# Stacking with no end posts      aka= show me your stack!



## mywaynow (Jan 6, 2011)

So I am beginning to stack the wood I have been working on over the last week or so.  I decided that I would forego the snow fence end post and try to stack the ends in the opposing direction method that I see in alot of pics here.  The question is, do you need to tie in the end stack to the main pile in order to get the structural support to thwart the stack's sideways pressure?  I just can't see how free floating these end stacks will stop the pile from settling and pushing them away.  My thought is to add some opposing direction logs into the regularly stacked area to tie them together.


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## EatenByLimestone (Jan 6, 2011)

No, not if you have the end stacks balanced well enough... and they aren't too tall.   I have trouble getting the end stacks balanced well enough.  I'd stack it with posts held straight up by a rope through the stack on the bottom and one through the stack near the top.  The weight of the wood on the rope will keep the posts from moving.  

Matt


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## shawneyboy (Jan 6, 2011)

freefloat works fine.  The sideways presure is nominal if you stack it properly.  Some people run a twine through thier stacks but I have never done that.


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## SnapCracklePop (Jan 6, 2011)

If you go only 4 feet high, you shouldn't have any problem. No need for additional sideways splits. But if it makes you feel better... It's your woodpile.
)


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## tfdchief (Jan 6, 2011)

The trick is to make sure your end stacks are as stable as possible...no wobble as you go up.  I even try to stack the end stacks with a slight inward vertical line instead of perfectly vertical.  It doesn't look quite as good but I have found it remains much more stable.  Lastly, as you stack splits next to the end stacks be careful to not jam splits up against them....rather they should be just kind of sitting there not putting any pressure on the end stacks.  Others have great ideas too, just what I have learned after 30 years plus stacking.  Here is a picture of my stacks....and just for info, stacking 3 and 4 splits wide like I do is not the best for drying, but I have a space problem and don't have much choice....just have to leave it there a little longer.


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## mayhem (Jan 6, 2011)

Make your ends two split lengths thick, not just one and you'll be fine.


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## firefighterjake (Jan 6, 2011)

As folks said . . . it's all about stability . . . I tend to use half splits and "rectangles" for use on the ends . . . stack them up . . . making sure they are level and stable with little to no rocking. As long as you don't go too high and stack the wood in the "middle" so it isn't all resting on the ends you'll do fine.


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## basswidow (Jan 6, 2011)

I also look for the square pieces and set them aside to use as cribbing on the ends.  Alternate the directions and make sure it's level going up.  No wobble is key - but nothing else is needed to tie it in to the regular stack.  

I went as high as five feet last year - but I use pallets as a base and have two rows with loose uglies in between.  So the extra foot in height was no issue at all.

Some species of wood splits into board like pieces really easily - like poplar and oak.  When my stacks are going up - I will keep an eye out for square splits and set them aside for the end crib brace.  It works well.  No posts needed.


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## Cowboy Billy (Jan 6, 2011)

I just started cross stacking my ends this year like Dennis. I do it like TFDCheif but I am stacking 6' high and was surprised it was more stable than the T posts I was using before.

Billy


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## Adios Pantalones (Jan 6, 2011)

Box stack the ends as tfdchief shows in his pics, and don't let them splay out as you go up.  Box stack 2 deep at each end if worried.  If going- say- 4' high, should not be a problem.  I have had piles go over because I went 5.5-6' high, but be reasonable and it will work.

It's a little skill to learn- save the straightest, flattest pieces for the ends and throw the uglies in the middle.


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## CJRages (Jan 6, 2011)

tfdchief said:
			
		

> The trick is to make sure your end stacks are as stable as possible...no wobble as you go up. * I even try to stack the end stacks with a slight inward vertical line instead of perfectly vertical.* *It doesn't look quite as good but I have found it remains much more stable.*  Lastly, as you stack splits next to the end stacks be careful to not jam splits up against them....rather they should be just kind of sitting there not putting any pressure on the end stacks.  Others have great ideas too, just what I have learned after 30 years plus stacking.  Here is a picture of my stacks....and just for info, stacking 3 and 4 splits wide like I do is not the best for drying, but I have a space problem and don't have much choice....just have to leave it there a little longer.



This is a good point - totally agree with you! This makes the ends of the stack to push against the middle of the pile helping to negate sideways pressure.


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## FLINT (Jan 6, 2011)

yes, as others have said - use square pieces for the cribbing at the ends.  

I intentionally split my wood in a way that makes the most square pieces,  here I'll try to draw something really quick.  

split a round in half

then on a half round - cut each end off so you are left with a square - then half the square and then half each half.  

this works especially awesome with red oak - which has to be the absolute best splitting wood on earth.


