# Heiss Masonary Wood Heater/Boiler



## gregoryMI (Jun 12, 2014)

First I live way out in middle of nowhere I have a 5300sqft home that's hell to heat. I been looking around and seen a lot of heaters for this house I have a boiler in my basement that's gas it costs about 800$ a mth to run. so i did my inspections and found everyone complaining about what they bought from different company's....I have never had a wood boiler and have no clue about them. so what i tell you here is from my experience with Heiss heater boiler..

Day one, Met with owner at my house, communication was easy showed up on time and very polite and accommodating to my needs with my financial ability. Quick and to the point about all my issues and concerns and rebuttals to complaints online with proof to its fixes on their stoves. He told me the minimum size to heat my house and what he would have put in to be the best for it. I still went with the minimum size boiler to heat as I am not rich. I was sold on the Model 3000 for my home and told a delivery date and install date.  The Stove arrived in excellent clean non cracked, they set it in place and told me what needed done by date to install. I am one day from install on this boiler. YES they require antifreeze and well why wouldn't you water freezes.  You Have to use theirs and only theirs for some reason. I am concerned about the Hard water issue I have seen in other posts about pump problems and will see what they say to do about it... the door Is adequate for the fire box I believe. the fire box is massive I mean huge.... I fit inside crouched... well I haven't any complaints thus far and they have been very on point with my calls and reply's in texts or Calling..

stay tuned.


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## maple1 (Jun 12, 2014)

You are very brave - I have no experience with them but with what I have read, I think that would be my last recommendation. Just how much did you research them first?

I will be tuned in.

And good luck - I hope you won't need it, but...


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## stee6043 (Jun 12, 2014)

Way out in the middle of nowhere?  I think the folks from the UP would laugh if they heard a downstater living 40 miles from Ann Arbor say they lived in the sticks!  Welcome to the board by the way.  Great place to be.

I agree with Maple, you've made a brave decision. 

What you've essentially done is gone to the "Amazon.com" of boiler reviews and information (hearth.com), searched for boilers and picked the one with the one star rating and a handful of negative reviews.  I'm not saying you're going to have a bad experience.  But based on the amount of information available to someone internet savy (as you are) your decision is somewhat puzzling.

If this post isn't spam I'll be surprised.  But, I've been surprised before...today even.  Good luck with your boiler either way.


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## arbutus (Jun 12, 2014)

Stee has it right.  I grew up in that area.  Gregory isn't that far out.


Good luck with the Heiss heater.  Post a picture when it's installed, and keep us updated this winter.


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## heaterman (Jun 12, 2014)

Gregory? We installed a Garn down that way a couple years ago.


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## hobbyheater (Jun 12, 2014)

gregoryMI said:


> First I live way out in middle of nowhere
> stay tuned.




What did you pay for the  boiler?


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## gregoryMI (Jun 13, 2014)

hobbyheater said:


> What did you pay for the  boiler?


Just under 6k. Im legit im not a spam ham.. I realy bought one.. Your making me nervious.. Yea they got one star yea a handfull of complaints but met a few shops and owners they likem so I said for the money I cant beat it im disabled vet USAF SFS. so I budget everything. I will post pics. 
I know from alot of forums folks just live on and dont realy care if its not causing issues they dont complain. But yeah if stuff sucks well thats all u see. Not the good.. I will be very ontop all aspects of the whole opperarion. Good and bad..


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## rkusek (Jun 13, 2014)

Thanks for your service!  Looking forward to reading about your new install and hope it fits your needs.


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## stee6043 (Jun 15, 2014)

Good or bad, we'll be happy to help you through your install and operation.  And as stated above, thank you for your service.  We all owe you one.


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## gregoryMI (Sep 10, 2014)

well the heater has been delivered installed and hooked up...the company has also been replying to every text and call I've made very quickly. They have gone out of their way to find me parts I need for my back up gas boiler. the company is overworked and needs more employees..the heater fired up on its break in fire very well it heated the water with only a small campfire kind of fire in the fireplace up to operational temperature oddly the in side kept warm water and hot in side stove for six days after I last stoked it..three split 12-15 inch leanth logs 10in in diamiter thats using only one sixth of the firebox.but yes its middle of summer as well. as far as wood consumption for this unit 3000 series I do not know yet. it looks well in the yard and have had many compliments...the company is yet to come out and add the entries required by warranty as I have not made a date yet. so far with what I have seenI would give them a 5 star rating for company service. as for this winter will tell on the actual working of the wood stove outside.I haven't had any bad incidences with them for the stove yet still a thumbs up needless to say I'm excited for winter. Stay tuned for more with pictures!


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## BoiledOver (Sep 10, 2014)

Welcome to the hearth boiler room.

My 2 cents on this subject:

I ran a similar home built unit for most of one season, not nearly as advanced as the Heiss unit appears. It worked very well and the flywheel effect is amazing. I believe the theory behind these stoves is sound. The biggest worry while operating this stove was pump failure. Ya gotta know how hot things can get without the circulating water to draw off the heat.

Fortunately in the respect of stove tending, I was here to keep an eye on it. Without anti-freeze. Translation = Slavery. There was never a thought to leave it running while away. Flash to steam is a term that had me sick with worry. Remember that this unit was a modified homebuilt wood stove with secondary combustion chamber and most important, natural draft. Meaning it could runaway, and did, after warping the firebox door frame. Very hot! Does the Heiss have safeguards in place? Pressure relief, intake damper closeoff....

I do not know the folks behind your heater but have seen reviews just as you and others. Maybe there were design flaws early and maybe there was operator error too. Anyway the reviews are what they are, don't worry too much about that. I was considering a purchase myself when shopping and chose the small EKO due mostly to price at the time. Today I would give them consideration if shopping for a heater, even after reading the reviews. If water thermal storage is impossible, then this unit should do a better job than a gasser without storage. Just my opinion there.

For anyone running a wood fired water heater, it is a very good idea to keep spare components on the shelf for a quick switch. In the case of the Heiss design, spare pump should be at the top of the list.

Good luck with the heater, and keep us posted one way or the other. If I get back that way maybe you would allow a look at the unit. We could head over to the damn site and kill some time too.


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## gregoryMI (Sep 10, 2014)

BoiledOver said:


> Welcome to the hearth boiler room.
> 
> My 2 cents on this subject:
> 
> ...





