# Stack bursting into flames?? myth?



## NSDave (Sep 18, 2012)

So ; in getting to know our new neighbors over the last year, I've heard 2 versions of a fire in our ( the old owners ) wood stack.

Long story short, neighbor looks out and sees the stack on fire; calls fire dept; they put it out.

He ( neighbor 1 ) and I ( House was a private sale so I know the PO ) both agree that this was probably a case of a flicked cigar butt that wasn't quite out.

Chatting with the neighbor behind; he says the fire dept said wood stacks do that from time to time. EDIT: meaning, they build up heat and just light up!.

I am skeptical; With all the wood stacked on hearth.com ; is this even possible? happened to you?


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## jeepmedic (Sep 18, 2012)

I have heard of big 800+ lb round hay bales spontaneously combusting....only because the inside is damp and they start to mold from the inside out. They then heat up from the inside, then the sun hits them from the outside and FLAMES....especially if they are covered up and cannot breath.

Never heard of wood doing it.


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## Wood Duck (Sep 18, 2012)

I have never heard of it.


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## fossil (Sep 18, 2012)

Never heard of it so far as stacked wood is concerned.  No mention of it in this article:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spontaneous_combustion


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## My Oslo heats my home (Sep 18, 2012)

I've never heard of that either. It would take something to get a stack going...


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## basod (Sep 18, 2012)

Hay bales will burn a barn down if stacked before drying - ever wonder why they leave them in the field for a few weeks, its not cause farmers are lazy.  I've seen this happen first hand

I've seen woodchip piles at biofuel powerplants ignite, they constantly have to move the piles around to release the heat.


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## JP11 (Sep 18, 2012)

It's the breaking down that causes the heat.  Like a compost pile.  Wood alone wouldn't do it.  You'd need a lot of dirt or manure in there.  Hay does it when wet.  Kinda like oily rags.. You need to confine them, and limit the oxygen to get the heat to build.  Loose hay in the field.. wont' do it.  Bail it up green.. and the inside can heat up and catch fire.

JP


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## JP11 (Sep 18, 2012)

It's the breaking down that causes the heat.  Like a compost pile.  Wood alone wouldn't do it.  You'd need a lot of dirt or manure in there.  Hay does it when wet.  Kinda like oily rags.. You need to confine them, and limit the oxygen to get the heat to build.  Loose hay in the field.. wont' do it.  Bail it up green.. and the inside can heat up and catch fire.

JP


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## Woody Stover (Sep 18, 2012)

jeepmedic said:


> I have heard of big 800+ lb round hay bales spontaneously combusting....only because the inside is damp and they start to mold from the inside out. They then heat up from the inside, then the sun hits them from the outside and FLAMES....especially if they are covered up and cannot breath.
> 
> Never heard of wood doing it.


I used to help my buddy pick up his square bales, and we felt a few getting warm in the barn from time to time. Wood? I don't think so. Maybe it was _really_ punky...


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## Jack Straw (Sep 18, 2012)

This does actually happen, wood piles are very dangerous. I like to live on the edge, soooo I am willing to remove these dangerous wood piles in the upstate NY area. Just PM me


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## red oak (Sep 18, 2012)

Stick your hand inside a bail of wet hay or grass sometime - the heat can burn you. I have never felt that kind of heat in my woodpile - until of course I throw it in the stove.


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## onion (Sep 18, 2012)

Autoignition temp for wood is north of 400 degrees F.  Not gonna happen on a straight up pile of wood.  Add enough nitrogen and you have a compost pile but still....that's a damn hot compost pile.


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## Blue Vomit (Sep 18, 2012)

In my expert opinion, I don't think it could happen. But then again, I didn't think I could light my own "gas" on fire until I tried it at age 14. So who knows... Maybe?


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## Nixon (Sep 18, 2012)

Jack Straw said:


> This does actually happen, wood piles are very dangerous. I like to live on the edge, soooo I am willing to remove these dangerous wood piles in the upstate NY area. Just PM me


I'm with Jack on this , I'll offer the same service in the Butler county , Pa. Area .  All wood will be disposed of in a safe and controlled manner .


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## peakbagger (Sep 19, 2012)

I used to work in a pulp mill. For many years the wood yard consisted of large pile of wood. Prior to mud season they would have a minimum of 30 days of wood stored up (for a place that consumed 1650 tons per day of wood). The piles of wood themselves usually didnt get hot but the thick layer of bark underneath it did and had to be managed so that it didnt spontaneously combust. For a typical home woodburner, I expect they dont pile up their wood on a couple of feet of bark so spontaneous combustion is probably not an issue.


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## firefighterjake (Sep 19, 2012)

Never going to happen with a wood pile.