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## tfdchief (Jan 6, 2011)

FLINT said:
			
		

> yes, as others have said - use square pieces for the cribbing at the ends.
> 
> I intentionally split my wood in a way that makes the most square pieces,  here I'll try to draw something really quick.
> 
> ...


 And I thought I was the only one that did that ;-P


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## mywaynow (Jan 6, 2011)

Here is what I ended up with-  Piles are about 5 1/2 foot tall


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## basswidow (Jan 6, 2011)

Looks fine to me.  And t-posts too,  should hold up just fine.


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## tfdchief (Jan 6, 2011)

Looks great.  You won't have any trouble with those stacks.


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## FLINT (Jan 6, 2011)

oh yeah, looks good

if you were worried about those ends leaning out - i bet you could run a thin rope around the top of the metal post - to the metal post on the other end of the stack - that might keep it from leaning out more over time and spreading apart.


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## mywaynow (Jan 6, 2011)

My pics and description are not clear, based on the comments.  The stack closest is the only stack that I used the wood end post to support the ends.  The other 6 stacks have the metal post, which I don't want to use if possible.  Frozen ground and overall appearance has me trying this other method.  The only other support on the new stack is the stone I rolled up to the downhill side of the stack.  There is no stack that uses both methods of end support.  The stck is on galvanized pipe and treated lumber to elevate it.  The pitch is 1/15 at worst so I figured it may help steady the stack if sliding was an issue.


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## tfdchief (Jan 6, 2011)

mywaynow said:
			
		

> My pics and description are not clear, based on the comments.  The stack closest is the only stack that I used the wood end post to support the ends.  The other 6 stacks have the metal post, which I don't want to use if possible.  Frozen ground and overall appearance has me trying this other method.  The only other support on the new stack is the stone I rolled up to the downhill side of the stack.  There is no stack that uses both methods of end support.  The stck is on galvanized pipe and treated lumber to elevate it.  The pitch is 1/15 at worst so I figured it may help steady the stack if sliding was an issue.


I got it, your "stacked ends stack" is the new one and it looks great.  You can always re-do the others this summer and then they will all be uniform.  I see you stacked the ends up a little "inward" from vertical.  That will help keep it stable.


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## Backwoods Savage (Jan 6, 2011)

Stacked in April 2009.






Stacked in April 2010.






Stacked in April 2002.





Stacked in between shooting dinosaurs.





This one wasn't so solid so I had to lean against it to hold it up.


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## tfdchief (Jan 6, 2011)

Backwoods Savage said:
			
		

> Stacked in April 2009.
> Stacked in between shooting dinosaurs.


Dennis, I love it  :exclaim: I want some of that dinosaur era wood....got to be good stuff :cheese: I wish I had the room you have to be that far ahead.  I am pretty far ahead and my wife reminds me every summer as we sit in our back yard  :-S


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## Backwoods Savage (Jan 6, 2011)

That dinosaur wood is pretty much all gone now and we're into the fresher stuff.


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## gpcollen1 (Jan 6, 2011)

Stack from the middle out so all the force is inward.  There will only be a few pieces that want to go outward.


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## bboulier (Jan 6, 2011)

Some beautiful stacks of wood.  Learned some good tricks for the next lot I stack.


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## LLigetfa (Jan 6, 2011)

I sometimes use squared off splits for the end cribbing but most often use half rounds.  Don't use quarters!


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## tfdchief (Jan 7, 2011)

LLigetfa said:
			
		

> I sometimes use squared off splits for the end cribbing but most often use half rounds.  Don't use quarters!


 LLigetfa, Nice stacks and nice wood shed!  I wish I could cut uniform, smallish, straight stuff like that, but I have to cut wherever I can and often it is not in mature timber where trees grow straight and tall without any limbs, like the stuff I see in your pics.  So my splits are seldom that straight and uniform.  Oh well, its all BTUs I guess.  I just love neat stacks and it is tougher to get them with the kind of wood I usually have to cut.


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## burntime (Jan 7, 2011)

He gets log form so they are a little more uniform I think.  With scrounging I get some really knarley stuff sometimes.  Once in a while I get some great stuff but it helps to have straight stuff definitely!  Here is some of my messes...  Obviously the lighter colors were later and better wood for stacking...


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## SolarAndWood (Jan 7, 2011)

mywaynow said:
			
		

> The stack closest is the only stack that I used the wood end post to support the ends.



I go 10' high with your no post leaned in method and have never had the ends fail.  It is stacked on asphalt and concrete though, I wonder how much ground heave contributes to toppling.