Yea sounds good to me stop on over.. Its a closed system as well. It has a pressure release valve on the in house gas boiler of thirty lbs. I know most boilers are open systems with a water tank it makes me a little bit weary of pressure and overheat..as the heater is away from the house in a faith explosion area the worst I need to deal with is a plastic pipe in the basement popping and flooding the basement that's why we have home insurance. extra pump is a good idea I will look into it.. on the system itself outside I do not see any pressure release or valve...so.. I dono what it will do if it gets hot? Lots of  what ifs.


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## Ken C (Oct 31, 2014)

gregoryMI said:


> First I live way out in middle of nowhere I have a 5300sqft home that's hell to heat. I been looking around and seen a lot of heaters for this house I have a boiler in my basement that's gas it costs about 800$ a mth to run. so i did my inspections and found everyone complaining about what they bought from different company's....I have never had a wood boiler and have no clue about them. so what i tell you here is from my experience with Heiss heater boiler..
> 
> Day one, Met with owner at my house, communication was easy showed up on time and very polite and accommodating to my needs with my financial ability. Quick and to the point about all my issues and concerns and rebuttals to complaints online with proof to its fixes on their stoves. He told me the minimum size to heat my house and what he would have put in to be the best for it. I still went with the minimum size boiler to heat as I am not rich. I was sold on the Model 3000 for my home and told a delivery date and install date.  The Stove arrived in excellent clean non cracked, they set it in place and told me what needed done by date to install. I am one day from install on this boiler. YES they require antifreeze and well why wouldn't you water freezes.  You Have to use theirs and only theirs for some reason. I am concerned about the Hard water issue I have seen in other posts about pump problems and will see what they say to do about it... the door Is adequate for the fire box I believe. the fire box is massive I mean huge.... I fit inside crouched... well I haven't any complaints thus far and they have been very on point with my calls and reply's in texts or Calling..
> 
> stay tuned.


I purchased my boiler this past summer after much research and a trip to Grand Rapids to see the “nuts and bolts” of the business and the units.  Customer service is excellent with everyone in the company devoted to quality and customer satisfaction.  This boiler is definitely the next generation of outdoor heating units.  The non-rust, lower cost of the unit and smaller size far exceed any other unit on the market.  The boiler has been providing heat and hot water to my entire house since early September and I have already seen a 15% drop in my power bill, while maintaining a 72-74 degree temperature in my home. I would recommend this product to anyone looking for a dependable, efficient wood boiler for home or business.


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## gregoryMI (Oct 31, 2014)

Im not saying its bad. But there's a few oddities I've seen. The system works well for my home. I haven't had to may issues, only that air in the old boiler lines not moving and needing a bigger pump. Some tweeking will happen after the warranty is off in two years. I think a combination of natural aspiration and blower should be used.. It doesnt always need a leaf blower on the fire to gain a few degrees.. Eats the wood quick. Its easy to clean and such.. The blower kicks on and starts back draft on wet wood dry wood big wood or small.. Its heat in the box is to much for the little hole the air blows thru.. I've opened the rubber flap manually on side of blower cage and it gains heat well with out force.. Or cho chooo chooo affect.. It does back draft through the squirl cage blower. Gumming it up with creosote... In time will need replacing... I do need to get extra parts on shelf.. As far as safety yes on my boiler in home the gas unit has a 30psi pressure valve and a air bleeder...  The only thing I see on the boiler any were is a air bleeder on top of stove.. Becides that nothing.. More pics soon to come..how ever that being said these issues are mine and not due to the boiler 3000series it does work dam well to heat this big house..


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## gregoryMI (Oct 31, 2014)




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## atvalaska (Oct 31, 2014)

them lines are missing something...........


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## gregoryMI (Oct 31, 2014)

atvalaska said:


> them lines are missing something...........


Yes believe u me I know.. I put patio bricks and filled with dirt...


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## tom in maine (Nov 1, 2014)

Good place to plant for early Tulips.


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## BoiledOver (Nov 1, 2014)

atvalaska said:


> them lines are missing something...........


Yeah, what the heck are they doing right there where your feet want to be? And the big box too.

Glad to hear that the stove is heating your home and you are working through your learning curve. Hey that is one good looking puppy.


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## Mike Fromme (Nov 1, 2014)

Very nice!  The heiss, free heat machine and vigas boilers were all at the top of my list when I was researching boilers.


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## Floydian (Nov 2, 2014)

Oh man, don't ever let a thermal imaging camera take a peak at that setup.

IMO any company that sells an outdoor unit should be required to provide the standby heat loss of the unit. Eye opening to say the least. And the Heiss may just the grand "winner" unless they are using some newfangled castable refractory that defies the laws of physics.... 

Noah


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## stee6043 (Nov 2, 2014)

Floydian said:


> Oh man, don't ever let a thermal imaging camera take a peak at that setup.
> 
> IMO any company that sells an outdoor unit should be required to provide the standby heat loss of the unit. Eye opening to say the least. And the Heiss may just the grand "winner" unless they are using some newfangled castable refractory that defies the laws of physics....
> 
> Noah



I try to keep holding my tongue every time a Heiss thread comes up.  But I must say that a standby heat loss estimate from some of the bigger Central Boiler rigs would probably make this Heiss look like downright sensible just based on the shear size of some of the CB's.  To each their own I guess.  More unusual to me over the years has been the number of first time posters that drop by to sing the praises of the Heiss setup.


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## gregoryMI (Nov 3, 2014)

Easy
	

		
			
		

		
	




	

		
			
		

		
	
 fellas. This stove is by no means perfect yes the black box is a pain in the but its constantly catching chips and in the way.. The inside is hot as hell. Ive read up on it yea lots complain about cement cracking.. I burned for three months now and no cracking has occurred.even if it does nones complained well the crack is leaking water.. Or any such issue. The out side of this thing is a cool light warm its only draw is this dam blower.. Its started making noise this morning from the chugging backdraft ..I've done as the comp said and put bigger wet logs in and she still chugs. I think its two much air force. A slower fan maby needs here.


