4 hours is doable. For longer periods you could have one of those car inverters and plug the ups into it (use your car battery or a spare).


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## begreen (Jan 8, 2008)

Highbeam said:
			
		

> The small hondas you were likely being shown were the EUi series of inverter generators. They are almost entirely red plastic box that can be carried like a lunchbox in 1000 and 2000 watt sizes. The larger ones are not easily carried and double the price. If you were at a dealership then I feel pretty confident that you were being quoted on a Honda Eu1000i which is sufficient for your pellet stove, quiet, and has a good track record. These small hondas do not need to run at 3600 rpm to produce 60HZ power so they idle down which makes them much quieter and efficient. They are very nice and suitable, really ideal, for campgrounds. I would suggest the 2000 watt model if you choose to go with the honda since the additional cost is very small and the extra power will allow you to run your fridge with minimal additional fuel cost.
> 
> For home backup power I need 220 volts to backfeed my panel (the legal way). The proper Honda is extremely expensive. So I chose the 3500/4000 watt Champion Power Equipment brand generator from the local schucks for 299$. This is the yellow one that weighs 112 lbs so I can lift it into my pickup if needed. This thing is very quiet relative to the typical portable generator from HD. I was preparing to pull wire just last night to mount the outside male plug. The cheap generators are disposable. I can buy 6 of them for the price of the equivalent Honda and the track record from the RV crowd for these champions has shown 500+ of hours of life without trouble. In other words, look out Honda.
> 
> This is the right time to decide on whether you want to just power the stove or you want to keep more items powered up.



What type of power does the Champion put out, true sine wave? I have a 5KW Coleman and can't run some electronics nor anything on the UPS. Suspect it's due to the square sine wave and poorer voltage regulation.


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## stoveguy2esw (Jan 8, 2008)

BeGreen said:
			
		

> Highbeam said:
> 
> 
> 
> ...



if a pellet stove is controlled by a digital setup (instead of analog) then a pure sine wave power source should be used, squared  or "modified sine wave' power tends to mess with digital equipment of some types.


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## wilbilt (Jan 8, 2008)

Highbeam said:
			
		

> For home backup power I need 220 volts to backfeed my panel (the legal way). The proper Honda is extremely expensive. So I chose the 3500/4000 watt Champion Power Equipment brand generator from the local schucks for 299$. This is the yellow one that weighs 112 lbs so I can lift it into my pickup if needed. This thing is very quiet relative to the typical portable generator from HD. I was preparing to pull wire just last night to mount the outside male plug. The cheap generators are disposable. I can buy 6 of them for the price of the equivalent Honda and the track record from the RV crowd for these champions has shown 500+ of hours of life without trouble. In other words, look out Honda.
> 
> This is the right time to decide on whether you want to just power the stove or you want to keep more items powered up.



I bought one of those on Saturday due to a storm-produced outage. I used it to power my refrigerator, freezer and well pump with excellent results. The ol' pellet stove was happily running from a car battery, so I saw no reason to interrupt that.

My initial impression of the Champion generator is very positive (and I hate imported crap). I have read that the engines are licensed "clones" of Honda engines. From what I can see, they nailed it. For the price, I don't think it can be beat.


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## begreen (Jan 8, 2008)

I thought Champion was Chinese. Guess I must have misread that.


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## wilbilt (Jan 8, 2008)

BeGreen said:
			
		

> I thought Champion was Chinese. Guess I must have misread that.


The Champoin _is_ Chinese.
I generally avoid Chinese imports at all costs, but did not have any other choices at the time.

The 6.5HP engine looks like an identical, slightly smaller twin to the 11HP Honda GX340 sitting next to it in my shed. The fit and finish on the entire unit are much better than I had expected.

We'll see how it holds up.


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## Highbeam (Jan 8, 2008)

Well yes, the champions are made in China but unlike most chinese clone generators the champions are made from a sole source for the CPE company rather than the typical chinese generator which is made in bulk from low bid and then you apply your company logo with a sticker. CPE has a very decent website with actual good support and service. 