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## mywaynow (Jan 7, 2011)

LLigetfa said:
			
		

> I sometimes use squared off splits for the end cribbing but most often use half rounds.  Don't use quarters!
> 
> 
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> > It took me about 2/3 of the end stack to figure out how nicely half rounds worked.  Trying to get splits that are the same hieght and straight is tough.  It is much easier to gauge half rounds for similar size too.


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## rdust (Jan 7, 2011)

I stack that way and hate it.  This year when I start stacking I have to figure out an easier way.  :lol:  I try to use squares or rectangles and have my best luck using those.  When I'm stacking I just toss the best looking pieces into a separate pile and use those for the ends.  As others have said if you stack from the middle out it doesn't put too much pressure on the ends.

Spring 2010


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## Backwoods Savage (Jan 7, 2011)

SolarAndWood said:
			
		

> mywaynow said:
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Ground heave can and does have a big effect on the wood stacks. One more reason why I limit the height of the stacks. I hate re-stacking. 


rdust, those are some great looking piles of wood.


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## basswidow (Jan 7, 2011)

mywaynow said:
			
		

> My pics and description are not clear, based on the comments.  The stack closest is the only stack that I used the wood end post to support the ends.  The other 6 stacks have the metal post, which I don't want to use if possible.  Frozen ground and overall appearance has me trying this other method.  The only other support on the new stack is the stone I rolled up to the downhill side of the stack.  There is no stack that uses both methods of end support.  The stck is on galvanized pipe and treated lumber to elevate it.  The pitch is 1/15 at worst so I figured it may help steady the stack if sliding was an issue.



OH - I see now.  Well the one with the stone looks nicely cribbed and stable to me.  

You said downhill side of the stack and pitch 1/15,  maybe this is an issue.  All of my stacks are on level ground.  If the ground is not level, maybe this could cause the stack to pressure the downhill side and it may need a brace rather then a cribbed end?

I wouldn't get concerned about appearance using posts.....  looks fine and works. 

My stacks are on level ground, on pallets - 2 rows of 16 inch splits with uglies and shorts inbetween.  Ends are cribbed and I stack it high.  Never had one fall and it seasons just fine this way.  My side yard gets full sun and lots of wind on the hill.


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## mywaynow (Jan 8, 2011)

I am in NJ too.  Can you get a truck right up to your stacks?  If so, what is your address??    :-/


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## ecocavalier02 (Jan 8, 2011)

basswidow said:
			
		

> mywaynow said:
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 my ground is definately not level. i stack goin up hill all the time. havent had a problem yet. hard to see in this pic but it goes up about the middle of the stack


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## Cowboy Billy (Jan 8, 2011)

Here's mine
















Billy


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## Got Wood (Jan 8, 2011)

This morning we had some fresh snow, real peaceful looking so I grabbed the camara and took a couple shots of my Stacks to show a few different things...

The first gives a view of the cross stacked ends with no bracing. Stacked on pallets (40" wide, 4' long) I do 2 rows and fill the middle with shorties and uglies. If I have a long row, at times I will cross stack in the middle...usually because thats about the cut off point for the wood I'm stacking at the time.

The second photo shows a Holz Hausen .... a different approach to stacking

The third picture is a work in progress but here I am using an old pallet braced on the end of the rows. I through together a couple of these last year with the idea that it would provide a real stable end to the stacks (mostly cause I was bored and wanted to build something). They do help but with a good cross stack really are not needed.

The last picture shows a few things... another stack with a pallet braced end... stack covered with metal which came from an above the ground pool that a friend and I took down - works real nice to cover my pallet wide stacks .... and it also shows my saw buck that I banged together with scrap lumber a couple years ago.


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## LLigetfa (Jan 8, 2011)

Got Wood said:
			
		

> The third picture is a work in progress...


I tend not to build the ends first as filling in between them could put pressure against them.  If you stack as much of the middle first so that it stands on its own, the cribbed ends don't see as much force.

I tend to set aside crib candidates when I'm stacking the middle as I never have enough select crib pieces at the start to do them first.


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## Got Wood (Jan 8, 2011)

LLigetfa said:
			
		

> Got Wood said:
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I agree, usually I do as you do. In this case, the left side is being used now and the right side is new splits that will sit there for a few years before meeting the fire. With the pallet bracing I'm not concerned about the stack tipping over.


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## PapaDave (Jan 9, 2011)

I stick posts in the ground, oak, popple, pine, whatever, then stack between. They last several years.
No need for the cross stacking at the ends. Works for me. YMMV


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## SolarAndWood (Jan 9, 2011)

PapaDave said:
			
		

> I stick posts in the ground



I want to see the picture of you on a 10 ft step ladder driving those posts in with a big ole sledge


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## LLigetfa (Jan 9, 2011)

SolarAndWood said:
			
		

> PapaDave said:
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My farmer neighbor has an 3PT attachment that drives fenceposts but in the case of PD, there are clues that he used an auger.