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## BoiledOver (Nov 3, 2014)

With most wood burners the owners are making tweaks and mods where the manufacturers could have gone further but didn't. Combustion air control is a rather important aspect in getting efficiency to its sweet spot. It looks like you could wire in a fan controller pretty easy, just want to get one with a sufficient amp rating for the blower. My thinker is wondering why the blower is laying at ground level. Mice like warm places and also enjoy a good meal of wire insulation, thinking the whole blower and piping thing could be better located.

Yeah that blower could be relocated easy enough if you are so inclined, and that would give room to insulate and cover the piping. Keep us posted.


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## stee6043 (Nov 3, 2014)

gregoryMI said:


> ..I've done as the comp said and put bigger wet logs in and she still chugs. I think its two much air force. A slower fan maby needs here.


 
The company told you to put bigger "wet" logs on the fire to help with the fan problem?  Oiy...

I hope you'll stop in throughout the winter and post updates.  I'd also be interested to know how warm the outside of your boiler is during a peak burn.  Do you have a thermometer you could tape to it for an hour or two?


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## atvalaska (Nov 3, 2014)

what keeps the drifting/blowing snow  and cold ,,,from raising hel! with the pipes and fan? ,,,


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## BoiledOver (Nov 3, 2014)

Yeah, I wonder about heat loss on all outdoor burners. That unit looks like an easy one to increase insulation on. Rigid polyiso is awesome and a few pieces of metal roofing.

Refractory can be mixed to accomplish different goals. I wonder if there is an insulating mix on the outer skin of those units. Guess I'll go back to their site and have a look around, it has been a long time since looking into those units.


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## PassionForFire&Water (Nov 3, 2014)

Do these come in other colors?


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## Mike Fromme (Nov 3, 2014)

PassionForFire&Water said:


> Do these come in other colors?


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## atvalaska (Nov 3, 2014)

yuk!!  I throw the stove in the stove


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## gregoryMI (Nov 13, 2014)

BoiledOver said:


> Yeah, I wonder about heat loss on all outdoor burners. That unit looks like an easy one to increase insulation on. Rigid polyiso is awesome and a few pieces of metal roofing.
> 
> Refractory can be mixed to accomplish different goals. I wonder if there is an insulating mix on the outer skin of those units. Guess I'll go back to their site and have a look around, it has been a long time since looking into those units.


They told me they got it down now... The mix!!


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## gregoryMI (Nov 13, 2014)

atvalaska said:


> what keeps the drifting/blowing snow  and cold ,,,from raising hel! with the pipes and fan? ,,,


With the fan and drifting snow we have yet to know.. I've bricked it up around the pipes and it has adequate hole for suction for the fan


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## gregoryMI (Nov 13, 2014)

stee6043 said:


> The company told you to put bigger "wet" logs on the fire to help with the fan problem?  Oiy...
> 
> I hope you'll stop in throughout the winter and post updates.  I'd also be interested to know how warm the outside of your boiler is during a peak burn.  Do you have a thermometer you could tape to it for an hour or two?


Yea bigger greener logs.. Lol it still choo choos and reverbs back through blower the fans starting to gum up and stick. Well I'm starting to see a few odd flaws.. That could be big.. So before I toot the horn I'll see what the company has to say about it and I'll keep ya's posted.. Happiness 10 worriedness 5 and climing


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## gregoryMI (Nov 13, 2014)

stee6043 said:


> The company told you to put bigger "wet" logs on the fire to help with the fan problem?  Oiy...
> 
> I hope you'll stop in throughout the winter and post updates.  I'd also be interested to know how warm the outside of your boiler is during a peak burn.  Do you have a thermometer you could tape to it for an hour or two?


The out side of the boiler is Luke warm not hot anywhere. Doors hot as hell but the shell they put over the cast cement is just Luke warm..


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## BoiledOver (Nov 13, 2014)

gregoryMI said:


> Yea bigger greener logs.. Lol it still choo choos and reverbs back through blower the fans starting to gum up and stick. Well I'm starting to see a few odd flaws.. That could be big.. So before I toot the horn I'll see what the company has to say about it and I'll keep ya's posted.. Happiness 10 worriedness 5 and climing


This EKO 25 will blow back and slam the intake damper too. It happens when the blower is set too slow, gas build up in the primary chamber and then combustion....boom and the damper slams shut.

So far you are heating only with the Hiess? Thinking about the blower getting gummed up and wonder if the blower was moved around either corner to a side wall would eliminated that. Backdraft flapper at original hole and 2 foot of ducting to the blower might fix that issue. Just a thought.


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## gregoryMI (Nov 13, 2014)

BoiledOver said:


> This EKO 25 will blow back and slam the intake damper too. It happens when the blower is set too slow, gas build up in the primary chamber and then combustion....boom and the damper slams shut.
> 
> So far you are heating only with the Hiess? Thinking about the blower getting gummed up and wonder if the blower was moved around either corner to a side wall would eliminated that. Backdraft flapper at original hole and 2 foot of ducting to the blower might fix that issue. Just a thought.


yes hiess only. So needs more air pushed in .  hmm I can't do anything to this boiler or it will void the three year parts warranty.. Were would I get duckting to go that wouldn't be a pain in the ass..lol thanks for the lesson on internals its a help for sure..I'll do the thermostat thing in a while havent got one..


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## BoiledOver (Nov 13, 2014)

gregoryMI said:


> Where would I get duckting to go that wouldn't be a pain in the ass..lol .



The warranty is pretty important to consider at the price these things go for.

Hmm, maybe 4" stainless exhaust parts. Or maybe turbo diesel trucks have intercoolers with piping to and from. Aluminum downspouts. What is that ducting that jeeps use for their air intakes up by the windshield? Could be anything.


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## BoiledOver (Dec 7, 2014)

How are you and your boiler getting along?


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## buddha (Dec 7, 2014)

GregoryMI,  What have your burn times been with this unit?  Have you had any trouble dialilng it in?

I am on my fourth year heating with Heiss Heaters.  If you have a clip-on snap-disk aquastat, I highly recommend upgrading to a Honeywell aquastat  (<$100) with a well. This should not void the warranty but you could always run it by them to be sure.  They have been pretty accommodating for me in the past.

If this is your primary heating source I would also purchase a backup grundfos pump and a blower.  The nice thing is that these parts are easy to replace yourself and if have them on hand you can be running again in minutes if the part fails.  