I've seen hay bales catch on fire from spontaneous combustion -- often from the farmer bailing the hay while slightly wet and allowing the microbes to go to work. Pretty cool to pull into a field and see multiple hay bales on fire and then watch other bales start smoking while you are there . . . not so cool having to tear apart those large bales to put out the fire.

I've also seen oily or stained rags spontaneously combust and do some damage to a garage.

I heard about (but conveniently managed to miss) the human poop at the nearby human poop compost facility catch on fire from spontaneous combustion.

And I've read about mulch spontaneously combusting . . . although sometimes it turns out it is just a cigarette butt that someone flicked on to or into the mulch.


With a wood pile you don't have that low an ignition temp like you would with hay, oily rags, etc. . . . not to mention the size of the fuel/surface area of the fuel source (think size of a split of wood vs. hay, rag or mulch -- it is much easier for example to light a fire with small kindling and scraps of wood vs. applying a flame to a large split of wood).

Also, no matter how tightly you might pack wood into a wood pile it is still going to get good ventilation compared to a bale of hay . . . and heat is not trapped.

Either the firefighters were very dumb or poorly educated as to the basics of fire cause and origin.


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## BrotherBart (Sep 19, 2012)

Guy must have stacked the wood on hay bales.


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## clemsonfor (Sep 19, 2012)

I dont think even a pile of wood, would combust spontaneously. There is to much air flow still even in tightly stacked stackes.

Wood chips will do it for sure, as will bark and mulch, have even heard of slash piles after loging where they pile all the tops and buts and push dirt and bark into them spontaneously combusting.  I saw a truck at the local saw mill with the tarp back after it had be set out to be hauled as boiler fuel. It was residual chips bark and stuff. The FD had got there and some was shoveled out all over and you could tell they sprayed it down good.


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## NSDave (Sep 19, 2012)

firefighterjake said:


> Never going to happen with a wood pile.
> 
> I've seen hay bales catch on fire from spontaneous combustion -- often from the farmer bailing the hay while slightly wet and allowing the microbes to go to work. Pretty cool to pull into a field and see multiple hay bales on fire and then watch other bales start smoking while you are there . . . not so cool having to tear apart those large bales to put out the fire.
> 
> ...


 

This is what I figure.  my money is on the neighbor taking the fire fighters too seriously !


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## Backwoods Savage (Sep 19, 2012)

Okay, many posts about hay bales. When I was a young lad, I remember going to 2 barn fires. Both were caused from the hay being mowed away when it was too wet. I also remember one time checking on some of our hay and finding it too hot on the inside. Yes, almost burned my hands. Here is what we and neighbors used to do (these are the older rectangle bales):

If baling when not completely cured, we would stack the hay, rather than flat, up on the sides. This did help just a bit but it still needed watching. A few times we had to bale when too wet so we simply left the hay on the wagons for several days. Usually we had to end up spreading out the bales so they could dry enough to be mowed away.

It is not a funny thing at all to see a neighbor's barn burning down and the very worst thing about it is the animals. They instinctively look at the barn as their "safe" area so when danger comes, they want to be in the barn. So one of the first things to do is close the barn doors. If the cows or horses are already in the barn it is extremely difficult to get them out and over the years many animals were lost this way. Very sad indeed.

As for the wood, a lot of folks have problems getting their wood to burn decently in the stove! No worries in the stack.


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## firefighterjake (Sep 20, 2012)

Backwoods Savage said:


> Okay, many posts about hay bales. When I was a young lad, I remember going to 2 barn fires. Both were caused from the hay being mowed away when it was too wet. I also remember one time checking on some of our hay and finding it too hot on the inside. Yes, almost burned my hands. Here is what we and neighbors used to do (these are the older rectangle bales):
> 
> If baling when not completely cured, we would stack the hay, rather than flat, up on the sides. This did help just a bit but it still needed watching. A few times we had to bale when too wet so we simply left the hay on the wagons for several days. Usually we had to end up spreading out the bales so they could dry enough to be mowed away.
> 
> ...


 
I think the most scared I ever have been in a fire was when I was ordered to go inside a burning barn to try to move a bunch of cows out . . . big, scared animals milling around with thick smoke and flaming pieces of wood and coal dropping down from above.


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## cptoneleg (Sep 20, 2012)

That would be some dry wood


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## trailmaker (Sep 22, 2012)

peakbagger said:


> I used to work in a pulp mill. For many years the wood yard consisted of large pile of wood. Prior to mud season they would have a minimum of 30 days of wood stored up (for a place that consumed 1650 tons per day of wood). The piles of wood themselves usually didnt get hot but the thick layer of bark underneath it did and had to be managed so that it didnt spontaneously combust. For a typical home woodburner, I expect they dont pile up their wood on a couple of feet of bark so spontaneous combustion is probably not an issue.


 
  I've actually got a Holz Miete stacked on bark,  just a few inches though,  not a couple feet.  I'll have quite a bonfire if this Holz ignites.


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