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## PapaDave (Jan 9, 2011)

SolarAndWood said:
			
		

> PapaDave said:
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That'd be a hoot! It's much easier to use a post hole digger (manual labor kind) though, so that's what i did.
I can have a hole dug in less than 5 minutes.


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## Intheswamp (Jan 9, 2011)

Ok, here's my first 4'+ stack.  A touch bit over half a cord there.  I haven't had any formal training on stacking (such as that received from The University of Experience).  What I did was build a short crib at the ends and then pile wood in the middle...when the pile started nearing the height of the short crib I'd add a couple more layers to the crib and then continue piling in the middle.  As the crib got higher I gradually "leaned" it into the stack.  Anyhow, it hasn't fallen...but it hasn't been 24 hours yet, either!  :lol: 

http://i111.photobucket.com/albums/n153/intheswamp00/FW010611CTurner_20110108_7647Medium.jpg


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## tfdchief (Jan 10, 2011)

PapaDave said:
			
		

> I stick posts in the ground, oak, popple, pine, whatever, then stack between. They last several years.
> No need for the cross stacking at the ends. Works for me. YMMV


That is a pretty good idea.  It doesn't look out of place either, like steel fence posts.  I look at and admire my stacks all year and hate dismantling them to burn, so I like them to look good too and the log/post ends I think I could get used to.  Sure would be easier than stacking ends.  Thanks PapaDave.


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## ColdNH (Jan 10, 2011)

Here are my stacks, its all free standing, nothing fancy, i find it takes way longer to stack this way though. Havent had any fall over yet, only stacked 4 feet high.


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## Adios Pantalones (Jan 10, 2011)

I'm having wood envy.  Take that as you will.

I pushed it with this one and it eventually fell over, but a fun pic


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## jcjohnston (Jan 12, 2011)

man oh man just when I think I have my shi- together then I look at these pics and realize I dont have enough stacked or cut and sure aint as pretty LOL


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## Stump_Branch (Jan 12, 2011)

I am mostly embarrased to show my stacks in comparison to these.


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## Spikem (Jan 14, 2011)

mayhem said:
			
		

> Make your ends two split lengths thick, not just one and you'll be fine.



Excellent tip.


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## PapaDave (Jan 14, 2011)

jcjohnston said:
			
		

> man oh man just when I think I have my shi- together then I look at these pics and realize I dont have enough stacked or cut and sure aint as pretty LOL



Depends on your needs. How much do you burn?
Doesn't have to pretty, as long as you get it c/s/s. I prefer function over form, especially for expendables. Mine are only somewhat straight because I HATE redoing things, and don't want them falling over.
Couple years ago, my stacks were 6' tall, but I've since reduced that to 5' (because they were leaning precariously to the south), and added another section lengthwise to make up for it.


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## Intheswamp (Feb 21, 2011)

I added to my initial 1/2 cord stack.  I'm shooting for being able to burn this water oak in 11/12 thus the wide spacing (and also to be able to get my lawn mower between the stacks).  The shadows cast on the side of the stacks were at 4pm this after noon (Feb 20th) so the stacks should be getting plenty of sunshine on the end grain along with good ventilation.  Early autumn / late summer I may cover the tops with some old sheets of tin.

The stacks are 12' long x 4' tall (except for the far right one that is 4'+).  The wood is mostly 16" and medium to small size...think I'll make it for 11/12?

Ed


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## Trundle (Feb 21, 2011)

Wow. I'm at a loss for words. You guys don't screw around.


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## kettensÃ¤ge (Feb 21, 2011)

All very nice, lots of good advice. I also keep the round side up, whether in the middle of the pile or on the end.


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## bogydave (Feb 22, 2011)

I use small ropes, sticks, straps etc. when going tall (for both  directions) for safety
piles move as it dries or the ground moves.
pics on this post
https://www.hearth.com/econtent/index.php/forums/viewthread/57345/


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## fyrwoodguy (Feb 22, 2011)

i use 4"x4" square tubing and pressure treated wood. 1" cement pavers and rubber kick panels.


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## bogydave (Feb 22, 2011)

fyrwoodguy said:
			
		

> i use 4"x4" square tubing and pressure treated wood. 1" cement pavers and rubber kick panels.



Another good idea & easy to make your own.
New & Good ideas on this site all the time 

Good one Fyrwood


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