BoiledOver, They do have polyiso insulation covering all refractory/cement/whatever-it-is, except on the bottom of the unit.  They apply a layer of stucco to the outside to cover the insulation.  Prior to placing my unit I placed 2" XPS and 1" polyiso under it to limit heat loss.  It does a pretty good job as I will have snow accumulate on top if the wind isnt blowing too hard.

To those who read bad reviews in the past, I recommend looking at them again.  They have come along way since I purchased my first boiler in 2010.  I have since replaced my old boiler with the 2013 version and it has been great.  The door design is much improved, the door opening is much bigger than my old one, insulation is improved and the cement has yet to crack.


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## gregoryMI (Dec 10, 2014)

BoiledOver said:


> How are you and your boiler getting along?


Well I'm back in business the pex line we layed had an issue cracked or hole new received and put in ground with in a week.. Of calling for warranty issue. The blower still puffs if not loaded quite right..outsides cracking the houseing shell. NOT internals just the housing and still works just fine... They are switching it out with new one this spring when they build one..no arguments either.. So far all is well.. The company is overworked a bit so times aren't slow at all so I can adjust for the asap clause they say on the phone..


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## gregoryMI (Dec 10, 2014)

buddha said:


> GregoryMI,  What have your burn times been with this unit?  Have you had any trouble dialilng it in?
> 
> I am on my fourth year heating with Heiss Heaters.  If you have a clip-on snap-disk aquastat, I highly recommend upgrading to a Honeywell aquastat  (<$100) with a well. This should not void the warranty but you could always run it by them to be sure.  They have been pretty accommodating for me in the past.
> 
> ...


I have my load times set at 6:30am/11pm-12/and again before midnight 12am..

3times in 48 hrs. Found to be a five hr burn with ash and pine haven't gotten to my good wood yet waiting forbthe snow for that..

However overloading the stove doesn't help it just coals it all up and u got a tone of coals that block the blow hole.. So I fill to about 8 inches from top straight in half way mid back in boiler. Logs split 48in long..

The cracking of the shell housing is from the foam expanding and contracting I have lots of cracks but they don't smoke or hamper working order..

purchase a backup grundfos pump and a blower? If u do I don't think u get a refund when their pump or fan stops workin.. Tight budget.. Thou I have a gas back up boiler.
Also they install the digital Honeywell aqua stat....I didn't ask.. Also dono if I told everyone I have this unit directly hooked to the house radiant heat system....I don't have forced air only pipes.


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## BoiledOver (Jan 6, 2015)

Hope all is well over in Gregory, any updates?


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## gregoryMI (Jan 9, 2015)

BoiledOver said:


> Hope all is well over in Gregory, any updates?


Welp.. pex lines had a fail replaced them company was fast for response. Hooked back up with in a week. Thou they will not touch a shovel and to redig the trench was 100$ from a friend. The current wood boiler is to be replaced due to my concern of a few manufacturing issues. They noted it was one of the stoves made by a former employee.. Said it would be replaced with a new made stove in spring. All working now well however I've learned the wood boiler isn't cut for high temps needed for a home with radiant heat. Need 185-200 to keep a 70° temp in house. I belive however the boilerbcould handle it not the pex...? Any ideas. If the out side temp get a wind chill below 5 its temp needs to come up. My house prolly could use better insulation. Short of tapeing plastic on windows. 

However the colder the longer the blower runs to keep the called temp up.. I've moved up to five loadings a day from the three I was. Mixed woods..


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## maple1 (Jan 9, 2015)

Radiant heat should require lower temps, not hotter. What exactly do you have for emitters in the house?

I think I would maybe try to change what's in the house to allow you to use lower temps - that would benefit you no matter what you had tied to it for a furnace.


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## gregoryMI (Jan 9, 2015)

This 3/4 copper line with aluminum fins runs through my entire 5300ft house. 8 zones


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## maple1 (Jan 9, 2015)

Ok, that's not what is more accurately known as 'radiant'. That is ordinary hot water baseboard that works more on convection than radiant.

Man that's a huge house, and must be quite a load - would be for whatever you're heating with. There are options for getting more mileage out of your baseboard, and your hot water. You could add more finned lengths in places where there is none, or add some that is naturally more capable. Slant Fin makes one type that will get more heat out of the water - I forget the model of it, but I will be checking it out for next season to try to get more mileage out of my storage. I think it must be bigger in the fin department. You could also get some used cast iron rads, the old fashion type, and plumb those into your zones. That might be the cheapest. Those things pump out heat. Then there are panel rads, that would likely work & look the best, but would be the most expensive. IMO if you NEED 185 water to keep your house warm, I think the system was underdesigned and they didn't install enough radiation when the system was installed. I think I got lucky - seems to be the opposite here. My house doesn't seem to start to lose temp until my water gets below 140 or so, depending on the day. This last cold spell my storage was down to 130 or so sometimes before I started burning. But I'd still like even better performance.

I am actually surprised you can stay warm in a house that big with that boiler. Good luck!


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## BoiledOver (Jan 12, 2015)

gregoryMI said:


> Welp.. pex lines had a fail replaced them company was fast for response. Hooked back up with in a week. Thou they will not touch a shovel and to redig the trench was 100$ from a friend. The current wood boiler is to be replaced due to my concern of a few manufacturing issues. They noted it was one of the stoves made by a former employee.. Said it would be replaced with a new made stove in spring. All working now well however I've learned the wood boiler isn't cut for high temps needed for a home with radiant heat. Need 185-200 to keep a 70° temp in house. I belive however the boilerbcould handle it not the pex...? Any ideas. If the out side temp get a wind chill below 5 its temp needs to come up. My house prolly could use better insulation. Short of tapeing plastic on windows.
> 
> However the colder the longer the blower runs to keep the called temp up.. I've moved up to five loadings a day from the three I was. Mixed woods..


I have zero experience with pex. Being that it is made for hot water heating, one would expect it to be rated for at least 212F.

How did your previous heating system do with the current baseboards? That is a large home to heat and insulation is hard to overdo.

You do know we are all using a bit more wood in these cold times.


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## Clarkbug (Jan 13, 2015)

Was the pex failure at a fitting?  Or the pex itself failed along the tube?  It likes to move a lot with thermal expansion and contraction, so make sure you have appropriate measures in place.  

The wind makes my house impossible to keep at setpoint when its this cold.  Plastic on Windows helps a lot....