I haven't put mine on a scope of course but the waveform is not the likely reason that your Coleman couldn't run the electronics. After all, the powerhead is a rotating magnet, should be a very decent sine wave not unlike what the utility uses to produce power. The Coleman will suffer from poor voltage regulation and high electrical noise levels resulting in dirty power. The fancy schmancy honda inverter generators make a modified sine wave also since the inverter creates the waveform from the varying alternator input of the genset. 

There is another forum out there called RV.net about RVs and the RV crowd is very particular about generators. They have a thread that has exceeded 500 pages in length about these Champion 3500/4000 watt peak generators. The reviews are nearly all excellent with some users reporting more than 700 hours of dependable service, also very good customer service when needed. The voltage regultaors are adjustable and replaceable. I believe someone even posted a scope shot. The RV guys run AC units as well as computer systems, entertainment systems, microwaves, and refrigerators which all contain circuit boards these days. Have you ever tried to read a 500 page thread? Seriously, it'll take days but if you are even slightly interested I believe you'll gain great value from the thread. The Champion will be much quieter than a coleman and very easy on fuel. Offers 15 amps of 220 power or the full 30 amps of 110 power out of a single outlet. This is uncommon. Usually each "phase" of 110 power in a 220 generator can only provide half of the generator's rated ouput. IE:your 5000 watt coleman can only send 2500 watts from any single 110 plug. Well the RV guys need a lot of 110 volt power through a single plug in so the 30 amp plug is valuable.

I have a big Coleman for welding but it has lost its voltage regulation ability. It is loud as heck and sucks fuel. Anybody want an 11HP Tecumseh engine run on synthetic oil all its life?


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## Highbeam (Jan 8, 2008)

Here's the Champion's waveform from the RV.net site. Poster name: professor95 

If you look at the second photo you will see a normal sine wave as measured on an oscilloscope. Note it is a well formed sinusoidal wave form of equal amplitude and time on each side of the center line. This is what you could expect from your “shore power”.

Virtually all direct drive alternators will have a somewhat altered wave form due to the lack of enough hysteresis to flatten the waveform peak. This is to be expected. 

Take a look below at the output from my 3,500 watt Champion.

Did you notice the sharper peak on the waveform? Actually, for a direct drive genset this waveform looks doggone good. There is a very low level of distortion on the wave. CPE advertises less than 4% THD. My genset easily meets that claim.

Many direct drive gensets will have “noise” or distortion on the wave form. There are several causes, the most common being eddy currents that naturally occur between the spinning rotor coil and the stator coil. Some gensets do a better job of filtering this distortion than others. Usually, higher levels of distortion cause no harm unless you have some very sensitive electronics on board.


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## Highbeam (Jan 8, 2008)

Woops, too big. Here's the normal utility wave form.


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## pegdot (Jan 9, 2008)

Sine waves??? Oh gosh, you guys are killing me! Too complicated. So now I've got to worry about whether or not my genny will hurt my stove?  hh: 

Is there some relatively simple way to "clean up" the power to insure that doesn't happen?


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## Highbeam (Jan 9, 2008)

The 4% THD means that at least this one generator is very clean. No cleanup necessary. They have some devices called power conditioners that will correct under and over voltage conditions, level spikes, and such but I've never used one. Many times a UPS can clean up the power from utility or generator power. 

I suppose you could put your generator of choice on a scope and then get the Englander guys to give you the thumbs up.


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## pete324rocket (Jan 9, 2008)

we bought a generator just before christmas at the local Walmart for 149.95 unbelievably. 1200 watts 2 stroke but real quiet rated at 65 db and a decently modest fuel consumption-bad part though is that it wouldn't power the pellet stove and the display on the stove indicated an inverted plug-though I tried it both ways. The generator would power the microwave and tv ok.
We have a battery charger-inverter-deep cycle battery set-up so we are still safe-its new and we can get 6.5 hours before the low voltage warning on the inverter-running one deep cycle battery.The generator was made in China unfortunately,hence the cost but could pass for any local product-especially the being quiet part.