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## gregoryMI (Jan 17, 2015)

The pex itself poped I haven't inspected it to see the hole yet. But no not a fitting. The heater has a blower and creosote build up issue. The fan now sticks about every other day. I've cleaned it weekly now. The fan cover is bent from install build.. They are replacing the whole stove in spring so I'm not concerned...



As for wind yes its bad.. Under 20° I need to bump up ten deg for every 8° change.. I know at 210 I could have a 80° house but pex won't allow it.. Yes next year during summer this year I'm insulating and and caulking all frames and doors.. I have cold drafts in my house so a large part is due to bad insulation... Plastic for sure next year..

Previous heater will work fine still installed but hooked direct to pex as well.. If I ran my gas boiler I can have 220° easy due to all thick copper pipes... Yes colder more wood woof a lot of work...


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## gregoryMI (Feb 9, 2015)

Well.. Seems I may have stumbled into the flaw we all know too well.. My stove is seemingly as the company replies the ONLY ONE EVER TO DO THIS!  I know what's caused it but they don't agree.. The chugging from day one has been issue, now causing the screws they put in to the fan shroud to hold the flap and clicker on off seloniode has vibrated loose and fallen off. Further more the steel tube they have formed in the cement and lossened up and vibrated out about an inch.. Which the fan and all the gizmos attach too. So in short it has now been a hassle to keep the heater from over heating by nautaral draft and or starving due to creaso build up in fan and flap not opening.. There first "loud" explataion was that they are pissed off and think I must be doing something to cause this to happen.. ? Not gonna be beating on my 6k for the fun of it I think I like having heat more.. Were five months in and almost at a full breakdown of the system they brought me and well service is awaiting a reply on email I sent asking about this wood boiler. I asked them to replace my whole deal with come spring when and date. They already said yes not a problem last time when they were out fixing pex.. So guess I can only ask is there anyone els having issues with there stove??


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## BoiledOver (Feb 10, 2015)

Well that's a bugger. Chugging can be from, too slow fan, too small of splits, too dry of fuel and maybe a few other factors. This I state from using solely an Eko 25 for two seasons. Maybe others can comment on chugging issues. We did touch on the air intake earlier in this thread, but with a different concern.

As far as the manufacturer goes, I know it is easy to get hostile over such an investment but working as a team to address the issues will be better in the long run. If they remain cooperative that will be fantastic. Some folks, me for one, like to do our own little mods on things here and there that we "think" is an improvement. I did have a warranty claim on the brand spanking new boiler, none of my doing, and was shipped a replacement blower assembly.

Are you limping through the rest of this season with the Heiss? Or, using your other setup?


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## gregoryMI (Feb 10, 2015)

Little of both I am using my gas boiler to keep up were this one fails. as well believe in the team effort to address problems and have it fixed. I know exactly were and what mods I will do but its a warranty thing you know.. However met with an angry cussing voice when asking politely where the new blower assembly is and why I have not got it yet after 3 months of waiting for it. they are quick to jump to conclusion and very vulgar and angry at the moment... I believe I have become part of them post you read on amazon..lol I've sent them and email to try again politely to remedy this situation.. They have yet to respond..they said last time out while fixing the pex it melted they would drop off a NEW unit in person with the issues like cuts in pipes and screws missing and dents in fan and proper spacing for the fan flap to open and close without hitting the pipes come this spring when its shut down.... I asked when and a date for this new stove nothing more and extremely politely put.... I've kept my cool lets see what happens if they rebound back and show a good company...I've taken pics of the break down from day one to today and will continue.. So be for I bash them and tell all the truth and upload pics.. I'll give one more chance.. Least I can do right..


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## gregoryMI (Feb 10, 2015)

BoiledOver said:


> Well that's a bugger. Chugging can be from, too slow fan, too small of splits, too dry of fuel and maybe a few other factors. This I state from using solely an Eko 25 for two seasons. Maybe others can comment on chugging issues. We did touch on the air intake earlier in this thread, but with a different concern.
> 
> As far as the manufacturer goes, I know it is easy to get hostile over such an investment but working as a team to address the issues will be better in the long run. If they remain cooperative that will be fantastic. Some folks, me for one, like to do our own little mods on things here and there that we "think" is an improvement. I did have a warranty claim on the brand spanking new boiler, none of my doing, and was shipped a replacement blower assembly.
> 
> Are you limping through the rest of this season with the Heiss? Or, using your other setup?


As for the wood portion I've done as the company asked burned green logs like they asked bigger greener.. No change.. I have found to  keep from chugging it needed less wood.. Like a half fill with bigger logs 10" thick 22-30 in long dry ash or really any wood even gofor wood.. But fill times increased to every three hrs ... I got a sleep!.. 

90% of what I have been burning is old standing ash dry yes and split not small..I bought 800$ in difrent types of wood and all are Tue same as the ash. Green whole split or not.. Willow oak pine walnut boxelder.. No change.. Its a issue with fan speed for sure.. Placement infront is a hamper but is workable.. I don't like the pipes exposed at all.. I highly believe this unit needs a natural asparation with option of fan manually...


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## stee6043 (Feb 10, 2015)

I'd suggest you get a claim going with the BBB.  They will contact Heiss independently and can sometimes generate more urgency to solve your problems.  If they don't care about their BBB rating, they won't do anything.

You won't like this...but my suggestion to you would be to request a partial cash refund in the Spring rather than a replacement boiler.  I think you're going to be miles ahead by saving your pennies and investing in proven technology that will work before next winter.  Your choice to go with the Heiss unit was a gamble and I think your gamble is not paying off.

Any wood boiler manufacturer that continues to tell you to burn "bigger and greener" logs to solve problems is...well....scary.


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## gregoryMI (Feb 10, 2015)

I was looking to be impressed the idea was a good one and could be if some simple thoughts to make some improvments were made.. Stove has potential just needs a costomer service plan that works with its warranty.. Partial money back? Out of the 6k how much u think? I think remove the stove and full refund.. I'll go buy a better one


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## stee6043 (Feb 11, 2015)

gregoryMI said:


> I was looking to be impressed the idea was a good one and could be if some simple thoughts to make some improvments were made.. Stove has potential just needs a costomer service plan that works with its warranty.. Partial money back? Out of the 6k how much u think? I think remove the stove and full refund.. I'll go buy a better one


 
A full refund would not be reasonable.  You have received some benefit from owning this thing regardless of how much pain you've experienced.  Assuming their material/labor expense is 50% of the selling price I'd ask them for half back.  Break even for them, best outcome for you.  My two cents only.


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## gregoryMI (Feb 11, 2015)

Ehhh five months of savings for me off 6k of head ache. Hardly half.. There labor and matereral I could see 1500$ tops. I had to do all the diiging laying of pipe and pay for all the parts to hookup.. Thou I appreciate ur opinion.. Less hassle and lot less cussing I may of seen half if it plain out didn't work out..


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## BoiledOver (Apr 14, 2015)

Spring is here........oohyah!

What is your opinion of this system after an entire heating season? Does it heat the house, is it reliable, is it worth the initial investment? How about the manufacturer? Are they interested in the long term or just getting the up front money, support with issues, warranty, friendly?


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## gregoryMI (Apr 14, 2015)

well I guess it is time for the review. I found that the unit 3000 has sufficiently heated my home with a running temp of 175 and 5 deg vary. it has needed to be loaded every 4.5 hours exactly. 5300sqft but 3900 heated if you missed during the night you will wake up cold and it takes roughly 3 hours for it to warm all the water and get the house started back to temperature. I've used every type of wood at all different increments. they all burn the same dry wet time lengths. it is more less in extremely hot kilm it burns anything and everything extremely fast cuz of how hot it is inside with blower..
pluses to this machine is it will not creosote up at all the chimney or door or inside. it holds a very large amount of wood almost half face crd which you do not have to worry about cleaning out but maybe once or twice during the winter.
as for the appearance of the stove currently it is needing to be replaced. the stove is cracked all over the exterior every edge that comes together has a large crack down it and it smokes through all the cracks so air is leaking.witch they claim is from overheating the unit which I'll get to in a second.its smokes out the Nabore hood for fifteen to twenty min really bad when u start it up at end of the 4.5 hrs during peak running it doesn't smoke bad at all . prior to this the power went out for a few minutes earlier in the month. 
 with that being said the boiler shut down like it should and snuffed out the air BUT ...the company explained I had to put out the fire somehow to keep it from melting the pexs in the ground..the pEXs I believe was faulty and did not melt but it is possible that is what they blamed. they however came out rapidly within 2 weeks and replaced the pexs that melted or crack.I had to contract a digger to re dig the trench! they do not dig! at that time I had showed him all the issues with the blower and furnace. he explained he would be out in the spring to replace the stove at my request.
  now with the front blower assembly issues with the chuging and chew chew issue it has   rattled and worn out all the screws and fills the blower with creosote burning the wires and switch they place right below it. causing the failure of the blower and for the flange it is connected to to literally rattle out of the cement it is incase to. the actuator that opens and closes there baffle also rattled out. I called the company and got a response that I must be kicking it beating it with a baseball bat because they've never had this issue (what the ***k are u doing) etc.. then they hung up on me afyer telling they told me they were sick of hearing from me 3rd call at this time. and kindof threatened to not have it fixed that it would be up to me to take care of it and they wanted nothing to do with it after a long conversation cussing and pretty much lawsuit conversation 2min call.... A few min later his copartner called and calmly explained sry and we will send u out a new blower and u installing it will not void the warranty..I was hesitant because if I replace the blower it might void the warranty and they would get out of it.
.....personal note.. The guy is short temperd he has a lot on his plate to keep up with and is swamped with work stress is high I'm sure I'm 2 hr drive for them on any issue. so I kinda wiped it off as just another call.
currently the wood stove is still sitting outside I have had to re rig the wiring and blower to keep it working the creosote had to be cleaned out numerous times of the blower. they have sent me a new one to install and I have yet to do so. It will remain in the box until they get here with the new stove and they can install it.

conversations on the phone have ceased and are now email for proof of conversation. do I feel comfortable with this stove... No..
.however the company has taken care of the warranty issues they have responded to all my complaints and about any and all issues. they have assured me of replacement this spring. 

as for the stove prior to receiving it they said that they had a few employees that were not following the sketches correctly I told them I believe that this might be one of their old stoves and the problems are consistent with all the reviews I've read in past years. they agreed it's possible we will replace it with new. After three months was pex failure five months the stove came to a compleat halt of use and I had to use my gas boiler..$6k should last longer I'm sure.. Pics to follow if company decides to not follow up.. Hope this helps.


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## gregoryMI (Apr 14, 2015)

gregoryMI said:


> Little of both I am using my gas boiler to keep up were this one fails. as well believe in the team effort to address problems and have it fixed. I know exactly were and what mods I will do but its a warranty thing you know.. However met with an angry cussing voice when asking politely where the new blower assembly is and why I have not got it yet after 3 months of waiting for it. they are quick to jump to conclusion and very vulgar and angry at the moment... I believe I have become part of them post you read on amazon..lol I've sent them and email to try again politely to remedy this situation.. They have yet to respond..they said last time out while fixing the pex it melted they would drop off a NEW unit in person with the issues like cuts in pipes and screws missing and dents in fan and proper spacing for the fan flap to open and close without hitting the pipes come this spring when its shut down.... I asked when and a date for this new stove nothing more and extremely politely put.... I've kept my cool lets see what happens if they rebound back and show a good company...I've taken pics of the break down from day one to today and will continue.. So be for I bash them and tell all the truth and upload pics.. I'll give one more chance.. Least I can do right..


Make note of this post as well


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## maple1 (Apr 14, 2015)

I think that if they do replace your boiler, I would immediately un-install it as soon as they leave, sell it second hand as a new unused boiler, and get something else. What a nightmare that all sounds like - I think you would be just setting yourself up for a repeat if you use the replacement.

Also not clear if the underground pipe was replaced yet or not? I think it was - but I hope with good product.


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## gregoryMI (Apr 14, 2015)

maple1 said:


> I think that if they do replace your boiler, I would immediately un-install it as soon as they leave, sell it second hand as a new unused boiler, and get something else. What a nightmare that all sounds like - I think you would be just setting yourself up for a repeat if you use the replacement.
> 
> Also not clear if the underground pipe was replaced yet or not? I think it was - but I hope with good product.


yes the underground pipe has been replaced with the exact same as of the old pipe.. I know my headakes are only starting. The company hasnt not followed there warrenty yet. Agree on ur idea as well.