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## MainePellethead (Jan 9, 2008)

pete324rocket said:
			
		

> we bought a generator just before christmas at the local Walmart for 149.95 unbelievably. 1200 watts 2 stroke but real quiet rated at 65 db and a decently modest fuel consumption-bad part though is that it wouldn't power the pellet stove and the display on the stove indicated an inverted plug-though I tried it both ways. The generator would power the microwave and tv ok.
> We have a battery charger-inverter-deep cycle battery set-up so we are still safe-its new and we can get 6.5 hours before the low voltage warning on the inverter-running one deep cycle battery.The generator was made in China unfortunately,hence the cost but could pass for any local product-especially the being quiet part.



That was one of the reasons I started the post...was curious on what would be the minimum size to keep a pellet stove running? Although I didnt quite mention it like that but perhaps thats why I had heard some people here locally complain that theirs wouldnt operate their pellet stove...maybe not big enough...


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## pete324rocket (Jan 9, 2008)

I think my fans need 3 amps to run so 3 amps x 120 volts = 360 watts. Thats assuming you don't use the ignitor to start which as you can imagine,as a heating element,takes a lot of juice.Thats pretty basic and I'm assuming the power to run the controls-digital board is hardly a factor. Must add that when I used the generator to run the microwave,it ran pretty funky with the digital display flickering a lot though it still did the job.I did get the pellet stove to partially run when I quickly switched from the wall current to the generator current but the fans wouldn't run though the stove fed pellets and the ignitor was lit. If it was life or death,in an emergency,I probably could have bypassed to get them to run...it would have to be pretty desperate though. One thought though, I suppose, my generator has a dc outlet for 12 volts and many do - an inverter rated for enough wattage could be used without the storage battery and hopefully would give a clean enough source to power a pellet stove.Just another angle.


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## pegdot (Jan 10, 2008)

Well.....SHOOT! Now I'm going to have to roll out the genny and try it on the stove. Better make sure it will work before I need it! Ours is big so I don't think size would be an issue but this "clean" electricity thing is news to me. I've never used it to power any sophisticated electronics. Usually just saws, lights, air compressor, battery charger, and such. We've only ever had to use it for the house once and if I remember right I had a sump pump, the blower on our wood burner, the microwave, one TV, and a couple of lamps plugged in to it. Certainly did a nice job. The only danger was tripping over the extension cords.  :roll:


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## Highbeam (Jan 10, 2008)

Good idea Peggy. It is very important to test your emergency equipment even to the extent of eating an MRE just so you know what to expect.

If your generator ran the microwave and TV with no apparent ill effects like flickers, crazy displays, etc. then I would say that your odds are good for success with the stove. Make sure that your extension cord is adequate for the amperage.

Running extension cords of adequate gauge and length can be a tripping hazard but it is electrically a very safe way to do things. Even better is one of the various transfer switch options but that requires investment. Much worse than extension cords is the famous double male ended suicide cord used to send current from the generator through an existing plug in the house like a dryer or welder outlet. Very common and quite illegal.


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## drizler (Jan 10, 2008)