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## BoiledOver (Apr 15, 2015)

Sure wish things had gone better for you and your investment. I am wondering if those folks are actually researching and redesigning like they have stated. My guess is they are around 5 -6 years into their production and still having issues. Is that about correct?

Were you loading that thing with a half of a face cord every 5 hours? Have any temp sensors at the unit and in the home for monitoring?

In my opinion, easy peasy wood boiler operations are not a reality. It requires adequate wood processing, daily monitoring and regular maintenance. If a company markets their product without full disclosure regarding the required operating procedures is failing their customer at the start.

I wish you all the best in your home heating needs.


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## Como (Apr 15, 2015)

A quick google only came up with problems.

Several reputable OWB manufacturers out there if you want to go that route. New regs come in this year that may scupper them.


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## Ken C (Apr 15, 2015)

We live in the U.P. of Michigan, have had our Heiss Heater for over one year and made it through our first year without problems.  Our house on Lake Michigan has winds in excess of 50 miles per hour at times, with temperatures -25 degrees this past winter.  In our house we have radiant floor heat with a hot water heat exchanger on house hot water heater and heat exchanger with a blower for the garage.  We ran our water temperature at 140 degrees on the Aquastat with an over shoot temperature of 160 degrees, this maintained the temperature in the house at 72-74 degrees.  In my opinion the owners having issues with the pex tubing are running the water temperature to high and forgetting about over-shoot temperatures.  What I mean by over-shoot is when the Aquastat turns the blower off the temperature continues to rise 10 to 20 degrees.  So if you are running your Aquastat at 180 degrees you could easily exceed the temperature rating of the pex tubing and cause tubing failure.  After putting this system in myself and burying 140 feet of underground tubing I really want to protect my investment and not exceed the temperatures.  Therefore I monitor system temperatures daily.  The only issue I had this year was with the type of wood used in the boiler.  Found that a mixture of green and seasoned wood worked the best in at least 2 foot lengths.  I have had very little ash and low creosote build up.


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## maple1 (Apr 15, 2015)

*What I mean by over-shoot is when the Aquastat turns the blower off the temperature continues to rise 10 to 20 degrees.*

I don't think a properly designed & engineered boiler would do that though. Which IMO points to a funamental flaw in the concept. Some might be able to work around that in the way they operate it, as it seems you have (the low required supply temps likely helps immensely there). But those that need the hotter water (e.g. baseboard) seem to be kind of up against it.


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## BoiledOver (Apr 16, 2015)

Hello Ken,
Does the Heiss's user manual explain that overshoot theory? Do they even have a manual to outline the operation of their units? Blaming operator error without providing documentation on the proper operating procedures is not very responsible at the manufacturer and sales level. My perspective has been of an open mind with this type of boiler and I believe a well made unit has its place. However, there have been quite a few unhappy customers voicing very similar issues. Best wishes on your sustained satisfaction.


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## Ken C (Apr 16, 2015)

maple1 said:


> *What I mean by over-shoot is when the Aquastat turns the blower off the temperature continues to rise 10 to 20 degrees.*
> 
> I don't think a properly designed & engineered boiler would do that though. Which IMO points to a funamental flaw in the concept. Some might be able to work around that in the way they operate it, as it seems you have (the low required supply temps likely helps immensely there). But those that need the hotter water (e.g. baseboard) seem to be kind of up against it.


Heiss  Heater is a properly design boiler.  I idea of using contreat


maple1 said:


> *What I mean by over-shoot is when the Aquastat turns the blower off the temperature continues to rise 10 to 20 degrees.*
> 
> I don't think a properly designed & engineered boiler would do that though. Which IMO points to a funamental flaw in the concept. Some might be able to work around that in the way they operate it, as it seems you have (the low required supply temps likely helps immensely there). But those that need the hotter water (e.g. baseboard) seem to be kind of up against it.





maple1 said:


> *What I mean by over-shoot is when the Aquastat turns the blower off the temperature continues to rise 10 to 20 degrees.*
> 
> I don't think a properly designed & engineered boiler would do that though. Which IMO points to a funamental flaw in the concept. Some might be able to work around that in the way they operate it, as it seems you have (the low required supply temps likely helps immensely there). But those that need the hotter water (e.g. baseboard) seem to be kind of up against it.





maple1 said:


> *What I mean by over-shoot is when the Aquastat turns the blower off the temperature continues to rise 10 to 20 degrees.*
> 
> I don't think a properly designed & engineered boiler would do that though. Which IMO points to a funamental flaw in the concept. Some might be able to work around that in the way they operate it, as it seems you have (the low required supply temps likely helps immensely there). But those that need the hotter water (e.g. baseboard) seem to be kind of up against it.





BoiledOver said:


> Hello Ken,
> Does the Heiss's user manual explain that overshoot theory? Do they even have a manual to outline the operation of their units? Blaming operator error without providing documentation on the proper operating procedures is not very responsible at the manufacturer and sales level. My perspective has been of an open mind with this type of boiler and I believe a well made unit has its place. However, there have been quite a few unhappy customers voicing very similar issues. Best wishes on your sustained satisfaction.



Any wood boiler using a blower will react this way. When the boiler blower turns off, the wood fire will continue to burn for several minutes causing increase temperature rise.   My experience with Heiss Heaters has been very good, they have answered all my questions in a timely and professional manner. I designed my heating system myself and I felt I needed a through understanding of the system for optimal operation.  Heiss Heaters provided any technical support I needed which proved to be invaluable in the design of my system.  What I like most about this system is the concrete structure being the heating mass instead of the water and the durability of the concrete vs steel as the housing of the unit.  I have read other blogs about steel/water boilers having problems so every design has its issues.  So far I am satisfied with my Heiss Heater.


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## Como (Apr 17, 2015)

According to the Heiss site the housing of the unit is stucco.

My structure is masonary and it is true that it will take a long time to cool down but also a long time to warm up. Going to be down to 20f tonight but the building would still be warm with no additional heat in the morning.

Trouble is that when you let it cool it takes a long time to bring it back unlike water. Which of course is why water is the heat battery of choice.

I see that Heiss sort of recognise that by including a little storage but separating it from the usual OWB on board storage so that would provide some protection, more so if was enlarged.

The web site is not that informative, EPA certification coming in 2013.

Wonder what the standby losses are?

From a design perspective can you easily replace the firebox liner? Mention is that it is coated which suggests not easily. The transfer water pipes seem cast in but will have different expansion rates, how is this allowed for?


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## maple1 (Apr 17, 2015)

*Any wood boiler using a blower will react this way.*

I don't recall of reading of any other boilers needing to be run below 180 to avoid an overshoot overheat & resulting pex blow-out. IMO that is a result of the design. Lots of guys here run that all winter.

*What I like most about this system is the concrete structure being the heating mass*

IMO that is the cause of the overshoot. The concrete keeps heating after the fan shuts down. That effect is not present in other boilers to that extent.


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## Como (Apr 17, 2015)

Depends on your altitude. 180 is too close to boiling for me.


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## gregoryMI (Jul 29, 2015)

Well as for Heiss I've sat back and waited to hear from them and now I sit with 12 calls to them and all phone numbers go to vm. Needles to say they don't want to talk. Last conversation mindy and jeramy heiss stated they were gona be out to replace the cracked up stove with a new one in end may middle June. I owe them 400$ still and was going to pay it in full when new showed up. They only had this argument and said OK to payment then. I was set up with a payment plan for three years. I paid it all off the first two months except 400$ I think I'm still ahead.  y u ask. Lol gas to get to the lawyer office and filing fees for the law suit.. 

I've wasted my time way to much for there junk box in my yard.. It does heat the house still but it smokes from all the cracks and leaks at their shark bit fittings. And rattles out all of the metal in cased in cement.. Boiled over knows what I mean by the expansion and contractions metal and cement.. 
Might as well have a camp fire out side and boil water through it with a leaf blower.. Maby better off...

Just a few pics of 5 months of use.. Tell me I'm wrong for being upset.. All cracks smoke the fan falls out on the ground and door bairly shuts. And leaks allll the way around..

Heiss was nice for the first problem I had. 
Then they were mad I asked why its cracking.
Then pissed and hung up on me when I said the blower keeps falling out..
Welp guess Amazon won't be backing this one up...


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## gregoryMI (Jul 29, 2015)

maple1 said:


> *Any wood boiler using a blower will react this way.*
> 
> I don't recall of reading of any other boilers needing to be run below 180 to avoid an overshoot overheat & resulting pex blow-out. IMO that is a result of the design. Lots of guys here run that all winter.
> 
> ...



I was concerned about this logicly I watched the water temp as the two pumps I have..it never raised any..


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## leon (Jul 30, 2015)

Have you looked at residential wood chip boilers?

I realise you have a problem on your hands but you
may be better off with a wood chip burner after all this.


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## TCaldwell (Jul 31, 2015)

Aside from the legal issues, nobody should have to go through this to heat with wood, your not going to want to do this for another winter. Take what ever money comes your way from heis, craigslist or the side of the road and get a real boiler. Start enjoying reliable, efficient wood heating and regular sleep!


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## BoiledOver (Jul 31, 2015)

It is sad to hear of the meltdown in relations with the Heiss company. I honestly hoped for them to fine tune their design and become a worthwhile option.

Ever hear if Dryvit? It appears this is what they mimicked in their design with the rigid insulation. Pretty much guaranteed failure with the extreme contrasting temperatures involved..

Best of luck in your legal dealings over this purchase. Affordable home heating with wood can be way better than this.


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## heaterman (Jul 31, 2015)

I am really sorry about your problems with the boiler and issues with the company. You would think they would want to give you a refund rather than go through legal action.........maybe they are not solid enough financially to do that.......I don't know.
Personally speaking, the design never struck me as having much merit and certainly no features that would make me want to buy it instead of a typical hot water type boiler. It appears to be someone's back of the napkin doodling with no sound engineering principles behind it.


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## maple1 (Jul 31, 2015)

[quote="Como, post: 1934334, member: 40]New regs come in this year that may scupper them.[/quote]

I might have messed up that quote, but likely a very good point here. Wouldn't be surprised if they call it quits.


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## gregoryMI (Nov 17, 2015)

Welp; lawsuit filed court clerk calls me today to let me know, heiss heater is a scam and he is currently locked out of his building, has three orders paid for six+ months and still hasn't delivers, he also is a registered sex offender and filing bankruptcy, in trouble by IRS and a fraud! Wow background check next time, guess I gota bit the big bullet on this one! Still gona Sue for what ever I can..


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## maple1 (Nov 17, 2015)

Holy crap.


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## heaterman (Nov 17, 2015)

Holy Crap is right 

That truly sucks.


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## BoilerMan (Nov 17, 2015)




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## stee6043 (Nov 18, 2015)

I wouldn't spend too much of your own cash to sue now that you know he's filed for bankruptcy protection.  Any secured debt he has (ie. locked doors indicating a lease/mortgage) will be in line in front of any customers in terms of getting money back.

Aside from this fiasco - is your boiler working enough to get you through the winter?  Looks like our first snow is coming....


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## BoiledOver (Nov 18, 2015)

Well that is good news and bad news. Now you can make whatever alterations as you desire without worry of voiding a warranty. With propane prices down maybe you can use both sources for heat and get the wood fired unit as close to perfect as it could be. The money was spent and the heater will heat, maybe not as well as others but it will still heat water. Have you thought of filling the cracks and adding another layer of insulation to it? For a few hundred more it might work well enough to recoup some of your investment.

Best of luck in all directions. Stay warm.


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## Heat1285 (Nov 19, 2015)

gregoryMI said:


> Welp; lawsuit filed court clerk calls me today to let me know, heiss heater is a scam and he is currently locked out of his building, has three orders paid for six+ months and still hasn't delivers, he also is a registered sex offender and filing bankruptcy, in trouble by IRS and a fraud! Wow background check next time, guess I gota bit the big bullet on this one! Still gona Sue for what ever I can..


@gregoryMI....i live right down the road from you.....are you right off M36??? i believe i have seen this stove a puffing when driving by a few times. I live right down off Barton Road. I have been burning with OWB for years and years. I would be more than happy to come by and try and get the stove to at least function as best it can with the damages it has suffered. I have a few ideas that might at least fix some of the problems you are having. Sorry for your terrible experience.


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