At 4 times in 14 years you will surely have way more problems with the gen set than you could ever hope to have with needing power during a winter outage.    You will have to change out the gas and or start it regularly or it will literally get all gummed up and not start when you need it.     Why not just go to Wallyworld or Sammys club or wherever and get an inverter.   Then you can run it off one of your cars batteries till the power comes back on or the house is warm.    I have a POWER ON BOARD 500 That I haven't even used and sits in a little plastic box it came in..   I think I paid around $25 or so at Sams club.   Its a modified sine wave like the generator I use on occasion.     Its small and just sits there waiting to be needed.  On the other hand my generator needs starting every couple months and has had a few small rubber pieces go bad and I have had to replace and pull the carb apart and clean out once since 1998.   We get outages every few months here in NY.      
    When it comes to generators we got the full education in our big ice storm and I had the privelige of owning a Cloleman.    It was a big monster  6200.   Very hard to start no compression break so it was doubly hard and ran very badly.   A good genset should cost around 700 bucks and is a world of difference.    Sears sells decent ones that I think are made by Generac.  If you do get one keep it filled with decent gas and STABIL fuel stabilizer and dump it in your car every 6 months and replace.     For what you need I think a cheap inverter utilizing whatever batteries you may have around the house would serve your needs better.   You can use any car, tractor boat or whatever 12 volt you have around just keep them charged up on a battery maintainer, something you should do anyway.   Buying a purpose specific battery like deep cycle is nice but won't do you any good if it goes dead sitting around so you need that charged up too.   They do sell those neat little solar chargers on ebay that come on all the new volkswagens in transit .   They are nice and well built for a good price.   Otherwise Wallyworld sells a Black and decker plug in model that suffices.   I have one of those and it only runs once in a while and as needed for a price under 20 bucks.     
  My own personal favorite for emergency heating is one of those coleman powermate 45000 btu radiant heaters you put on top of a propane BBQ bottle.    No electric needed will heat your house for a day or 2 on a BBQ bottle of propane and is small since it sits on top vertically being about 3 feet high sitting on top of the bottle.    Its easy to move around carrying by the bottles handles too.   I use mine all the time sunning my tushey fixing broken cars and tractors in a snowbank and to heat my garage when I need quick heat.   Ebay for around 100 usually and can be dialed down from 45 k to 25 I believe.     I positively love mine and wouldnt be without one again.   I use it to heat up the house in the morning when its super cold to make up for the pellet stove being so slow to bring it up to temp.    I hope all this isn't too confusing but as you can see there is no simple cheap or long term answer now is there.    Remember those wise words of the kindly drill seargant ,  "KEEP IT SIMPLE STUPID".    It all goes so much easier when things go wrong doing it that way.


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## MainePellethead (Jan 11, 2008)

Driz said:
			
		

> At 4 times in 14 years you will surely have way more problems with the gen set than you could ever hope to have with needing power during a winter outage.    You will have to change out the gas and or start it regularly or it will literally get all gummed up and not start when you need it.     Why not just go to Wallyworld or Sammys club or wherever and get an inverter.   Then you can run it off one of your cars batteries till the power comes back on or the house is warm.    I have a POWER ON BOARD 500 That I haven't even used and sits in a little plastic box it came in..   I think I paid around $25 or so at Sams club.   Its a modified sine wave like the generator I use on occasion.     Its small and just sits there waiting to be needed.  On the other hand my generator needs starting every couple months and has had a few small rubber pieces go bad and I have had to replace and pull the carb apart and clean out once since 1998.   We get outages every few months here in NY.
> When it comes to generators we got the full education in our big ice storm and I had the privelige of owning a Cloleman.    It was a big monster  6200.   Very hard to start no compression break so it was doubly hard and ran very badly.   A good genset should cost around 700 bucks and is a world of difference.    Sears sells decent ones that I think are made by Generac.  If you do get one keep it filled with decent gas and STABIL fuel stabilizer and dump it in your car every 6 months and replace.     For what you need I think a cheap inverter utilizing whatever batteries you may have around the house would serve your needs better.   You can use any car, tractor boat or whatever 12 volt you have around just keep them charged up on a battery maintainer, something you should do anyway.   Buying a purpose specific battery like deep cycle is nice but won't do you any good if it goes dead sitting around so you need that charged up too.   They do sell those neat little solar chargers on ebay that come on all the new volkswagens in transit .   They are nice and well built for a good price.   Otherwise Wallyworld sells a Black and decker plug in model that suffices.   I have one of those and it only runs once in a while and as needed for a price under 20 bucks.
> My own personal favorite for emergency heating is one of those coleman powermate 45000 btu radiant heaters you put on top of a propane BBQ bottle.    No electric needed will heat your house for a day or 2 on a BBQ bottle of propane and is small since it sits on top vertically being about 3 feet high sitting on top of the bottle.    Its easy to move around carrying by the bottles handles too.   I use mine all the time sunning my tushey fixing broken cars and tractors in a snowbank and to heat my garage when I need quick heat.   Ebay for around 100 usually and can be dialed down from 45 k to 25 I believe.     I positively love mine and wouldnt be without one again.   I use it to heat up the house in the morning when its super cold to make up for the pellet stove being so slow to bring it up to temp.    I hope all this isn't too confusing but as you can see there is no simple cheap or long term answer now is there.    Remember those wise words of the kindly drill seargant ,  "KEEP IT SIMPLE STUPID".    It all goes so much easier when things go wrong doing it that way.


I hadnt planned on "just" for the pellet stove. As with my other toys I would run it fairly regular for various chores around the house etc....but yes.....what you have said makes sense. Thanks


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## Kenny1 (Jan 11, 2008)

Before buying a generator. prehaps you should do some thinking about what you are going to use it for and how you are going to connect it.

If you just wish to power a pellet stove, a small generator will suffice.  If you wish to ride out a 2 or 3 day power outage, and run the stove, fridge, well pump, freezer, etc., you may need a larger unit (and a large amount of stored fuel!).

Gas is handy for most of use, but does not store well.  Desiel keeps longer. but the generators cost more.  NG may also be an option for you, or propane.

How often does the power go out for long periods where you live? Are you planning for the “storm of the centuary” or just looking to ride out “typical” conditions? To handle a week requires a much larger budget than to cover a 1 - 2 day outage. 

What is the load size? Do you want to run everything (including the big screen TV), or would a fridge and a couple of CF light bulbs be enough?  Keep in mind the start up current draw of motors (e.g. well pump). 

How will you connect the generator to the load? This is very critical for your safety (and the safety of others). A proper transfer switch is required for powering hard wired appliances, and is very safe and convient.  Extensions cords are fine for smaller loads, but more work to hook up. 

Will you have fuel for your generator?  How much?  How long can you store it for?  Where will you store it? 

Whatever you do get, be sure to order some extra filters for it (you need to change them durning a power outage). 

If you do go gas, then the smallest generator will require the least amount of fuel (a good thing if gas is scarce!).

BTW, we have a B&S;PRO4000 (nice, clean, well regulated power), and a bunch of extension cords.

Cheers


Kenny


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## zogboy (Jan 11, 2008)

I converted my Homelite/b+s 4500 w to burn 
propane a few years back.
I got  the parts from a WVa company for around $35.
I took about an hour to do the conversion .
I have a manual transfer I got out of salvage from work.

The oil seems to stay cleaner with propane and the plug is alway clean.

It will run my boiler, fridge, lights , and entertainment.
 in the inverter 
But if I just need power to the pellet stove I plug into the 750 w inverter on my little car and let that run 
to power the car.
It is a lot less hassle.


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## wilbilt (Jan 11, 2008)

Kenny said:
			
		

> How will you connect the generator to the load? This is very critical for your safety (and the safety of others). A proper transfer switch is required for powering hard wired appliances, and is very safe and convient.  Extensions cords are fine for smaller loads, but more work to hook up.



I agree that safety in this matter is of utmost concern. It is absolutely imperative that you do not backfeed the utility lines.

My home is a manufactured home, which means it has a subpanel that powers everything in the home, but the well pump and outbuildings are fed from the main panel out on the power pole. I installed a 6-circuit transfer switch on the house panel several years ago (remember Y2K? LOL) but due to procrastination, I never wired it in.

During this latest outage, I simply pulled an extension cord in through a window to power a refrigerator and freezer as well as cell phone chargers, etc.

In order to power the well pump, I had to tie into the pump circuit at the main panel. With the main breaker shut off, I removed the wires going to the pump from their circuit breaker and wired them to a Romex pigtail with a 220V plug to match the generator cord.

Since the generator I bought will not supply power to the 110V and 220V outlets at the same time, I had to alternate between running the appliances and running the well pump. This actually worked out pretty well, since my pellet stove runs directly on 12V power.

I could have cobbled together a "Y" cable to power everything at the same time, but since it was raining heavily, I did not want to temp fate by playing with electricity while soaking wet. 

I plan to be better prepared for next time by wiring the transfer switch, adding a permanent twistlock connection for the well pump, and putting together some cables that will allow everything to be connected at once.


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## MainePellethead (Jan 11, 2008)

"Driz" mentioned  "inverters" . Can someone explain a little more on them.  Not real familiar with....right size inverter? And the operation of the pellet stove with  it?


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## Highbeam (Jan 11, 2008)

An inverter takes direct current such as the power from a car battery and creats alternating current that looks sorta like what the power company sends you. Input is usually 12 volt and output is 110 volt. The inverter's AC output is generally good enough to run most things and some inverters do a better job of creating this cleanly. They all consume a bit of the power in the conversion. They are available in many sizes and price ranges. Some are small enough to plug into the cigarrete lighter of your car and produce AC to use for a home DVD player or cell phone charger. Some are big enough to run the entire house as is the case with most off-grid types folks that use solar or wind power to charge batteries. 

There is another device called a converter that makes DC out of AC and is essentially a battery charger but if you had a 12volt DC device you could run it with AC power. 

With an inverter, say a 1200 watt output one. You've got to send the same amount of watts to it from the battery so 1200 watts. Well that's 100 amps of 12 volt DC power and it's going to take two fat and expensive pieces of wire. Once you convert the same watts to AC it is only 10 amps and a tiny little 14 gauge wire will pass the current safely. The point is that you want to locate your inverter very close to the battery and then run the AC line to your appliance. The batteries will bubble and blow all kinds of nasty fumes and gas while putting out their power so you want the batteries outside or in an outbuilding.

A welder operates at 25 volts and I can weld 1/4" steel plate with 90 amps. 100 amps of DC power is really something and the batteries will be working.


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## zogboy (Jan 12, 2008)

AwsumSS said:
			
		

> "Driz" mentioned  "inverters" . Can someone explain a little more on them.  Not real familiar with....right size inverter? And the operation of the pellet stove with  it?




I got a little 750 watt inverter made by black and decker at walmart for $49.

I connect it directly to the battery in my little geo metro.
I put a large alternator on the car last summer to power this 
setup.
It will idle for days on a tank of gas , I run a 14 ga 50 cord to my  stove and stay toasty warm .


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## bit_flores (Jan 12, 2008)

Ok,  generators ==>   I use a backup generator.   I have a 5000 watt Generac.  I bought it because we have an all-electric house and have outages here near Cleveland.   It does NOT cause any major issues with the pellets stove when I have used it during an outage.   Sine wave distortion or not, my pellet stove handles it well.   If the pellet stove circuit design is robust enough, the only thing that should matter most is the voltage.  The generator easily handles my standard emergency load:  pellet stove, sump pump, lights, refrigerator, freezer, microwave if needed, plus a couple of computers if I want to get on the internet.   My APC UPS units do complain because of the wave distortion, but they manage to still work and take the charge from the crappy sine wave.

Now, UPS units  ==>   I have successfully run my pellet stove with a APC 1000 Back-UPS Pro this last November.   It had new batteries put in this last summer.  The UPS ran fine, with the stove on a B setting.   It ran for over an hour, with plenty of battery life left on the UPS.  The power came back on, so I cannot tell you how long it would last until the battery charge would deplete.  I have read on other forums that if you have a UPS that takes a 12 volt battery source input, you can use marine batteries as your battery source.  That would greatly increase your UPS backup life.  Just make sure that you use the proper wire gage, connectors and use the protective battery boxes.


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## CygnusX1 (Jan 16, 2008)

I use an American Power battery back up unit.

It's not much bigger than a stereo receiver.

I get 8-10 hours of uninterrupted power from it.


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## wundercat (Jan 16, 2008)

Regardless of what power source is running your stove, you should always use a good surge protector between the stove and the 110v power source.
The "choppy" edges of the sinewave (or modified sine) create little needle-like spikes in the signal. The spikes are also created when motors turn on and off, back-feeding spikes to other devices connected to the same common power connections.

Low voltage digital circuits tend to be very sensitive to these spikes.

I would also make sure that any surge protector you purchase is rated for 360 joules or more. If that information isn't printed on the box, don't buy that surge protector.


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## melody (Oct 7, 2009)

Xena said:
			
		

> 800 bucks?  Where you shoppin?
> I have a portable Coleman Proforce
> 3750 that powers my stove, computer,
> and more.   Paid 313.00 shipped on sale
> ...



THanks for this. I was gonna ask the same thing so this would help.
It's still a lot of money for me though. Can't afford for sure but i'll save up.




Regards,
Melody
Placement financier


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